This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Brian Sedita: Hey everyone, welcome to Page to Stage.

[0:03] Mary Dina: A conversation with theater makers.

[0:04] Brian Sedita: We're your hosts.

[0:05] Mary Dina: That's Brian.

[0:06] Brian Sedita: And that's Mary.

[0:07] Mary Dina: Join us as we focus the spotlight back on the theater maker to uncover their process.

[0:12] Brian Sedita: We speak with folks in the industry that often aren't heard from.

[0:15] Mary Dina: Such as stage managers, producers, crew members, marketing professionals.

[0:19] Brian Sedita: And everything in between.

[0:20] Mary Dina: We hope you enjoy this episode.

[0:26] Germán Martínez: Hi, my name is Germán Martínez, pronouns he/they, and I'm a sound designer. Welcome.

[0:31] Brian Sedita: We, uh, you know, we go way back to, uh, college days, uh, and Mary and I and Germán were just talking about this before we started recording that we're just getting the Montclair Mafia on Page to Stage, and we're also coining that term, the Montclair Mafia of Double L.

[0:50] Mary Dina: Theater folks taking over the New York theater scene.

[0:53] Germán Martínez: The roundup.

[0:54] Mary Dina: I really love to see everyone in, and it's, it makes me just feel so happy that I'm like, oh, somebody from home.

[0:59] Germán Martínez: Uh, it does feel like home, you know.

[1:01] Mary Dina: It's true.

[1:02] Germán Martínez: It's so true.

[1:03] Mary Dina: And you've been so busy lately. Do you want to tell everybody what you're currently working on?

[1:08] Germán Martínez: Absolutely. Uh, I've been, I've been definitely working for sure. I gotta keep the lights on. Uh, well, today I'm opening up, uh, my off-Broadway debut, official off-Broadway debut, uh, MCC with the production of Soft, uh, by Danye R. Love, directed by Whitney White, and I'm currently going to be making my Broadway debut.

[1:27] Brian Sedita: Wow, quick jump.

[1:27] Germán Martínez: Uh, at the St. James with the production of Into the Woods.

[1:33] Mary Dina: Woo!

[1:34] Germán Martínez: Which just transferred from City Center, which, uh, I got a chance to see and see you afterwards, which was frigging awesome, and it's so exciting that like it's, I'm sure it's like a whirlwind.

[1:46] Mary Dina: And that whole experience was a whirlwind to even like become a part of, and we'll get into that later on.

[1:51] Germán Martínez: Oh, yeah. Crazy. It was a, I did, I just didn't expect that. I, I, for a long time I worked on a lot of shows that, uh, you know, it was hard to get any, anybody at the foot of the door and to have so much, uh, uh, eyes on this between Twitter and TikTok and, uh, like all the whole community was just raving about it that I was very overwhelmed.

[2:12] Mary Dina: But so it's nice to see this kind of support.

[2:14] Germán Martínez: And we've had a couple people from the sound world on the podcast. Uh, we've had Jess Paz, Twee McCullum, uh, two collaborators in which you've worked with before.

[2:25] Germán Martínez: Yes, uh, they are incredible. Jess, I consider a mentor. She is a powerful, powerful woman, um, just incredibly smart. And the way she approaches the process and sound is, is I'm in awe when I was in a room with her.

[2:38] Germán Martínez: And Twee, what a beacon, uh, for, uh, to build community. Uh, what a great person. I truly love Twee. Like one of the first people to, uh, give me a shot. I think we also like went on a blind date kind of like a assistant designer kind of thing, and it ended up working out.

[2:50] Germán Martínez: It ended up working out really nicely, and then we just kept, uh, uh, go working on different projects from then on. So I have a lot of love for the two of them.

[3:03] Mary Dina: I love that because I feel like with both people we've just interviewed for sound with Jess and Twee, I feel like they both have really talked about the community and talked about, you know, the networking, and I just, I mean, maybe it's just my ignorance here, but I feel like the sound community feels very small.

[3:18] Germán Martínez: I don't know if you feel the same way.

[3:20] Germán Martínez: And so I feel like everyone works with everybody, but also everyone is just like really genuinely looking out for each other, which is just so nice to see.

[3:28] Germán Martínez: It is, it is, and let me tell you, I didn't know how well I agree with, well, first, I want to agree with you and say that it is a small community, so we all, we all know who's on what show. We're all like, oh, you're over here, you're loading it with so and so, uh, you're assisting so and so-and-so person. So we all know what's going on.

[3:43] Germán Martínez: So it's really warm in that capacity, but I didn't recognize how much of a community was until the pandemic really. Um, so I'm part of this organization called, uh, TSECA, the Theatrical Sound Designer and Composers Association.

[3:55] Germán Martínez: And so that was, uh, it was a platform that was already available for quite some time, but it really kicked off when it came to the pandemic. Um, and they really, uh, jumped on to say, oh, well, everybody's at home. Let's, uh, let's do some planning.

[4:06] Germán Martínez: And the organization is gearing, uh, it has always been geared towards, uh, advancing sound design, sharing with the role for the education, um, and providing more equity and diversity and, uh, and, uh, between the field and, uh, rights all around.

[4:24] Germán Martínez: And so I really appreciate the group, but they took the opportunity during the pandemic to say, all right, well, we have a bunch of people sitting at home, let's, uh, do some masterclasses essentially.

[4:35] Germán Martínez: And it was great to talk between Jess, Lindsay Jones, Palmer Hefner, um, Nevin Steinberg, everyone did like, uh, like a video, everybody had a class, uh, Ken Goodwin, Josh Samuels, all people who I look up to and consider smart people, um, and, uh, good resources to have.

[4:54] Germán Martínez: So it's nice to be connected in that sense.

[4:56] Mary Dina: Um, I've been also had the opportunity to like meet other folks throughout, uh, uh, between the central region, between the western region.

[5:04] Mary Dina: Um, it's nice to expand network that way.

[5:07] Brian Sedita: Well, how else? I mean, aside from this association, which sounds amazing, and I wrote it down so we can put it in our show notes for our listeners.

[5:15] Brian Sedita: Um, how else are you guys networking? How else are you meeting people and kind of finding the gigs?

[5:22] Germán Martínez: Like, is there, is there another area or is there something that you're, that you've personally done that's been working really well for you?

[5:30] Germán Martínez: I wish that I could have invented the way. Uh, no, you know, you gotta do the old school, uh, it's, it's about getting into the rooms.

[5:37] Germán Martínez: Um, you show up to the calls and, and you never know who's gonna be on the call. So, uh, by that I mean I remember, I remember when I had graduated and I would take up, um, load-ins, wonder whether it be at Theater Row or load-ins at, uh, any local, any of the local theaters here, like, uh, MCC, uh, signature.

[5:58] Germán Martínez: I tried my best to get on those calls because I knew I was just gonna meet folk.

[6:02] Germán Martínez: And there's always gonna be the need for hands. There's always gonna be the need for somebody to run something.

[6:08] Germán Martínez: And you know, work ethic speaks for itself. People will recognize, um, how you show up, who you are, and would want to give you a chance.

[6:17] Germán Martínez: And so I've been so blessed by the kindness of, uh, the people around me, uh, that I show up with my full self with my hundred percent, and they go, All right, let, well, why don't you, uh, get you working for me?

[6:29] Germán Martínez: And, um, actually it's, it's funny, uh, talking to, uh, about Twee, um, we had crossed paths one time and I just didn't recognize it because, uh, I guess I was just so busy that I just didn't, I didn't bother retaining any information of who was in for that day.

[6:44] Germán Martínez: But then she had told me we were like, I think this is the first time we meet in person. She's like, No, we actually met in person before. I think you were just busy that day.

[6:51] Mary Dina: That's amazing.

[6:52] Germán Martínez: If anyone who's listening maybe doesn't live in New York or close enough to New York, do you recommend still getting involved like locally, regionally, if they have plans to jump to New York at some point in their life?

[7:05] Germán Martínez: Is it, how important do you find it to be in proximity to the city as you're, as you're growing and as you're learning?

[7:13] Germán Martínez: Like, do you think that there is a need from a networking standpoint to make sure you're building those connections in New York, even if you don't live close to it?

[7:21] Germán Martínez: Absolutely. So I, I guess I can only talk from my personal experience.

[7:24] Germán Martínez: I guess I can say I had the privilege of growing up in Jersey City.

[7:28] Germán Martínez: Uh, I was born and raised in Jersey City. I lived in, we, uh, West New York, excuse me, I lived in Union City for a long time and, um, I had, I was a 15-minute bus ride from New York.

[7:38] Germán Martínez: And so I, I still am, I currently live in Weehawkin. I'm in quick in and out.

[7:41] Germán Martínez: And so that was really important to me, uh, when I started when I was in undergrad where I, whereas a lot of folks wanted summer stock, I stayed in the city and I did whatever thing I could do, uh, whoever would hire me.

[7:43] Germán Martínez: A lot of folks left the industry, a lot of folks said, uh, theater's not sustainable right now, um, which is a current, a good conversation to have, uh, but a lot of folks left and anybody who did stick it out, um, there's kind of, but what you had talked about, like the small community, there was like maybe 10 of us who are just swapping between jobs who are like, I can't do this, can you, can you, uh, and so we're all trying to like fill in the position because, um, we're trying to recover from the pandemic and go, uh, all these shows and, and not enough folks.

[8:10] Germán Martínez: So I was just talking to a friend, uh, who was out in the central region in the Midwest and I said, listen, if you're thinking to go to coming to come into the city, now is the time.

[8:51] Germán Martínez: Um, people will put you to work. And I definitely recommend that.

[8:54] Germán Martínez: For me, I knew that the goal was always Broadway. I would always want to do that. That, that was undeniable.

[8:58] Germán Martínez: And so I knew that for me I had to get into the, into the city.

[9:03] Germán Martínez: But that's not everybody's track. Some people come to the city and figure that out and then end up taking different paths, which is also okay.

[9:10] Germán Martínez: What I would recommend is find out who the players are, find out who's doing what, who are the, what's the work that you want to do, what's the work that you want to be seeing and being part of, and then you start to like find the end that way.

[9:24] Mary Dina: And so you graduated, as we mentioned from Montclair State with a BFA in production design.

[9:29] Mary Dina: And so do you think you, you did most of your learning in the classroom or on the job?

[9:35] Mary Dina: Or would you say it's a nice even split between the two?

[9:38] Germán Martínez: Oof, I'm still doing the learning. What are you talking about?

[9:42] Germán Martínez: No, I, I, I want to say that right now I'm on the path of, uh, uh, most growth.

[9:47] Germán Martínez: And what that means is the learning doesn't stop. I'm still, uh, even now, I'm still being introduced to new software, uh, new consoles.

[9:55] Germán Martínez: Um, what I will say is the undergrad gave me a very strong base of what the standard is, uh, what to expect, uh, when you walk into a room.

[10:05] Germán Martínez: And for me, I'm a, I'm a very kinesthetic, uh, learner.

[10:09] Germán Martínez: That, that gave me all the tools I needed to, uh, to succeed.

[10:12] Germán Martínez: And so when you start to, not me, let me speak from the eye.

[10:16] Germán Martínez: When I started going out and, uh, working with other sound designers that weren't, you know, my professor, um, who's great, Scott, uh, Scott O'Brien, if you're listening to this, shout out to you.

[10:24] Germán Martínez: Um, but if I, when I started to work with other sound designers that weren't my peers, I w wasn't my professor.

[10:30] Germán Martínez: Um, I felt like it was, it was easier for me to navigate and, uh, be a little, uh, more flexible how I approach my work, uh, knowing what the job is at hand.

[10:40] Germán Martínez: And so you pick up t, uh, tips and tricks, uh, from other people around, but ultimately my foundation has meant everything for me.

[10:49] Mary Dina: Basically, I'm just curious if you wouldn't mind kind of since you've worn so many different hats on Team Sound, as we've called it in our notes here, maybe just kind of giving us a breakdown or our listeners a breakdown of like what each of those roles mean in relation to any production.

[11:05] Germán Martínez: And if you want to use any specific production that you've worked on in the past or currently, that's totally fine with us as well.

[11:11] Germán Martínez: Absolutely. I mean, does anybody still wear a hat?

[11:15] Germán Martínez: Uh, I'm glad we got it in there.

[11:19] Germán Martínez: Oh, I love company.

[11:22] Germán Martínez: Do we have the rights to say to say that? Do we have the rights?

[11:25] Germán Martínez: Uh, so, so just to reiterate, you're, uh, want me to go over all the hats worn.

[11:29] Germán Martínez: I guess they can bring like if you think of like, uh, like the organizational chart for a sound department when you're working on a production.

[11:36] Germán Martínez: So, you know, sound designer at the top, and then how does that trickle down?

[11:40] Germán Martínez: All the way down to the engineers, technicians and absolutely.

[11:43] Germán Martínez: Um, how I can think about it immediately is sound designer, of course, uh, meets the needs of the director, uh, make sure that the creative, uh, end is met.

[11:53] Germán Martínez: In order to fulfill that need, we have the associate who will act really as, uh, second in command, uh, right hand person who will do every, uh, really be a, as a backbone in the production to make all those needs melt, uh, make all those needs be met, whether that be, uh, generating paperwork, whether that be communicating, uh, notes, whether that be, uh, taking care of it, uh, of anything else that the sound designer can't directly take care of, they are really there to support the sound designer's vision.

[12:23] Germán Martínez: Um, an assistant, what I've, what I've learned, uh, because I've been in this kind of position is that an assistant is an excellent position to bring somebody in and learn.

[12:34] Germán Martínez: Um, I've been an assistant in a few places, uh, at the public.

[12:39] Germán Martínez: Um, I'm an assistant now at, uh, Into the Woods.

[12:42] Germán Martínez: Uh, again, this is my first time on Broadway, so to put me on right away is, uh, wouldn't be setting myself up for, for success.

[12:50] Germán Martínez: Um, if I'm, in my perspective.

[12:52] Germán Martínez: So an assistant really is a nice position to, uh, bring someone in to get somebody to learn the ropes, um, how it's done on that kind of caliber.

[13:00] Germán Martínez: So I think, uh, an assistant position is really valuable in that aspect.

[13:04] Germán Martínez: Now it, it's not only, uh, just to bring somebody in who, who is a little green for lack of a better word, but it's somebody else who also help out and has, uh, the particular skill sets to help out in the production.

[13:16] Germán Martínez: Um, we get our production audio, our production audio, um, another backbone when it comes to, uh, uh, the industry.

[13:23] Germán Martínez: So they're the person who is leading the crew, they're the person who is in direct communication with the associate or the sound designer, and they're the ones making it happen when it comes to like, uh, getting their hands dirty, they're the ones hanging the speaker, they're the ones, uh, making sure everything is worked to the specifications and schematics of the designer.

[13:40] Germán Martínez: Um so to me, I have always tipped my hat off to all the production audience I've worked for. Um it's been at regionals, so they're the ones who know the theater and the space and the equipment best. So I go with their expertise. And then we jump to any of the crew; in that crew might be an A1 who is oftentimes mixing a show, an A2 who is backstage. Um, and very often you get like an A3, which is just another A2. And then you have like the sound crew who just may just work for the day, who might do some notes, um, but aren't directly involved with the production. I'm fascinated by, like you said, the organizational chart of it all. Listen, it's a whole volleyball team. You can't, it does it just it takes a whole village to make it happen.

[14:29] Mary Dina: Oh, yeah, I absolutely do not doubt that at all. I'm curious, do we see all of these positions at every level? Or do we, is it obviously more, I shouldn't say obviously, but I'm sure it's more common to see all of these positions filled at a Broadway level. What about like a regional level or an off-off Broadway?

[14:47] Germán Martínez: No, that is a great question because it really depends on the resources of the institution. Um oftentimes I've had to fight to get another pair of hands on because it really comes down to like money. Can an institution really pay to have somebody there to do X amount of hours for X job? Um, and so you get into situations where you do get like an army of one person doing everything. Um for me, I guess I like working in a team. I think theater is a team sport and a team endeavor. And um I am nothing without my associate, without my assistant. Um, I feel the strongest and most supported when I have other people around me to like bounce ideas off of to make sure that I can delegate responsibilities to.

Um so that really is a luxury to have that in certain theaters. And re and some regionals, yeah, there is like the house head who takes care of the production audio, who is there supervising the equipment, how things come in, come out, and then they hire their local people to come in and load in this system. Um and they might have some like the institution might have a favorite like person who runs the show. So it really depends on like the size. Um right now at MCC, it's which more of an off Broadway space. Yeah, they do they did have a production audio, shout out to the production audios, and I did have a like a board up. So that stuff um it's kind of an unspoken thing of like it is understood that to run the show you need a certain crew.

There's like the crew to run the show, there's the crew to make the creative decisions and make that happen. Um, and I'm glad that some people take are in the know of the difference between the two because that just opens again another conversation and jar of worms about am I gonna get paid more money to run the show if I design this? Am I sticking along? You know, it's just about resources at that point. And of course, play versus musical. There's different needs there when it comes to yes. I mean, you also get your plays with music, you never know.

[16:56] Mary Dina: Exactly. You know, as we were talking about before most recently, and you're currently working on the, you know, the Broadway bound production of Into the Woods. So can you walk us through that process from your perspective and kind of like break that down for us?

[17:10] Germán Martínez: Um, you know, being that it was such a short, truncated process, what are some of the things you noticed that maybe were different from working on that versus more of a traditional process in production where you have a standard process?

[17:25] Germán Martínez: Of course. So this one was very fast. I want to like emphasize to the listeners how fast this was. Uh to get into exact, we had an eight-hour tech. That eight-hour tech, we had to do the whole what, two and a half hour show in that time. We had notes for the a four-hour note session the next day, but then we did a dress rehearsal. So it again was fast.

[17:51] Mary Dina: Is that normal for Encores?

[17:53] Germán Martínez: For Encores, yes. So the integrity of Encores is to be able to provide affordable shows. Uh the shows are often show time shows that aren't done. Uh and let me be clear, they're musicals that aren't done, and they hire a bunch of celebrities and they get them on in this truncated amount of time, and they do it for a weekend. Um now, given that this was a very unique circumstance, we did it for two weeks of performances. Um I think given the name, the fact that it was a Stephen Sondheim show, they wanted to really like give this one a little bit more TLC, um, but not enough TLC to you know have more hours of tech. But it was a crazy process. So uh I was hired, uh I was given a call by uh Scott Lair.

Scott Lair has been doing the Encore shows for about 30 years now, one of which has also transferred to Broadway, it being Chicago. And um, so he kind of like has been there, done that with Encores. Yeah, other guest designers always come in and do that, but uh at Encore, that's really like his baby for lack of a better word. So he had given me a call and said, Hey, we're kind of doing this uh this thing over at Encores, you want to be part of it. I said, sure, I'm happy to. And in that vein of path of most growth, I always wanted to learn more, and I thought it'd be a great opportunity to. So I show up, we had quiet, uh, we had some days of load in and some that was enough time to like program the QLAP file our A1 was programming the console so that she could mix the show.

So everything is really done in advance um because it's gonna be quick and fast. So uh we saw a run through we talked about some sound cues uh and then we jumped into tech the next the very next day and because they were so tight in the room because they really had the opportunity to be in communication with the lighting designer they would send videos of what staging would be like everybody was prepped in advance to kind of just plug and play and anything that needed refining would be taken care of on the fly. Um in my case we really had to give a little bit TLC for like those sound cues for like those giant footsteps because those were kind of an added event and so with uh James Ortiz and the two actors playing grabbing the boots uh we took some time to make sure we got each of those steps in and then also program those into the console.

Um that being said eight hours was just enough time to get all of that in and the other four four the next four hour day for notes was just enough to like let's clean this up. Um and then we showed so that was the first time I've ever done that for like a musical that size with celebrities and you know so on and so forth.

[20:55] Mary Dina: So that is mind blowing to me. I still think it's crazy. Would is that format something that you'd like to explore again if given the chance, or is that something that's like a one and done? You'd much prefer the like standard, more traditional like production schedule.

[21:16] Germán Martínez: I'm always for the side of like, let's sit in and bake in this event and have enough time. I mean, who doesn't like more time on this? I mean, really the integrity of the Encores production is all about the music. We're in here to present the show. It's not a fully realized production, it's about the music being presented in this like reading-esque style. Um and so I inherently understand the like why that is. Um yeah, in something like that, I can understand in for something that I do a lot of plays. I will yeah, it gives me my time of tech. I want to look at things with a careful eye and really sit and simmer with stuff.

[21:54] Mary Dina: And I actually just have another question as you were talking. So when you said that you're or you guys are programming the board prior to your very quick tech, is that something that you do once you're in the theater, or is that something you do ahead and bring it into the theater?

[22:09] Germán Martínez: Uh Encores or regular?

[22:11] Germán Martínez: Absolutely. It could that's a really good question. So uh yes, in that load-in time while scenery is doing their thing, while lights are being hung. Uh it is ideal for our A1 to take the time and program each scene, which is containing who's gonna be on stage, uh, who needs to be up, uh in a musical kind of sense, uh what am I doing with my band? And you know that that kind of refining happens with the sound designer during tech. Um, or you can also program it in advance. Uh there are a lot of softwares, uh Digico offline editor, Yamaha CL editor, uh, or just tools to use. I use these in like nomenclature, but they're just softwares to edit on the console so you can have things prepared in advance.

It's also done at the shops when people are getting ready for the shows um we'll have a day we'll we're test everything make sure everything's working and um the if when the time allows the A1 will take the opportunity to get some scenes in or at least get a base layout of like what am I looking at essentially uh the A1's gonna be living at this place for X amount of time they should be programming it to the needs of how they're gonna run whether that be making sure their DCAs just what the one through eight microphones that they're controlling are set throughout or um the layouts when you have like really big consoles where you have like three banks of layers um where are you setting your like sound designer bank so that the sound designer can come in and do tweaks on to the band or make adjustments to any of the actors. Um yeah does that answer your question?

[23:52] Mary Dina: Yeah it really it does I and I feel like I have like five more but I we'll just keep going because I need I need to it's one of those things where it's like my brain is just like going and this area this happened with Tweet and Jess too where I was just like it sound is one of those areas that genuinely I don't know much about and admittedly like I feel as like with this podcast I should know more about but I'm fascinated because sound is one of those things to me that's like not it's not tangible if that makes sense.

[24:21] Germán Martínez: So it's like it's a mystery.

[24:23] Germán Martínez: It's truly a mystery and honestly like it's so much it's uh nobody notices us unless something goes wrong unless something feeds back, unless something you know is not done the right way. Um, and so uh in general, I think it's it's all about uh us being like flies on the wall and and uh yeah, flies on the wall and absorbing the information and just like working quickly and in advance so that no one has to wait for us. Um that's that's my general experience. Well, when whether it be working on a musical or on a play, uh we want to be working in advance and just like flying under the radar. Jess Paz actually, uh, when on our our day one of tech, she was like, uh, she wasn't there for the for that day, so it was uh she was out of office.

She had called me up afterwards and said, Did anything blow up? Did anyone get hurt? Then you had a great day of tech. Everybody had what they needed to do in order to work, we're fine. That is that constitutes a good first day of tech. And uh it is, I mean, it's the lowest bar of standard you could do uh but if everyone has all the equipment that they needed to work, if the stage manager's god mic is on, if everyone uh if no actors were hurt in terms of like feedback happening in the room, if everyone is able to work, then it was good. In some instances where I found a production to be a little overwhelming, and I get scared, um, I kind of remind myself of that of like, okay, I did my basic job. Now let's let's fulfill the other list of my responsibilities.

[25:53] Germán Martínez: I'm sure each designer you've worked with has their own style, their own process, and you have your own relationship with each one of how comfortable you are giving input. But I'm just wondering how much from a creative standpoint, how much creative input do you feel comfortable putting forth or is it maybe expected of you as an associate or an assistant on a production?

[26:15] Germán Martínez: Ooh, that's a really good question. How I view it and how uh Jason Crystal, associate to Nevin Snyder would probably answer is the an associate really is there to help the needs of the sound designer. Anything that they ask for, um, you know, under the under the means, uh, they are there to provide and help towards because the end goal is to make sure that the team looks good. Um, and so while under the guise that the sound designer is the one who knows best in terms of what the needs are, what what the quote sound is best for for the production. And so we're following with that. Of course, there's a um the kind of relationship and where you ask like what would be best, uh, but I try to keep that for me as an associate, I relinquish that because that is not my job responsibility.

[27:04] Germán Martínez: Uh my job responsibility is to help my designer and make sure that the things are being asked of me to accomplish those things and help make that happen.

[27:13] Germán Martínez: Now, that's not to say that I will have my opinions of how to do things, but unless it's helpful or for the greater good, I keep those to myself.

[27:23] Mary Dina: Yeah.

[27:24] Mary Dina: Given all of the many hats you've already worn, whether it's specifically with sound or any role within theater, do you think that that well-rounded experience gives you a different perspective when you approach a job as a sound designer now and or even as an associate or assistant?

[27:44] Mary Dina: Um and then kind of like parallel to that question is it typical for the trajectory of a sound designer to go from like assistant to associate to sound designer or even like a one up the ladder, if you will, is that standard?

[28:04] Germán Martínez: That is an excellent question. Um, and I say that because, yes, for me, I find it very important that I have done all these jobs and I've worn all these hats, so I do have a strong understanding of what it is that I'm asking for of my crew when I'm in the position of leadership, asking for oftentimes me asking for 16 to 20 speakers up in the air, and people looking at me like, why do you need this many speakers? Uh so I have a little bit more of a holistic understanding of what I'm asking for of my crew.

[28:35] Germán Martínez: Yeah, it's really normal to be, I mean, I started as an A2. Well, really how I started was I started loading up speakers in whatever space that I could get into, and then I went to board oping, then I was working as an A2, then I A1, and then I assisted, then I associated. So that for me, it doesn't seem unreasonable when I ask such and such of a job responsibility of someone. It's because I also I too understand what that's like. I've been in situations where I've jumped on and I've made ear rigs as an A2, even though I was the sound designer, even though that wasn't in my job description. I still jumped out and helped out because I didn't want to make my team look bad.

[29:15] Germán Martínez: Um, I'm there to help the production look good and not make anyone look a mess. And so I will do whatever it is that I have to do in order to help out if we don't have all the skill sets there. Um it also allows me to explain to anybody who's a little bit more on the green side what it is that I'm asking for, and I'll explain in a bigger context. Well, this is what the standard is, this is what we do here. Um I think it would be unreasonable for sound designers to just come in and ask for things if they kind of never done the job. It just makes it seem like, well, you don't even know what you're asking for.

[29:55] Germán Martínez: Um, I've been up into the grid, I've been up in the grid 30 feet up in the air. I've been harnessed so I can make sure that I hang a speaker safely. I have done my time. That doesn't mean I'm not still doing my time. I like backstage with the actors. My full philosophy is one to spend time with the equipment and like have the hours in. Since okay, so this would be a great transition to your sound designing hat.

[30:21] Mary Dina: So since associates and assistants usually are hired by the designer, how do you usually land a design position? Because that's the great mystery. I mean, like, you know, there's places, there's job boards for just about everything, but you never see a designing post job posted.

[30:40] Germán Martínez: Uh and for a job posting like that for some, I mean, I recall using like Playbill, Offstage Jobs. I still use those things when I was starting out. Uh again, those are more on the sides of anybody who's coming out of college, anybody who is transitioning into this into the biz. Um those are good resources for that. TSCCA also has a nice directory for members where the people like share jobs and anybody who could suit it for it.

[31:08] Germán Martínez: But as far as design jobs, um I can answer that with this anecdote. So I did a reading during the pandemic with MCC called Gargola. Uh it was a Puerto Rican play from a Puerto Rican playwright. Um and it was just on Zoom. And so the relationship I had with the director was very active. Uh the way I show up into the room, I like to ask dramaturgical questions and I always like to ask what is the end goal of what we're trying to do.

[31:39] Germán Martínez: Um really it's really important to me on the why. What are why are we doing X for what is the emotional catharsis that we're trying to achieve or end goal of this piece what are we trying to spark? Um so I led with that in the process and it was really beautiful to throw things out there. Uh so Gargoyla was about um some gargoyles. Uh there was a time period in Puerto Rico where people thought gargoyles were coming alive and so that was what this 10 minute play was about. People thought that gargoyles were being alive but it was actually like this high cyber hacker doing like their thing. So to make the sound of a gargoyle like reverbed donkey I pitch shifted it like made it uh put it backwards I did a bunch of stuff to it.

[31:41] Germán Martínez: Um but I would throw things out to play on the Zoom room um and the director would say oh this is great this is fantastic I think this is a little bit too much can we bump this down a little bit? How for me it's very important to have an ongoing relationship with the director um because they're the ones uh they're the ones uh image who I'm trying to help create and so my relationship with Christina shout out to Christina um was so fruitful and so nice uh that the producers of MCC had always taken stock of that. So Iana Parker um who is currently one of the producers at MCC had reached out to me and said hey we're currently working on this production of Soft what is your availability?

[31:41] Germán Martínez: Uh it always starts with that what is your availability and are you interested? And I said yes immediately. Danya is somebody who I've admired from afar for quite some time and somebody who I've been wanting to work with and that time frame just so happened to be like uh available. So I said, absolutely. So for me, establishing those directors, uh excuse me, establishing those relationships is very important. You never know who's gonna be going on to direct the next thing. You never know who uh where somebody's gonna be at what institution.

[33:39] Germán Martínez: So it's important to make sure that you foster those good relationships because uh oftentimes people who I've worked with in the past on kind of one-off gigs have recommended me for other gigs. Um, and now I in turn do the same.

[33:55] Mary Dina: So, okay, so really what you're saying is like the relationships can come from the producer or the institutional side and even the director.

[34:03] Germán Martínez: Oh, absolutely. A director, a director also comes in, like for a director who has been working for quite some time. They say, like, oh, these are my tribe of people who I work with that I trust, like hire these people. Um, and it depends all again on availability and interest, and then the institution will do their due diligence and hire them. But yes, between the relationships that you are fostering and the direct relationships you're fostering um and kind of how you show up into the room, people will acknowledge that, which just like circles back to like the beginning portion of like our thing of like how I showed up into the room, what you bring in is what people will acknowledge ultimately.

[34:42] Mary Dina: Yeah, and that's just like such a theme.

[34:46] Mary Dina: What you just said is such is is is recurring for all of our guests that we've had on this podcast over the years, right? So people obviously it's people always say like they want to work with people who are kind, like it's not always about the talent, it's really about like the personality because you're spending a lot of time and a lot of crazy hours, or maybe sometimes only eight hours with people.

[35:08] Mary Dina: You want to make sure it's a good fit. Not just that like obviously everyone has the story's best interest at heart. But it's like do these styles um like mold well you know mold maybe is not the right word there but you know do they blend really nicely you're absolutely catching the essence of what it is like it's um it's the same that people will always remember how you make them feel if they if you make them feel good about themselves if you show up with if you show up with 100% people will remember that.

[35:40] Mary Dina: People will also remember how shitty you made them feel um or the lack of interest you were at the job or um how careless you were doing so and so or people will also remember that and not refer you to things or just or not actively speak bad but just pass on and follow to the next so it's really important to uh for me to show up and show out in every regard.

[36:01] Germán Martínez: You know for me when I was working at smaller theaters I said I'm gonna show up the same way that I will at Broadway both are just as important to me. Um whatever has my attention at that point is the most important to me in that time frame.

[36:17] Mary Dina: Well that's so interesting because I was thinking like and I was trying to think I'm I'm still trying to think of how to craft this question so this might come out jumbled but I was thinking because of your current work situation where you're you know and also just because there's not a lot of there's a shortage right now you're probably overlapping right you're overlapping on gigs.

[36:37] Mary Dina: And so sometimes you are the designer so you are at the top of that team and you're leading that team and maybe in the in the same day you're maybe you know talking with the designer as an associate. So it's like very I'm sure it's very humbling of like that cyclical environment and just kind of in that constant state of like learning and kind of like pulling off the energy from people.

[37:01] Germán Martínez: That really wasn't a question, it was more of just like an observation at the end of the day, I guess.

[37:05] Germán Martínez: But it's no, it's a really good observation. I mean, I before I for lack of a better words, was you know, starting to get catch a traction to myself, I would do the same. I would work on my gig that would you know pay the bills. I would run a show, and then during the day I would go and design something else, or I would design something and then go off to do another show where I was designing something else.

[37:30] Germán Martínez: You know, it's the two-brain aspect of it um really speaks a lot to like the sustainability of our industry. Um, but I've kind of gotten accustomed to working the two jobs, if not planning in advance, because you know, again, gotta pay gotta pay the bills, man.

[37:48] Brian Sedita: Brian, do you mind if I ask this question since it's tied to the jobs?

[37:51] Brian Sedita: This one that I have highlighted.

[37:53] Germán Martínez: Okay, so when I was looking on your website today, I saw you had audio samples or what you've called I think soundscapes.

[38:00] Germán Martínez: Maybe I didn't put it emotional environments and emotional territories.

[38:04] Germán Martínez: So I didn't listen to all of them because I was multitasking, but oh my gosh, I was like, wait a minute, this is your portfolio, right?

[38:11] Germán Martínez: So this is like and I because I was like, this is so unique. And then I was like, no, Mary, this is his portfolio. This is what like designers, I mean, it's I mean the sounds were amazing, don't get me wrong, but the like the I guess I'm I don't often see that, and that can come down to just I'm not often looking on sound designers' websites, or maybe they just don't have websites, but I feel like it's it's obviously the equivalent of like a scenic designer having pictures of their set, whether it's like from sketches to realization on a stage, and I just um what was my question?

[38:45] Mary Dina: Okay.

[38:46] Germán Martínez: So how do you go about choosing the right quote unquote soundscapes to include in their portfolio?

[38:51] Germán Martínez: Like, where are you finding those clips? Or how are you determining what to pull?

[38:55] Germán Martínez: That is a good question. Um, I do want to give like a little context when behind it that I found when I was an undergrad and I was graduating, I found it so difficult. Uh a lot, I think I was yeah, I was the only no, no, no, it was me and and uh Abby Martin. Shout out to Abby. Um we were the one of two sound folks.

[39:15] Germán Martínez: Uh I think it was like what, 11 in our graduating class? Everybody else was a lighting designer, everyone was a scenic, uh, something visual. And so, how do you how do you make sound a visual? It you know, you can't one, but how do I showcase that in in a website format? How do I give an accessible place to show this is what I can do?

[39:36] Germán Martínez: And so for me, when I select what I end up wanting to put on my portfolio, it's how does this communicate the things that I'm able to do? How does this showcase to somebody who does not know me and go, oh, this is where his brain goes on X project? This is what he brings to the play, this is what he's capable of doing.

[39:55] Germán Martínez: And so these are just tools of communication. Um, and so that I always try to lead with that perspective of how do I what what more information can I give to someone to say who does not know me and say, this is what I do? Um I for a long time I would say I just make sounds, and I still say that actually. That's still my high-end description of my job.

[40:19] Germán Martínez: But um, to really take myself seriously, this is how I do my job in the same capacity. I'm sure Beyoncé doesn't have to do this because she's Beyoncé, but Beyoncé has her albums, that is her resume of work that she has to do.

[40:31] Germán Martínez: Um, how does someone—how do I showcase that? And so I pick—uh, there's one on my website called, uh, from a production of Sweno out in Rhode Island, and so I think I made two pieces for that. And so, uh, the two samples that I have there are just like the most fun, ridiculous sound cues that I had that I'm like, no one else has something like this. No one has anything like this. How do I show that? Um, and that's important. I've often clicked through a lot of sound folks' websites, and we all have like the same three things, which are around the same two things, which are like drones and like all the warbly, like wam won won wah. We all love that, that and like soundscape. So we'll put you in like a nature, we'll put you in like a babbling bubbling brook. Um, and so I said, you know what? How do I showcase you weren't there? You weren't there at the show. How do I give you a little piece of the show?

[41:28] Mary Dina: So at this stage in your career, having the experiences that you've had already, what have you found to be the most challenging aspect of a career in sound? Maybe it's a career in the theater for you, but what's the most challenging part? Maybe it's technically, maybe it's lifestyle.

[41:47] Germán Martínez: For me right now, the most difficult aspect of working in theater is that there is no "I made it." There is no "this is the one gig, and I need to stop here, and all the doors open for me." I think Rob McClure had said this at a talk back one time, but you have to consistently make it, you have to consistently outdo yourself. There is no one gig that's gonna open all the doors. You have to continue to outdo yourself, you have to continue to learn and find new ways. I'm surprised at myself by how much I've grown since I graduated in 2018, so not for four years now, how much insight I've gained into the industry, how much I've learned with the equipment that I now use. And I try to keep that same fire of when I had graduated of wanting to learn more, pushing myself to try something new, always asking questions and keeping that today.

I just finished up a gig, I want to say the other day, where I was talking to a sound designer about mixing, and I was asking what their approach was because what they had done was stunning. What I had heard in the room was beautiful, and I wanted to know what was their school of thought, and so that kind of self-starter fire under your ass cannot go away. And so I've been wrestling with that right now because it's really easy to stay stagnant, to kind of just be like, oh, whatever I can do, so and so, and let it be. I have to fight that inner saboteur and always push myself to continue going. So between that and really the lifestyle change, those are my two balancing scales for me right now.

And as far as lifestyle goes, it really is of, you know, sometimes I'm just not in my house for months at a time. I spent the better part of the first six months traveling on the go. How do I travel better? How do I prep work in advance? How do I take care of myself, which is really important? How do I foster those relationships while I'm away, not just professionally but personally? That balance is really difficult when a lot of the work is so time-consuming. So between trying to push yourself and trying to stay in shape, for lack of a better word, it's the most difficult thing for me right now, especially because I'm still young. I have a long way to go. I'm still making mistakes. I don't have it perfect. But I think the most important thing to me right now is that I'm trying to. That I'm trying to. And that's the most, for me, the most humbling part of the job.

[44:51] Mary Dina: Mary, what do you say we move into our lightning round?

[44:54] Brian Sedita: Ooh, let's do it. Kick us off.

[44:57] Mary Dina: Okay, great. I miss this question. What is one thing in the theater industry that confuses you?

[45:06] Germán Martínez: I still don't understand how some folks are still not giving opportunities to other people who want to stay with the same old teams and not give chances for new people. There are people who are hungry, people who can do the job who are excited to do that. And I don't understand why people don't give people a chance. I recognize people want to do a good job, but like, listen, it's theater. The worst thing that could be is bad. Get over it. There's another show. And there's a lot of things that are bad. I'd say no offense, but you could have the same team and it can still be bad. Maybe. It's we're just not like, you know, that is subjective, but you know, or it, you know, it's not, it's not, it's not a favorite.

Exactly. And so I think I credit to my professor about that. Like the worst thing that it could be is bad. But if you're not trying something new, if you're not giving chances to people, then like, what are you doing? It's then you're gatekeeping and making it like a boys' club. It's time for new people, fresh faces. Let's go reinvent the wheel. Let's get with it.

[46:10] Mary Dina: What are three adjectives that describe your ideal working environment?

[46:14] Germán Martínez: Ooh, three adjectives. Collaborative, inspiring, and challenging. If it's easy, I don't want to do it. I'm sorry. If it's a walk in the park, then never mind.

[46:27] Brian Sedita: I don't think we've gotten challenging before.

[46:30] Germán Martínez: I credit it to Jess. Jess says if it's scary, if it moves you in a certain way, like say yes to that. Follow down that path, because that's gonna be the—that's what keeps the fire underneath, and that's what's gonna make you go. It's gonna do one of two things. It's gonna make you go, it's gonna make you sink or swim, or you're gonna rise to the occasion. So challenging, that's important to me. How do I not do the same thing beforehand? If I do the same thing beforehand, then sure, it's another way to pay the bills. But how do we make it challenging? Collaborative is very important to me. Like I said, I'm very in conversation with my director, even with the other departments. I want to feel engaged.

I am very empath in that way of like, let me feed off of what's going around me. And I said inspiring because I want to be proud of the thing that's in front of me. If everyone is working at 100, I will be inspired by that. I will also meet everyone where they are. I like to be around, I want to be in rooms where people are excited about the things that they're doing.

[47:31] Mary Dina: Is there something in your process that you find unique to you?

[47:35] Germán Martínez: I have not met any other sound designer that uses just Spanish music for their quiet time. Everybody like, Jess has a cashmere cat, she has some Prince songs, tweez music changes up depending on the project. Some people have like their same alt rock. I've not heard any other sound designer who plays like some cumbia or some bachata or like, and that's what I was wondering. I want to get the one, I want to do my job, yes, and tune the system, but I want to get the crowd going too. So I think that's unique to me.

[48:13] Brian Sedita: What is a book or resource that you found helpful for you in your process?

[48:18] Germán Martínez: I will say like TSGCA is a huge—it's not even just a sell, shameless plug, not just because I'm the Eastern representative, but I wouldn't have done half the things as successfully as I did if it weren't for the resources of reaching out to the other sound designers, reaching out to Jess Paz, calling up Lindsay Jones, having Josh Samuels as an assistant and by my side when I have a difficult question. These other designers are resources. They are people who have done it longer than I have and have known more things than I do. And so I look at them like my encyclopedias, and it changes the perspective of not working against anyone, not working against my peers, or just really working with everyone so I've picking—I've like to think of myself as a collection of all the good parts of these folk. So I would say a good resource has been TSTCA because I've met all these folk and been able to use them.

[49:27] Mary Dina: What is one job in the theater industry that you would trade jobs with for one week?

[49:27] Germán Martínez: Oh, scenic designer. Oh my goodness. They get to clicky clicky on their computer and then show up to tech and be like, oh yeah, it looks good. All right, bye. This is more so shade to my boyfriend. He's a scenic designer and he does exactly that.

[49:27] Brian Sedita: What is one hobby you have outside of the theater?

[49:27] Germán Martínez: Oh, I love to go to a good place and discover good foods, especially when I'm on the road. I will always ask what's the most aggressive like either Texas thing or what's the most aggressive like Boston food that I or experience that I could have because I want to have—I'm not gonna lie, I'm a touristy person when I travel. I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna admit to it and I'm here for the whole experience.

[50:26] Mary Dina: You have to give me your Boston recommendations. I need to know.

[50:29] Germán Martínez: It was a clam chowder, it was the clam chowder, the lobster tail, of course, of course it was the lobster tail, of course, and just eating any of the restaurants by the water by the aquarium, delicious.

[50:45] Brian Sedita: Yeah, the aquarium's really cool in Boston.

[50:48] Mary Dina: So nice. All right. I'm noting this. I'm going next month. Um, yeah. Um, okay. Last question. What is the last great piece of theater that you saw?

[50:59] Germán Martínez: Oh, this is a great question. I saw Fat Ham at the public.

[51:03] Mary Dina: I was gonna ask you about that.

[51:05] Germán Martínez: Oh my goodness. I thought it was perfect. And I don't say that often.

[51:11] Brian Sedita: It was a Pulitzer, right? I mean, yeah, go for it.

[51:14] Germán Martínez: It better have, right? I mean, no, it was perfect. I mean, that was a way to one, engage an audience. The profound sadness that is wrapped up in this comedy, the various tools of storytelling that there was, the unbelievable amount of talent on stage. Oh my goodness, I was blown away. I thought that that was a perfect production from beginning to end. That is something that needs to be studied. And if you—again, this is for the listeners. If by the time this is out, if you have not already gone to the public, catch it now while it's—while the getting's good.

[52:02] Mary Dina: Yes. Well, tell everybody how they can follow you on social media, your website, all that good stuff. Give all the shameless plugs, and of course, Soft is running at MCC until June 26th.

[52:14] Germán Martínez: Yes, it is. I'm also have my first show at Repertorio Español. First time having a show in rep, especially in Spanish. Eva Luna, that'll be running on for years to come, is the hope. Into the Woods will be debuting at the end of the month. Shameless shameless plug, shameless plug. You can catch me on Instagram as Heteman the Sound Designer. That's G-E-R-M-A-N, the Sound Designer, and that's it. Oh, and website. Website also. Listen to those soundscapes. You can catch it at www.germanlikethelanguage.com.

[52:59] Mary Dina: Amazing.

[53:01] Brian Sedita: This was amazing. I feel like okay, so it's always crazy when we talk to somebody from sound because I live with somebody that does this. So to hear more perspective and just more, it's always so enriching and really, really exciting to hear somebody else talk about it other than Stanley.

[53:21] Germán Martínez: Much love to Stan. It is my absolute pleasure, and thank you both so much for having me. This was a lot of fun.

[53:28] Mary Dina: Yay!

[53:29] Brian Sedita: Thanks everyone for listening to this episode of Page to Stage. To keep up with us, you can find us on Instagram and Facebook at Page2Stage Podcast. And if you're enjoying these conversations, we would really appreciate it if you could take a couple minutes to rate and review us wherever you're listening to this podcast.

[53:44] Mary Dina: Until next time.

[53:45] Brian Sedita: That's Brian.

[53:46] Mary Dina: That's Mary.

[53:47] Brian Sedita: We'll see you later.

[53:48] Mary Dina: Bye.