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[0:06] Gordon Cox: Welcome to Stagecraft, Varieties Theater Podcast, bringing you backstage and behind the scenes with the stars and creators of the hottest shows on Broadway, off Broadway, and beyond.

[0:17] Gordon Cox: I'm your host, Gordon Cox.

[0:19] Gordon Cox: On this episode of Stagecraft, I'm talking to the writer, actress, comedian Rita Rudner. She's best known as a stand-up comic who rose to fame in the 80s and has been performing ever since in a career that's included a popular, long-running showcase in Las Vegas. But she got her start in the theater, performing in the original productions of legendary Broadway shows, including Follies and Mac and Mabel. She and her husband, Martin Bergman, have collaborated on films like Peter's Friends and a handful of plays. And their latest, To's a Crowd, is now running off Broadway at 59 East 59th Theatres. Rudner is in the studio with me to tell us about the inspiration for her new show, what she intends to have engraved on her tombstone, and what she learned from Gower Champion and David Merrick. Hi Rita, thanks for joining me.

[1:05] Rita Rudner: You're very welcome.

[1:06] Rita Rudner: I think you should add sweaty to that introduction.

[1:08] Gordon Cox: Yes, yes, it's very sweaty today here in New York.

[1:16] Rita Rudner: It means maybe I'll lose weight.

[1:18] Gordon Cox: It also means the listeners can't see your sweat nor smell it.

[1:23] Rita Rudner: Yeah, but now I've mentioned it, so that's true, it's in their head that attribute.

[1:27] Gordon Cox: Okay, never mind. I'm not sweaty, I'm really pristine.

[1:31] Rita Rudner: And it is fairly air conditioned in here, so it is, and it's let's just it's very white. It's got some very nice ice cube trays on the top of the ceiling with lights in them.

[1:41] Gordon Cox: Even though the building isn't finished, some of the lights have already gone out.

[1:44] Rita Rudner: Yes.

[1:45] Rita Rudner: We're working on it.

[1:47] Gordon Cox: I think you need a little bit of artwork.

[1:49] Rita Rudner: Yeah, I think that's true.

[1:50] Rita Rudner: Yeah, the walls are very bare.

[1:51] Gordon Cox: Okay, but otherwise I think it needs work.

[1:55] Rita Rudner: Yeah.

[1:56] Rita Rudner: That's what I think.

[1:57] Rita Rudner: But I'm happy to be here with you.

[1:59] Gordon Cox: Even though you're not as sweaty as I saw.

[2:01] Rita Rudner: No, only because I got here a little earlier.

[2:03] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[2:03] Gordon Cox: Well, I think you cheated. I saw your show, Choose a Crowd last night, and I really enjoyed it. And tell me why a stage show. You've written things before, of course, and you've written movies and plays, and why was this a stage?

[2:15] Rita Rudner: It's sort of a play with music. You do sing, but yes, we wanted to write an, well, we just kind of look around and see what's not there. And I always admired Neil Simon comedies, which to me are timeless. I mean, you look around and you still see the odd couple being performed all over the country. And Barefoot in the Park was even performed in the theater next door to me in our where we have our beach house, which we where we tried the show out.

[2:38] Gordon Cox: Right. So yeah, how long ago was that now?

[2:40] Rita Rudner: That was, was that last year or this? Last summer, I September. I don't know, somewhere there.

[2:45] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[2:45] Rita Rudner: And then Martin and I decided, well, what's not there is a show that addresses problems of older people and has witty dialogue. So that's what we wanted to do. We wanted to write a Neil Simon play with music.

[2:56] Gordon Cox: And why music?

[2:59] Rita Rudner: That's what we did. Because I used to sing on Broadway, and I just thought it would lighten the mood because we didn't want to write something, it tends to be Broadway tends to be divided into things that are very, very heavy or things that are very, very light. And there's nothing kind of in the middle. So we wanted to try something in the middle, and we didn't because we didn't want to do something to kill a mockingbird, which is important and a wonderful play. You can't add music to that because that's a serious, serious piece.

[3:30] Gordon Cox: Right.

[3:30] Rita Rudner: But there's another show that Martin and I both really liked when we were younger people going to shows on Broadway, which was They're Playing Our Song, which started Luciana's and Robert Klein.

[3:40] Gordon Cox: Right.

[3:41] Rita Rudner: And we just said, let's do something like that, where there's a light themed show where you could add music. So that's what we did.

[3:46] Gordon Cox: Right. Martin, we should say is Martin Bergman, he's your husband and also frequent collaborator. You've been collaborating with him for quite a long time now.

[3:54] Rita Rudner: We met because I was performing at Catch a Rising Star, and he was a comedy producer and a theatrical producer, and he was looking for shows to bring to Australia and to England and to the Edinburgh Festival, and he saw me and he had the good sense to think I was funny, and he hired me to do the Edinburgh Festival, and that was c we've been married for 31 years, so and then we didn't date for let me do math because I'm really my daughter's bad good at math. I'm bad. So then we knew each other for two years before that. So we knew each other for 33 years, and then we dated 33 years ago, but I knew him like 35 years. Two years I didn't date him, and then we did date, and then we got married 31 years ago.

[4:36] Gordon Cox: When did you start writing with or collaborating with him?

[4:38] Rita Rudner: The day I moved into his apartment on the Gold Coast in Australia. Oh we rented a typewriter, because that's how long ago it was. And we started collaborating on our first movie script, and then we both started reading books about movie scripts, which we do, which w what we did too with this musical play. We, you know, reading books about writing musicals and how to incorporate music that moves the theme along, and so we just started studying it and you do it over and over and over and over and over again until you get something right, and our first produced screenplay was Peter's Friends.

[5:10] Gordon Cox: Right, right. Um and what books were helpful for you for this project?

[5:14] Rita Rudner: Did you know? Oh, they're yeah, I never know the titles or anything, but there's lots of, you know, Broadway books for how to read music. And I had a lot of experience because I was in six musicals on Broadway. That is true. And I was in Mac and Mabel from the beginning, which was a tremendous, the other ones I was replacement in, but I was a tremendous learning experience. I mean, I saw Gower Champion just throw out huge bits of the show and bring huge bits in, and then I saw the producer David Merrick come and insist.

[5:41] Gordon Cox: These are legendary.

[5:42] Rita Rudner: I mean, all our listeners will know this, but these are legendary names that you're talking about.

[5:45] Rita Rudner: Yeah, well, I was that's why I was so excited to be in the show with David Merrick and Gower Champion and Bernadette Peters and Robert Preston. Yeah, right. I mean, it was a huge learning curve. And um it was interesting to see uh one of my favorite books, Oh Tell Me His Name, it's oh my favorite book about Broadway. And he died, and then he wrote screenplays, and then he was really good. Come on, you can do it. You can see William Goldman?

[6:08] Gordon Cox: Yes, you see, I know you can do it.

[6:09] Rita Rudner: Uh is it called the season? I think that's what that one's called.

[6:12] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[6:12] Rita Rudner: I look at you and you have all the knowledge right in your head. William Goldman and the season there can only be one muscle, and you if you've got two muscles, you're gonna have a bad clash in personalities. And Gower Champion and David Merrick were both the muscle. And Gower Champion was really terrific. But the minute David Merrick came in and started once, you know, he said, We've got to have a hello dolly number, we've got to have pretty costumes, we've got to do because he comes from a different place than Gower Champion, who's gonna follow the story. So it that was just such an interesting interval where we all got fitted for these gorgeous costumes and hats, and we he wrote a song, we all called it Hello Mabel.

And um when in the end of the first act, we we all came in and we danced in these gorgeous costumes and it had nothing to do with the show and it never appeared again. And David Merrick insisted that we use the costumes again, so we did them in the bow. And then no one knew who we were because they'd never seen us in these costumes. So it was really interesting. And I I used all of my experiences. We read lots of books and then we tried it out in our little playhouse and we're still tinkering but what we wanted to do that we know how much an audience loves good dialogue, witty dialogue and um classic confrontations between two styles of people trying to share the same space.

[7:29] Gordon Cox: Right, right. And you're also I know you're also at work on an autobiography. Was anything in To's a Crowd inspired by taken from your life or there's nothing on the autobiographical?

[7:34] Rita Rudner: No, we have but I do have friends who are very very much like my character who's Wendy Solomon who are very precise and organized. I used to say one of my friends you'd open her refrigerator and her food was on little hangers. You know she was just like a closet and but I mean you know everything's in alphabetical order and one of those people. I've never been one of those people I'm a mess. When I a burglar once broke into my house things were neater when he left. See that's my joke. But anyway I'm I'm much more Oscar than Felix. But this is kind of a classic Oscar Felix situation until they get to know each other.

[8:16] Gordon Cox: Right.

[8:16] Rita Rudner: And it's also about people having different layers because um that's one of the lines in this the play is I shouldn't judge a man by his shirt. Because this is a man who even though he's uh seems uh that they would have nothing in common they do connect on certain levels once they get to talking to each other.

[8:35] Gordon Cox: Right, right. And who, yeah, you said there can only be one muscle in a show according to I was just gonna ask, okay thank you.

[8:42] Rita Rudner: There's nobody else I mean I do see I have suggestions and we generally agree on things which is how we stay married. But um he is the one who decides things and but if I strongly disagree I'm gonna say it but it's very rare that I think his judgment is um not on the money.

[8:58] Gordon Cox: Yeah. What in general is your collaboration process like? How do you write together and on a sort of day-to-day design organized one?

[9:01] Rita Rudner: Okay, yeah and he has the computer and we have this great big desk because we bought a beach house in Laguna and we knocked it down but we saved a lot of the furniture because it was antique furniture and there was this huge desk and it's two sided. You don't see many two sided desks and it's all scarred up and we really love it. So he sits on one side and then I sit on the other side and I put my feet up and I stare at the ocean and then he says okay we need a joke here what can I say say the joke and then we just then we go out to lunch and then we discuss how we're gonna develop the character for the next scene and it's very enjoyable. And things I find things are much more enjoyable when you're doing them for free.

Because when Martin and I would um write we were loads of movies in Hollywood and we got paid a lot of money I have to say and we sold spec scripts and all of a sudden there was an influx of one time we we sold a script for so much money that um when Martin went to deposit the check the teller actually flirted with him. So I said well that's how you know it's a good check when the teller's flirting with you and you're depositing the check. But they drive you crazy.

[10:14] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[10:14] Rita Rudner: And you go you go in they're very mean they say uh someone this needs to be on page 20 it has someone has to be shot you're not following my rules and and they I just I just got so dispirited and then as one of my friends who's a screenwriter said I said I don't write um scripts, I write novels with stage directions because nothing ever gets made, you know, and then you go through the process. In fact, this is funny. So the very first writing job Martin and I got was for a movie called Um The It Just Got It Just Got Made. Okay, you're gonna know this one again. It just got made, and it's about four women who do the bank robbery.

[10:51] Gordon Cox: And see, I love you follow me around wherever?

[10:56] Rita Rudner: Sure.

[10:57] Rita Rudner: Widows. So 31 years ago or 30 years ago, that's the first script that Martin and I got to rewrite was Widows. And that's how long and how many incarnations things take. And w when we got the script, Linda LePlant, I think, who was the original writer had already been fired, as had many famous writers. And we they had just crossed their names off. And they and the first thing is how they're gonna fire you on the script. And I'm sure 20 more people got fired in 30 years. You can't we didn't want to live our lives like that anymore. So we found that um doing things by ourselves, and that's why I went to Las Vegas. I Martin produced the show, I wrote my things, we went straight to the audience, and we did really, really well.

[11:40] Gordon Cox: You are this is you are the longest running solo comedian show out there, is that right?

[11:46] Rita Rudner: Okay. Now I've lost that um I think I've lost that title to Carrot Top. But now I say I'm the longest running comedy show that's not named after a vegetable.

[11:56] Gordon Cox: See, there, yeah.

[11:57] Rita Rudner: So I can still say it, I just have to add vegetable.

[12:00] Gordon Cox: Right, yeah. And now you tour, yeah.

[12:02] Rita Rudner: I do, I do little like even here Monday night. I am out in I noticed that, yeah.

[12:06] Rita Rudner: And out in Morristown, New Jersey.

[12:09] Gordon Cox: Okay, yeah.

[12:09] Rita Rudner: And then on August 5th, I'm in the Argyll theater in the Babylon.

[12:15] Gordon Cox: Oh, I'm remembering things. See, I know things that you don't know too. You're not the only brainiac in this very, very sparse room.

[12:23] Rita Rudner: Um and so the uh you have a collaborator well uh for the music in Choose a Crowd. Who how did you find him?

[12:29] Rita Rudner: And well, I do lots of radio because I do um lots of promotions in and I raise lots of ch I do lots of charities. So I actually met um Jay Sinfetty, who we think is uh a fabulous musician, and at a charity show that I was doing for a local radio station, and we got to be friends, and we heard some of the songs that he'd written, and he actually had uh albums released in England and Martin and he became very good friends because they're both in both English. And when Martin finds somebody he can relate to from his from his homeland, it's very exciting for him, even though we've got a lot of American friends, we live in America, and we said, let's try. And he came up with some songs, and we're still rewriting a lot of them, but he's a witty, wonderful.

We wanted to write songs that were reminiscent of the Beatles and lighthearted music, and he we also wanted him, he was so effective in our show in Laguna, we added more of his singing as a narration plot and to move the um the show along because unfortunately we don't have huge mechanical um help and we don't push a button and all things move. We have to move our stage ourselves.

[13:48] Rita Rudner: I just think he's a fantastic composer and a fantastic musician and has an evocative voice.

[13:55] Gordon Cox: Don't you think so?

[13:55] Rita Rudner: Yeah, absolutely. I think he's a great addition to the show. He's a great voice to have a lot of people. And we wanted to do something different because that kind of never happens in a show.

[14:03] Gordon Cox: Yeah, right, right, yeah. So as we've talked a little bit about, you spent some time on Broadway. You sang and danced in a lot of shows that people will have heard of. You know, you were in Follies. You were in Annie. You were in Promises, Promises.

[14:18] Rita Rudner: Annie Magic Show, so long 16.

[14:20] Gordon Cox: Magic Show, the Doug Henning show, right?

[14:22] Rita Rudner: Yeah. I was understudy to Charmin.

[14:25] Gordon Cox: Uh-huh.

[14:26] Rita Rudner: And I got cut in half. And I got changed into a tiger. And it was very, I loved doing it. I was, and that was one of my standby jobs where I didn't have to go to the theater every night. Or I just had to call in. That was good. That was a good job.

[14:41] Gordon Cox: Yeah. What are your memories of Broadway in general at that time? This would have been in the sort of late 60s, 70s, early 80s.

[14:49] Rita Rudner: It was in the late 70s and eight. No, yeah. All through the 70s. Because my last show was in the 80s.

[14:55] Gordon Cox: Right.

[14:55] Rita Rudner: Yeah. And I came to New York when I was 15. And in fact.

[15:01] Gordon Cox: And you'd have been a dancer before then.

[15:02] Rita Rudner: Yeah, I studied dance and I started when I was four.

[15:04] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[15:04] Rita Rudner: Oh, yeah. I did all acrobatics, tap, jazz, mostly ballet. I was in ballet companies when I was 10 and 11. I was always a dancer. But you know, we just did the Apollo, the man of 50th anniversary.

[15:18] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[15:18] Rita Rudner: And I just remember, and I was 15 living by myself in the Barbazon Hotel for Women. There were no TVs or anything.

[15:24] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[15:25] Rita Rudner: And I went down and sat with all the old ladies, and we watched, because it was a bunch of old ladies at the Barbazon Hotel for Women, and I watched the landing on the moon on the black and white television. How weird is that? That I was 15 just sitting there with all God. But anyway, my daughter's 17, she's not allowed out of the house. In fact, she's here and she's the wardrobe mistress backstage, so I keep an eye on her.

[15:45] Gordon Cox: Okay, good.

[15:46] Rita Rudner: Yeah.

[15:47] Gordon Cox: Um and what, uh, well, first of all, I have to ask you about Follies because I feel like that is a show that is particularly legendary and sort of.

[15:55] Rita Rudner: Oh, wasn't that? I was so honored. I went right from Promises, Promises to Follies, and I replaced the legendary, I was the first replacement on Broadway and I replaced Scotziella Danielle.

[16:05] Gordon Cox: Oh wow.

[16:06] Rita Rudner: Who was a phenomenal dancer and choreographer. And but she did lead tango. And Margot, another girl, transferred into lead tango, and I took Margot's spot into the regular tango. But just to be one of the Follies girls was, I mean, I was on cloud nine that I could get a job like that.

[16:26] Gordon Cox: And um I was just honored to go into the theater every night.

[16:29] Rita Rudner: Yeah.

[16:30] Gordon Cox: And be in a show that was that important.

[16:33] Rita Rudner: Yeah, yeah. What, uh, is there a show in particular that has really meant a lot to you over the course of your career? You talked about Mac and Mabel.

[16:41] Rita Rudner: I think Follies and Mac and Mabel were my two favorite shows. I liked Annie. Annie was important because I had a part.

[16:45] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[16:47] Rita Rudner: Right. And I was Lily St. Regis, so I got to actually talk on Broadway in my own part rather than when someone broke a leg or you know, couldn't make it. So that was really important. But that was kind of the time I said, I've done this for ten years. Maybe I should try something else. There aren't too many female comedians, I'll try that.

[17:06] Gordon Cox: Right.

[17:07] Rita Rudner: Uh, were you a jokester before then? What led you to comedy, I guess, other than anything?

[17:14] Rita Rudner: Yeah. I was so quiet and people always said, "What's wrong with Rita?" And then people still say, "Well, Rita was never funny. Why is this happening?" I just decided to learn how to be funny. And I thought it was something that could be learned.

[17:25] Gordon Cox: Was it?

[17:29] Rita Rudner: Yeah.

[17:29] Gordon Cox: Yeah, right.

[17:31] Rita Rudner: Yeah. And so what are the rules? One day I'll write a book about it.

[17:34] Gordon Cox: Okay, yeah.

[17:35] Rita Rudner: I can't really say it in one little sentence. There's a lot that goes on.

[17:39] Gordon Cox: Right.

[17:39] Rita Rudner: And it seems effortless. It's the same, it's a lot the same as ballet, where when you, which is what I was schooled in, where when you see a ballerina you go, "Oh, that looks so easy."

[17:48] Gordon Cox: Sure.

[17:48] Rita Rudner: You know, anybody could do it. And then you try it.

[17:50] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[17:50] Rita Rudner: Right. And it's the same with comedy. You go, maybe people go, "Oh, my friend's funny. She should be on stage." And then they get on to, "Oh, well, it's not that easy, is it?"

[17:57] Gordon Cox: What of all your theatrical experience leading up to that, what in your theater experience prepared you? What did you feel well prepared for moving into the stand-up world that your sort of theatrical background?

[17:57] Rita Rudner: I guess that I was on stage, but that's the only thing.

[18:14] Gordon Cox: I was just gonna say okay, and what are the differences?

[18:16] Rita Rudner: Like everything is different. And dancing you don't stop moving, and in comedy you don't move.

[18:19] Gordon Cox: Right, right.

[18:20] Rita Rudner: And for, and I was so scared for a long time. Not only did I not move, I wouldn't let go of the microphone because I was just gripping onto it for dear life.

[18:28] Gordon Cox: In a totally different way than stage fright would have been for you on Broadway.

[18:32] Rita Rudner: It was a different kind of fear or something. There's nothing the same except I'm standing on a stage.

[18:37] Gordon Cox: Right.

[18:37] Rita Rudner: So I guess I must, and I used to, you know, talk on stage, do parts, but another thing that prepared me for Two's a Crowd was that this was my third play in Laguna. And Martin and I adapted my first novel, which was about becoming a comedian, Tickled Pink. And I played lots of parts in that and it was fun because I got wigs and I had to do voices, and I never did anything like that. Then I got sent a play to do in London and I didn't want to do it. It was a two-person play, but I like to challenge myself at least once a year to do something that's just out on a cliff. And this was my yearly cliff.

[19:16] Gordon Cox: Yeah, I was just gonna ask, is this it? Is this the cliff?

[19:18] Rita Rudner: This is my cliff. Next year is probably my autobiographical cliff.

[19:22] Gordon Cox: Right, yep.

[19:23] Rita Rudner: And let's see what other cliffs I can find.

[19:25] Gordon Cox: Comes after that, yeah.

[19:27] Rita Rudner: Um, as you mentioned, you were there weren't very many female comedians back when you were.

[19:33] Rita Rudner: I knew Joan Rivers and Phyllis Diller.

[19:34] Gordon Cox: Right.

[19:35] Rita Rudner: That's all I was aware of. And how hard was it to break through?

[19:39] Rita Rudner: Did you extremely hard?

[19:41] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[19:41] Rita Rudner: There's nothing easy. I've tried everything. It's gonna be on my tombstone. Nothing was easy. And then if Molly, my daughter, ever comes to visit me, it's gonna say, "What have you accomplished today?" She's gonna, she's gonna, I make her crazy when I say that.

[19:57] Gordon Cox: I'm not gonna come visit you then.

[19:58] Rita Rudner: Uh, you're gonna come visit me is gonna say, "What have you accomplished today?"

[20:03] Gordon Cox: Um, has things improved in the comedy world to your view?

[20:06] Rita Rudner: I think so. I think very slowly and you know, marginally, but what I've found is that comedic actresses are now allowed to star in movies, which didn't really happen when I was a comedian. You know, like I think Amy Schumer starring and writing in her own movie is a fantastic step forward. And there's so many great comedic actresses now, with, you know, Kristen Wiig and Amy Poehler and Tina Fey and Melissa McCarthy, and I could just, you know, keep going on. I just think, and they're allowed to star in movies, which it was always Adam Sandler and Claudia Schiffer is the wife. Or somebody who was always, you know, Michelle Pfeiffer is the new comedian. She's now so funny. Kim Basinger's never been funnier in, but now real women who are funny are allowed to star in movies. So I think that's a tremendous step forward.

[20:59] Gordon Cox: Who or what do you consider the sort of biggest influence on your sense of humor?

[21:03] Rita Rudner: Jack Benny and Woody Allen.

[21:04] Gordon Cox: The two of them.

[21:05] Rita Rudner: Yes. I loved Woody Allen's writing and I thought he was a fantastic comedy writer. I used to listen to his albums in the 60s from that hungry, what was it? Hungry Eye, Hungry Foot, Hungry Toe. I don't know. Something like that. It was a hungry part of your body. And then Jack Benny, my mom always liked him, and I love that he was so understated. And I realized that my persona could never be aggressive because of who I was as a person, and I decided to kind of concentrate on an understated sort of comedy, which I got from those two people.

[21:40] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[21:40] Rita Rudner: Have your feelings about Woody Allen as a comedian changed at all?

[21:44] Rita Rudner: Yes, I stopped going to see his shows when he married his stepdaughter.

[21:50] Gordon Cox: Oh yeah.

[21:51] Rita Rudner: Yeah. I do and I just thought that he, I think he was wonderful, but I think that everybody needs some editing. And for some reason he was somebody who I wrote a movie every year, no matter what happens. And it just, you know, I think that there's nothing better than Hannah and Her Sisters. Annie Hall was a watershed movie for me, and I saw it over and over. And I went to see everything, Love and Death, and you know, all he's wonderful.

[22:21] Gordon Cox: Sure.

[22:21] Rita Rudner: But I think he, you can't just, "I'm writing a movie every year, I'm doing it." Yeah. You know, how about spending some time on it?

[22:28] Gordon Cox: Right, right.

[22:29] Rita Rudner: Um, and so you are here in New York.

[22:33] Gordon Cox: Yes, we're here to the twenty fifth, and we are doing lots of shows and the audiences are really, really enjoying them.

[22:41] Rita Rudner: Where do you hope it goes next?

[22:42] Gordon Cox: We don't know. We'll have to wait and see. We're still, you know, tinkering with it, and we always had offers, like I had a lot of offers to do the play I did in Laguna, which was called Act Three, which was written by a different playwright and it was sent to me. And I have to figure out if it's worth it for me to uproot everything. And right now the only reason, you know, I love doing this play and I'm so fortunate, you know, to be at 59 East 59th Theater. And it's a great little theater off, uh, it's technically an off-Broadway theater.

[23:11] Rita Rudner: Yes, and right off Central Park might be on 59th Street. But this is my daughter's last year of high school and the reason that this fit into our plans is that she's here with us and we gave her her first job and she's very good. She does has a headset on and she's running around to getting everything washed and cleaned and preset and she hasn't made a mistake. I've made a few and she hasn't made a mistake.

[23:35] Gordon Cox: Sure.

[23:35] Rita Rudner: So I have to see if it fits in with our agenda.

[23:37] Gordon Cox: Right.

[23:38] Rita Rudner: How do you find when you're acting and playing a role how do you feel like that kind of intersects and interacts with the comic?

[23:38] Rita Rudner: Well, we inserted some things where I can talk to the audience.

[23:51] Gordon Cox: Yes, that's true.

[23:51] Rita Rudner: I noticed that last night, yeah, because I enjoy talking to the audience and I always feel because I'm so used to it I have a special connection when I talk directly to the audience. And it kind of gives you an insight into what this woman is thinking in her inner self. So we might add a little bit more of that as the time goes on because it seems to be working so well.

[24:12] Gordon Cox: Right, right. So I think that informs the play.

[24:15] Rita Rudner: Yeah, yeah. Um, do you have other plays or plays with music or musicals even that you're considering writing with?

[24:17] Rita Rudner: Oh, now I gotta finish my, I mean I did finish my autobiography but I'm gonna go over and over and over and then see what I can do with that. But and I have loads of, luckily I have loads of stand-up work whenever I want to do it.

[24:36] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[24:38] Rita Rudner: And it's really fun. And I love it. People go, "Oh, you poor thing, you've got to travel." Oh, it's so hard. You know, I get on a plane, I order mimosa.

[24:42] Gordon Cox: Yeah.

[24:46] Rita Rudner: I read a book. I don't have anyone saying, "Make me dinner, wash the dishes, you know, mom, where's my socks?"

[24:52] Gordon Cox: Right.

[24:53] Rita Rudner: Yeah. And then I go there and I tell my jokes. Everyone's really nice to me. And I stay in a hotel and I have a glass of wine and I bring it up to the, and I watch my television. I go to sleep. And it's like being on a little vacation. I read a book, I read a magazine, and then they get paid and everybody's happy.

[25:10] Gordon Cox: How often does your act, how much does your act change show to show?

[25:14] Rita Rudner: Does it? I always try to give do new things all the time. I've got a whole bunch of notes right there.

[25:20] Gordon Cox: Okay.

[25:21] Rita Rudner: That I'm gonna, uh, two to three, I can only do two to three things at the most. New things because my brain doesn't really absorb that many new things and you never know what's gonna happen. So I always have to hammock it between two jokes that work and then put it in a specific place and it's a complicated procedure.

[25:41] Gordon Cox: Where are you finding most of your inspiration for your jokes these days?

[25:44] Rita Rudner: And the fact that I don't know how anything works these days and technology that I stay away from political humor because first of all it changes every day.

[25:53] Gordon Cox: Yep.

[25:54] Rita Rudner: So if I would write something today, next Monday it would be obsolete and no one would be caring about it. And I think it's a perfect platform for people who have a nightly show or even a weekly show, but not for someone who has a show that has to build and have longevity.

[26:10] Gordon Cox: Right, right.

[26:11] Rita Rudner: You know, raising a teenager, being married for a really long time.

[26:16] Gordon Cox: Yep.

[26:16] Rita Rudner: All these things that people can relate to.

[26:18] Gordon Cox: Right, right. Well, we look forward to seeing you on stage both in Two's a Crowd and in your comedy shows. And thanks for being here. Enjoy the run of your show.

[26:27] Rita Rudner: Thank you. I'm gonna enjoy it and I'm gonna take a shower.

[26:30] Gordon Cox: Okay, do please.

[26:32] Rita Rudner: Okay. Thanks, Rita. Nice to talk to you.

[26:34] Rita Rudner: Thank you. Bye.

[26:41] Gordon Cox: That was Rita Rudner, the co-writer and star of Two's a Crowd, playing this summer at Off Broadway's 59 East 59th Theaters. And you can also catch her stand-up sets at various stops around the country.

[27:04] Gordon Cox: Or tell a friend. I'll be back with another new episode in two weeks. Until then, see you at the theater.