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[0:00] Charlie Murphy: Hello, hello, and welcome to Mapping The College Audition. I'm your host, Charlie Murphy, director of MTCA. That's Musical Theatre College Auditions. Check us out at mtca.com. And today we've got Bill Digneit from Northern Michigan University on the pod.

[0:19] Charlie Murphy: For our newer listeners, it's another one of our college deep dive episodes, where we explore the landscape of the college theatre world and try to demystify this daunting audition process. And this is it, our last episode of 2025. I hope you're all enjoying wonderful holidays and getting some true rest and relaxation. If it's been more of a hectic one for you so far, maybe you can figure out how to do a bit of a forced reset before we dive into the busyness of 2026, especially for our senior listeners. I feel like that is really key. It's about to turn from this marathon of what it's been the past few years or past few months, depending on how you've done this, and all this preparation to now the sprint that is the auditions every weekend for the next two months.

So even if you can give yourself one truly restful, peaceful, reset type day, I'm into it. Put that phone away, enjoy some time in nature, enjoy some time with friends, family, whatever it is that's going to actually refill your cup before we get into all the craziness.

[1:23] Charlie Murphy: For those of you who are a bit younger, juniors, sophomores, freshmen, et cetera, please do mark in your calendars our next Meet MTCA workshop, which will be Tuesday, January 20th. That's Tuesday, January 20th at 8 p.m. Eastern is our next Meet MTCA workshop. Normally we have them on Wednesday. So if you've just been waiting for a non-Wednesday opportunity because of your standing bridge night or whatever, this is your chance. Tuesday, January 20th, you can sign up for free at mtca.com. Those workshops are really a great chance to meet us and get a bit more of an understanding of what we do at MTCA since I really do try to not go too deep under the MTCA process in the podcast for those of you who might not choose to be MTCA students, as well as hopefully these workshops are going to get a sense of artistic expectations for the process as a whole and begin to make a bit of a plan for yourself. So please do sign up for that if you're interested. And again, it's free.

[2:10] Charlie Murphy: I do want to thank all of you for a really great 2025 in both the MTCA world in general and the podcast world specifically. I really appreciate all the feedback and the love that's been sent our way this year. Thank you for the ratings, the reviews, all the shares of our pod as we grow the audience and try to reach more people. It all truly means the world to me. I know sometimes listeners will kind of describe the parasocial relationship that they have with me, often in flattering and sometimes unflattering ways. Sometimes they describe me as the annoying voice in the car that their mom makes them listen to, or maybe I'm the voice that they listen to as they try to fall asleep at night. But I do really feel like I have that relationship with all of you as well.

It's a bit of an amalgam relationship because obviously I don't know all of you individually. It becomes personal and individual when I get to see you at events or get to interact directly with you at various MTCA students in different ways. But the love feels real from me to you, to all of you. So here's to another great year with all of you. I love you very much. And with that, let's get into this interview with Bill Digneit from Northern Michigan University.

[3:18] Charlie Murphy: Well, we are so excited to be joined by William Digneit. William has a bachelor's from NMU, this very Northern Michigan University we're about to talk about. He's an MFA from FSU in technical theater, which we're going to talk about that as well. He's a production manager for LDI, that's Live Design International, co-founder of Double Trouble Entertainment, and the co-owner of Diggs Gastropub in downtown Marquette, which we're going to talk about some digs. So we'll get some digs. And he's also the department head and professor of theater and dance at NMU and the director of SISU, the Innovation Institute at Northern Michigan University, which is located in Marquette, Michigan. They take about 20 in acting and MTs in their cohorts. And we'll talk about the degrees they offer, which is acting, musical theater. Those are both BFAs and the theater tech and design BFA, as well as a theater entertainment arts BA. Bill, welcome on the show. How are you feeling today?

[4:11] Bill Digneit: Oh, my gosh. So excited to be here. It's great to see you. I know we connected a while back at a regional audition, and it's just great to be here on MTCA.

[4:22] Charlie Murphy: Not even necessarily secret regional auditions. It was at Pittsburgh Unified, and our listeners who have regular listeners as possible have heard five minutes of you in that absolute speed dating catastrophe that was that wonderful episode. But boy, I felt like you used to hear me talking quickly. You hear all of us just absolutely. You know how to rock a room. You were ready. You were like, I got this. There's a lot of coffee before that.

[4:46] Bill Digneit: But other than, of course, our little personal background, I'd love to hear a little bit of your background, sort of your journey to Northern Michigan. So anything people need to know about you in terms of how did you end up there? What brought you to Northern Michigan before? We'll dive into the school itself, but anything we want in terms of your personal background?

[5:01] Bill Digneit: Yeah. I mean, I guess some people find theater very early in their lives. I did not. I went to Northern because of the adventure side of things, of the wilderness and the rurality of it and the kind of cool adventure that you could have at Northern and the fact that it was the right size institution. And then I had done one play and one musical in high school and then went as a business major and then found theater when I was honestly kind of unhappy in being a business major and found Northern that way and then got a theater degree there. And then it changed my life.

[5:40] Charlie Murphy: Well, and when you talk to me, I mean, we're going to break down a little bit of the acting, the musical theater and the tech side of NMU. But from yourself personally, you said you'd only done one show. How much of you as an undergrad was a performer versus how much of you were thinking about more of the tech and the things that you're going to get an MFA later in tech? But how did that journey to finding the tech side of things come for you?

[5:57] Bill Digneit: Yeah, totally. So I played music. I was in the choir in high school. I went out for my first musical. I actually asked to just do like backstage or support. And then Mary Rashid, who is my vocal director, goes, well, I know you can sing, so why don't you audition? And then it was Bye Bye Birdie and I got the lead as Conrad for Show Out. So then that was really cool. But then I went to college and like many students think, well, this is something I did in high school and maybe I can't do it in college or I just it wasn't a career path. And so I started actually, though, when I went to get a theater degree at Northern, I did start in the performance side of things and doing that. And I love that.

I use all those performative skills that I learned in a myriad of things that I do in my life. But I really fell in love with the storytelling on the technical side. So I guess I'm a bit of both. But yeah, I'm multi-hyphenated. Like if you ever hear me talk, I think people are more than one thing. And so, yeah, I just the opportunities kind of led me down more this technical side. But I use my performative nature in a lot of different roles that I have around in my life.

[7:15] Charlie Murphy: I love it. We certainly on this podcast are fans of multi-hyphenates. And we'll talk a little bit as we get into it about some of those permeableness or permeability of NMU, but really just in general of people who might start off interested in multiple things and how they can pursue those different paths. But first, just from like a broad scale, I'd love to hear like what is a Northern Michigan student? So basically, like as you look at your theater department as a whole, like what kind of students tend to come to Northern Michigan? Is there an ethos of like, this is what an NMU student is?

[7:44] Bill Digneit: Oh, yeah. I think that we have a student that really wants to get a little gritty with it. That's the type of student that comes in to Northern, in my opinion, really wants to push themselves and have a lot of discovery and is up for an adventure. It takes an adventure to fly to Marquette, Michigan. We have an airport in town 15 minutes from campus. But to say, I'm going to come most even if you're downstate Michigan or Wisconsin, it's a six to eight hour drive or you're flying and come here and have an adventure. So usually the type of student we have is like, I'm looking for that college experience, but I want to go out and even push myself and see what I can do because it is not a commuter campus.

So a lot of students are here. Like over the fall break, many of our students, I'd say about half, do stay on campus. There's a very exciting Friendsgiving that happens on our campus. But yeah, I mean, it's someone that wants to go see the Northern Lights after rehearsal and be on the Shore Lake Superior and do all that. But yeah, the type of student is there really, I think, that wants to have that discovery experience.

[9:05] Charlie Murphy: I love that. I love the idea of sort of the adventurous outdoors person and how that parlays into a theater education and parlays in the way you study. I often ask about this later, but tell me just because we're talking about it, tell me a little bit more, what is the campus experience of Northern Michigan? So outside, we'll get into the theater curriculum, but outside of the theater, just like what does that mean? If you picture, I heard Northern Lights, am I picturing Alaska? What is it going to feel like to be in Northern Michigan?

[9:30] Bill Digneit: Yeah, so Northern Michigan University is nested right on the shore of Lake Superior in Michigan's Upper Peninsula. So 37% of the state's landmass with like 4% of the state's population. Marquette is this wonderful community, beach community, waters life where we are. It's definitely a part of who we are. And when you come onto campus, we have about 7,000 students, 170 different degree programs ranging from research sciences to the arts, to political science, to vet, pre-vet, pre-med, and 200 student organizations. And it really is, the students say this, they're like, oh, it's really chill. But it's big enough to where you're not going to know everybody, but small enough to when you're walking down the hallway, you're going to see someone that you know.

And there's that just Midwestern nice kind of vibe there. Everyone's really friendly. They talk to each other. But when you're on campus, there is just always something to do. We're a really active campus. So we are in a more remote location, but we have that what I call big city feel with small town service. So we are bringing in major thought leaders and performers and concerts and all those types of things, even though we are in kind of small town USA in Marquette. So it's really exciting. We have all the sports. We have hockey and football and all those things that you're going to want to see, as well as art galleries and all those types of things. Tons of coffee shops. We're a huge coffee shop town. The founder of Starbucks, Howard Schultz, actually went to Northern. So we have a lot of Starbucks on campus. Yeah, let's go.

[11:18] Bill Digneit: And I think the type of student that comes there and when they're, and I know I said chill, but the students really interact with each other. We have varsity athletes that are within our department. We have had varsity athletes that, like football players that came over and said, we just heard it's really cool over here. Can we help with the flies for Tarzan when you're doing the musical? Like, it's when I say, oh, yeah, yeah, exactly. It's one of those campuses, I don't, there's the type of student that comes here really wants to meet everyone. Cause we don't get a ton of students. It's not like we get 50 students that all go to the school, right? Like many, many people know those colleges that are around their hometown where everybody graduates from high school and you're either going to A or B and very few people go to the other school.

We're that other school where you're like, oh, one or two students from a high school might come, come to Northern. And we're like, come to Northern. And that's, what's great is so because we're so many different states and so many different perspectives, we're getting a lot of people coming in. It makes it an exciting campus. You're getting a ton of different perspectives and a lot of exciting new friendships and relationships that happen.

[13:03] Bill Digneit: It's just this unique, like you can be in the middle of town at a coffee shop or we have your big box stores if you need them, but then you take a 10 to 15 minute drive and you're either at the ski hill or you're climbing a mountain or you're in the middle of the woods, taking a really beautiful hike or cross country skiing or summer sports. Or it's just, it's really serene. I left Marquette. I never thought that I was coming back. I loved it. And you get, I call it Marquette-itis. You get hooked. So you love Northern, but then the community is amazing. And that's also the best part about Northern is our community loves us and comes to our shows, but also the community takes care of each other.

And so when you're in campus or off campus, the students that they're going to, people are going to come up and ask them questions and say, how are you liking living in Marquette? And I think that's really amazing to find in that college experience and feeling like this is my second home while you'll hear a lot of students graduating, like it's hard leaving my second home. And that's pretty exciting to have that opportunity for our students to experience.

[14:11] Bill Digneit: I do love that you use the phrase Midwestern nice though. I will say that's like in, on the East coast, that's what we say when we're saying Midwesterners that aren't actually nice. That's like the Southern nice of like, where people say like, oh, bless your heart, Midwestern. And we did a whole play about, they were like, but they're actually not actually nice, they're nice, but when they're being Midwestern nice, that's the secret undercutting knife down a different rabbit hole though. I'm excited to go down. I want to go down a tech theater rabbit hole, but first, can we talk a little bit about the performance curriculum? So I'd love to hear, especially for the actors and MTs, what does that four years look like? You know, most of our listeners are going to be either actors or MTs that probably musical theater should in some way. How does that look in terms of the four years of training they're going to get?

[14:53] Bill Digneit: So we do 15 shows a year in our season, four to five fully produced musicals a year. I'm not counting showcases or any of the other crazy things. One of the things, and if you've heard before, we talk about endless opportunities. We guarantee that all freshmen are in a show in their first year on stage performing in one of our main stages. And honestly, every one of our performance students this year is in a show and pretty much every year we keep adding shows. So a student auditions, right at the PUA's or any one of these great events, we connect with them. They're going to connect with Paul Truckee, who's our head of our BFA MT, or Jimmy Ludwig, who's the head of our BFA acting program. They take cohorts of 20 each.

So that's 40 coming in for that, as well as we do have our BA performance led by Kristen Ludwig, where many of our students come in and they're going to do auditions. We actually audition our first three shows in April. So students that have committed to the BFA's incoming freshmen will audition then. We honestly cast some of those freshmen in our fall, one of our fall musicals, if they're not in the showcase, which is exciting. And they're going to come in and they have an eight semester curriculum. They're going to take private voice lessons each week, which is included in our tuition. We have dedicated music faculty in our department. So we have Donna Porter, who's the head of voice for musical theater in our program, which is fantastic to have, along with all of our other voice teachers.

[16:18] Bill Digneit: You're going to take a hardcore dance approach, but we meet you where you're at. Jill Grunstrom, who's the head of our dance program, does placement. And so you might be, you might be a wonderful mover, but you're going to be in maybe that either beginning dance or absolute beginner dance where we're going to get you at the bar. You're going to learn jazz, tap, et cetera. Or maybe you've been dancing your face off your entire life. We're going to make sure you're placed where you need to be. And then in the acting proficiencies or the singing proficiencies when it comes to our MT classes or acting classes, they're going to come in and it is a ton of training. It's a program of practice. So you're going to be taking all your different studios and you're going to be performing and working in those different groups with Paul and Jimmy.

We've worked in your degree map that they're going to take over those four years to really space out the required classes through some of your sciences or your lectures to make sure it's not all just at once happening. And we're going to make sure that through those lectures and all those experiences that you're having, it's not overloading.

[17:35] Bill Digneit: One of the things that's different about our program is I really love the idea of the conservatory model where sometimes, hey, we're shutting down class and we're all going to do the show. So we, but we're for your public institution. Regional comprehensive is a term that you might hear. We have changed where a lot of our hundred level or in 200 levels. So those intro first hundred level acting classes, 200 level acting classes, singing classes, et cetera, stage combat. They're actually eight week courses. So they're half semester. And so your first half of your semester is going to be a little more front loaded. But then as you're leading into, okay, I have the artistic part of my life that's happening.

You're going to be getting into the, we know how tech week goes. We know how performances, we do eight shows a week. All of our shows are two week runs at least. Those classes fall off as you're getting into production. So then you can lend yourself over with this more time that's going to become available to the artistic process and enjoy that a bit more and not just be the, oh, I'm so stressed. I'm sure many of the students that are listening or parents are listening. They're like, I know exactly what you're talking about.

[18:44] Charlie Murphy: That's also interesting. You guys do eight shows a week. That means you're doing a, you're taking Mondays off. Are you doing like a—

[18:50] Bill Digneit: No, no, no, no, sorry. Two, eight shows over two weeks. So that makes more sense. I was like, that's actually really unusual for college. That would be, yeah, that'd be seen the Wednesday matinee. Yeah, we do. We do get a lot of people that come to the matinees. Um, cause we're kind of that big regional up here. Right. Cause there's not a lot of big theater. There's no major regional up here. So we have people that drive three hours to come see our shows. So that's very exciting, but, um, yeah, we, uh, what's nice is running that second week of shows and making sure we do that as they get to put it to bed. They get to understand what that is having to come back and be like, okay, I got to do this again.

[19:23] Bill Digneit: Right. Um, and while we're on the academics, I love that. And it's interesting model of the eight weeks. Um, and especially as that pairs with the show, I think it's really makes a lot of sense. But how much academics, if you were to sort of give a percentage or, or you can tell me, check me out credits, but how much academics am I getting outside of the BFA as part of my, my NMU degree versus how much artistic, if I'm an actor?

[19:42] Bill Digneit: So there's going to be the 32 to 40 credits of what we'll call general education. Northern does not require minors. Um, so you, it takes 120 credits to graduate. So really you're looking at one third of that gen ed, a little less, depending on what you're coming in with. And then mostly two thirds of it is going to be theater dance. Um, and then you have room for electives. So this is where Northern really tries to support students and you're more than something of just an actor or an MT. You are creative. So some of our students really focus on film or they get into media production or broadcasting, or they have a student that's like, I'm a performance artist, so they want to, they can do musical theater, but they're also doing pottery because they're like, I want to do some crazy stuff.

Um, so we really try to leverage to make sure they're going to figure out who they are as their unique storytelling person, uh, and leverage those electives to really make sure they're coming out, um, prepared.

[20:43] Bill Digneit: I love it. And you said they don't require minors. How many of your students choose to get a minor and do any of your students choose to get double majors?

[20:49] Bill Digneit: Oh yeah. Lots of students get minors. They either get the dance minor or like if they're, uh, and many students double major. So we'll have BFA acting and dance or BFA musical theater and the BA dance program that definitely happens a lot. Or we do have students that are like, I also want to get a degree in communications or business or, uh, totally great. We have lots of students. You'd be surprised how great an MT student is at pre-law. So we've had a couple of pre-law students that, um, have graduated that are getting accepted into MFA or law programs or getting that as well as we have a lot of pre-med and pre-vet, um, students as well. So, uh, again, we're the right size institution where we're big enough to have everything, but small enough to where we can build these kinds of couture opportunities to make sure that it can work.

[21:37] Bill Digneit: So a student came in and was like, I, I'm going to be a varsity cheerleader. That takes a lot of time. How can I also be a BFA musical theater student? I was like, that's an exciting problem for me to navigate with you. And so you can have a unique journey. And so we're excited to tackle those things and they're doing a great job. And, uh, it was awesome. And that honestly led us to a great partnership of our MT and dance students actually performed at the halftime show with the marching band for, uh, some of the football games and teaching, hey, if you ever go to any major sporting events, they hire lots of entertainment professionals to get out there and do their thing. And it's pretty exciting. So I think that's the truth.

[22:15] Charlie Murphy: All right. Well, what a perfect segue into talking a little bit about interaction between disciplines. So I'd love to hear, you know, between the acting and MT, we've talked before about some of that permeability, how that's possible, but then especially, uh, I'm coming from the tech world and we'll talk a bit about tech specifically. How do you find that permeability? If you're a musical theater major, who's interested in lighting design or costume design or something, an element of tech.

[22:38] Bill Digneit: Exactly. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So first thing I'll say is, um, I don't, uh, different schools run different, uh, casting processes. We do not have a hierarchical, uh, casting. It doesn't mean like if I'm BFA MT, I get priority in being cast into a show. So if you're a BA performance major, a BFA acting, a BFA musical theater, when you go into the casting room, it's the real world, baby. Uh, who the best person for the show is the best person for the show, and that's what it's going to be. Now we have opportunity. We make sure everyone's getting opportunity to be in a show, but it doesn't mean because you're a BFA musical theater student that you're going to get the lead because you're a senior. You might get that lead as a freshman, right? Because you deserve it. That's where the talent needs to be. And that's what the show is. And we're, we're teaching you in a, um, a great way.

[23:25] Bill Digneit: Um, so when it comes to which, uh, leveraging into, we believe in endless opportunities and everybody is still discovering who they are, right? You think this is who I am at this moment and coming to Northern and, uh, and to a theater program like ours, it's about discovery. If you're not, if you haven't discovered new things over those four years about who you are and who you're going to be, um, we're not doing our job. Right. Yep. Um, so, uh, a great example of how we're willing to let people explore either on the tech side and or performance side. Um, we had a student, uh, that was like, I'm really interested, a BFA tech student, but is really interested, uh, in, in the performative nature and said, I think, I think I want to play in the pit on a show and they're like, I play bass guitar and I was like, cool.

Well, Jesus Christ superstars coming up. Uh, we need a bass guitarist in the pit. They played in the pit and like, this was great. I think I, I think I want to audition for a show. Okay. Audition get, get ready. And they auditioned and they were actually one of the princes and are into the woods this fall, uh, that we just did.

[24:27] Bill Digneit: And now there'll be the lighting designer for nine to five, the musical in the spring. Um, and on the other side of that, we've had a dance major that was like, I'm really into the idea of what this lighting is and I need to be able to speak this cause I want to be a choreographer as well as a performer. And so they're like, can I take the lighting class? Absolutely. Uh, could I come and assist and learn how to do some programming? Absolutely. And then they ended up in their senior capstone for their dance piece, lighting, designing their own piece that they're also in and that they choreographed. Um, so they're filming it and then running back to the board, making changes, getting on stage and doing that.

Um, we've had many actors and performance students and we encourage this at Northern. You're more than one thing. The industry is going to require you to be more than one thing to make sure you have multiple avenues for revenue generation. We want to make sure that you are paying your rent, putting money in that 401k health insurance is all paid up. So we need to make sure that you can work at any point. So we, we strongly encourage our students, um, to seek jobs in all of our shops. So we hire students to work in paints, props, costumes, box office, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Um, uh, to do that as well as discover what you might be good at. So we had a student that is, um, doing great out there right now and was a wonderful MT student, but was like, you know, I really like drawing.

And I was like, well, have you tried scene painting? And then they honestly were our scenic charge in the shop. So they were painting the shows, but then singing their face off as the lead in, in them. Um, so really trying to give them those tools and those skills.

[26:07] Bill Digneit: Sometimes actors get pushed into like box office or stage management, which I'm not saying that's like, that's great. And we have lots of students to do that, but we want to make sure you are going to be there because I'd much rather have you working in the room where the magic's happening. Maybe it's not singing, but you're in the theater, you're in the shop doing that. Cause it's more, you're going to get discovered in a, in a better way by being in the room versus being a barista somewhere or a bartender. Right. Not saying don't do those things. Yeah, we love them. I'm not saying I own a bar. I hire lots of bartenders, but I'm learning that production or, Hey, I can go pick up four days of a gig work here.

Cause that's how you get discovered too. Cause then you're building those relationships. You're, you're networking, you're, and this person goes, Oh wow. So that young dancer, musical theater student that was also a lighting designer got her first gig doing lighting, but it's sitting in there and someone goes, Oh, we need another person. And she, the teacher goes, well, have you talked to Megan? She's great. And they had her sing and she goes, so she's now, and it led that way. So we've got to embrace that squiggly path of how you're going to get to success in life and stop putting those preconceived notions and blinders of like, this is what I must be from day one.

[27:22] Charlie Murphy: Totally makes sense. And I love that description of all the different, sort of multi-hyphenate options. What about the student who does come in? Let's just take a little dive down the rabbit hole of the student who knows they want to be a tech major, a design and tech major. You know, most of our listeners will know they have at least some interest in acting musical theater, but we definitely do have students who say, Hey, I think I would look at maybe some programs just for tech and some programs for MT. They're not totally sure what that's going to look like. What does a tech major look like? And, you know, even hearing about the different aspects of theater, you know, I remember this at Carnegie Mellon, when I went to school, there was, we had design and tech majors.

And it's very interesting, the sort of broad scale that, you know, the difference between a costume designer and a lighting designer and a sound designer. And some of the, you go, those are, they're all in the theater world, but they're all kind of different skills. How much is it exploration versus if you come in knowing, I think I'm really interested in costume design. How much costume design are you getting? Basically what does that degree look like as your specialty?

[28:20] Bill Digneit: Yeah, it's a great question. So, um, with our BFA theater technology and design program, uh, students that come into that program and that cohort is not limited. So some years it might be 20 kids. Some of my years, it might be 25. Um, uh, on the tech side, honestly, 15 shows a year. So like we need a lot of people. Um, uh, so plenty of opportunity on that side. Um, so someone that's coming in and says, you know, I'm a lighting designer or I'm a sound designer or I'm costumes just in the way we talk about, like, I'm a musical theater person acting. My job is to take those horse blinders off and see all the things that you can be and all the skills that you're going to do. So when you come in the academic side of things, you're going to come in and you are going to take fundamentals of design.

You are going to take all of the 100 and 200 levels of all of the disciplines to make sure that you're ready to go because you need to know how to work interdisciplinary, um, with all of these people because the sound person needs to know how to talk to the customer cause how we're going to sell that mic packet. The customer needs to talk to the lighting designer because, Hey, I'm thinking of using this yellow or green fabric and or are you using any yellow or green gel? Like all the scenically, all of those things. So we make sure that you have a really good baseline knowledge and honestly our acting students all take stage craft and makeup. Um, and all of our tech students take acting classes, um, just to make sure that they know how to talk to each other and have that shared understanding.

But a tech student that comes in is going to start picking their focus. So there'll be a jack of all trades, but a master of a couple. Um, so some students will be like, I'm really into lighting and projections or I'm interested in sound or I want to be a technical director. They're then going to take their intermediate and advanced classes where they're going to really spend 16 weeks doing all of these intense dives into the engineering of sound or I'm going to work on scenic properties or CNC or welding or all the different technical aspects and really build their portfolios and get ready to go over those four semesters. Um, uh, obviously many of our tech students are working in the shops, leading crews, um, being shop managers.

So they're getting those hands on applied experiences on the shows, but also working day to day and generating some revenue from that, which is exciting. Um, but yeah, it's, it's a, it's a really hands on program. Our students build everything. They're designing everything. Our faculty, we always say we're here for health and safety and guidance. Our job, I know how to sound design. I know how to do these things. My job is to give the student the opportunity. That's who we're there to serve. Um, and make sure that they can have the opportunity to explore and also fail. I know this is a hard word for people to hear sometimes of like, I hope your student comes to Northern and fails, uh, and learn some things from those failures and fails forward.

And we're going to figure out what went wrong, where was okay. And get them prepared. So when they get out of the bubble of higher ed into the real world, that they're ready. So then, so that they know how to take it on. Um, but in the tech world, yeah. I mean, lighting design, scenic, it's all students. It's a, as I'm here at a conference and right now, some of my students are all on, uh, uh, tech calls right now for their different projects they're designing. And I'm just like, okay, you're doing it. You're D it's great. It's really exciting.

[31:40] Charlie Murphy: Oh, I love it. What a great parlay into, I'd love to hear about the launch into the business, both from an acting or an MT from the performer perspective. And then also, yeah. How does somebody launch into the business from a tech perspective in terms of getting jobs and where, where you would start off first level before those next steps?

[31:55] Bill Digneit: Yeah. Yeah. So we, we definitely are talking, um, uh, kind of two phases, both on the performance side and on the tech side. Um, phase one is while they're in school. So that sophomore year, we're making sure that their portfolio, their resume, their headshot, their websites, either on the performance or tech side, they're ready. And we're leveraging to get them to auditions, to interviews, regional, um, technical interviews, et cetera, to get them into summer stocks. So we need to send students out to be working in summer. Um, between those, those sophomore to junior and that junior to senior year, they got to get out there working. Even if it's a performative summer camp or those things, they've got to get those leadership experiences.

They've got to get that. I'm on my own. I'm making money. I understand what this is and building those networks. Um, and we support students through classes to make sure that they're ready. They have a jury process and all the BFA programs and the BA programs to make sure that those materials are ready. They're getting guidance. They know how to do these types of things. Um, and then the more important, I guess that next launch, right? So on our trajectory of success that you're going to experience at Northern, so you're going to come, we're going to, you're going to get here, you're going to launch a lift often to your higher education experience. It doesn't end there. Really. We always measure our success if we did a good job with you as the four years post-graduation, is that more successful for you as a student because you came in or is that better?

So on our performance side, um, the senior showcase model obviously is there. So we have a senior showcase on campus. We build a show. Our technical students participate in this as well. Um, but for our performance students, we have a senior showcase, but we do not go to New York. Um, our senior showcase is a bit different. Um, in, uh, if you've never been to Michigan, uh, one of the gems of Michigan is an Island called Mackinac Island. Um, it's in between our two peninsulas and the streets of Mackinac. I think there's maybe the photo I'm referencing that I saw that was, yes, yes. Uh, the, and we actually go to Mackinac Island for four nights, um, five days. And we, instead of getting sometimes the assistant to the person that you invited to come to watch your showcase, we fly all the people in.

So I'm only buying the plane ticket for the casting director or the agent. I'm not buying for the assistant. So, uh, and if you've never been to Mackinac Island, it's beautiful. Watch the movie somewhere in time with Christopher Reeves. That's a, that's a famous thing there. Um, uh, the Island's a little bit different. Uh, you have to take a ferry to get there and there's also no cars. Uh, the only thing you have is horses and bicycles. Uh, so carriages. Um, so our showcase, we trap, uh, all of these wonderful professionals on an Island, uh, with all of our students for basically a week. And we have a showcase performance on the Island. Um, but we eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner with these professionals and build relationships, uh, do workshops, have understanding so that they can get out there and that they're ready to go.

We also do a New York field studies and there's a, I call it the big Apple meetup and we bring all of those people out there too. And they're going to get stuff. We're bringing in from cruise lines to voice acting, to film, to musical theater, all of that. And our students are studying all of those things. It's not just musical theater. We, they're doing film, they're doing voice acting, et cetera. If they don't sign them, they don't get to leave the Island. Is that what you're telling me? They don't get the ferry back.

[35:15] Charlie Murphy: That's the rule.

[35:16] Bill Digneit: The you, you understand what I know. Um, yeah, we, we, yeah. And it's great because then there's some shared experience, right? Cause just knowing that you're talented is, is amazing. But, uh, anybody that's in this industry, I think will tell you, talent gets you far, um, strong relationships and people liking working with you will get you way farther than your talent. Um, uh, and so on the technical side, we do some similar things. Our, our, our seniors build, uh, showcase tables. If you've ever heard of ERDAs United regional theater, uh, auditions that happen, um, uh, they build tables like an ERDA table on the design side. So it's going to showcase their portfolios and all the crazy things that they've done and what they're amazing at.

Um, but then we also take them to what's called live design international, which I'm the production manager of. And they come out here and have these really crazy intense industry experiences with the who's who of the industry. And we get them there. And, um, I have 12 students here right now. I'm, I'm coming from Las Vegas right now. It's in December. And then we have USITT, um, United States Institute of Theater Technology, um, that happens around, uh, the country, uh, in March and our students will go there. And then technical interviews. We have a really extremely high placement rate in our technical side. Our performance students are doing great too. Um, uh, but so there's a little earlier.

So the technical students don't go to the Island. Um, that's the performance side. The technical students have a different thing, but there's a shared experience happening in that sophomore, junior year of getting into summer stocks. But then there's a little bit of diverting, um, to getting them, you get a bachelor party out of the way that you get to go to a fancy Island or go to Vegas. That sounds great to me.

[37:05] Charlie Murphy: Yeah. You know, I, I, uh, in my life I've, I, I do plan a party and I just, uh, that, that networking and teaching them the soft skills, um, is really important. And I, I, this sounds crazy, but like with the whole COVID and all of that, I think it, it's something that really we have to focus on, um, with the young people of today, uh, to make sure they know how to give a handshake and say hello and look someone in the eye and teach some of those things. So we really are purposeful in the way that we're creating those opportunities so they can be successful the rest of their lives.

[37:26] Bill Digneit: Um, you mentioned earlier that, you know, this Northern Michigan is not a school that, uh, a single high school is going to send a bunch of people to, how does it work in terms of how many students come from the Michigan area or the Midwest versus you mentioned from all over the country at these different regional auditions, especially when you talk about performance students, how many come from where, or where do they all come from? And then I'd love to kind of hear where do they end up? Do most end up in New York? Do most end up in Chicago, LA? How does it sort of, how do you come in and how do you disperse?

[38:00] Bill Digneit: So coming in, um, if you've seen us, we have students from Alaska, California, Texas, Florida, Tennessee, Virginia, Idaho, all over New York, New Jersey, uh, Maine, Connecticut. Um, we have students from all over the country. Um, we recruit at a, um, national level, um, making sure that we're all over. So we have a lot of Michigan students. Um, but if you took all the rest of the States, there's huge populations from not just the Midwest, but, um, all over the country, um, which makes it a really exciting place, um, to help, uh, tell more diverse stories to make sure that as we're learning, cause the best part of about a theater program, in my opinion is learning from your peers and that peer education and the different stories of, Oh, how did you grow up or where are you from and learning all of those things makes you a better human being, which is really what we're in the business of doing is I tell parents and I'll tell the students, my job is yes, to make you a great musical theater, actor, technical person.

But my real job, the thing that I'm excited is to help you be the best human being. And the best way to do that is to have a lot of different perspectives. So we recruit on that large level. And then our students right now, uh, I would say there's a huge contingent that goes to New York. Like that's where they want to go. Um, we're definitely telling them to make.

[39:41] Bill Digneit: We're a themed entertainment. We have a ton of kids in Orlando and Anaheim right now. I might have a friend that's playing a, you know, a Minnie Mouse or, right? We have some friends that are working for, down in there and you might meet this friend and they might know one of our friends that went to Northern if you get my drift there. So yeah, we have a lot of students that are working down in the themed entertainment and then quite a few students are heading into the cruise ship world right now. The entertainment lineup that's going into all the different cruise lines out there is just getting better and better and they're really pushing that kind of boundary. And it's a great way to make a ton of money and see the world and when you're young, it's really easy to do.

[40:27] Bill Digneit: Let's talk a little bit about cost. So our crack research team says it's about 21,000 for non-residents and 15,000 in-state. Does that sound right for tuition on your end?

[40:38] Bill Digneit: It's a little less than that on the in-state. I think it's 11 and change and then housing. So right now, housing is around like 20 with housing. For in-state, it's like 22. For out-of-state, it's like 33 with housing. But some great things that we have going on at Northern Michigan University is the Wildcat Merit Scholarship. So if you're out-of-state and you have a 4.0, you're going to get a scholarship that's going to bring you basically to in-state tuition for your repeating as long as you stay in good academic standing. Those scholarships start at a 3.0 or 2.75 all the way up to a 4.0 ranging from $1,000 all the way up to like $9,000 a year. And that's just your GPA. Whatever GPA that you start the first day of Northern with.

We don't require any test scores or anything like that. That's not counting any of the departmental scholarships that we'd love to offer students and do as well as any donor funded and it's all stackable. So the goal is to make it as affordable as possible. We're the second lowest tuition rate in the state of Michigan. So we're built on the idea that college is an opportunity everyone should have if they choose. And we want to keep it as affordable as possible.

[41:55] Bill Digneit: Some other good things about our tuition and things that are included, obviously voice lessons are included. There's no extra fees for that. There's no extra fees for your dance classes or anything like that. But we include a MacBook Pro included in your tuition when you come to Northern. We're a laptop campus. So you don't have to worry about buying that laptop, any of the software, all that. It's all covered within your tuition and you get that. So that's a really nice thing. And just really making sure that it's an affordable opportunity. We do have a two year housing requirement. So students do need to live in the dorms for two years. But that really is a benefit. You don't have to pay summer rent. As well as we're not a commuter campus. Students stay here, they live here. You're building that sense of community. So that's an exciting thing. And then lots of our students move off those junior, senior years.

[42:51] Bill Digneit: All right, so that's great. Let's take a short break. And on the back end, we're gonna talk a little bit about the audition admission process for NMU.

[42:58] Bill Digneit: Well, we are back with Bill Digneit from Northern Michigan University. And we're gonna talk a little bit about the audition and the admission process. So I'd love to first start off. We mentioned some of these different regional places. Where are all the places I have the opportunity to audition? Let's maybe focus especially on the performers. If I wanna be seen by you or by Northern Michigan, what are all the different ways I can be seen from videos to regional auditions to on-campus auditions? How does that all work?

[43:24] Bill Digneit: Exactly, yep. So being seen, getting out there, making sure that we shake hands, say hello, and we understand this exciting four-year relationship. Because as much as I'm interviewing them, y'all are interviewing us. It's who do you wanna be locked in this theater with for the next four years making art? On an island without cars, my God. Hey, it's fun. They have lots of fudge on there. It's really good.

[43:45] Bill Digneit: I believe you. I'm gonna have to get you out there. So we go to lots of regional auditions. So like Pittsburgh Unifieds. We were just at Marca's, Texas Thespians, Virginia Thespians, Michigan Thespians, Wisconsin, all these different thespian festivals. We'll be at Chicago Unifieds and some of these other auditions that are happening. So if you see us there, our institution, that is definitely your pre-screen audition of yes, we watched this, we're interested, let's connect.

[44:19] Bill Digneit: You also, you're like, I couldn't make it to any of those things. I wanna apply to Northern. We use Get Accepted. And they, if you go on our website under auditions for the program, you can just upload your materials. If you've already auditioned at, say you were at Pittsburgh Unifieds or Marca's and we got your information, you don't need to do that because we've already seen you. So that's the first kind of major step.

[44:45] Bill Digneit: Then you need to apply to Northern. We have open enrollment. We are on the common app. Also, there's no fee to apply. So if you want to apply to Northern Michigan University, you absolutely should. It's rolling enrollment. So within three weeks, you'll know if you get admitted and accepted and you're excited. They also mail you this wonderful knit NMU hat from admissions, it's really nice.

[45:10] Charlie Murphy: I'm gonna have to get a free hat.

[45:11] Bill Digneit: Yeah, yeah, there you go, get a free hat. I think I can take care of you on one of those. So you're gonna get a letter from us that'll say you need to audition. If you've already auditioned, you don't need to be stressed out that you're like, oh, I have to audition again. And then the really next big step is that relationship building. As you're building a cohort, it's really important to have a relationship with the faculty member you're gonna study with. And sometimes this gets more emphasized in the graduate school portion of it, but we really try to take that time as you're coming far away for most of you to Marquette, Michigan. We wanna make sure that you trust who you're gonna spend the next four years learning from and doing that.

[46:01] Bill Digneit: So you'll connect with either Paul and the MT program, Jimmy from the acting program, or Kristen in the BA performance program, or Jill in the dance program, et cetera. And we're gonna connect you with them and we're gonna start talking. Because as much as we offer you the opportunity, you also need to say that you wanna come. So understanding that relationship, we connect them with current students. So a lot of students, prospective students, are like, I'd love to talk to someone that moved from New York to Marquette. What is that like? Or moved from Texas, right? Houston, Texas. I've never seen snow before. I always do enjoy the first snow at Northern when all the freshmen that have never seen snow before are like, this is amazing! And I'm like, oh, I'm glad. I am glad you like it. We do get a bit of snow.

[46:33] Bill Digneit: So then that relationship really comes down to, okay, Paul or Jimmy or Jill or Kristen or whoever's gonna offer, saying we'd love for you to come. Here's a spot in the program. And then that, like most programs, that end of February, March is really where that deadline is to be considered for departmental scholarships. We need you to commit. We need to, you either need to take your spot or not because there is a waiting list. So we get those offers out there.

[46:59] Bill Digneit: And then once you've committed, we're gonna say, okay, make sure you get registered for orientation because we need, depending on when you're coming, we have a lot going on. We try to get our students to register for either the first or second orientation or the last one because we also have shows going on in the summer. So we want you to come see a show while you're up for orientation.

[47:19] Bill Digneit: And then you're gonna audition if you're on the performance side of things or if you're on the technical side of things, you're going to interview to get what's my first assistant job or where am I gonna be running crew or doing those types of things. And then the kind of different thing that we do for all of our onboarding, our freshmen, is we run what we call the theater bootcamp, theater and dance bootcamp.

[47:41] Bill Digneit: And so we bring all of our students in a week before the traditional move-in date. And we actually, this is in August, yep. So taking you through the whole thing here, sorry. And you're gonna come in and we're gonna build some community building. You're gonna get trained. You're gonna get safety trained. You're gonna start rehearsing for whatever your first show is that week. You're gonna start dancing. And you get to do this without the pressure of having that first syllabi and you're that intro to biology class or whatever, right? It's just about team building, having fun. We have an epic lip sync battle competition. And the upperclassmen are also participating in this. Our freshmen are for sure coming and there's a lot of the upperclassmen and participating and really building that sense of community so you know where your people are.

[48:29] Bill Digneit: So that first week of class, you're ready to go and you're like, okay, this is where I wanna be. And I'm really understanding that.

[48:36] Charlie Murphy: I wanna work backward with two questions. You mentioned already the auditions in April. Now, are those happening virtually? So if I am from New York, am I flying to Marquette to do my audition for my freshman year?

[48:48] Bill Digneit: Yeah, yeah, exactly. So no, it's all gonna be virtual. You're gonna send in video. We'll send you the sides or whatever you need to do. Just like the rest of the business doing that, we're able to assess talent and connect. And yeah, so four freshmen were different roles within Into the Woods this past fall and it was all virtual. And so yeah, even dance callbacks, we'll send you, hey, here's what we need you to do. And we're able to cast and make sure that those opportunities are there. But yeah, no, technology is great. We're a very technology-forward campus. We're also an Adobe Creative Campus, so we leverage those tools as well.

[49:27] Bill Digneit: And so yeah, all virtual.

[49:30] Charlie Murphy: I'll make sense of that. I just wanna unpack a little bit of it. You mentioned, and this may be some of the language that is just about what is the university and application, you mentioned if I see you at one of these auditions, including something like Chicago Unifieds, you're considering that like a pre-screen or you're saying at that audition? And then what is, I understand the idea of relationship building, but it's not necessarily that I'm coming in and auditioning again. What is that, can you talk me through that process of say I did a walk-in at Chicago?

[49:44] Bill Digneit: So I don't know you well and how do we build that relationship?

[49:59] Bill Digneit: Yeah, so say you do a walk-in and you come and you just sing at Unifieds for us, right? And we're like, wow, you were great. We're gonna send you an email saying we're interested, you should apply, let's have that. We feel that you have the tools necessary to be successful within our program. Then it's really, we'd like to get you to do a campus visit just so you can see campus. If you can't, I can tell you that Jimmy, Paul, myself, very many times have gotten on an iPad and walked you around campus.

[50:30] Bill Digneit: Yeah, to get a personal virtual tour.

[50:31] Bill Digneit: Yeah, personal virtual tour to make sure that you're gonna know what's going on and what you're in for. And yeah, so that's really where that is. We don't have this where you've auditioned, okay, we got you through this first round, now we're gonna make you audition again. We don't do that. The second part of it is gonna be more of a relationship building, meaning maybe there's an interview. If you haven't met the whole faculty, you're meeting someone else, that kind of thing.

[50:55] Bill Digneit: Yeah, you're gonna meet more faculty, you're gonna do that. And sometimes the student really tells us like, no, I've done my research, I really wanna be here, that's great. We are a different choice. Because it is more rural, the type of student that wants to come, that is where more of those kind of soft-sided conversations are happening about what are your goals and how are we gonna make sure that you're gonna find success here. Because if you have lived in Texas and you're coming to Northern Michigan University and you've never dealt with snow, we wanna make sure that you understand there will be days where you're gonna get eight inches of snow in a day and we will still have school and rehearsal and the world doesn't end. So how do you feel about getting a nice coat and some boots?

[51:41] Bill Digneit: So understanding that side of it. And then, yeah, as our program's been growing over the last, I've been there nine years, going into 10 years here. This has definitely been one of the things that we, our process has kind of evolved a little bit, but we've always wanted to stay true to that relationships. Because your network's your network, right? And all of our performance faculty still work or still singing. They go to summer stocks in the summer performing or New York gigs and et cetera. And so we wanna make sure that we're able to help launch that and get that out there.

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[1:05:18] Charlie Murphy: Welcome back to Mapping The College Audition. I’m your host, Charlie Murphy, and today we’re diving deep into Northern Michigan University with the Department Head and Professor of Theatre & Dance, Bill Digneit. Bill, thank you for joining us today.

[1:06:48] Bill Digneit: Thank you for having me, Charlie. It’s a pleasure to be here.

[1:07:18] Charlie Murphy: So, let’s start with the basics. What makes Northern Michigan University a unique place for students pursuing theater and dance?

[1:09:18] Bill Digneit: NMU is truly a place for adventurers. We encourage students to explore their creativity and take risks in their artistic journeys. The environment here fosters a sense of community and collaboration, which is essential for growth in the performing arts.

[1:09:48] Charlie Murphy: That sounds fantastic. How do you think students can find their best fit when it comes to choosing a school?

[1:10:18] Bill Digneit: I believe that finding the right school becomes clear through auditions and conversations with current students. It’s important for prospective students to engage with the community and get a feel for the culture and values of the program.

[1:10:48] Charlie Murphy: Absolutely. What are some of the benefits and trade-offs of curricular freedom that students might experience at NMU?

[1:11:18] Bill Digneit: Curricular freedom allows students to tailor their education to their interests and career goals. However, it also requires a level of self-discipline and initiative. Students must be proactive in seeking out opportunities and creating their own paths.

[1:11:48] Charlie Murphy: That makes a lot of sense. Can you talk about the entrepreneurial mindset you encourage in your students?

[1:12:18] Bill Digneit: We emphasize an entrepreneurial mindset by encouraging students to think creatively about their careers. From unique showcases to developing transferable skills within their BFA programs, we model the creative problem-solving that artists need today.

[1:12:48] Charlie Murphy: That’s such an important aspect of modern theater education. How do you see this mindset benefiting students after they graduate?

[1:13:18] Bill Digneit: Graduates who possess an entrepreneurial mindset are better equipped to navigate the challenges of the industry. They are adaptable, resourceful, and able to create their own opportunities, which is crucial in today’s competitive landscape.

[1:13:48] Charlie Murphy: It sounds like NMU is preparing students not just for their first job, but for a sustainable career in the arts.

[1:14:18] Bill Digneit: Exactly. We want our students to leave with the skills and confidence to forge their own paths, whether that means performing, teaching, or creating their own projects.

[1:14:48] Charlie Murphy: That’s inspiring. For students considering NMU, what advice would you give them as they prepare for auditions?

[1:15:18] Bill Digneit: My advice would be to be authentic. Bring your true self to the audition and showcase your unique talents. We’re looking for individuals who are passionate and willing to take risks.

[1:15:20] Charlie Murphy: Great advice, Bill. Thank you for sharing your insights with us today.

[1:15:22] Bill Digneit: Thank you for having me, Charlie. It’s been a pleasure.

[1:15:24] Charlie Murphy: And to our listeners, if you have any questions about the college audition process, feel free to reach out at mailbag@mappingthecollegeaudition.com. If you’re interested in working with MTCA for help with your individualized preparation for your college audition journey, please check us out at mtca.com.

[1:15:26] Bill Digneit: Thank you, everyone!

[1:15:28] Charlie Murphy: Until next time, keep exploring your artistic journey!