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[0:00] Jeffrey Dreisbach: I hear this quite frequently. I like my agent, but they're not sending me out much. Or my agent doesn't see me the way I see me. Or I'm afraid of pissing my manager off because they aren't pushing me enough, and I'm pissed about it. Does this sound familiar? Maybe you are looking for any representation or new representation. Today I will weigh in and offer my best advice on this episode called Representation Regrets. I'm Jeffrey Dreisbach, and this is Casting Actors Cast, the podcast for actors from a casting director.

[0:43] Jeffrey Dreisbach: It's time for another episode of Casting Actors Cast. Insights for Actors from a Casting Director. Each week, we show you how to advance your talent and your career with practical tips, advice, and positivity. Here is your host, Jeffrey Dreisbach.

[1:02] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Well, hello, and welcome to today's episode of Casting Actors Cast. I'm casting partner Jeffrey Dreisbach with the McCorkel Casting Group in New York. How are you? Hope you're having a good day. I'm having a really good day, and I'm looking forward to sharing this topic with you today, all about agents and issues that many, many actors find during the course of their career. And hopefully some advice and some information today will be of some value to you.

[1:32] Jeffrey Dreisbach: But first, this is that moment of the conversation where I say thank you for tuning into Casting Actors Cast. We continue to grow these podcasts, and I'm getting excited about some of the upcoming episodes that we are having. Hey, listen, if you haven't done so already, I invite you to check out the website. It's called Casting Actors Cast, all one word.com, castingactorscast.com. There you're going to find all kinds of information.

[1:55] Jeffrey Dreisbach: One is a place called Jeff's Jots, and those are corresponding show notes to each of the episodes. These are the notes that I use when I present the material, when I present the podcast. But you can have them in a PDF form so that you can either follow along or have some notes for yourself, some cheat sheets for each of these episodes. Also, there's a place that says dive into the talent pool. If you fill out that form, and then just give me your name and your email address. By the way, I don't do anything with that. I don't spam you or send unnecessary stuff.

[2:29] Jeffrey Dreisbach: I might on occasion throw out a promotional topic that you might be interested in, but that is very rare even then. So please rest assured, your information is completely safe. But if you do that, I'm giving away a free book on doing voiceover work called Conversation Pieces Out of the Studio. It's a downloadable 100-page PDF, yours to keep. You can put it on your device to read, or you can print it out, whatever you want to do. Additionally, there is a video that I put together. It's an exclusive video on YouTube that only those people who fill out the form get. And it's called Casting Secrets, what they don't tell you.

[3:08] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Now come on, that's a tease, right? But do check out that video. I think you'll find that really, really useful. And finally, here's my shout out to my good friends at Actors Connection, ActorsConnection.com slash New York. Hello to my good friends, Colleen and Tony. All right, so let's jump into the subject, all about agents and managers. And by the way, as we have this discussion today, I want you to know that I'm using agents and managers sort of interchangeably. Although we know that there are differences, and Lord knows, I've done a lot of previous podcasts on how to get an agent and that kind of thing.

[3:45] Jeffrey Dreisbach: This is a little bit different. These are common questions. In fact, when we did the live patio, the live podcast of this podcast, the live version of it, I guess it was like four weeks ago, something like that. And we had a live audience. One of the questions actually stimulated me to putting this topic together because I wanted, I felt a little bit unsatisfied with my answer. I didn't feel like I gave it as much depth of discussion as I wanted to, given that situation. So I thought, well, you know what? I can always put additional information here in this podcast.

[4:23] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So there are some common questions that I'm getting, but guess what? I'm going to try and frame some of my answers in an uncommon way. These are things that you might not have heard before that I think it's worth at least listening to and considering. So, one of the first questions I get quite frequently is why am I not being sent out on auditions as much as I want to be sent out? Why is that? And so, of course, here's my answer. You first you have to understand a couple of things.

[4:57] Jeffrey Dreisbach: One is what are the roles that are available? When we have a role that we're seeking an actor for, we put that on breakdown. Those breakdowns go out to all of the agents and managers. And so, whatever the kind of request is for a particular actor, we try our best in the description of the character that we're looking for. We do our best to give as much information as possible. Now, it is conceivable that the parts that we might be looking for might not be you. And so there are limitations based on the roles that are being cast right now, today, this week, this month.

[5:46] Jeffrey Dreisbach: You also have to weigh that against the agent's limitations in terms of their talent pool. They may have several actors that they are really working on their behalf because there are roles for them, that they might not be able to give you the time and attention that you deserve simply because there might be, and this has happened quite frequently, a whole sort of slew of roles in one particular area in terms of age range or in terms of ethnicity or whatever it might be. And so the agent might not necessarily be 100% available all the time to see if you are right.

[6:30] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Plus, there are agents and the really good agents are ones that are very, very careful with who they submit to casting. Now, you might find that a little frustrating because you might be thinking, gosh, I think I would be really great in that role, but you might not be aware of the specific nature of what is being sought. And so trusting your agent that if there's a role that they believe you are right for, then they're going to probably send you out. But it's the agents' perceptions that really can make a difference in how they see you. So I hope that that's a little more helpful to you. It's not just about them not sending you out. There are other reasons that are coming in that just might not make this the best time, or have the available roles that you might be looking for.

[7:26] Jeffrey Dreisbach: All right, let's move on. Here's another question. Is it better to have one agent that sees me as one quote type? Or should I freelance with different agencies at different times? So let me explain first of all what freelance actually means. And freelance means that without a contract, without a written agreement, you and the agent decide to, for lack of a better word, date. You decide that you're going to work together. When stuff comes up and submissions come up that you might be right for, that agent will decide to send you out, try you out, you can try them out, and that's how that relationship goes.

[8:06] Jeffrey Dreisbach: You can conceivably freelance that way with several agents. I know actors who freelance with commercials and then freelance with theater, and then maybe they have a signed agreement for film and television work. If there are all kinds of menus ingredients, so to speak, that actors can use. But I would caution you on a couple of things. One, it's just kind of getting into muddy waters if you're freelancing with more than three agents for the same area, for example, for theater or for commercials. Here's why.

[8:45] Jeffrey Dreisbach: If that agent thinks that you're right for something, they've gotten the same breakdown as your other agent that you're freelancing with. Now you've got two agents who are trying to submit you for the role. If the one, the first agent that submits you for the role should be the agent that you use for the appointment, for the audition, for the callback, for the booking. That doesn't always work that way. Sometimes actors feel, well, I like this agent better because I like their office better, but you know what? That's not really professional.

[9:15] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So I'm not sure it's better to have a lot of freelancing arrangements with several different agencies. I think there's value in it, and I think it's really important that you date before you get married. And that's just the way I see it. Now, as to the question is whether it's better to have one agent that sees me only in one area, or should I freelance because I'm capable of doing all kinds of things. Let me first say that I've done a lot of podcasts on type and I don't ever use the word. Now I used it here today because actors asked me that question.

[9:49] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And if you are working with an agent that only has a very specific idea of the kinds of roles you should play, that is something that you need to work with that particular agency. And how do you do that? Well, you need to demonstrate your ability to do more than what they see you for. Here's an example. If you're signed with an agent and they're only sending you out for cop, you know, for police detectives on procedural television shows, and that's all the auditions that you are getting from this agency, it's time to have a conversation.

[10:28] Jeffrey Dreisbach: It's also if you're signed with that agency, then it's not a good idea to sort of freelance with another agency just because they might be sending you out on different roles. That exclusivity agreement that you've signed, making you exclusive to that first agent is something that you have to deal with. And we'll talk a little bit more about how to deal with that in a minute. But understand that if you have an agent that only sees you in one way, listen, it's up to you to make it clear by demonstration, by showing that agent that you are capable of much more.

[11:06] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And how you do that is your business. I mean, you certainly can take a class, you can certainly shoot some auditions of you trying and doing different kinds of roles and ask them to take a quick look. So there are ways in which you can open up their eyes, but if that doesn't help, then maybe it's time to think about another relationship. And so doing it in a practical, pragmatic, very clean way is my best advice. Your brand, instead of using type, I like to use the word brand. Your brand must be compatible with your rep or with your new potential rep.

[11:47] Jeffrey Dreisbach: That's what I'm saying. It's got to be mutually understood that you are capable of playing these kinds of roles that are out there now. Another thing that I don't see a lot of actors doing is, you know, actors should be watching a lot of programming. They should be watching a lot of television, a lot of series, a lot of these streaming services, and seeing the kinds of material that is going out over the air. And asking yourself, those are the roles that I should be playing. Make a note of that.

[12:24] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Make a decision that you're seeing this material on the air that you could and should be playing. That is something that you need to make a list, and then you need to act on that list by either working on material that's similar or talking to your rep about playing those kinds of roles. That just shows that you are an active participant in your own career, and you are not just waiting for that rep to send you out. Here's another question that I get.

[13:48] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So it's up to you to make sure that as a paid person on your dime, that they get what you are looking for.

[13:59] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And you have a responsibility as a professional to make sure you have an open line of communication with that agency.

[14:07] Jeffrey Dreisbach: If it's difficult or you're not sure where you stand with that agency, you know what? Pick up the phone, write an email, take a lunch meeting, whatever you can do to make sure that you both have a good understanding about where you both stand when it comes to your talent and your career.

[14:30] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Here's another question. What ways can I stop myself from getting upset with my agent?

[14:36] Jeffrey Dreisbach: You know, I think that's an excellent question. Um, I think actors—um, forgive me for this—but I think actors many times like to simply blame their agent for not doing enough for you. Um, and that might be true. I'm not saying that isn't true. I'm just saying that that doesn't help you create a positive movement forward.

[15:00] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And I can speak from my own experience when I was an actor, and that is that I did kind of—and I'll be truthful with you—I felt like I was kind of a lazy actor sometimes. That I really waited for them to tell me about an audition or to send me out on stuff. And it really took me a while to understand that I could create my own career plan and less reliance on my rep.

[15:24] Jeffrey Dreisbach: It's as if I should have two parallel universes. One with an agent who's representing me for certain jobs that might be coming through that I'm not aware of, and me creating my own work, creating my own career plan, writing my own material.

[15:43] Jeffrey Dreisbach: I've talked about writing a one-person show, getting into an acting group, taking an acting class that's really challenging for you, taking an improv class, doing whatever you can to grow your talent to help grow your career. Those two parallel universes are not in conflict with each other.

[16:03] Jeffrey Dreisbach: In fact, one can often feed the other in really amazing ways. So I encourage you to really make sure that you have a plan for your career that might include a relationship with an agent. But a sole dependency on an agent is just, to me, it's just a slow progression of reliance that I think is really unhealthy, to be frank.

[16:30] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So here's another question. I need an agent. I need a manager. How do I get one?

[16:36] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Okay, I get it. Um, you might be one of those podcast listeners out there who's graduated from school and maybe you even had a showcase from a university training experience. Um, and maybe an agent didn't show that much interest in you, and whatever, whatever, whatever. Let's just talk about and bring it into simplistic terms for yourself.

[17:00] Jeffrey Dreisbach: The first step that must happen is you must research agencies. You must research the kinds of agencies that you believe are going to be right for you in your career.

[17:13] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And what does that mean? Well, knowing the difference between a small boutique agency and a mid-size agency and a behemoth monster size agency. Know who those agents are. Um, how many departments do they have? How many people work at that particular agency? Who are the people that are in the legit theater department? Who are those people that are in the commercial department? Who are those people that are in the voiceover department? Who's the film and television person or persons that I should at least make an effort to connect with?

[17:47] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Speaking of connect, that's the next step. Once you've done your research, it's now a matter of keeping your eyes and ears open for that agency's appearance, whether it is in showcases, whether it's in classes, whether it's in seminars, actors' connection.

[18:06] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And I know they're kind of a sponsor. It's just we have this mutual agreement that we sort of promote each other. There's no money changing hands, by the way. I just really like their work, and they really have been so supportive of the podcast, but they do a really good job of showcasing agents.

[18:23] Jeffrey Dreisbach: They'll sometimes have three or four casting directors or three or four agencies to watch your audition work. Those are ways that you can connect. The next step is to then ask for a collaboration with that agency.

[18:40] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Once you have a relationship with that agency, you need to be actively pursuing a freelance relationship with that agent. Listen, I would love to freelance with you if you're interested. I'm wondering where you see me. Um, and I would love to at least have an opportunity to show you what I'm capable of and with my auditions.

[19:04] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And then, of course, the final would be to sign. Signing with that agency is an exclusive agreement that you are only going to work with them. They are only going to work with you. And that's the sort of hierarchy of how to get an agent.

[19:21] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Now, the next question that I get after that is: should I sign? Signing with an agency is no small task. First of all, many times actors just get emotionally involved with what that means. It means validation. It means, oh my God, somebody is willing to just make a full-time commitment to me and my work, or there's a manager who really, really loves me, and that's so exciting.

[19:49] Jeffrey Dreisbach: But here are some questions that you need to ask. Are there good signs to sign? What do I mean by that? Are there roles that you are absolutely hot for right now? Are there film and television opportunities that the agent or manager thinks that you should be seen for right now? And if that's the case, then that is an opportunity for you to make that relationship happen.

[20:16] Jeffrey Dreisbach: How does signing with an agent benefit you? After all, does that agency get those really cool good calls from producers, directors, networks, production companies? You see, there are some agencies that might sign an actor, but their relationship with some of these production companies might not be the strongest.

[20:39] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So that's an important question that you, when you've done your research, will have an answer to. If you know that this agent is a mid-sized agency and they are well respected and they have a lot of clients that are getting work, that's kind of like a no brainer, right?

[20:55] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So asking yourself, how does this signing benefit me? Well, it might get you into doors that you would have not gotten into. And so that becomes a really positive answer.

[21:07] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Another question. What if I do if I'm dropped by my agent or manager? Um, this is happening frequently. It happens more often than I care to share with you. It's not like this mass exodus of throwing talent away and stopping to working with clients, but there are many, many different reasons why agencies decide not to continue a working relationship with an actor.

[21:34] Jeffrey Dreisbach: And that's so tough. It's really hard. It's really hard not to make it an emotional thing. I've been with this agency for five years, I've done work with them, they love me, and now they're saying they no longer want to work with me. Wow.

[21:50] Jeffrey Dreisbach: It's also incumbent upon you to make a decision about when is it a good time for you to leave? Maybe they're not sending you out as much because they're sort of like, yeah, been there, done that. Maybe you're not getting the most positive responses from some of your auditions, or maybe just the trend of casting taking place in the industry is kind of leaving you a little bit by the wayside.

[22:16] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Um, those are all reasons why the agency may say it's just not worth my time and energy, even though I love this actor, it's not providing this sort of financial incentive for me to want to continue to work with that actor.

[22:34] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So many times it's a financial consideration. On rare occasions, it might be just not connecting with that actor anymore. Maybe there is a personality clash, perhaps. Maybe there are extenuating circumstances, either with you in terms of your availability, and maybe there's a shifting momentum in your career that the agent just doesn't see as valuable for the agency.

[23:00] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So there are myriad reasons why that can happen. But don't emotionalize it. It's simply a situation. It's not a problem. It's a matter of understanding that the thing that happens to you is simply the thing that happens to you. No more, no less.

[23:18] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Also, please understand that if an agent is dropping you, that is a temporary situation. It is not a forever problem. Don't make it more than what it is. You're a talent. If your talent is needed, there will be somebody to help you be well represented.

[23:39] Jeffrey Dreisbach: So don't lose faith, don't lose hope. Our office, for example, keeps a very active list about excellent talent who's not currently being represented. So that's something that you could certainly address with casting folks if that happens to you.

[23:56] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Finally, if you are dropped by an agency, you need to tell everybody. So making sure that you do the professional thing and communicate it is, I think, really valuable.

[24:30] Jeffrey Dreisbach: Here's our last question, and I know we're going a little over our usual time, but the question is when is it time to leave an agent? And my answer is kind of a simple one to this. And it's a matter of trusting your gut.

[24:41] Jeffrey Dreisbach: It's both business and personal. You need to understand the implications of leaving your agency. What are the reasons you're doing it? If you can keep it in a professional's perspective, you're doing yourself a favor.

[24:56] Jeffrey Dreisbach: You see, what is best for you may not be what is best for them. Makes sense. Now, having said all that, please know that there are never any perfect answers to these complicated questions. Really.

[25:58] Megan Grace Martinez: Thanks, Mm.