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[0:00] Rory O'Malley: You're listening to episode number 73 of Living the Dream with Rory O'Malley.

[0:04] Rory O'Malley: Audition, side job, swim and upstream. Believe it or not, you're living the dream.

[0:11] Rory O'Malley: Hello, dreamers, Rory O'Malley here, your host for Living the Dream. Thank you so much for downloading, listening, and joining in on the fun, these fun conversations we're having together.

[0:22] Rory O'Malley: Um, I am still belting the vote with the rest of the Broadway and theater community all across the country. If you aren't registered to vote for the November 6th election, what are you doing? Get on it right now. You can go to BeltThevote.org and register yourself. You can also go there if you want to find out where your polling place is, where you should go to vote on November 6th. And you can also find out exactly what's on your specific ballot. Our friends at When We All Vote have put that all together. And yeah, it's so convenient. Go over there to BeltThevote.org and let's make the Voice of America's theater community heard this November 6th, all the way in the back row. Sing out Louise.

[1:07] Rory O'Malley: Okay. Um my guest today is Carly Hughes. Carly is so fantastic. I've known Carly, gosh, since we were in college. She didn't go to school with me, but she worked with some of my classmates as we talk about on the podcast. And uh she's just one of those personalities that you fall in love with immediately, and we all became such great friends with her, and she hung out with us for uh, you know, any time she could come visit Pittsburgh where we were going to school. And so it was great to have a person in New York to um be a part of our tribe in the city. And she has really made an amazing career for herself. She's currently on AMERICAN HOUSEWIFE on ABC with my classmate Katie Mixon, and she's so good on that show.

She came up through regional theater and Broadway and ensemble and understudy. She has worked so very hard. And I think she has a wonderful perspective on this business. I am so glad I got a chance to sit down and talk with her after we just worked together this week for a benefit performance of You're a Good Man, Charlie Brown. I was Linus, she was Sally, and she was fantastic as always. She has such a great story, and uh here it is. My conversation with Carly Hughes.

[2:34] Rory O'Malley: You're ready?

[2:35] Carly Hughes: Yes.

[2:35] Rory O'Malley: Yes, let's see how.

[2:36] Carly Hughes: Yay!

[2:37] Rory O'Malley: Okay, Carly. Hi, Ramora.

[2:39] Carly Hughes: Here we are.

[2:40] Rory O'Malley: Here we are. You're on Living the Dream. Welcome.

[2:42] Carly Hughes: I'm living the dream.

[2:44] Rory O'Malley: Thank you.

[2:44] Carly Hughes: You really are.

[2:45] Rory O'Malley: I know. This is how I start every episode of my dream. You remember you dreamed about this and you're living it. Now you're living it.

[2:51] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[2:53] Rory O'Malley: Um we are in your wonderful place in Los Angeles. It's kind of funny that we're both in LA right now.

[3:00] Carly Hughes: I know.

[3:00] Rory O'Malley: Yeah. The journey. We've known each other since we were in college.

[3:03] Carly Hughes: We didn't go to school together.

[3:04] Rory O'Malley: We didn't go to school together.

[3:05] Carly Hughes: I pretended like I went to school with you.

[3:08] Rory O'Malley: I wasn't sure. When you were like, oh she's in dance class today. Remember when I would come and take dance class with you and Leslie?

[3:14] Carly Hughes: Yes.

[3:14] Rory O'Malley: Well, you didn't. And then you were like, what? Did she go? Did she go here now?

[3:17] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[3:18] Rory O'Malley: But you were probably in a different class than I was if you were in classes with Leslie.

[3:23] Carly Hughes: But we did some dance class together, but I don't think it was a class. I think, or maybe it was like Ken's class or something.

[3:28] Rory O'Malley: Oh, sure. Remember?

[3:29] Carly Hughes: Sure, yes. Whatever. I didn't go to school there, and I just ended up in your class.

[3:33] Rory O'Malley: Yeah. You went how far away was your school?

[3:36] Carly Hughes: Two and a half hours out to State College.

[3:38] Rory O'Malley: So it wasn't far.

[3:39] Carly Hughes: Right.

[3:40] Rory O'Malley: And I had more fun with you guys. So I would just come, you know, Megan was there and everybody was there. How did you get involved with everybody?

[3:46] Carly Hughes: Because you must have met them. I met, you know why? I met um Leslie First and Van.

[3:52] Rory O'Malley: And Van only went there for a little bit.

[3:54] Carly Hughes: But I I met we were doing Smokey Joe's Cafe together at West Virginia Public when it was in their freestanding vinyl structure, which was a tent. I mean it had AC, but it was a tent.

[4:02] Rory O'Malley: It was a tent, but they called it Freestanding Vinyl Structure. Which was brilliant.

[4:09] Carly Hughes: And we were doing Smoky Joe's, and then Megan came in to do Godspell there. And I met her there, and then I uh then I started just coming to hang out with all of you guys. And I was like, hi guys, I'm here, we're friends.

[4:23] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, I remember that, but I remember you just kind of like fitting right into a groove. And that's kind of a weird thing because I mean it's it was a hard thing to do because we are in college and we're in each other's faces all the time. Maybe it's because you were a new face, a new happy loving. You still loved it.

[4:42] Carly Hughes: I know, I just love everybody.

[4:45] Rory O'Malley: Yeah. You have a positivity.

[4:47] Carly Hughes: I know.

[4:48] Rory O'Malley: And maybe it came at the exact right time because we were probably, you know. Over we're always over something in college.

[4:54] Carly Hughes: Yeah, yeah. It's a lot, it's a lot of work. You're kind of around the same people all the time, and you can drive. You see the same faces and you feel like you're being competitive, but kind of you're not because you're learning, but still.

[5:03] Carly Hughes: Yeah. We met in a very interesting way, and you were coming like two and a half hours to like hang out.

[5:03] Rory O'Malley: Hang out.

[5:13] Carly Hughes: I was like, oh my god, what are you guys up to this weekend? Because in my head, at what 19, 18, 19, I was like, we're both in Pennsylvania.

[5:21] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[5:22] Carly Hughes: Like where did you grow up?

[5:24] Carly Hughes: I'm originally from St. Louis, Missouri. I only lived there till I was like seven, and then I grew up in Maryland, Columbia, right outside of Baltimore.

[5:33] Rory O'Malley: Wow. Okay. So then you went to school in in Pennsylvania.

[5:37] Carly Hughes: But you were like, we're in Pennsylvania, yeah. Also, I was like, I'm young, we could do it now. If it was now, yeah, we would all see each other less. Just like living in LA.

[5:47] Rory O'Malley: Oh. That's you're like, life, you know, life happens. But yeah, at that time, I was like, I don't have anything to do. Clash, smash. You know what I mean? And drove and hung out with you guys.

[5:57] Carly Hughes: But it's amazing because you know, getting through college and getting an education is so important, but really it's that network of people that you make there.

[6:06] Rory O'Malley: That's the thing, as like you guys were doing so much more at Carnegie Mellon than than we were doing at our school, um, show wise and class wise. That I got, I actually learned more sitting in on a class every now and then with you guys, or talking, you know, just with Leslie or Katie at whatever class they had just come from.

[6:25] Carly Hughes: Right.

[6:26] Rory O'Malley: I learned more that way, just like you do when you're immersed, you know, you're thrown into life.

[6:31] Carly Hughes: How crazy is it that oh my gosh. I mean, all the connections that we've all had in ways that you know paths have crossed. We were both a part of Spelling Bee.

[6:40] Rory O'Malley: And we never worked together, so I think we never did. I was like, Oh, we're in New York, that's so cute. And then I came into Book of Mormon and I was like, Yeah, Rory, we're finally working together.

[6:48] Carly Hughes: Yes, I mean Katie never worked together, never, and then first gig in LA, Katie.

[6:55] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, you and Katie Mixon are on a TV show on ABC called AMERICAN HOUSEWIFE.

[7:01] Carly Hughes: Which is in its third season, yeah.

[7:02] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, we just premiered like three weeks ago. It's amazing.

[7:05] Carly Hughes: I know. Time flies, it really does. I feel like I just moved here yesterday. I remember when I saw the preview for it when Leslie and I were still in um Hamilton together.

[7:14] Rory O'Malley: Oh, that's right.

[7:15] Carly Hughes: And I was like, that show looks incredible. It also looks like exactly what Katie Mixon has been waiting for to do.

[7:21] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[7:22] Carly Hughes: Like when we were in college, like, this is it. You're like, there's your role. And she stepped into it too, right after Mike and Molly, like days later. And you and Allie um Along are so good in it.

[7:33] Carly Hughes: Thank you. We'll go we'll go back to the beginning, but I kind of want to just talk about this. This is but you are um a Broadway gal.

[7:40] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[7:40] Carly Hughes: You are someone who's been in the theater scene, and this kind of came up, and you moved your entire life here to LA for this gig.

[7:47] Carly Hughes: I did. I um I mean I had been in New York 14 years, I think.

[7:52] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[7:53] Carly Hughes: Um, and still auditioning for TV and film in New York, um, which for a while was neither here nor there, and then so much started filming in New York in the Connecticut area, like more than LA for a couple of years. So it opened up, you know, a whole new playing field.

[8:10] Carly Hughes: But kind of before Hamilton doing Broadway in New York was considered by some casting directors as cute.

[8:17] Rory O'Malley: Right, but not on the same level.

[8:19] Carly Hughes: And then like Lynn came along and kind of made it cool again, if you will. And then going into the same rooms with the same casting directors of like, oh my god, you're on Broadway, you do how many shows a week? And then I would automatically be seen more because he broadened the horizon of what people really that you think that it was a Hamilton effect.

[8:36] Rory O'Malley: Immediately.

[8:37] Carly Hughes: Because soon as and I noticed the difference because I it was like a handful of casting directors that I had been going in for years that were like, Oh, we really like her, but and then once they saw Hamilton and and Hamilton was associated with the word Broadway, right? I was going in for so much more and being taken so much more seriously and respected in a way that I wasn't respected before.

[8:56] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[8:57] Carly Hughes: Like I said, I would go in before and they were like, Oh, you do Broadway. Mmm, which frustrated the hell out of me.

[9:02] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[9:03] Carly Hughes: And then, you know, years later, I would go in and they'd be like, oh, and just uh in awe, and I'm like, I'm doing the same thing I've always done. But you know, yeah. And so I started auditioning and being taken more seriously on that end, and I auditioned for it was pilot season, 20 fifth fifth, who knows? Yeah, it was 2016.

[9:23] Carly Hughes: Yeah, 2016. Um I was doing my last show that I did in New York at City Center Encourse, Cabin in the Sky.

[9:30] Rory O'Malley: Uh huh.

[9:30] Carly Hughes: And I got this audition on opening night.

[9:33] Rory O'Malley: Oh wow.

[9:34] Carly Hughes: And um, and I was kind of like, uh, okay, I'm tired. We had rehearsal 12 to 6, and then I had to run to ABC and Columbus Circle from Carnegie Hall.

[9:43] Rory O'Malley: Sure.

[9:43] Carly Hughes: Um, for a 6 30 audition, you know, and your brain's kind of like, whatever. And I was also like, I'm not gonna bucket because I'll never bucket.

[9:49] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[9:50] Carly Hughes: You know, and uh and I remember Norm Lewis and LaShant's being like, girl, you better go get that gig. And I was like, Yeah, you're right, okay, yeah, sure. And I got there, did the audition, you know, and most of the time it works out this way too when you take this dress off, and you're also my brain was on opening night. Yeah, I went in and I was a person, yeah, and was acting, but you but being a person, yeah.

[10:10] Carly Hughes: And uh they were like, Great, that was great. And I made them I remember making them laugh at being like, Oh, that was a good audition. And she's like, uh, do you want to do it again? And I was like, Yeah, oh no, I I have to go to my half hour. Went, opened the show, and about a week later, my manager was like, You're pinned for AMERICAN HOUSEWIFE. I was like, Oh my god, wait, what show is that? Well, no, it was called Second Fattest Housewife in Westport.

[10:32] Rory O'Malley: Oh, remember the first year.

[10:33] Carly Hughes: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, Wait, yeah, which one is that? And she's like, Remember the one and explained it. I was like, Oh yeah. Also, also what's pinned mean?

[10:40] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, yeah.

[10:41] Carly Hughes: You know, I was like, Yeah, and they're like, because they mean they they the they're you're on their regular and they you might test. And I and in my head I heard might maybe, and I was like, okay, great, whatever. Sure. And uh by the time we close, because City Center does like two week runs, they were like, you have to fly to LA on Wednesday. And it was like Friday and screen test.

[10:59] Rory O'Malley: So you booked it from New York.

[11:01] Carly Hughes: Wow, you did.

[11:02] Carly Hughes: Yeah. I sh I uh they flew me out here to screen test for it.

[11:06] Carly Hughes: Uh-huh. Um, and then they taped my screen test and sent it up to network like they do, and I was back in New York. And then uh I think I heard maybe the next week that I had booked it, and then I was like, what is happening?

[11:20] Rory O'Malley: So you had you're like now I have to go do a pilot in Los Angeles.

[11:24] Carly Hughes: And did it and was like, okay. How long did it take?

[11:27] Carly Hughes: We shot for three weeks.

[11:29] Rory O'Malley: Three weeks.

[11:29] Carly Hughes: Yeah, the f the first episode in three weeks, which is ironic because now we do one episode in five days.

[11:33] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[11:34] Carly Hughes: Um, but we shot the pilot over the course of three weeks because everything, you know, when pilots is on location, you don't have a sound stage yet, you don't have your your home base. Um, and I went back to New York, like on a cloud, but also like, wait, uh I'm still poor, I think, because you sign, you know, the you do the whole deal and sign a contract and visually you're supposed to be making X amount of money. But if you're a working Broadway actor in New York, nine times out of ten, you're not incorporated yet. So you're you all the taxes are getting taken out.

[12:05] Carly Hughes: And as if most people don't know, the more money you make, the more taxes get out. So, you know, get taken out. So I I remember getting my my check from the pilot being like, What is even happening? I don't even see, I didn't even see like sixty percent of it. I think sixty percent was gone.

[12:21] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, because you afterwards.

[12:23] Carly Hughes: I gotta pay my manager and all the taxes, and all the taxes because they're taxing you like you make that on a regular basis, yeah. And New York takes out New York State, New York City, federal, and then and there's another extra New York ticked out the most. So I just remember being like feeling so excited that I had just booked a pilot finally and shot it, and then getting the paycheck and feeling like I still am yet to be paid what you know the value of what I I worked, right?

[12:50] Rory O'Malley: Which is half of Broadway all the time.

[12:51] Carly Hughes: Right, which could have been the only check that you got from there because it's the only Yeah, if it didn't get picked up, I would that probably would have been, you know. Um, and then that was end of but beginning of April, end of March, and then you have the whole waiting period where you just sit on pins and needles as you know, yeah, till upfronts, which is in May.

[13:10] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[13:11] Carly Hughes: And you're just like walking around like everything's fine, everything's fine, it's fine, it's fine, it's fine. Yeah, it's not fine, it's not fine, it's fine, it's not fine. You're just thinking about it. It's like, and there's always and obviously, you know, there's this other factor after you shoot a pilot and you put it out there, you're waiting for it to be picked up, but it could also be picked up and they can replace you.

[13:17] Rory O'Malley: They can replace you.

[13:30] Carly Hughes: Which is and I didn't know that. Then you you you're like, oh, I don't want to even think about it. I'm not putting energy into that. I'm not putting that into the universe. And I didn't even know that was a thing. Like I was just kind of like, I didn't know it was a thing I want to say up until after they announced the pickup. And then my managers were like, Okay, so now we have to get your letter. I was like, Yeah, for like a job. And they're like, No, like as if as in your letter that they officially want to give me the role. And I was like, What did you what are you talking about, Willis?

[13:58] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[13:58] Carly Hughes: I was like, I got it. I did the role. We shot it. I was just like, I'm Angela. And they were like, yeah, no, they have to officially send you the letter that says the show is the pickup, and you are picked up with the show. And I was like, What? Say what?

[14:11] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[14:12] Carly Hughes: And then I was like, Do I have to stress about this? But luckily the letter came shortly after.

[14:16] Rory O'Malley: Okay, good. Um, but for our pilot, I don't know if you remember, the oldest daughter is different.

[14:21] Carly Hughes: Oh.

[14:22] Rory O'Malley: She did one episode and then they replaced her as they do all the time.

[14:26] Carly Hughes: I didn't know that.

[14:27] Rory O'Malley: Yeah. And sometimes they'll go back, depending on the show, you know, and reshoot the scenes with that character. We didn't. We just started airing episode two with And she changed who she was.

[14:50] Carly Hughes: So it's hard to keep track of when episodes come out, especially if it's on a weekly thing, and if not, you're benching it on Hulu.

[14:56] Rory O'Malley: Exactly.

[14:56] Carly Hughes: Now you can.

[14:57] Rory O'Malley: Now you can.

[14:58] Carly Hughes: But I think also because once the network or whoever decides to make decisions like that, then they can go in before the season is released and edit scenes that they don't want with whoever they don't want. You know what I mean?

[15:11] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[15:12] Carly Hughes: But yeah, no, it was different. I remember thinking, oh, that's what they mean by that letter.

[15:18] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[15:18] Carly Hughes: You know what I mean?

[15:19] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, it's scary.

[15:20] Carly Hughes: You kind of always feel like you're in the clear when something happens, but it really is like there's a— and it's every season.

[15:27] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[15:27] Carly Hughes: Like it's not just for the pilot, which I didn't know either.

[15:29] Rory O'Malley: I did also didn't know that.

[15:30] Carly Hughes: Yeah. So every season, season two, this season, season three, they're like, you get picked up, and you still have to get your letter. That's like, and you get picked up with it.

[15:38] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[15:38] Carly Hughes: You know?

[15:38] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[15:39] Carly Hughes: I have no idea.

[15:40] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, it's scary.

[15:40] Carly Hughes: We always— we have to prove ourselves every day.

[15:44] Rory O'Malley: Every turn, day.

[15:45] Carly Hughes: Every turn. And there's no sense, like, I feel like the world always looks at us as actors and in the business, especially— no, across the field. I was gonna say, especially on Broadway, but across the field on Broadway, it's just more in your face and immediate.

[16:01] Rory O'Malley: But as it being easy or magical or just like, you know, something that just magically happened.

[16:07] Carly Hughes: And honestly, if that's what they're thinking, then that means we're doing our job correctly.

[16:11] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[16:12] Carly Hughes: You know, sure. But on the real side, it's not that way. There's no sense of job security. You can get to a point where you're making more money than you did last year or five years ago. But even if you're making, you know, the money of your dreams on a certain show, you still have to wait to get that letter that says, okay, and you can continue on next year.

[16:30] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[16:30] Carly Hughes: So the sense of security is just— I'm finding as I get older and do this longer, is just kind of non-existent.

[16:37] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[16:38] Carly Hughes: You know what I mean? Or, um, fleeting.

[16:40] Rory O'Malley: Yes.

[16:40] Carly Hughes: There's no threshold that you cross where now you don't have to have those concerns.

[16:44] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, where you don't have to wait for a letter or a job offer.

[16:47] Carly Hughes: Or beg at an audition.

[16:49] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[16:50] Carly Hughes: Or be like, remember you saw me on that one episode of that one thing that done? Didn't you like that?

[16:53] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[16:55] Carly Hughes: Yeah, no, it's all the time. It's hard. And you so you have to kind of just learn how to deal with that and not let it overtake.

[17:03] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[17:03] Carly Hughes: And that's a process too. What's it like though being on a set?

[17:08] Rory O'Malley: This is a single camera show, so it's very different from being on a stage.

[17:12] Carly Hughes: Yeah. Um, it's— I mean, it's interesting. It's kind of— it's kind of like, you know, being on a Broadway stage in a sense of when you have a sound stage, it's a huge warehouse blocked off into different rooms that are built to look like what the audience sees.

[17:29] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[17:29] Carly Hughes: So when you see us at Second Breakfast, our whole— that whole room is designed kind of to look like Jones on Third, which is a, you know, restaurant here in LA, and then next door is another room that is designed to look like the kitchen living room of the house, and then there's another, you know. So, but once you step into those individual rooms, it's like, you know, being on a set, which is universal, you know, across the board, and then you look up, but there's just like rafters and like— so that is kind of cool to feel like you're on a set every day, and the— feeling the equivalence of Broadway in that, but it's different because on the TV set, there's always a action and a cut, you know, which takes you in and out of reality and play.

[18:14] Rory O'Malley: Whereas, you know, on Broadway, there's no action, there's no cut.

[18:17] Carly Hughes: It's like you step on a set and it's cool, but like don't mess up because you're— the train doesn't stop. Yeah, that was interesting to get used to because I'm used to my brain over the years memorizing everything and let's go, seeing top to bottom and learning that, you know, in TV, there's no top to bottom per se. Like you could start at the top, but sometimes they don't. And then you could start at the top, and then five lines in, they're like, okay, cut, we're gonna do it again. You're like, what? Did we do the scene? We're not doing the whole scene, and you're like, no, you are just like pieces.

[18:45] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[18:47] Carly Hughes: Yeah, it was interesting to get used to that. Did you have a— I've found on sets, especially single camera, which is—that's how a movie is made. It's with one camera set up or sometimes multiple cameras, but yeah, it's set up, and then you each time you shoot, you have to move the camera whereas when multicam, it's like a play, and there's three cameras at once.

[19:05] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, that's— yeah.

[19:06] Carly Hughes: So I found though in single cam that it's very— the language is very different. It's kind of like, you know, when they say go camera left, go camera right. I was like, well, what's that? Where is it to the right? Like, no, it's to the cameras. I'm like, oh, the camera is in charge here. Yeah, you know, it's not your perspective, it's the camera's perspective. So we all need to think about what the camera is, what can we do? Seeing and seeing.

[19:30] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, I had to get used to that too because, um, we'll do the one scene, you know, and we have three cameras, A, B, and C.

[19:39] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[19:39] Rory O'Malley: So it'll shoot head on facing us, and then we have to turn around and do the whole scene again because it'll shoot head on facing behind us to Katie.

[19:47] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[19:47] Rory O'Malley: Um, and I for— I— what probably all of season one, I was like, I just, you know, I just go where you tell me and do what you tell me to do.

[19:55] Carly Hughes: Yeah, and then by season two, I was like, I learned from Allie actually because I was like, what are you shooting? What is that camera saying? And I was like, oh, we can ask that. You know what I mean? Because again, on Broadway, you do what you're told, you get the job done.

[20:07] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[20:08] Carly Hughes: But part of the learning process is going, what is that camera saying? So are you seeing this side of me? And it affects how you say your lines and who you say your lines to, and it kind of helped me too to go, is that a— is that a single? Is that a double? Is that a wide shot? Is that on me? And learning what all that meant. And like, okay, so if you have just— why is there just one camera over there? Oh, you're getting a wide, so I don't have to be a specific, or this is a single on me. And then I go, what's the frame? And then they can tell me it's just your face or it's your chest up. And I'm like, okay, so that determines what my body language is doing. You know what I mean? I don't need to be flailing my arms if you're just seeing my eyebrows, you know.

[20:45] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[20:46] Carly Hughes: But yeah, I feel like it's like all of season one to be like, wait, I can ask a question. You know what I mean? Also, that's part of being like, I have a job, don't wreck the boat. Yeah, you don't want to step on any toes or make it a problem for anyone, but you also— you need to soak up everything as quickly as possible, like a sponge because— and also nobody tells you, like, you know, no— nobody tells you the language.

[21:09] Rory O'Malley: No.

[21:09] Carly Hughes: You know, I remember we got our first schedule, it was during the pilot, and you get a— a dudes a day out of days and a one-liner.

[21:09] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, yeah.

[21:19] Carly Hughes: And I remember Allie goes, did you get the one-liner? And I was like, what?

[21:23] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[21:23] Carly Hughes: Like just trying to be like, yeah, I know what you're talking about, say it again. And she's like, did you get the one-liner? And I was like, no, I have one line now. J like serious. And she laughed, she was like, what? And I was like, I don't know what you're saying. And she goes, oh yeah, nobody explains it to you. And she was telling me too. She's like, nobody explained it to me. Of that, you know, the schedule is broken down, yeah, and each scene is basically titled one line from that scene, which is why they call it a one-liner. And she explained it all, and I still was like, that don't make no sense. Why don't you just call it the schedule? Yeah, just tell me when to be here. Just a hundred minutes, but I needed to. And then it took all of season two to be able to read the one-liner, and I was like, I don't get it. What time do I need to be here? Why is it a one-liner?

[22:04] Carly Hughes: This show that I just did, American Princess, is shot outside, so we have some night shoots.

[22:08] Rory O'Malley: Oh, yeah.

[22:08] Carly Hughes: And I didn't know how to read that it was a night shoot or not at all. That it just says N in this one corner means it's a night shoot. So my call in my— I think it was my first day or second day, was at six o'clock at night. And I saw— no, no, I didn't. I got there, but I was like, Gerald, I'm gonna have a short day today at 6 p.m. I'll be home. A man, they must have seen me for an hour. I wasn't home until 3 a.m.

[22:34] Rory O'Malley: Of course.

[22:34] Carly Hughes: And that was a quick day. He literally made dinner for you and wasn't trying to come home.

[22:39] Rory O'Malley: I was like, I don't think I'm coming home. I don't know how to read. I don't know how to read as one-liner. But it's— it's a whole different language. That's different than Broadway too. On Broadway, you literally have what time you come and sign in.

[22:52] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[22:53] Carly Hughes: With the basics.

[22:54] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[22:54] Carly Hughes: This one has crew calls and things like that that I still don't even need to know.

[22:58] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[22:59] Carly Hughes: For me, as an actor. Because it confuses me. It's such a big aberration that there's so many people that, you know, hundreds of people every day that they have to schedule and I still was like, what's a dudes? And she goes, it's day out of how many days out of days that you work. I was like, see, I'm gonna need a new title because so you're living the dream here in LA. It's a big change, but you're doing so well, and I'm so glad that you're here. Let's go back to where you started that you started your career in Baltimore doing theater in high school.

[23:33] Carly Hughes: High school, yeah. And in middle school and high school, I started doing all the theater because I went to Wild Lake High School, which was essentially the performing arts school for Columbia, but not technically a performing arts school.

[23:48] Rory O'Malley: Okay.

[23:48] Carly Hughes: Because Maryland has Baltimore School of the Arts and Duke Ellington School of the Arts for DC. Um, but we had— our school had been remodeled and we had the James Ross Theater, which was a donation from the city of Columbia where like Alvin Ailey and tours like that would come into the theater and rent the theater out. So it was an actual theater, not a high school auditorium.

[24:10] Rory O'Malley: Wow.

[24:10] Carly Hughes: But as the high school, we got to take advantage of all the lighting and the sets and the things like that. And we were also— Columbia, Maryland did block schedules. I don't know if they do it now, but Monday, Wednesday, and Friday would be what I always call regular classes, like science and math and all that, and then Tuesday and Thursday, you could take other classes if you wanted. Um, and we had a whole arts wing. So I took— I danced with the dance company, I took musical theater class, I took concert choir and madrigals and beauty shop, which was like the female version of Barbershop, and I sang for Jazz Man, and I did all of those classes on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

[24:50] Rory O'Malley: So yeah, I— and then after school, you know, you did all the plays and you rehearsed for the Lake Singers, the Wild Lake Singers, which was a girls' choir. I did everything.

[24:58] Carly Hughes: Wow.

[24:59] Rory O'Malley: Cause it— because it I was available to, you know what I mean? It opens up your days and you just were able to pour yourself into what you loved.

[25:05] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[25:05] Rory O'Malley: It's kind of amazing.

[25:06] Carly Hughes: Yeah, and I— like it helped me to figure out what to do because like I could sing probably before I could walk, I talk, you know, and then started dancing later than the average person, but still started dancing and acting around like middle school, and I always thought it was fun, but I always saw it all as something that was unattainable or not available to me because I didn't grow up with lots of money and I didn't grow up going to Broadway shows. I didn't even know what that was until high school.

[25:36] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[25:38] Carly Hughes: Because I would go to the library and rent— I'm dating myself— but VHS tapes from their musical section and watch all the golden age musicals, and I was like, oh, isn't this lovely? Wouldn't it be so cool if we could still do this now? Because I saw movies and TV and then Whitney Houston and Mariah Carey sing, you know what I mean? I didn't know, and the musicals I did in high school, which were versions of what you rented on VHS. And I remember, um, like I didn't even watch a Tony Awards growing up, and I'm so sad because I missed out on so much, but my parents didn't know any of that. Um, and so sophomore year of high school, the dance company took a trip to New York to see a Broadway show. We saw Footloose, and I was like, what? Wait a minute. People doing this for real.

[26:24] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[26:24] Carly Hughes: I j— I genuinely was like, wait, what? This is happening in real life, even.

[26:29] Rory O'Malley: Wow.

[26:30] Carly Hughes: And we saw it, and we came back and we all, you know, I was in awe. I'm not sitting there in the audience watching Stacey— is it Stacey Francis that did Footloose?

[26:43] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, on Broadway.

[26:43] Carly Hughes: Mainly. Let's hear for the Boy. Yeah, yeah. She did that whistle tone at the end. I remember everybody like, I could do that. I could do it. I mean, like, that's my part. I could do that. And just being so— and I came back, and I remember coming back, and that's when I decided to graduate high school a year early because I was like, oh, I could do this for real. Bye.

[26:59] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[26:59] Carly Hughes: And so, like, a lot of people always think I graduated a year early because I'm like super smart. I mean, like, I am, but no, I really— because I was like, oh, let's go. I felt like I had missed out on so much, not knowing that that was a whole new world available. Like always thinking that it was on TV, something unattainable and on TV. And so I graduated the next year and then went and got my— to start doing it, got my degree, and then, like, after freshman year of college started Summerstock for the first time.

[27:31] Rory O'Malley: Right, and that's where I met Leslie and all of the— we all connected.

[27:34] Carly Hughes: Yeah, that's amazing.

[27:36] Rory O'Malley: So after you graduated, you went straight to New York?

[27:36] Carly Hughes: Straight to New York. After I graduated, I booked— I had— every summer I had— I would drive to New York in the fall in the spring, audition for all the whatever the stuff you did, which was a four-hour drive from Pennsylvania where I was auditioning, book something, some summer stock stuff. And so, like, the last year I booked Dreamgirls. I booked it at Arkansas Rep and then Pittsburgh CLO.

[28:01] Rory O'Malley: Oh, wow.

[28:02] Carly Hughes: Um, which is another— Megan was auditioning for that too, and we both did a dance call, which was just hilarious. She's like, do you remember that dance call that I forgot all the choreography and just like it? It was amazing. Um, but yeah, I graduated in May. I think that a lot of dance couple days later went to do Arkansas Rep and then had a week off. I think I visited Leslie or somebody in LA and then went to PCLO and went home, got a bag of stuff, and went to New York like in August of 2004, I think.

[28:37] Rory O'Malley: Okay.

[28:37] Carly Hughes: Yeah, and Megan was there already because she had gotten Wicked right out of school.

[28:42] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[28:43] Carly Hughes: So I actually stayed in her apartment.

[28:45] Rory O'Malley: This is Megan Hilty, did you say?

[28:47] Carly Hughes: No, we didn't.

[28:47] Rory O'Malley: Megan Hilty.

[28:48] Carly Hughes: She was a year below me at Carnegie Mellon.

[28:52] Rory O'Malley: And you guys connected while just in that whole group there.

[28:55] Carly Hughes: Yeah, we connected at, uh, what's her gym in public that year.

[28:58] Rory O'Malley: Right, right.

[28:58] Carly Hughes: When she was doing West Side Story, and she literally was like, you're good. We should be best friends. Did you ever hear that story?

[29:04] Rory O'Malley: No.

[29:04] Carly Hughes: Did you know that? We were hanging out after she saw us in Smokey Joe's, and she was like, hey, what's your name? And we introduced her, you know, and she's like, you're really good. We should be best friends. And I was like, ha ha, okay. And then she was like, no, I'm serious. And then I would come up and saw her in Wild Party and things like that, and we became best friends for real. But she— that's how it started. She was like, we should be best friends. And I was like, yeah, yes, ma'am. Um, but yeah, I moved to New York and stayed in her apartment for a few months until I got my own place and was just like hit the ground running.

[29:34] Carly Hughes: And started doing more regional theater, you know, the goal to be on Broadway. But once you get to New York and you think, you know, after you graduate, I'm gonna be a Broadway star. And then you get to New York and you grow up and you're like, that's not how it happens. And there's a whole nother level of like people that you have to audition against. And the style of auditioning and the caliber that you don't know until you get to New York and start doing it. You can't know it until you're in the middle of it. How do you deal with that rejection at that time? Because that time rejection is very different when you get out of school and it's for, you know, like you've dealt with it a little bit, but it feels so raw.

[30:13] Carly Hughes: Well, because you're dealing now with rejection as a quote unquote adult, you know what I mean? A young adult, um, of being on your own, not under your mommy and daddy's care and not under a teacher's care or your colleagues half the time or classmates, you're now on your own. So that rejection at that time, I remember being, I kind of feeling like, wait, what? A lot of the times I'd always be like, wait, wait, what do you mean? I didn't get it, and not because I thought I was like amazing and, you know, all deserving. I think sometimes I genuinely was like, but how? And but I was always wanted to know how so I can know what not to do next time. Do you know what I mean?

[30:54] Carly Hughes: Right. And not that it was always about that, you know. Sometimes as you always wanted to know why you didn't get it. Yeah, I did. Um, because I'm a perfectionist too, and it took years later to realize that nine times out of ten, that has nothing to do with it either. You know what I mean? Um, I've always found that if you press a casting director or someone to give you an answer of why, they don't really have an answer. So they'll give you something and it'll not be helpful. And it'll make you sad. It'll make you sad, and then you're like, I didn't want to hear this.

[31:25] Carly Hughes: Yeah, so it's not always, it's not always, uh, no, there's, it's not constructive criticism at all. It's like just a something to be like, here, something to say. Because it's like, oh, this person was this height, and this person was that height. Yeah, but this person say that connection with the director, and you've never met the director, or there is a million reasons. There are a million reasons, and you never know.

[31:47] Carly Hughes: Yeah. You know.

[31:48] Carly Hughes: Um, but rejection at that time was special because it's just so real. It's just so in your face. And everything is so scary. Everything's so scary, and everything is life or death.

[32:01] Carly Hughes: Yeah. At that age, everything's life or death because you think, oh my god, if I don't book this job, what else am I gonna do? You know what I mean? I'm not gonna get another one, you know. And you know, now where we are now, there are, and your best friend is doing Wicked.

[32:15] Rory O'Malley: Right, and you're, you all, I mean, all of you guys were working, but that's also a, well I wasn't working, you were like, I wasn't working. I was out here working at the Grove.

[32:24] Carly Hughes: But you know, like Katie, like she was out here and she was, you know, working. She was working snowballing, yes, and you know, she was really, even if she wasn't working, she was certainly auditioning and doing stuff. Leslie too, he was doing NCIS or something right out of, yes, so but, but you know, yeah, Meg, Meg was is my best friend, and she was in Wicked, and I would like go and sit with her during the show when she was a standby and be like, What is my life?

[32:48] Carly Hughes: Yeah, uh, you know, and that was another lesson in not comparing, you know, life lessons always hitting you in the face. Um, but it was, it was, I remember always being life or death and being like, I have to do this, I have to get this, I have to get this.

[33:00] Carly Hughes: And um, I wish I knew the turning point of when I calmed down and was like, it's not that deep, or it doesn't matter the same way. Well, I'm still working on it. I mean, it's definitely way better than it was, yeah, and it helps to have a little bit of success.

[33:18] Carly Hughes: But I think sometimes the bit of success is the breadcrumb that just keeps you walking further and further down the dark hall, it does, it does. You're, it's like keeps you searching for that light and you're like, but where is it?

[33:31] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[33:32] Carly Hughes: And you keep going because you're like, I know there's more, but yeah.

[33:35] Rory O'Malley: But was Spelling Bee your first extra?

[33:37] Carly Hughes: Spelling Bee was, yeah.

[33:38] Rory O'Malley: Okay.

[33:38] Carly Hughes: Um, Spelling Bee for so many of us. That show was like our Broadway debut for so many of us.

[33:40] Carly Hughes: So many.

[33:44] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[33:45] Carly Hughes: Like I feel like almost everyone who did that almost the first, not the first cast, but most of the first cast, and then all of the second cast.

[33:51] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[33:52] Carly Hughes: Um, and most of them thereafter.

[33:54] Carly Hughes: Yeah. I, I was, it was 2007, and before that, I hadn't worked in a while and was on unemployment in New York, and unemployment in New York at that time was like $400.

[34:11] Carly Hughes: And I wasn't even making, that was the max. I was not making the max. I don't even think, I think I was making like 182 a week or getting that from unemployment. Because it's based on how much you've made and as a working actor who'd never been on Broadway and doing regional theaters and trying to rack up the roles and experience. You have to take stuff for two dollars.

[34:28] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[34:28] Carly Hughes: And you're not making that money in New York. So New York's like, well, what do we care? You're not a, it was a, that, oh yeah, that was a process too.

[34:36] Carly Hughes: Yeah. Um, and I had, I had just done the West Coast premiere of Dessa Rose, which was at Kin no Lincoln Center in New York with LaShant and Norm and Rachel York. And I wasn't gonna take it at first because I was like, No, I don't want to, that year I didn't work a lot because I was like, I don't want to do regional. Regional I worked a lot, I was fine leaving, but I was like, I don't want to leave this year because if I'm gonna do a Broadway show and book it, I feel like my face has to be here and able to be seen, which was smart, but it also meant saying no to several jobs that year and being poor as poor AF as the children say.

[35:14] Carly Hughes: Um, and by the end of that year, I hadn't worked, and I said no to five jobs, and it was all August, August to whatever, two months. I, and I, I was gonna say no because they were not paying well at all to do that show, and I was like, I'm tired of making no money, and also going out of town to make no money.

[35:33] Carly Hughes: And uh somebody, I probably my agent at the time was like, You should, you should do this part, and I was like, and I don't even know about the chant, I'm, I wasn't excited about it.

[35:41] Carly Hughes: Uh, ended up being one of my best, one of the best experiences playing the title role in that show and doing it and singing that music every night was different than listening to it and not having a connection to it. But I'm, I did that in Theatreworks Palo Alto, uh, end of that year, and then the next year in, uh, in May, I think, or April is when I booked Spelling Bee.

[36:04] Carly Hughes: And I remember being like, Oh my god, I can finally breathe. And it kind of paid off, making no money for a year, just so the casting directors wouldn't be like Carly Who, you know what I mean? And I, I don't know how I had the wherewithal at that time of being 23, 24, however old I was, 24, I think, and being like, No, I'm, I'm gonna say no to things and stay here, and it'll pay off.

[36:27] Carly Hughes: Yeah, don't know who I thought I was. I think at the time I didn't even think about it. I was just like, I keep leaving, I need to be here, and it made sense. But looking back, I'm like, who the heck did I think I was turning down like five offers? You know what I mean?

[36:41] Rory O'Malley: Well, I mean, it's, it's the gift of being young is being naive and like not, you and eternally optimistic.

[36:51] Carly Hughes: Yeah, yeah, and just like not knowing what hard times are when even when you're in them, yeah.

[36:58] Carly Hughes: Yeah, like or not letting them affect, they don't affect you the same way.

[37:01] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[37:01] Carly Hughes: Like if you were going through the same period of time now, you'd be like, I'd be like, well, I gotta go get another job.

[37:07] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, yeah.

[37:07] Carly Hughes: Let's make it. Let's, let's, you know, it, it gets harder and harder the more you know, yeah, as you get older.

[37:13] Rory O'Malley: It does, the more experience you have.

[37:14] Carly Hughes: It does.

[37:15] Carly Hughes: So you are on Broadway, you're with a group, we just had the lovely opportunity to work with a bunch of our fellow Spelling Bee alums.

[37:24] Rory O'Malley: I know.

[37:25] Carly Hughes: Um, we did You're a Good Man Charlie Brown at the Montabond Theater here for a pause LA benefit, and um Barrett Foa was in it, Jared Gertner, you, me, me and you, and then Jackie and Jackie Polk, yeah, Jackie Polk and Snow Wilson came.

[37:40] Rory O'Malley: We're watching.

[37:41] Carly Hughes: They were watching, yeah. It was like a mini Spelling Bee reunion. That's a really special show place in my heart, I know for all of us because of the show and it being our debut, and like I just remember James Lapine because you know, I, I think to this day too, I'm the only black female to ever do it.

[38:02] Rory O'Malley: Really?

[38:03] Carly Hughes: Yeah, on Broadway.

[38:04] Rory O'Malley: Now, regionally.

[38:04] Carly Hughes: And then, and then ironically, after it closed, I couldn't get cast in a Spelling Bee anywhere regionally because they were like, Oh, you're not, and I, because I was a standby for Rona and Marcy, right? And they were like, Oh, what do you mean? And I'm like, What do you mean? I did it on Broadway, you know, and James, I just remember being so thankful for James to one taking a chance on someone who like, and you know, giving them their barber debut, and also not care, not seeing color and not, not just being like, She's funny, I like her for that.

[38:17] Carly Hughes: I like her for that. You know what I mean?

[38:33] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, but I still couldn't do it anywhere regionally.

[38:36] Carly Hughes: They were like, Rona, Lisa, what are you talking about? And I'm like, What are, so weird, yeah.

[38:41] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, to this day.

[38:42] Carly Hughes: Not at all.

[38:43] Carly Hughes: Wow.

[38:43] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, yeah, I don't, I never got to play it again, but I don't, I don't know, maybe, I don't know.

[38:48] Carly Hughes: I'm good.

[38:49] Carly Hughes: Yeah, we did it. We got our benefit on Saturday was like bringing it all full circle of adult Splendids.

[38:56] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[38:57] Carly Hughes: It was.

[38:57] Carly Hughes: It's a good thing. Plus, it was such a great experience that I don't want to like try to redo it.

[39:01] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[39:02] Carly Hughes: You know?

[39:02] Carly Hughes: Oh yeah. That's what I always say with Mormon is that like you can love the experience. And I of course I want to go back, but I don't know any of the classmates. It's like going back to your high school and you don't know anyone who goes there.

[39:13] Rory O'Malley: You know, I think it's not gonna be the same.

[39:15] Carly Hughes: I don't know them.

[39:15] Carly Hughes: No, you know, you could go back, it's just gonna be different.

[39:18] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, yeah.

[39:19] Carly Hughes: And then, and then you'll be comparing them the whole time.

[39:21] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[39:22] Carly Hughes: You're so good at booking warming.

[39:23] Rory O'Malley: Oh, you're so good.

[39:24] Carly Hughes: I'm so glad we got to do that.

[39:25] Rory O'Malley: No.

[39:25] Carly Hughes: Now, how long, what did you do in between that?

[39:28] Carly Hughes: That was, I did Spelling Bee.

[39:30] Rory O'Malley: Yes.

[39:31] Carly Hughes: Uh, 2007, and then I left Spelling Bee because I knew that it was about to close like in that January.

[39:37] Rory O'Malley: Sure.

[39:38] Carly Hughes: And I got offered How the Grinch Stole Christmas, the last year it was on Broadway.

[39:42] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[39:42] Carly Hughes: And then we opened, and on opening night was that, that dirty little strike. Remember?

[39:47] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[39:49] Carly Hughes: So we opened and then they shut down for like two weeks. And then the courts were like, oh, we were a special agreement contract with, we did 15 shows a week.

[39:57] Rory O'Malley: Oh my god.

[39:58] Carly Hughes: But they didn't acknowledge that till after two weeks of us not working and audiences being pissed at us and calling us the Grinch, and we're all like, we just want a paycheck. Don't be mad at me.

[40:07] Carly Hughes: Um, and ironically, left Spelling Bee to do the Grinch. All of Broadway shuts down, but five shows. Spelling Bee is one of the shows that doesn't shut down.

[40:17] Rory O'Malley: It was just stayed open.

[40:19] Carly Hughes: Okay.

[40:19] Carly Hughes: It's like, are you right?

[40:22] Carly Hughes: Um, but we're talking like mu a month of work here.

[40:26] Carly Hughes: Yeah. Really at the end.

[40:26] Carly Hughes: But that's, which was a tough. But because of that contract was tough was more money than I'd made in my whole life at that point because there were so many penalties based on how many shows you did.

[40:35] Rory O'Malley: I see.

[40:35] Carly Hughes: And only the kids are double cast, not the adults. So we were all doing 15 shows. It was a good one. And if there were three shows a day or four shows a day, or four shows followed by three or four ball followed by a, where was it at?

[40:46] Rory O'Malley: Uh, the St. James Theater.

[40:47] Carly Hughes: Oh.

[40:48] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[40:48] Carly Hughes: Wow.

[40:49] Carly Hughes: So anyway, we reopened and finished out the holiday season. And then that was 2007 to 2008. And then I don't think I, then it was another like dip of like, what is my life? I'm can't find a job. And I'm thinking, oh, I've done two Broadway shows now. I, I'm in, I'm in the door. Like, easy.

[41:07] Rory O'Malley: Not easy.

[41:11] Carly Hughes: Not booking anything, not even getting seen for certain things all of 2008. And then when you were making, uh, when you have these hard times and you have unemployment or you're in between jobs, were there times that you had side jobs or that you had to do with the job?

[41:25] Carly Hughes: Oh yeah. I, um, in when I first moved to New York, I, I nanied part-time for five years. So I had two families, one main family, and who I would go if I went away to do a show out of New York, they would get a substitute for me, and then I'd come back.

[41:41] Carly Hughes: And I had, I remember Benjamin, I had him from the time he was one and like picked him up from his first day of kindergarten. Diapers, potty training, everything in between shows.

[41:51] Carly Hughes: And then I also did the grimy sample sales in New York were like sure huge, you know, fancy, expensive companies have their 90% off sale and 90% off of those companies is something I still can't afford to this day. You know what I mean? Like those kind of clothing and house goods, and you'd be there on your feet for twelve hours to make twelve dollars an hour folding, you know, cashmere sweaters or whatever, you know.

[42:14] Carly Hughes: So I would do that. I remember doing one of those types of things and then like passing out flyers outside to get people to come and I couldn't do that more than that one time I did it because it was embarrassing for me because I would always see my friends walking by, and then I was like, I need to do something else.

[42:28] Carly Hughes: I'd rather change a diaper.

[42:29] Carly Hughes: Than, you know what I mean. And again, there's nothing wrong with it. Like to this day, I'll take a f-if you're handing me a flyer I'll take it just because I know the pain of being on a corner and not being able to go home until all the flyers are done.

[42:39] Carly Hughes: Yes.

[42:40] Carly Hughes: Uh and not being, you know, an a-hole and throwing them in the trash can next to you.

[42:44] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[42:45] Carly Hughes: Um, but yeah, so I, I did sample sales and I did, I nanied, um, you know, but after I, I didn't work that whole year, and then I think we did something, something oh, I think Jackie and I did that James Lapine show in Martha's Vineyard or something, and did the Grinch again that, uh next year.

[43:06] Carly Hughes: Next year, but that year only it went to Baltimore and Boston.

[43:09] Rory O'Malley: Uh huh.

[43:09] Carly Hughes: Uh, and I remember thinking, no, I don't want to do it, it's not on Broadway. And one of my friends who was in the show was like, get your life together.

[43:18] Carly Hughes: We had a knock from the Grinch. There was a knock from the Grinch at the door of Fantasy. What are you talking about? Don't you joke about me?

[43:26] Carly Hughes: Um, my friend was like, get your life together. Do you have something else you're doing? And I was like, No, but it's not on Broadway.

[43:34] Carly Hughes: And she was like, You're insane. This gig is literally eight weeks long, and you were making, we were still doing the production contract.

[43:41] Carly Hughes: And I was like, Oh yeah, you're right. And I, I because I had said no, my agent said no. And I got on the phone immediately, like an hour later and was like, call them back and tell them yes, I've lost my bite.

[43:50] Carly Hughes: And luckily it was fine. Um, did that, then didn't work again. And then did Ragtime, the revival on Broadway.

[43:58] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[43:58] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[43:59] Carly Hughes: So I, but I remember auditioning for that.

[44:02] Carly Hughes: We, so I was doing the Grinch in Baltimore before we went to Boston, and Ragtime was going to the Kennedy Center first. So and, uh, and not Broadway. So I was auditioning for the Kennedy Center, uh, between shows, between one of the 15 shows.

[44:16] Carly Hughes: And uh, I ended up booking Ragtime at the Kennedy Center, and I didn't book Sarah, and I, um, and I had already played Sarah regionally, so I was kind of like, and my agent at the time was like, Do you really want to be in the ensemble and Ragtime when you already done?

[44:30] Carly Hughes: I was like, but it's a Kennedy Center, and we both were like, nah, I don't need to do it. Moved on, cut to that summer, Ragtime revival coming to Broadway, and I was like, Boo, what the heck did I just do? Because I turned it down, right? You know, and they were taking most of the same people. So I remember going in again, and you know, minding my P's and Q's, and you know, a couple people were like, Why didn't you do it in DC? You know, and you couldn't say because I didn't want to do it at DC, yeah, you know. Um, I was like, I don't know, blah blah blah. Um, rehearsal process again, and I had booked another show out of town, and I was dating someone in New York, and I remember not wanting to leave the person I was dating, and also not wanting to leave New York and also hoping I booked this Ragtime and being so stressed for like a month, you know.

And I think two weeks before I was supposed to go out of town, they finally were like, Okay, you got it. You're the understudy for Sarah and this soloist and the pot of you know, all about the breakdown. And I remember being so excited to call that theater and be like, I can't come, and also being like, Oh, I booked another Broadway show. Which led to another life experience because I booked it August 2009. Uh-huh. Rehearsed, previewed, opened in November, got our closing notice in January. Wow. So we were open two months. Yeah. And I remember thinking, what? Of I don't even I guess hearing that that happened, but not being fully cognizant of that that actually happens a lot. Or what that feels like.

Or what it feels like being in like a show in my mind and the rest of the world's mind was a hit. I mean, it ran on Broadway originally for what, two years? Yeah, at least. Two, but it won all the Tony. Like it was it's a hit show. Like everyone knows Ragtime by the McDonald's, Brian Church Mitchell. So we none of us were under the impression that it would ever be in trouble. Right. Although I was curious that we were reviving it like less than 10 years after it hit closed, you know. Right, right, right. It didn't seem like the right time. It's a huge production, and I thought that they kind of scaled back the design so it wasn't as big of the cost for that, but it's still like 50 people on stage or something.

Yeah, we had a huge cast, and we didn't, we had you know, we had the four levels, yeah, and everything was bare, which was her concept, you know, which was great, but and we were at the Neil Simon, it wasn't a big theater, yeah. But we closed in too, there was lots to go on with that. I learned about like advertising, and if your producers slash team choose not to advertise, which is you know what happened with us, then nobody knows about your show. Right opening a Broadway show in the fall versus opening it in the spring. I learned all of that. You don't know, you don't want to open in the fall when everyone's gone back to school. The tourism has gone down and it doesn't go back up until about Christmas, and it goes down again until spring break.

Right. So we learned a lot. I remember there were cast members that would go around flyering with our flyers of and I'm and I and I never did because I was I remember being so frustrated thinking, why are we on Broadway and we have to do someone else's job of advertising a Broadway show? Right. And I would be so angry. And it wouldn't overtake me to the point where I was like, screw you, I'm not doing I just remember thinking that's not my job, and I'm not gonna take that on. I'm gonna accept whatever happens with it, but I don't think that's fair, and I don't think it's fair for anyone else to have to run around worrying. We worry about our jobs anyway. Yeah, I mean, and at the end of the day, that's kind of like taking a pail and trying to bail out of a boat.

That's exactly and that's what I and that's what I felt like too. I was like, if we're going down, which evidently we are already, me putting a flyer in the shoe repair shop on Eighth Avenue is not about to say anything. You know what I mean? Because it just will make someone else feel better. And I'm like, if that makes you guys feel better, go for it. But I it didn't it made me frustrated, you know, and and the whole way it went down and how we found out about you know, we found out at 15 minutes to places by you know, our lead producer, you know, sure comes down, and you find out different ways. Some people find out some people are lucky enough and they find out you know, a month in advance, and you're like, Great, I have four more paychecks.

We were uh getting ready, and they were like, 15 minutes, you get you know, you get your half hour call, your 15-minute call. And they were like, Could everyone come down to stage? And we were like, Oh, okay, we come down, producer's there, half makeup, halfway casting do various, you know, uh things of getting ready. And he's like, So uh we're closing, and then I remember being so still, and everyone's like, Wow. Also, also did you just say we're closing like as if it's like you're closing the book or you're what are you talking about? And uh we're gonna close on Sunday. It was Tuesday, and it was just like that, and then the little boy that plays the little boy, and the little girl that plays the little girl, just balling, and he has to start the show in 1902, Fatherville to have it was like in 1902 Father, and I was like, Oh, Jesus.

It was you have never seen a more angry Harlem, a more confused immigrants, and a more like angry, you know, group of Caucasians on stage because the because you know those three groups face off, and every I mean just that emotion from being like, Oh, we close on Sunday. And then I remember show that night. Yeah, and I remember the next day they were like, Okay, we were extending. We were like, Oh, great. They were like, till January 10th. I think that was like another week. Maybe two, but uh yeah, that was my first experience of like we're closing tomorrow, yeah. Oh, oh okay, yeah, that's that's pretty crazy, and banking on like having a job because it's not a new show, it's a revival of a hit show, yeah.

So there was that. We close in January, and that was 2010 by that point. When these things happen, it kind of takes away your trust in everything, everything, everything, everybody and everything, yeah. Because all you want, all you want in this business ever, which we were talking about earlier, is a sense of security, a sense of of belonging, and a sense of of I don't know any other word besides security. You want to feel like you don't have to worry. Right. Well, and and nobody goes, I'm pretty sure that nobody goes into this business to make money because if they do, they're crazy. That's not but it's funny that you say that. But but but I feel like you get to this point where you're you know what it's like to be in this business and not have anything for long periods of time.

So you become like a squirrel. You're like, I gotta hoard this all and hide it away. I'm like trucking Tiffany Haddish, I'm still on Groupon. Luckily, my boyfriend does not judge me. Because I'll be like, look what I found on Groupon. Oh look at this voucher. I found a squirrel. Yeah. That is never gonna leave me. Right. Because I started working professionally in theater at 18. Yeah, and theater's not the same as TV. TV if your show closes, at least you made exponentially more in those episodes than you ever would in a week on Broadway. Do you know? Yeah. And you get residuals for it re-airing and all those things that don't happen. I will always be a squirrel. Yeah. Which, you know, is 50-50 a good thing.

Oh good 70-30. 70-70% a good thing, and 30% of like, okay, learn to live now. Yeah. I'm trying to figure that out, but like all of that, um, it's like someone handing you a golden ticket Broadway is and then taking it away right when you get to the gate, a show opening and closing like that. Yeah, you know. Yeah, absolutely. Um so that that shook me. And then I didn't work again after that for a year. And I was doing, I mean, thank God for Tara Rubin. Yeah. Obsessed with her, casting agent in New York, obsessed with her. She's the one who gave us all of our jobs. She gave me a Broadway debut, and then in 2010, I didn't have any jobs, but I did like two workshops. That's a lie. I did two workshops and I did a new show at Yale Rep, I think that year.

And something they were all Tara Rubin and offered, like she was like, Oh, use Carly, you call it, and I was like, uh, not worthy. And got to the end um of that year. I was doing another reading, which you don't get paid for readings, you get a stipend. The stipend is a hundred dollars, you know. Yeah, and I hadn't worked all year besides then, and then Ghost came along, and that was Tara Rubin, too. Wow. Yeah. And I was like, what? Okay. I was doing a reading of Beautiful. Ah. I was doing like the first or second reading of Beautiful. Planning that seed. Mm-hmm. Uh-huh. And I remember and Joy Aaron Reed was in it with me at the time and a bunch of friends who were just doing a reading at NOLA of all places.

Uh, and getting called in and being like, I want to see you for this track. And again, I was kind of like, uh, because my mind was always thinking, Yes, Broadway show, yes, do this, take you need a job, but also strategically, do you need to do this role? Will that get you to this place? Like, I was always thinking of next level of how will this get me here. So I remember getting the call for the Ghost audition and being like, ah, ensemble to cover. And every show I've ever done on Broadway, I was a uh an understudy or standby, which is not bad, but I was constantly thinking, okay, but I'm ready to play part. Right. But I and I always had a feature too, you know, which is still better than just being a tree in the back.

Sure. Um, and I was kind of like, I don't know, and then I was like, Ghost, like Whoopi Goldberg Ghost, like what? How do you even what? Yeah. And they were like, just go in. And it's Tara, and again, I will do any she's gotten me most of my Broadway shows, and anytime she says she wants to see me, I will say yes. Yeah. And I was like, all right. And I remember having fun at the audition, and I remember doing the dance call and having fun too. And I was like, okay, I'm I'm I'm in, I'm for this now. And I think like by the end of the Beautiful reading that I was doing, they were like, Okay, you got the part. And I got cast as one of Oda May's sisters, which was like a featured track, and then the understudy for uh Oda May Brown for the Whoopi Goldberg part.

And I was like, I remember thinking, Great, because it was November of 2010, and it was supposed to start in January. And so I was already like, okay, I don't I can breathe because I don't have work for the next month, but then I will in a moment. Right. And it was already in London, you know, and I had I didn't know anything about it. But we got an email over Christmas from the producers. Uh we would love for you to come to London and see this production of Ghosts so that we're all on the same page when um when we start rehearsals in January, that you know what we're talking about and when and blah blah blah. These are the dates. Let us know if you can come. And I remember there was like text going around me and Fossi Mompoint, Daniel Watts and all these people, like, did you get that email?

Yeah, I got the email. We're to London, London. I can't afford I don't have any money until we started the show. And then the second email follows, like, and oh, also, which they forgot to say, yeah, they're paying for it. Yeah. I was like, what? It's I think it's probably the only time in history they took the whole Broadway cast over to London to see the show. Yeah. Uh, which was needed because all the magic tricks and things like that. Sure. Um, but we did that, and then we came back and started rehearsal, and I was like, I remember feeling like I was in like Camp Hogwarts with all those tricks for like Sam being a ghost and the subway ghost and things flying and stuff like that. It was that was one of the the that was the most fun, or one of the shows that I had the most fun on.

It was like it was never the same. Yeah, so inventive, it was never the same. And I hear in the audience, I remember I'd be like when Sam went through the door when like the ghost sub was subway ghosts went through something where things went floating on stage, and us knowing that we're literally doing like this with you know, holding something up in black, and it's all about lighting, right? But the audience doesn't see we're dressed in all blacks and stuff, and and you see a briefcase or a book floating, and they're like, How do you it's amazing like when a show gives you the opportunity to like create a new skill? Yeah, you're a magician now. Yeah, and we were called ninjas, uh direct to cultus ninjas.

There, those of you going to be ninjas, ninjas, and the and then those of you that are going to be all in the subway call. So I get to be a ninja. The quick change was putting on all black. Um let me cut let me do a side note here about just you you we you talked a little bit about being cast uh by James Lapine. Oh my god, and and being the only woman, only black woman to play any of any of the roles inspired by me. And a lot of your casting here is pretty typical, like there's no like you know. How do you think that you're being a woman of color affects you, and also just like being a woman? It's one of the things I talk about the most. It's so hard for women in this business. Body image and and roles, and and how does that affect you?

So much to juggle, and I've I was talking about this with my boyfriend the other day. We talk about it all the time, but like there's so much to juggle already growing up and being black in America, yes, and then growing up and being aware of being a woman in America, and then being a black person woman in America, right? Going into this business. Do you know what I mean? Um, which was in my face the whole time. Forever, I think, because once I got to New York, it's like it's better now, but for well, like definitely once I got there, it was like you'd see a Broadway show, and there was one black girl and one black guy. And so in going into auditions, it was like, God, I hope I get it, because there's only one spot, you know, and not that it was ever uh necessary, but that's just how it was.

You know, and I uh tons of my friends in New York, you know, we'd be like, hey girl, how you doing? Did you get it? Oh, I didn't get it. Oh, that means Michelle got it. Or that means you know what I mean, because you could tell. Yeah. Um so constantly knowing that you were not only up against each other, but there was only one part spot. Right. Do you know what I mean? Uh and that kind of dissipated as years went on, but then coming into TV and film, it's like uh the league that you step into, you know what I mean, of being just typed. Yeah, like I can't go up against Jada Pinkett Smith, even though we're similar type, but I'm like, her resume is her resume, also, she's been doing this way longer, you know what I mean, on this end of the field.

So you compete with people in that in that aspect. You are now it's like everything is H D 4D X, triple D W X, Y, and Z. Yeah. So that affects when you go into a room and you think, you know, you're taught just or you hopefully you're taught be yourself, do what you do, and blah blah blah, and then you go in the room, but you're like, that's not it, because now it's like, how do you look?

[59:17] Carly Hughes: Do you look like this role? If they're not gonna put a wig on you, so you have to go in kind of being similar. Also, you know, what's your body type? What is your type of game? And then you end up getting in a room, the waiting room going, oh my god, trying not to compare yourself to the other women sitting next to you. And for me, with TV and film, I've found myself in situations where two situations. I go in, and I'm the only black woman, and there's like a blonde, a brunette, a redhead, and I'm like, oh, okay. So like literally, I can let this go. And not that I give up, but it's like automatically I'm like, either you want me a black woman for this part or you don't, like, I can't do anything about it.

Um, which sometimes is easier to go into the room because I'm like, look, no stress. I'm just gonna do it and live my life and have this role. Cause I already know now I have no say, you know what I mean, in the outcome. Um, or I find myself in LA a lot the youngest person in the room because I'll get calls for like 40-year-old mom or 45 years, and I have a baby face. Um, but I'll walk in and like see sometimes these women that I've seen on TV or have been watching on TV, and I'm like, ah so you either want a young whatever, or so I I've learned to be like, oh, I have no control over any of the any of these variables anymore. So I go in and play now. But it's frustrating because there'll be stuff and roles that I really want, and then I get there and I'm like, I don't think I'm gonna get this based on history and experience of being like um there was this movie I was up for.

Um can I say the movie? Should I say the movie? Yeah, Pet Cemetery, the new Pets and I went in, it was me. There was an Indian woman, a Hispanic woman, there was all ethnic, and the kid even the kids they were seeing were I think they wanted to go ethnic. And then they're starting to do press for it and everything. It's a whole white family. And I was like, not of course, but like, oh okay, of course. Right. Like you were just looking. Yeah, yeah. But you shop for you. But told yeah, told us that you're you were really serious, but you didn't yeah, you didn't really shop. You were just window shopping, but you didn't really put anything in the cart. And that frustrated me because I was excited about the opportunity.

I was excited about the remake and that movie, and I was also excited that they were also making it an not an all-it was it's like gonna be a mixed family, you know what I mean, which to me represents all of America anyway. So I was just excited about all the possibilities, and then I saw the ad, and it's like a white woman with red hair or brown hair, whatever, but it was like not anything of what the breakdown and how it started, and it was just another like, you know, in your face moment of like because sometimes even still like they'll tell you one thing and you go in and with the intention, and then you don't you know get it, like we were talking about before. You don't get told why, you don't get you can't you can't ask a casting director because the reason is they wanted a white girl, or the reason is they didn't want a black or Indian or Hispanic, you know what I mean?

Like, and you I can't do anything about it. So you feel like when they when they cast someone of color is when they say they want someone of color. When they say like, oh, we we're open to anything, they're kind of like, well, we'll say that we are, and yeah, and even sometimes lately, um, because with Pet Cemetery, they were looking for a woman of color, and then it just not anymore. Uh I see. Yeah. I mean, and so yeah, you just never know. And so I find that frustrating with I don't know, they're just with with women, how big are you boobs? How tall are you? How big is your butt? How tiny is your waist? How that that I think men don't have to worry about. No, how old are you? When a man gets older, it's you're distinguishing you're still handsome. When a woman gets older, it's like, oh, you play the grandma now, and you're like, no, I'm still hot and sexy. Thank you very much. Yeah, you know what I mean?

[1:03:00] Carly Hughes: Yeah. So all of that goes into a effect, you know. It's interesting. I try not to let it get to me. I mean, it does every now and then, but I think I just am constantly telling myself, like, I only have control over what I go into the room with and what I present the casting director and directors with. After that, I don't whatever I say or do before and after is not gonna encourage their decision. It's what it that's it's what I have control over, the audition itself.

[1:03:29] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:03:29] Carly Hughes: And then once I leave the room, I have to be like, all right, that's it. Because you can't stress yourself over any other decisions that you can't make. No, you know. Um, part of the having the control though is I think that we try to have control over is social media and using social media to kind of have influence, cultivate your image, be like this is someone who is out there. They want to work with and it's it's a tool, but it also can be a trap. How do you deal with social media?

[1:04:04] Carly Hughes: Social media stresses me out.

[1:04:06] Rory O'Malley: Okay.

[1:04:06] Carly Hughes: Like it didn't used to stress me out when it was like, oh, Instagram, Facebook for fun, post pictures of your life and your friends who want to know what you're up to, it's great. But then once it be started to become a gateway into getting a job, I it infuriated me.

[1:04:24] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:04:25] Carly Hughes: It's still it still does. Because now getting a job can be 50% not even based on talent. And I don't think I'll ever get over that frustration of being like, What are you talking about? You cast this person opposite of me or opposite of whoever who's never done this before, or you cast this person who has a quatrillion followers and they s don't still don't know how to do this, like that will forever blow my mind.

[1:04:51] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:04:51] Carly Hughes: I mean, if you've if you're lucky enough to find a mix and this person has like a quadrillion followers and they're talented and they have done this for a living, I don't I will never fault anyone for that. But there is a thing now because people want to extend their show, movie, whatever, into that person's followers, into their following. And the easiest way to do that is because this person has one million followers already. So if we put her or him on screen, it'll automatically draw that crowd.

[1:05:20] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:05:21] Carly Hughes: I don't I don't agree with it. You know what I mean? I don't agree with it in the sense of if that's the only thing you're going by. Because I've been stuck in. I've been stuck in a situation where I've been doing a show with someone who doesn't do it for a living. And then I it makes me work harder.

[1:05:23] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[1:05:23] Carly Hughes: You know what I mean? Yes. Uh in every every way. Um and then also the the pressure to be like, get your followers up. Uh you need to get more followers, followers. And it's like, but what? I follow me if you want to. Do you have that pressure for just like theoretically, or are there people put that on you?

[1:05:55] Carly Hughes: Casting directors that I've mentioned it to my managers, my team being like, you know, not pressuring me, but just full making me fully aware of like if you build this, it will come. I mean, essentially that's what it's that's what it is now. If you build this, this being your brand, your empire, your Instagram page, yeah, more things will come because that's how it is now. Do you know what I mean?

[1:06:18] Rory O'Malley: Um, or you will be, you know, I'll be considered a little more than I am in other instances because my followers can contend, which again has nothing to do with my talent.

[1:06:30] Carly Hughes: Right.

[1:06:31] Rory O'Malley: You know, I can go into a room and be like, well, we really liked her and her read for this part, or her we love her for the part, but the producers want her because she has this many followers, you know, it's a whole nother level now.

[1:06:42] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[1:06:43] Rory O'Malley: That's it has nothing to even do with being black or a woman or a man. It's now just Instagram.

[1:06:49] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[1:06:49] Rory O'Malley: Which that frustrates me more.

[1:06:51] Carly Hughes: Sure.

[1:06:52] Rory O'Malley: You know.

[1:06:53] Carly Hughes: Oh, it's a it's a whole nother part of the business that's very not. Wasn't around when we were at at uh there was no Instagram. It was literally like, can you melt this sea? Yes.

[1:07:03] Carly Hughes: And you're like, yeah, I think.

[1:07:04] Rory O'Malley: You know?

[1:07:06] Carly Hughes: Can you do it eight times a week? Yes, you get the job. You know what I mean?

[1:07:10] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, it's a very different world.

[1:07:12] Carly Hughes: Um, your last show, I think that you did on Broadway was beautiful, right?

[1:07:16] Rory O'Malley: No, it was Chicago.

[1:07:18] Carly Hughes: Oh, of course it was.

[1:07:21] Rory O'Malley: Okay, so let's go quickly between for for those two before we wrap up here. You were in Beautiful, you had been doing that from the readings.

[1:07:25] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[1:07:29] Rory O'Malley: So you were able to readings.

[1:07:30] Carly Hughes: Yeah, so it's kind of nice to actually see something.

[1:07:33] Rory O'Malley: Originate from that's it.

[1:07:36] Carly Hughes: Left Ghost of Beautiful, originated uh that track and that role and those that music and um then left that.

[1:07:45] Carly Hughes: No, that's a lie. Ghost into book and Mormon, Book of Mormon.

[1:07:49] Rory O'Malley: Yes.

[1:07:50] Carly Hughes: For like seven months.

[1:07:51] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:07:51] Carly Hughes: Left that to do the uh uh Beautiful.

[1:07:54] Rory O'Malley: Right.

[1:07:55] Carly Hughes: Originally Beautiful, left that after about eight, nine months, and took over as leading player in Pippin.

[1:08:01] Rory O'Malley: Oh yes.

[1:08:02] Carly Hughes: Oh my gosh, Charlie. I'm like I'm like gone somewhere. Like after Book of Mormon, I'm like checked out because I came out here.

[1:08:08] Rory O'Malley: Oh, that's why I'm like, that's why I've I didn't know which I originated, another CMU uh grad and friend, took over that, closed that show out for the last like six months, and then took over Zivelle McKelly in Chicago.

[1:08:22] Rory O'Malley: Incredible.

[1:08:23] Carly Hughes: Um, and then did Cabin in the Sky and came out here.

[1:08:25] Rory O'Malley: I see.

[1:08:26] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[1:08:26] Rory O'Malley: How what was it like you? You I mean, that's you basically manifested all that track because you were like, I'm making decisions so that I can be playing these leading roles, which you clearly were.

[1:08:37] Carly Hughes: It was life life changing.

[1:08:39] Rory O'Malley: Wasn't it I well, because when I was doing beautiful, I wasn't, you know, it wasn't the heaviest show work workload, you know, wise.

[1:08:47] Carly Hughes: It was easy.

[1:08:47] Rory O'Malley: I could do it in my sleep, and I had been doing all the readings, so I knew it. And when I uh auditioned for Pippin, did the whole you know, song and dance and all that, and I got and they were like, okay, she she booked it, and I was like, okay, great, what? And they were like, uh, the understudy, and I was like, no. And I I've become the queen of saying no when it's not right for me. I was like, I'm not leaving singing, will you still love me tomorrow? Having a fierce feature to go do a cartwheel eight times a week. I'm not doing it. I was on a Friday. Monday I get a call and they were like, look, the team really wants you. If Diane Paulist likes you, you'll take over. And I was like, nah, what are you talking about? They're like, no, as the leading player. She's flying in in two days, your final auditions. And I was like, oh, okay, now we're talking.

[1:09:30] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:09:31] Carly Hughes: Um, and I auditioned for Diane that Wednesday before uh the two show day of beautiful before the matinee, did all stuff for her, went and did the matinee, found out between the matinee that I booked it on a Wednesday, did the night show, started rehearsal the next day for Pippin.

[1:09:46] Rory O'Malley: Wow.

[1:09:47] Carly Hughes: And and all because I said no on Friday, because I was like, I'm not, I was like, I can't go backwards or lateral. I'm the goal is to go up.

[1:09:56] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:09:56] Carly Hughes: You know what I mean? And to and to do that, you have to say no. You have to, you just have to. You can't always say yes.

[1:10:04] Rory O'Malley: You know what I mean?

[1:10:05] Carly Hughes: It's tough though, huh?

[1:10:06] Rory O'Malley: It's tough it was tough. I was like, did I make the right decision? And then Monday morning I was like, Oh, I did.

[1:10:11] Carly Hughes: Oh, I did, okay. You know, trust your gut if you can most of the time. But it was life changing because I was like, oh, okay. Now all of those years of saying no and saying X, Y, and Z and sticking to my guns have are starting to pay off. You know what I mean? And then it went like this.

[1:10:24] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:10:26] Carly Hughes: You know, like like clockwork or ladder uh up the ladder after that.

[1:10:31] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:10:31] Carly Hughes: No, I mean it was I I mean you really were kind of shot out of a cannon. And it was like this this is someone who can lead a Broadway show, and here you are, you know, in a TV show as well.

[1:10:44] Rory O'Malley: So now you've kind of got like all of the above.

[1:10:47] Carly Hughes: What do you think?

[1:10:48] Rory O'Malley: You know, you've got this great gig. What do you think uh is next for you? Which I hate asking.

[1:10:54] Carly Hughes: I hate when people ask me that when I'm like, I'm doing the thing and I don't know what is next.

[1:10:58] Rory O'Malley: I don't know what's going on.

[1:10:58] Carly Hughes: Because I just enjoy this, but like you're clearly somebody.

[1:11:02] Carly Hughes: I do all the time. Like I, you know, I'm grateful for AMERICAN HOUSEWIFE and and um that other my other show on Netflix called Insatiable.

[1:11:10] Rory O'Malley: Oh.

[1:11:11] Carly Hughes: Which is fun. I have two uh two episodes in that. I think we we just got a season two, so I think I'll do a couple more episodes in season two. But ideally, I want to do a feature film. Like I want that to be next on the horizon. In my dreams, I would be like one of the next Marvel characters because I really just want to kick butt and like put on a fierce costume and like you know what I mean.

[1:11:33] Rory O'Malley: You are you're ready to kick butt.

[1:11:35] Carly Hughes: Yeah, I just want to kick butt. But like also be super positive and happy because that's who you are.

[1:11:40] Rory O'Malley: Yeah.

[1:11:40] Carly Hughes: So with sunshine, kick butt with sunshine.

[1:11:42] Rory O'Malley: Kick butt with sunshine.

[1:11:43] Carly Hughes: And I wanna I want to do some drama because I've been doing comedy forever.

[1:11:47] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, you know what I mean?

[1:11:48] Carly Hughes: Yeah.

[1:11:49] Rory O'Malley: Well, I'm sure that you're gonna do it because if you set your mind to it, if that's what you want, then it's gonna happen.

[1:11:55] Carly Hughes: It's so amazing to hear your story.

[1:11:58] Rory O'Malley: Um, because I knew parts of it, but but just to kind of hear your thought process of how you got from one step to another, you really should be so proud of everything and where you are, and you're so talented, and it takes more than talent, though. It takes perseverance and determination, and you can't. I always tell people like when I do master classes and stuff, I'm always like two things. Know what you do and do it you know wholeheartedly. I had one experience where I sang something I shouldn't have sang, and that was like first moved to New York, and literally from that moment I was like, I'm good, I don't do that if I couldn't if I couldn't sing it. And so I'm always like, No, no one else does what you do and the way you do it. So why go and try to imitate you know? I love Eden. She's a Eden Snow, she's a close friend of mine. I'm not gonna try to sing like her because I can't.

[1:12:45] Carly Hughes: Right.

[1:12:46] Rory O'Malley: I'm gonna do my thing, you know.

[1:12:49] Carly Hughes: Right, nobody can do what you do.

[1:12:51] Rory O'Malley: And the second thing I always say is if at any moment in life you can think of something else that brings you just as much joy as being an actor, a performer or more, yeah, you should go do that.

[1:13:04] Carly Hughes: Yes, and then this should become a hobby.

[1:13:06] Rory O'Malley: Yeah, because you're never gonna be fully fulfilled because you're always gonna be searching for something else.

[1:13:11] Carly Hughes: That's true.

[1:13:12] Rory O'Malley: Whereas if this is the only thing you can think of, you know, and you wake up every morning wanting to do this and better this, then you'll be able to sustain because there's lots of up and ups and downs. And if you're on your lowest moment and you can't hack it, you you it's just you're not gonna make it.

[1:13:29] Carly Hughes: Well, you did.

[1:13:32] Rory O'Malley: Oh, so thank you so much for yeah, the roller coaster.

[1:13:36] Carly Hughes: Thank you so much for talking.

[1:13:37] Rory O'Malley: Thank you for having me.

[1:13:38] Carly Hughes: I love you so much.

[1:13:40] Carly Hughes: Audition, side job, swimming upstream. Believe it or not, you're living the dream.