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[0:00] Martín Acuña: Hi everyone, I am Martín Acuña and you are listening to Backstage Talk.

[0:16] Martín Acuña: Jonathan Larson asked how can you make someone take off and fly in one of his songs from Tick Tick Boom, and I, for the past two years, have learned one way to do it, through the power of community. Welcome to the Latinx in Musical Theatre Special for Season 3 of Backstage Talk, where we will be featuring artists from across all positions in musical theatre, from several Latin American countries and different Latin heritages. I am proud to showcase my Latinx family. I hope you enjoy.

[0:52] Martín Acuña: Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Backstage Talk. Today's guest is a very dear friend of mine. I have here with me Camila Brugés. She is a performer, director, writer and producer for both film and stage shows. She is an amazing tap dancer, a massive writer and an incredible director. After working together in 2016 in an original jukebox musical called Casting, Camila and I bonded over musical theatre nerdiness and the power of storytelling through musical theatre. I am truly honoured to have one of my idols and closest friends in this industry today over on Backstage Talk. I admire Camila deeply and she was the perfect person to be in the first episodes of this Latinx in Musical Theatre Special for Season 3 of Backstage Talk. Camila, I am truly happy to have you over. Welcome to the show.

[1:58] Camila Brugés: Well, what can I say after that introduction, Martín? I love being here. I love, I don't know, keeping you company in this project that I feel is amazing and totally projects and shows who you are, what your passions are and what a wonderful human being you are. So, thanks for calling me and it's an honour as well to be here. I absolutely love it. I know that you come from a family of artists, but I want to know what made you choose the thespian path in life?

[2:34] Camila Brugés: Ah, well, I feel I have never been out of it. As you say, my family is full of performers in the musical business and theatre and television. So, it has been there all like since forever. I don't know a life that doesn't happen, you know, between rehearsals and sets and TV studios and, I don't know, behind cameras, in front of cameras. So, it's very natural to me. It's very natural to me as well to be like, quote-unquote, in a public eye, having a relationship with audiences and being aware of entertainment and storytelling. So, it's weird because I studied, I went to school and high school in Colombia. You go just to one school, like from the beginning to the end, which had sort of an emphasis in art, performing arts and the rest of them.

But I thought I was gonna study like car design, which was very weird. Yeah, very weird indeed. And that went until, I don't know, I was like in 10th grade and I really thought I was going to study car design. Then I went into architecture and, well, even there you can see there was like an inclination towards aesthetics and design and stuff. And I feel that I had gone through different experiences within performing arts, musical theatre, because as a child I had some experiences acting in radio shows in, I don't know how you say it in English, like radio soap operas or something like that, because my family was kind of, you know, traditional actors in that media. And I had, I don't know, I was part of Peter Pan as one of the kids, but I really never thought about becoming an actor, a serious actor as an adult.

And I guess it was in kind of a rebellion against, not like a tough, not like a strong committed rebellion against my family, but just to be a little bit different. I guess I never thought about following that path. And also because my mom was not really encouraging, not being against, but she was very open about the hardships of being an actor and what you need to go through, you know, in that industry. And she was like, maybe something else, or maybe not an actor and more behind the camera, more in the production area, which is, you know, like super tough as well. But she was, yeah, she was kind of protecting me. And in that school I was telling you about, they had like a really strong dance department, and we had tap dance in ninth grade.

And I fell in love, like, I was so struck by it. Like I could not believe it, the energy it has, the joy it brings to you when you're doing it, and the community. It feels so different from any other dance style and the community that gathers around, you know, ballet, dancing, or contemporary. Like all of them, you know, are like so identifiable niches of how you behave, a convention of living. And tap dancing is just like, you know, community, ghetto, jamming, having fun, the love of music, the love of someone that is outside of mainstream. And I just loved it. It was super strange in Colombia when I was tap dancing. I think we were not more than 50 people that I knew that tap danced. I don't know if it has changed, maybe a little bit.

It probably has. But I mean, I don't think there's like a thousand tap dancers in Colombia. So we knew each other. And it gave me sort of an identity, because I was really good from the beginning on in that. So it gave me like a spotlight, a place to shine, a place to have fun. And then it became very evident that I wanted to experience it. But in any case, I chose to go to New York to dig a little bit more into it as soon as I graduated from high school, thinking that I was coming back to study architecture. And I never came back. I stayed in New York and just kept on doing it. And, you know, learning many other things about musical theatre, dance, acting, etc.

[8:04] Martín Acuña: I love it. I love it. So I want to dig a little bit deeper in that journey in musical theatre, because you started as a performer and then transferred or slowly went down that directing writing path. So tell us a little bit about that.

[8:22] Camila Brugés: Well, I think that happened because I injured my knee and I sort of was forced into a different career path. But at the same time, after, you know, 20 years of that accident happening, I really think that, as they say, and it's very cliché, leading a creative team and directing and sort of putting together the people who are necessary for a project like that is the place where I have to be. And I sort of followed my intuition. I was just like pushed into it, like in a very not nice way by life. But then, I mean, it has been since super clear and lovely. I love being in that place from sitting in a desk and sort of imagining what happens, what's the story behind, which is sort of a torture-like process.

But, you know, it has joy sometimes a very few times. But then working with people, having a team, materializing it is just like, it's so awesome. It's so great, really. So I feel that's my place. That's where I have to be. And I think that happens to everyone who truly listens to an inner calling, to a force, to, you know, something beyond words and beyond your initial desire. It's just like, I feel life really works that way.

[10:15] Martín Acuña: Yeah, I agree with you. Life actually works in very mysterious ways sometimes. And funny and weirdly enough, it always takes us down a path that we need to go down. So I want to now know what's your directing process like from day one until opening night? Because I personally experienced it working with you. But I know that every process is different. Every play, every show is different. So I want to know the milestones, the key things from your directing process.

[11:01] Camila Brugés: I don't know if I have a process, like the formula process. I don't know if anyone does. I don't know if I would want to have one, but I don't reject that idea. But I feel that I build around images that come to me. I sort of think that we creatives download stuff. And it happens in the most unexpected moments and places, right? So suddenly you're walking.

[11:32] Camila Brugés: You see the character moving in a certain way and I kind of see in a very clear way how the stage is set for one instant. And then I kind of draw. I'm a terrible drawer. I don't think I have any skills with my hands. I think it all went to my feet. I try to draw and do conceptual thingies around those images. I really don't work with paper, maybe because I chose a writing path as well. I don't work right away with actors or with a dancer or maybe with composers. Like my process for casting the show you're talking about was very close to the composer of the play. And it was my first experience of working with a composer so closely and figuring out even scene structure or character decisions. But yeah, I feel from a whole piece that I begin with instants and moments that are very separate in the whole storyline and then kind of building around and closing the gaps between them and making sense and have consequence from one to the other.

And because I'm coming from a family that works in the TV industry and film industry, I also feel that I'm very audiovisual, very cinematic. And that sometimes is not a cool thing to have as a theatre director or as a theatre writer because you find obviously that you don't have the same tools. So if you want to, if you're thinking, if you're imagining like a close-up that with the camera is very clear that you can write in a certain way, induce the director to do a close-up. Well, you cannot like, how do you do that? How do you translate that to the stage? And I feel I spent a lot of time there in translation, you know, in translation from a cinematic narrative to the theatre form. So yeah, I spent a lot of time with myself.

I spent a lot of time drawing and I just kind of put myself in the rehearsal space and just making, make it happen. I also feel that I surround myself and I'm very good at it with very talented people. So for me, this, the joy of this work is about conversation really with people I admire and people who bring things to the table, people that can give me, you know, like a clear idea of what's like forming in my head.

[15:00] Martín Acuña: I love it. And that is something, that is a pretty nice skill to have, to know how to surround yourself with people that understand your vision.

[15:06] Camila Brugés: No, and I think it's, you know, it's just like a teamwork. I don't see how it can happen in any other way, really. And, you know, I hate, and I've always said like, I have never had the ambition of working with a genius or like a brilliant mind that is a horrible person. I really want to create healthy environments and just environments where people thrive. And that's it. That's it. I want to have fun. Like I seriously lit candles before any project of just like, I don't want drama queens. I don't want this to be a struggle for anyone. I don't want like, you know, yeah, just excessive drama or any toxicity because really like we're doing entertainment. So come on. It doesn't make sense to, you know, take it so seriously.

[16:10] Martín Acuña: Yeah. I agree with you. Why do we need drama? We need drama, but not inside of our teamwork.

[16:18] Camila Brugés: Yeah. Like the other kind of drama, the good drama.

[16:22] Martín Acuña: So what advice would you tell a younger version of yourself, a younger Camila?

[16:28] Camila Brugés: Trust. Well, I tell that to myself like every morning. Well, I lit the candle. Because that's, I think that's the process of a lifetime. And I believe that it must be like that for most of us, or at least the people that I have talked to in my life. Like we, the people who work within the artistic community doubt so much about everything themselves. And because it's weird, you know, like we're downloading ideas and it's easy to think like, why is this important? Does this make sense? Because you're like materializing something out of thin air. So, and why you, why do you have to be heard? So many questions, but when you're given certain talents, and when you have like a sensibility towards the world, I feel you have, maybe not a responsibility because I feel that's like a guarded word.

And it gives that weight that is super unnecessary. But I feel you have just like, you know, an open door. So you just have to cross the door. And then the next one, and the next one, and just like, keep on moving and believing in. Yeah, I would say to myself, like, you know, it will happen. And that brings me to that, you know, that thing that you really don't know when you're young, and is that life is not lived in the future, but just like, every single day, every single moment. So yeah, just like, not take it so seriously and just enjoy it. Enjoy it. Not that I didn't do that.

[18:20] Martín Acuña: Yeah, absolutely. I feel you like a little bit of trust in whatever lies ahead. So you lived for a couple years in New York, you got to taste the theater and the dance scene in New York, you have also lived through the theater scene here in Colombia, and you're now living in Mexico. What is for you visibility and representation in theater and film?

[18:59] Camila Brugés: As an Athena? Yes. That's such a huge question. Well, I don't, I'm not sure of how to answer that question. But I mean, representation for anyone is important. And it's so basic, that when you are beginning to write, for example, for the TV industry, that is more massive. The premise is always you are writing for people to feel represented by those characters. And if not, they will change, they will change and watch something else. So it's just like a basic premise. You need to be included as a spectator. If you don't see yourself there, there's a missing link, and you're watching the others. But it's a tricky question, not only for the Latino community, also the trans community, the gay community, the black community, the Jewish community, that like, everyone who is not, you know, the status quo, that can be also a very wide concept.

And I think the industry, the industry, both in stage and screen, has included more Latinos and people from, you know, the fringe zone. Not because they want to, but because people from minorities have started doing things, have taken the bull by its horn. And I feel it's very important to have like a fight, a revolution to be out, to be like, you know, like having the conversation, having this conversation. But I feel you do more when you do, when you put yourself in the position and you become a creator, when you become a director, when you become a producer. Because if you stay and wait for Hollywood or the West End or Broadway to talk about you, well, you're going to be waiting for a long time.

Because they're not really interested, because they have not, they have not needed us to make money, which is all the industry really, or all industries really are interested in. The industry is not interested in, you know, education, building community, and I don't know, becoming like a more sensible, intelligent species. They don't care at all about anything. They just care about numbers. So if they have not needed us to do that, to become, you know, this multi-billion corporations, why would they look this way? If they have, it's because now they perceive an audience that, you know, is reclaiming, like, where am I there? So I feel, you know, it has happened, whatever, whatever inclusion minorities have now in entertainment.

It's because of the conversation, it's because we are reclaiming our place there, but it's also because we have gained trust in our artistic processes, our ideas, and we have become producers of our own, yeah, shows, podcasts, theatre play, our own content. If not, wait and wait.

[23:05] Camila Brugés: The New West Side Story. And they didn't feel represented, a lot of them. And then it becomes such a complex conversation, because then you have to talk about what is the Puerto Rican experience? What is the New Yorican experience? What is the Puerto Rican experience in Puerto Rico? And how is it different from second generation Latinos in New York? And it becomes just within that specific community, it's such a wide and diverse experience in life. Then really, you cannot identify the Latino idea. That is such a cliché. What is a Latino? Do you think, or does anyone think that Mexicans are the same as Colombians? Right now, I'm writing a film, a very unique film, for a Mexican director. And she's always, we always laugh because we are so different in the way we express.

And we both have Spanish as a principal language. And culturally, we have many places in common. Families, this is a movie about a family. The decision, the choices the characters make are very similar. But the way we talk is so different. But then the gap is just like, whew. So the conversation about representation is like, okay, come on. It's going to take time. If you want to see a Colombian represented in Broadway, seriously, you have to be a Colombian writer, director, actor, and go do the show. Because why are you expecting to have an American director to do that? That's why Lin-Manuel Miranda just found and really had the vision, and the strength, and the opening, and the talent, such amazing talent, to do something no one had thought, but he did it all.

He was not invited into his own show, his own ideas. So that's, I think we have to do it. If we want to do musical theater, we have to build our own musical theater. Because also Broadway and West End is very culturally attached to the Anglo culture. So I mean, it's big. Sorry, such a long answer, but that's perfect.

[25:58] Martín Acuña: It's perfect. And I loved it. Because this takes me to one of our last questions. And it is what, for you in this process of creating Latin characters, because you write about Latin experiences and specifically Colombian experiences. What is the most important part of creating these characters for the film or for the stage?

[26:22] Camila Brugés: Well, I always try to go for authenticity. When you're writing someone from your own culture, it kind of flows. But at the same time, you see yourself kind of like stepping on eggshells. Because within your own culture, you don't have the experience of a humble person that lives in the rural areas. You're a person who was born in the capital city and went to study dance in New York, which is pretty exceptional. And I don't know, the 0.000001% of Colombian population. So you're always kind of, I, from my experience, what I want to do is kind of researching a lot, talking to people, talking to people who relate more closely to the character than I do in my own life. And from there, try to bring truth.

I think that, you know, the human experience has many places of universality. Global experience, you know, global human experience. But if you don't bring locality, it's nothing. It's like an archetype. And I feel research is just like the base. If you don't do it well, what are you doing? Yeah, so try to do that.

[28:10] Martín Acuña: Yeah, and you do a lot of research. And I remember in our process with our show, you talked to us as performers. You talked to us a lot. And you wanted to know our experiences, even though our age gap wasn't much. It wasn't even 10 years between you as the director and us as the cast. And that research was like something that really has been embedded in all my creation process and in my writing process, to just like go deeper on things.

[28:49] Camila Brugés: Yeah, absolutely. And I feel like when you are like, not only those, our creative process was very particular in the fact that we had total freedom of what we wanted to do. And it was within like a school system or a school experience, a university experience. And I feel as an educator, that is very important for my students to feel represented in their artistic experiences in university. Because it makes like, seriously, it makes no sense to me of young adults or teenagers doing Hamlet. Not to, I mean, obviously, you can learn things and Shakespeare is very important, but I feel you gain more as a young adult. And as a performer as well, if you are playing a character that resembles you in real life, that is exactly the same things you are.

Because then again, as what I said about writing, you can bring your own experiences, but not that thing of, how's it called? Well, I don't know, but not digging emotions from a conceptual kind of point or searching for your sadness when your dad left you when you were three years old, or your most painful trauma. It's like, why do you have to do that? If you have the possibility of working with a group of actors and creating a show or whatever it is, out of nothing, why don't you try to do something that resembles the things that you're experiencing? I feel that opportunity has, it's invaluable. And of course, then conversation is a way that you can access. And when you're not working with something that resembles your own particular experience, still, we're all human beings.

So talking with an actor for hours, I feel it's absolutely necessary. I don't believe in giving actors a text and then marking movement in space and watch it happen in front of my eyes. I feel there has to be many, many conversations about what does it make you feel? What do you believe the text is really talking about? Something has a specific X. And you know that I work that way as where do you think the text is telling you to make a pass and why? Probably because I come from a family who acted in radio and reading is key. And because I write, so for me, text is important. It's not a pretext. I know that I know what it takes to write something and why do I make a mark on pausing or whatever.

[32:11] Martín Acuña: Yeah. Yeah. I agree with you. Cami, if someone wants to follow you on social media, know more about the work that you're doing, where can they find you? Where can they contact you if they want to work with you?

[32:22] Camila Brugés: Oh, wow. Well, in social media, I only use Instagram because now is that for like old people now? Because I don't have like other things that I don't know the name of even. But I'm on Instagram. That's all I can stand. And it already bores me a little bit. And my username is Labruges, which is L-A-B-R-U-G-E-S, which is my last name. And I'm pretty, you know, I talk a lot with strangers there. And I've met a lot of friends there. And I traveled for a long time with my wife. And I found allies all over the world through Instagram. So I like it. That's an easy way to contact me.

[33:13] Martín Acuña: I love it. One last question before we wrap up. Which are your top five favorite musical theater shows?

[33:22] Camila Brugés: No. Wow. Wow. Well, Rent. I don't know. I have to give a thought. I love Wicked because it's so classic. And it's so Disney. And I love it. I love it so much. I'm forgetting names. Let me think a little bit more about that. I'll come back to you with that.

[33:49] Martín Acuña: Well, that's our last question.

[33:51] Camila Brugés: All right. So you're gonna be with three. My three favorite shows.

[33:57] Martín Acuña: Awesome. Your top three. Cami, thank you so much for coming over. I have loved this conversation. And I really cannot wait to keep seeing your work all the way from here. I'm sending you all my love.

[34:09] Camila Brugés: Well, back to you. Thank you. You know, I love you very much.

[34:16] Martín Acuña: Thanks, everyone, for listening to this new episode of Backstage Talk. Remember to follow us on Facebook and Instagram at Backstage Talk Podcast.