This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Jess McInley: Hey guys, um, so we got a little introduction here.

[0:03] Jess McInley: Um, we're not very good at seriousness, but this is a time that calls for seriousness.

[0:09] Jess McInley: Um, so here we are.

[0:11] Jess McInley: So to start off, I know that it's weird that we're kind of doing an episode during these weird times, but we're gonna start this way.

[0:18] Jess McInley: Black lives matter, and me and Andrew are united with those standing up against police brutality and racial injustice in response to the murders of George Floyd, Ahmad Arbury, Brianna Taylor, and the many, many, many others who lost their lives at the hand of police in this country.

[0:34] Jess McInley: Uh, it's a fucking mess out there.

[0:36] Jess McInley: Um, I personally have donated as much as I can to as many people, including the bail relief fund, specifically in Detroit and Minneapolis.

[0:45] Jess McInley: Um, and we encourage you to do so as well.

[0:49] Jess McInley: Um, racism, hatred, and state-sanctioned murder have no place in a civilized society.

[0:54] Jess McInley: Unacceptable and terrible, and nobody cares what we have to say about that, honestly.

[0:58] Jess McInley: Um, please listen to the voices from the black community, hear the pain they are feeling, and extend empathy and compassion to our listeners who are a part of the communities affected, our hearts break with you, and we are with you and support you.

[1:11] Jess McInley: A lot of folks out there we know see us as a form of escapism from this kind of weird time we're living in.

[1:18] Jess McInley: As much as I we didn't quite feel right posting an episode today, we knew that people use us as an escape from the darkness of the world.

[1:27] Jess McInley: So we hope we give you a few laughs here.

[1:30] Jess McInley: Um, but don't think that we're looking away from our fellow Americans that are treated as less than human by the most horrible, horrible administration and people and just general humans that are living amongst the.

[1:45] Jess McInley: And uh, one last thing before we start the episode that I just want to throw in.

[1:48] Jess McInley: Um, I know sometimes we reference events that are currently happening in our episodes.

[1:54] Jess McInley: Uh, this episode was recorded two weeks ago.

[1:57] Jess McInley: Uh, so these events were not happening.

[1:59] Jess McInley: We are recording this intro after, well after we recorded this episode.

[2:05] Jess McInley: So just because we don't mention it in the following episode does not mean that we don't care.

[2:11] Jess McInley: Uh, it just means that we recorded it prior to the events happening, so keep that in mind.

[2:15] Andrew DeWolf: Yes.

[2:15] Jess McInley: And finally, before we start, just if you want a way to help, um, please go to blacklivesmatter.ca or .rd.co.

[2:24] Jess McInley: You'll have a list of a bunch of places where you can either sign a petition, text or call, donate, and all that stuff.

[2:31] Jess McInley: And if you're not American, you're from Canada, Australia, there's places there where you can help your local people.

[2:37] Jess McInley: Um, but just do something.

[2:40] Jess McInley: Do something, people.

[2:41] Jess McInley: Enjoy the episode.

[2:42] Jess McInley: Thank you, enjoy the episode.

[2:44] Jess McInley: I'm sure you'll get a laugh or two.

[2:45] Jess McInley: I think this one's a good one.

[2:47] Jess McInley: I don't remember what it was about.

[2:48] Jess McInley: Sorry.

[2:49] Jess McInley: It's a new brain.

[2:50] Jess McInley: It's a new brain.

[2:51] Jess McInley: Oh, yeah, this one's got the frog in it.

[2:52] Jess McInley: Yeah, you guys will like this one.

[2:54] Jess McInley: You guys are gonna like this one.

[2:55] Jess McInley: Yeah, we'll have fun.

[2:56] Jess McInley: Alright, guys, thank you so much.

[2:59] Jess McInley: Oh my god, what are you doing in here?

[3:01] Jess McInley: This is my hotel room.

[3:04] Jess McInley: You're not supposed to be here.

[3:06] Jess McInley: You're not the one that's supposed to be in my hotel room tonight.

[3:09] Jess McInley: But either way, while you're here, I should let you know that today's show is brought to you by our kind donors over at Patreon.

[3:17] Andrew DeWolf: Andrew, what's Patreon and who is donating to us on Patreon?

[3:22] Andrew DeWolf: Uh, Patreon is where you can donate to us if you'd like to and get access to additional content.

[3:27] Andrew DeWolf: Uh, we actually have a lot of additional content right now, considering we have a patron-only podcast, Glee with Cheese.

[3:37] Andrew DeWolf: Because we are masochists.

[3:39] Andrew DeWolf: We hate ourselves.

[3:40] Andrew DeWolf: We hate ourselves.

[3:42] Andrew DeWolf: Why talk about things that are good when you could talk about things that are horrible?

[3:47] Andrew DeWolf: Already, like, people are pitching us for things to do for when we finish Glee.

[3:52] Andrew DeWolf: So don't worry, we're not even more than four episodes into Glee right now, and they're already like, this also sucks watching.

[3:59] Andrew DeWolf: No, no, no.

[3:59] Andrew DeWolf: They want us to do Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, which I isn't actually a good show.

[4:03] Andrew DeWolf: Okay.

[4:04] Andrew DeWolf: Or Smash, which is at least a short show.

[4:06] Andrew DeWolf: I don't believe them, but maybe.

[4:09] Andrew DeWolf: Alright.

[4:10] Andrew DeWolf: And our current patrons are, and this is a long list.

[4:15] Andrew DeWolf: Terry Needleman, Max Looning, Benjamin Lear, Lily Accles, Mackenzie Horner, John, Donna, Terry and the Duck, the Fantastic Jess Lightning, Ewan Cassidy, Haley McDonald, Teskear, Fire September, Mina Maniri, Monica Thoreau, Brent Black, Haley Murray, Allison Warnerway, B.A. Flix, Lathaniel, Stacy Coomb, Joseph Ebbens Green, Lunar Rock 222, Iragale, Drew A Whiter, Christine Malmadale, Mezzanine Theodore Diary, Mary Lucio, Kent, and Nunnalie, Cole Birchfield, Sam Coffield, John Vinals, Holy Staccality, Russ Walker, Musical Hell, Julian Bach, Emily Grace, Andrew Van Barsen, and Emily Stack.

[4:46] Andrew DeWolf: They give us a little extra financial support that helps us keep the lights on here, Musicals with Cheese.

[4:51] Andrew DeWolf: If you would like to join them and get all those fun perks that Andrew mentioned earlier, come join us over at Patreon.

[4:55] Jess McInley: Alright, Andrew, you ready to start this show?

[4:57] Andrew DeWolf: I'm ready.

[4:59] Andrew DeWolf: I'm ready.

[5:05] Jess McInley: Hello, I'm Jess McInley.

[5:08] Andrew DeWolf: And I'm Andrew DeWolf!

[5:10] Jess McInley: And welcome to Musicals with Cheese, the podcast where I try to get Andrew to like musical theater.

[5:14] Jess McInley: How are you doing today, Andrew?

[5:16] Andrew DeWolf: You look like you're not feeling great.

[5:18] Andrew DeWolf: I am currently not feeling great.

[5:22] Jess McInley: Did you write a song today, though?

[5:23] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, I'm writing a song about frogs for my friend who is a frog.

[5:28] Jess McInley: Um, no, you passed out!

[5:31] Andrew DeWolf: Oh, oh no!

[5:32] Jess McInley: Oh no, man down!

[5:33] Jess McInley: We gotta get him to the hospital!

[5:36] Jess McInley: Oh, doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor DeWolf.

[5:39] Jess McInley: What's wrong with my friend Andrew here?

[5:42] Andrew DeWolf: He's dead.

[5:52] Jess McInley: Just refused to yes, yes, and me there.

[5:55] Andrew DeWolf: I will not just kill Danny I will not write the yes song.

[6:03] Jess McInley: Fuck you!

[6:03] Jess McInley: This week we're talking about A New Brain.

[6:03] Andrew DeWolf: A New Brain.

[6:08] Jess McInley: That's not actually a song for this, I don't think, but here we go.

[6:18] Jess McInley: What a mess I got us into brain dead.

[6:22] Jess McInley: Everybody's setting off alarms.

[6:26] Jess McInley: Baby, maybe lift my head up.

[6:29] Jess McInley: I see.

[6:30] Jess McInley: I just pulled a doozy.

[6:32] Jess McInley: Don't ask why me.

[6:34] Jess McInley: Roger pass the Uzi as the MD lifts me in his cruisy chiseled eyes brain dead.

[6:47] Jess McInley: Stupid and thoughtless is what I am.

[6:52] Jess McInley: Cause I'm brain dead.

[6:55] Jess McInley: And God dead brain dead, dressed up in words.

[7:04] Jess McInley: A New Brain is a musical with music and lyrics by William Finn's and a book by Finn and James Lapine.

[7:09] Jess McInley: Though many of Finn's previous musicals were to the same basic autobiographical standard, A New Brain dealt directly with his own harrowing experience with an arteriovenous malformation and the healing power of art.

[7:24] Jess McInley: The hero of the musical, Gordon Schwinn, you know, that's kind of like William Schwinn, but William Finn's, but it's Gordon Schwinn.

[7:31] Jess McInley: Um, worries that he may not live to complete his work.

[7:34] Jess McInley: Finn wrote many of the songs soon after his release from the hospital.

[7:38] Jess McInley: The musical premiered off-Broadway in 1998 and has since been revived in the US, England, and elsewhere.

[7:45] Jess McInley: Andrew, what is your overall what was your thoughts on A New Brain?

[7:48] Andrew DeWolf: Just your initial thoughts.

[7:50] Andrew DeWolf: Um, I liked it more than I thought I was going to.

[7:53] Jess McInley: Because you didn't like Falsettos.

[7:55] Andrew DeWolf: Eh, not hugely.

[7:56] Andrew DeWolf: I think I actually like this a bit more.

[7:59] Jess McInley: Okay.

[8:00] Jess McInley: So tell tell me what happens in A New Brain.

[8:02] Jess McInley: I'm very curious, because this is not really a story show.

[8:06] Andrew DeWolf: It's more of like a, it's like a biopic almost.

[8:09] Andrew DeWolf: I, yeah, but it kind of pick style.

[8:13] Andrew DeWolf: It's very stylized, very weird.

[8:15] Andrew DeWolf: It feels like an experimental show mixed with a review, mixed with like classic musical theater.

[8:20] Jess McInley: So what happens in the show, Andrew?

[8:22] Andrew DeWolf: Um, uh, the author insert character gets a Gordon.

[8:29] Andrew DeWolf: Gordon.

[8:30] Andrew DeWolf: Uh, he's writing for a children's show.

[8:33] Andrew DeWolf: And the guy who makes the children's show is kind of crazy.

[8:37] Andrew DeWolf: Um, and he's probably the best part of the whole thing, but I guess we'll get to that.

[8:42] Andrew DeWolf: Um, and Gordon gets a brain tumor, and they have to operate and get rid of it.

[8:47] Andrew DeWolf: And he's all worried that he's not gonna be able to make art anymore.

[8:51] Andrew DeWolf: And then everybody in his life worries about him, and then he wakes up.

[8:56] Jess McInley: Mm-hmm.

[8:56] Andrew DeWolf: And there's also like a homeless woman or something, but I don't really understand that part.

[9:00] Jess McInley: It's just a homeless woman that wants change in the world.

[9:03] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[9:04] Andrew DeWolf: In two ways.

[9:05] Andrew DeWolf: Change is in like change in your pocket and change is in change in the world, like Barack Obama brought on.

[9:11] Jess McInley: Yeah.

[9:12] Jess McInley: Like Barack Obama promised to bring on.

[9:15] Andrew DeWolf: Mm-hmm.

[9:16] Andrew DeWolf: Now we're covering this in June because all through the month of June, we're gonna be doing June, June, June.

[9:23] Jess McInley: June is busted out on Oliver.

[9:25] Andrew DeWolf: And we're gonna be doing um Pride Month, basically.

[9:30] Jess McInley: Every musical we're gonna cover is either gonna be about LGBT characters or written by an LGBT author, and we're gonna do a lot of fun things.

[9:38] Jess McInley: So this week we're talking about A New Brain, and our lead character, since William Finn's is a homosexual man, um, is also homosexual himself.

[9:46] Jess McInley: And this is one of those great musicals where it's not a big deal.

[9:51] Jess McInley: It's not like the story is about him being gay.

[9:54] Jess McInley: Kind of not unlike Falsettos, where it's kind of like him as well.

[9:58] Jess McInley: It's very incidental.

[10:00] Jess McInley: It just reflects the life that William Finn's was living, and he could only write what he was living through, basically.

[10:05] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[10:07] Jess McInley: And it's nice to just see, especially in the 90s, them just be people instead of like cut to Rent where they're literally just perfect ideal angels, literally named Angel.

[10:18] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[10:19] Andrew DeWolf: I feel like this is honestly much better representation than anything in Rent, because like, yeah, if you want just they exist and they're not evil, I guess Rent is the one for you.

[10:31] Andrew DeWolf: But if you want, like, hey, they're actually people, this is much better.

[10:36] Jess McInley: But how's the rank of like compared to Falsettos where they're also just people?

[10:41] Andrew DeWolf: Um, it's honestly, it's about the same.

[10:44] Andrew DeWolf: I like that this one he didn't have AIDS.

[10:49] Jess McInley: I understand.

[10:50] Jess McInley: I understand that that is a big issue, and obviously there has to be some shows about that.

[10:55] Andrew DeWolf: But like when every show is about that is about gay people is about having them having AIDS, it's almost like it becomes almost a parody of itself.

[11:04] Jess McInley: It's like, I mean, at the time maybe not, but I get what you're saying, like at a certain point that was just all gay people had AIDS in media for a while.

[11:14] Andrew DeWolf: It's like, okay, this is a show about a gay person.

[11:17] Andrew DeWolf: Let me guess, they have AIDS.

[11:19] Jess McInley: It's like, you know, at least this one, it's not that.

[11:19] Andrew DeWolf: It's not that.

[11:23] Andrew DeWolf: It's a brain tumor.

[11:27] Jess McInley: Although they do have a reference to it, which I think is actually kind of funny.

[11:31] Jess McInley: The doctors are like, is it HIV?

[11:34] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, wouldn't that would be the question?

[11:36] Jess McInley: What is that?

[11:37] Jess McInley: It makes sense.

[11:38] Jess McInley: And I like her, because basically he passes out while he's with his agent, and she's the one that takes him to the hospital, and she's like getting asked all these questions.

[11:47] Jess McInley: She's like, I don't know, I don't know him.

[11:49] Andrew DeWolf: I like that.

[11:50] Jess McInley: Like, and they're like, is he HIV?

[11:52] Jess McInley: And she's like, I don't know for sure, but I don't think so.

[11:56] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[11:58] Jess McInley: It's little things that make this feel real.

[12:01] Jess McInley: Like, this feels more real than any other like cancer or brain tumor story I've ever seen in media, just because of those little tiny touches that obviously someone that went through it could only describe.

[12:12] Andrew DeWolf: That, and of course, all the dream sequences, which really emphasize how real it is.

[12:18] Jess McInley: Well, those are specifically taking out of it.

[12:20] Jess McInley: I'm talking about the little elements.

[12:21] Jess McInley: Like, my lover isn't showing up, but everyone else is here.

[12:25] Jess McInley: Where is he at?

[12:26] Jess McInley: Is he trying to avoid me like dealing with the problems and like all that?

[12:30] Jess McInley: Or the mother being very loving and probably a decent person but overbearing, like shit like that.

[12:37] Andrew DeWolf: And then Frog Guy, who is a guy who is a frog.

[12:43] Jess McInley: He is a guy dressed as a frog.

[12:44] Andrew DeWolf: He's Mr. Bungie.

[12:46] Jess McInley: I actually really like Mr. Bungie, and I wish I could see him in something else.

[12:50] Andrew DeWolf: You want to see more Mr. Bungie?

[12:52] Jess McInley: Yeah, like honestly, a sequel to this that obviously isn't based on real life, but is just Mr. Bungie, the show.

[13:00] Andrew DeWolf: I'd watch it.

[13:02] Jess McInley: Why?

[13:03] Jess McInley: Why?

[13:03] Jess McInley: He's hilarious.

[13:04] Jess McInley: He just wears a frog hat everywhere he goes.

[13:10] Andrew DeWolf: And he's like this tyrannical, like children's show host.

[13:18] Jess McInley: The move musical.

[13:20] Andrew DeWolf: I would watch that.

[13:21] Jess McInley: You can't tell me you wouldn't watch that.

[13:23] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, I would, but I found the brain tumor stuff more interesting.

[13:27] Jess McInley: I mean, yeah, in this, but that's just because he's not given much to do.

[13:30] Andrew DeWolf: But the scenes where he is in there, I mean he and he saves the day in the end.

[13:34] Jess McInley: I mean, kind of.

[13:35] Jess McInley: Like, I'm curious.

[13:36] Jess McInley: What do you think Mr. Bungie represents in this show?

[13:39] Andrew DeWolf: Because he does kind of save the day, but he's also kind of an evil man.

[13:44] Andrew DeWolf: Mr. Bungie represents uh patrons of the arts.

[13:50] Andrew DeWolf: Or what people want people to do with art, if that makes sense.

[13:56] Andrew DeWolf: Or maybe I'm going crazy and don't quite understand.

[13:59] Jess McInley: I think he represents like what people would expect a composer to do.

[14:05] Jess McInley: Just do kids' shows.

[14:06] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[14:07] Andrew DeWolf: Get your money.

[14:08] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, he was commissioning the music, so he is a patron of the arts.

[14:15] Jess McInley: He's also a frog.

[14:17] Andrew DeWolf: Yes.

[14:20] Andrew DeWolf: Do you think the yes song ever aired as Gordon wrote it? Because basically he has this really hard time writing songs for frogs because he just wants to write these like gripping epic stories of like love and all that. And he's stuck writing songs about jumping from lily pad to little lily pad, not knowing how to write about springs or just about saying yes to your parents. And I think the yes song is probably like the funniest song in the show to me.

[14:47] Jess McInley: Yeah, the yes song is very strange in how he writes it, because it's definitely. I mean, as Mr. Bungie says, it's uh it's certainly not for kids the way he wrote it. And it's framed as if like Gordon needs to finish this last song. He rejects his lover spending the night with him on his last night before surgery. It could be the last night of his life, and he's just like, I need to write this song. And he writes it, and it gets to Mr. Bungie, and it's like, yes is a good word, no is a bad word, except when you're asked to lose your virginity, then you can say no. It's like, um you know, that's not really what we're trying to say. And he's like, Oh, I know he's got this brain thing. Like, I I know he's got sick and shit.

Get my son in here, he can write better than this. Uh. And that's the last straw. That's when he almost gives up, and then he he he needs Mr. Bungie to come back and sing sing don't give in. And that's a Mr. Bungie lesson there. Don't give in because you like Smaghetti.

[15:55] Andrew DeWolf: I honestly don't understand why they chose to have Mr. Bungie be the last person to come in in his dream to wake him up. Just because it's insanity. And William Finn is probably one of my favorite composers, like to ever hit a Broadway stage. Just because he's so insane and even he doesn't even know what his lyrics mean half the time. Like he just throws things onto a page, and sometimes it's poetic, sometimes it's just him being weird.

[16:22] Jess McInley: Yeah. Okay. Um and then you have a director like James the Pine, who's like known for like working with Sondheim and Into the Woods and all that. Like, let's rein this into a story right here. Will come on, come on. Let's sit sit down on Uncle James's lap. Let's let's talk about what what any of this means. He's like, nope, I'm not talking.

[16:42] Andrew DeWolf: Oh boy. Okay, well, let's see. What else about the story in here? Why does his lover just like to sail? I mean, he that his thing, his release, his calming nature, and Gordon just hates being out in the fucking sun. I do too. I do too. I wouldn't want to go sailing across the horizon. That sounds like garbage. Ugh. Just thinking about being on a boat on purpose. Oh no.

[17:18] Jess McInley: How are you on a boat on accident? That's my question.

[17:20] Andrew DeWolf: I don't know. Somebody just puts you there, I guess.

[17:27] Jess McInley: No, that's bad. Don't say that. Don't say the thing I was thinking. Oh. Oh. Okay. What other character is interesting in this? Can we talk about it?

[17:35] Andrew DeWolf: I love the mom character.

[17:38] Jess McInley: Yeah. The mom is uh probably the most complex character in this. She's not taking it well. But she likes to frame it like she is. Like she wants Gordon feel secure with her being around, but she is not taking any of this well. You can't die. You're too young. Like overbearing Jewish mother, but I don't even think they like outwardly say that she's Jewish. Which is a good thing. Mm-hmm. But you kind of get that vibe from her. And she has some of the best songs in it and is involved with some of the best songs in it. I really particularly like her opening number where she comes in and she's like, I'm gonna take care of everything. I'm gonna do whatever I can, and you don't worry, I'll take care of you.

And it's just like these overbearing, like percussive like beats like, Mother's gonna stay, mother's gonna help you, and it's just like you can feel like the walls closing in on you while the lyrics itself are like supposed to be calming, but it's like real bombastic and unpleasant. Mommy isn't gonna let you die ever.

[18:40] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, it's a rough thing to watch your kid possibly die before you. I mean, I'm not a father, nor do I ever intend to be, but I can't imagine how rough that must be.

[18:50] Jess McInley: Oh, you're not gonna be a daddy? That's so sad.

[18:54] Andrew DeWolf: Do you want to be a father?

[18:56] Jess McInley: I don't know. I don't think I'd be a very good parent.

[18:59] Andrew DeWolf: What are you talking about? You're you're a rock and roll star. What should we talk about, Willis?

[19:08] Jess McInley: Uh oh, okay. What was your f we have to talk about the the homeless woman because I don't get it.

[19:09] Andrew DeWolf: I don't get it either, but I think she's just a representation of like um the lover, I believe his name is Roger.

[19:21] Jess McInley: Yeah, Roger.

[19:22] Andrew DeWolf: Um, his concerns and fears about the world and like all that. And she's like, you know what? Things are gonna be fine, and no matter what. And he's like, How do you know? Like, here's money, please just take my money so I can help you. So I can help something, so I can have control over something. And she's like, this is this is too much for me to handle.

[19:39] Jess McInley: Yeah. That was the weirdest part for me. Because she doesn't really make any sense.

[19:44] Andrew DeWolf: No, she she makes she makes change, not sense.

[19:47] Jess McInley: Yeah. Fair. Fair enough. Alright. Let's see. I don't think I have much more to say about the plot. There's really nothing. What would you do? What would you do if you found out I had a brain tumor? Would you would you come to my side?

[19:57] Andrew DeWolf: Would I rush to your aid?

[20:01] Yes.

[20:02] Andrew DeWolf: I don't know. Like, would you keep doing the podcast? Like if I'm like bedridden and like have to have immediate surgery, would the podcast still go on without me?

[20:10] Jess McInley: I would wait for you to be dead and then I would get Brent on as the co-host.

[20:13] Andrew DeWolf: I I mean, yeah, I know, but like in between when I'm just dying and not dead. Would you still like, hi, I'm Andrew DeWolf, and welcome to Musicals with Cheese.

[20:23] Jess McInley: We would do a video cast and we'd have a live feed of your of your your body laying there.

[20:30] Andrew DeWolf: Refusing to talk.

[20:32] Jess McInley: Because I've got a tube down my fucking throat.

[20:34] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, it will be like the most uncomfortable podcast you've ever sat through. Andrew's refusing to talk to. He's just on his phone.

[20:41] Jess McInley: I'm just on my phone, and and you're just like uh please turn it off.

[20:52] Andrew DeWolf: Unplug me, goddammit.

[20:54] Jess McInley: If you unplug yourself, you unplug the world.

[20:57] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, it's kind of the point, isn't it?

[20:59] Jess McInley: It's true. Isn't that Dave Malloy's point with Octet? Like, yeah, just unplug yourself. Honestly, I don't understand what his point with Octet was, and I think he had like eight different points, so don't worry, guys.

[21:13] Andrew DeWolf: You all made it clear. I didn't understand what the point was.

[21:16] Jess McInley: Don't worry, none of us understand what the point was. Apparently we didn't read tarot cards, apparently.

[21:22] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, I didn't I didn't read the tarot cards. I don't know what I don't know what the f the hanging man is. I don't know what it means.

[21:29] Jess McInley: Alright, Andrew. Out of all these characters, who do you sympathize with the most? And you can't say Mr. Bungie.

[21:34] Andrew DeWolf: Why not?

[21:36] Jess McInley: Because I told you so. I'm limiting you.

[21:39] Andrew DeWolf: Find the minister.

[21:40] Jess McInley: Oh, really?

[21:41] Andrew DeWolf: No. No, probably Gordon. Not not the nurse that's that's um poor, unsuccessful, and fat.

[21:50] Jess McInley: I am those I am those things for the most part. I re I related to that character so much, I was like, oh man, me too. I am that for the most part, but I feel like it's better to relate to what you want to be versus what you are.

[22:04] Andrew DeWolf: What do you want to be?

[22:06] Jess McInley: Um dying dying of a brain.

[22:14] Andrew DeWolf: Uh who do you relate to the least? And you can't say Mr. Bungie.

[22:18] Jess McInley: I relate to the agent the least, honestly. Like, she's just like, uh fuck it, I need that song. Give me the song, please. I need the song.

[22:27] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. And I'm like, bitch, you're in a hot hospital.

[22:33] Jess McInley: You're right off stelbo double.

[22:37] Andrew DeWolf: You're in a hostable bowl. I've been up since 4 a.m. today. I apologize if I'm a little more stumbly with my wumblies.

[22:52] Jess McInley: I think we gotta go to a bit show.

[22:55] Andrew DeWolf: No!

[22:56] Jess McInley: No, I actively refuse!

[22:58] Andrew DeWolf: Why?

[22:59] Jess McInley: Because I wanna know more about what you think of that agent character.

[23:03] Andrew DeWolf: Why do you need to know more about the agent character? The agent character is.

[23:08] Jess McInley: Why is she there?

[23:09] Andrew DeWolf: I think is more my question. She baffles me more as her of her presence more than the homeless woman, honestly. Especially in the Encores production where they kind of cut some of her big moments. Because right after the Brain Dead song, she had a basically puppeteer scene that's right out of Chicago where she sings a song about whenever I dream, which is kind of like Gordon reflecting his own insecurities. Why is she there? Like in the more recent productions at Encores if you're not gonna do anything with her. She just kind of sits around, bitches, and then leaves. Whereas I think that a character not directly connected to Gordon, like fam familial-wise, is important.

[23:56] Jess McInley: She's there.

[23:57] Andrew DeWolf: Well, I think they could have just combined her and Mr. Bungie into one character and call him Mr. Bungie.

[24:05] Jess McInley: Could have combined Obi Wan Kenobi and Quai Gon Shen and call one character Obi Wan Kenobi.

[24:15] Andrew DeWolf: Motherfucker, I know where you're stealing this shit from. I know that you know where I'm stealing it from, too. Like, imagine if you were just there. Like you and I were doing like a live show or something. I pass out because of a brain tumor. Would you just hang around?

[24:30] Jess McInley: Yes.

[24:33] Andrew DeWolf: You would?

[24:34] Jess McInley: Like for serial?

[24:35] Andrew DeWolf: Like, that's fucked up. Like, I get it. Like, there's the awkward, like, kind of, I feel obligated to do this, which I find interesting, but and they don't do anything with that.

[24:46] Jess McInley: I want to talk about the musical numbers here.

[24:48] Andrew DeWolf: I know you do. Because there's really just not that much to say about this plot.

[24:52] Jess McInley: You know what, Andrew? It's kind of just a review.

[24:56] Andrew DeWolf: You know what I think of you, Andrew?

[24:57] Jess McInley: What?

[24:58] Andrew DeWolf: I think you're brain dead.

[25:01] Jess McInley: Sure. But alive.

[25:03] Andrew DeWolf: Brain dead, dead alive. Alright, let's go into a mid show.

[25:06] Jess McInley: Man, this feels like classic musical cheese. Like you saw, I only had like two drinks, and I'm already way more buzzed than I should be.

[25:13] Andrew DeWolf: Oh god. It's just this isn't like a bonkers episode though, because I don't have anything to say about this. Some of the music is pretty good. I like that the guy that plays Mr. Bungie is the lead in Balls of Fury. That's pretty funny.

[25:32] Jess McInley: Hey guys, sorry to interrupt you in the middle of the show, but I've got a shill at you. We got Patreon, and there's a lot of people that give us money on Patreon. I'm about to read their names.

[25:41] Andrew DeWolf: He's gonna read it. Um our current patrons are Terry Neilman, Max Lunig, Benjamin Learer, Lily Accles, John Donna, Terren the Duck, The Fantastic, Jess Lightning, Ewan Cassidy, Haley McDonald, Tess Gear, Fire of September, Mina Maneary, Monica Thoreau, Brental Black, Haley Murray, Alison Wonderland, B Way Flicks, Lathaniel Stacey Coombe, Joseph Evans Green, Lunarox, 222, Uregul, Drew A White, Carrier Hearn, Christine Malmadell, Mezzanine Theatre Diary, Mary Lou Choquette.

[26:15] Jess McInley: Anne Nunnelly, Cole Birchfeld, Sam Caulfield, John Van Alz, Hollyistic Lee, Russ Walker, Musical Hell, Julian Bach, Emily Graith, Andrew Van Barsen, Emily Stack.

[26:29] Andrew DeWolf: Alright, that's everyone. They give us a little financial support that helps us keep the lights on here at Musicals of Cheese. If you'd like to support us, just like them motherfuckers, just just come on over. We got a Glee podcast where we watch every episode of Glee. Come on, it'll be great. Great. Alright, that's enough of that. Let's get back to the show.

[26:46] Jess McInley: But you gotta have heart and music.

[26:46] Andrew DeWolf: Heart and music.

[26:54] Jess McInley: Heart and music to survive.

[26:59] Andrew DeWolf: You gotta have heart and music.

[27:04] Jess McInley: Heart and music.

[27:07] Andrew DeWolf: Heart and music.

[27:09] Jess McInley: Keep us all alive.

[27:14] Andrew DeWolf: If I only had the time what I would write for Georgie Love Stories.

[27:29] Jess McInley: Let's talk about heart and music, which is basically the there's a lot of stuff that happens before this, but this is basically the opening number that sets up what this story is about. In the way that an opening number should. Like, cause this is a weirdly structured show as is.

[27:44] Andrew DeWolf: Are you trying to say that frogs have so much spring is not the opening number?

[27:48] Jess McInley: No, it is not. I consider like the first three songs all the way up to heart and music as like an extended prologue.

[27:55] Andrew DeWolf: Okay.

[27:56] Jess McInley: I can see that. It actually kind of begs the question why they didn't just start with this song, but yeah.

[28:01] Andrew DeWolf: Because you kinda do need to set up like the relationships, the fact that he's got a brain tumor, the kind of chaos, like y you want all that stuff, but you can't just start with hardened music until you're in the hospital. I get it.

[28:14] Jess McInley: Okay. Alright. Well, heart and music. Which basically is like not really his goal, and not really his I want song. But it's like this is what I stand for, and this is what I'm going for, to the rhythmic beats of like the medical equipment. They're like boop boop boop boop, which I think is really effective too, and sets up location, theme, as well as just character motivation, all in one song. And I think it's beautifully done there.

[28:40] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. I actually so I like to talk about music kind of as a whole a lot of times too. And I think that the music in this overall is pretty strong.

[28:50] Jess McInley: Yeah, but that's kind of how you felt about Falsettos, where you were like, I really like the music, but I don't like anything else.

[28:56] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, I think that the story in this is somewhat bare bones, but the music and how every song is structured, and it's almost more of a, uh, just like it's almost like Cats. Every musical is Cats, guys.

[29:12] Jess McInley: No, but it's like, uh, it's like a revue kind of thing where it's just like, well, here's a character and they're gonna sing a song, and here's a new character and they're gonna sing a song, you know.

[29:21] Andrew DeWolf: No, I get ya. Well, it is like that in the first act, but the second act it kind of falls further off the rails.

[29:27] Jess McInley: Uh, the second act that even turned it, it leans even harder into that. It's like now here's a dream sequence, and now every character's gonna sing a song.

[29:36] Andrew DeWolf: I get that. Um, but I think "Heart and Music" is like really setting up the mood of this show. Like, because "Frogs" have so much spring is a joke song.

[29:46] Jess McInley: Let's be fair. It's setting up a joke that is paid off in the very last song of the show, which I think is effective, where he actually turns it into a reflexive number about why he feels happy with his life and contentment.

[30:01] Andrew DeWolf: He finally understands what he means by "I feel so much spring," which is the arc of him like realizing what's important in his life and all that nonsense that I know Andrew hates.

[30:12] Jess McInley: I like the closing song. I think it was a really good way to tie everything together.

[30:17] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. And I think "Heart and Music," while not the most memorable song, is effective as an opening number, so to say.

[30:24] Jess McInley: "I'd Rather Be Sailing."

[30:28] Andrew DeWolf: Yes, I would.

[30:32] Jess McInley: On an open sea.

[30:37] Andrew DeWolf: I'd stand at the railing, if I could.

[30:46] Jess McInley: Feeling wild and free.

[30:52] Andrew DeWolf: The sun is on my neck.

[30:55] Jess McInley: The wind is in my face.

[30:59] Andrew DeWolf: The waters incredibly blue.

[31:06] Jess McInley: I do want to talk very briefly about "Sailing."

[31:09] Andrew DeWolf: Or "I'd Rather Be Sailing."

[31:11] Jess McInley: Me too.

[31:11] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, I what do you think? Because I have weird thoughts about this.

[31:15] Jess McInley: Um, I don't quite understand why they put it here, if that makes sense.

[31:19] Andrew DeWolf: It's Roger's introduction song. So it's like, if we introduce him, we need to show what's important to him and what Gordon resents him for, basically.

[31:29] Jess McInley: Yeah, but I don't know. It's a weird way to introduce him. And it he kind of it makes him come across as almost like a yacht club guy.

[31:32] Andrew DeWolf: It makes him come across aloof and uncaring, which as soon as he shows up, he is very caring and not aloof and worried. It's like, what is going on here? It's like the music is saying one thing, but the book and actual character actions are saying another thing.

[31:52] Jess McInley: It almost makes me feel like maybe they wrote this song before they decided what they were gonna use the song for.

[31:59] Andrew DeWolf: I think that too, because this kind of feels like a pop hit, and a lot of people have used it on their albums and such.

[32:05] Jess McInley: Yeah, it's um, it's interesting. I don't like the placement in the show. I almost feel like this would work better during the dream sequence where he's kind of dreaming like what he thinks everyone is feeling.

[32:15] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, I'd agree with that, but they pay it off in the "Sitting Becalmed in the Lee of Cuddy Hunk" when he's like talking about how much he hates sailing and all that.

[32:23] Jess McInley: Yeah. So I get why they put it where it is, and it kinda like the lyrics itself is like, I'd rather be sailing than be with you, but I'll come home eventually when I'm done doing my thing.

[32:34] Andrew DeWolf: And that isn't the character we see, which is where I'm most baffled by it.

[32:38] Jess McInley: Yeah, and I think it kind of shows that in some ways this show is a little messy, a little sloppy.

[32:44] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, which is kind of the reason why it's never really hit Broadway, it's always stayed off-Broadway. I think it's a great album. Let me frame it like that. I think this is an absolutely wonderful album. It's got some bangers.

[32:55] Jess McInley: It does. And speaking of bangers, I want to talk about literally one of my favorite songs in musical theater.

[33:00] Andrew DeWolf: Next, "Mommy Sat and Cried."

[33:05] Jess McInley: But Dad was unaffected. He said, "Have you ever had a better two minutes in the last three years?"

[33:13] Andrew DeWolf: She said, "But Joe, the dumb horse lost!"

[33:17] Jess McInley: He said, "Sometimes joy has a terrible cost."

[33:20] Andrew DeWolf: I know that we would laugh. We would sneer, we would scoff.

[33:29] Jess McInley: Yeah, they're all mommy's biting his neck as they roll on the deck. And there is blood on the ground.

[33:44] Andrew DeWolf: And the band starts to play as the horse is around.

[33:50] Jess McInley: And they're off. Isn't life funny? People lose money and have fun.

[33:58] Andrew DeWolf: Betting, of course, is hell on the horses and on families where the betting is done.

[34:04] Jess McInley: It's a joke to believe someone's won. And they're off.

[34:07] Andrew DeWolf: I think this is one of the best songs ever written in musical theater to tell backstory, character, and reflexive, like just like on past, and like I think this is top-tier great songwriting.

[34:19] Jess McInley: This is, uh, this is when Gordon's dad commits, um, Shark Tail, right?

[34:23] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah.

[34:25] Jess McInley: Yes, exactly that. So Gordon tells the story of basically how his family falls apart because his dad bet the family fortune on a horse race.

[34:41] Andrew DeWolf: Which is so exceptionally dumb.

[34:44] Jess McInley: Yes, and this show is quick to frame it that way. I don't understand why anyone would bet anything on a horse race.

[34:51] Andrew DeWolf: Let alone by anyone who go to a horse race. I live in Saratoga Springs, and I have never been to a horse race.

[34:58] Jess McInley: What? Are you even like a New Yorker?

[35:03] Andrew DeWolf: I mean, I don't know if New Yorkers like the horse racing. But it is kind of a Saratoga thing. But most of the people I know that live here don't like horse racing. It's all just rich tourists.

[35:16] Jess McInley: Which makes sense, but here it's like you see a guy that's got trouble with gambling and watching his marriage crumble apart, and like the specific things that you remember as a kid, like mom would bite his neck as they roll on the deck, there's blood on the ground, like just shit you would see and interpret one way as a kid and then look back as an adult, like, oh that was fucked up.

[35:38] Andrew DeWolf: No, that's weird.

[35:39] Jess McInley: Yeah. I think kids are kind of programmed to almost accept everything that they see as just like, yeah, this is normal. And then eventually you look back and you're like, oh, right.

[35:53] Andrew DeWolf: And one of the parts that like really breaks my heart every time I hear it, which is accurate, because we all in general, like all people who have grown into like their full human selves, like you and I are in our 20s, so we're not quite there, but we're almost there, like to bitch about their childhood and like see the worst of it all. And one of the lines in this song that just breaks my heart because it's too accurate, which is like he's basically spending this entire time bitching about how his parents divorced and how his mom like bitched and how he was like an arrogant, like impulsive jerk, and he's like, but we also laughed a lot, but that's a part I all often forgot to mention.

[36:32] Jess McInley: Yeah.

[36:34] Andrew DeWolf: Well, the bad always overrides the good. That goes for everything.

[36:38] Jess McInley: Um, and I think it just as a song, it has a chorus, it has a melody, it tells a story, like a complete story. Like it's not it's like up there with the greats of musical theater storytelling, to be honest.

[36:52] Andrew DeWolf: And I will forever say this show is worth it with all its messy parts because it gave me "And They're Off," which is one of the best musical theater songs ever written.

[37:01] Jess McInley: I like it as well.

[37:05] Andrew DeWolf: I think we both agree.

[37:07] Jess McInley: Tell the story. Tell little children, cause you're gonna scare them.

[37:12] Andrew DeWolf: How I'm poor, unsuccessful, poor, unsuccessful in fact. And getting older, getting grayer.

[37:22] Jess McInley: Stop me if you've heard this before. Cause if you've heard this before, hell, it's just more of the same.

[37:27] Andrew DeWolf: Help me. I'm a player. We'll never make it. I won't make it. I won't make it. No, no, no, no, no, no.

[37:38] Jess McInley: I was practically thin.

[37:42] Andrew DeWolf: No.

[37:43] Jess McInley: I can eat like I'm renovating. Soon you'll uh be back home. A success in training.

[37:50] Andrew DeWolf: I'll be here complaining that I'm poor, unsuccessful, poor, unsuccessful, and fat. And getting older.

[37:58] Jess McInley: I am not successful. I am not so damn successful.

[38:01] Andrew DeWolf: I'm getting older. I am not successful. I am not so damn successful.

[38:07] Jess McInley: You were not successful. I am not successful. You're too old to be a failure. Your future's looking cloudy.

[38:14] Andrew DeWolf: And your sister is a whore.

[38:16] Jess McInley: My sister's a receptionist. Let's talk about poor, unsuccessful, and fat.

[38:21] Andrew DeWolf: Which is basically our bio names.

[38:23] Jess McInley: Yeah. I don't know if I really want to do like, uh, autobiography talk right now, but our future talk.

[38:32] Andrew DeWolf: Oh, you go first.

[38:34] Jess McInley: Um, mostly I want to talk about this nurse character. Like, what do you think about him her? Cause it's been a her in previous productions and other things.

[38:42] Andrew DeWolf: Um, it's it's weird how the nursing stuff ref is reflected in this. Like you've got the nice nurse, you got the bitch nurse, you've got the good nurse, so to say, as framed by our main nurse.

[38:54] Jess McInley: Um, yeah, I don't know. It's kind of it's odd that you have like these one off characters like this.

[39:01] Andrew DeWolf: Mm-hmm.

[39:02] Jess McInley: But I like this song, and I feel like it has a purpose. Like, hey, look at all these crazy characters you run into in a hospital and how wacky they are.

[39:11] Andrew DeWolf: But when he comes back later and it's like, oh, you guys are gonna get me in so much trouble because I can't give you a sponge bath. Like, okay, yeah, you're uh overstaying your welcome. Get out of here, Skimbleshanks.

[39:25] Jess McInley: Skimbleshanks is perfect. Don't you dare shit on Skimbleshanks.

[39:30] Andrew DeWolf: I don't know. Uh I can see why they did it because it need they needed to fill some time, but...

[39:31] Jess McInley: Well, this isn't even that long a show. It's like an hour and 36 minutes.

[39:39] Andrew DeWolf: Exactly. That's why they needed to fill some time. They had to get it to that length so they could get people to pay for it.

[39:49] Jess McInley: But I feel that, because I feel like that's also Gordon's like fear is like becoming poor and successful and fat. He's kind of staring into the future if he's not great.

[39:55] Andrew DeWolf: If he's not great, he's gonna be a nurse.

[40:01] Jess McInley: What a what a controversial thing to say in these times, Jess.

[40:04] Andrew DeWolf: I'm not saying that, but it's the way the musical is framing it.

[40:08] Jess McInley: I mean, I think everyone's fear to some extent is being poor, unsuccessful, and fat. And it might be an irrational fear, but I think it's a fear that society imbues onto all of us.

[40:18] Andrew DeWolf: Growing up, uh, I think pretty much all media has always portrayed the worst qualities you can be is poor, unsuccessful, and fat.

[40:28] Jess McInley: Yes.

[40:29] Andrew DeWolf: But the nurse is singing it as if it's like it's framing it like you've got a good life, and I'm a nurse. And I feel like that's William Finn's's like interpretation of nurses and the way he was treated in that hospital.

[40:40] Jess McInley: I'm not gonna lie. Is that a bad thing? Should he not have done that?

[40:43] Andrew DeWolf: I don't I don't know. It's just questions I'm asking here.

[40:48] Jess McInley: I feel like, yeah, you shouldn't have done that. That's rude. Nurses don't deserve that kind of treatment.

[40:53] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah, but he had a brain tumor, so.

[40:55] Jess McInley: It's true. He probably misremembered all of it.

[40:57] Andrew DeWolf: Right. Like all this is a fucking mess. The nurse was probably rich, successful, and thin.

[41:04] Jess McInley: And thin. Which are all the best things you can be.

[41:09] Andrew DeWolf: Um how about I rephrase this song a little bit?

[41:14] Jess McInley: Sure.

[41:14] Andrew DeWolf: Alright, alright. I'm gonna call this, um, humble, yeah, modest, yep, and thick.

[41:22] Jess McInley: With two C's?

[41:23] Andrew DeWolf: Yes, with two C's. Cause then she's a snack.

[41:27] Jess McInley: She's a snack that, uh, that gives her money away.

[41:30] Andrew DeWolf: Or he's a snack.

[41:31] Jess McInley: She's a snack.

[41:34] Andrew DeWolf: You know we're missing out on the dance Andrew just did.

[41:39] Jess McInley: Because I don't think you guys realize that Andrew is altogether humble, yes, modest, yes, and thick with two C's.

[41:49] Andrew DeWolf: Snack. Because Andrew is a snickety snack with two C's.

[41:55] Jess McInley: Yes, I'll be fair. Yes, I'll be bossing bones. Yes, I have. Yes, I will survive.

[42:08] Andrew DeWolf: Yes, is the word that opens the door to being host.

[42:13] Jess McInley: Hello!

[42:39] Andrew DeWolf: Except when a stranger says, "Get into my car!"

[42:44] Jess McInley: Say no!

[42:45] Andrew DeWolf: No!

[42:46] Jess McInley: Or when someone says, "Would you like to lose your virginity?"

[42:52] Andrew DeWolf: Someone will have no affinity.

[42:58] Jess McInley: Say no.

[43:00] Andrew DeWolf: No, no.

[43:02] Andrew DeWolf: No, no, no.

[43:04] Jess McInley: No, no, no, no, no. Let's talk about the yes song. Um, this is the song that he decides is the greatest thing he's ever written.

[43:16] Andrew DeWolf: Well, he tries to make it the greatest thing he's ever written. So he's like, Alright, I'm ready for this kid's show, so I'm gonna do it as best as I can.

[43:25] Jess McInley: And he fucks it all up.

[43:25] Andrew DeWolf: That's what happens when you have a brain tumor. I actually kinda like the song though, like as a song. I think it's decent. It gets stuck in my head a lot.

[43:35] Jess McInley: I think Mr. Bungie was probably right not to want to use it on his kid's show, though.

[43:40] Andrew DeWolf: Why though?

[43:41] Jess McInley: Because it was inappropriate for kids.

[43:43] Andrew DeWolf: What do you mean? It wasn't appropriate for kids.

[43:46] Jess McInley: He reads the lyrics and they're not appropriate. And Mr. Bungie is dressed as a frog, so I trust him.

[43:52] Andrew DeWolf: I don't I think you're just being a fucking hater. Mr. Bungie is the lead role from Balls of Fury in the Encore's production, yes. He was played by the gentleman from Balls of Fury. He was also in the Fantastic Beast movie.

[44:11] Jess McInley: True. He seems to not have been in any good movies so far. But I think even as is, like, the song itself has some funny lyrics like, or when a stranger says, get into my car, say no. Or when someone says, Would you like to lose your virginity? Someone with whom you have no affinity. I think that's funny.

[44:33] Andrew DeWolf: It's I think that's fucking hilarious. It's funny. Um, but it's not appropriate for a kid's show, so it's obviously a bad song. I mean, do you believe that yes is the best word to use in any kind of situation?

[44:44] Jess McInley: Shh. Yes.

[44:46] Andrew DeWolf: Is yes a good word and is no a bad word?

[44:49] Jess McInley: Yes.

[44:52] Andrew DeWolf: Do you love Adolf Hitler?

[44:54] Jess McInley: Yes. Uh wait.

[44:57] Andrew DeWolf: I got I got you, motherfucker!

[45:02] Jess McInley: Uh-oh. Looks like somebody hasn't been listening to Mr. Bungie.

[45:09] ♪ Musical number ♪

[45:45] Andrew DeWolf: I love don't give in. It's so stupid. I love it so much. I feel like this like this the show was kind of losing me a little bit until this song happened. And then I was like, oh okay. Like, he Mr. Bungie has not showed up again since the yes song. And he's just like, hey, little tadpoles. I feel like y'all are like getting real sad. But when you feel bad, don't give in.

[46:13] Jess McInley: It doesn't even make sense. Because Mr. Bungie has been almost like the antagonist the whole time. And now all of a sudden he's like, shows up and saves the day. And it's like, okay.

[46:21] Andrew DeWolf: It's not really him though. It's like a dream version of him, but it's so Gordon's vision of him. It's so bizarre. Why is he having such a positive vision of Mr. Bungie?

[46:32] Jess McInley: I mean, is he having all that positive vision of him?

[46:36] Andrew DeWolf: I would say so. He's telling him not to give up, and he wakes him up. Am I wrong?

[46:41] Jess McInley: You're not wrong, but it's also very weird that like what really gets him up is like him just like when you're feeling low, maybe eat spaghetti. And he's like, Yep. Time to get up. I hope it is spaghetti. And he's like, I like spaghetti. That's worth getting up for.

[47:03] Andrew DeWolf: It's very weird that they rhyme spaghetti and more ready. I mean, in my brain that works, but do you actually believe that quitting is the specialty of jerks?

[47:17] Jess McInley: Yes. I've never had a good person give up on me.

[47:21] Andrew DeWolf: Am I a good person? I've never given up on you.

[47:23] Jess McInley: You're a good person, Jess.

[47:25] Andrew DeWolf: What?

[47:26] Jess McInley: You're a good person, Jess.

[47:28] Andrew DeWolf: Let's kiss. Let's kiss to break the tension.

[47:37] Jess McInley: Frogs have so much spring within them. Jump frog jump. Jump so high you split your tights. You know, that was awful.

[47:58] ♪ Musical number ♪

[48:35] Jess McInley: Can we talk about I feel so much spring at the very end?

[48:38] Andrew DeWolf: I guess you're making me.

[48:40] Jess McInley: I feel so much spring. I don't remember how the song goes. I feel so much spring within me. I that's the first song. I like that it transitions from him writing the the frog song into his own song. And then it becomes like the homeless woman starts singing and gets it really so full and makes it really nice. And then everybody's in there and the full band in the back, and it gets big. It's a nice song at the end. It's a good way to end it.

[49:09] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. It is. It makes you feel whole, and he finally understands what the songs he was writing means instead of just writing a song for song's sake.

[49:17] Jess McInley: Like that was the most important lesson that Gordon really had to learn was w yes. This is a show about someone not understanding why he's writing music and like the reason why he's in such a block is because he can't emotionally connect, and he finally learns to emotionally connect to that first song that he was having such fucking difficulty with. And then at the end when he's there, he's like, I get it. I I can I can relate to this frog character because I have a new rejuvenated view of life.

[49:45] Andrew DeWolf: Do you think Mr. Bungie ever saved uh like ever s ever sang the song?

[49:49] Jess McInley: He was there singing it at the end, so I assume he would. Um maybe that's why Mr. Bungie saves him. Because now he he can finally connect with the frog. He finally understands what a frog's life is. Because a frog just he Gordon needs to learn that it wasn't easy to be green. Being before he had this brain tumor, it's like he was a tadpole. And the brain tumor Fuck you, the whole experience brought him into being a frog.

[50:20] Andrew DeWolf: Fuck everything you represent in the world.

[50:22] Jess McInley: Now he's a frog. That's my interpretation of this. Take it or leave it.

[50:28] Andrew DeWolf: I'm leaving it. That's garbage.

[50:30] Jess McInley: I'm taking it. Alright. I don't really have any more to say. It's good.

[50:34] Andrew DeWolf: It's okay. Andrew's giving up. I've given up on this show. But you know, quitting is a specialty of jerks, Andrew.

[50:42] Jess McInley: That's true. And I'm a jerk, so I'm glad to quit.

[50:46] Andrew DeWolf: I'm a jerk and everybody loves me. Everybody loves me. Alright. What is your overall thoughts on a new brain and your cheese rating?

[50:53] Jess McInley: Okay. Overall thoughts. Um well. I like it.

[51:03] Andrew DeWolf: That sounded convincing.

[51:05] Jess McInley: I mean, okay. It's a little bit messy. Like it's a little sloppy. And brain tumors are sloppy.

[51:13] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. It seems a it's not like it's unfocused because there is a very straightforward like this is what's happening. But there's no like plot necessarily. It just it starts with he gets a brain tumor and then he has a brain tumor, and then he doesn't at the end, and it's better. It's more of like an emotional, like uh emotional ride rather than a like story-driven ride.

[51:40] Jess McInley: Right. It's not plot-driven as much as it is kind of like emotion-driven. You said it perfectly.

[51:45] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. Which works fine. But the the thing is, like, there's a lot of characters, and some of them are kind of pointless, and I don't know. There's a lot of weird stuff going on. But overall, the music holds it all together, and it's not very long, so it's not like it meanders. You know, it's it's like no, it it moves pretty quick.

[52:07] Jess McInley: Yeah, so it's not like, oh, it's two and a half hours of the same thing. And it's depressing.

[52:13] Andrew DeWolf: Yeah. Like, and I appreciate that this didn't have a really depressing ending, too.

[52:18] Jess McInley: Yeah. Like, even throughout it, like it being about a brain tumor, it's not a fucking downer.

[52:23] Andrew DeWolf: Well, yeah, and he gets better at the end. And like, obviously, not every story can end that way, but it's nice to see at least sometimes these things have things work out. You know? Um, and and so I I kind of Wizard doesn't die of AIDS at every musical.

[52:37] Jess McInley: Yeah, wizard is is still alive at the end of this musical. Um and uh yeah, as far as a cheese rating goes, I'm gonna give it frog cheese. Which thing which accord according to Merriam Webster is a young puffball, and I have no idea what that is.

[52:55] Andrew DeWolf: Alright then. I think a new brain is great um as an album. I'm not sure it works a hundred percent effectively as a full stage production, which is why I think most of the stage productions have been very limited, and I think it really relies on how good your cast is. Um, like the Asian character, I think her name is Rhoda, she just becomes a fly in the wall at certain point, no frog pun intended, but she is not very useful after that opening scene. And I kind of feel bad because I often like the actresses that portray it. Especially in the Encore's version where they cut out like her Whenever I Dream moment, where she's like really like Whenever I Dream, a dream pornographically explicit, and it's like a real nice pattern song where she's a puppet and she gets to perform and be a little goofy, but they cut that out, and I don't like that.

And if you want to see the best version, Emily Cork has a really good one on her Instagram, so check that one out. Um but either way, I think this the song-wise, like this has some of the greatest songs in like William Finn's's library, so it's hard for me to be like really unbiased about how much I enjoy that. So overall, I'm gonna give us a Danish white cheese, which is a very famous spring cheese, because I feel so much spring within me. Jump frog jump.

[54:17] Jess McInley: Andrew, do you have anything love to say before we wrap this on up?

[54:21] Andrew DeWolf: Um, not really. I hope I don't get a brain tumor.

[54:24] Jess McInley: Hello, Andrew! I am your fantasy frog man, I I am the representation of your brain tumor.

[54:31] Andrew DeWolf: Oh my god. What are you gonna do, Andrew? What are you gonna do?

[54:35] Jess McInley: Oh my brain tumor situation's gotten a lot worse. Oh my goodness. Oh my god, we're gonna have to do surgery on your brain. Oh my goodness.

[54:43] Andrew DeWolf: Frogman, please help me.

[54:45] Jess McInley: I'm putting you under, I'm your doctor now. Oh putting you under.

[54:49] Andrew DeWolf: Oh, frogman, please don't do that. Please, no.

[54:53] Jess McInley: Up yonder. Oh, what's operating on your brain? Oh!

[54:57] Andrew DeWolf: Oh, your brain needed lots of operating.

[54:59] Jess McInley: Oh, please. What's happening?

[55:03] Andrew DeWolf: Oh, my finger snipped your frontal corplex. You're brain dead. Ribbit.

[55:10] Jess McInley: Oh wait, I repaired it. You're all good. You're fixed. Your brain tumors removed. Rivit ribbit.

[55:19] Andrew DeWolf: Do you know who definitely doesn't ribbit?

[55:22] Jess McInley: Um our patrons?

[55:24] Andrew DeWolf: Yes, our wonderful patrons! Thank you guys for listening. Um please follow us on iTunes Spotify Stitcher at Musicals with Cheese. If you could leave us a review there, we we would think it would just be darling if you could leave us a review on iTunes, Spotify, and Stitcher. Our Twitter is at Cheesy Musicals. Our Patreon is Musicals with Cheese. Our Instagram is Musicals with Cheese. Our YouTube page is Musicals with Cheese. We have a patron only podcast where we review every episode of Glee once a week. And that is called Glee with Cheese, and you have to be a five dollar patron to go check that out. Are you really missing out? There's a ton of FOMO. Andrew hates Glee so much, and it's kind of funny to watch him get angry. Uh our email is musicaltheatrelives@gmail.com. Our title card was created by the amazing Jolene Casco. Go send her love at Instagram. Jolene. At Jolene Casco. Andrew, is there anything else you have to say before we wrap this all up?

[56:19] Andrew DeWolf: Happy Pride Month.

[56:20] Jess McInley: Happy Pride Month. We got a lot more to come this month. Um, I think there's gonna be some fun things and some surprises that you're not going to expect. I can't wait to watch Dracula. Maybe Andrew and I can make out. Maybe that's the thing that's gonna happen for our Patreon. If you or maybe for our OnlyFans, like you get the full full sex tape between me and Andrew. OnlyFans. Yeah, follow us on OnlyFans. Follow us on OnlyFans at musicals with cheese. Imagine if we had an OnlyFans. And we just post like cheese porn. Dude, that's like disgusting.

[57:00] Andrew DeWolf: What no?

[57:02] Jess McInley: You're just sex shaming me. Alright, we'll see you next time on Musicals with Cheese. Ba ba ba ba ba ba boo ba