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[0:00] Ruthie Fierberg: I'm Ruthie Fierberg, and this is Why We Theater.

[0:05] Ruthie Fierberg: The podcast that digs into the onstage works we love to make the offstage change we need.

[0:12] Ruthie Fierberg: After all, that is why we theater.

[0:17] Ruthie Fierberg: In case you missed it, in our last main episode, we talked about Nadira Simone's play, The Killing of Kings.

[0:24] Ruthie Fierberg: This play has not been produced on stage anywhere yet.

[0:28] Ruthie Fierberg: I saw it in a Zoom reading from Brave New World Repertory Theater as part of their Brave New Works series.

[0:34] Ruthie Fierberg: In addition to the week's necessary conversation about mass incarceration and the transition of incarcerated persons out of prison, I hope Why We Theater propels producers and artistic directors to mount this play in their theaters.

[0:49] Ruthie Fierberg: So for those of you who haven't listened to the episode yet, allow me to entice you.

[0:54] Ruthie Fierberg: The Killing of Kings begins on the day Patrick King finishes serving time, his second stint in prison, and he returns home to his wife and three adult children.

[1:05] Ruthie Fierberg: Laced with the undercurrent of racism, police brutality, and Black Lives Matter, Nadira's examination of this family brings to light not just the literal killing of Black people in America, but specifically the killing of souls, the killing of families, the killing of relationships by incarceration.

[1:24] Ruthie Fierberg: Because when someone is convicted of a crime and sent to prison, they are not the only ones serving time.

[1:31] Ruthie Fierberg: Now I want to be clear.

[1:32] Ruthie Fierberg: I'm not arguing that we should eliminate consequences for committing crimes, but I do believe we need to be much more thoughtful in what those consequences are.

[1:43] Ruthie Fierberg: In my eyes, the goal should be to transform an incarcerated individual, to heal them, treat them, help them change their thought processes and behaviors so they do not re-offend.

[1:56] Ruthie Fierberg: And that's in the case of if they actually committed a crime, because we're not talking about wrongful conviction today.

[2:04] Ruthie Fierberg: A totally separate issue.

[2:05] Ruthie Fierberg: All of this brings me to today's recommendation, an incredible documentary I watched called The Prison Within.

[2:13] Ruthie Fierberg: The film comes from Catherine Hervey, who served as a Los Angeles public defender and volunteer prison college instructor, working with prisoners who had committed serious acts of violence and were sentenced to die in prison.

[2:26] Ruthie Fierberg: The documentary chronicles the stories of about six incarcerated men as they participate in the victim offender education group run by the Insight Prison Project of San Quentin Prison in San Francisco.

[2:40] Ruthie Fierberg: This group is one of the only of its kind in the U.S. prison system that unites those who have committed crimes and those who have been victims of crimes together in a restorative justice process.

[2:52] Ruthie Fierberg: And watching this documentary really changed me.

[2:55] Ruthie Fierberg: It prepared me for the conversation I had with Nadira and experts Anthony Dixon and Esther Matthews.

[3:02] Ruthie Fierberg: I have to tell you, not so long ago, I might have been scared to speak to Anthony or Esther or both of them.

[3:09] Ruthie Fierberg: I would have judged them.

[3:11] Ruthie Fierberg: But I fundamentally believe people can change and that people make mistakes of all sizes and impacts.

[3:18] Ruthie Fierberg: So watching The Prison Within, I listened to the stories of the crimes these particular men committed.

[3:24] Ruthie Fierberg: Some of them killed people, but this film pushed me to see the restorative justice process in this group.

[3:35] Ruthie Fierberg: So first, the incarcerated person immerses himself in deep introspection.

[3:40] Ruthie Fierberg: He investigates his own behavior, his upbringing, his pain, and this is breakthrough work guided by a restorative justice professional.

[3:49] Ruthie Fierberg: And it's wild what these men uncover.

[3:57] Ruthie Fierberg: So, for example, if a man killed someone, they meet with, say, the widow of someone who was killed, but not the incarcerated person's specific victim.

[4:09] Ruthie Fierberg: It's a surrogate victim.

[4:11] Ruthie Fierberg: And this type of justice is about processing and healing rather than retribution or punishment.

[4:19] Ruthie Fierberg: Our current criminal justice system asks what law was broken, who broke it, how do we punish them?

[4:26] Ruthie Fierberg: Restorative justice asks, what happened and what needs to happen now.

[4:31] Ruthie Fierberg: Troy Williams, a formerly incarcerated man who went through San Quentin's process, put it best.

[4:37] Ruthie Fierberg: He said, "You take people that have already experienced huge amounts of trauma, you place them in an environment that further exacerbates that trauma, and then you hold them there."

[4:49] Ruthie Fierberg: "And then you turn around and you release them."

[4:51] Ruthie Fierberg: "And then somehow society expects there's going to be a different result."

[4:55] Ruthie Fierberg: "And that trauma then continues to get transferred right back into the community."

[5:01] Ruthie Fierberg: With the current system, from the years 2005 to 2014, 68% of people released from state prison were rearrested within three years.

[5:11] Ruthie Fierberg: Because we are not treating imprisoned people, we are exacerbating rather than resolving the issues that put them there in the first place.

[5:19] Ruthie Fierberg: The Prison Within depicts an alternative.

[5:22] Ruthie Fierberg: It shows us the process in action and some of its results.

[5:26] Ruthie Fierberg: It's incredible to watch how the restorative justice facilitators change, how the survivors change, and of course how the men at San Quentin change.

[5:36] Ruthie Fierberg: Restorative justice is about actually changing individuals and making communities safer.

[5:42] Ruthie Fierberg: Again, it's not excusing wrongdoing.

[5:46] Ruthie Fierberg: It's about forgiveness and transformation.

[5:49] Ruthie Fierberg: And if you're out there thinking, I could never understand how a person could kill another human being.

[5:56] Ruthie Fierberg: Please watch this.

[5:58] Ruthie Fierberg: I was once of that same philosophy.

[6:00] Ruthie Fierberg: If you're thinking, there's nothing you could say to me to make me believe a murderer should not spend their life in jail.

[6:07] Ruthie Fierberg: Again, watch this.

[6:09] Ruthie Fierberg: You may not change your mind, and I respect that.

[6:12] Ruthie Fierberg: But I think what you see and hear will surprise you.

[6:15] Ruthie Fierberg: Watch simply to witness.

[6:18] Ruthie Fierberg: If nothing else, you'll be in awe of the survivors who changed throughout this.

[6:23] Ruthie Fierberg: As Esther explained in our main discussion, restorative justice relies on three pillars: the person who committed the crime, the victim of that crime, and the community.

[6:33] Ruthie Fierberg: In her words, all three need to accept responsibility for how our fabric of society got shredded and how we fix it.

[6:42] Ruthie Fierberg: And I think that watching this documentary is the community's piece of this.

[6:48] Ruthie Fierberg: If you tuned into that episode, you also know that our expert Anthony Dixon of the Parole Preparation Project has thoughts on the term restorative justice and that process.

[6:57] Ruthie Fierberg: So I urge you to go back and hear that debate and all the other honest thoughts batted back and forth.

[7:03] Ruthie Fierberg: Because the fact is that the current system locks up a lot of people.

[7:08] Ruthie Fierberg: 2.2 million people in the United States are incarcerated, which costs taxpayers 260 billion dollars per year.

[7:17] Ruthie Fierberg: Our country has 5% of the world's population, but 25% of the world's prisoners, and 40% of the 2.2 million, which comes to about 880,000 people, are imprisoned with no compelling public safety reason.

[7:34] Ruthie Fierberg: We talked about all of this in our panel episode.

[7:37] Ruthie Fierberg: But The Killing of Kings put these statistics in a human context for me.

[7:42] Ruthie Fierberg: It showed me the effects of imprisonment on Patrick King himself and on three generations of his family.

[7:50] Ruthie Fierberg: The documentary The Prison Within further expands that lens.

[7:54] Ruthie Fierberg: Find the documentary on YouTube where you can buy or rent it for as little as $3.99.

[7:59] Ruthie Fierberg: Filmmaker Catherine Hervey sought to create a movie that captures the complexity of people locked behind bars that contrasts with the dominant black and white depiction of victims, prisoners, and those who we label criminals.

[8:12] Ruthie Fierberg: And from where I sit, she did just that.

[8:15] Ruthie Fierberg: She opened my mind with The Prison Within, and she can open yours.

[8:20] Ruthie Fierberg: After all, that is why we theater.

[8:34] Ruthie Fierberg: If you like the show, subscribe at bpn.fm slash WWT or Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[8:43] Ruthie Fierberg: And don't forget to leave a review and tell your friends.

[8:46] Ruthie Fierberg: Our theme music is by Benjamin Velez.

[8:46] Ruthie Fierberg: Why We Theater is recorded in part on the traditional lands of the Wapinger and Lenape peoples.

[8:55] Ruthie Fierberg: I acknowledge this land was unjustly taken from them and pay my respect to elders both past and present.

[9:02] Ruthie Fierberg: Special thanks to Dori Berinstein, Alan Seales, Lee Silverman, Patrick Taylor, Tony Montaneri, Wesley Birdsall, Elena Mayer, and Suzanne Chipkin.

[9:12] Ruthie Fierberg: For more resources for change, info about our guests, and more, visit us at WhyWeTheater.com.