This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:04] Tori Bullard: Hello everyone and welcome back to Stage Door Podcast.

[0:08] Eliza Gunther: Today we are doing another deep dive, but before we get started, we would like to acknowledge the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation, the traditional custodians of this land on which we work, live, and record, and recognize their continuing connection to land, water, and community.

[0:25] Tori Bullard: 38 planes, 7,000 strays, hundreds of characters, 12 actors, and one incredible story of a town that welcomed the world.

[0:33] Eliza Gunther: As of September 10th, you can experience the Tony Award-winning Broadway musical Come From Away exclusively on Apple TV Plus, featuring a majority of the original cast.

[0:43] Tori Bullard: This is your opportunity to see the show critics called a celebration of the best of humankind whilst you are currently in isolation, lockdown, or can't get to the theatre.

[0:53] Eliza Gunther: It'll be available to stream from the 10th of September. Don't forget the tissues.

[0:57] Tori Bullard: The Production Company have announced their new online archive celebrating the 65 musical productions they presented and the people who both created and starred in them.

[1:07] Eliza Gunther: Head over to their website to enjoy original show announcements, a photo gallery of production images, and copies of the original show programs.

[1:14] Tori Bullard: For more info, head to theproductioncompany.com.au.

[1:19] Eliza Gunther: Lockdowns caused by COVID-19 are still ravaging our arts in Australia. All we can really say for now is keep going.

[1:26] Tori Bullard: Keep doing your part, stay safe, and remember you are not alone.

[1:30] Eliza Gunther: If you ever need to talk or feel out of hope, make sure to reach out to us, your family, friends, or one of the many organizations that can provide you with the help you need, such as Beyond Blue, Lifeline, and Headspace.

[1:43] Tori Bullard: We will pull through this together.

[1:45] Eliza Gunther: Back over to me, I guess. Today we will be discussing the critically acclaimed musical Anastasia with music, lyrics...

[1:55] Tori Bullard: Sorry, with music and lyrics by Stephen Flaherty and Lynn Ahrens, and with book written by the late great Terrence McNally.

[2:04] Eliza Gunther: Anastasia is based on the true story of the Romanov family, otherwise known as the Russian Royal Family, who were executed by a firing squad in 1918.

[2:15] Tori Bullard: This story takes the folk tale of the Romanov child Anastasia, who was speculated to have survived, and it takes also the 1997 animated film of the same name and Ingrid Bergman's 1954 film.

[2:31] Eliza Gunther: The Broadway production reunites the composing team of Ahrens and Flaherty, taking songs from the 1997 film, such as Once Upon a December and the Academy Award-nominated hit and now high alto belting standard Journey to the Past.

[2:45] Tori Bullard: Ahrens and Flaherty wrote an entirely new score and story with the help of McNally, grounding the Broadway production more in reality than in the fantasy world of demons and talking bats from the '97 animated feature.

[2:56] Eliza Gunther: The show closed on Broadway in 2019 after 842 performances, including previews.

[3:03] Tori Bullard: And it began touring North America in October 2018 and spurred a series of worldwide productions in Spain, Germany, the Netherlands, Mexico, and Japan.

[3:14] Eliza Gunther: Sadly, most of these productions were halted due to the COVID-19 pandemic, with Japan notably taking their final bow after only 14 performances.

[3:24] Tori Bullard: The future of the show is currently unknown, with many producers confirming their versions would not reopen post-pandemic.

[3:31] Eliza Gunther: And I just want to say, before we jump into it, that is very sad, but also, you guys, the listeners, picked us to talk about this musical.

[3:42] Tori Bullard: This also happens to be one of my all-time favourite shows.

[3:45] Eliza Gunther: And I would also like to point out, because I'm such a fangirl of Christy Altomare, those 842 performances, she performed in almost all of them.

[3:55] Tori Bullard: She was in that show from the first preview to the last show, as was John Bolton, who is a phenomenal man, that John Bolton.

[4:07] Eliza Gunther: Anyway, I'm gonna be quiet now and actually start talking about the show and to not fangirl about it.

[4:13] Tori Bullard: You're going to be quiet and talk about the show.

[4:16] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, so we did put this forward. We put a couple of our favorite shows forward to you guys, and it was definitely Tori's absolute favorite.

[4:24] Tori Bullard: She does not stop talking about this show.

[4:26] Eliza Gunther: So I'm really glad that we actually got to doing this. I don't know if she bribed someone to vote for it.

[4:33] Tori Bullard: I didn't even vote.

[4:35] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, speaking of, is that check in the mail talk?

[4:37] Tori Bullard: Uh, yes.

[4:37] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, yeah.

[4:38] Tori Bullard: Um, I didn't even vote myself. I can I was like, no, that's not fair.

[4:43] Eliza Gunther: Like I can't, I can't pick.

[4:45] Tori Bullard: I voted in the initial round, but once we got to the last one, or like the last two, I can't remember, I was like, no, no, no, you can't like you no.

[4:55] Eliza Gunther: Um, but it is, it's one of my favorite. I've always loved the story of Anastasia and always loved the movie, and then when there was a show, and obviously I'm very lucky to have seen it twice on Broadway.

[5:07] Tori Bullard: Um, it's one of those shows that makes me just absolutely cry.

[5:12] Eliza Gunther: And Christy Altomare, Christy Altomare, Carrie Hope Fletcher, those are like two of my biggest, like I'd say modern idols in terms of performance.

[5:21] Tori Bullard: Um, and I've got to meet Christy Altomare a few times. It's just overall, I was like, when this won, I was like, Yes.

[5:30] Eliza Gunther: I was like, we're gonna talk about it at some point. The fact that we get to do it now, I'm like very happy getting to talk about a show that I love.

[5:37] Tori Bullard: Obviously, at the time of recording, myself and Gareth are both in heavy lockdown in Sydney.

[5:44] Eliza Gunther: Um, Tori is in loose, you know, mask wearing, mask wearing, really where it's glorified mask wearing.

[5:54] Tori Bullard: It's really not the lockdown situation.

[5:57] Eliza Gunther: It's locked down from between the nose and the chin.

[6:00] Tori Bullard: Yeah, that's about it.

[6:01] Eliza Gunther: That's about it. We're still living our lives. I'm going to Stradbroke on the weekend.

[6:05] Tori Bullard: So we know we're pretty lucky on here.

[6:07] Eliza Gunther: Like living the high life.

[6:08] Tori Bullard: Living the high life, honestly. Here we are in Sydney, just like I'm just liking the fact that we've gone from a deep dive from one of my favourite musicals straight into one about Tori's favorite musical.

[6:20] Eliza Gunther: So I think they're really lining them up perfectly for us.

[6:23] Tori Bullard: Yeah.

[6:24] Eliza Gunther: They are, especially, especially during lockdown. Cheer you up.

[6:26] Tori Bullard: Yes.

[6:27] Eliza Gunther: The good end of your day. Um, and this show is really interesting.

[6:33] Tori Bullard: I found because I watched it today.

[6:35] Eliza Gunther: Um, so I watched it today online. No one come for me.

[6:41] Tori Bullard: Um, had to do a little bit of research. Maybe Gareth and I both did a cheeky, a cheeky Google.

[6:47] Eliza Gunther: Um, no, no, don't you lump me in with this crime?

[6:51] Tori Bullard: You just watched the slime tutorial. That's all it was.

[6:55] Eliza Gunther: Slime, we love slime. And it is an interesting show because it's very different.

[7:02] Tori Bullard: It's different to the animation, but it's still the same, like it's quite similar, and I really like kind of the more historical take on it, I think.

[7:11] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, but it's a very interesting show. There's so much to talk about. Like that's what struck me as well.

[7:17] Tori Bullard: I will admit, in 1997, Gareth was not a huge fan of animated features about girls at that point because he was a little trash bag at six years old.

[7:28] Eliza Gunther: So I've seen and I've seen animated Anastasia once in my life, and I was like, Yeah, it's kinda cool.

[7:34] Tori Bullard: Is that Doc from Back to the Future being Rasputin? I like that.

[7:39] Eliza Gunther: And then I only really fell into it after you realize.

[7:43] Tori Bullard: Yeah, that was a thing. Christopher Lloyd was his voice, but the guy who voiced Winnie the Pooh was his singing voice anyway.

[7:48] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, I only really fell into the Anastasia train after listening to the soundtrack as a young man going into musical theater saying, Oh, Journey to the Past actually like slaps. This is awesome.

[8:00] Tori Bullard: And then of course Broadway did its thing. Ahrens and Flaherty, who I can't say without doing all your accents, came back and rewrote an entire score of frankly very good material to pad out the story.

[8:13] Eliza Gunther: Oh, it's such beautiful music, and it's written in such like a, it does like, like you say, it does take on much more of like a historical aspect and a much more, you know, real world scenario.

[8:13] Tori Bullard: There is no Rasputin. The villain, I say in air quotes, because something we'll talk about later is, is Gleb a villain?

[8:42] Eliza Gunther: Um, but I find that the music is really what brings the magic to this show.

[8:49] Tori Bullard: Um, and obviously you do, you have, you know, your staple pieces in it, but it also has so much new amazing music where you get to learn so much more about characters like Dimitri and Popov and the Dowager Empress.

[9:04] Eliza Gunther: Dowager Duchess, sorry. The Dowager Empress and the Countess.

[9:08] Tori Bullard: Dowager Empress, yeah, and the Countess. Like you get to really learn about these people that were such fabulous characters in the movie, but like you didn't really know anything other than, you know, it was Countess Lily and the Dowager Duchess.

[9:24] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, they were just sort of...

[9:25] Tori Bullard: I love the love story.

[9:27] Eliza Gunther: Love the extra love story in there.

[9:28] Tori Bullard: Oh, we love a C plot.

[9:30] Eliza Gunther: Yes. We love a C plot. I think the music was really interesting because I did find though at times, and this could be a little controversial, that because it's such a historical, it's a moment in history, not only that, but it's a very historical piece.

[9:49] Tori Bullard: And sometimes I felt like the music was too happy in comparison to what was happening on stage.

[9:55] Eliza Gunther: Like what was happening at the time. I don't know if sometimes the music is like too happy or Disney-fied to what actually happened in history at that time.

[10:07] Tori Bullard: Yeah, I guess that there is the thing of, uh, this is what you do because look, as we have seen with things like Come From Away, for example, you can take a really awful situation, and there definitely are the sad moments in it, but there are also the really real moments in it.

[10:25] Eliza Gunther: My honest opinion is I don't know if I would go see a show about Anastasia if it was just downright depressing.

[10:36] Tori Bullard: I think that they do have moments in it where they're trying to, you know, really show what it was like living in St. Petersburg at that time.

[10:43] Eliza Gunther: And I can think they tried more, I don't, I can't think of the actual word, but like they're a bit sarcastic about how wonderful it is to live there.

[10:54] Tori Bullard: But yeah, I don't know. I feel like if it was sadder, it wouldn't be very enjoyable to listen to.

[11:00] Eliza Gunther: Well, I'm just gonna sit very squarely on the fence and say, yes, I agree with Tori. If we were going into a musical post-Bolshevik revolution Russia in the smack bang in the middle of what was then Leningrad, I don't think I would be too thrilled to sit there and listen to them griping too much.

[11:19] Tori Bullard: But by the same token, Ahrens and Flaherty have such a signature sound.

[11:25] Eliza Gunther: Like you listen to some of their musicals, you listen to Ragtime, you listen to A Man of No Importance, you listen to Seussical.

[11:31] Tori Bullard: There are certain trills and thematics that they do that lend themselves to a bit of Broadway razzle dazzle, if I can say that.

[11:40] Eliza Gunther: Like, if we're going to be...

[11:40] Tori Bullard: That's exactly how I felt listening to...

[11:44] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, so for example, My Petersburg.

[11:47] Tori Bullard: I mentioned in our little Google document, it's the most Broadway sounding thing I've ever heard in my goddamn life.

[11:54] Eliza Gunther: I love it, and I'm very much about it. And I've been singing it all day.

[11:59] Tori Bullard: But my problem with it is I don't think it really fit the tone of where they were at that point.

[12:11] Eliza Gunther: I think it just became Dimitri needs a song. And so Ahrens and Flaherty did their thing.

[12:18] Tori Bullard: I do agree. I think I like that Dimitri has a song because obviously you want to learn a little bit more.

[12:23] Eliza Gunther: And obviously, it's a bit of a different storyline for Dimitri in the musical. It's not the thing of this was, well, as far as we know, in the musical, um, he was not necessarily one of the housekeeper's children in the show.

[12:38] Tori Bullard: Um, but I definitely see, I felt like it fit really well. I think when listening to the show, and this is where shows either do this really well or don't do this well.

[12:52] Eliza Gunther: When just listening to the show, I'm like, it does kind of, it's kind of just like there. Whereas when watching it, it kind of feels like it does, it does definitely stick out a little bit, I think, in the placement of it in particular.

[13:04] Tori Bullard: I think maybe it would fit better in act two. Obviously, you're not in Petersburg anymore.

[13:09] Gareth Isaac: Um so it kind of probably wouldn't make sense. Um, but it definitely it it feeds a little bit more into seeing it, but it definitely is kind of like you've just come out of like once upon a December, and it's like BAM! I am singing at this girl that I air quote hate. Um and it's it's I don't know, but there definitely is that Razzle Dazzle feel to the music. Like you have something like um Land of Yesterday, which I think that's I think that's the title of the song.

[13:39] Eliza Gunther: It is.

[13:40] Gareth Isaac: Which is um which is oh my god, Countess Lily's song.

[13:44] Eliza Gunther: Caroline O'Connor.

[13:46] Gareth Isaac: Oh my god. Australia's gift to the great white way. Oh my god, she is phenomenal. But it's definitely one of those songs where if you were just watching it and listening to it, you'd be like, oh, it's just like fun, and you know, it's they're drinking in like a speakeasy. But then when you listen to the lyrics, they are so incredibly depressed.

[14:08] Tori Bullard: Mood.

[14:09] Gareth Isaac: Living in this world that they are living in mood.

[14:12] Eliza Gunther: Yes, I agree. Um so it's interesting how they put these ideas of like these people are unhappy. They don't want to be living in the times they're living in. They want to go back in time, they want to go back to St. Petersburg, how they knew it. Um how they make that sound so happy and like upbeat and fun. It's cr it's such I think that that was some of my favourite parts when watching the show actually. Because it was so spectacular and the energy was amazing.

[14:40] Gareth Isaac: I just didn't know how Caroline O'Connor can move like that. Like, how does she move like that? She's just insane. Like, there was moments watching her performance where I was like, girl, if I'm your age and I can do that still, and like be nearly on the floor being picked up and dropped and picked up and dropped and turned and spinned, and I was like, this this is some next level stuff. She is absolutely incredible. And that it's very true that there are definitely moments where they try and uplift the sadness with like happiness.

[15:15] Eliza Gunther: I guess the plot itself is interesting how they've changed the villain and they've changed it to be more realistic, but then it doesn't for me, it didn't have the same impact for me as the animated film had, because it was kind of lackluster with the the ending with um oh what's his name, the bad guy.

[15:40] Gareth Isaac: Gleb, yes. With Gleb, I I was completely taken aback by that.

[15:45] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, I I have to agree. I found the threat in the musical, as opposed to the animated film, was the threat of being exposed for bringing out this false Anastasia by perpetuating this falsehood for a scam rather than one direct antagonistic force like it was in the 97 film. Obviously, I think it's a smarter choice by making the villain Soviet Russia in general. Number one, because at that point in time the Americans had just had a whole thing about the Russians tampering with the election, but also because they didn't want to bring in the overt Christianity of Rasputin as a villain. Also, like historically he was dead at least a year and a half before the Robodops were executed anyway. Um that's my take. That's my take on it.

[16:37] Gareth Isaac: And I don't think Gleb held that same weight, especially when he met Anya all of twice in the piece, and the second time was when he was pointing a gun at her.

[16:50] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, so they run in during the prologue and then um after she's um for for context for anyone listening, they ran in during like the you know, the beginning part, um what's it, rumour in St. Petersburg, and then after she originally meets with Jam Dmitry and Popov, um, he is brings her in being like, what are you involved in? Um, and then obviously uh at the very end when he is holding a gun at her face.

[17:17] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, I do agree, and I think part of it is that because they have literally taken some of the magic out away. Which I do think I agree. It is a smart choice because I think it would have been very hard to do, although I have been proven wrong with things like Frozen. I was super skeptical seeing it. I was like, Keen Broadway Disney like Disney musical, don't get how they're gonna do the magic, and of course they did it, and they continue to do it seamlessly. It's phenomenal.

[17:48] Eliza Gunther: But I do agree that he doesn't hold as much, and there is that weird thing of he kinda likes her, and she's quite I think she's very oblivious to this, in my opinion, watching it and watching Christy Altimar do it. She, you know, that's not anything to do with her. But there's this weird, like, or is it like again, it could be up for discussion of I I can see that you two agree with me that he's kind of like into Anya. Um, she's oblivious to it, but it could be taken on as he's just trying to do his job as an officer and be like, here, come to this tea shop, take a moment to calm down before getting back to your work, kind of thing. I don't know. You could take it very differently.

[18:27] Gareth Isaac: But adding that slight, like, mmm, Anya, I was like, ugh, back off.

[18:32] Eliza Gunther: It's so over.

[18:33] Gareth Isaac: I totally agree. It's so bad. His character was really interesting. The whole the whole character arc is really interesting, and I like that they gave humanity to a villain.

[18:43] Eliza Gunther: They really did.

[18:43] Gareth Isaac: They with the song about you know, his father uh shot one of the royals, basically, and all of that. It's really nice that there is some sort of humanity for that character, but the same token, it does it doesn't, it doesn't create an impact for the audience as much as like a very feared figure that is that is domineering, and it doesn't quite tie in. I don't I don't feel like it ties in the beginning, the the how they got shot and the red, and like how visceral that is to then one little character on stage the whole time. Like we never see like a huge threat, it's just like one character who's a human and can't really do that much damage. And it's just like the thought.

[19:31] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, honestly, I don't think we can classify Gleb as a villain with all this. I think antagonist would probably be the better term because he he is the representative of the entire government of the Soviet Union at that point. He is the face behind it, which is an overarching force that want to get rid of the Romanov family in general, because they are still viewed as a ruling aristocracy. And the people are still very unhappy with the fact that they are now a Soviet state. So I think, yeah, Gleb's not really classified as a villain. He's an unwilling tool at best.

[20:08] Eliza Gunther: Emphasis on tool.

[20:10] Gareth Isaac: So you see a woman once and you're obsessed with her, it's it's phantom all over again. Ironically played by Ramin.

[20:15] Eliza Gunther: Hello.

[20:15] Gareth Isaac: I was just gonna say that maybe it's historically, though, a little bit more accurate to the which side is better. Who who is who is actually the good and who is the bad? Because I think from different viewpoints, it could be viewed a little bit differently on were the royals bad, were the royal was, you know, were the people the Soviets are they good. I think it all it depends on your viewpoint.

[20:40] Eliza Gunther: Hmm. I think taking it back to the music again, what they have done so well with this show is when we were talking about how, you know, it does feel all a little bit happy go happy go lightly, kind of for a majority of the show. It does have its moments that really bring it back to reality of what it was like living in Soviet Russia. Um, for example, Bless My Homeland, um, I believe that's what the title of the song is. Um, which uh when listening to it originally, I was like, uh, you know, there's always like that one song on an album. If you haven't seen the show, or even after you've seen the show, we're kind of just like, I can skip it and it's fine. But it's one of those, it's they're about to get on the train to Paris, and it's these, you know, whenever the they've been talking in the show about being unhappy living um in St. Petersburg, they've been very, you know, glib about it being very, you know, sarcastic, like we hate it here, but we'll live here.

Um, this is very much the moment of like we we don't want to leave. This is our home. This is our homeland. We don't want to leave, but we feel like we don't have a choice, and it really just brings it like right down to earth.

[21:59] Gareth Isaac: And I think that if you didn't have that moment, the show definitely would feel a little bit too happy throughout the whole show, but having that moment brings it back to reality, and same with like if the whole show is more realistic, the whole show would sound like this, and it would be fucking depressing. But it really does, it does bring it back to reality, and I think Played and Aaron's have done that absolutely beautifully, and like you listen to it and you watch these people, and it's like it's like mothers, daughters, like people with families having to be like, We grew up here, this is our life, and we now have to leave and start an entirely new life because a lot of them are leaving illegally as well.

Um it's just uh it really. Although it might seem like lustre, it's actually beautiful. It's so beautiful watching it because it's so soft and still, and like they don't move on that stage. They pretty much do not move until the end of the song when Anya kind of has her moment of I'm leaving, and I'm probably ever gonna come back.

[23:08] Eliza Gunther: Who doesn't love a stand and sing?

[23:09] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, yeah. But uh in that similar vein, that scene, I'm just gonna dork out on the set. I love the train. I love the way they do the train.

[23:18] Eliza Gunther: Oh, the training.

[23:20] Gareth Isaac: It's very clever. It's like it's not only just a very good set piece that sitting on the revolve so they can get into the next number of we'll go from there, which is just a delightful little three-piece number. The way that carriage in design and the way the set is designed in general, utter genius. I specifically hone in on the rail carriage because it does look like a set of prison bars when you're looking into it. And that's fascinating to me. That is just this subtle reminder that there is this threat of imprisonment or worse coming their way.

[23:54] Eliza Gunther: And oh, I could talk about the set all day.

[23:57] Gareth Isaac: The French windows, all the very, very cool revolves, all these delightful tables and chairs flying in and out at any given point. It's just it's making me very happy. There were moments in the show where I was losing interest, I'll admit, because it's it's a long show. Your boy's got a very short attention span, so keeping me occupied is difficult. But when a set is doing that job for me, I say kudos to you guys. Congratulations, you've hooked me.

[24:25] Eliza Gunther: Exactly. I think the set, the projections in particular, really took it to that next level. And I think it really it kind of because it's animated, they animated themselves the product to the projections. It kind of brought me into that Anastasia land. It really transported me into the movie, but also history. It kind of helped it tie all of the ends it was trying to do, and it helped tie it in in a really Disney way.

[24:54] Gareth Isaac: Yeah. And I mean, the set designer literally won a drama desk for best production uh projection design. So that tells you just how phenomenal the projections were.

[25:04] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, congratulations. Just like a moment of true appreciation because obviously it throughout the entire show it's wonderful. But the moment that gets me every single time is at the end of a journey to the past. Similarly to how they do it in the movie, you go from they've just jumped off of the train, they're in like kind of like the forest wilderness area, and just at the end of Journey to the Past, as she's singing that beautiful crescendo, the it's almost like a pairing up of a camera onto Paris, and it is just it is beautiful, and it's exactly what you think of when you think of the movie as well. Because when you think of the animated movie, um, when you think of um why can't I think of the titles of the song The Key to Your Heart, Paris Holds the Key.

[25:55] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, Paris is the key to your heart.

[25:56] Eliza Gunther: Yeah.

[25:57] Gareth Isaac: Oh, well, it is longer than I thought it was. Yeah, it's it it's parenthesis, it's parenthesized. It's like you think of them on the Eiffel Tower and them around like going through the streets of Paris, and that's exactly exactly what they give you, and it's phenomenal. And talking of the set, also the costuming in this show.

[26:15] Gareth Isaac: Gorgeous. Absolutely done to perfection. All of the daughters, all of the Romanov daughters, all of the sons, the costumes are just stunning. And you know, you really look at the differences between when they're in St. Petersburg too versus when they're in Paris. St. Petersburg, the colours are all blacks, greys like charcoals, all very dark colours. And as soon as you get to Paris, as soon as you see that projection of Paris, it's like all of the colour has been brought back into the world. And it's just and also her final dress, the red dress, the blue dress at the opera, is like it's like it's been taken. Like with obviously they've taken their own design and they've really, you know, made it their own, but it's still like you could see her in that dress in the movie. And also the final dress will just blow me away every single time.

[27:09] Tori Bullard: Yeah, following on from that note of the reveal of Paris, there's a very cleverly lampshaded line that Dimitri has with Vlad before we get that pan up, we before we go into Journey to the Past. We see our first hints of colour in those projections, like the trees suddenly have the slight pinkish hue in their leaves. And Dimitri just turns around and says, "This looks like Russia," and Vlad very angrily points out, "It looks nothing like Russia." And then middle of act two, or the big sorry, as soon as Act Two starts, boom, looks nothing like Russia because we have colour. Which I think is just a very it was a very smart way to handle it.

[27:50] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, no, definitely. Because definitely all of a sudden they've jumped off this train and it's like, oh, well, clearly they're in somewhere different, but you also don't know that until all of a sudden that you know that moment at the end of Journey to the Past happens.

[28:02] Gareth Isaac: Exactly. Um, I feel like we've really we've really fangirled about this for a good like 30 minutes.

[28:10] Tori Bullard: I think or two.

[28:12] Eliza Gunther: I think we have.

[28:13] Gareth Isaac: I think it might be time for a game.

[28:17] Tori Bullard: I will fangirl about Christy Altimore because I have a story.

[28:21] Eliza Gunther: I have a bedtime story.

[28:23] Gareth Isaac: Oh, I love that. Um, I'll catch that later, but it might be time for a game.

[28:30] Tori Bullard: I think it's time for a cheeky game, my friends.

[28:33] Gareth Isaac: Hosting this week's game is Gareth.

[28:35] Gareth Isaac: Hello, I'm your game master for this week. How are you all feeling?

[28:38] Eliza Gunther: I'm so scared.

[28:40] Tori Bullard: I'm so excited about this.

[28:42] Gareth Isaac: Because I say this is my favorite show, and then I feel like maybe I don't know enough.

[28:46] Tori Bullard: Yeah, well, I mean, how often do you actually get to take part in the game, Tori?

[28:51] Tori Bullard: I know, I very rarely.

[28:52] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, so this is gonna be We didn't we've never done it against each other. This is gonna be fun.

[28:56] Eliza Gunther: Oh, I'm creating some podcast host rivalry.

[29:00] Gareth Isaac: I love this. I come in for the deep dives, drop a rivalry bomb and bounce.

[29:06] Tori Bullard: The showdown.

[29:08] Eliza Gunther: Except I know nothing about Anastasia's.

[29:10] Gareth Isaac: Well, you're gonna be boned then because today's game is a trivia competition, my friends.

[29:16] Eliza Gunther: Woo!

[29:16] Tori Bullard: Woo!

[29:17] Gareth Isaac: We'll be throwing questions at you, turn-based, so I'll go Tori, Eliza, Tori, Eliza, etcetera, etcetera. If we reach a certain point and we're matched, I'll throw in a tie-breaking buzzer round. But I think we'll be able to get through this, and one of you will walk away the crowned Princess of Anastasia Trivia.

[29:36] Eliza Gunther: Don't know why I'm Spanish.

[29:37] Tori Bullard: Oh my gosh, can we get a tiara?

[29:40] Gareth Isaac: So starting things off, we've got a question for you, Eliza.

[29:46] Gareth Isaac: Oh my gosh. In Act Two, the characters attend a ballet. Can you tell me the name of the ballet being performed?

[29:54] Eliza Gunther: I know this!

[29:54] Eliza Gunther: Oh my god!

[29:55] Eliza Gunther: Swan Lake!

[29:56] Gareth Isaac: Ding ding, one for Eliza!

[29:59] Eliza Gunther: Oh my god, guys. Iconic.

[30:01] Tori Bullard: Strong opening, strong opening. I loved that.

[30:04] Eliza Gunther: No, I just thought that I the actual ballet itself was iconic.

[30:07] Tori Bullard: No, I wasn't saying.

[30:08] Eliza Gunther: You are so pleased with yourself. Don't hide that.

[30:10] Tori Bullard: Both.

[30:13] Gareth Isaac: Both is iconic.

[30:14] Tori Bullard: Yes.

[30:15] Gareth Isaac: We have a question for you.

[30:18] Gareth Isaac: What is the name of Anastasia's baby brother mentioned in Learn to Do It?

[30:24] Tori Bullard: Correct. Alexei.

[30:25] Eliza Gunther: Oh my god.

[30:27] Tori Bullard: Depending on how you I don't know. Depending on dialect, yes.

[30:30] Gareth Isaac: So we've got a point each. This is a strong opening, guys. Get some rivalry happening.

[30:34] Gareth Isaac: Alright. Eliza.

[30:39] Gareth Isaac: In the act two song, The Countess and the Common Man, Lily mentions that Vlad Popov stole a piece of jewelry from her. What was it?

[30:48] Eliza Gunther: It's a diamond. Um, we're gonna need to be a bit more specific.

[30:54] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, I know. It's either a diamond ring or a diamond necklace, and I'm trying to remember which it was. I'm pretty sure it's a diamond ring.

[31:02] Gareth Isaac: Bing bing bing! Correct.

[31:05] Eliza Gunther: Yes. Well done, well done. We sweatin'.

[31:08] Gareth Isaac: We kinda who wants to be a millionaire'd that.

[31:13] Gareth Isaac: Alright. So I think I'm gonna have to throw a tough one of these tough ones to Tori's way.

[31:21] Gareth Isaac: Oh god. Tori.

[31:23] Gareth Isaac: This is a finish these lyrics question.

[31:27] Tori Bullard: Okay.

[31:29] Gareth Isaac: The Neva flows, a new wind blows, and soon it will be spring. The leaves unfold, the czar lies cold. A revolution is a simple thing.

[31:41] Tori Bullard: Bing bing bing bing.

[31:43] Gareth Isaac: Correct.

[31:44] Tori Bullard: Yeah. You kept going, and I kept going to like finish it, and I was like, no, stop.

[31:51] Gareth Isaac: I could sense you wanting to jump in and just do the whole goddamn number.

[31:54] Tori Bullard: I probably shouldn't have thrown that one at you.

[31:57] Eliza Gunther: Oh look, it's not what am I that's that's the song in the show that I kind of am like eh.

[32:02] Tori Bullard: You know, I can skip it.

[32:05] Eliza Gunther: Sorry.

[32:05] Tori Bullard: Yeah, that no, don't worry, I have the same reaction, but we'll get onto that later.

[32:10] Gareth Isaac: So we're two apiece now. I think it's time for the tiebreaker buzzer round.

[32:14] Eliza Gunther: Oh my gosh.

[32:16] Gareth Isaac: Yeah. So this is also gonna be dependent on how fast my internet is. Good luck, NBN. In the opening tune, Rumour in St. Petersburg, there are three items being sold in the marketplace, purportedly belonging to the Romanovs.

[32:32] Eliza Gunther: Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing.

[32:36] Gareth Isaac: Oh, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing!

[32:38] Gareth Isaac: I'm gonna have to give it to Tori, unfortunately, because she has to be.

[32:44] Eliza Gunther: But she binged before you finished the sentence!

[32:46] Gareth Isaac: He didn't make that at all!

[32:47] Eliza Gunther: I make that at all!

[32:49] Gareth Isaac: I didn't specify, I'm sorry.

[32:52] Gareth Isaac: There is a pair of silk pyjamas.

[32:55] Tori Bullard: Yes.

[32:56] Gareth Isaac: Uh, and obviously there is the music box.

[33:00] Tori Bullard: Correct.

[33:00] Gareth Isaac: Genuine Romanov. I could never part for it.

[33:04] Tori Bullard: Two cans of beans.

[33:06] Gareth Isaac: Done.

[33:07] Eliza Gunther: No, I knew that too.

[33:09] Eliza Gunther: I also would have accepted a painting.

[33:12] Gareth Isaac: Painting.

[33:12] Tori Bullard: That's what I thought.

[33:13] Eliza Gunther: See, I was wondering what the third one was.

[33:16] Tori Bullard: Yeah, that's why I didn't bing, because I thought it was three, and I was like, well, oh I know two. I was gonna guess painting, but I was like, there's a very good chance that it's wrong.

[33:24] Gareth Isaac: Because I always remember the um pyjamas.

[33:28] Eliza Gunther: Because aren't they pop-ups?

[33:31] Gareth Isaac: I don't know. I can't remember the lyric specifically, which is.

[33:34] Tori Bullard: I can't quite remember. But yeah, uh, thank you for playing Gareth's Anastasia trivia quiz. Anastasia trivia quiz. Once I stop falling out of my words.

[33:45] Gareth Isaac: Congratulations, Tori, you are the supreme.

[33:48] Tori Bullard: But I already knew that.

[33:49] Gareth Isaac: She her music theater, like crazy random knowledge is amazing, and I'm forever bowing my head.

[33:57] Eliza Gunther: I'm slightly terrified.

[34:00] Gareth Isaac: It's terrifying, right? I'm like, going against Tori is not something you want.

[34:04] Tori Bullard: I'm like knows everything.

[34:07] Eliza Gunther: Not always.

[34:07] Tori Bullard: I don't always know everything. Do you want to take it away, Tori?

[34:11] Tori Bullard: Oh yeah. Well, I guess my oh, it's hard. I have a lot of favorite moments in the show. Umsurprising. I'll look at the whole show. Um there are definitely moments that I don't love. For example, the Neva flows. Like, I like it because Gleb does, you do need a little bit of an explanation of why Gleb is who he is. Um, and I do like the realness that it brings. But also at the same time, I was like going into the show, and I was like, yeah, yeah, and my energy just went. Um, which is like not what you want. Even with um Bless My Homeland, my energy was still like because I was like there the whole time, being like, are they gonna like get caught? Like, repeat are you gonna see that people get like dragged away for trying to get out? Anyway, that's not a favorite moment, so I don't know why I'm talking about it.

[34:59] Tori Bullard: Um, I love the addition of the song In My Dreams because I feel like it really does bring so much depth and realness to Anya's character. Of she really has no idea, and obviously it's never obviously she you know in terms of this show, she is Anastasia, but there is that thing of this poor person has no idea who they are, no idea who their family is. They've just been put into this place. Their name is Anya, and it's just yeah, I don't know. Like that's one of my favourite songs in this show, I think, and I love and sadly it was cut. I do understand why, it does slow down the show, but crossing a bridge is absolutely stunning. You know, she goes back to the bridge where it that's I say that it was cut from the show for for a reason, you know.

It does slow it down, it's not necessary to be there, but it is such a lovely moment because it brings back to, you know, that's where her grandmother told her to meet her. Um, and it brings back all these little moments from the movie, from the show that and that's kind of why part of the reason is it's not necessary. Um it's not necessary to the point to the plot why Anya goes to the bridge, it's kind of just she goes there because that's where she told her grandmother she would meet her.

[36:32] Eliza Gunther: Um yeah, I guess that's me. I don't know. I could talk I could talk about the show for just hours on end. I just love the entirety of it.

[36:39] Gareth Isaac: Um, I hadn't gotten that impression.

[36:42] Tori Bullard: Yeah, I guess one of my favorite parts of the plot and the show in general is actually when um Dimitri and Anya realize that they've known each other for a long time.

[36:57] Eliza Gunther: Proud of her.

[36:58] Tori Bullard: And it's the song In a Crowd of Thousands, which is such a beautiful duet. I really love it. I love listening to the covers of it. I love I love seeing it in the show itself. And it's put in such a good place because she just wakes up from the nightmare of all of her family and her dreams, and she's trying to figure out who she is. And in that moment in a crowd of thousands is really where the penny drops at. Oh wait, I think I am Anastasia. And oh my gosh, I remember this this um memory of us together and how how yeah, you were when I was ten we we had a connection and now here we are. I mean, it's a little far-fetched that when you're ten you still remember, you know, you you were in love from first sight from afar.

But um, I think it's a really lovely moment of bringing that childhood into the into the present and it's a beautiful duet. And I'm just a romantic, so I love the romantic part. And I like the moment of actually being like because obviously, like I said before, in the movie, Dimitri is like the child of one of the servants. Um, and that's how he knows Anastasia. Um, but this is such a lovely moment to without being like, here, let's have like this entire big scene or monologue about how they actually know each other. But just this beautiful song that has a penny drop for them both. Like you learn how Dimitri fits into this world, like actually fits in. Um yeah, you get that such beautiful and like the the reactions that they both had when he's like, I never told you that, and she remembers and she knows that and she knows that this is a memory. This is not something that's kind of being coerced into her memory. It is a memory, and it's just so beautiful.

[38:46] Eliza Gunther: Yeah, it's really gorgeous. Also, just very good songwriting. Like it takes us on a journey, they end somewhere different from when they started, and it just warms the cockles of my old dead heart.

[38:56] Gareth Isaac: It's lovely. But I'm gonna be the old school comedy king over here. My favourite parts of the goddamn show are when Caroline O'Connor is doing her thing, and then we go into The Countess and the Common Man. It is pure, unbridled and very period for 1927 comedy gold. It is physicality, it is reaction, it is listening, it is just very good musicality as well in the middle of it all, because you can tell these two are highly, highly trained singers and performers.

[39:33] Gareth Isaac: It just gets me and makes me think, my God, this is what the craft can be when it's handled by two professionals.

[39:43] Eliza Gunther: Literally, and the dancing, and the dancing.

[39:45] Gareth Isaac: That's what I was talking about before.

[39:47] Eliza Gunther: Carolina Connor's dancing in that number.

[39:49] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, like y'all who know me know I am by no means a dancer. I'm a smart mover at best. Put me in an ensemble, I'm fine. But I recognize that game that they have. So watching amazing, yeah.

[40:03] Gareth Isaac: Like watching that whole scene, uh, the land of yesterday, that whole routine, and then into Countess and the Common Man, like there's some very highly technical and very funny dancing in it.

[40:17] Gareth Isaac: And that's what strikes me and makes me think, oh, there's a lot of energy here, and I hate to be that guy. I couldn't find anything matching it throughout the show. I found some very funny aside lines that dragged me back in. As I mentioned earlier, it's a long show. Again, nothing wrong with that. I love a lengthy theatre drama, but I wish there was more of that energy throughout, which is why, controversial, the show musical should have had Bartok or some analogous to Bartok. Give me the talking bat, yeah, I know it's, it really is that hard. And it would have been such a hard decision to make when creating this show going, do we have Rasputin and Bartok? Do we make it like how would you think that?

Like I said with Frozen, I'm always so skeptical of shows that have like magic in them, but then you have Frozen which has done it seamlessly and beautifully. Yeah, even then like, uh, films like Aladdin where the villain has the animal sidekick, I feel like Anastasia borrowed heavily from that with its thematics there. Um, they just turned Iago into a weird little guy, which I loved. Yeah, so I exactly, I would have liked to see a bit more of the, I suppose that Don Bluth directed energy from the film like find its way into the musical.

[41:47] Eliza Gunther: I completely agree. I think that is something that it kind of lacks that little bit of punch that that character, those characters did bring. But I guess on a completely different topic now, let's talk a little bit about Broadway casting.

[42:00] Tori Bullard: As we've already said, the original cast, phenomenal. Love, love loved bits.

[42:04] Tori Bullard: And um, two fun facts, actually, was that the original Dimitri was actually Aaron Tveit and the original, and Angela Lansbury did the reading of the Duchess.

[42:18] Eliza Gunther: And I was like, that's iconic.

[42:20] Tori Bullard: That is such a good get. I have to say, I think Angela Lansbury would have been phenomenal in it.

[42:27] Tori Bullard: But I don't know how long she would have lasted in the show, I have to say. In terms of, I think even, and I saw it with Mary Beth Pyle, I believe that's how you say her name, and she was phenomenal, but you could definitely kind of see she got to a point in that run where she just went, I'm gonna gracefully bow out.

[42:52] Eliza Gunther: I've done my part, it's eight shows a week, it's a lot, and like I, I'm still, I was so happy and shocked though that Christy Altimore and Derek Clenner, along with a whole huge range of the ensemble, lasted through the entire run.

[43:08] Tori Bullard: Yeah, like I don't think that happens very, and I'm so glad that John Galton never left because he was one of my, other than Christy Altimore, he had to be my, uh, favourite other character.

[43:20] Eliza Gunther: I mean, my God, how can you not?

[43:22] Tori Bullard: Yeah, uh, phenomenal, iconic, but I mean the controversial one that we need to talk about. I think Tori has some thoughts on this, so I'm just like, they're gonna be controversial thoughts, I think.

[43:35] Eliza Gunther: I mean, you guys can enjoy controversy yourselves. I'm gonna sit over here in old man ignorance and say, ah, these lovely kids are talking about a pop star.

[43:44] Tori Bullard: Yeah, exactly. We are talking about Cody Simpson taking on the role of Dimitri.

[43:50] Tori Bullard: Now I've seen a couple of clips of this, um, and I wasn't mad about it. I totally wasn't that mad about it. But what do you think, Tori?

[43:57] Tori Bullard: Well, look, such a weird choice. Like I've got to say, but to be fair, Cody Simpson is like, okay, so he was the Aussie, and I think this is how most of us would have known him.

[44:10] Tori Bullard: The Aussie Justin Bieber.

[44:12] Eliza Gunther: Yes, oh 100%.

[44:14] Tori Bullard: For, uh, but did not last very long. Um, to me, it kind of disappeared off the face of the earth, like, you know, you would see stuff occasionally. Then all of a sudden one day, bam, on Broadway, and I was like, okay. And at first I was like, I'm sorry. The fuck? You're gonna have Derek Clenner, followed by a couple of other phenomenal actors, and then Cody Simpson. Interesting.

[44:39] Eliza Gunther: Didn't he do it? He was also now training to be an Olympic swimmer.

[44:45] Tori Bullard: Yes.

[44:46] Tori Bullard: Yeah, um, he actually, funnily enough, like seen him around, because I'm from the Gold Coast, and I used to be a state level swimmer. Um, so all in the same sort of circles, and I'm very confused by him. I'm like, good on you for being a swimmer and a singer because those two things do not go together. He keeps doing, like he's really, he's really, um, you know, like adapting. But I have to admit, people may not agree with me. He did close out, he did close it out, and so obviously I have seen footage of him. I'm not mad about it. He's far better, like his voice is actually really lovely.

[45:25] Tori Bullard: The only thing that I wasn't a huge fan of is one of my favourite things when watching a musical or watching any play, any form of TV show, anything, is when an actor has a moment where they're not doing anything, where they're not singing, they're kind of just their part of it. What do they do? You know, and it's one of my favorite things watching people just like, you know, they're completely in it. He definitely did pop in and out a little bit. It was a little bit like, okay, like what's, what am I, what's coming up now? Like, I didn't hate it, but I would just be so curious to find out how that happened.

[46:03] Eliza Gunther: I know. So such an interesting, of all the people, such an interesting choice. An Aussie pop singer.

[46:10] Tori Bullard: Well now, friends, that does bring us close to the end of the episode. But I do believe Tori prefaced this by saying she has a bit of a bedtime story regarding this show. So take it away, Tor.

[46:20] Tori Bullard: I do, I do. Um, and it's, it's kind of like a bedtime story, but also a stage door story. Um, so I saw this, um, in its opening year in 2018. Um, I went, um, January 2018, right after graduating. Um, I saw it twice in the same year, both times were phenomenal. And as I said earlier, Christy Altimore is like my, like I adore her and I adore her acting ability, I adore her just as a person.

[46:53] Tori Bullard: She always stage doored. And now that's never a requirement as an actor, putting that out there. It's never a requirement. We have a whole episode, if you want to listen to it, about stage door etiquette. Um, that's like back, like maybe like episode four of season one. Um, so there are a lot of things, um, there. Um, but actors did not have to do this, but she did it every single night and she stayed there. She missed the closing night party because she stayed at stage door for four hours because she just could not leave without talking like to as many people as she could.

[47:27] Tori Bullard: Um, so she stayed there for four hours doing stage door. Anyway, that's not part of my story. My story is I think Anastasia, uh, in 2018 when we went to New York was one of the first shows that we saw.

[47:39] Tori Bullard: Um, and it was my first time in New York, not understanding what stage dooring was. Um, and I think this was one of the first times I had done it. Um, maybe what, like the first or second, and like I did the thing that I think you should always do is I waited until the orchestra had finished. Um, like you would, because that's the polite thing. These people are here doing their job. Watch till the end. Do not leave before that because I saw lots of people do it. Um, and then went down to stage door, um, was kind of like all these people, and I was like, oh, I don't know.

[48:14] Tori Bullard: Anyway, Christy Altimore kind of came around and I like freaked out and got her to sign my thing. I didn't realise that you were like allowed to like do photos, that was a thing until I realized that everybody else around me was doing it. And my response was I went back to my mum, as a good 20-year-old would do, and started crying because I didn't actually say anything to her. I didn't get a photo with her, I didn't like, you know, she was like hugging people and stuff, and I was like, oh my God, I've lost it. I've lost my opportunity to like meet Christy Altimore, and like anyway, and then she was like, go to the end, like go like go to the like the end, like because she was like on her way around.

[48:38] Tori Bullard: And I was like, no, I can't do that, that's not fair. Anyway, I went to the end, still crying. Christy Altimore came around and kind of like looked at me and she was like, were you up there? And I was like, yes, but I was really nervous. I just started crying, and like she hugged me, and we had like a great little conversation, but I was also like the last person there, and I was also like, so I was like, you know, she's gonna like go home.

[49:15] Tori Bullard: Um, she doesn't have to be doing this. But we had like the loveliest conversation about theatre and like doing what you love, and I was just like a lot of the stage dooring I've done, and again, actors are not required to do stage door, nor do they have to, nor do they should they feel the need to, nor should they feel the need to give you anything that they don't want to give you. But not even a butt, it's just that Christy Altimore is so giving and so lovely to just the community in general.

[49:46] Tori Bullard: As long as you're lovely to her, she'll be lovely right back. And it was just one of the most humbling and lovely experiences having this person that I've just watched for like two and a half hours on stage, absolutely killing it. Just come back and be like, oh my God, thank you so much for coming to see the show. And you're like, oh my God, oh my God.

[50:08] Eliza Gunther: That's lovely.

[50:09] Tori Bullard: She was, and she was as lovely the second time that I met her later on that year, and she is just someone that is very, very, very committed, as every actor is, but just visibly so committed to what they do.

[50:22] Tori Bullard: Like the night before I saw it in the summer that year, my friend had seen it who I was studying with, and she said, oh yeah, she really hurt her ankle that night. Like, you could see you saw when she jumped off the chair, she like rolled it, she looked like it really hurt, and so she was like, yeah, I don't think she's gonna be on tomorrow night when you see it. And I was like, ah, damn, but also great, I get to see an understudy. How awesome is that?

[50:44] Tori Bullard: And there she was on stage, and we asked her afterwards, and she was like, yeah, it hurts a little bit, but she was like, also, the understudy, like, uh, my first understudy was feeling really unwell tonight, and I just didn't feel fair, like putting that on her, and I was like, why are you so nice? That is a very, very nice thing to do.

[51:03] Eliza Gunther: I think this whole story, stage door story is a lesson in, um, in how kindness and um, taking the time for people and really like thanking people is a beautiful thing in theatre, and to really um, not get so caught up in the big stuff that you forget the smaller things.

[51:22] Gareth Isaac: Yeah, theatre is an industry of the heart, and it's nice to see some people still applying that.

[51:27] Tori Bullard: Yeah, great story, Tor.

[51:29] Eliza Gunther: Thank you guys so much for listening to today's episode. We've had so much fun talking about Anastasia, and thank you so much for voting on our all our social media platforms.

[51:39] Tori Bullard: We will have another voting, um, what do you call it?

[51:44] Eliza Gunther: A poll.

[51:44] Tori Bullard: A poll, yes, we'll have another voting poll for our next show. So make sure you guys keep, uh, keep your ears and your eyes peeled on our Instagram.

[51:54] Eliza Gunther: Also, thank you so much to Gareth for being here today and chatting about Anastasia with us. You are an absolute legend.

[51:58] Gareth Isaac: He's always so prepared.

[52:01] Tori Bullard: As always, it's an utter pleasure.

[52:04] Gareth Isaac: So much fun, so much fun.

[52:05] Tori Bullard: Yep, it, it's keeping me from slowly going insane in lockdown, writing up new stuff about musicals.

[52:11] Gareth Isaac: So thank you guys. It's always a thrill.

[52:12] Tori Bullard: Thank you for being here. And you will be here next time, and we will have another deep dive for you. But until then, stay happy, healthy, and safe, and we'll see you later.

[52:21] Eliza Gunther: Bye.