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#281 - The Color Purple (2023)

"Like the color purple Where do it come from? Now my eyes are open Look what God has done..." Grab a slice of Huckleberry Pie and some great cinematic ideas because this week we're diving into the brand new feature film adaptation of "The Color Purple." Hosts: Jesse McAnally & Andrew DeWolf... Read More

1 h 15 mins
Jan 25


"Like the color purple Where do it come from? Now my eyes are open Look what God has done..." Grab a slice of Huckleberry Pie and some great cinematic ideas because this week we're diving into the brand new feature film adaptation of "The Color Purple."


Hosts: Jesse McAnally & Andrew DeWolf

Podcast Edited By: Andrew DeWolf

Theme Songs: Robyn Nash of IOU Music UK

Keeper of the Cheese: Juliet Antonio

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00:05 - Jess (Host)

Hello, I'm Jesse McAnally.

00:09 - Andrew (Host)

And I'm Andrew DeWolf.

00:10 - Liz (Host)

And I'm Liz Esther.

00:11 - Jess (Host)

And welcome to Musicals with Cheese, a podcast where I try to get Andrew and Liz like musical theater. Um, I think this might be a first. No, no, yeah, it is definitely the second or third time this has happened. We are re-reviewing Musical because the film adaptation came out and we've already previously done the stage show. Now correct me if I'm wrong probably Julieta Antonio. The only other time we've done this is with Dear Evan Hansen. That sounds correct, right?

00:46 - Andrew (Host)

Well, we definitely covered, dear Evan Hansen, at least three or four times so.

00:49 - Liz (Host)

I would say it must be correct. It sounds correct to me.

00:53 - Jess (Host)

I can't think of another time, because A not a lot of movie musicals get released, specifically ones based on older shows. So, yeah, I'm going to count this as a win that Hollywood finally made a movie musical out of a good musical, Unlike what's coming up next couple of weeks. Spoilers, spoilers. I saw a bird eat a cow, or something.

01:20 - Andrew (Host)

Oh god, have you seen that already?

01:22 - Jess (Host)

No, I'm seeing it tomorrow. What are you talking about? Oh god, mean girls.

01:28 - Liz (Host)

Oh, the mean girls.

01:30 - Jess (Host)

But you know what the girls in the color purple are pretty, not that mean. This week we're talking about the color purple movie. Let's go.

01:38 - Speaker 5 (Host)

So make a joyful noise onto the light. When the king threw down your in the lion's den. The god works in mysterious ways.

02:21 - Jess (Host)

So the color purple is a film written by Marsha Norman, adapted for the screen by Marcus Gardley, with music and lyrics by Brenda Russell, ali Willis and Stephen Bray, directed by Blitz Bazouule. The film had its world premiere in London on November 20th 2023 and was released theatrically on December 25th 2023. It was originally scheduled to be released on December 20th 2023, but later switched release dates, with Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom Going up in competition against another musical film, wonka, which we have talked about on this show already. The plot of the color purple is a decade spanning tale of love and resilience and one woman's journey to independence. Seeley faces many hardships in her life but ultimately finds extraordinary strength and hope in the unbreakable bonds of sisterhood.


Not sure if that's how I describe the book or any of the other adaptations, but definitely this film. So I've kind of publicly stated my feelings on this film on Twitter the minute I saw it. I stand by it, but I still feel like the things that annoy me about it really, really annoy me about it. So what do you guys think?

03:37 - Andrew (Host)

Well, you can't just leave us hanging like that. What did you say on Twitter?

03:40 - Jess (Host)

Oh well, fuck alright. So basically, my tweet was more or less the color purple is one of the best movie musicals since Chicago and I do believe that I stand by that. That is truly how I feel about it and I think it is completely accurate. That being said, I have a lot of dumb nitpicks.


It feels like this film, along with the Steven Spielberg film, are very afraid of handling the sexuality and romantic aspects of Seeley and Shug's relationship, especially in adapting a specific series of scenes, but one specifically where Shug Avery makes Seeley look at her own vagina for the first time and the direct sexual romantic relationship between them.


In a way that's text as opposed to subtext. In Spielberg's film it is very blatantly subtext, kept under the rug. There's like a mild kiss, but it's not framed in a romantic way. This time there is a kiss in silhouette, very much hidden as well, as they wake up in the same bed together and as well, shug Avery turns to Christ at the end, which is not a subplot in either the book or the previous film adaptation or the stage musical. In fact, it ruins the overall emotional arc of Seeley, because Seeley's big song I'm here at the End is in the musical, a reaction to her to Shug Avery being like hey, before I'm too old I want to go out and fuck a bunch of other people. And Seeley's like I thought you loved me and she's like I gotta do this. And the first words of that song which are cut in the movie are I don't need you to love me, I don't need you at all.

05:19 - Speaker 5 (Host)

I don't need you to love me.

05:26 - Jess (Host)

Is, I think, a disservice to the overall character arcs. However, this film seems to be much more interested in finding the joy in situations and not harping on the pain and the emotional hardships of Seeley, which is something both the book and the previous adaptations really, really reveled in a lot more Not saying they don't show some of how bad Seeley's life is, but it doesn't quite linger on them as much. However, I'm not sure if that, if there's not that much hardship to go through, the high points aren't quite as high. You don't soar quite as high when you get to those other points. But maybe that's just me. What do you guys think?

06:06 - Andrew (Host)

I don't even remember exactly how I felt about the Broadway one, so I wish I did, but I feel like that was so long ago. I just cannot live for the life of me.

06:16 - Jess (Host)

Lovingly re-listen to that episode. Do you recall any of Andrew's own opinions?

06:20 - Liz (Host)

I've never recall you enjoyed it but like you knew there was flaws but you overall liked it. You thought the music was really good but you thought the plot was a little bit struggling.

06:31 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, I remember not fully understanding what happened. You were confusing.

06:38 - Liz (Host)

I think, and also Jess was confusing, though he read the book.

06:43 - Andrew (Host)

I think Jess was confusing me more than anything in that episode because he kept bringing up stuff that didn't happen in the Broadway show. I thought I saw Jess talking about the book that sounds right, but he kept talking about stuff that didn't happen in the Broadway show and I was like what's going on?

06:57 - Jess (Host)

This thing about different adaptations, and I've brought this up in our previous episodes, specifically ones on Jane Eyre and things like that. Sometimes, when you are very familiar with a source material and you see a musical, you kind of fill in the gaps with your own knowledge, because you already know the story.

07:17 - Andrew (Host)

That's why being familiar with source material is almost always a bad thing. You should just not read the source material ever.

07:22 - Jess (Host)

I mean, it's not like I Okay.

07:27 - Liz (Host)

It's very easy to overthink it when you know the source material.

07:30 - Andrew (Host)

Yes, when you read the book, what you should do is hit your head as hard as you can with a hammer so you forget the book and then watch the movie. Usually you'll have a better experience.

07:39 - Liz (Host)

So you're in your car waiting to go into the theater. You have your friend or partner hit you in the head with a hammer until you kind of remember your name.

07:47 - Andrew (Host)

Then you go see the movie. Then you go see the movie and you'll have a much better time.

07:51 - Liz (Host)

And then you had to go to a doctor for your head wound, but it's fine.

07:53 - Jess (Host)

I really want someone to clip this out of context and just frame that as what we should do before we see the color purple.

08:02 - Andrew (Host)

That's actually not my opinion on the color purple, though. If you are in that state, you won't enjoy it nearly as much.

08:09 - Jess (Host)

So back to you, andrew, the film.

08:13 - Andrew (Host)

Oh man, the film was really good. I mean I have a few things I didn't love, but honestly the music is really solid and for a movie musical in this day and age, having them actually sing the songs properly and well is like holy shit. I witnessed a miracle. It's like wow, they hired singers for this.

08:36 - Jess (Host)

I also want to say that two of the lead actors, ceeley and Sophia, are from the stage version in different capacities. Fantasia was from the original Broadway cast and wonderful casting choice. Wonderful then as well. Daniel Brooks was from the new Broadway cast playing the same role, and both of them fucking kill it. And one of my favorite actors of all time, trajie P Henson, is in this and doing incredible work here, like next level incredible. She's been in this business for so long and I wish she was getting more attention for a lot of her work, but that's just not what's going on, because you know a lot of things in our world, sadly. I think that bringing on those Broadway actors added authenticity and as Andrew said, and they have experience with this characters and all that.


What did you feel about it visually?

09:33 - Andrew (Host)

I think visually it looked pretty good. There was at times it felt like I don't know. I don't know how to describe it. I'm not like a film guy in that sense, but I felt like the background felt flat sometimes Is specifically in outdoor scenes.

09:53 - Jess (Host)

Okay, I don't know. That's a good point, but if I pin in that I'll come back to it. Liz, what did you think of the film?

09:58 - Liz (Host)

I liked it a lot. I enjoyed it. It's tough to watch in some areas just because, like the sexual abuse, even when it's implied, it's difficult to.

10:09 - Jess (Host)


10:10 - Liz (Host)

Stomach a lot of the time, but the singing is great. It felt like a musical director, by a person that actually cared about musicals.

10:17 - Andrew (Host)

Oh yeah.

10:18 - Liz (Host)

Which, like kind of a miracle, Like Wonka felt like Paul King just got hired and Evan Hansen is a whole other bag of worms. But you know, this one was directed by a guy who liked the stage show and wanted to make it a movie which never happens anymore. Like good on you, dude, you actually cared. Thank you for caring. It's really fun. I liked it. It was. It's like it's obviously a tough subject matter but it's enjoyable. The actors are great Like songs are great. Like looks great. It's a photography, great editing.

10:52 - Andrew (Host)

Your kids will love it. Don't bring your children no.

10:55 - Liz (Host)

I think there were some teenagers in my theater. Actually I saw this on MLK Day.

10:59 - Speaker 4 (Host)


11:00 - Liz (Host)

I think there were some teenagers in my theater.

11:05 - Jess (Host)

So let me just talk about things I love about the original story, that this did well and things that I think so. Has anyone seen the Steven Spielberg film in this group?

11:16 - Liz (Host)

I watched about 20 minutes of it and realized I was not in the mood to watch a depressing movie, so I turned it off. But it's a good movie, yes.

11:25 - Jess (Host)

It is a fine, fine movie. Whoopi Goldberg is in it. She has a cameo in this film, oprah Winfrey actually giving a wonderful, wonderful performance in that film. The acting is the reason to see that. I think Spielberg was kind of out of his depth as a filmmaker at that time. I think if he had tackled it more recently he would have probably done it a lot differently.


It does feel a little navel-gazy as a film. It feels a little fearful and a little unaware of how to properly portray some scenes and then other scenes it does beautifully and a lot of those pieces this film tips the hand to. That being said, this film strangely feels similarly navel-gazy at points. In fact I kind of felt myself a little conflicted on how this represents it, because it is very much about finding black joy and I know as a white man that's a weird thing to say. But this film, despite hardships, really does want to focus on the good things in life, the positivity, the joyous moments, and not wallow in the sad moments. I was having conversation with my partner Miranda afterwards and she said the thing that felt different about this than most musicals is if it doesn't feel like any song pushes the plot forward, it seems that each one kind of stops and gives us a little music video, which makes sense because Blitz Bazouwule worked on mostly music videos, including Beyonce's Black as King for Disney. Great work there.


I listened to his conversation with the director's guild for the DGA podcast and hearing the reason why he was picked for this film by Steven Spielberg, oprah Winfrey and Quincy Jones, who were the producers and had pick of director, was fascinating to me, because he had to draw every shot of this film, beginning to end, and he has an animator's thought process and you can tell that when he's like.


If I described these things to them that I wanted to do for this film, they would have laughed me out of the room, but if I drew it for them it would have had different things. So specifically the phonograph where Ceeley dances on it with Shug Avery in the bathtub on a phonograph he's like. Those are the images I wanted and I didn't know how to get to those images until I reread the book and I saw the first little words of it, which is Dear God, where she's writing letters to God, means this woman has an imagination which allowed us to find free Ceeley in a way that she hadn't been previously where she was kind of this inter-kind of wallflower character and gave her life and autonomy over her own story that she hadn't before. And those are the things that really worked for me and really felt effective and in any other kind of format would have felt a little too grand for such a painful story. But they, they fray for it, so better. I would even say that the fantasy sequences work better here than they do in Chicago.

14:29 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, there was actually quite a few of those type of sequences throughout the, throughout the movie, and it does let you get into her head more, especially since she doesn't. She doesn't really get a chance to to do or say what she wants to, in most of it because of her situation. So you kind of get visual of what she actually feels using that.

14:59 - Jess (Host)

And there are points where it kind of takes something that should be horrific and puts you in her point of view to find the joy and love in it and, like this is going to sound really horrific. But in the movie she does get sexually assaulted by her husband many times but in the way of framing that as kind of her taking power, we focus entirely on Sug Avery's photo, which draws that romantic connection between her and Sug before she even meets her, which I think are is a great choice, like these choices that make horrific things seem a little bit more palatable, a little bit more, I won't say romanticized, but a little bit more honest, a little bit in her head, a little bit more, a little bit more empathetic instead of just voyeuristic. I think the removal of the voyeurism of these horrible events is really the best thing that this does. That being said, this is not a really miserable film at all. This is very joyous. But to do that they had to cut 13 songs out of the film from the stage show.

16:13 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, yeah. So as a has a two I think it's two and a half hour long movie there is considerably less songs than you would expect. I would say Not that there is like not that. The songs that are there aren't really good, but I'm trying to remember the Broadway show. But there must have been quite a bit of music cut for this movie.

16:41 - Jess (Host)

Yes, and the reason is Blitz, in that same interview, said he really wanted there to be turn what is a more kind of early 2000s almost everything is sung through kind of musical with a Greek chorus into a 60 style musical.


He wanted to have book scenes and song scenes and for one to lead into each other and diegetically introduce the song through things in the book scenes, for example, like when they're building the house, they will set up the diegetic sounds to make the music, being hammers and nailing things and putting things on, and every scene starts with that. And if he couldn't find a justifiable way to lead into the song he was going to cut it, which, on one hand, I miss a lot of those songs. I feel that it kind of makes it feel less like a musical, more like a film of songs. However, it does kind of take away the power from the the. The horrible characters, the only people that sing in this are the quote, unquote decent human beings. Mr does not sing a non-diegetic song throughout the entire thing and that almost makes him feel of other because of that.

17:56 - Andrew (Host)

Mr is a piece of shit. Holy fuck, fucking sucks. Yes, he does he gets more than he deserves at the end.

18:05 - Liz (Host)

Seriously, I would have fucking punched him.

18:09 - Andrew (Host)

He deserved that, that razor through the neck 100% and he didn't get it.

18:15 - Liz (Host)

He got like a will be friends thing. No, I would have fucking punched him out anytime I saw him.

18:20 - Jess (Host)

Yeah will be friends, my ass Will be friends, fuck you, don't talk to me, it is interesting because the the story takes place over so many years, so many decades, and they don't really look to be aging that much over the time. Thanks, Pike.

18:36 - Andrew (Host)

It's supposed to be like 40 years. I think yes.

18:38 - Liz (Host)

For if you and the last scene, on some of the close-ups you can see a little bit of prosthetic on some of the actors Thresh P Henson definitely has some and I think Coleman Domingo has a little bit, but like it's not like a Keegan-Michael Kean-Wanka level of prosthetic. No no.

18:57 - Jess (Host)

It's like a subtle I got old prosthetic. But I like the fact that Young Seely and Young Nettie are played by different actors when they're young than when they're old. I think Sierra plays older Nettie and Haley Bailey plays Young Nettie. I think it's Halle Bailey. I'm pretty sure Is it Halle Bailey.

19:15 - Liz (Host)

Okay, I think it's Halle Bailey.

19:17 - Jess (Host)

Halle Bailey wonderful, and she leaves an impression despite having very little screen time at all. That being said, andrew, there is a little bit of the artifice felt here and I think that's kind of what you're feeling with the colors. So I think what is the biggest difference and the reason why you thought that the sky felt like kind of washed out the colors is because anytime they are indoors they are 100% on a set and everything has a bright, like incandescent, like shining right through the window, creating these beautiful smoky spotlights like very theatrical, very big, and then when you go outside for any reason, it's just harsh sunlight. So it just feels like you're entering into a different kind of movie. So it feels distracting, a little too realistic, which is fine. I just feel like you could choose one or the other and we have more of the theatrical and I think that suits this kind of story that Blitz was doing, as opposed to the kind of more rough and tumble kind of 12 years of slave style more Steve McQueen, look that the outside world reminds me of.

20:32 - Andrew (Host)

So the outside is actually outside, yes, but because it's just lit by the sunlight it actually kind of makes everything look a little. It almost looked unrealistic to me because I was used to the like bright stage lights that they were using before.

20:48 - Jess (Host)

Yes, but you can't control the sun. So if you've got like a bright day, no clouds in the sky, where you can control the shadows, a bit like, specifically, the moments I'm thinking of are like when they're on the beach and all that, when they've got tree cover on them, it's fine, they're covered, it looks beautiful, you can have those shining side lights.

21:09 - Andrew (Host)

But when they're just like out in the middle of a street or something, it becomes very, I think, when they were near the dock, when they were near the dock at times, I remember that looking kind of a little bit weird. Currently there was not much they could do about that.

21:23 - Jess (Host)

No, it's not their fault or anything like that. It's just one of those things you kind of notice and then you can't unnotice it. So let's take a little bit to unpack all the characters really quickly. We got Seely wonderful performance from Fantasia Didn't originate the role on Broadway, but played on Broadway.


They had to take a lot of convincing to be in this show in the film, allegedly because they hated doing the Broadway performance. It nearly killed her. It was a very unpleasant experience for her on stage and all Blitz had to do was show some of the drawings that he was doing for every shot of the film and she was like, oh yeah, I wanna do this. I see that this won't be just utter pain for me. I think that's a big problem that a lot of actors find with Seely is it is just so much pain and so much horror throughout the entire story and this one gave her focus a lot on her joy and those moments and a lot of those kind of things. However, it was not fun and games on the set of this film. Have you guys heard about the controversy of the set experience for these actors?

22:33 - Andrew (Host)

I haven't heard anything about behind the scenes, really.

22:36 - Liz (Host)

I have.

22:37 - Jess (Host)

All right, Liz, I feel like I've been talking too much. Why don't you elaborate on that?

22:41 - Liz (Host)

All right, let's go. So let me just get the actual paragraph up with the details, because I'm not remembering all of them. Okay, so Terajmi Henson sent an interview that she had to speak out against unfair working conditions during the movie.


So, this is a quote from her. At this point. I'm a Golden Globe winner and a Academy Award nominated, so I went in there with a chip in my shoulder because I was like you will never second guess me again, because they fought against her. And then Daniel Brooks also said they didn't have dressing rooms and there was no food provided at rehearsals. And then the cast read out to Oprah and Oprah was like shit, let me fix that, because it's Oprah. Also, apparently, they had to drive themselves to the set, which is an actual safety issue.

23:36 - Jess (Host)

That could fuck with your insurance. There's a reason they have drivers.

23:40 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, so that was the main few things. Also, terajmi Henson was apparently very underpaid for this movie and she considered quitting acting, I'm pretty sure.

23:48 - Jess (Host)

Yes, and a lot of that lies on the shoulders of the producers, which Blitz has been openly kind of antagonist I wouldn't say antagonistic because that's openly critical of and there's only four of them they're Oprah Winfrey, Steven Spielberg, Scott Sanders and Quincy Jones. And once the film was hitting like close to the $100 million budget, he no longer the director of the film, no longer had final say in who he chose and was getting pressure to hire folks like Beyonce and other folks like that, as opposed to the people that were right for the role Beyonce, Rihanna. They're fine performers. I guess, If you like, battleship and Austin Powers, I would not have put them in this movie.

24:34 - Andrew (Host)

That wouldn't have worked at all.

24:36 - Liz (Host)

It wouldn't work at all, frankly.

24:38 - Jess (Host)

It's. Maybe Beyonce could have played Old Nettie at the end, but that's about it. I'm trying to say she wouldn't be a good fit for any of the other roles.

24:48 - Liz (Host)

I mean, they did cast her as a side character, so they kind of got their way.

24:53 - Jess (Host)

I'm Squeak.

24:54 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, her played Squeak. She was credited as her actual name, but in like Wikipedia it says her.

25:01 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, from the. I think that she did wonderful, but there's so many little roles here that just don't have much to do and it's Sealy's story and you can't hire a traditionally kind of normal movie star looking person to play Sealy. This is a star making role in the same way it was for like Whoopi Goldberg and folks like that, and you can't cast someone traditionally movie star quality to play Sofia. That's why Oprah Winfrey played the role previously and Danielle Brooks was perfect and Coleman Domingo perfect cast in Corey Hawkins, who we all remember from In the Heights, really good as Harpo. There's just things from the book that I really felt like missed Speaking of, remember when she shows up to Mr Tows and there are two other children that never get seen again.

25:56 - Liz (Host)

That's true, yeah. I forgot about those kids Where'd?

26:01 - Andrew (Host)

they go. I just figured they died.

26:04 - Liz (Host)

I just really ran away off screen, or something.

26:07 - Jess (Host)

And they do a lot to sand off the edges. Specifically, those children were horrendously abusive to Sealy in the books, especially Harpo in fact. So just showing Harpo be immediately nice to Sealy was a little jarring to me in the movie and showing them as this is why you needed to use the hammer technique.

26:28 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, the hammer technique.

26:29 - Jess (Host)

I had to just shove the hammer technique. Also, I brought this up. David Allen Greer plays the preacher Samuel Avery.

26:39 - Liz (Host)

The problem with the David Allen Greer show up. I was only thinking about the Angels in the Outfield sequel.

26:43 - Speaker 4 (Host)

That we found out David Allen Greer was in.

26:45 - Liz (Host)

So I immediately started laughing internally and I was like is that David Allen Greer?

26:51 - Jess (Host)

So wild, I do not believe. Correct me if I'm wrong, liz, that is not a character in the book, that is not an arc in the book. She did not have a preacher that lived in the town, like that was her father and I. Really I'm sorry, andrew, I'm talking a lot. I'm on my fucking soapbox right now.

27:12 - Andrew (Host)

This is definitely how the first episode went, isn't it?

27:15 - Liz (Host)

100%, it's mostly. Jess who's talking about how the book should have gone and how the show should follow the book more than Andrew being like okay, dude, I didn't read the book. I thought it was fine.

27:25 - Andrew (Host)

See, I used the hammer technique, so this whole book thing is way over my head.

27:29 - Jess (Host)

The musical was out of your head beforehand.

27:31 - Liz (Host)

Okay, there is a character named Sam in the book, but I don't remember. Is that one of the children?

27:38 - Jess (Host)

Um no, samuel Avery is apparently the Reverend. I don't believe he is. Samuel Avery is in the book then Okay, okay, maybe Andrew cut this out, andrew is in the book.

27:48 - Andrew (Host)

Jess, you don't even know the source material and you're complaining.

27:50 - Liz (Host)

And you read it like 50,000 times apparently.

27:53 - Jess (Host)

No, no, no, I read it once.

27:56 - Liz (Host)

Did you read it before this recording?

27:57 - Jess (Host)

No, I revisited some of it, didn't reread it.

28:02 - Andrew (Host)

I feel like they gave the arc to the wrong character there, so I feel like the Reverend was the one who should have learned to forgive the daughter.

28:12 - Liz (Host)


28:12 - Andrew (Host)

But they went the other way.

28:14 - Liz (Host)

I also more read that scene as like the daughter finally reconnecting with her family at home rather than running away from it, be it like alcohol and like all the other stuff she used to cope, rather than just like being with her dad for 10 seconds, oh fuck this.

28:28 - Jess (Host)

All right, let me just I'm so sorry. Samuel Avery Allegedly he's a Reverend Mary to Corinne and he adopts Celia's children and Mary's Nettie. He is not the same character.

28:44 - Liz (Host)


28:47 - Jess (Host)

Just wanted to clarify that one out there.

28:49 - Liz (Host)

I'm not reading the book. I'm reading the Wikipedia summary and there's a lot of words in it.

28:53 - Andrew (Host)

There is so did they just give them the same last name to confuse you?

28:57 - Jess (Host)

I don't think it says Avery. I think they just gave this guy the Reverend role and just made him the parent of Sug Avery.

29:04 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, it does happen.

29:05 - Jess (Host)

So Sug Avery is never contrite in the book. She is basically like I'm a fuck around and for the rest of my life I'm gonna fuck who I want, do what I want, drink however I want, and I hate the fact that they gave her an arc because I don't think that character would have an arc. She stops drinking, as you can see by the fact that she had to be driven around the first half of the film and is driving herself in the second half of the film. Finds God and her and Celia are just gal pals that kissed once, instead of having a committed relationship that she throws away to go fuck some more before she's too old.

29:42 - Liz (Host)

Well, she's also like married at some like, even before she gets up alcohol.

29:46 - Jess (Host)

She married to me.

29:47 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, but that's that dude's a total cook. True.

29:52 - Jess (Host)

That also kind of pissed Celia off, and that happens after she escapes. Uh, Mr Hideaway or Mr Grasp, mr Hideaway God. Mr Grasp in the book. So I just thought that that really kind of felt cowardly in a weird way. Yeah, it gives Suga a bit more to do, but it kind of betrays the character that we've set up for her.

30:14 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, I didn't see it that way, but I respect it. I just like your view of it.

30:19 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, and that's with a lot of extra additional context given, and it also just bothers me that there's a decent male father figure which this story seems to really not like male father figures at all.

30:35 - Andrew (Host)

Wait, who are we talking about? Who's decent?

30:38 - Jess (Host)

Um. She gave Rhee's father.

30:40 - Liz (Host)

But also like Celia's. But Celia's, like biological dad, was like a decent guy. He's just off screen. Yeah, he gave her the store even when she was like a child.

30:52 - Speaker 4 (Host)


30:54 - Liz (Host)

So there's some decent men.

30:57 - Andrew (Host)

That boxer guy wasn't the worst, I think, but I don't know where he went. He disappeared.

31:02 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, where did he go? He apparently died while Sophia was in prison. Jesus, I should have brought that up.

31:12 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, they should have mentioned that Jesus Christ, because he just starts dating Harpo again. It's weird.

31:18 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, he apparently died and then Celia started taking care of the kids. It's a whole thing.

31:24 - Andrew (Host)

You know it's, you know it's fine.

31:26 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, sophia is the best character in the story anyways.

31:30 - Liz (Host)


31:32 - Jess (Host)

God, that's some wonderful character.

31:34 - Andrew (Host)

I feel like the my biggest gripe with the whole thing is that the mayor's wife never got any comeuppance.

31:41 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, yeah, she sucks.

31:43 - Jess (Host)

But that's true to real life.

31:46 - Andrew (Host)

I don't care, I'm watching a movie.

31:48 - Liz (Host)

I'm watching a musical.

31:50 - Andrew (Host)

I want her to shit in her drink, and then she drinks it.

31:55 - Speaker 4 (Host)

You want the help.

31:58 - Andrew (Host)

I don't want to watch the help though.

32:00 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, I don't want to watch the help. Nobody should want to watch the help, Like okay. One of the things that I really appreciate about every adaptation of the color purple is white people kind of aren't involved in it. It is not about them, and then when they are, they fuck it all up.

32:16 - Andrew (Host)

One white person shows up and ruins everything.

32:19 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, ruins the life of a perfectly nice woman who was just living her life.

32:23 - Andrew (Host)

Only only white person in the entire thing.

32:25 - Liz (Host)

She was just buying her son's ice cream. It's like, fuck, I want to ruin your life today.

32:29 - Andrew (Host)

They do a good job showing the alternate route of slavery that was implemented in America. Yeah, just put them in prison.

32:40 - Jess (Host)

And it's yep, yep, white people are the worst. I think is basically it.

32:47 - Andrew (Host)

And none of them are worse than me.

32:51 - Jess (Host)

I can think of a few.

32:52 - Speaker 4 (Host)

How about we?

32:52 - Jess (Host)

compare our opinions to those of the real critics over on letterboxcom, the real enemies. It's time for previews. The letterbox game one star, five star.

33:02 - Speaker 5 (Host)

It's time for previews. It's time for previews. It's time for previews.

33:09 - Jess (Host)

Andrew, do you even play the previews theme anymore?

33:13 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, okay it was in the last episode. Did you not fucking listen to it?

33:16 - Speaker 4 (Host)

I haven't had the time yet, fucking asshole.

33:18 - Liz (Host)

It doesn't have a previews. Yeah, it does.

33:21 - Andrew (Host)

It does. We read the New York Times review.

33:24 - Liz (Host)

Oh, we did.

33:24 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, I forgot God all right, are we ready, guys?

33:30 - Liz (Host)

I'm ready.

33:31 - Jess (Host)

Andrew, are you ready?

33:34 - Andrew (Host)

Oh yeah, of course it's the letterbox game. I win all of these every single time.

33:38 - Liz (Host)

No, I know.

33:39 - Andrew (Host)

I have to. I've literally never lost. Don't, don't, don't.

33:44 - Jess (Host)


33:48 - Andrew (Host)

Andrew, you're first Look into it.

33:51 - Liz (Host)

I'll help you.

33:52 - Jess (Host)

All right, trolls band together.

33:59 - Andrew (Host)

We're going to go with one star.

34:04 - Jess (Host)

That is correct, liz. You ready, I'm ready. Cryed so hard I got a migraine, oh fuck.

34:13 - Andrew (Host)

Jesus Christ I mean it's like Celia at the end of the movie. Yeah, Did you cry so hard.

34:21 - Liz (Host)

Five, that is correct.

34:25 - Jess (Host)

Andrew, yeah, how did they make it a musical and less gay?

34:35 - Andrew (Host)

I mean, from how you describe the movie, it sounds like they still made it more gay, just not gay enough.

34:44 - Jess (Host)

Strangely the movie, so the kiss scene in the movie has heat to it, like it is not like to quote the movie, like to quote Jordan. Jordan Serles, who is a wonderful critic, said I felt more sexual tension between a scene that is not meant to be sexual than the scene that is explicitly romantic, which I don't disagree with. I felt more sexual tension between Wobby Goldberg and the actress that played Shugin the Spielberg movie than Taraji P Jansen and Fantasia in this movie, and they had a whole like lesbian dance sequence here.

35:21 - Andrew (Host)

You guys got weird standards Okay.

35:25 - Jess (Host)

I'm just, I'm repeating others and agreeing with it.

35:29 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, I know, you just want them to fuck.

35:32 - Speaker 4 (Host)

I do.

35:32 - Andrew (Host)

There's plenty of gay porn on the internet, like it's no, it's important.

35:37 - Jess (Host)

There's an entire scene where Shug show Sealy her own vagina with a mirror and she describes it in detail Also.

35:43 - Andrew (Host)

There's an entire Chest jerking off to lesbian porn.

35:45 - Jess (Host)

This is important, it's important.

35:48 - Speaker 4 (Host)

It's not porn, it's already Andrew.

35:51 - Liz (Host)

You know Lee and Michelle once showed someone their vagina, is that art?

35:55 - Jess (Host)

She would claim it is.

35:58 - Andrew (Host)

Okay, okay, I'm being facetious, but we're gonna go with half.

36:10 - Liz (Host)

You have fun way of saying it.

36:11 - Andrew (Host)

I'm gonna go with one star. This is a one star.

36:14 - Jess (Host)

That is correct, liz, are you ready?

36:18 - Liz (Host)

I'm ready, hell, no. Well, they quoted the song, which means they liked the movie. So five Nope, that was a one.

36:27 - Jess (Host)

I tricked you.

36:29 - Liz (Host)

I was using Andrew's theories to try to win, but I lost because of Andrew's theories.

36:36 - Andrew (Host)

My theories only work in theory.

36:39 - Liz (Host)

That's true, a game theory.

36:41 - Jess (Host)

Oh, he's dead. Now I'm retiring, I'm retiring, I'm retiring because Andrew has a letterbox. All right, Andrew.

36:51 - Andrew (Host)


36:52 - Jess (Host)

Why they face tune the sky.

36:56 - Liz (Host)

That's just the sky, man.

37:04 - Andrew (Host)

She's a one star.

37:07 - Jess (Host)

That is correct, liz. Yes, not even as purple as Wonka.

37:15 - Liz (Host)

Can't disagree with that, wonka wasn't that purple Could have been more purple, let's say blanked out, wonka Probably did, honestly.

37:28 - Jess (Host)

One that is correct, andrew.

37:33 - Andrew (Host)


37:33 - Jess (Host)

The novel gave my flatmate dyslexia and the movie gave me a rash.

37:39 - Liz (Host)

So you did the hammer technique, I see. Ok, well, you can always use baby powder to recover.

37:46 - Andrew (Host)

We're going to go one again. These are all one star reviews.

37:52 - Jess (Host)

That is correct, liz. Yes, bring back Hexing people, oh yeah.

37:57 - Liz (Host)

Where's that song? It's the only thing I know about the musical, about the Hexing song I miss.

38:02 - Jess (Host)

Ok, the one time that Mr sings in the song is him singing about how miserable he is under Sealy's curse and I kind of miss it.

38:11 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, I think I'll go to hit that kicked ass on that one.

38:15 - Jess (Host)

Instead he just falls asleep in mud. True.

38:17 - Liz (Host)

That was fun. One star.

38:21 - Jess (Host)

That is a five star. Damn it, andrew. Yeah, holy moly, three dots.

38:28 - Andrew (Host)

Holy moly. Holy moly Five stars they were impressed.

38:34 - Speaker 4 (Host)

That is correct they were impressed.

38:37 - Andrew (Host)

I am nailing these.

38:37 - Liz (Host)

And Liz last question. Well, I already lost.

38:40 - Jess (Host)

so yes, you did, grandmother Core.

38:45 - Andrew (Host)

Another one for me, I mean, I never lose.

38:47 - Liz (Host)

It's like what was the review again?

38:51 - Jess (Host)

Grandmother Core.

38:52 - Liz (Host)

Grandmother Jesus Christ Um five.

38:56 - Jess (Host)

As a one. Andrew, you have won the Letterbox game. Congratulations. Make a speech right now.

39:03 - Andrew (Host)

Go Jess watching this movie. He's like G-Milf, g-milf, hang on.

39:11 - Liz (Host)

No, no, jess, watching this movie is that this should have been in the from the book. They should have this from the book. They should have this from the book.

39:18 - Andrew (Host)

Where's the scene where they fuck? It's really important to watch.

39:21 - Liz (Host)

Where's Amir for her badge? We need it.

39:25 - Andrew (Host)

We really needed that scene and I think they should have really leagered on that.

39:32 - Jess (Host)

It is important. I'm not going to sit here and get cyber bullied in real life.

39:40 - Speaker 4 (Host)

["dreamy Donations by the Doughnuts"].

39:46 - Jess (Host)

Hey guys, today's show is brought to you by the extremely kind donations by our donors over at Patreon. Um, andrew, what's going on over there Is that-. Is that one of those fancy cups? Is that a Stanley cup?

39:58 - Andrew (Host)

Oh, it is.

40:01 - Speaker 4 (Host)

I didn't know you had big money. What where Not? No, my eyes are flat.

40:11 - Jess (Host)

No P he got the knock off Um.

40:13 - Speaker 5 (Host)

Andrew, what's going on over at Patreon?

40:15 - Andrew (Host)

Thank fucking God, patreon is where you can go to spend the money you didn't spend on all the Stanley cups. Um, I know you wanted a Stanley cup collection of 50,000 cups that just have one color and nothing special at all about them and they're not gonna be worth less than beanie babies in five months. But you could spend that money on Patreon instead and get extra content from your favorite podcast, musicals with Cheese. Um, and also we receive that money and can use it to keep the show going because Lord knows we need it.

40:46 - Speaker 4 (Host)


40:48 - Jess (Host)

Um, speaking of which I don't know if you noticed this, cause I just did we got her first patron back. I don't know if we guilted them or something, but they came back I hope we didn't I hope we didn't guilt them.

40:58 - Speaker 5 (Host)

I already guilted them back. Well maybe I do hope we did guilt them. Welcome back.

41:02 - Liz (Host)

Melissa, now Jessica remember the list and the way he wanted to.

41:07 - Jess (Host)

You've slightly inconvenienced us before, but now we're back to normal.

41:12 - Andrew (Host)

Oh, there's definitely gonna be some Angels in the Outfield. Content on Patreon soon. Oh, absolutely.

41:18 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, there better be. I'm always ready. Um, but our current patrons are Melissa Goldman hey, welcome back. Danielle Reddix, justice Ampede, ewan Kasti, monica Thoreau, brent Black, nathaniel Sasekum, justin Vevins Green, mary Lou Chouquette, jean Vanals, russ Walker, musical Hell, emily Gracie, Kyle Summers, jenae C Scootin' the Technicolor Dreamcoat, nothing Assert in Sub-Beth and Taxes.


Besbian, robert Benjamin, jessica T Mitchell, young Chai Tikap, chris Markoat, kiji, marie, anastasio Trevi, joseph Leila, rj Nariga, julia MacLennan, bjorn Hermans, toriana Frazier, sammy the Adequate of Mount Jacobson, kaylee Blazier, cinema Get-N'Reviews Villanus, Miss Sofia, nali, the Omega Geek, paige Pearson, maddie Wargle, alisa Erdman, anna Lois-Catova, sarah Den Black, evan Ball, zachary Torres, rora Maraso, mara Forlun, lisa L, possessed Washing Machine, nick Roten, puffy Boy, sydney Hicks, anna Beal, billy Clifton, andrew Wright, the Red Caboose, caboom, gold Play to Kiki Mora, julia Baldur's, dotaer and Hutmut Butt. These folks give us a little extra financial support that helps us keep the lights on here. Musicals with cheese, if you'd like to join them in supporting us and get all those fun things Andrew brought up and discounts on our merch and our monthly patron meetups and a lot of other cool shit. And the Discord and the Discord. I keep forgetting to promote the Discord, but the Discord is fun. I know what. Maybe we should start some bingo nights. I feel like that'd be a good thing to do. I think we'd be better at it too.


Let's get back to the show ["The Opening Song"]. Okay, the opening shot of this movie is so fucking impressive. Do you guys remember it?

43:13 - Andrew (Host)

Oh god um.

43:15 - Jess (Host)

I'm trying to remember it. I saw this movie less recently than both of you.

43:20 - Andrew (Host)

It's following Mr On His Horse with the banjo. With the banjo, and then it goes up into a tree.

43:31 - Jess (Host)

So it's one long shot setting up it's a musical, making it diegetic, introducing the music in the world, then introducing the beat from the girls playing, creating a proper song in Huckleberry Pie. It is setting up the musical language of the film in one shot and it's beautiful, Truly next level, incredible, long take, filmmaking taking obviously some inspiration from Spielberg but also very much your own, very much gorgeous, very much everything you'd want in a film adaptation. Can we call this the entire Les Mis, this entire film?

44:08 - Andrew (Host)

Oh my god. Well, Les Mis is relevant right now, isn't it?

44:12 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, it's true.

44:14 - Jess (Host)

Have I talked about what I think might be happening with that Les Mis re-release? I know I tweeted about it and I know it's not really relevant to our color purple discussion, but I think I'd like to bring that up.

44:25 - Andrew (Host)

You just brought it up. So just to make it relevant, I am going to actually agree that this is the anti Les Mis, and I watched this with my girlfriend and we were joking about oh man, they should have cast Hugh Jackman in this role and Russell Crowe, that would have made this way better.

44:43 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Who would have played Russell Crowe? Russell Crowe would have played Harpo.

44:48 - Liz (Host)

Harpo, yeah, yeah.

44:51 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Sophia. I need to talk to you Well, Hugh.

44:54 - Andrew (Host)

Jackman would have been a.

44:58 - Jess (Host)

Mr Sealy what I said, mr.

45:01 - Liz (Host)

Well, if Hugh Jackman is Sealy, the name has to be Russell Crowe.

45:05 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, I think that makes perfect sense.

45:07 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, it makes more sense to me.

45:08 - Andrew (Host)

Okay, but like for real, hey sister what you gonna do.

45:11 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Gonna do the river. You're gonna play with you. This is cursed.

45:15 - Andrew (Host)

Alright, I'm gonna die.

45:16 - Speaker 4 (Host)


45:19 - Andrew (Host)

This is the actual worst thing to ever imagine. I'm regretting to read it up.

45:24 - Speaker 4 (Host)

I got my sister. I can see her now. She may not be here, but she's still mine.

45:32 - Andrew (Host)

Why do you do a good impression of these people?

45:35 - Jess (Host)

Yes, so Les Mis is getting re-released with a brand new. The word they're using is bold and new audio mix.


That's vague and I looked it up. So they sent an email to people about this, about what exactly is different, and I found it interesting what's going on there. So they listed four new audio mixers in their description in their promotional that were not on the original film's cast list. They are from live recordings like Disney's Newsy's and Heather's the Musical. They are by all means and a brand new orchestrator. They're bringing in the original orchestrator from the arena tours to re-orchestrate the film.

46:27 - Andrew (Host)

So are they getting new singers?

46:29 - Jess (Host)

No, but they are altering the score and the mix to fit the live singing better. So I don't know if you guys remember the film. They really doled down the orchestrations because they were singing live and I think they're just kind of bringing it back, which also leads me to believe maybe they're dubbing the singers a little bit because they're a rich.

46:53 - Andrew (Host)

Please dub the singers. There's a version where Hugh Jackman does not sound like he's literally going to die.

46:59 - Liz (Host)


47:01 - Jess (Host)

So I don't know if this would be worth doing, but I will definitely going to see this in theaters and report back, because I know it'll be different. I just know that in my bones Something's going to be different, or else they would not have remastered this and spent money on a re-release. It strikes all that bullshit, but they wouldn't be pushing a marketing budget behind this the way that they have been if there wasn't something going on. You might be right, you could be on to something, and they wouldn't be promoting brand new people that are not in the credits for the film if something wasn't going on.

47:38 - Andrew (Host)

Okay, so one other thing, since we're talking about new releases and whatever, before we talk about more songs.

47:45 - Jess (Host)

Yes, we'll get back to the color purple don't worry.

47:47 - Andrew (Host)

If we are, I'm actually going to go back to the color purple. Did this do well?

47:52 - Liz (Host)

Oh yeah.

47:53 - Jess (Host)

Not really.

47:54 - Andrew (Host)

I think, See, that's a problem, because this is the best representation of a musical in a movie theater in a while, even though they've been consistently trying.

48:06 - Jess (Host)

but it's been a bad year for movies altogether. Let's be clear this year has not been great. As far as Wikipedia says, on a hundred million dollar budget, it made fifty eight point four million dollars, which is not great. However, let's not forget that some of the biggest hitters out there, like Disney, has had an all time shitty year, with things like Wish and the Marvels flopping hard, basically. But, those movies suck though.

48:38 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, this movie is actually good.

48:40 - Speaker 4 (Host)

I don't know.

48:42 - Jess (Host)

I mean it's hard to get people to want to go to the theaters.

48:46 - Liz (Host)

I mean, this will probably do well once it gets to home media.

48:50 - Speaker 4 (Host)


48:51 - Jess (Host)

So, but it's hard to justify and right now we are talking about this in the wake of the Mean Girls movie, which came out about six days ago, right as of recording, which was meant to be a streaming alone project, that they updated to a feature film in theaters, which means they 100% are gonna make a profit off this just because most of the money spent on that is for the marketing push. But if you weren't Barbie or Oppenheimer, not really you weren't making money in 2023. Can, like, aside from like shocking hits, like you know, Super Mario Brothers movie, which is also garbage, don't at me you weren't really making money. Like I'm just looking at the films, that list of this year, the only one of the top 10, one of them is fucking Avatar, which technically came out the year before, and all the rest of them were quote unquote flops. If you weren't Barbie, Oppenheimer, or Garden of the Galaxy or Mario.

50:06 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Or Mario.

50:07 - Jess (Host)

Things like Mission Impossible flopped hard. Things like Elemental flopped at first but then gained its money back Wonka I don't even know where that's hitting and it just was not a good year for movies this year, probably because of the strikes, probably because of a lot of things, but even things that seemed like it would do well, like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, flopped, and the only reason why the Hunger Games did seem to do well is because they kept their budgets low. We are overblowing these budgets by a lot, and I love the color purple. I don't know if it needed a $100 million budget to make this film.

50:46 - Andrew (Host)

It's a movie that mostly takes place in a single house. Yeah, true.

50:51 - Jess (Host)

But I love this. Like we already talked about the fantasy sequences which do look good and do look expensive, yeah, yeah.

51:03 - Speaker 5 (Host)


51:04 - Andrew (Host)

You know it might make its money back with streaming. I guess really there's a lot of stuff that's new to the movie industry that you can't just look at box office anymore and just be like that's how much money it made, like you could before.

51:18 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, there's a lot of new ones to it now.

51:20 - Jess (Host)

Yes, I mean we've got the biggest musical of all time coming out later this year. It is a financial gamble, unlike any other movie musical we've ever seen with Wicked, I think it's not gonna do well just because the landscape we're currently in.

51:36 - Liz (Host)

I don't know, I don't know, with the Ariana drama attached to it.

51:43 - Jess (Host)

I don't think people come out for celebrities anymore Like I do not believe this would have done so any better if they had put like Beyonce in it. I know that the producers were pushing it. I don't think it would have affected the box office too much.

51:57 - Andrew (Host)

No, no, the landscape is completely like movie stars aren't even a thing anymore, really, yeah, like we don't have like a Arnold Schwarzenegger type, like people don't go to movies to see specific actors, necessarily.

52:10 - Jess (Host)

No, they do it to see like there's only one director that can really get asses into seats and that's Chris Nolan. Like that is like the only name value alone and he had to spend years doing some quality stuff to get there. Yeah.

52:26 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Yeah, let's talk about.

52:28 - Jess (Host)

Sheebie, Mine. See Lee's I Want Song ["Sheebie?

52:33 - Speaker 5 (Host)

Mine"]. When I see my little hold of babies After pain come across my heart, something deep inside Been torn apart In life, I swear from all my body and my baby's breath on me. She gon' carry her away, but I still see you. Oh, the Lord doesn't save your sound. Oh, I know, sheebie Mine. Oh, the Lord doesn't save your sound. Oh, I know, sheebie Mine.

53:29 - Jess (Host)

This is the moment I discovered that this was gonna be like a properly good movie. So let's talk about this song and its history really, really quick. It is not technically, in the original Broadway show, really Interesting. It was written as the audition song for Allie Willis, brenda Russell and Stephen Bray when they were trying to make the musical, so they basically submitted this as their go-to song. They were picked and then it got cut before the Broadway show premiered in 2005, and they put it back in for this.

54:05 - Andrew (Host)

So it was written for the. Broadway show, but it was never used, but cut and then replaced.

54:10 - Jess (Host)

Yes, beat, and it's so smart because Seely doesn't have an I Want song in the original show, and it's one of those things you don't realize until you have it.

54:21 - Andrew (Host)

It's a really good one actually too, and I love what they do with the scene, even though I don't fully understand what thematically it's supposed to mean with the prisoners and the people in the waterfall, but visually it looks very good.

54:35 - Jess (Host)

I think it's something to visually show interesting and keep a rhythmic beat to it. So the hitting of the prisoners, the kicking of the waterfalls and all that just to keep a music video beat to it. Should we talk about push to button?

54:51 - Liz (Host)

Oh, now that I'm here, yes, All right.

55:54 - Jess (Host)

Apparently, when we covered this the first time, I specifically said there's a very frank conversation in the book where this song originates from, about Seely being told the specifics of how her vagina works, and in that she was describing it like oh, it's like little wet rose petals. It's weird. And she's like how do you get in? It hurts. She's like there's a button and you got to push the button if you want to put things in there, because she's only experienced pain with it. So she's like no, you got to push the button to go in. And I found it baffling that they turn into a very funny tongue and cheek song out of what is essentially someone explaining their own body to them.

56:42 - Andrew (Host)

You know, they do say it though, so you can't complain, it's in there.

56:45 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, it is, it is, it is, it's exactly what you fucking wanted. It is. The context is very different, but who cares?

56:56 - Liz (Host)

Female sexuality should be empowering, Like let's talk about the clitoris in a fun way.

57:02 - Jess (Host)

I agree. But also it should be empowering in that someone should discover it in their own body, and I feel like Seely sexuality is kind of not a thing in this movie.

57:14 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, she reads to me as asexual for a lot of it.

57:18 - Jess (Host)

When literally honestly within the first five pages of the book which I've reread, the couple pages of this book. She's like I never felt about men or the way I feel about women, because women have never hurt me and I find women beautiful and I find men disgusting and I'm like that says it. Like that is as clear as day in the first like 20 pages of the book.

57:41 - Andrew (Host)

You know, if you wanted to watch the book, you could have watched the book.

57:45 - Jess (Host)

I could have, but I miss these pieces that I feel like really set the book apart. There are things that I'm glad they don't have in there, but there are pieces of empowering lesbian and women content specifically that go with Seely that I miss. What did we say incorrectly about the song previously that you would like us to rectify this time, liz?

58:10 - Liz (Host)

Honestly, I don't think you said anything wrong. After the top of my head, you guys just talked about the clitoris for like a minute.

58:17 - Speaker 4 (Host)

What's wrong with that?

58:18 - Liz (Host)

That's basically what I remember from that song discussion. Nothing wrong with that. You guys just talked about the clitoris.

58:24 - Jess (Host)

This song is a joke about a clitoris.

58:26 - Liz (Host)

So it's accurate.

58:28 - Jess (Host)

Yes, 100%.

58:31 - Liz (Host)

Also lady masturbation is valid.

58:35 - Jess (Host)

It is.

58:36 - Andrew (Host)

All masturbation is valid.

58:38 - Jess (Host)

No, no, male masturbation is a sin. God jerks off. How do you think we got Ben Shapiro?

58:48 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, where do you think rain comes from?

58:50 - Liz (Host)

It's God's tears from all the jacking off. That's a sight.

58:55 - Andrew (Host)

God doesn't need to cry I just imagine when I jerk off sometimes.

59:00 - Jess (Host)

I just imagine God's dick looking like you know, like a watering pale spigot.

59:06 - Andrew (Host)

If you look at the whole universe like the God is the universe right Earth is like right near where his genitals would be. We're basically like little bacteria living in his pubic hair.

59:23 - Jess (Host)

I can't wait for like real people, like people like that theologians. They're like. I really want to dive into the color purple. I feel like I need an interesting discussion and an hour in we hear this this is ridiculous.

59:36 - Andrew (Host)

They're talking about jerking off during the song about jerking off. This is ridiculous. This is not the mature discussion that I was hoping for.

59:48 - Jess (Host)

Yes, let's talk about I'm here, the other song that caused my audience to stand up and applaud so much that the movie leaves a pause for applause after it's done.

01:00:00 - Speaker 5 (Host)

I got my house. It's still keep the cold down. I got my chair when my body can't hold down. Got my hands doing good like they supposed to Showing my heart to the folks that I'm close to. I got my eyes know they don't see us for now. They see more about how things really are now.

01:01:01 - Jess (Host)

Every time this song has been played, or song or done everything, there is cheers and a collapse at two points in the song and it always happens without fail. It's when Ceeley says I'm beautiful, which is her finally coming to terms with her own beauty and love and self appreciation she's not ugly this whole show, which we didn't really discuss, but like she's not ugly this whole show. Yes, it is a little dialed down from the other movie and the book and the stage musical, but it still happens a lot.

01:01:34 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, yeah, it's definitely present. It's kind of awkward.

01:01:39 - Jess (Host)

The trigger point of this song is different than it is in the musical, and I already kind of gave this rant to Liz beforehand.

01:01:47 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, no, I texted him that. I saw it. And then he texted me a six message rant about the context of this song. It just does when you text him about things.

01:02:00 - Jess (Host)

They cut out the first few lines that lead to the song. The emotional reason why she's singing this song and here she gets, it's because Mr Comes by and, I believe, gives her all the letters from Nettie. Am I incorrect there?

01:02:13 - Andrew (Host)

Yes, no, well, wait, she's got the letters. A bunch of her stuff.

01:02:19 - Liz (Host)

Yes, yes, yeah, her stuff, and he buys a pair of ugly pants.

01:02:23 - Andrew (Host)

She already had the letters.

01:02:25 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, she's read all the letters already. She read those words in the movie of her she left.

01:02:28 - Jess (Host)

Yes, yes, yes, you're right. So this is triggered by her getting her stuff back and remembering her sister, and the first lines are I got my sister when in the stage musical. This song is triggered by Sugavri saying Silly, I want to go fuck other men, please by. And she's like wait, I thought you loved me, I thought we were in this together. And she's like yeah, just one more time. Let me go fuck a bunch of people and I'll be back. And the song starts with being abandoned by Silly and her saying I don't need you to love me, I don't need you at all. And she talks about all the things that she has, including her sister, and the things that make her valid outside of her romantic relationship. And, you know, I think I'm starting to understand why they did it.

01:03:17 - Andrew (Host)

People probably really like that character and don't like that that. She's a fucking horrible piece of shit who just leaves leaves our main character. Yes, fuck a bunch of men. So they probably were like let's make her more likeable. But likeability, honestly, they kind of did. Everyone got more likeable.

01:03:36 - Jess (Host)

I feel like Silly. The way that Silly finds self-love is not finding it other people, which is what she was doing throughout it. She was finding it in her children and all this other things and trying to find her validation through Sugg. And then she has to discover no, I don't need Sugg to be happy. I am happy because I am who I am and I don't think that hits as hard here because she's kind of already become independent. She has her own store, she has her house back. The catharsis doesn't hit as much and it's one of the few times she gets knocked down and gets up by herself, as opposed to being brought up by Sugg or someone else. And I feel like that kind of feels a little lost on here. And one of the and the reason why Mr and her become friends in the book is because they bond over both being cocked by Shukabri. It's weird.


But, they're like it was cock bonding, where it's like yeah, Sugg, yeah, Sugg.

01:04:37 - Liz (Host)

It's like trauma bonding, but worse.

01:04:40 - Jess (Host)

Exactly, and that is the reason why they become friends is because they both just vent about how much they're unrequited love for Sugg Avery, which, at least, is an interesting dynamic. I don't think it's right.

01:04:55 - Liz (Host)

No, it's wrong, it's wrong. You shouldn't be friends with someone who abused you, but like I don't see why you should.

01:05:01 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, I agree.

01:05:03 - Andrew (Host)

I just think that there's like a nice community spirit vibe at the end of this one, though. Yes, I like the scene around the tree and the color purple scene. Yeah, they're getting all happy about everybody being there. It's kind of nice.

01:05:19 - Liz (Host)

Also like as a person that has only seen this movie. I've never seen any other version of I'm here. I've read the entire new context is more of a. I've risen out of my trauma.

01:05:31 - Jess (Host)


01:05:31 - Liz (Host)

And I've become successful, but I haven't realized it until now, because my abuser is no longer has power over me. That's how I personally read it yes so that's why I found it impactful. And that is a hard said bound, because they'll make her scared of her and buying ugly pants to make her happy after being beaten for years and years. Yes, it was impactful to me personally, but I can see where Jess is coming from with the different context.

01:06:00 - Jess (Host)

And I think I just emotionally latched onto different things than you guys. Andrew, I attached to the community, you attached to the abuse, I attached to this core love story that basically doesn't exist anymore.

01:06:11 - Andrew (Host)

He might just have a crush on Shug Avery.

01:06:14 - Liz (Host)

I mean she's played by Taraji P Henson. Like why wouldn't he?

01:06:18 - Jess (Host)

I had a crush on Taraji P Henson the first time I saw Benjamin Button and have never stopped ever since. What a weird movie developer Chris went for. She is so, so wonderful in that movie.

01:06:29 - Liz (Host)

I don't remember that movie at all. She deserved.

01:06:34 - Jess (Host)

I think that was her first Oscar nomination. I could be wrong, but she is incredible in that film. Next level great. The Color Purple is a great song. I literally was like a mess in my own hands when every time Celie sees her children again I just feel so many horrendous deep emotions in every version and it is truly, truly one of the greatest catharsises. And just having that choral song playing and sung. I do kind of miss the fact that it's a reprise of a previous song which I'm pretty sure they shot and just had to cut for time, but it still works in its own context here.

01:07:15 - Liz (Host)

Also, it's the old Benjamin is the first and only accounting award nomination she's received, Are you?

01:07:20 - Jess (Host)

fucking okay. She has done so many incredible performances since Benjamin Button that that feels like ugh. You know who her husband in that film was.

01:07:32 - Liz (Host)

It's been years.

01:07:33 - Jess (Host)

Marshall Ali, who has won two Oscars in the meantime. True. What is our overall thoughts on the Color Purple?

01:07:43 - Speaker 4 (Host)

and our cheese ratings.

01:07:44 - Jess (Host)

Are we ready, Liz? Why don't you?

01:07:47 - Liz (Host)

go first it's ready as well. I guess I enjoyed this. I've only seen the movie. I haven't seen the stage show or read the book Most American audiences most likely. So I enjoyed this a lot. It's really well made. The acting's great. There's little things obviously that like aren't perfect, but that's basically every movie. So you know, the fantasy is really good, the act, the songs are well performed. I'd recommend seeing it. I enjoyed it. What is cheese rating? Baked mac and cheese.

01:08:29 - Jess (Host)

Beautiful, beautiful Andrew, do you want me to remind you of what your cheese rating from last time was?

01:08:36 - Liz (Host)

I don't remember what his was yet?

01:08:38 - Jess (Host)

Oh sure, it was goat cheese. And I'm looking at the list and you use goat cheese four times in a row before this and twice after it.

01:08:48 - Liz (Host)

I think his rationale for this one was I don't like it personally, or something, or I don't remember.

01:08:56 - Andrew (Host)

I'm glad I use goat cheese that much. It needed the representation.

01:08:59 - Jess (Host)

You also use Parmesan four times in a row, but you changed it up the last time with Christmas Parmesan.

01:09:08 - Liz (Host)

And Andrew's defense. That was really the early era before he got creative.

01:09:12 - Jess (Host)

We were 60 episodes in.

01:09:15 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, but like at a certain point.

01:09:16 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, that's the early era before we got creative.

01:09:18 - Liz (Host)

It was like two and 80 something.

01:09:20 - Jess (Host)

Fair enough fair enough, Andrew. Do you want to reframe that?

01:09:28 - Andrew (Host)

Well, this is a different thing, so I'm giving you a different cheese rating. It still has goat cheese the original, I'm not changing it. Yeah, this movie is really good. You should absolutely fucking watch this movie. Like just go watch it. Right now it's probably still in theaters, but it might not be because Mean Girls.

01:09:48 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, I had to go to one theater I don't go to anymore because all my other theaters weren't playing it anymore.

01:09:54 - Andrew (Host)

So yeah, it is on Amazon for $20, which is maybe more than a movie ticket.

01:10:00 - Liz (Host)

It's probably worth it.

01:10:02 - Jess (Host)

You can have it forever for $20.

01:10:04 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, great movie.

01:10:05 - Andrew (Host)

Just keep it. So yeah, I'm going to give it Southern Cheese Grits. I don't know what those are, but I'm sure they're grits with cheese. Sounds, good Sounds good to me. Probably People like grits.

01:10:24 - Jess (Host)

I like grits. I love this movie. Obviously I have pits to knit and all that, but truly I know it sounds like I had a lot of things that I didn't love about it, but the things that I loved I loved very, very hard and one of the best since Dream Girls and since Chicago. Truly perfect. And I wish that Fantasia was in more of the awards conversations. I have not seen poor things, but I wish that Fantasia would be able to get at least a nomination for an Oscar.

01:11:00 - Liz (Host)

I have seen poor things. Emma Stone is insane in that movie and it's kind of astounding. So I would keep her on that list.

01:11:09 - Jess (Host)

I'm not saying, remove Emma Stone, but I'm just saying Fantasia's great.

01:11:12 - Liz (Host)

I think you should add Fantasia to that list, though she should be in no worse contention.

01:11:15 - Jess (Host)

I loved Oppenheimer, but remove Emily Blunt from that list. She's fine, but you know.

01:11:22 - Liz (Host)

They should add Florence Puta to that list, just for the micro amount she's in it.

01:11:26 - Andrew (Host)

Oppenheimer sucked terrible movie.

01:11:28 - Jess (Host)

You are so wrong. Oppenheimer was kind of boring. You're both fucking wrong.

01:11:32 - Andrew (Host)

It was so boring I was falling asleep the whole time I watched it.

01:11:36 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Andrew, you did not watch it.

01:11:39 - Andrew (Host)

I definitely went and saw it. I fell asleep in the theater.

01:11:43 - Liz (Host)

That's why I didn't see it in theaters. I fell asleep.

01:11:47 - Andrew (Host)

Yeah, you can't see Oppenheimer in theaters.

01:11:49 - Jess (Host)

That's why I sleep. That movie is like having an anxiety attack for three hours. You can't just be bored in a theater if you're trapped watching it.

01:11:57 - Liz (Host)

Yeah but I have anxiety attacks whenever I feel like it, so why would I have one in a movie theater?

01:12:04 - Jess (Host)

You make good points.

01:12:05 - Liz (Host)

I am getting this. I fell asleep watching Lincoln, so you know.

01:12:08 - Jess (Host)

Lincoln is boring as fuck, so Anyway, jess do cheese ready. I am giving this Port Wine Derby, which is a beautiful looking cheese. I love wine and cheese. I will miss drinking it, but look at that, isn't that pretty.

01:12:28 - Andrew (Host)

I can't believe Jess turned into a straight edge yeah.

01:13:00 - Jess (Host)

I'm going to dig deeper. The cheese's. Juliet. Antonio, here's some ASMR for you. Juliet, the color purple when does it come from? Our themes are created by Robin Ash of IOU Music UK. Thank you to the Broadway Podcast Network for having us on the platform and for not kicking us off, for talking about the button that you push to get in. All right, guys, we have anything else left to say.

01:13:21 - Liz (Host)

Okay, I'm going to gripe about that fucking phrase. The button you push to get in is not accurate in any fucking way. It's a button you push to get things going. That's the better way to phrase that.

01:13:36 - Jess (Host)

Yeah, but you're not getting it if you don't push the button.

01:13:40 - Liz (Host)

Yeah, but it implies the clitoris is a different spot. It actually is.

01:13:47 - Jess (Host)

Wait, where does it imply the spot is?

01:13:49 - Liz (Host)

If it's just to get in, it's like where I don't want to have this.

01:13:54 - Andrew (Host)

I thought that we were talking about the belly button.

01:13:57 - Liz (Host)

So you've seen the room, yeah.

01:14:03 - Speaker 5 (Host)

You are my rose.

01:14:04 - Speaker 4 (Host)

You are my rose.

01:14:07 - Jess (Host)

I thought the clitoris was up the nose man.

01:14:10 - Liz (Host)

No, the clitoris is the lady's thumb.

01:14:15 - Jess (Host)

Damn Well, we'll see you next time on Musicals with Cheese.

01:14:27 - Speaker 4 (Host)

Like a plate of corn, like a honeybee, like a waterfall, all a part of me. Like the color purple. Where do we come from? Now my eyes are open. Look what God has done.

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