This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:01] Mikayla Petrilla: Hey, everyone, and welcome to Tea Time with Mikayla. This is Tea Time. I'm Mikayla, and you're listening on the Broadway Podcast Network.

[0:14] Mikayla Petrilla: Friends, the kettle is on, the guitars are chonky, and today's tea has distortion.

[0:20] Mikayla Petrilla: My guest today is Matt Copley, recording artist, creator, theatrical producer, frontman of the band Unwell, and the mind behind Broadway Does Punk, the viral project that takes the Broadway songs you know and love and gives them new teeth.

[0:33] Mikayla Petrilla: Matt's work lives at this really fun, deeply theatrical intersection of musical theater, punk, rock, Internet culture, fandom, and live performance.

[0:41] Mikayla Petrilla: And what I love about this conversation is that it is not just about going viral, although we do get into that. It's about building your own lane when the lane you want doesn't fully exist yet.

[0:51] Mikayla Petrilla: We talk about growing up as a musical theater kid, finding rock music and Phil Collins, life on tour, which does include Planet Fitness, believe it or not, and how Broadway Does Punk is making the jump from the Internet to the stage.

[1:05] Mikayla Petrilla: And that part is happening very soon. Broadway Does Punk plays October 2nd and 3rd at the Abrons Arts Center in New York City with a full rock show experience and a lineup of Broadway guest artists.

[1:15] Mikayla Petrilla: So if you're listening in real time, go check that out immediately. It is almost sold out. It is Broadway, it is punk, it is chaos, it is catharsis, and frankly, it feels very Tea Time.

[1:25] Mikayla Petrilla: So pour yourself something strong, emotionally caffeinated, and please enjoy the conversation with Matt.

[1:32] Mikayla Petrilla: Welcome to Tea Time. Matt, I am so happy to have you here.

[1:36] Matt Copley: Thank you for having me.

[1:37] Mikayla Petrilla: Thanks for coming again because you filmed an episode earlier today in the same space, which is awesome.

[1:43] Mikayla Petrilla: Important tea question first. What is your drink of choice to keep you fueled for a day? Is it tea, coffee?

[1:49] Matt Copley: It's black coffee. Black drip coffee.

[1:53] Mikayla Petrilla: Ooh, black drip. Okay, okay.

[1:56] Matt Copley: Something a little just like to really kickstart my day and wake me up. And that's what I found works best.

[2:01] Mikayla Petrilla: You know, I hear that. I get that. And you know why? You're probably saving money in the long term.

[2:06] Matt Copley: I don't know.

[2:07] Mikayla Petrilla: In the long term.

[2:08] Matt Copley: I hope so.

[2:09] Mikayla Petrilla: I'm hitting myself with espresso and I'm like, I need more.

[2:12] Matt Copley: That's the thing with espresso drinks, too, is like, yeah, it hits me good for like 30 minutes and then I'm like crashing.

[2:18] Matt Copley: And drip is like hot, so hot enough where I can just like keep sipping it for like a long time.

[2:23] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, it kind of sounds like this steady like buzz, if you will.

[2:27] Matt Copley: A steady buzz, if you will, is correct.

[2:29] Matt Copley: And then it's like you don't have to worry about the sugar crashes if you're drinking it black, which is great.

[2:34] Matt Copley: You still get a little bitter taste.

[2:36] Mikayla Petrilla: Okay, so when somebody asks you what you do, how do you answer?

[2:40] Matt Copley: That's a really good question. I usually say I'm a singer or I say I'm an artist.

[2:45] Mikayla Petrilla: That's kind of, yeah.

[2:47] Matt Copley: Do you think of yourself as like a musician first, theater person first, or is it the multi-hyphenate life?

[2:52] Matt Copley: That's a really good question. I think just based on the last few years of my life, I identify more with like musicians, like I'm a singer, like I'm an artist or a musician first.

[3:01] Matt Copley: But based on like my life as a whole, I'm definitely a multi-hyphenate kind of person.

[3:06] Mikayla Petrilla: That's the way to go. That is the way the industry is going right now.

[3:09] Matt Copley: That is definitely me, too.

[3:11] Mikayla Petrilla: So we've got to like integrate all the different parts of ourselves.

[3:14] Mikayla Petrilla: Everyone needs to be every role ever right now.

[3:17] Matt Copley: So yeah, I think like that's just that's just the life and a creative person.

[3:21] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes. Well, we were talking about Peter before and he was saying that especially with Broadway shows now, the casts are so much smaller that it's like you need to be able to do so many things.

[3:31] Mikayla Petrilla: Like you're always looking for these unicorns, not to say you need to create extra skills where there aren't before unless you're genuinely interested.

[3:39] Mikayla Petrilla: But every part of what you do is going to tie in to the parts that you get, which I think is great.

[3:44] Matt Copley: Yeah. OK, let's start with the obvious. How does a musical theater kid get into the guy making Broadway punk covers?

[3:51] Matt Copley: It's it's a culmination of how I grew up. I grew up in like community theater shows.

[3:57] Matt Copley: My mom directed a bunch of she got me into it at a really young age.

[4:01] Matt Copley: And then I did like, you know, the traditional theater kid track I did in middle school and my high school shows.

[4:06] Matt Copley: And we had this little community theater stuff along the way.

[4:09] Matt Copley: But at the same time, I was really into like Warped Tour kind of bands like like emo bands like All Time Low and May Day Parade and Sleeping with Sirens.

[4:18] Matt Copley: Yeah, so it was like all those Warped Tour bands, if you will, that I grew up with that I was that was just my music taste.

[4:25] Matt Copley: But I never thought of melding, I guess, the two together until much later in my life.

[4:29] Matt Copley: But both of those things were introduced to me so young.

[4:32] Matt Copley: And then I kind of grew my love for both of those in tandem like along the way.

[4:38] Matt Copley: And yeah, in 2020 or 2021, we finally got the first kind of taste of both worlds, I guess.

[4:46] Matt Copley: Yeah, she would not be able to tell from me.

[4:49] Matt Copley: But growing up in Jersey, they would have Warped Tour and Bonnaroo at a Six Flags Great Adventure every summer.

[4:56] Matt Copley: And I would go like I was I had a season pass so I could see All Time Low.

[5:01] Matt Copley: I could see Good Charlotte.

[5:03] Matt Copley: And I was like wearing this weird looking Avril Lavigne denim black vest.

[5:07] Matt Copley: I was like, this is me.

[5:08] Matt Copley: But it was so good.

[5:11] Mikayla Petrilla: Highlight of your summer of your childhood.

[5:13] Matt Copley: And dude, those are not a roller coaster and see All Time Low.

[5:16] Matt Copley: Like, please.

[5:17] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[5:18] Matt Copley: The fact that it was at Six Flags is honestly iconic because it is kooky.

[5:22] Mikayla Petrilla: It is kooky.

[5:23] Mikayla Petrilla: You grew up in Michigan.

[5:24] Matt Copley: Yeah.

[5:25] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[5:26] Matt Copley: And Michigan at Warped Tours held at a couple different places.

[5:28] Matt Copley: But it was normally just like a big like arenas parking lot.

[5:31] Mikayla Petrilla: So it wasn't as cool as Six Flags.

[5:33] Matt Copley: But no, but it's so cool.

[5:35] Mikayla Petrilla: I love that.

[5:36] Mikayla Petrilla: What was your favorite musical theater show when you were a kid?

[5:40] Matt Copley: Your favorite role to play? What was your like theater boy special?

[5:44] Matt Copley: This is so crazy. But I was in my high school theater's production of Tarzan.

[5:51] Matt Copley: And dude, I was like for like a year.

[5:54] Matt Copley: Oh yeah. For like a year or two, dude.

[5:56] Matt Copley: I was into Phil Collins and like everything up his alley.

[6:01] Matt Copley: Like going back to like Genesis.

[6:03] Matt Copley: And then like also I became like theater kid obsessed with Tarzan and Phil Collins.

[6:08] Mikayla Petrilla: As you should.

[6:09] Matt Copley: For like a year. It was like weird.

[6:11] Matt Copley: But it was fun.

[6:12] Mikayla Petrilla: No, it's not weird. You know what? Also, I went to my good friend's wedding.

[6:17] Mikayla Petrilla: Her father-daughter dance was to You'll Be in My Heart.

[6:21] Matt Copley: And I was like Phil Collins.

[6:24] Matt Copley: Dude, Phil Collins is that guy.

[6:26] Mikayla Petrilla: Phil Collins like came for this wedding.

[6:29] Mikayla Petrilla: It was like it is Tarzan.

[6:31] Mikayla Petrilla: It is Phil Collins on the speaker.

[6:34] Mikayla Petrilla: We got so many good hits from him, but I don't think we will ever have enough.

[6:39] Matt Copley: Like I wish he was still actively writing a bunch of stuff.

[6:42] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[6:43] Matt Copley: Yeah, he's insane.

[6:45] Matt Copley: And the fact that Disney got him to do the whole soundtrack is just like it was unreal.

[6:49] Mikayla Petrilla: The fact that you got to sing that through your high school years as well.

[6:52] Mikayla Petrilla: It's like that's so sick.

[6:54] Matt Copley: That's so sick.

[6:55] Matt Copley: Yeah, it was silly.

[6:56] Matt Copley: But it was I mean, that was very formative for me in my youth.

[7:00] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes.

[7:01] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes.

[7:02] Mikayla Petrilla: Impressionable youths by Phil Collins.

[7:04] Matt Copley: And that's funny that it was Tarzan too.

[7:06] Matt Copley: Because otherwise you're watching videos of Phil Collins and Genesis.

[7:09] Matt Copley: And it's just him in like the most dad like business casual attire.

[7:13] Matt Copley: Like he's wearing a vest while he's doing In the Air Tonight.

[7:16] Mikayla Petrilla: And you're like, what?

[7:18] Matt Copley: Like, yes, Phil.

[7:19] Matt Copley: That is decidedly not punk, but decidedly informing a whole generation of you can do it all.

[7:25] Mikayla Petrilla: Dude, yeah, you can do it all.

[7:27] Matt Copley: Absolutely.

[7:28] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[7:29] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes.

[7:31] Mikayla Petrilla: Tarzan, Phil Collins, All Time Low. This is what went into your stew.

[7:35] Matt Copley: Stew? Ew.

[7:36] Mikayla Petrilla: We can't say salad because of the diarrhea virus.

[7:40] Mikayla Petrilla: Favorite punk bands?

[7:42] Matt Copley: All Time Low. Sleeping with Sirens. I mean, I think I think they were when I was younger, for sure.

[7:47] Mikayla Petrilla: What are they now?

[7:48] Matt Copley: Now? Oh, man, there's just there's so many. I really like this band Colorblind.

[7:52] Matt Copley: We toured with them a couple years ago. They're amazing.

[7:55] Matt Copley: They're they're on the come up. They're hot and new and young. They're awesome.

[7:58] Mikayla Petrilla: Okay. Shout out, Travis.

[8:00] Matt Copley: And I really like I'm so back at like, remember it because I follow my Spotify playlist.

[8:04] Matt Copley: And like these days, like I just listen to like curated stuff and then like save my favorites.

[8:08] Matt Copley: I'm trying to think off the top of my head without pulling my phone out.

[8:11] Matt Copley: Oh, there's this new band called Breakaway with three K's. All in one word. Breakaway.

[8:15] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[8:16] Matt Copley: No, but they're super sick.

[8:20] Matt Copley: They're like heavy, chonky, riffy guitars. But it's like this, like this woman singer that's incredibly soft, but powerful.

[8:29] Matt Copley: It's so cool.

[8:30] Matt Copley: I love The Plot In You is a band that is also from Toledo, Michigan area.

[8:36] Matt Copley: And they've been a band for a very long time. But they're most recently getting like this crazy success.

[8:41] Matt Copley: They just went on tour with Bring Me The Horizon, opening them for like, like two years straight, basically.

[8:47] Matt Copley: And they're really cool. They're really heavy, but they're really, they're really unique.

[8:52] Matt Copley: They're really unique.

[8:53] Mikayla Petrilla: I love that.

[8:55] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, that's great.

[8:56] Mikayla Petrilla: Back to when you were young, were you dressing like a theater kid? Were you a theater kid? Or were you dressing punk?

[8:59] Matt Copley: Because I'm thinking like, I know like Three Days Grace. I was like all into it. And I was like, I can't escape this.

[9:05] Matt Copley: I'm wearing an outfit from Kohl's. And it's like, was there a dissonance there for you as well?

[9:15] Matt Copley: Or were you fully like, I'm locked in?

[9:17] Matt Copley: Oh, there was a dissonance for sure. I mean, I would like be adventurous and wear like the Hot Topic studded belts.

[9:25] Matt Copley: You know, like the Hot Topic Spencer special. PacSun jeans, American Eagle t-shirts.

[9:32] Matt Copley: Dude, this is perfect.

[9:35] Matt Copley: I mean, hey, it was never a phase.

[9:38] Matt Copley: It was never a phase.

[9:39] Matt Copley: But yeah, no. So I definitely like got adventurous here and there.

[9:43] Matt Copley: But no, I was I was like a kind of geeky, just theater kid.

[9:47] Matt Copley: There was my seventh grade year of school. The entire year, I wore the same sweatshirt every single day.

[9:54] Matt Copley: And I don't know why, why or why I did that. It was like this disgusting, like blue.

[10:00] Matt Copley: Disgusting.

[10:01] Mikayla Petrilla: I don't know.

[10:02] Matt Copley: But yeah, my clothing and my fashion taste as a kid was interesting.

[10:08] Mikayla Petrilla: We're all figuring it out.

[10:09] Matt Copley: Yeah.

[10:10] Mikayla Petrilla: My mom cut my bangs for a long time.

[10:12] Matt Copley: Hell yeah.

[10:13] Mikayla Petrilla: You know, we get to where we need to be.

[10:15] Matt Copley: But look how well put you are now.

[10:17] Matt Copley: Oh, thank you.

[10:18] Mikayla Petrilla: It was great then, too.

[10:19] Mikayla Petrilla: It is a journey to discovery.

[10:21] Mikayla Petrilla: So speaking of discovery, what was the first Broadway song that you were like? This could be punk.

[10:24] Matt Copley: I guess it was the first one I really put out, which was Defying Gravity.

[10:29] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[10:30] Matt Copley: Just the lyrics of it. I was like, dude, like, she's so angsty. Like, she's you know, she's got a lot to say here.

[10:36] Matt Copley: I mean, obviously. But I was like, I feel I was like, there's we can make this instrumental nasty.

[10:42] Matt Copley: And like, put some like chonky guitars behind it and really, like, give some grit to this vocal performance.

[10:48] Matt Copley: And like, make it a make it make it like an angsty pop punk song.

[10:52] Mikayla Petrilla: And you did. I'm not going to lie. Before I knew you, I was helping out at a Schmackary's.

[10:56] Matt Copley: Oh, my God.

[10:59] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes. Yeah.

[11:00] Matt Copley: They had it on a Schmackary's.

[11:02] Mikayla Petrilla: Oh, my God.

[11:03] Matt Copley: Oh, my God.

[11:04] Mikayla Petrilla: This is sick.

[11:05] Matt Copley: Shout out Schmackary's.

[11:06] Mikayla Petrilla: I was trying to serve cookies. And I was like, uh, uh, uh.

[11:10] Matt Copley: I just miss myself because this is great.

[11:13] Mikayla Petrilla: But yeah, you're, you're playing live on the Schmackary's.

[11:16] Matt Copley: Okay. All right. Shout out Schmackary's, man. Thank you.

[11:19] Mikayla Petrilla: So did Broadway Does Punk, was that a strategy, a joke, an experiment, or like an artistic need for you?

[11:26] Matt Copley: It was an experiment. For sure. It was, it stemmed from, of all places, like a marketing.

[11:31] Matt Copley: Because TikTok was huge during the pandemic, right? And it blew up and everyone thinks.

[11:34] Matt Copley: So we were trying to find, I was in a band, Unwell, because of that we just formed in 20 during the pandemic.

[11:39] Matt Copley: And then we recorded our first.

[11:41] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes, yes, yes.

[11:42] Matt Copley: Yes. It says Unwell right here.

[11:44] Mikayla Petrilla: Yes.

[11:45] Matt Copley: And that's why my handle is Mattis Unwell as well.

[11:47] Matt Copley: As well, Unwell.

[11:48] Mikayla Petrilla: He is Unwell as well.

[11:50] Matt Copley: But my band recorded a new EP. And with our label, we were trying to figure out like a good marketing plan for, for, for the music.

[11:59] Matt Copley: And we were trying to figure out like what was authentic and like unique to me and the band as a whole.

[12:04] Matt Copley: And I was like, well, I have a degree in musical theater, but I mean, I'm in this like post-hardcore band.

[12:08] Matt Copley: Like, it'd be funny to combine those two.

[12:11] Mikayla Petrilla: And that's literally all it was.

[12:12] Matt Copley: It was just like, that's the idea.

[12:13] Matt Copley: And my bandmates weren't super stoked about it because they're not like very forwardly theater or Broadway people.

[12:19] Matt Copley: Forwardly.

[12:20] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah.

[12:21] Matt Copley: Not forwardly.

[12:22] Matt Copley: Yeah. We got them on board and I was just like, let's just do one. And if it hits, like it hits and we'll, and we'll ride that wave.

[12:29] Matt Copley: But if it doesn't, we'll never have to do it again.

[12:30] Matt Copley: And then that was Defying Gravity.

[12:32] Mikayla Petrilla: And it hit.

[12:33] Matt Copley: And here we are.

[12:34] Mikayla Petrilla: It hit.

[12:35] Matt Copley: Yeah.

[12:36] Mikayla Petrilla: Well, I feel like musical theater people and people that are into punk both have like secretly very, or maybe not secretly, very intense feelings.

[12:42] Matt Copley: Is that the overlap?

[12:43] Matt Copley: It has to.

[12:44] Mikayla Petrilla: I mean, yeah.

[12:45] Matt Copley: Yeah.

[12:46] Matt Copley: From what I've, you know, come to hear and see from a lot of people online is emo music is very wear your heart on your sleeve.

[12:51] Matt Copley: I mean, so is Broadway. I mean, it's, it's all story.

[12:52] Mikayla Petrilla: Right.

[12:55] Matt Copley: Yeah. It's all story and it's all about your, the emotions that are so forward and how you perform.

[13:00] Matt Copley: And I think that is like a big part of the overlap.

[13:02] Matt Copley: And also I feel like theater, I'm speaking very generically here, but people that were up in the Warped Tour emo phase were also like kind of, they felt or were seen as like outsiders, I guess, or outcasts from like the sports kids in high school or whatever.

[13:15] Matt Copley: I feel like that's the same.

[13:16] Matt Copley: Five that theater kids also got, like I was part of the drama club in high school, not sports. And I feel like there is a lot of overlap in those communities and feeling like outsiders. So to combine both of those two, it just makes one super group.

[13:31] Mikayla Petrilla: And that's so well said. Yeah, I'm thinking about, not to go back to the dissonance, but being like so emotionally free listening to emo music, but then also like next on the shuffle on your iPod Nano is like Seussical. Yeah.

[13:44] Matt Copley: And you're like, oh my god, both elements. I like, I feel seen in so many ways. I'm crying. So we talked about chunky guitars, but what makes musical theater songs work in a rock or punk arrangement? How do you have to rearrange it? Or what already works? What do you think?

[14:01] Matt Copley: There's not like one answer. Each song is so uniquely different. Because that's what I love about this project as a whole, too, is like each of these musical theater writers and composers have their own unique flair and the way they write and the melodies they write and the lyrics they write. So each song truly is its own unique approach to how I'm going to arrange it. Some songs I have to like really dig in there and like rearrange things, cut things, chant, like just basically make it into like a pop song kind of structure. And other songs kind of like to find gravity or like really just like made for it. Like the melodies are like very poppy, like maybe I'll repeat an extra chorus just for funsies or like, yeah, stuff like that.

But it's there's a good mix of like, I have to do I want to rearrange a lot and stuff where I'm like, I really don't have to change like anything. I'll just sing it like how I sing it and add some heavy guitars to it and call it a day. And some and I don't think the amount of work I have to put into arranging or not arranging really defies how or defines how successful it's going to be. I think it's just just the luck of the draw. Some songs are really hit and some some don't as much but regardless, they're all fun. Yeah, it's a really fun experiment to be like, okay, I want to try this composer's work or I want to try this musical and it might be more or less of a challenge to rearrange it.

But what a fun thing to do. I'll tell you what, Sondheim is the one that's like the hardest by far. I'm sure you could probably guess that. But like, I've only tried, I did one Sweeney Todd cover online. Yeah, that one wasn't so bad, but I've tried a lot. And there's a lot that are sitting in the recycling bin at home. So it's hard to at least online for like 30 second clips and songs that like usually do well or go viral. It needs to be like catchy and repeatable or like something that and that's just like Sondheim does not really write like that. Yeah. Which is awesome, which is beautiful. It's just like not as it's so hard to do what I do to that kind of you certainly can't like I'm picturing some screamo elements of this and it's it's just so hard when there's a lot of patter like your fault could be so fun.

But then it's like you can't have any of the patter you would just be like, it's your fault. Yeah, and I'm sure you know down the line though, there will be more Sondheim stuff that I do. It'll just require a lot more time and creativity, I think on my part to.

[16:27] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah. So do you have a present core team? Are you still working with your band? Or how do you approach from start to finish? Like I want to work on this song. Here's what I'm going to do.

[16:32] Matt Copley: Yeah, I still work with the same people I've worked with from the beginning. So it's me and I have two writing partners, Drew Bender and Chris Mandel. And they are also in UNWELL with me. They're my bandmates. And I went to high school with Chris. Yes. But Drew's Drew and Chris are producers and recording engineers full time for like bands, different rock bands, metal, all kinds of genres. But that's kind of like their day jobs. And so but they're there's been my writing partners throughout this process from the start of this project. And yeah, so every week, I'll text them and I'll be like, okay, so this week, like, I want to do this song. Here's the cut. Let's figure it out. And then we just take like six to eight hours and rip it out. And that's it. We've got it down to like a pretty good process now.

[17:13] Mikayla Petrilla: Right? For the most part. Yeah, once you can establish process, it's like, let's make it out. But now you just moved to New York.

[17:23] Matt Copley: Yeah, yeah. So will that look different for you? Or are we on Zoom?

[17:30] Matt Copley: Honestly, not a ton because we already worked pretty remotely. Okay. Because yeah, we just do everything like on Zoom or on FaceTime. But beautiful if you can get that to your science. Yeah, because I mean, well, they'll start writing the guitars or the drums or something and I'll just be on FaceTime. And if I have notes, or I want a certain part to go a certain way, I'll just tell them and then we'll just send their files back over to me to cut the vocals and like do production elements on it. And I'll send it back for them to mix. And then that's that. So it is a lot of back and forth and communicating. But like we've been doing it for the past like year or two already just like that. So it's it's moving here hasn't really changed.

[18:00] Mikayla Petrilla: That's great. What tools are using like Audacity or you're just like getting stems from the different tracks and plugging it into?

[18:04] Matt Copley: Yeah, we use different DAWs or digital audio workstations. So I work in Pro Tools, they work in a program called Cubase. Right? There's a bunch of logic, there's Reaper, there's a bunch of other programs. Is Audacity still even a thing? Or is that like 20 years?

[18:18] Matt Copley: I don't know. I really don't know. I think I think so. I have such a limited scope of audio engineering, like you lab I know a little bit, but I don't even know. I know. Yeah, that's just logic. But then I'm really just like adding a little reverb on myself tapes if I need.

[18:30] Mikayla Petrilla: That's all you need. I mean, it's like these programs are so complex. But like at the end of the day, like you only use what you need to get out of those programs. Like I probably only use like less than 1% of the features that it can do because all I need to do is record my vocals and send them to Drew, the producer to, you know, make them sound great. So like, I don't really, yeah, they're awesome. But yeah, that's how that's how like, that's how our workflow kind of works. There's just a lot of sending stems, like individual stems and like stuff. And then he makes him he mixes it and masters it makes it sound all pretty.

[19:10] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah. Okay, so when you post talk me through and this might be a whole other section, TikTok culture, help a girl out help us out. Like I'm trying to make videos. I'm trying to do musical parody videos, whatever. Let's just use that as an example. Okay. Do you lip sync over yourself over the track? Or are you singing? Like, what do you do to make videos?

[19:15] Matt Copley: Oh, do I lip sync? Okay. I don't try to hide it. Yeah, I'm not I'm not I'm not out here trying to sell a fake product. No, I'm thinking on those for sure. Okay, because I'm always wondering, I'm like, do I just lip sync over myself? Or like, your videos and this for a fully produced track? This may be might not be the same example. But you hear people like singing in their bathroom. And you're like, oh my god, they sound so good. The audio so clear. And I'm like, I don't know, their throat just doesn't look like it's tight enough. It's not even the breathing because you can tell they're breathing. But I'm like, you just seem to relax to be hitting that note. I think you're lip syncing.

[20:06] Matt Copley: I'll tell you what, fine, like pop off. Yeah. But I just need to know, like, should I be doing? Oh, dude, I mean, there's no right or wrong there. Like as far as like, if it's gonna be if it's gonna hit online or not, like, there's plenty of people that are completely acoustic, not edited that really hit because they're amazing performers. And there's way more than you think that are definitely edited. And like, yeah, definitely. And people get are really, really good at it, especially like, some people can record the videos live, like if I'm going to record a cover right here right now, and then we can just pull the audio and like, and then edit it, edit this audio, and then just like dub it over the video, because then it actually is the live performance, but it's actually just edited.

Right? So then it's synced. Yeah, yeah. So there's, there's a bunch of different ways you can go about editing it. And just depends how much work you want to put into it and how much stuff but for me, I mean, it's just the fact that my tracks are so produced that like, I was gonna try and do that live, it would sound like crap, dude. Like, I've tried, I've tried, trust me, like, there's and there's, it's just like, I saw this really good video from this voice teacher in New York recently. And he said something's like, Yes, your live video or your, from your show or from whatever are not gonna or your concert are not going to sound and if they sound bad to you online or on your phone video, like that's okay. That's not how you actually sound.

[21:23] Mikayla Petrilla: Thank you for saying that.

[21:24] Matt Copley: It's just like, it's so isolated on your phone video. And it's not how the room sounds. It's not how like, you know, especially if it's pulled directly from the board and not any processing through it. Like, yeah, dude, there is so many. I guess what I'm trying to say is like, everything online more than you know, is edited. Yes. And there's no shame in it as long as you're not claiming that it's unedited when it is picking yourself apart, which is me. Hello, because we're talking about this with human and I'm curious what you think self-taping is the number one most heinous thing for me and in my mental health journey, let's say, yeah, because when you are singing for a Broadway stage or for a concert venue, but you're in the confines of your apartment with your iPhone camera, something about the audio feature on the iPhone camera, the way it distorts the sound or picks up the sound, I sound like a freak.

And I'm like, why am I in this industry? Like I spiraled this week, because I was like, watching this self-tape, and they wanted you to sing pop rock. I'm like, I sound like a hag and a half. Like, I can't send this. And then the next day, I went in for a callback. And I was like, oh, actually, you know, I feel good about this. I feel empowered and grounded. But it's also because, you know, at Pearl Studios, you have acoustics, and you can like, trust in that. Or if you're picking up a stem for your production, like they just know how to edit it. But then I'll go on my self-tape. And I'm like, alright, like, let me see if I can just like overlay this with the stem of the instrumental and just balance the sound.

So it sounds less bad. I don't know what I'm doing. So it sounds even worse. I sound like this. I'm like, no one cares. I need to let this go. But there's just so many different elements involved with production that you can't, like pick apart. You gotta like outsource it or just like, let it be what's gonna be. But yeah, I mean, that's kind of like what we were talking about earlier, where they're all productions and casting, everyone's just asking you to wear so many different hats now, or just be an artist in general. It demands so much from you in all different aspects of it. And I think it's such a hot topic right now, especially when it comes to self-taping. Like, you're supposed to, you know, edit your audio and have the lighting figured out and be a video editor and do all you're supposed to wear all these hats just to get a self-tape into maybe get an in-person appointment kind of thing.

And it has to be perfect. Yeah, yeah. The casting directors and production team, you're like, No, please just be yourself. But then you're watching it. And you're like, but this doesn't feel like myself. So now I have to edit it to make it myself. But now it's less myself, because it's edited, dude, exactly. But then if you submit it, and no one sees it, let's say it's bad. That's living on your breakdown forever, because it clicks at past auditions. Oh, I called her in for this. My anxiety, I am told that we don't have to read that deeply into it. But that is one version of the reality of it. So you're like, yeah, no, I think there's definitely the two types of people that either love self-tapes or hate self-tapes.

And I don't know which is more, but I'm definitely on that I would rather be in person all day long, because I just know, because for me, self-taping, I know, for others, like self-taping is great, because you can take your time and you can get as many takes as you want to get the right one. But for me, that's my downfall is like, I will keep taking and taking and taking for like eight hours. And then I'm like, I spent a whole day doing this, like 30 second cut to maybe not even get an appointment. So it's like, that's just that's just not something I would rather go in person and blow it. And then I like have that half hour my day back, you know. And then it's as well, like you said, when you're doing the production of your songs, but then in person, it may sound different.

There were some roles like I have been talking to a couple of Glinda's lately. So let's use that as an example. Like girl, those high notes are a hope and a prayer. And you have to be training yourself to sing it every day and have that muscle memory in or else it you know, you're not sure Chapel Rowan was like, yeah, I can't sing my own songs. It was great in the studio. It was an experience that I can share with people. But for consistency, it's like, you may only have like one or two of those in you a day. And that's normal. That's okay. So to be able to have to like fine tune and edit and be like, I'm just not so happy about that thing. And then do it and do it and do it again. It's like the self-editing, it can be helpful if you're producing art, as you said, not to say self-tapes aren't art, but that's supposed to be just like, a fragment of the experience of getting to know you versus like, this is a finished product.

Exactly. So it's very, very, very different animals. Yeah, it's like so hard to divorce those two things. Yeah, it's Yeah, the age of technology and self-tapes and music production as a whole has come a long way just since the pandemic. But to be a creator online, a music creator online right now, you really have to be versatile and so much.

[25:56] Matt Copley: Yeah. Do you do lives? I mean, not really. I really I've been trying to get better at that, because I would love to incorporate that the more I establish or grow online. But I don't do like live performances online there, because I am self-conscious about, you know, performing from the iPhone audio feed or like, hooking it all up. So like, I can get a mic to but but I think like, at the end of the day, I don't want to perform online. Like I want to perform for an actual audience. And so I'm not incredibly interested, I guess, in like doing live performances online.

[26:32] Mikayla Petrilla: Good to hear because there is such a, as we figure out the online world and how it uplifts you and the work you're doing, but also figuring out like, this is what aspects of that bring me joy versus like, this is not for me. And it doesn't have to be. All the TikTok lives are like people like doing ASMR. Maybe that's not us today.

[26:53] Matt Copley: Yeah. And there's something else too. Like I don't think, especially for theater, and I know we'll probably talk about the show I'm doing in October later, but like, there's a lot of people asking for like a live stream of that. And I don't want to do it because it's like if you're going to live stream like a Broadway show to me, it's like, sure, like, yes, there's a point where like, it'll make it accessible to a lot more people. But that's not the experience of the show. I want people to see like, I really want people to be in those seats. And not from like a selfish, like producer standpoint, like I, the vision for the whole show, like you need to be, you need to feel the surround sound of like, the characters I created, you need to hear like the band and feel the bass in your chest.

That's what I want. That's the experience I want to give to my audience. I don't want them to like, be watching it on their iPhone, like on their commute to wherever. Like that's, that's not this, it's not at all the same. Like I put so much work and effort into building my audience online. But at the same time, I'm like trying to create this live experience to heighten this project like the next level. And that's trying, I'm trying to build that aspect of that right now.

[28:06] Mikayla Petrilla: And I think that's wonderful. You sometimes you really just need the bass to like vibrate inside of your bones. Like I feel like that is such an oddly cathartic thing. Like I have never felt more like free and embodied when I just like literally feel my body shake from the music that's around me, which like might sound crazy. But like, it really is like some sort of like weird vibrational healing. I'm into it.

[28:27] Matt Copley: No, it is. It takes you out of like you're bought out of your mind, honestly, and you know, beautiful in a great way. Like and that's, I mean, that's why there's so many people at Warped Tour, like in mosh pits sweating next to a bunch of other sweaty big dudes, because they just love that experience of feeling the music in their whole like being and being surrounded by other humans and people that connect with the music the way they do. And that's exactly what I'm trying to show I'm doing. So yeah, online creation is a catalyst to then bring people kind of home to a community in person, which is great. It's like a great freaking night, which let's talk about it.

[29:00] Mikayla Petrilla: Sure. Let's talk about it. So it started online. Now it's becoming a full theatrical rock concert experience. Like, when did you realize this was bigger than a set of videos? Was it always in the pipeline?

[29:10] Matt Copley: It was in the back of my mind for a little while, but I never had the time or I guess interest to really pursue it like head on like full on and something I talked about with Alan was I never do anything half assed or like just a little bit like everything I do creatively has to be like to the fullest extent. Yeah. So I knew if I wanted to do a live experience or a live concert show, I wanted it to be the full thing. So I was waiting for the right time. And finally, this year, the stars kind of aligned where my schedule opened up pretty widely. And this series was getting big again online and having a lot of hot online moments where I was like, Okay, this is this year's the time and from like February till now, I just kind of been assembling the dream team to make this the show happen.

[29:59] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, and get it all lined up.

[30:03] Matt Copley: Yeah. Tell me more about the dream team. There's Okay, so there's a lot of cool people. I'm really excited about the production elements because I've been from the start. I've been calling this the perfect fusion of a Broadway musical and a rock concert. Yeah, so it's in a so the contents of the show is like a rock concert. You know, we've got the full rock band. We've got like a light show. We've got like the video LED walls that have like, they're like panels like the panels. Yeah, and they're so they're like, they're called blow through panels. So they're like, they're just so cool. There's really cool effects. Yes, which I've never been able to perform with yet. So I'm super excited to see all those elements come together.

I've seen all the creatives so far. And I'm stoked to see it just all come together. But so the production team, the production manager, his name is Jeff Maker. He's worked with All Time Low. He's a Megadeth I Prevail. He's like, okay, he's like, he's like in the rock arena. Yeah, world. He's been doing it for like over 20 years. So he's production managing the entire show. What a great dude.

[31:00] Mikayla Petrilla: I know. He's the man. So like this. So the energy the show is bringing from the get go from the start is like the rock arena. Yeah. But the Broadway elements kind of come in with the set design is it's a huge design like a Broadway musical. And then a venue we're playing it in Abrons Arts Center, their Playhouse Theater. It's a proscenium theater. So it's a seated audience. So that is the one thing we're calling these two shows or three shows technically over two nights. We're calling them the proof of concept for the international and national tour that we want to do next year. So we're testing. So one of the things we're testing and looking at, among many things is the audio like the venue type.

So I wanted it specifically to be my vision for this whole production is to have it be a part of like each city's like Detroit's and Los Angeles and Buffalo's like their Broadway in city. So like their Broadway in Detroit is what Detroit calls it. So like in each season, each city has like their season subscribers that like have the touring Broadway shows come through. And it's kind of my dream to have Broadway Does Punk like a one night event or like a special offering for these subscriptions and all these different markets. So in that vision, like it's proscenium theaters, it's like big seated auditoriums. And so that's why we're testing out this venue type here to see if that will work because the other side, it's kind of hard to know, because the other side of this audience is like the rock concert.

It's like work for us, like all general admission, like mosh pits, like, you know, just standing room only kind of stuff. And so moving forward after October, like there is an idea where like we try that kind of thing out next and see if that works better for the show or for if the seated Broadway kind of traditional proscenium theater is going to work best. And we don't have the answer, but that's what we're going to find out in October and get some feedback. And because it's a rock concert, I'm not sure if people are going to want to like get up out of the seats and like mosh or if they're going to want to like sit back and enjoy.

[32:47] Mikayla Petrilla: Well, there is depending on the proscenium space, if there is an area for a pit in the front, which there usually isn't always. I think there might be a little bit, but it'll be helpful to because like pretend you're at MSG without the arena, like without the. Oh, my God, what are you called? The fourth, the four seats. Yeah. Pretend there are no four seats. Like people will get up when they need to get up, when they know it's time to like rock out. I guess my my thought for this, what's your transition between numbers? Because would that be like an audience sit down and then get back up again?

[33:14] Matt Copley: Yeah, that's that's a good question. I so right now it's it's pretty much just there's no overarching narrative. So it's not like a musical, like a show show. It's more like a concert. But the transition transition. Oh, my God, that word is so hard. Transitions are just musical interludes. And then there also is like this. We created this animated narrator character. That's like an evil little jester kind of guy. Yeah. So he kind of pops up in between some transitions throughout the show just to kind of like move things along. And not no narrative involved. He's just like, he says some shit. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, he is the chaos. That is him, dude. He kind of creates some chaos, dude. Oh, my God. So yeah, no, it should be it should be really cool. It's a it's a cool mix of both worlds. And that's what we're testing in October to see what works, what doesn't and adjust for when we go to tour it.

[34:05] Mikayla Petrilla: I love that. Do you have what numbers are you most especially excited about? Can you tell us or is it still a secret?

[34:11] Matt Copley: Yeah, I mean, I'm pretty much anything. Almost all the stuff that's on Spotify that I've released officially is going to be performed. Great. So I'm excited for Phantom. Defying Gravity. I'm really excited to do. We're going to open the show with The Greatest Showman or The Greatest Show from The Greatest Showman. So there's I mean, there's a ton the set list is like 14 songs or 15 songs. It's an hour hour long. And that's it. So super easy. So like no breaks like breezy. Yeah, there's no openers or anything like that. Like it's just a one hour event experience. Because it is a proof of concept. Like I don't want to do like a two hour show if people aren't enjoying, you know, so they're going to enjoy it.

I know. But I also I get that because people's attention spans are also a little difficult to keep on in the age of like, internet culture, everyone probably has a little like touch of yes, for sure. For sure. touch. So it's like, you know, most shows now like you have to earn the intermission. So then to have it just like an hour long, like boom, let's go high energy.

[35:11] Matt Copley: Yeah, dude, it is like high energy the entire time. And there's there really is no I mean, there's there's a lot of dynamics in the music that we chose to play. But like, it is just an hour packed of just really cool stuff. And the production elements that Jeff's making are just like, even if you don't like I've been telling people this, even if you don't like my music, and you come to this show, you will have an amazing time just watching the production elements. Yeah, it's so cool. Dopamine hits abound between the animation and the light panels. Like I I'm already so excited for this.

[35:40] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, it'd be great. Are you singing lead for all of these songs? Or do you have special guests? And what does that look like?

[35:44] Matt Copley: Yeah, I'm doing I'm singing on every song. But I do have special guests joining on certain songs. Yeah, we're hopefully going to be announcing those later this month. Good. So I'll time that out.

[35:54] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It might. It might just work out perfectly.

[35:59] Matt Copley: Yeah. announced when this podcast drops, maybe. Yay, I love that. So let's talk about you being the lead vocalist of UNWELL. Like, okay, what did touring with the band teach you about performing that musical theater didn't?

[36:13] Matt Copley: Honestly, this is gonna sound so like against everything I was ever taught or you're taught in a theater program. But it's like, I, the biggest thing for me was to, I guess, not baby my voice. That's the biggest thing I've I learned. Yeah, personally. And yes, like, of course, you have to take care of it. You have to get your sleep and your water and all those things. Like, I'm not discrediting any of that. But you also have to take risks and take chances if you want to, like, change or like see progress and become a better performer. And that part of touring with UNWELL, I mean, just joining the band in general, like a post hardcore band from going from a theater program to a post hardcore band was a huge adjustment in itself.

And so it took me a lot of trial and error to figure out what my voice was going to be and what how I wanted my vocal quality to kind of be in the band and then touring in like a tiny especially because the band started off like very small and DIY we toured in a 40 350 van with bunks built in the back. So like, and we drove everywhere ourselves like on full US tours. So like we would our daily schedule was just insane. And we would sleep in Planet Fitness parking lots and stuff.

[37:19] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, because Planet Fitness has free showers. I mean, if you remember.

[37:19] Matt Copley: Yeah, yeah. So yeah, I mean, but yeah, dude. So I mean, just touring in general. It really put me touring like that, like with no hotels and like no air conditioning and the Planet Fitness dude, it is you buy the black card for like 25 bucks a month.

[37:39] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah. And then you have a shower every day you can work out if you feel like it at least from the.

[37:43] Matt Copley: Yeah, dude. Yeah. So and they most will let you sleep in their parking lots. This is innovative, dude.

[37:50] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah. And it's 25 bucks. Because I'll tell you what, if you go to like Loves or any or Pilot or Flying J or any Pilot like truck stop those hours are like 30 bucks a pop, which are crazy, which we've done if we've had you but like 25 bucks a month for unlimited showers, dude, that has been is all day long.

[38:05] Matt Copley: Let's play a sponsorship. I am so I'm still a member. Good. Remember, I still love I mean, I no shade to them at all. Do they they have come in clutch for us and it's air conditioned. So if it's our van didn't have air conditioning one summer. So like, no, we would just go chill in the Planet Fitness for until our loading.

[38:25] Mikayla Petrilla: That is your home. That is your third space.

[38:32] Matt Copley: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, touring like that. Yeah, like it puts a lot on your voice and you will never get that experience unless you do that. And so I lost my voice plenty of times because I wasn't sleeping because I was driving to like four in the morning and then I get up at 10 to load in or whatever it was. So I think just like going through the ringer and really conditioning my voice in that awful way. Kind of taught myself to kind of figure out what works and what doesn't in terms of the qualities I can use in my voice.

[39:03] Mikayla Petrilla: And yeah, so as far as taking care of yourself, clearly Planet Fitness prevails. Like if you're tired, sleep at the bunker, like you just foam roll that out.

[39:08] Matt Copley: Oh, yeah. Did you end up having to do legs of your tour so you can have like a few days to recover before you do the next city? Or were you just like, let's go.

[39:14] Matt Copley: So honestly, a lot of the touring UNWELL does is support. So we as a support band, we don't decide the tour routing. It's all the headliners agents and their responsibilities. So we literally and we get offered like a support slot. So when we take an offer, they'll send us the route or we can send an offer. They'll send us the routing and the dates and they'll basically say if you want it or not. So we have no control over like the scheduling of it.

[40:18] Matt Copley: Like, did you like, you like crap, dude? It's tough, dude, because I mean, and to give you, I'll be transparent, like, yeah, the band in the early days, we were making like 200 bucks a night, dang, like 250, maybe 300, like in the early days of a guarantee, right? And then we live off our merch money basically because that's how any band makes money, that's from the merch. And because everyone, all their managers, their booking agents, and anyone else involved in their team, they have business managers or lawyers, they all get percentages off the top, right? And so, but the only one that has a merch cut is you guys, is the band itself. So that's where we'll take merch money and like, you know, go to a fancy dinner every now and then or on a day off if we have time, we'll go to a movie or something.

But dude, you are like, at least on the touring level that we were at, it's tough, dude. It is like you're living a very nomadic life. It makes sense, you know, if it's worth it for the art, for the project, it's like you gotta, yeah, really hustle. And that's the thing, like me and the guys, we never doubted or questioned that lifestyle at all. We wanted to play our music on the road and we wanted to tour the bands that wanted to take us because the headliners were always amazing. So we didn't care, like we were doing what we loved every day and we still are, but that's just part of touring. And when you get started, unless you know you start very fortunate, like you gotta grind, dude. It is a grind.

[41:34] Mikayla Petrilla: So pretending I know nothing about you, doing theater after doing rock, have you done it? How does this feel? Has the stamina from living that lifestyle for so long and then bringing that into a more theatrical performance, like do you feel like you're like, oh, this is easy, I can do this? But are there different elements to it?

[41:54] Matt Copley: So I have yet to be in like a full production contract since I've joined UNWELL. I was gonna do one this summer, I unfortunately had to drop off because I was moving to New York. I just moved to New York on Saturday, so I, you know, the contract's happening right now and I needed, I was moving my life and my cats and my whole life from Michigan to New York for the first time. So I was like, I had to drop that contract because I was like, I need to be here. Yeah, I was like, and then, you know, so I was gonna do it this summer, but I'm excited to find out what the next thing will be because I am interested in doing another production of some sort. I've been auditioning a little more frequently now, especially now I'm in the city.

The things I've gone in for definitely I feel from my rock experience are not as difficult as I thought they were in college, you know, especially like auditioning in general. Like the material, like it's kind of, it's not as hard as it once was to me, right? Which is cool. I think a lot of it has to do with like the material and our songs that UNWELL writes too are just so high and like really hard to sing, yeah. So you're vocally like training yourself to meet that, which is great because contemporary musical theater is going all like pop rock, like high belt sounds across the board. So the fact that you have also, okay, we didn't say, where did you go to college?

[43:03] Matt Copley: I went to the University of Cincinnati, the College Conservatory of Music.

[43:08] Mikayla Petrilla: Okay, I wasn't sure if you went to Michigan because you were from Michigan. I feel like sometimes you want to like get out of...

[43:12] Matt Copley: No, tried and denied, baby, tried and denied. Listen, we all find ourselves where we need to be.

[43:19] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, no, it was the right fit for sure. Yeah, but then, yeah, to have that musical theater classical training and then even classical, I don't know how old you are, I'm assuming we're in the same bucket of some decade, but like we were trained with this very particular sound and now that has like expanded and stretched to an even more contemporary sound that is like so difficult to sustain if you were practicing something else. So the fact that you were literally practicing like through being the lead in a rock band is awesome because you inadvertently have this like solid edge and authentic sound that I am sure people are looking for.

[43:58] Matt Copley: Yeah, thank you. Thank you for saying that. In a musical theater program, any of them, you're taught to sing in a very healthy way. And when I joined a band, like I kind of threw all that out the window at first because I was just like, I just want to like sound edgy and like tear up my voice. And there were times where like I was definitely singing unhealthy and like tearing up my voice, but you recover. And but that's part of like what I said earlier in the podcast was too is like you just gotta try. Like if you don't try, like you're never gonna grow or like be different with like if you're trying to like achieve something better or expand your horizons and your vocal qualities, like you gotta try.

[44:29] Mikayla Petrilla: Yep. You're not only covering songs, you're a songwriter as we have established. So how does your musical theater background show up in your original work?

[44:39] Matt Copley: That's a really good question. I don't think I've ever really been asked that before. It's hard for me to analyze my own writing from a third person's point of view in that way, but I think it like melodies from musicals and stuff are very, I guess, particular. Yeah. And when I go to write music, I like to maybe like emulate a lot of my melodies based on like some of my past experiences in theater. So maybe, maybe that's why it's hard for me to come up with an answer right now. There might not be an answer. Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I don't have like a pinpointed like this is where I'm drawing this from. It just kind of, the music I write is just a culmination of all my experiences. So, you know, theater's a huge part of that. So I mean, anything I write is coming from at least a little bit of theater.

[45:20] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, well, I'm sure you're probably drawn to like big emotional hooks because of it in some ways and that informs it, especially like lyrically too. I'm like, like you want a good, you want a good like hook line, like you want a good like story to your song. So like, you know, you think of really effective musical theater songs, you're like, okay, what are they doing here? What do you wish more artists understood about building work from the ground up?

[45:39] Matt Copley: I mean, you're not going to be successful right away unless you're very, very lucky. Yeah, you gotta really grind. You gotta really work. That sounds like a generic statement, but like you really have to like put in hours and hours and hours and the time to really just try things and like get your, like really hone in on what you do right. Because nothing's gonna happen overnight. And like even if you have like a viral video that hits, that's awesome, but that's not the end all be all. That's like one, that's one little tool in your whole tool belt of like things that will make you successful. So virality is like awesome, but you have to work on top of that. Like that's something that will propel you forward, but if you don't have the work ethic behind the virality or whatever else, the support you have, you're gonna not go very far because you need, you need that work ethic.

And luckily, I think like being in New York and going to a musical theater program, that's something to teach you is like you need to grind. You need to audition. You're gonna go audition every day. You're gonna be like grinding. Your agents are gonna be sending you stuff all the time. You have to learn stuff in 24 hours and like that's a grind. Yeah, so any musical theater performer or any performer in general is going to know how to work like that. Have a good work ethic. And I think that for me at least carries over into this project just like I was trained to work very hard and, you know, and it knows happen all the time. No's are like 90% of my days.

[46:59] Mikayla Petrilla: So yeah, and it's not learning to be super discouraged by some of those. So yeah, and there's also such an unpredictable momentum which goes with being viral and also in our industry where it's like you don't know what's gonna hit, but when it does, you have to build off that immediately and you have to press the advantage immediately, whether that's a callback or like I had this viral video, yeah, people are now giving my page attention. I want to use that platform to now get them to see what else I really care about. It's like, oh, okay, like suddenly your whole day is rewired to adjust for that, which is a skill to learn too regarding work ethic. It's hard, not everyone can do it. It can be very exhausting.

[47:35] Matt Copley: Oh, it's, it's like, it's so exhausting. No one has enough hours, nobody, nobody in their day, in their adult life has enough hours in the day to like keep up with social media online like 24/7 if it's like a career. Like, you know, if you're an artist full-time, like trying to do social media all day long is just not realistic. So like, yeah, you pick and choose the bad, you know, what's most valuable to you and the goals you want to achieve and you kind of go from there. And hopefully you have a team behind you that can make all those pieces, you know, work as effectively as possible.

[48:05] Mikayla Petrilla: What part of producing were you like, oh my gosh, I'm so glad I have a team or this is a moment I realized I need to hire someone to do this?

[48:10] Matt Copley: When specifically for this October show, they asked me if I had event insurance. I was like, what do you, what do you mean? Like insurance? Like I have like Progressive, like is that what you're talking about? This is a Wendy. They're like, no dude, like if you want to perform here, you need event insurance. I was like, okay, gotta figure out what this is. So I leaned on Martian Entertainment or Carl White, the producers and general manager tied to this show in October too, and they helped me out with that, which is amazing because I had no, he like knew right away exactly who to talk to and they got me a call within like 48 hours and it was like, okay, cool.

[48:45] Mikayla Petrilla: Well, you're learning how to speak so many different languages between being a content creator, like running a band, like navigating record label partnerships and collaborations. Like there's so many different elements.

[48:58] Matt Copley: Yeah, you're like just learning in real time, dude. Yeah, that is like the biggest thing. I don't know if a lot of viewers from the outside like realize. I really, I don't have like a business manager or like someone that manages all my things like separately for me. It's literally just me like dealing with the labels I'm working with or the booking agents I'm working with or my casting agents or my general manager, executive producer or the production manager, Jeff, or the, you know, it's all these different players and figuring out how everyone communicates and making them all work together is really just on me right now. So I'm hoping in the future that this is successful and I can pass some of these stuff off so I don't have to wear all these hats.

But I enjoy it for the time being because it keeps me busy and makes you better for it. Like becoming your own mini media company for yourself as an artist, it's like then you understand the language and then can help like, yeah, understanding other people and how they do their jobs is so helpful. So it's like, yeah, very overwhelming to learn, but then you're like, okay, like once somebody else takes it, like you have a deeper appreciation, but then also like you don't have to do it 100%.

[50:03] Mikayla Petrilla: For anyone who's trying to build an artistic life and it doesn't fit cleanly into one category, what would you want to say to them? What do you want them to know?

[50:08] Matt Copley: Such a good question. I would say just keep exploring it, like keep doing it. Even if it's not what everyone else is doing, that's a good thing. Like that's the best thing in the world, dude. Yeah, even if it's like, it doesn't hit online and it's not viral overnight, like who cares, dude? It's different and it's unique to you. That's what's interesting. And you know, if you have bigger support behind it or you grow bigger support for, that's awesome. But like you don't need, you don't need a crazy team or a bunch of money or like a bunch of things to be successful or fulfilled. And you know, being the leader of your own pact, like I think I would just say just keep trying new things and keep doing what feels good to you and just make it your own.

[50:49] Mikayla Petrilla: Yeah, yes, and you're doing it. I'm trying. Remind us when is your show in October, what day it is?

[50:56] Matt Copley: October 2nd and 3rd in New York City at Abrons Arts Center.

[51:02] Mikayla Petrilla: We're gonna come see you! Yay! Oh my gosh, all right. And where can we follow your work, Madison?

[51:09] Matt Copley: Yes, at Matt is UNWELL and everything and find you on streaming platforms. Yeah, Matt Copley is, if you are on like Apple Music or Spotify or YouTube, whatever, Copley, C-O-P-L-E-Y, that's right.

[51:21] Mikayla Petrilla: Yay! Oh my gosh, thanks for coming on. This was amazing.

[51:27] Matt Copley: Thank you for having me. It's been great.

[51:32] Mikayla Petrilla: That was Matt Copley, creator and producer of Broadway Does Punk. I loved this conversation because Matt is such a great example of what happens when you stop waiting for permission to be all of the things that you are: musical theater kid, rock artist, creator, producer, frontman, internet person, live event builder, all of it gets to be in the same room. And I think that is such an important reminder, especially for artists right now. Sometimes a work that feels the most specific to you is the thing that other people have been waiting for. Sometimes that weird overlap is the whole gift. And I am thrilled to tell you that Broadway Does Punk is almost entirely sold out for its three performances on October 2nd and 3rd at the Abrons Arts Center, but there may be a handful of tickets left.

So take a peek at the website or at Matt's socials at Matt is UNWELL. The current listed Broadway guest stars are Constantine Maroulis, Samantha Pauly, Tamika Lawrence, TROY from EPIC: The Musical, Jasmine Forsberg, and Keaton Whittaker. This is such a killer lineup, oh my goodness! A note that Samantha Pauly is only performing October 3rd at 4:30 and 8 PM, and Jasmine Forsberg is performing only October 2nd at 8 PM. So this is an incredible lineup. It is a gift. You get a banging show no matter which one you go to. If you can't go to the show, I hope it tours to a city near you soon. Please, in the meantime, support Matt's work. And if you like Tea Time, leave us a little rating, a review, and send this episode to the friend who contains both the theater kid and a rock star in their hearts. Thanks for listening. Thanks for spilling with us. I'll see you next time.