This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Kevin David Thomas: Hey, listeners, Kevin and I need your help.

[0:02] Robert W. Schneider: Yes, we need your help. Please, please, please. We need your stars.

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[0:25] Kevin David Thomas: Then let us know what you think from one to five stars.

[0:29] Robert W. Schneider: If you need some help, think of one star being Carol Channing and Paul Lynn in The Road Company

[0:33] Kevin David Thomas: of the last five years, and five stars being free front row tickets to Hamilton.

[0:38] Robert W. Schneider: Although, when you think about it, I actually would give five stars to The Road Company of

[0:42] Carol Channing and Paul Lynn in the last five years, because I think that would be awesome.

[0:45] Kevin David Thomas: I would love to hear, could I hear Move in Too Fast with Paul?

[0:48] Robert W. Schneider: That's the one I really want.

[0:51] Kevin David Thomas: She's a sheik's the goddess.

[0:52] Robert W. Schneider: I've been through Erika Schwartz and Danica Weiss and the Handelman twins.

[1:00] Kevin David Thomas: So there you go. You can also leave a comment if you like.

[1:03] Robert W. Schneider: That's it. That's it.

[1:03] Kevin David Thomas: Your reviews. Send us your reviews.

[1:05] Robert W. Schneider: Please. Thank you.

[1:06] Robert W. Schneider: Hi, I'm Rob Schneider.

[1:08] Kevin David Thomas: And I'm Kevin David Thomas.

[1:09] Robert W. Schneider: And this is Behind the Curtain Broadway's Living Legends.

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[1:20] Kevin David Thomas: And maybe follow us on Instagram at Broadway Curtain Podcast.

[1:22] Robert W. Schneider: Plus, you can always listen to our podcasts on Broadway World and Stitcher.

[1:26] Kevin David Thomas: Ooh, Stitcher. We're moving up in the world.

[1:29] Robert W. Schneider: Since 1960, thousands upon thousands upon thousands of young sopranos have been singing

[1:36] much more, but no one sings it better than today's guest, because she is the one who sang it first.

[1:41] Kevin David Thomas: That's right.

[1:42] Robert W. Schneider: And she's the best at it, I'll say.

[1:43] Kevin David Thomas: Thank you.

[1:44] Robert W. Schneider: And as if originating the role of the girl in Fantastics wasn't enough,

[1:49] she is also known to audiences as the hip-hopping grandmother

[1:53] in the musical version of The Wedding Singer.

[1:55] Kevin David Thomas: Plus, she has been seen on Broadway in On a Clear Day You Can See Forever,

[1:58] Ben Franklin in Paris, and Last of the Red Hot Lovers, just to name a few.

[2:03] Robert W. Schneider: Oh, my heavens. Wow.

[2:04] Kevin David Thomas: To tell us what it was like to stand by for Barbara Harris, work with John Kander,

[2:09] and to tell us all about her new show Much More, a tribute to Tom Jones and Harvey Schmidt,

[2:14] here to prove that her wish came true when she said,

[2:17] Please, God, don't let me be normal.

[2:20] Robert W. Schneider: I'm still saying it.

[2:22] Kevin David Thomas: Is the beautiful and wonderful Rita Gardner.

[2:24] Rita Gardner: Thank you. Thank you, Rob. Thank you, Kevin.

[2:27] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, we are so happy to have you here, Rita.

[2:29] Rita Gardner: Happy to be here.

[2:31] Kevin David Thomas: So, Rita, let's start at the beginning. Where are you from originally?

[2:34] Rita Gardner: I'm from Brooklyn.

[2:36] Kevin David Thomas: All right, a New Yorker.

[2:37] Rita Gardner: I'm a New Yorker.

[2:39] Kevin David Thomas: Through and through. Where in Brooklyn?

[2:40] Rita Gardner: Crown Heights.

[2:41] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, Crown Heights. Now, was your family involved in the arts?

[2:45] Rita Gardner: Nobody. I mean, nobody can sing. Nobody has ever been an actor in my family. No.

[2:51] Kevin David Thomas: They sing off key.

[2:54] Rita Gardner: So, where did you get this from?

[2:55] Rita Gardner: I have no idea. I don't know. I never found that out. No.

[3:00] Kevin David Thomas: Did you grow up going to see shows on Broadway? Do you remember your first show that you saw?

[3:03] Rita Gardner: About three or four or five or whatever, I sang on the radio at five years old on WHN.

[3:12] Rita Gardner: And so, I sang. I was always a singer. I guess that's what I'm told.

[3:17] Rita Gardner: I don't quite remember it all, but my brother does. So, he fills me in sometimes.

[3:20] Kevin David Thomas: Of course. Older brother, right?

[3:22] Rita Gardner: Older brother, yeah.

[3:25] Kevin David Thomas: When you were singing on this radio program, were there any songs that you specifically remember singing or you were just...

[3:30] Rita Gardner: And then, I sang on Coast to Coast on a Bus. I was on a radio show called Coast to Coast on a Bus

[3:35] that Milton Cross was the host. The opera.

[3:39] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[3:39] Rita Gardner: The guy.

[3:41] Kevin David Thomas: Was it called Coast to Coast?

[3:42] Rita Gardner: Coast to Coast on a Bus. And we sang,

[3:45] Coast to Coast on a bus, beep, beep, along the highway, through every byway.

[3:52] Rita Gardner: That's what we sang every week.

[3:53] Kevin David Thomas: Beep, beep. I like that song.

[3:55] Rita Gardner: Yes. I thought I'd put it in my show, but not this one.

[3:58] Kevin David Thomas: Okay. Amazing, amazing, amazing.

[4:02] Rita Gardner: And it was thrilling because if you couldn't get to a show, I mean, we couldn't afford that.

[4:08] Rita Gardner: So, you could afford whatever it was I paid at that time and saw all those great people.

[4:13] Kevin David Thomas: Did you like popular music? Would you listen to the popular music?

[4:16] Rita Gardner: Oh, I sang on Coast to Coast. I sang pop stuff.

[4:19] Kevin David Thomas: But were there any singers or songwriters that you really, really liked?

[4:23] Rita Gardner: I liked the old one. Richard Rodgers. Richard Rodgers, but Rodgers and Hart.

[4:27] Rita Gardner: And I knew Richard Rodgers.

[4:29] Kevin David Thomas: That was the popular music of the time, too.

[4:30] Rita Gardner: Yeah, Rodgers and Hart.

[4:33] Rita Gardner: And Richard Rodgers came to see the Fantastics.

[4:36] Kevin David Thomas: Oh?

[4:37] Rita Gardner: Oh, he did. And his limousine was bigger than the block.

[4:40] Rita Gardner: Because I tell you the truth.

[4:41] Rita Gardner: He took a limousine to go see Fantastics.

[4:42] Rita Gardner: He took a limousine with his wife.

[4:44] Kevin David Thomas: You better take a limousine.

[4:45] Rita Gardner: And then he took me out to a restaurant. And they were playing all that Richard Rodgers music.

[4:52] Kevin David Thomas: And you didn't, he didn't really know him. He was like, I'm taking out Louisa.

[4:56] Rita Gardner: No, no, I did know him because I grew up with his music. I knew all of his songs.

[5:02] Kevin David Thomas: Did he know you beyond what he just seen?

[5:04] Rita Gardner: No, he just saw me in the show. And he said, come on, we're taking you to dinner.

[5:10] Kevin David Thomas: So that's what happened.

[5:12] Robert W. Schneider: Would you get intimidated? Did you get intimidated?

[5:14] Rita Gardner: Well, when he ordered shrimp, I said, what is that? Because I never had it.

[5:20] Rita Gardner: He said, you'll love it, Rita. I said, okay, all right, all right.

[5:24] Rita Gardner: No, he was, he was lovely. Absolutely lovely.

[5:28] Kevin David Thomas: That is so wonderful. It's so exciting when you get to meet one of your mentors

[5:31] or one of your inspirations.

[5:32] Rita Gardner: Well, yes, I mean, the best. And of course, I mean, Gershwin Kern.

[5:38] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, sure. I'm going to put you on the spot if that's okay.

[5:40] Rita Gardner: Of course.

[5:41] Kevin David Thomas: Here we go. Your favorite Richard Rodgers song.

[5:45] Rita Gardner: He was too good to me. How can I get along now?

[5:50] Rita Gardner: That's my favorite.

[5:52] Kevin David Thomas: I love that song. It's honestly one of my favorite. That melody is so beautiful.

[5:58] Rita Gardner: People forget. I mean, people don't know that song as well, that Rodgers and Kern.

[6:01] Kevin David Thomas: That's amazing.

[6:02] Robert W. Schneider: So now you went to high school for the performing arts. You graduate.

[6:06] Kevin David Thomas: And then what's the next step for you?

[6:07] Rita Gardner: Well, I had a lot of jobs. I was always working, doing something.

[6:12] Kevin David Thomas: In addition to your studies?

[6:14] Rita Gardner: Well, yes, absolutely. But when I graduated, I was still working.

[6:21] Rita Gardner: And then I decided it's time to go to school.

[6:24] Rita Gardner: My parents said it's up to you because I could get into Brooklyn College.

[6:29] Rita Gardner: I guess I had the grades at that time. It was a city college.

[6:33] Rita Gardner: So I was in Brooklyn College, but I had about nine jobs.

[6:36] Rita Gardner: So I would go to different classes and fall asleep.

[6:39] Kevin David Thomas: What were some jobs that you had?

[6:41] Rita Gardner: Well, I was singing with a band. I was a dental assistant.

[6:46] Rita Gardner: I can now read x-rays. I'm very good at that.

[6:48] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my goodness.

[6:50] Rita Gardner: Whatever I could get to pay me. I mean, whatever jobs I could get to pay me.

[6:57] Rita Gardner: When I was a young kid, I was on Let's Pretend and all those places, too.

[7:00] Kevin David Thomas: What's Let's Pretend?

[7:01] Rita Gardner: Let's Pretend was a radio show.

[7:05] Rita Gardner: At the time when I was growing up, there were all these radio shows.

[7:09] Rita Gardner: That's what people listened to, the radio, quote, unquote.

[7:15] Kevin David Thomas: I like the name.

[7:16] Rita Gardner: So there was quite a market for that.

[7:17] Rita Gardner: There were podcasts today.

[7:19] Kevin David Thomas: Exactly.

[7:20] Rita Gardner: I mean, that's what we're doing.

[7:22] Rita Gardner: And I was on this radio show called Coast to Coast.

[7:25] Rita Gardner: And then I was on a television show.

[7:27] Rita Gardner: I was with a jazz quartet called the Honeybees.

[7:30] Rita Gardner: And Dave Lambert did our first record.

[7:37] Rita Gardner: And it was Moonglow.

[7:39] Kevin David Thomas: My God, who remembers all of this?

[7:41] Rita Gardner: Yeah, I'd like to find that record, please.

[7:43] Kevin David Thomas: Anybody out there?

[7:43] Rita Gardner: I don't think I have it.

[7:45] Rita Gardner: But my friend Margie Gray might have it.

[7:48] Rita Gardner: I don't know.

[7:48] Kevin David Thomas: But we were a jazz quartet, too.

[7:52] Rita Gardner: I mean, you did everything, it seems.

[7:54] Kevin David Thomas: And did you end up going to a college?

[7:56] Rita Gardner: Did you end up going to Brooklyn College?

[7:56] Rita Gardner: I went to Brooklyn College.

[7:58] Rita Gardner: And then I was in school about a year and a half or two years.

[8:02] Rita Gardner: And I was in this English class.

[8:04] Rita Gardner: And I think it's Jocasta.

[8:08] Rita Gardner: Jocasta is from Odysseus, right?

[8:12] Kevin David Thomas: Yes.

[8:12] Rita Gardner: So I had read that before because that's what I did.

[8:16] Rita Gardner: So the teacher said, my name is Rita Shire.

[8:20] Rita Gardner: So he said, Miss Shire, you stand up and read Jocasta's speech.

[8:24] Rita Gardner: And you can't fall asleep, please, because he was very upset at me.

[8:30] Rita Gardner: So I said, oh, OK.

[8:32] Rita Gardner: So when I was a kid and I had all these lessons,

[8:34] Rita Gardner: I was taught to read cold, as it were.

[8:39] Rita Gardner: And when you do radio, you read cold.

[8:41] Rita Gardner: So I read it cold.

[8:42] Rita Gardner: And he applauded.

[8:44] Rita Gardner: And so did the class.

[8:45] Rita Gardner: And he said, don't stay here.

[8:46] Rita Gardner: Don't stay in class.

[8:48] Rita Gardner: Don't stay in college.

[8:49] Rita Gardner: Just go out and act.

[8:50] Rita Gardner: And that's exactly what happened.

[8:52] Rita Gardner: He called my mother and said, oh, she has to act.

[8:57] Rita Gardner: Get her out of school.

[8:59] Kevin David Thomas: What a great teacher.

[9:01] Rita Gardner: Do you remember his name?

[9:02] Rita Gardner: No.

[9:03] Kevin David Thomas: But what a great teacher.

[9:04] Rita Gardner: Jose.

[9:05] Kevin David Thomas: Wow.

[9:05] Rita Gardner: Well, I mean, it was a surprise.

[9:08] Rita Gardner: But rather than fall asleep, he said, why don't you get on the stage?

[9:13] Kevin David Thomas: So how did you do that?

[9:16] Rita Gardner: I think I auditioned for everything.

[9:17] Rita Gardner: You did.

[9:18] Rita Gardner: Everybody auditioned for everything.

[9:20] Rita Gardner: I mean, one half of the world is auditioning for the other half, isn't it?

[9:23] Kevin David Thomas: So you know about that.

[9:25] Rita Gardner: Did you have like, other than he was too good,

[9:28] was there a song that was like sort of your standard audition song?

[9:31] Rita Gardner: Well, when I went to sing.

[9:33] Rita Gardner: Since much more had not been written yet.

[9:34] Rita Gardner: No, I auditioned for the Fantastics.

[9:36] Rita Gardner: Well, that's, I guess I told that.

[9:38] Rita Gardner: And because I have a show called Try to Remember.

[9:43] Rita Gardner: And I did tell that story.

[9:45] Rita Gardner: And it's really true.

[9:47] Rita Gardner: I came home from a funeral and I said, I've got to get a job.

[9:54] Rita Gardner: It was so upsetting.

[9:55] Rita Gardner: So I looked in Variety and they were auditioning for the Fantastics.

[9:59] Rita Gardner: And I thought it was a review.

[10:00] Rita Gardner: I had no idea.

[10:02] Rita Gardner: And I called Lori Noto and he got on the phone.

[10:06] Rita Gardner: And I talked and talked and talked.

[10:07] Rita Gardner: He said, you know, I like your voice.

[10:09] Rita Gardner: We really know who we want.

[10:11] Rita Gardner: But why don't you come and audition?

[10:13] Rita Gardner: I said, OK.

[10:15] Rita Gardner: So I brought over the Rainbow because I sang that song.

[10:19] Rita Gardner: And I sat and I waited and I walked in.

[10:22] Rita Gardner: And because I was very lucky, I knew how to sight sing.

[10:27] Rita Gardner: So I sang something from the Fantastics.

[10:32] Rita Gardner: I think, I don't know if they were you, something that Harvey gave me.

[10:37] Rita Gardner: And they kept calling me back and back and back.

[10:40] Rita Gardner: And so I got the job.

[10:42] Rita Gardner: But I didn't expect it.

[10:44] Rita Gardner: I really didn't.

[10:45] Rita Gardner: And it was just an accident.

[10:48] Rita Gardner: And I always tell students, because I do teach.

[10:51] Rita Gardner: And I say, you know, everything is an accident.

[10:55] Rita Gardner: You know, as Ruth Gordon says, you work hard.

[10:58] Rita Gardner: You put in that time and you never face the facts.

[11:06] Kevin David Thomas: So do me a favor, if you don't mind.

[11:09] Kevin David Thomas: Would you be so kind as to tell our listeners,

[11:11] Kevin David Thomas: what was auditioning for theater like in the 1950s?

[11:15] Rita Gardner: Because now it's totally different in the 2010s,

[11:18] Rita Gardner: the way you would go and audition for a musical.

[11:21] Rita Gardner: Well, there were more sopranos around.

[11:23] Rita Gardner: Now you have to belt.

[11:24] Rita Gardner: I mean, that's really one of the things.

[11:27] Rita Gardner: And since I don't belt, you know, I was a soprano.

[11:32] Rita Gardner: And I sang songs.

[11:33] Kevin David Thomas: And rapper.

[11:34] Rita Gardner: You're a rapper, too.

[11:35] Rita Gardner: And a rapper, too.

[11:36] Rita Gardner: Before it became popular at Hamilton.

[11:37] Rita Gardner: That I had to learn.

[11:39] Rita Gardner: But, you know, by the way, the interesting thing, I think,

[11:44] Rita Gardner: is that because I realized at a certain time

[11:47] Rita Gardner: that there were no shows that had sopranos.

[11:51] Rita Gardner: Certainly my age.

[11:52] Rita Gardner: You know, I mean, I'm very pragmatic about that.

[11:55] Rita Gardner: I'm a certain age.

[11:56] Rita Gardner: And there were no shows.

[11:59] Rita Gardner: So I...

[12:01] Rita Gardner: I decided that at one point, you know, I said, I have to get back to doing plays. And I did. And that's really what I've been doing. I did I Remember Mama, and then I did it just this past June and July at the Two River Theater.

[12:20] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. And got excellent reviews, by the way.

[12:23] Rita Gardner: Absolutely. Wonderful, wonderful show. And it was very well done. Very good actresses. We played all the parts. We were a certain age. So, you know, when you go to the theater, I don't see that anymore. But you have to nest in the gale, as Margaret Mead says, because you have to see what's, you know, happening and try to be part of it at least.

[12:48] Kevin David Thomas: I see that. And so I audition. That's my middle name.

[12:53] Kevin David Thomas: And you like the process of auditioning?

[12:55] Rita Gardner: No.

[12:55] Kevin David Thomas: You don't like it?

[12:55] Rita Gardner: No, because what are they looking for? What do they want? You know, as an actress, you always go, Oh, my God, what am I doing here? I don't want to be here. And you've had a very wonderful career.

[13:10] Rita Gardner: That never goes away. The what am I doing here? What do they want? No, it's always there. Absolutely. Why would you be an actor? I mean, it's always that part of you that says, I feel like five years old again.

[13:22] Kevin David Thomas: Totally. What piece of wisdom would you like to impart on people that are just entering this business?

[13:25] Rita Gardner: I think you, I guess I'm keep quoting things. Hamlet says, the readiness is all. Am I right about that? Yes. I think you have to know your craft because so many things happen and you have to know how to handle yourself in the theater. And now you have to know how to do a movie. I mean, what does that take? It's not a big voice, but you still have to have an emotional life and be real. So I think you have to know your craft. Always keep oiled because you can meet someone on the street and they say, gee, you're right for this. And when you're not oiled, that's when you get into trouble.

[14:10] Kevin David Thomas: How do you stay oiled?

[14:13] Rita Gardner: I take classes all the time. I take singing lessons. I go to a gym. I have an acting class. We did pieces of Pinter and that's going to be done again.

[14:22] Kevin David Thomas: That's awesome. And you don't think about it, but it gives you joy. What gives you joy and what is your passion? Passion is very important. You only get one choice really in life. Have someone you love, hopefully, but you have one choice when it comes to what you love to do. So you have to look at that very carefully.

[14:47] Kevin David Thomas: That is beautiful. And that's a great piece of advice to pass on to the next generation of performers.

[14:51] Rita Gardner: Absolutely. And when I see it, when I teach and I see it, I go, ah, that one I know is going to be good. I mean, you get to know.

[15:06] Kevin David Thomas: That's beautiful. And then you look at yourself. When you were auditioning for the Fantastics, we'll go back to the Fantastics for a second. When you were auditioning for the Fantastics, did you realize that you were working on something that was going to turn out to be so monumentally huge? Did you know what you were working on was special?

[15:25] Rita Gardner: I always thought it was special because I was the only girl.

[15:28] Kevin David Thomas: That's the right answer, Rita. That's the right answer. That's always the best.

[15:37] Rita Gardner: And it had Jerry Orbach. It had Kenneth Nelson. And Tom Jones did the old actor. And we had Word Baker. And it was fun. And if it was a good day, we worked longer than we did when it wasn't a good day. And it was like the French. You come in and you start rehearsing and Word would say, let's go home. And then the next day would be great. And you'd stay later because there were no rules. I mean, you're talking about 1960.

[16:08] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah. Going back to the Fantastics for a second, like you had mentioned earlier, which was the staging of the show was so unique because most musicals at that time were very literal. And they're literal now, too, believe me.

[16:20] Rita Gardner: And they are very literal now. But I recently took a group of students to see the Fantastics. And it is still so moving and so inventive and so creative. In the rehearsal process, were you all part of creating or did Mr. Baker have a very clear idea of this is the way it's going to be?

[16:41] Rita Gardner: No, we improvised a lot of stuff. He said, that works, that doesn't. And then he said, try this. Everything was easy. We didn't know we were going to be in a hit or a show that's lasted over 50 years. We were just doing a show and we got a dollar forty. I mean, God knows we didn't get a lot of money. So and then I knew I said. And I did. I do talk about it. We did a 12 midnight preview. That was the first preview.

[17:16] Kevin David Thomas: A midnight preview.

[17:16] Rita Gardner: Yes, we did. Midnight show.

[17:18] Kevin David Thomas: And who came but my ex-husband and Charles Nelson Reilly.

[17:23] Rita Gardner: Nice. So because my ex-husband had said, it'll never amount to a thing. And very quickly, would you mind telling our listeners who your ex-husband was?

[17:30] Rita Gardner: Herb Gardner. He was a playwright.

[17:33] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. And a very talented one.

[17:35] Rita Gardner: Right. But he didn't think that it would last or he didn't think, what is this that you're doing? And Charles said, of course, it's wonderful. And in 12 minutes, he had eight songs.

[17:48] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, that's like totally. I couldn't hear him saying that. I mean, like. Eight songs.

[17:56] Rita Gardner: We love Charles Nelson Reilly on this podcast.

[17:59] Kevin David Thomas: The best. The best. We used to go to auditions. I played his agent. He played mine. We were.

[18:05] Rita Gardner: Really? I've known him for a long time.

[18:07] Kevin David Thomas: Wait, what do you mean? And I loved him, but he knew everything.

[18:12] Rita Gardner: Oh, please. Charles was very astute. He taught opera history. Nobody knew more about opera.

[18:20] Rita Gardner: Oh, my God. He really loved it. Wow.

[18:22] Kevin David Thomas: Wow. That's really, really fun.

[18:24] Rita Gardner: Yeah. We heard he was like kind of this renaissance man. I mean, more than just being a singer, actor. Nobody knew who he was. It was remarkable.

[18:32] Rita Gardner: And he introduced me to Roberta Peters, who became a friend.

[18:35] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. Oh, yeah.

[18:37] Rita Gardner: And I loved her. And I guess one of the most thrilling things I ever did was singing with her. She was asked to sing at the Eugene O'Neill. They were having a big benefit. And she said, I can't sing an hour, Rita. I mean, so I'll sing some things, you'll sing some things, and then we'll sing together. And it was thrilling.

[18:56] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my God. That was thrilling.

[18:58] Rita Gardner: And I love her. She's a special lady.

[19:01] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, wow. This role that you created has been embodied by so many young actresses.

[19:06] Rita Gardner: Oh, my God. It'll continue to be embodied by young actresses way beyond any of our lifetimes. What pieces of advice would you give a young actress that's about to play the girl for the first time in The Fantastics?

[19:17] Rita Gardner: I do say that you keep it simple. Simple. I mean, that's what it is. And it didn't get good reviews. You knew that, didn't you?

[19:28] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. Oh, yeah.

[19:28] Rita Gardner: Cute, adorable, right? Yeah. Walter Kerr. So Lori Noto, because I wouldn't have gotten the part if it weren't for Lori.

[19:37] Kevin David Thomas: He was the producer on it?

[19:38] Rita Gardner: Yes. And I came in after talking to him and he said, you're the girl.

[19:43] Kevin David Thomas: Right. That's what he said to me immediately before I sang. And did you say originally that they had another girl in mind for this role?

[19:47] Rita Gardner: Oh, yes, they did. She's still crying, I'm sure. Oh, God, I love it so much.

[19:58] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, it's so good. I mean, she was sitting there. Oh, my God.

[20:01] Rita Gardner: Oh, gosh. And I think they wanted Susan Watson also because she hadn't gotten Bye Bye Birdie.

[20:09] Rita Gardner: But she got Bye Bye Birdie and I'm very thankful that she did.

[20:13] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. Good for her and great for you.

[20:16] Rita Gardner: Yes. Even better.

[20:17] Kevin David Thomas: So then after The Fantastics, your first Broadway show is A Family Affair. Is that correct?

[20:24] Rita Gardner: Yes.

[20:25] Kevin David Thomas: Now, can you tell us who wrote the music for A Family Affair?

[20:28] Rita Gardner: John Kander.

[20:30] Kevin David Thomas: John Kander. And this cast of A Family Affair is like a who's who because it's Linda Lavin.

[20:36] Rita Gardner: Yes, she was marvelous. Shelley Berman, Eileen Heckert. Larry Kirk. Larry Kirk, B.B. Osterwald. I mean, this is this is a group of people. Catherine Damon, would you do me a favor? Would you tell us a little bit about what exactly was A Family Affair about?

[20:52] Rita Gardner: Marriage, getting married. This is about two families. And I was the girl in the one family and Larry was the guy in the other.

[21:01] Kevin David Thomas: Wow. So that and it wasn't very easy. And I don't know if you know this, but it was very sad for me because I guess some things didn't work. And so Word was asked to leave and Hal Prince took over.

[21:15] Rita Gardner: That was the first job as a director.

[21:18] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. Who had directed Fantastic.

[21:19] Rita Gardner: Yes. Oh, that I did. And then Hal took over and Hal took over. And I loved Hal. But I remembered the first day he came to rehearsal and I was crying because, oh, my goodness. And he said, it's OK, we'll work it out. And he was so kind. And I've always remembered that about him.

[21:37] Kevin David Thomas: That is so sweet. Very.

[21:39] Rita Gardner: And this was one of his first big, if not that was the first.

[21:42] Kevin David Thomas: This is the first show we ever directed on Broadway.

[21:44] Rita Gardner: Yeah. So no, no, no. So that was the first one.

[21:46] Kevin David Thomas: And Shelly, is he still alive?

[21:52] Rita Gardner: I think Mr. Berman has passed.

[21:55] Kevin David Thomas: Very difficult. OK, yeah.

[21:59] Rita Gardner: You know, very, very difficult.

[22:01] Kevin David Thomas: What made him so difficult as a.

[22:06] Rita Gardner: I don't know because I didn't know Shelly Berman. I mean, I knew that Charles told me a very funny story. I said, who is this man? That's you know, I mean, he's not done a show before, but he was so difficult to work with. He said, Rita, when I was studying with Uta Hagen. Uta and Herbert had their first place was on 26th Street, I think the first school. And I mean, I think Geraldine Page was there and Jason Robart. I mean, a lot of very famous, wonderful actors. And Uta would assign scenes. And Shelly Berman was in the class. So Charles would say, everyone said, well, I'm working with this one. I'm working with this one. I'm working with. Never would they work with Shelly Berman. But that started his career as a monologist, because then he started writing monologues because no one would do a scene with him.

[23:01] Rita Gardner: That's really funny. That's really what I was told. And I said, I understand that.

[23:09] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my goodness. Wow. Tell us what it was like working with Eileen Heckert.

[23:14] Rita Gardner: I what can I say? And I say this because what an actress, right? So she got this part in a musical. She'd never done a musical, but she had auditioned and she got the part. Right. But she didn't realize there's eight performances where you really have to sing and you really have to know some music. You have to be musical. And she found this very, very difficult. And I don't blame her. So she left, I think, rather early because it was very difficult for her. She didn't understand it. I mean, unless you do a musical, you don't understand what that takes.

[23:53] Kevin David Thomas: Exactly. I mean, Ethel Merman said, I lived like a nun. You know, you go, you went home and slept and came back and did the show. And you have to do the same.

[24:03] Rita Gardner: The Family Affair does not last very long, unfortunately, but this company, my God, this cast.

[24:08] Kevin David Thomas: Yes. And the, who, William Goldman and Jim, is it Jim?

[24:14] Rita Gardner: Yeah. They wrote the book.

[24:16] Kevin David Thomas: The Goldman Brothers.

[24:17] Rita Gardner: The Goldman Brothers wrote the book and wrote the lyrics.

[24:19] Kevin David Thomas: And what was it like working with John Kander?

[24:22] Rita Gardner: Oh, I thought he was marvelous. And I think that this, I don't know if he remembers it, and I don't know if you really want to put it. Just, I'll tell you the story. I mean, my God. They were always doing jigsaw puzzles or whatever, because they'd never worked on a musical. So one day, I just, I guess Johnny was, you know, it was upsetting. The whole thing was upsetting. So I said, Johnny, once you get a lyricist, you'll be a star. So at 12 o'clock one day at midnight, when I was living on the Upper East Side, he said, do you want to hear my coloring book?

[25:00] Kevin David Thomas: That was the one that Barbara Streisand did, isn't it?

[25:03] Rita Gardner: Yeah, that's right. And he played it for me and he said, I'm working with Fred Ebb. And we just did this and I wanted you to hear it.

[25:13] Kevin David Thomas: Really?

[25:14] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Oh, my goodness. That is so lovely. Yes. Oh, the nicest, the loveliest. And I don't know if you want to use that.

[25:21] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, yes.

[25:22] Rita Gardner: Because he was a very kind man. And all I'm saying is that, I mean, Bill Goldman has gone on to do many things, and so has Jim, and they were talented. But the other thing is, they had never written a book for a musical.

[25:36] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[25:37] Rita Gardner: Or lyrics. Do you think that's what the issue with the show was?

[25:40] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[25:41] Rita Gardner: Do you think we might ever see a revival or maybe an encore?

[25:43] Kevin David Thomas: It's a wonderful show.

[25:44] Rita Gardner: Maybe someone can redo it or something. Maybe encores. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. There's some wonderful things in that. At least there's an album, at least.

[25:53] Kevin David Thomas: You can hear the song.

[25:55] Rita Gardner: Yes. Oh, yeah. There's a wonderful album. I really love that album. It's terrific. It really is. And, John, you hear the talent.

[26:02] Kevin David Thomas: Yes.

[26:03] Rita Gardner: You hear it. The talent, the wonderful talent. And I think had they had maybe more money or they could take it on the road for a little bit longer and get help, it would have run a long time.

[26:11] Kevin David Thomas: You next do Pal Joey.

[26:14] Rita Gardner: Oh, my God, with Bobby Fosse.

[26:17] Kevin David Thomas: Bobby Fosse.

[26:18] Rita Gardner: Who?

[26:19] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, yeah. Fosse.

[26:21] Rita Gardner: Bobby Fosse. I love it. Bobby Fosse. And that was a nut. Oh, my God. She's not here, thank goodness. That was Vivica Lindfors. And she had the same problem.

[26:30] Kevin David Thomas: What?

[26:33] Rita Gardner: She'd never done a musical. Vivica Lindfors.

[26:35] Kevin David Thomas: Lindfors is an actress.

[26:36] Rita Gardner: Yeah, right there. Who played Vera. Oh, my God. Oh, Vera. Yeah. And so that was also very difficult. You played Linda.

[26:43] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[26:44] Rita Gardner: And you also had Kay Medford.

[26:45] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, she was marvelous.

[26:46] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Best known to many people as Albert Peterson's mother.

[26:49] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, of course. By Bertie.

[26:51] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Tell me what, so now this is very interesting. This is Bob Fosse onstage, not offstage, onstage.

[26:57] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah, he's playing.

[26:58] Rita Gardner: But he redid the-

[26:59] Kevin David Thomas: Joey.

[27:00] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Well, he played Joey and then he choreographed the dances.

[27:05] Kevin David Thomas: He choreographed his own dances or-

[27:07] Rita Gardner: The whole thing.

[27:08] Kevin David Thomas: The whole thing.

[27:09] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Okay, my gosh. What's it like sharing a stage with Bobby Fosse?

[27:14] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my God.

[27:15] Rita Gardner: I've never heard him referred to as Bobby. We sang If They Asked Me I Could Write a Book, remember?

[27:20] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah, well, yes.

[27:21] Rita Gardner: You were his love interest. And everybody was singing with the orchestra and there was no time to rehearse this song because Bobby was doing a dance number. And so Bobby said, I'm not going to do the dance number. I know this dance number. Let's sing this song because Rita needs to rehearse.

[27:44] Kevin David Thomas: Wow.

[27:45] Rita Gardner: Sounds like Fosse. I mean, you're bringing back so many memories. I mean-

[27:49] Kevin David Thomas: My goodness.

[27:50] Rita Gardner: And he did that. So that, I always remembered Bobby. He was terrific. And I said, Mr. Fosse, don't yell at me because he would, you know, they yell at dances, choreographers-

[28:05] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[28:06] Rita Gardner: At that time. And he said, no, I'd never do that. He was cute. Nice man.

[28:12] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah. Now, this is really fun. Did you enjoy working in these larger environments? So what I mean by that is you had just done The Fantastics, which was off-Broadway in a nice, intimate theater. Did you enjoy playing Broadway? Did you enjoy playing something that was more commercial?

[28:27] Rita Gardner: I loved it because it was Broadway and that was the thing I knew. You know, I always wanted to do a Broadway show, sure. Speaking of Broadway shows, do you want to ask about one of your favorites?

[28:39] Kevin David Thomas: Ben Franklin in Paris.

[28:41] Rita Gardner: Ben Franklin in Paris? Yes. Well, that's another show that I replaced Susan Watson. She was in it and then I came in it. And another great guy was Bob Preston.

[28:53] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, Robert Preston.

[28:55] Rita Gardner: Mr. Harold Hill from the Music Committee.

[28:56] Kevin David Thomas: That's right. Tell us what it's like working with Robert Preston.

[28:59] Rita Gardner: He would come in and I had a dance. Now, I'm not a dancer. So, and he was very tall. And he said, let's work on this. And he came in and rehearsed with me and sent me dozens of roses.

[29:10] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, what a sweetheart.

[29:12] Rita Gardner: Oh, my God. He was great. So, what was Ben Franklin in Paris about?

[29:17] Kevin David Thomas: Ben Franklin in Paris.

[29:20] Rita Gardner: And we move on. Good job, Rob. Good job, Rob. Thank you. And we move on from there. Yes. And he was brilliant in the role. Did you mind replacing?

[29:30] Kevin David Thomas: Did I mind?

[29:32] Rita Gardner: I think at that time I was happy to work. Later on, when I had a standby, I needed a job. I did standby for a lot of people.

[29:39] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[29:40] Rita Gardner: I didn't like it because there was no time to rehearse. I mean, I went on for Franny Sternhagen, what was it, five or six years ago? I don't remember. And there was no time to rehearse The Foreigner. Do you know? I mean, there was no time. This is a play, a very difficult play with Matthew Broderick. I'd never worked with him. And I had to go on immediately. I mean, she was ill. And there's no time to rehearse. I didn't. That was very difficult. So I think later on, no, I didn't like it. Later on, no.

[30:10] Kevin David Thomas: And then, you know, you standby for Barbara Harris, right?

[30:14] Rita Gardner: Oh, yes, I did.

[30:17] Kevin David Thomas: So, you know, having gone from the girl in The Fantastics to then a nice big role in Family Affair, then your pal Joey, are you okay standing by at that point?

[30:27] Rita Gardner: Well, they were paying me well, but I said, Jesus, I'd love to go on for this show. I did it in stock afterwards. But she never got sick till after I left. So that was the end of that. But I did do it with Gig Young, and I did it with a couple of other people.

[30:46] Kevin David Thomas: In stock?

[30:47] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Were you doing stock?

[30:49] Kevin David Thomas: Sure.

[30:50] Rita Gardner: Everyone did stock. During this time, yeah. Absolutely. You know, the stock, they did all this. Stars were doing, I mean, like, everyone, yeah. Everyone did stock. What's the theater you like?

[30:59] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, Kenley.

[31:00] Rita Gardner: Yes, I did it.

[31:02] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, Ohio.

[31:03] Rita Gardner: You did, what's his name? He, you know, dressed as a woman, too. John Kenley, is that his name?

[31:07] Kevin David Thomas: Yes.

[31:08] Rita Gardner: Yes. And I did 1776 with Joel Grey.

[31:11] Kevin David Thomas: What?

[31:12] Rita Gardner: Joel was John Adams?

[31:13] Kevin David Thomas: Yes, he was.

[31:14] Rita Gardner: And we did it at the Kenley.

[31:16] Kevin David Thomas: Yes, in Ohio.

[31:17] Rita Gardner: At the Kenley. Oh, my.

[31:19] Kevin David Thomas: So you did the Kenley? You did that?

[31:21] Rita Gardner: Yes, when I did 1776 on Broadway, and so then they, you know, they asked me to do the Kenley players, and so of course I did it.

[31:27] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my gosh.

[31:28] Rita Gardner: With Joel Grey.

[31:29] Kevin David Thomas: That's very cool.

[31:31] Rita Gardner: That's wild. That's very, very cool. Okay. And so that was, that was all summer. Did you enjoy, what was it like working with Barbara Harris?

[31:39] Kevin David Thomas: I didn't work with her.

[31:40] Rita Gardner: Or at least observing her process, I should say. Because she fascinates us, and she fascinates a lot of our listeners.

[31:46] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah, she's, she kind of like, yeah.

[31:49] Rita Gardner: Brilliant. I think she's a brilliant lady. Yes. And so when she was doing this part, well, the one thing Burton Lane said, because she said, why would I sing What Did I Have That I Don't Have, a girl who really doesn't speak that way. And she did it wonderfully. And Burton Lane said, I don't know if you want to put this in, but he said, Barbara, it's going to be a hit. Just sing it. Just sing the song.

[32:15] Kevin David Thomas: Did you have a lot of, did you have a lot of interaction with Mr. Lane or Mr. Lerner, the composer and the writer?

[32:23] Rita Gardner: Well, Mr. Lerner was always going to somebody's funeral or wedding. So, and he, the best. I mean, you know, when you read his book, On the Street Where I Live, I mean, he was one of the best lyricists. And Burton Lane, I got to know. So I liked them both. And the show kind of worked, I guess, but it was never really a true hit.

[32:45] Kevin David Thomas: It was Idy Murphy.

[32:46] Rita Gardner: Oh, yeah. And it was, it never coagulated, as it were. And if those of you are wondering, if you've, in case you don't know, On a Clear Day, You Can See Forever, you could say it's the ESP musical. You know, it's essentially about, you know, going back and finding your alter life, your previous life.

[33:03] Kevin David Thomas: Yes, reincarnation.

[33:04] Rita Gardner: Reincarnation. But it wasn't together. Do you know what I mean?

[33:07] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[33:08] Rita Gardner: It just didn't happen. And there were some wonderful songs that were cut out that I still have.

[33:11] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, yeah.

[33:12] Rita Gardner: Oh, really? Cozy and Tosh. I still have the music to that. And it took place. I mean, and the character, you know, goes back in time. And they never could get that.

[33:25] Kevin David Thomas: Yes.

[33:26] Rita Gardner: I mean, it was difficult. John Cullum took the lead.

[33:29] Kevin David Thomas: I know.

[33:30] Rita Gardner: What's his name? Either was fired or left. Or I don't remember. I think it was Louis Jordan.

[33:36] Kevin David Thomas: That's right.

[33:37] Rita Gardner: It was. Who was on the road. And then they said, bye bye.

[33:40] Kevin David Thomas: You always do that.

[33:41] Rita Gardner: I do. You're like, I think it's so and so. You know.

[33:44] Kevin David Thomas: You don't know.

[33:45] Rita Gardner: You know you're right. Yes. And he was. I thought he was terrific.

[33:49] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[33:50] Rita Gardner: He was. But I don't know what happened there. You know, we don't really talk a lot about plays on our podcast. But I do have to talk about Last of the Red Hot Lovers. Because I think it's such a funny play.

[34:02] Kevin David Thomas: Yes, it is.

[34:03] Rita Gardner: And you got to work with, I'm assuming, an actor who I really, really love. And that's James Coco.

[34:07] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, he was adorable. I don't think a lot of our younger listeners might know who James Coco is. But I'm going to go so far as to give this analogy, if that's OK. You have to think the Nathan Lane of the 60s.

[34:20] Rita Gardner: Very good.

[34:21] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, yeah.

[34:22] Rita Gardner: OK. Absolutely. Very funny. Very witty. And when I went on, I don't, I think it was for Linda or was it Rita Moreno? I don't remember. But I think I went on for Linda. Because Linda, wasn't Linda Lavin?

[34:36] Kevin David Thomas: Yes, Linda Lavin, yeah.

[34:37] Rita Gardner: I think I went on for her. But I don't, it was very fast. Of course. And so I was doing the part. And Jimmy Coco was so sweet. But he, you know, he was nervous. I had never worked with him. And Linda was wonderful. And she was. That every time I spoke, he would speak with me. I mean, he said my lines under his breath. And so I don't think he realized that. And I said, Mr. Coco, I think I can do this. And he said, yes, you can. OK. So he was adorable.

[35:09] Kevin David Thomas: How sweet.

[35:10] Rita Gardner: Yeah. Very, very sweet. I love that. I love that. I love that. He was lovely.

[35:15] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah. Let's hear a show that fascinates us. Because we don't know all that much about it. But we've heard many stories. What was Ari?

[35:22] Rita Gardner: Ari. Oh, my goodness, Ari.

[35:28] Kevin David Thomas: Yeah.

[35:30] Rita Gardner: I stood by in that, too.

[35:34] Kevin David Thomas: Oh, my goodness. It was an original musical from like 1971.

[35:37] Rita Gardner: Yes.

[35:38] Kevin David Thomas: And Constance Towers.

[35:39] Rita Gardner: I stood by for. Constance Towers. I look like a walking bodice because she was so tall.

[35:46] Rita Gardner: And I was so short. Oh, my goodness. That's amazing. It was so crazy. And David Cryer.

[35:54] Kevin David Thomas: David.

[35:55] Rita Gardner: I don't. Yeah, David Cryer. He was in it.

[35:58] Kevin David Thomas: He was Ari.

[36:01] Rita Gardner: Yes, he was Ari.

[36:04] Rita Gardner: There's a song, and I once did something in a, well, you know, I did nightclub stuff. And Ken Friedman, and I will say his name, was this wonderful writer who said, you should do your medley of mistakes. He's a brilliant writer. So I had to sing the song that I sang in Ari that was probably one of the worst songs you ever heard. This is the musical version of Exodus, correct? I'm going to say that again. The musical version of Exodus. Oh, my God. I forgot all about that. But I remember when I was singing the song from Ari, if I could ever remember. This medley of mistakes, it was a wonderful piece that he wrote because there were many shows that I had to do the wrong song. Everyone else had the good songs. And you had like the skip song. Yeah, you had the skip song. So that really was a very, that didn't, I don't know if that, did that come in or that's the last?

[37:08] Robert W. Schneider: No, according to our notes, it did come in. You were at the now defunct Mark Hellinger Theater. You played 12 previews and 19 performances, and then we went away.

[37:18] Rita Gardner: Yeah, yeah. Okay. It was very short. And I think you were okay with that. Is that right?

[37:22] Rita Gardner: Oh, I was so happy to get out of that. Oh, that was because I said to Constance Tower, she had to go home New Year's Eve and sing with Guy Lombardo or somebody. And I said, she's going home and I have to go on for her.

[37:38] Robert W. Schneider: You work so fluidly between musicals and plays. It just, and voiceover work. You're a very successful voiceover artist.

[37:45] Rita Gardner: Well, right now it's hard because everybody wants to do them. But I did Dora the Explorer, so that's really wonderful.

[37:58] Robert W. Schneider: Who are you in Dora the Explorer?

[37:59] Rita Gardner: I did Joan Rivers for them. And then I was the grandmother. So they said, that's what we want. I did it over the phone. So they said, oh, I said, let me try that.

[38:11] Robert W. Schneider: That's so wonderful. So you can just do it from the comfort of your own living room.

[38:15] Rita Gardner: I didn't realize it, but my agent said, you're going to do it on the phone.

[38:18] Robert W. Schneider: Yeah. Well, a lot of voiceover people do set it up in their apartments now.

[38:24] Rita Gardner: They do that.

[38:25] Robert W. Schneider: Yeah. You have a list of questions, right? Is that right?

[38:28] Rita Gardner: No, I was just curious.

[38:30] Robert W. Schneider: What, how, after your career has spanned many different facets, how do you stay motivated? How do you stay active in it? Because jobs just don't fall in our laps.

[38:45] Rita Gardner: You know, we have to, you know.

[38:47] Rita Gardner: I take classes. And that, oh, that is such a good, I think it's so refreshing to hear you say that out loud that you constantly are challenging yourself. Or read another play or say, listen, this is interesting. I mean, that's how we did Pieces of Pinter. And then I take singing lessons every week.

[39:03] Robert W. Schneider: Right. The classes refuel you.

[39:05] Rita Gardner: Yes, absolutely. They give you a jolt. And then I have to, if you don't take singing lessons, it's a blind art to sing.

[39:11] Robert W. Schneider: Right.

[39:12] Rita Gardner: So if you don't take singing lessons, if you let it go for a long time, then your voice can go.

[39:17] Robert W. Schneider: Right.

[39:18] Rita Gardner: And if you start squeezing the vocal cords, it goes forever. So, you know, you have to really be aware of that.

[39:26] Robert W. Schneider: Were there certain transitions throughout your, were there any times in your career that you thought, man, I don't know if I need to do this anymore, or maybe it's stalling or maybe, you know, because we look at you and say, you know, you've always been a legend. How could it ever, but.

[39:39] Rita Gardner: Every single day. What am I doing? Oh, my God. Why am I doing this? Oh, my God. And, you know, I mean, my husband hears it all the time. So it's it's always a constant battle.

[39:52] Rita Gardner: It's a constant battle, even when you're working. Oh, my God, I'm doing this part. It's not very good, is it? Is it very good? No, but I'll try something else. I mean, you go through so many things. But the thing that you always have is the joy of what you do.

[40:11] Robert W. Schneider: Right.

[40:11] Rita Gardner: Because in the end, you forget, you know, reality. I'll only go as a tourist. I mean, that was written. So you go on the stage and it's another world. So that's the joy and that's your passion. And no matter what it is, I mean, if you're a bricklayer, if that's your passion, do it. I don't believe in retirement.

[40:34] Rita Gardner: You're asking the wrong person, because I know people retire now. I say, what do you play golf? You go to the beach, you do this, you do that. And then what do you do? No, no, I don't. Oh, well, I just don't believe it. And maybe because I started so early. That's all I knew.

[40:53] Robert W. Schneider: Right. That's part of your life.

[40:55] Rita Gardner: Yeah. What do you look for in your fellow storytellers? What do you look for in another actor?

[41:01] Rita Gardner: In another actor? I don't really look for anything. If they move me or I'm glued to them or something magical happens, then that's it. If I'm thinking, oh, God, they're working too hard. They shouldn't do that. They've chosen the wrong song. If my brain starts going, no. And it's just me. You know, I mean, people love certain people and it's not everybody. But I know that if I'm sitting in an audience and somebody wonderful is on the stage, I love it. And even people that are my age and do what I do, if they're terrific, they're terrific.

[41:41] Robert W. Schneider: What do you look for in a director?

[41:44] Rita Gardner: Oh, that's hard. Because there's no rules here. A director has to reach your subconscious or let you alone so that you can find it. Dan Sullivan is one of the best. Jack O'Brien. And they know how to get to you. And it's a wonderful thing. Otherwise, you feel like you're in a classroom and I don't like to feel like I'm in a classroom.

[42:13] Robert W. Schneider: You've done a lot of standing by.

[42:16] Rita Gardner: Yeah.

[42:18] Robert W. Schneider: That's an art in itself.

[42:21] Rita Gardner: Hard. I don't want to do it now. Somebody offered me something. I said, no, not at this age, not now. I'll wait for a part. Thank you.

[42:30] Robert W. Schneider: Would you explain to our listeners exactly what does a standby do?

[42:34] Rita Gardner: You have to learn everything. Very little rehearsal. And you can go on at a moment's notice and never have a chance to do it and be with actors. It's awful.

[42:47] Robert W. Schneider: Are you required to be at the theater every night?

[42:49] Rita Gardner: Yes, most of the time.

[42:50] Robert W. Schneider: And just wait until...

[42:51] Rita Gardner: Wait or watch it every night.

[42:53] Robert W. Schneider: Yeah. Some people have to watch it all the time.

[42:56] Robert W. Schneider: The last time you stood by was mornings at seven?

[42:59] Rita Gardner: I think so. Yeah. Yeah. And I had a difficult time there, but they were very good actors and it was a wonderful play. But I was glad that it was over.

[43:13] Robert W. Schneider: How do you make it work when you're having a difficult time?

[43:17] Rita Gardner: I think you have to do your best to relax, breathe.

[43:21] Robert W. Schneider: Are you into yoga or meditation or good whiskey?

[43:25] Rita Gardner: I'm into breathing, a lot of breathing. Whatever that means. I just sit and I relax and I think of a place that I want to be and just breathe. And so maybe that's when I was... Maybe that's meditation, my meditation. Everybody has their own.

[43:41] Robert W. Schneider: You're still auditioning?

[43:43] Rita Gardner: I think probably always I'll be auditioning.

[43:47] Robert W. Schneider: About, what was it? 10 years ago, the musical The Wedding Singer was coming to Broadway. How did you hear about that? Was it just a regular audition? Were your agents like, hey, there's this part, but here you go.

[44:01] Rita Gardner: Here's the secret. I was. Hamilton hadn't started yet. So rapping on stage wasn't exactly the biggest thing in the world. No. And I...

[44:07] Rita Gardner: And here's Rita. I turned it down to begin with.

[44:11] Robert W. Schneider: Did you really?

[44:12] Rita Gardner: No, this is what happened. Because that was an awesome moment in theater when you rap that song. Amazing.

[44:18] Rita Gardner: Thank you. I was doing The Foreigner. And my agent said, listen, they're doing The Wedding Singer. And you come and audition for it. They're doing a reading. So they sent me the music. It was such dirty lyrics.

[44:35] Rita Gardner: Yes, it is. And I said, you know something? I've seen the movie. I don't want to get on a stage and say all that. You know why? Because it's not this character. I can't do it. Tell him no.

[44:48] Rita Gardner: So somebody else did it and they did the workshop and whatever. And my agent called a couple of months later. And said, now Bernie Telsey, very nice man, says you have to come and audition. They fixed the song. It's not the same. Blah, blah, blah. I'm sending you the song. Get an accompanist and come and audition.

[45:06] Rita Gardner: And I thought, or Bernie Telsey will never speak to you again.

[45:09] Robert W. Schneider: Yeah.

[45:10] Rita Gardner: I said, OK. So I did. And I walked in. And I didn't care. That's when you get everything, when you don't care. In life, when you don't care. I'm not going to speak about what's happening now in this world. But the thing is, I said, OK. And I was reading. And this is a very flirty person. And I sat on someone's lap. And I sang. And I got up. And I left. And I didn't even get home. But my husband called. And he said, you got this. And I got. And they said, if she does this big workshop, she has the part. Incredible.

[45:52] Robert W. Schneider: That's what happened. And did you grow to enjoy the rapping of the song?

[45:56] Rita Gardner: Well, the thing is, then I had a song called Eight Men. And they cut that.

[46:00] Robert W. Schneider: OK.

[46:01] Rita Gardner: Eight Men? It's called Eight Men. Oh. I still have the music.

[46:04] Robert W. Schneider: I bet.

[46:05] Rita Gardner: And they cut that. But then they put in the rap number. So there was it. And yes, I enjoyed it. Big reaction. The audience loved it. I mean, come on, every night. And I had a great Kevin. I worked with Kevin. And he was wonderful. And I think I realized that, oh my god, who cares? I'll just do it. And again, my agent was terrific. Tim got me a great contract.

[46:32] Robert W. Schneider: Who is your agent, by the way?

[46:35] Rita Gardner: Oh, it's BRS Gage.

[46:37] Robert W. Schneider: Yes.

[46:38] Rita Gardner: Oh, yes, of course. Mark Redonte and all the, I love them. But Tim left. But at that time, he was the one who got the contract and whatever. But I was lucky. He was very good. And the rest of the agents are, too.

[46:52] Robert W. Schneider: Yeah. When does Much More, a tribute to Tom Jones and Harvey Schmidt, get premiered?

[46:56] Rita Gardner: I think it'll probably be in the spring.

[46:58] Robert W. Schneider: In the spring.

[46:59] Rita Gardner: Because I've been asked to do something for HB, where I work.

[47:02] Robert W. Schneider: Oh, HB Studios.

[47:03] Rita Gardner: And a musical thing that they have. And said, would I do it? So I'm in the middle of thinking about that.

[47:10] Robert W. Schneider: Great. And at the Metropolitan Room, I'm assuming?

[47:13] Rita Gardner: No, this would be at, oh, where would I do? Much More. It's either there or 54 Below, whichever.

[47:21] Robert W. Schneider: Come to 54 Below.

[47:23] Rita Gardner: Anywhere. We'll take you anywhere.

[47:24] Robert W. Schneider: Oh, really? Thank you.

[47:26] Rita Gardner: You want to set up in Times Square with a boom box.

[47:28] Robert W. Schneider: Oh, wow. That's so nice of you.

[47:30] Rita Gardner: How nice. How sweet. Thank you.

[47:31] Robert W. Schneider: And we so appreciate you taking the time to be with us today.

[47:36] Rita Gardner: Oh, it was fun. And you know what? I didn't realize I had done so much.

[47:42] Robert W. Schneider: Good. I mean, you reminded me. And I said, Jesus Christ, I did that? You do this very well.

[47:49] Rita Gardner: Oh, thank you. And I know talent.