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[0:00] Joe Barros: The music of tomorrow is being written today. The music of tomorrow is almost ready to play.

[0:18] Jen Sandler: Experience the musicals of tomorrow today. Get a glimpse inside the blueprint of an original musical being developed in real time.

[0:26] Joe Barros: With New York Theatre Barn's podcast, The Musicals of Tomorrow.

[0:40] Joe Barros: I'm Joe Barros and I'm Jen Sandler and we're the hosts of The Musicals of Tomorrow.

[0:46] Jen Sandler: As the Artistic Director and Associate Artistic Director of New York Theatre Barn, we make space to speak in community with musical theatre writers and their creative teams.

[0:56] Joe Barros: Lifting up songs from original culture-shifting musicals in development and introducing them to a global audience has become a major part of New York Theatre Barn's evolving story.

[1:06] Jen Sandler: Each original musical's intention, content, and journey are unique and extraordinary to the storytellers who create them.

[1:14] Joe Barros: We believe that there is no formula for musical theatre except authenticity.

[1:20] Jen Sandler: We recently spoke with the writer of Ramona, Nevada Lozano, and the writer of Johnny & The Devil's Box, Douglas Waterbury-Tieman.

[1:28] Joe Barros: Our first musical is Ramona, which has music and lyrics by Nevada Lozano.

[1:33] Jen Sandler: Based on the classic novel by Helen Hunt Jackson, Ramona tells the story of an orphaned girl growing up on a Mexican hacienda in Southern California in the 1850s.

[1:43] Joe Barros: She falls in love with a Native American ranchero, and together they journey across the new U.S. state in search of a place to call home.

[1:51] Jen Sandler: With a blend of American, Native American, and Mexican musical styles, Ramona is an epic love story set during one of the most violent, tumultuous times in American history.

[2:02] Joe Barros: And now, here's our conversation with the writer of Ramona, Nevada Lozano.

[2:06] Nevada Lozano: Hey, Joe. Hey, Jen. How's it going?

[2:08] Jen Sandler: Let's dive in. So, Nevada, you are a musical theatre composer and lyricist, as well as a professional music director, arranger, orchestrator, and pianist. What a mouthful.

[2:18] Joe Barros: In the past two seasons, you've had the pleasure of being a part of the music teams of The Sound Inside, Seawall Alife in Oklahoma, among many other projects off-Broadway and regionally.

[2:29] Jen Sandler: You're also a proud member of the BMI Lehman Engel Musical Theatre Workshop and received their Jerry Harrington Award for Outstanding Creative Achievement in 2018.

[2:38] Nevada Lozano: I'm bad right here, Angela.

[2:44] Jen Sandler: So, I was like your obituary teacher, like your lifetime.

[2:50] Joe Barros: We like to lift you up because we think you're special.

[2:53] Jen Sandler: And I first became familiar with you as an artist when you reached out to me to tell me about your new musical that's centered around the Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Contest, a musical called Hot Diggity.

[3:04] Nevada Lozano: I've come far, I would think, going from writing about a hot dog eating contest to writing about, you know, political turmoil in Southern California in the 1850s.

[3:13] Jen Sandler: Totally, but I think that I totally recognize that you were a really promising musical theater voice on the musical theater scene and that you were writing really interesting stories, the really sophisticated songwriting approach to them.

[3:26] Joe Barros: I also wanted to note that we also got to collaborate on a few projects with you as music director and you're fantastic.

[3:31] Jen Sandler: As we mentioned, Ramona was previously featured in our February 2019 New Work Series at the Daryl Roth Theater.

[3:37] Joe Barros: So, Nevada, in addition to your work as a skilled musician, when did you discover that you were a writer?

[3:42] Nevada Lozano: Oh, man, it happened gradually. I started taking piano lessons in second grade.

[3:48] Nevada Lozano: And then only a couple of years after that, I started putting my own melodies together. And my interests kind of changed focus as I was growing up.

[3:56] Nevada Lozano: So I remember getting really into like Danny Elfman and film music and wanting to write that kind of music. And then inexplicably, I turned into like ragtime and I was obsessed with ragtime for a couple of years.

[4:08] Nevada Lozano: And then early on in college, I started reading plays and really getting into musicals. And that's been my obsession ever since.

[4:16] Jen Sandler: Wow. So this show, Ramona, what led you to want to adapt Helen Hunt Jackson's classic novel that so much is about female empowerment with a strong female protagonist? Why this show?

[4:25] Nevada Lozano: The novel just swept me up. You know, it's an epic story. It's an epic romance. By chapter two, I was completely swept up in the story and it didn't let me go.

[4:35] Joe Barros: Awesome. Well, tell us a little bit about the show's development. We do know that the show was featured in our Newark series and that your producer is Mr. John Albert Harris.

[4:44] Nevada Lozano: Good friend and good producer, John Albert Harris, who lots of what I do, it passes through him first before it enters the outside world.

[4:54] Nevada Lozano: But, yeah, as far as the show's development goes, you know, I started writing it when I was in the first year of the BMI Musical Theater Workshop. And then I continued writing that throughout the second year.

[5:03] Nevada Lozano: And that's the year where you get to work on a full length project. So I got to showcase a lot of the songs during that year. And then, of course, the pre premiere.

[5:11] Nevada Lozano: And since then, I've been fortunate enough to get some writing residencies. Some that happened earlier this year. KHN Center for the Arts in Nebraska, Rush Creek in Wyoming. I've got one at Yaddo.

[5:23] Jen Sandler: Sure. That sounds awesome. Tell us about our first epic song tonight.

[5:29] Nevada Lozano: Our first epic singer. Yes, we have an epic singer, fantastic singer. It's called Donde la Tierra Toca el Cielo, which is where the earth touches the sky.

[5:38] Nevada Lozano: And it's sung by Shereen Pimentel. We're very, very excited to have tonight. And it's Ramona's I Want song.

[5:44] Nevada Lozano: It comes fairly early in the show and it happens right after Ramona asks her guardian, Senora Moreno, about her biological parents, who Ramona knows nothing about.

[5:54] Nevada Lozano: And the Senora keeps withholding any information she knows about Ramona's biological parents. And so after she gets scolded and like Disney princess fashion, Ramona retreats to a stream at the edge of the Hacienda and looks longingly at the water and contemplates running away.

[6:12] Nevada Lozano: Don't we all? So here is the amazing Shereen Pimentel for Donde la Tierra.

[6:31] ♪ Musical number: "Donde la Tierra Toca el Cielo" — performed by Shereen Pimentel ♪

[11:14] Joe Barros: Yes! She was wonderful. I'm so glad we got to work with her.

[11:21] Jen Sandler: She's amazing, yeah. I felt very lucky when she said yes, and obviously she did an amazing job.

[11:25] Joe Barros: Yeah, and you can also see her if you're a John Mulaney fan. She's on the Sack Lunch Bunch.

[11:29] Jen Sandler: Right, that's right.

[11:30] Joe Barros: By our friend Eli Boland. All right, well, New York Theatre Barn favorite Amanda Robles is singing the next song. Do you want to set up this song?

[11:36] Nevada Lozano: Sure, absolutely. So this song is sung by a much more worldly experienced character, you could say.

[11:45] Nevada Lozano: So it's sung by Margarita, who is a maid at the Rancho Moreno where Ramona lives. And she sings it to this guy, Alessandro, who is the Native American ranchero who comes to work there for the summer.

[11:52] Nevada Lozano: And obviously there's a huge attraction between Ramona and Alessandro, but Margarita wants him for his own. So this is her seduction song.

[12:06] Nevada Lozano: So here is the lovely Amanda Robles.

[12:37] ♪ Musical number ♪

[13:16] Teresa Attridge: Welcome back to Backstage Pass. Today, we have two incredible guests joining us, Nevada Lozano and Douglas Waterbury-Tieman. We're excited to dive into their works, "Ramona" and "Johnny & The Devil's Box."

[13:46] Pauls Macs: Yes, both pieces are so rich in storytelling and music. Nevada, can you tell us a bit about "Ramona" and what inspired you to adapt this classic novel?

[14:06] Nevada Lozano: Absolutely! "Ramona" is based on the novel by Helen Hunt Jackson, which tells the story of an orphan girl growing up on a Mexican hacienda in Southern California during the 1850s. The novel explores themes of love, identity, and the search for belonging, which I found incredibly compelling. I wanted to bring this story to life through a musical lens, blending American, Native American, and Mexican musical styles to reflect the diverse cultural landscape of that time.

[14:26] Pauls Macs: That sounds beautiful. The historical context adds so much depth to the narrative. Douglas, shifting to you, can you share what "Johnny & The Devil's Box" is about and how you came to create it?

[14:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Sure! "Johnny & The Devil's Box" follows Johnny Baker, a young fiddler who believes he’s the best there ever was. However, he faces a challenge from the Devil himself, who haunts the hills of North Georgia. The story is about Johnny's journey as he navigates the pressures of fame, love, and the expectations of society. It’s a celebration of music's power to heal and unite communities, which I think is a vital message.

[15:06] Teresa Attridge: I love that theme of music as a unifying force. Can you both talk about the musical styles you incorporated into your shows?

[15:26] Nevada Lozano: In "Ramona," I wanted to create a soundscape that reflects the cultural influences of the characters. We have traditional Mexican folk music, Native American rhythms, and American musical elements that all come together to tell Ramona's story. It’s a blend that honors the heritage of the characters while also making it accessible to contemporary audiences.

[15:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: For "Johnny & The Devil's Box," I drew heavily from bluegrass and folk traditions, which are deeply rooted in the culture of North Georgia. The music is lively and energetic, reflecting Johnny's youthful spirit and the struggles he faces. I collaborated with Annabelle Fox, who brings her own unique voice and style to the project, which adds another layer to the music.

[16:06] Pauls Macs: Collaboration seems to be a key element in both of your works. How did you approach working with your teams?

[16:26] Nevada Lozano: Collaboration is essential in theater. I worked closely with my music director and choreographer to ensure that every element of the production aligned with the story we wanted to tell. It was important to create a safe space for everyone to share their ideas and contribute to the vision.

[16:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: I completely agree. With "Johnny & The Devil's Box," I had the pleasure of working with a fantastic team, including Annabelle and our music supervisor, Scott Wasserman. We had many discussions about the themes and how to best express them through music. It was a collaborative effort that made the project stronger.

[17:06] Teresa Attridge: It sounds like both of you have built wonderful creative environments. What do you hope audiences take away from your shows?

[17:26] Nevada Lozano: I hope audiences walk away with a deeper understanding of the complexities of identity and belonging. "Ramona" is a story that resonates with many people today, and I want them to feel connected to the characters and their journeys.

[17:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: For "Johnny & The Devil's Box," I hope audiences feel inspired by the power of music and community. It’s a reminder that we can overcome our differences and come together through shared experiences, especially in challenging times.

[18:06] Pauls Macs: Those are powerful messages. Can you both share a bit about the development process for your shows?

[18:26] Nevada Lozano: The development process for "Ramona" has been quite a journey. We started with workshops to test the material and gather feedback. It was crucial to hear from diverse voices to ensure we were honoring the story's roots while making it relevant for today’s audience.

[18:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Similarly, we held readings and workshops for "Johnny & The Devil's Box." It was important to refine the music and the script based on audience reactions. Each iteration brought us closer to the final product, and I’m grateful for the insights we gained along the way.

[19:06] Teresa Attridge: It’s fascinating to hear about your processes. What has been the most rewarding part of creating these musicals for you both?

[19:26] Nevada Lozano: For me, the most rewarding part has been seeing the characters come to life on stage and knowing that their stories resonate with people. It’s fulfilling to create something that can spark conversations and inspire change.

[19:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: I share that sentiment. Watching audiences connect with the music and the story is incredibly rewarding. It’s a reminder of why we do this work—to create art that speaks to the human experience.

[20:06] Pauls Macs: Thank you both for sharing your insights and experiences. It's clear that your works are not only entertaining but also meaningful. Before we wrap up, can you let our listeners know where they can find more information about your shows?

[20:26] Nevada Lozano: Absolutely! You can follow me on Instagram @nevadalozano for updates on "Ramona" and other projects.

[20:46] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: And you can find me on Instagram @jdwtieman. "Johnny & The Devil's Box: The Concept Album" is available now, so be sure to check it out!

[21:06] Teresa Attridge: Thank you both for being here today. It’s been a pleasure discussing your incredible works.

[21:26] Pauls Macs: Yes, thank you! We can’t wait to see how your stories continue to evolve and inspire.

[21:46] Nevada Lozano: Thank you for having us!

[22:06] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Thank you! It's been a joy to share our stories.

[22:26] Teresa Attridge: And thank you to our listeners for tuning in. Be sure to check out "Ramona" and "Johnny & The Devil's Box." Until next time, keep celebrating the artistry that transforms our industry!

[26:33] Annabelle Fox: Also, I mean, I mean, Douglas is such a diva and a jerk that, as you can see, it's really been a challenge because, you know, he just pushes back on everything. But no, yeah, it's really been a great, great fun. And I got to go down to Nashville and be there for the reading and make a surprise appearance in the reading when a cast member had to drop out.

[26:55] Scott Wasserman: So tell us more about the music of this show. Why does it add to the epicness so much? Yes. Well, you can't help but have a good time when you're listening to bluegrass music. And they always say that you should write what you know. And this music is what Douglas knows intimately. And, you know, my job as the music supervisor on the show has been to really just take what's already in Douglas' head and realize it out on the stage. Right. My favorite thing about developing any new musical, working with any composer, is just being able to, like, get into the mind of the composer and into the genre as deep as I can. And bluegrass is something that I've always been a fan of, but haven't really gotten a chance to learn until I've started collaborating with Douglas on this show.

And it's been so cool to understand the difference between competition-style fiddling and old-timey fiddling and different styles of banjo playing. And, you know, it's just, it is epic in its own right as a genre. And there's so much history to it. I think that's the one thing that really makes it the most exciting musical form to bring the story to life, is that inherent in the music is folklore. So to put it onto a story about folklore and different characters that are represented in different bluegrass styles from different regions of the South is really amazing. It's just so fun. The show is such fun to work on and to listen to. It's the best. It's also so fun, you know, just watching Douglas and, like, a band of players just get up and jam out to the songs.

It's so inspiring. It's like, oh my god, why am I not there? Oh wait, I am there. It is a party, yeah. And I think the other thing that makes this show stand out from other shows I've worked on is that usually in musical theater, you're writing down every note for every instrument, telling everyone exactly what to play when. This genre and this show is something where you can say, all right team, let's get together. All of your ideas are great. Go. You know, it's so fun. It's kind of literally like, you know, you're going as you go and making something. And I think that's what makes the show so cool.

[29:10] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Yeah. Yeah, 100% collaborative. I think let's put up our first song. So our first song is Abigail's I Want. She sort of starts out as like this caged bird, I like to describe her. She's had a really sheltered life. And in this song, Douglas has so beautifully written this journey that she sort of goes on of discovery. And it's sort of the first time we see her sort of fighting the only life that she's known and sort of exploring going past that like what's beyond what's beyond what she knows. She finds Johnny at the end of her song. She finds the music. The music leads her to Johnny. Yeah. So here's Annabelle Fox singing Abigail's song.

[29:50] ♪ Musical number: "Abigail's I Want" — performed by Annabelle Fox ♪

[32:49] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Thanks. I practice a lot. Tell us about the second song, The Devil's Dream, which is going to be a live presentation.

[33:05] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: That's right. So this next song, you know, as I mentioned, the devil is a character. Maybe I didn't mention it, but the devil is personified in this show as a fiddle player. And there are many myths and legends about the devil playing the violin. And what I decided to do with this piece is sort of meld together that idea with the idea of Lucifer or the devil as a fallen angel. So the show actually starts at the beginning of time with God creating the universe as a banjo player in a rocking chair. And he picks his banjo and the world comes into existence. So he picks the sun up in the morning and the moon up in the night. And then he decides he needs a band to help him out. So he gets his angel band and it's Michael on the mandolin, Gabriel on the guitar, Lucifer on the fiddle, and they continue to play and make music.

And eventually God decides he needs dancers. So he creates these dancers that are ostensibly Adam and Eve. And eventually the devil gets jealous. Lucifer gets jealous because of his pride, ends up in hell. Subsequently, however, many millennia, whatever later, now sees Johnny, this fiddle player that represents everything that he wants to be and wants to have. And he's coming up with a way to bring Johnny down and end music on earth forever. So this is The Devil's Dream.

[34:28] ♪ Musical number: "The Devil's Dream" — performed by Douglas Waterbury-Tieman ♪

[37:03] Annabelle Fox: That was so cool to see you perform that song just solo, fiddle, and voice like that. Usually we've had some kind of band accompanying it, but I love the idea of the devil just taking it solo, yeah? I don't mind that a bit.

[37:17] Douglas Waterbury-Tieman: Very cool. And speaking of the devil, we have Faustian musical adaptations like Randy Newman's Faust, Little Shop of Horrors, and Damien Keyes. What makes this sort of Faust-inspired musical different? I mean, in terms of the musical specifically, it's because it's about music. I think that definitely gives it a specificity because it's dealing with, we can use good and evil if we want to, but really what the devil is sort of interested in in this story is music and silence of the world. What he's trying to do is get that music back for himself, and to do that he has to get that fiddle away from Johnny because Johnny represents the possibility of dancing and jubilation and humans' ability to just be in community and with each other in rhythm and in harmony.

Ultimately that's what drives out the devil is when everyone comes together to Johnny's music to dance, and the devil's trying to make sure that he's trying to rip those two things apart, the dance and the music. And so that's specifically, you know, it's a little more about the community, so to speak. Johnny represents the community in his sort of dealings with the devil, whereas in a lot of the other stories usually it's just sort of about the main person's soul and whether or not they will be saved, but this has a bit more of a community-wide implication. So that plus the music, I'd say.

[39:02] Annabelle Fox: Beautiful, and honestly it's frighteningly familiar and allegorical, and again, it leads us back to Nevada. Nevada, the state of Nevada. Nevada, the state of mine, and Nevada, the brilliant composer. Anyway, thank you so much for the answer to that question. That was beautiful. Thank you, Anika, Scott, Douglas, and Annabelle. We can't wait to see more from Johnny and the Devil's Box. We'll see you guys soon, hopefully in person.

[39:17] Annabelle Fox: If you enjoyed The Musicals of Tomorrow, please rate, subscribe, and share. The podcast is co-produced and edited by Paul Smock and Hector Flores Jr. Our theme song, The Music of Tomorrow, was written by Lynn Shankle and Sarah Cooper for their all-female identifying musical, Perpetual Sunshine and The Ghost Girls. Join us next time for more of The Musicals of Tomorrow.