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[0:00] Backstage Pass: Welcome back to Part 2 of our special coverage of the National Alliance for Musical Theater's 37th annual Festival of New Musicals.

[0:50] Backstage Pass: Last week, you heard four of the eight shows featured in this year's festival: Thin, Love is Dead, Soft Magical Tofu Boys, and Particle. This week, you'll hear demo recordings and interviews from the other four shows: The King of Harlem, Roja, Wakeman, and Alice Bliss.

[1:07] Backstage Pass: One of the most exciting aspects of NAMT is that it serves as a hub and connection point for musical theater writers and producers from all over the country and even the world. Listen all the way to the end for bonus interviews and demos from two shows we love, Big Quarterly and Balls, the Monster Catchin' Musical.

[1:23] Backstage Pass: In case you missed the news from Part 1, our usual co-host, Teresa Attridge, could not join us because she was undergoing a tonsillectomy. These NAMT episodes are guest co-hosted by New York Theater Barn's Artistic Director, Joe Burrows.

[1:36] Backstage Pass: Our first show is The King of Harlem. The King of Harlem follows the story of Mercy Wheatley, an up-and-coming black prize fighter who is boxing his way to glory at the height of the Harlem Renaissance. But after a chance encounter with Federico Garcia Lorca, all the plans Mercy made begin to collapse in the name of desire.

[1:52] Backstage Pass: I was able to catch up with one half of the show's writing team shortly after seeing its 45-minute NAMT presentation. These interviews are captured in the midst of a thriving theater festival. Don't be afraid to turn the volume up.

[2:03] David Gomez: Hello, I'm here with one half of the writing team of The King of Harlem, David Gomez. David, do you want to introduce yourself and also your partner who is not here?

[2:12] David Gomez: Yeah, I'm here to speak on behalf of Joe Michael, and we co-wrote the book, music, and lyrics of The King of Harlem together. It's been a passion project of ours for a long time, and getting to share it with the NAMT community and these audiences has been a thrill. It's been quite a journey, and I can't believe we've landed here.

[2:28] David Gomez: I saw your presentation. It was really thrilling, and I've heard a lot of people talking about your presentation and praising it, just so you know. So tell me about how you wrote The King of Harlem, how it came to be as a musical.

[2:39] David Gomez: The journey of the musical began when I was sitting at a little small piano in a Harlem apartment. I turned to my roommate, Joe Michael, and I said, did you know that our favorite playwright and poet, Federico Garcia Lorca, lived down the streets? Before he wrote plays like Blood Wedding and Bernardo Alba, Federico actually attended Columbia for a semester, Columbia University. The records show that he never really went to class, and we began to wonder, what was he doing? Or perhaps, who might he have been doing? And he created this poem called Arre de Harlem, and the world of it, around it, our research, inspired this musical, The King of Harlem.

[3:15] Backstage Pass: That's fantastic. I saw your presentation. I can tell other people were very moved by it, as I was. Can you tell me about your weekend nap? What did you learn about your show? What did you experience?

[3:26] David Gomez: It was wonderful getting to work with our esteemed director-choreographer, Roger Feather-Kelley, and just collaborating with actors. It feels like playing in the sandbox with your friends, for nerdy theater kids. All we need is one little room, real paper, pencils, a piano. I think it's amazing, the musical theater, to make it. The things we need are kind of ancient and analog, and getting to have those 20 hours with those actors, but they're able to sight-sing and learn and come together as an ensemble. It's just remarkable, and you do learn a lot. People have questions for you. Maybe this doesn't make sense, and you get to make little tweaks. I always feel like we're tailoring the material to the people. It's kind of the way Christian Siriano would want to dress to fit someone just well. That's kind of what we get to do with actors in a rehearsal room, and that's been a real joy.

[4:14] David Gomez: One thing that I think is so great about your piece, and I believe I talked with you about this before, is so often we learn about these poets or these artists, but no one tells us they're gay. I just recently worked on a production of Our Town, and I found out that Thorne Wilder was gay, or many people believe that he was. I just think your show exposes that history very imaginably and very effectively.

[4:37] David Gomez: I would say that's something that John Michael and I encountered. We studied Lorca in college, and I would say in high school you learn about Langston Hughes. You learn about the Harlem Renaissance. Walt Whitman, Lorca was very inspired by Walt Whitman. That's kind of why he was coming to America. He was inspired by the free verse. I didn't learn that Walt Whitman was gay, and I wrote a whole essay. But actually, all of our essays would have been a little bit more nuanced, wouldn't they?

[4:57] Backstage Pass: I think so.

[4:59] David Gomez: If we could have read between the lines, him talking about sailors. Just a fun fact, I think that Lorca, when he was trying to learn English, he was very obsessed with the poem Annabelle Leigh, because it had a certain rhythm and rhyme. He stumbled to try to learn English while he was here. He wrote a bunch of letters home. Sometimes he's asking his parents for money. Sometimes he's saying, I'm having a good trip, when he's having a bad trip. It's amazing to look at a historical figure and be like, oh, they're just like us. They have a bad breakup and they go on vacation.

[5:25] Backstage Pass: No, that's really powerful, what you just said. So often we can put these writers up on a pedestal, and we can forget they were human, just like us. Or the needs and wants in a relationship, just as many of us have.

[5:37] David Gomez: One thing that really struck me about your show was incorporating boxing into it. There have been a few boxing musicals, but I'm really excited to learn what that was like when you were trying to make that an integral part of your musical.

[5:49] David Gomez: Yes, and I will say, it's funny because Lorca has this whole poem where it might have been his lover was like a bullfighter in Spain. So we were like, oh, you had a thing for athletes. And so while we were inventing this world of Harlem and prize fighting in this boxing world, I was fascinated to learn that it was show business. At the same places where you would see a theater or a club, like the next night there would be boxing. The same is still true in Madison Square Garden. You could see Adele one night, and you could see a fight the next night. There was a heightened theatricality to it, which we were drawn to. But I will also say, John Mangle and me are the two least likely people to know anything about boxing.

And you just write a show. And now I've got really strong opinions about boxers in the 30s, and the stats, and the rounds. And if there was a boxing dramaturge, it was really kind to take a meeting with us. And we asked him so many questions. Yeah, I will say I'm really great at Thanksgiving with someone's grandpa now. I could just talk about boxing all day long.

[6:38] Backstage Pass: So what I need to do if I want to get good at talking about football is write a musical about football, is what you're telling me?

[6:43] David Gomez: Make a love story. You get so invested. I'm sure they have happened.

[6:48] Backstage Pass: Yeah. Isn't it interesting to note, I honestly can't think of the last time there was an athlete that had a coming out story in public news. It's always like a figure skater. I really think that there is this kind of world the show presents for these real athletes that have to make choices about what if being who you are was totally at odds with your job, or your ambition, or how you're presenting to your community.

[7:09] David Gomez: Yeah, and then what if you really believed in what you did and had a reason behind it. So we found all of that quite both theatrical and emotionally compelling.

[7:16] Backstage Pass: Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for your presentation. Hope you're feeling great.

[7:20] David Gomez: Thank you.

[7:24] David Gomez: Thanks for stopping by.

[7:26] Backstage Pass: Of course. And thanks for speaking with us.

[7:30] David Gomez: Thank you, New York People. And now, so you can get a feel of what the show sounds like, we'll play a demo from The King of Harlem. Here is Federico, performed by John Michael Lyles.

[M:SS] ♪ Musical number: "Federico" — performed by John Michael Lyles ♪

[11:31] David Gomez: I think it was a great response from the audience, and we're happy with all the process and our cast and everything and the creative team. So we are really really really happy with the result. I thought it went fantastically. For those who don't know, can you tell the audience a little bit about your show Roja?

[11:48] David Gomez: Yeah, Roja is a reimagined version of the Little Red Riding Hood tale, but told through a mestizo Mexican lens with Mexican music, contemporary and modern music. And we create our very own fairy tale using different references from Mexican traditions and Mexican folklore. And in the story, Roja's father has passed away two years, or is it three years?

[12:15] David Gomez: Three years. Three years before the beginning of the story. And Roja is on the farm with her mom. They are working this untenable land that they have been living on since the father's death, and they are really suffering in the absence of the father. And Roja meets this mischievous magical coyote who offers her the opportunity to see her father again. And that's really sort of the crux and the heart of the show. They have to go on this journey to satisfy their desire.

[12:48] Jaime Lozano: The offrenda, making an offrenda for the Lady of Death, and in doing so she tries to sort of break this curse of grief that has really been the center of their paradox life.

[13:03] Tommy Newman: As I was watching it, I was thinking to myself, I've seen versions of the Little Red Riding Hood story in my childhood, like in elementary school. We did a unit in the library where they showed us three different versions of the story. They're all European versions of the story, like how it differed between, say, Holland and Ireland. But to see you claim this show with your unique flavor of music is so exciting. Tell us about your week at NAMT. What was your experience like? What did you learn?

[13:27] Jaime Lozano: First, we expanded the show. Right before NAMT, we realized, originally we were keeping it very small. It was four actors. It was like one act, around 90 minutes. And talking with the people, with the consultants at NAMT, and getting into another development process, we realized that maybe there's more story to tell. So we decided to expand the show to six actors and do it as two acts. So we added three or four new songs, and we had a chance to include some of those new songs in this presentation. We have a room full of Latino cast, a beautiful Latino cast, and a Latino band, and a Latino creative team director, and a great ally that is Tommy, like helping us to shape all the story, writing all this.

So it's really a joy to see a room like that, you know, like all these different colors and accents, and people with all different points of view trying to tell the same story, and putting all our heads together to tell the same story in not too much time. So I think it was very successful, and we have learned a lot about the material.

[14:36] Tommy Newman: Sure, I can just add that it has been so much joy in the room because we just really love each other. We love the family that we've created while we've been here, and just have had such a fun time working on this material together. It was also really exciting to see the community get to meet Mariela Barrera. She's just incredible, and for those who don't know, her sister was Vanessa in the movie In the Heights.

[15:02] Jaime Lozano: And that actor played Roja, right?

[15:07] Tommy Newman: Yes, correct. Fantastic.

[15:11] Jaime Lozano: I believe this is your second collaboration, or third one?

[15:12] Jaime Lozano: I know of Yellow Brick Road, which became El Otro Az.

[15:16] Tommy Newman: That's right.

[15:17] Jaime Lozano: Cool. What's the third one?

[15:19] Tommy Newman: Third, actually.

[15:19] Tommy Newman: We actually wrote another show together called Savage. It was commissioned by UAB, University of Alabama in Birmingham, and it's a really, really incredible piece that is about a story. Well, it's very complicated. I don't want to get into it too much, but it is a historical piece set at the turn of the century, and is really sort of capturing the past and the present all sort of in one big moment.

[15:46] Jaime Lozano: One thing I was just thinking about, because we were talking about the performances of the actors, was, for example, one big change in your version of Roja to Little Red Riding Hood is there's a big bad wolf. But in your show, there's a coyote that is played by a very, very charming, very hilarious actor. Can you talk a little bit about either working with that actor or other sort of creative changes that you felt needed to be made to that classic story to really make it your own? I know there's numerous changes, but if there's one or two that you'd like to share, that would be great.

[16:15] Tommy Newman: I'll say, first of all, Miguel Cervantes is incredible. We love him. He was Hamilton in Hamilton for quite some time on Broadway and in the national tour as well. But as far as the comparisons between our version of Little Red Riding Hood and the original, we did change. It's no longer a big bad wolf. It is El Coyote, who is sort of based on this god from the mestizo folklore that is Huehuecoyoro. And he's sort of like Loki. He's the god of mischief, but he also kind of created mankind and was very much a part of actually creating death itself. In another part of the story, he is the god of dancing and the god of music. And he's just this shape-shifting, miraculous creature that has sort of always existed since the beginning of time.

And he gets into all of these hijinks with Señor Crow, who is a small part, I suppose, of our adaptation. And then the other thing that we did was to say, like, what are the big elements? In Little Red Riding Hood, of course, it's the mother, it's the grandmother, it's Little Red, but there's the basket. And the things that she brings in the basket to the grandmother are the flowers, the bread, and then, of course, her love. We tried to figure out, like, how do we make this translate to this particular story? And it just so happens that one of the traditional things in Dia de Muertos is that you make an ofrenda. And in an ofrenda, you have the marigolds, which are a big part of making an ofrenda, but also the pan de muerto, which is bread that is baked for the dead to consume, but also is really delicious and we eat it as well. But that's sort of just a few of the little ways that we have adapted the story to become our own.

[18:11] Jaime Lozano: Well, I thought it worked really well. It was very successful. Congratulations, Tommy and Jaime. Thank you for talking with us today. And now, here is the song, I Will See You Again, Te Veré Otra Vez, from Roja, with musical lyrics by Jaime Lozano and Tommy Newman, featuring Mayela Barrera. This recording is from the album Jaime Lozano and the Familia, Songs by an Immigrant Vol. 3, released by Concord Theatrical Recordings.

[18:34] ♪ Musical number: "I Will See You Again (Te Veré Otra Vez)" — performed by Mayela Barrera ♪

[22:32] Jaime Lozano: Our next show is Wakeman, which is a folk rock Americana musical, which had the distinction of performing at 9:30 AM on the second day of the festival. We were able to catch up with the creator of Wakeman, Jen Grinnells, shortly after this 9:30 AM presentation.

[22:47] Jen Grinnells: Hello, we are here with the creator of Wakeman, so please introduce yourself.

[22:51] Jen Grinnells: Hello, I'm Jen Grinnells. I was so blown away by your performance this afternoon, and I would go as far as to say that it was probably a little longer than 45 minutes, and guess what, I'm not complaining, I'm just explaining. I could have listened to that all day long. Your cast was extraordinary, and you did such a beautiful job at setting up your show. You were so vulnerable and honest about how you were connected to the story and what it means to be an artist. You reminded us that it was 9:30 AM in the morning and that your show is very complicated and nuanced. It really invited us to lean in and lift up the story, lift up the actors who were bringing it to life. So that was just thrilling, and to see Beth Malone and Rihanna Casio, who's currently starring in Hamilton, play such impactful roles, and to see the story of, I would say, essentially three women.

It's following one woman, but also seeing them not even as women, but as people. All of them, or maybe one of them, would be gender expansive, different time in history. Speaking of setting up your show, one thing we like to do on Backstage Pass is have the writers set up their own show in their own words.

[23:57] Jen Grinnells: Oh gosh. I think every time I stumble, it's only because I do get so emotional about it. But the story essentially is about an individual that lived in the 1800s that wrote 33 letters home to their parents when they left home at age 19, joined the Union Army, presenting as a man. So it's really inspired by those letters, but I also incorporated the letters, and I really am trying to make sure people understand that that is a voice that has been forgotten by history that now gets to tell their own story in their own words. But it also incorporates other women who joined the Union Army and what their motivations were to dress as men and join. And I think what it's really about, though, is this person who's just trying to figure out who they are and where their place is in this world and what makes them happy and what they have to maybe sacrifice to live in their own skin the way they want to. And then also just kind of remind us all about being teenagers and how we were trying to figure out who we were, and that's the shared humanity that I always kind of bring up at the end.

[25:01] Jaime Lozano: And I think that absolutely comes across. In the letters, sometimes when they're writing, you can tell they're really mad at their parents. They've got that mad teenager energy, and other times they're feeling betrayed by them, and other times they're feeling tender. And so I think using their own words to tell their story is very, very moving.

[25:17] Jen Grinnells: What have you learned the most about your show throughout the process here at NAMT?

[25:21] Jen Grinnells: Well, let's see. One thing I've learned is that guitar-centric musicals, they're still new. We're still figuring out the best process in terms of teaching the music and rehearsing the music and stuff. You know, guitar is just not a thing.

[25:37] Jenn Grinels: And so it's been interesting and challenging to make that work. So that was one thing I learned. And then I also learned that the score is probably not great for 930, although my cast, I mean, knocked it out of the park.

[25:53] Pauls Macs: I saw it at 930 and it rocked. It was awesome.

[25:56] Jenn Grinels: The guys in the cast are like, come on, B-flats. Now? Really? You know?

[26:00] Pauls Macs: The cast was incredible, but I loved observing your band as well. And PJ, your musical director, they're so talented. It was really, really beautiful to watch.

[26:09] Teresa Attridge: One thing that I thought was really, really fascinating about your musical is that I didn't know that Wakeman was a person. And the way that they encounter other people pretending to be men, I just thought that was really interesting to learn about. Can you talk a little bit about the research process and how you wove that into the story?

[26:27] Jenn Grinels: I am now a Civil War buff. I did so much research. I think there's an element of the letters that you really have to do detective work. You have to figure out where exactly were they? What was going on around them? What were they not saying to their parents? I think is a big question mark and a big rabbit hole.

[26:46] Jenn Grinels: I was like, what was going on? You write to your parents and you're like, everything's fine, but it's not. That sort of thing. So there was a lot of detective work. And then in that research, it was like, oh, they estimate that 400 women dressed as men and joined the Union Army or at least joined the Civil War.

[27:02] Jenn Grinels: And so learning about other motivations of these people was really interesting. But fun fact, the fact that they were working at a prison where they were guarding a prisoner who was in there for doing exactly what they were doing, I just thought was so fascinating. And so those scenes, yes, there's some confabulation going on in terms of the dialogue, but I would say it's historical fiction because it's very researched.

[27:28] Jenn Grinels: And if some people are getting Yentl vibes or vibes of The Ballad of Little Joe, I totally hear you. But this is a very powerful untold story and done in a very, very original way.

[27:42] Teresa Attridge: There's a fundraiser coming up for Wakemen. Tell us about that, Jen.

[27:45] Jenn Grinels: The music is definitely, I would say, people's, I don't want to say favorite part, but they like the music a lot. So I did this thing where I took the demos that have gotten me this far and I put them on a vinyl record and I made 100 of them. So I'm selling them to help me make transcriptions and to pay all of the things. You can get them on my website and they are half gone. So there's 50 left.

[28:09] Pauls Macs: Get them while they're hot. Awesome musical theater writers. That is a very creative way to fundraise for your musicals. So take note. Fantastic. Well, thank you, Jen, for joining us.

[28:17] Teresa Attridge: Thanks so much, Jen.

[28:19] Pauls Macs: And now here's the trio song from Wakemen performed by Jenn Grinels, Ari Notar-Tomasso, and Beverly Anderson.

[28:39] ♪ Musical number: "The Trio Song" — performed by Jenn Grinels, Ari Notar-Tomasso, and Beverly Anderson ♪

[34:34] Pauls Macs: All right, we are here with Adam Gwon and Karen Hartman from Alice Bliss.

[34:39] Teresa Attridge: And we at New York Theater Barn are huge Adam Gwon fans. The first time I ever met Adam Gwon was at a benefit for like NYU or something. And he was singing a song called I'll Be Here. And I asked him what that was. And that song became a musical called Ordinary Days, which you all know.

[34:53] Teresa Attridge: What's really special about this piece is that Adam is only writing the lyrics. He has also collaborated, as far as I know, with other book writers, but mainly writes music and lyrics and often is writing book music and lyrics. So this was really exciting to hear a little bit of a different non-Adam Gwon sound with Adam Gwon lyrics and a really, really powerful story that I actually knew nothing about. I didn't know its source material or anything.

[35:16] Teresa Attridge: If you could tell us about the story in your own words, we'd love to hear it.

[35:46] Adam Gwon: I was in high school in 2006. That was my senior year of high school.

[36:10] Teresa Attridge: What I can say is that what I experienced while I was watching your show was it took me right back to that moment with the Iraq War in the background. I never experienced that in my family, but I had people at my high school who experienced similar circumstances. And the way your piece just transported me back to that moment was very palpable.

[36:28] Pauls Macs: Tell us more about your weekend nap. What did you learn or what did you experience? We'd love to hear more.

[36:33] Adam Gwon: It's been great. I mean, there's really nothing like these two days. It's everyone you've ever met in the American theater.

[36:41] Adam Gwon: It's truly wild.

[36:42] Adam Gwon: It's exhausting, but amazing.

[36:44] Adam Gwon: Yeah. And as Joe mentioned, I've known so many people here for so long, since really the very beginning of my career. And so it's just such a joy to reconnect with people who I met when I was very young and just starting out and who lifted me up and who amplified my work and sort of allowed me to sustain a career in this wild thing and come back for what is my fourth NAMT festival.

[37:11] Karen Hartman: And it's my first time at NAMT because I come from the playwriting, regular theater world. So to me, it's just, it's super exciting to be in this musical theater community. And also the work itself on our piece has been so smooth and so beautifully articulated by this company and our director, Chayu, and music director, Chris Fennick, who just brought everybody through with such clarity.

[37:38] Teresa Attridge: Your presentation was really spectacular. Really loved your cast. Whitney Basher was fantastic as the mother. But I was truly fangirling over Andrea Frierson, who was the original Air Zoolian once on this island and was the original Dr. Charlotte in the combination of March of the Falsettos and Falsettoland at the Hartford stage, which was the impetus to create Falsettos to come to Broadway.

[38:03] Karen Hartman: And also was Catherine in the world premiere of Rattlesnake Cage at the Denver Center, which I wrote the book for as well, which is how I lured Andrea to come in.

[38:16] Adam Gwon: Very cool. And she still looks exactly the same. She does not age.

[38:20] Karen Hartman: There's lots of fanboying and fangirling or fan everyone-ing that happens at the NAMT festival.

[38:26] Kim Kibley: You're actually not the first playwright who said that, oh, I got dragged to this musical theater world. Can you tell us about how that happened? Well, it's like the one thing people will actually ask you to do as a playwright is to write books for musicals, right? Because you're in charge of structure and dialogue. Like, that's what you know how to do. And for me, it's been kind of great because I tend to write in a minimalist way anyway so to say, like, I can kind of reserve the feelings and then the songs will just let it flow is a great rhythm for me. And also it's so much less lonely. The third collaborator is Jenny Giering and she's not here with us right now but I'd love to know what it's like to collaborate with her and how you all work together.

[39:12] S. Todd Townsend: Yeah, Jenny is an old dear friend of mine and so when she reached out and said, "Hey, would you be interested in writing lyrics for this piece that I'm writing music for?" I, of course, said yes. I love Jenny's music. I love Jenny. And it was a surprisingly different muscle to just write the lyrics without also writing music because when I do it myself, it feels like a very instinctual, organic way that I understand the music and lyrics to be working together. And when you're working with a different person, a different brain, who's coming up with the music part, it takes a few extra steps, for me anyway, to understand, oh, okay, this is what the music is doing, this is what I need the lyrics to do and sort of adjust so that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

So I think Jenny and I did a lot of passing back and forth. Some songs started music first, some songs started lyrics first, so that kind of did the load but it felt like a real true collaboration, passing things back and forth and making it better each time.

[40:17] Kim Kibley: Your show deals with the complicated relationship between a mother and a daughter while the father is in the Iraq war. And I know you're adapting a novel. Can you talk about how you adapted that for the musical?

[40:30] S. Todd Townsend: So I've actually been writing about mothers and daughters since I was a teenager. Probably I became a playwright to try to figure out my relationship with my mother, now passed away. So part of what drew me into this was the opportunity to do that in a sense like I grew up, my parents were divorced, so I grew up with a similar to Alice sense like dad is the one who understands me but he's not here, right, and so I'm stuck with you. And that's what Alice has to do. Now in the novel, the dad is actually a really big character. There's a lot of flashbacks, we see that relationship and we strip that away in the musical so that we're left with the mother and daughter who have to deal with each other and mothers and daughters can be kind of brutal. That void is quite palpable in the musical.

[41:24] Kim Kibley: What do you see as your next step or what do you see in the future for your piece?

[41:28] S. Todd Townsend: Well ultimately I see our piece being everywhere. I see it as a show that is about an upstate working class family in a smaller town and that could be seen in communities and cities all over the place. And the card I've had on my desk for what I hope will happen is that mothers and daughters will be healed.

[41:59] Kim Kibley: I think that's beautiful and even from seeing a 45 minute excerpt I think that's very possible. But before that we need a world premiere.

[42:07] S. Todd Townsend: Yeah, let's make that happen. One of the wonderful things about NAMT I think is that it amplifies shows that are not on the same path. Like I think especially at this moment where theaters are sort of navigating their own stuff in order to be able to bring shows to the stage. A showcase like this where we're kind of saying, here's our show, help us make it happen is really powerful because we for instance had two world premieres scheduled that were both canceled. One because COVID hit and then the second because the theater came back after COVID and then we were the last show in the season and it ran out of money. So I think there are all kinds of unexpected and new and different challenges that writers are navigating at this moment. And to have something like NAMT help us on the path is sort of invaluable.

[43:03] Kim Kibley: I feel like fans are in a similar situation. They have a very specific unexpected need that has arisen for their show and NAMT has kind of swooped in and said maybe we can help save the day. So we're very grateful to have that chance. And for those who don't know, NAMT is this incredible member organization but the festival committee is comprised of leaders from all around the world. The committee changes every year so it is a very fluid process. That's truly fantastic to see COVID heartbreaks come into reality in the year 2025. So thank you NAMT, thank you Adam and Kendra for sticking with it. We truly love your piece. We loved hanging out with you today. So thank you for joining us.

[43:46] Kim Kibley: Thank you.

[43:49] ♪ Musical number: "Prologue/One More" — performed by Jenny Giering ♪

[45:36] S. Todd Townsend: And with that, you've heard interviews and songs from all eight shows in NAMT's 37th annual Festival of New Musicals. But we're not done yet. Part of what makes NAMT such a unique experience is how many musical theater writers and producers make the journey to NYC, support these shows, and make connections with other artists. While we were there, we ran into some artists we'd like to spotlight. We spent some time in the Green Room Lounge chatting with S. Todd Townsend and Kim Kibley, two of the three writers from a very special musical called Big Quarterly, which was on the NAMT Recommended list, as well as faculty member Dan Marshall, who helped develop the show at Berklee NYC.

[46:14] S. Todd Townsend: We are so lucky, we just ran into Dan Marshall from Berklee NYC and also the writers of Big Quarterly, actually two of the three writers of Big Quarterly, which is a musical that started at Berklee NYC, who are NAMT Recommended writers. That means that the panel was so excited to buy their show, even though the show was not chosen for the festival proper. New York Theater Barn actually got to do a presentation of it in our choreography lab. So let's meet the writers of Big Quarterly.

[46:39] Kim Kibley: Hi, my name is Kim Kibley.

[46:41] S. Todd Townsend: And I'm Todd Townsend.

[46:43] Kim Kibley: Awesome. Hey guys, tell us a little bit about what Big Quarterly is about.

[46:46] S. Todd Townsend: Well, Big Quarterly is about a man named Peter Spencer, his journey from slavery to becoming a world-class influencer in the 1800s in Wilmington, Delaware. So it's a profound story, including the conflict between him and his brother, also the journey through his relationships, his development of his relationship with his wife, and his crew that became the church, that became the foundation for a world-changing freedom festival. And people of color would want to come to that festival to be connected in community, but also to potentially secure their spot on the Underground Railroad, is that right?

[47:22] Kim Kibley: Exactly.

[47:23] S. Todd Townsend: That's right. And what we've done in terms of our development and continuing to dig closer to the heart of the story is really add a lot of layers and factual information about that comes from the history of the Underground Railroad and studying and really making our characters enhanced with this authentic information that really tells the challenges and also the potential connections that emerged that changed people's lives but also connected people to the future.

[47:56] Kim Kibley: And through your process, you've had the privilege of working with collaborators Lee Summers and Jovan Dansbury. What have their contributions been like?

[48:04] S. Todd Townsend: Oh my gosh, so New York Theatre Barn was so essential in bringing another member to our creative team. Jovan Dansbury is basically at the table with being director, choreographer, and that has his lens in understanding movement and how movement-based storytelling can be maximized. It's been so helpful to us in our writing process, and really I think the point of the Choreography Lab is that, is to understand how both of those components relate to one another and enhance one another, and so that's been so critical in terms of our being able to go back and write a completely new draft, see the opportunities where movement helps that moment come alive and see where we needed to enhance our written material and help the word keep that story moving forward. So it's been super, super helpful.

[49:00] Kim Kibley: What does it mean for your team to be a finalist at NAMT, and which of the shows have you really resonated with here at the festival?

[49:07] S. Todd Townsend: Well, first of all, to be NAMT recommended is one of the, I guess you could say it is the biggest honor we've experienced so far. I mean, expect many more. But along with what Kim was saying about the movement and the choreography, now all of that is shaped by a musical score of hip-hop, jazz, and gospel, which is very exciting. And so here, considering the different genre expressions in the theater, one of the ones that has resonated with me the most is Finn. It's really exciting, the storytell and the merge of the musical motif built into the character development. So I think that has both been exciting and motivational for me as well.

[49:53] Kim Kibley: For me, I mean, we have not seen all of them yet, so I feel like I cannot give a fair assessment.

[49:58] S. Todd Townsend: That's what everybody says.

[49:59] Kim Kibley: But Wade Kamin has really spoken to me in terms of the sort of passion that came through the music and how the music really enhanced and supported that beautiful story. That got me very excited in terms of I'm excited to see where that show goes next. And what's amazing about this festival is different pieces are going to resonate with different people. There's such an eclectic group of musicals this year and every year, and the fact that it goes beyond the shows that are selected for this festival, that they make sure to share who are the NAMT recommended writers, that they go above and beyond to spread the word is really fantastic.

[50:38] Dan Marshall: So Dan, Dan Marshall from Berklee-MIC, what does it mean for you and the institution to see your students receiving recognition like this?

[50:49] Dan Marshall: Gosh, Joe, what a great question. I mean, for me, it's just sort of a dream that we, as educators, all aspire to. It's to see our students succeed at a very high level and to see these beautiful pieces find their audience, find their way in the world, and to continue on beyond the first draft, which is what Berklee-MIC is all about, like generating within nine months the first draft of a very exciting piece.

[51:44] Pauls Macs: All around the country, world really. Thanks. Magia has been featured on Backstage Pass, also in conversation with Syracuse University in the New Works New Voices program. If you didn't know, you should listen, but during the podcast they talked about how much their experience at Berkeley NYC influenced the development of that piece and how valuable that was.

[51:55] Dan Marshall: Yeah, I did listen. Thanks, Dan. And for those out there who don't know a lot about Berkeley NYC's musical writing program, be it a writer or producer, what's so amazing about this program is that it concludes with an excerpt of the show that has design elements and a cast that are produced in a way to really engage the imagination of the audience and to further sort of support the development of the show off the page, which is unlike any program or institution that I know of.

[52:36] Dan Marshall: The Berkeley experience was The Incubator and then Theatre Barn, so there's this teaming up of these sort of venues and institutions that really motivate, they mine our hearts for this creative expression. And so I really wouldn't encourage anybody out there, if you're thinking about it, dreaming about it, take that platform. Or if you're thinking about where to give your money, I think New York Theatre Barn, I can't recommend it enough just in terms of the authentic love and passion of trying to help us as writers have an audience and meet our audience, meet our creative team. I can't say it enough. So if you've got an extra whatever laying around, donate it to them. It will go far.

[53:28] Pauls Macs: That's great, Kim. We did not pay Kim to say that. Thank you. And now here's "Opening" from Big Quarterly.

[53:39] ♪ Musical number: "Opening" — performed by Big Quarterly ♪

[54:27] ♪ Musical number ♪

[57:50] Pauls Macs: And now we have one final surprise for you. We ran into friends of the show, Harrison Bryan and Brandon Zellman, who spoke with us about their show, Balls, the Monster Catchin' Musical.

[58:02] Harrison Bryan: It's the creators of Balls, the musical. Oh my god. Can you explain that statement, Harrison Bryan?

[58:08] Harrison Bryan: Balls is the Monster Catchin' Musical. We take a nostalgic, crazy look through video games and anime of our youth and we blow it up on stage with puppets and animation and it's a wild time. Teresa, your co-host on the podcast, is in it and is incredible.

[58:25] Pauls Macs: Teresa is having a tonsillectomy during NAMMF, which is why she's not here. Although we're so glad to have Joe Barros with us. But we love you, Teresa. We miss you. And it's so fitting that one of your best friends is right here with us right now.

[58:37] Brandon Zellman: And also, Harrison's holding a puppet. Can you explain this puppet that's in your hand?

[58:41] Harrison Bryan: I think he'd prefer to explain it himself.

[58:43] Pauls Macs: All right, here's the puppet.

[58:45] Warlord Turtle: Hi, I'm Warlord Turtle, the Warlord of Turtlekind from Balls, the Monster Catchin' Musical comedy. New musicals are cool and so is taking over the world.

[58:55] Harrison Bryan: He's definitely a bad guy. I've seen the show twice and it's fantastic. And I tried to mic that puppet just so everyone knows on this podcast.

[59:03] Brandon Zellman: What have you seen?

[59:05] Harrison Bryan: Brandon and I, as we run headfirst into the world of new musical development, we just wanted to surround ourselves with awesome new musical creatives and just enjoy the spirit of this festival. We just stepped out of Particle just now, another video game adjacent piece.

[59:24] Brandon Zellman: So we really wanted to connect about that because we've got a lot of interactive video game elements in ours. We're really into that whole world, that whole community, which is growing. And it's really cool to see theater embrace technology and the current state of gaming in this world.

[59:41] Harrison Bryan: Particle was one of my favorite pieces. I just love the world that Zelda and Derek have created. And super surprising ending, too.

[59:50] Brandon Zellman: Yeah, yeah, we really didn't see it coming. We won't spoil anything, but there's a lot of heart to that show. And if you're going to write a musical, you've got to really find the heart. And I think they really did a great job at that.

[1:00:00] Harrison Bryan: I should also note, too, that Harrison is one of the writers of a Hanukkah carol, or Guilt Trip, the musical.

[1:00:07] Brandon Zellman: Wow, and the whole title, Joe. It's so amazing.

[1:00:10] Harrison Bryan: Yes, we are still developing that. We're hoping to do another reading this winter in New York City and hopefully for many Hanukkahs to come.

[1:00:20] Pauls Macs: What's next for Balls?

[1:00:22] Harrison Bryan: Balls is a pop-up event. So we just wrapped up our Comic-Con debut. We had a sold-out panel with the original voice of Ash Ketchum, Veronica Taylor, moderating. We had our last show of the year. And we've got big dreams. We want to take it on the road. We want to go to conventions. We want to have that cast album so that people can hear us. Basically, it's the largest franchise in the world that we are in love with. So we really want to meet those people where they are everywhere.

[1:00:52] Brandon Zellman: When I saw the show the first time, the real Ash Ketchum was actually pulled out from the audience and brought into the opening number onto the adventure, which was really exciting.

[1:01:01] Harrison Bryan: And also, Stuart Zagnant is in the show.

[1:01:04] Brandon Zellman: The voice of Professor Oak.

[1:01:06] Harrison Bryan: Yeah, and don't forget all of my terrorist turtles. I hear there's a show here called Finn. I wonder if I can get some of those sharks on my team.

[1:01:16] Pauls Macs: Thanks.

[1:01:18] Brandon Zellman: Well, on that note, is there anything else you wanted to say?

[1:01:22] Harrison Bryan: Oh, no. I was going to apologize for this.

[1:01:26] Pauls Macs: There's no need to apologize. It was so great seeing you both. Thanks for joining us.

[1:01:31] Brandon Zellman: Oh, we also want to say that Teresa's surgery, we love you, Teresa. We know that it went really well. And we're all rooting for you here.

[1:01:39] Harrison Bryan: Oh, that's true. It's day two of NEP. I should have said that. Teresa's surgery went well, everyone. She is fine. We love you, Teresa.

[1:01:46] Pauls Macs: All right, thanks.

[1:01:47] Harrison Bryan: Thanks, guys.

[1:01:48] Brandon Zellman: Thank you.

[1:01:49] Harrison Bryan: That was so fun. And to close us out, we have an excerpt of a song from Balls: The Monster Catchin' Musical, this is "What the World Should Be," a song that features the show's villainous Warlord Turtle performed by Harrison Bryan.

[1:02:02] ♪ Musical number: "What the World Should Be" — performed by Harrison Bryan ♪

[1:03:30] Pauls Macs: Thanks for joining us on New York Theatre Barn's Backstage Pass, hosted by Teresa Attridge and Pauls Macs. And if you believe in supporting original culture-shifting musicals, please like, subscribe, and share.