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[0:00] Mo Brady: You're listening to My Show Closed, a miniseries from The Ensemblist, the only podcast that shows you Broadway from the inside out. Welcome, I'm Mo Brady.

[0:37] Mo Brady: Making it to Broadway is a dream come true for many. But no matter the show, living that dream will eventually come to an end. Whether your show runs for one month or one decade, eventually every Broadway musical will close. It doesn't matter if it's your first Broadway show or your tenth, closing means a future of artistic and financial insecurity. And yet, closing shows are just a part of the big, beautiful cycle of musical theater. This summer, seven Broadway musicals are shuttering their doors, sending scores of Ensemblists onto the unemployment line. But is there a good side to having your Broadway show close, or at least a silver lining? That's what I'm interested in finding out in this miniseries with three actors who have closed Broadway musicals this summer.

Chloe Campbell made a name for herself performing in London in four West End musicals. Since making a leap across the pond, she's performed in the Chicago Company of Hamilton and the National Tour of In the Heights. Her Broadway credits include the short-lived Tuck Everlasting and the just-closed production of King Kong. Here's our conversation.

[2:03] Mo Brady: Hi.

[2:04] Chloe Campbell: Hey! Will you introduce yourself and tell us what neighborhood of New York City you live in?

[2:18] Chloe Campbell: I'm Chloe Campbell and I live in Crown Heights.

[2:26] Mo Brady: Tell me how you see the relationship between artistry and business.

[2:32] Chloe Campbell: That is such a good question. So I feel like it's really tough being a performer, just in terms of you want to like fulfill like your artistic needs. However, you have to live in this insanely expensive city. It does become a thing of, well, you've got to pay the bills. So it's like a very like back and forth thing. And occasionally you can get the two to merge like really, really well, which gets to be amazing. And that kind of segues well into King Kong, just in terms of I was in the original cast. So like I began with it. I did the lab and stuff. It's really cool when you get to be part of a new show because you do get more of the artistic fulfillment rather than just coming into like something that's already set. Come in, do eight shows a week.

[3:10] Mo Brady: Are there warning signs for you that a show is going to be closing?

[3:17] Chloe Campbell: Yes. So I've, yes. So I have closed two Broadway shows. I closed them. The main thing is probably the audience. You look out into an audience and you can be, ah, then there's not that many people there. With King Kong, we actually did sell pretty well. However, I guess like because the theatre is so big that it's like ticket prices. So if people get the ones that are at the back more than the ones at the front. So I guess for me, like the first thing that you notice when you're like, oh, a show this might close is ticket sales. Yeah. With King Kong, it was like we got really bad reviews. So I think there was always like in the back of everyone's head. Hopefully people come just based off they want to see something different.

There's always that thing in the back of your head of like, oh, will our show last? Because unfortunately, in this day and age, a lot goes off reviews. Whereas with Tuck Everlasting, we got an incredible review from the New York Times and we closed within a month. So it's just like, I feel like reviews, like you can get an amazing review and still close is my point. Whereas like personally, from a performing point of view, and I don't know what goes on behind the scenes at all, but going out onto a stage, it can be obvious just by pure numbers. On this show, actually, it was like some of our dresses, they always look at the grosses just so they know, like, do I stay? Do I go? Should I stay or should I go?

Like, what do I do? So I guess on this show is when I've been the most aware of that stuff. But it's not something I look at every week. Because I'm just like, what's the point? Like, I'm just going to enjoy myself, enjoy the show. And this is the thing, when you're a performer, things open, things close, that is like normal. And for me personally, I want to keep being artistically filled and doing new things. So where I am right now in my life, I don't necessarily need to like sit in a show for years. So you know, if something closes, like that's fine. That was like the course it had to take.

[5:16] Mo Brady: How did you find out that King Kong would be closing?

[5:24] Chloe Campbell: We got a notice, basically, they sent us an email being like, we're gonna have a company meeting on stage. Then we came on the stage. And yeah, the producer was there. And they basically gave like a really nice chat about everything that's been happening and tried really hard. And it's just that time, like, normally, like people shows will hold on to Tony's. And then after Tony's, if you don't really win anything, then you'll like, see how the sales start doing. And then after that, if like the sales haven't picked up to where they want it from like a business perspective, then there's just no point because they're not going to make their money back. We kind of had an inkling just with looking out into the audience. And then, yeah, I guess we were like, well, it's either going to be around this time or like January. And then yeah, and then we had a meeting and then we were like, okay.

[6:19] Mo Brady: So what was the feeling when they said we're closing and it's this date?

[6:24] Chloe Campbell: I think it was something that we were kind of ready for a lot of us were ready for. We have become like such a close family. Like this is one of the shows where I just loved going into work. It was just like such nice people. We had such a good time. Like there was only seven girls on stage and then three swings. There was 10 of us all together. So we were like really, really tight and gotten really well. Things like that I'll miss, but it was more just like a celebration because we were just like, this is what we achieved and we've achieved something that's like not really been seen on Broadway before. Did people like it? Yes. Did people have things to say about it in a negative way? Yes. Like that's fine.

Everyone can have their opinion, but it was more just like about creating something that's different. I think we were all just like proud of what we've done and everyone put so much work into that show. Like we all just were like celebratory of what we achieved, but also knew that it was going to come to an end at some point.

[7:13] Mo Brady: Do you know how long it was between when you found out the show would close?

[7:17] Chloe Campbell: Yeah, it was two months, which I was like so excited about because with Tuck, they told us on Tuesday that we were closing on Sunday. It was, that was savage. I was like, I'll take two months. That's fine.

[7:29] Mo Brady: Was there a grieving process for you?

[7:35] Chloe Campbell: I kind of named myself as a bit of a heart of stone when it comes to these things. I don't know why, like when something finishes, I'm not a very emotional person. That's what we do as performers. Like, so I'm kind of, and I've been doing this for a while.

[7:48] Chloe S. Campbell: So I'm used to like shows open and shows close and that's just kind of how it is and like if something doesn't end then you are not free to like have new opportunities open up for you. So I'll miss the people but also like we're so close that we're gonna stay in touch. So I think it's more like the crew and stuff I was like oh it's gonna be sad because they're like such good people but yeah I am like the worst because I am not a griever at this stuff and I feel so terrible. I didn't really grieve that much. I think I just like was celebrating I was just like enjoyed what we did and I was like this has been an amazing year and I just more feel grateful for having such a good year.

[8:33] Chloe S. Campbell: So what was the last performance like? Describe the energy. The last performance obviously when it's like the last show like the audience I mean it was the same for Tuck Everlasting the audience is just so amazing because they're there to support you and they want to celebrate the show. So obviously it's a heightened experience because everyone's like shouting at things like for no reason or like you know clapping at stuff that wouldn't normally get a clap but it's just really fun. It was weird being backstage because like obviously after we did like a number then like the costumes get packed up and so there's like less and less things in your place and like you're like oh wow yeah that's really it.

I think it was just weird like my favourite number in the show is the opening number and after doing that number I was like man I'm not gonna ever get to do that again. That was pretty sad and then Casey who I partner with in the opening uh he had like tears in his eyes when we were partnering together and I was like oh man because I really like the choreography in that opening number is just so good.

[9:36] Chloe S. Campbell: Yeah just things like that but the audience was incredible it was it was just like a really fun last show. It doesn't feel this the thing is I think maybe also the reason I don't get super upset is because it doesn't feel real. This doesn't feel like this is going to be our last show because you've been doing eight shows a week for so long and then you look back and you're like think of all the things you did in that year and it just feels like a dream it's so weird we're like oh my gosh we had Christmas together here like we did Secret Santa we were like thinking back over that and like it's just funny so yeah kind of it's like it's just weird it's like a weird experience and like I was like saying to my husband because he's not a performer and just trying to explain it it's because yes it's just a job but you spend so much time like and it's intimate you know you're like sharing dressing rooms you're like quick changing together you spend so much time together and it is such an emotional experience like you talk about everything you've gone through on your day-to-days and like problems you're having you know you you like share so much together so I think that is like the biggest thing that you're like you miss because you miss the camaraderie too.

[10:34] Chloe S. Campbell: And why do you think people from multiple shows wanted to mourn and celebrate together kind of as a group? I think it was really good because so when I did Tuck Everlasting that was the year that Hamilton opened so Hamilton like like killed everything at the Tonys obviously it's an incredible show and a load of shows closed Tuck closed before Tonys even happened like I remember like that year loads of shows closed too. I think what was so nice about it is the thing of being like we're all in this together and this happens and it doesn't mean like anyone's a bad performer or any the nature of the business like it really is like you got to make money if you don't make money you can't keep running you know what I mean like it was just like so nice to be like we're all in this together and we're all going through the same thing and it sucks but like we at least we were here you know so yeah I think it was I love that it happened it was just really fun.

[11:32] Chloe S. Campbell: So today is Tuesday. Yes I should be at my half-hour call right now. You should. How are you feeling? I'm actually fine I think honestly for me things probably hit later right now it's nice to like I'm so I feel like everyone once we closed got sick so many of the girls have like been sick today so I think um it's just nice to chill for a second and also just like take in what happened in this last year yeah I kind of feel okay today I think it's gonna hit me I already got like an email for an audition and like all of that I'm like oh god and it starts I don't think it's gonna hit me right now and then I'm going away on a vacation in a week so I think it'll probably when I get back from that and then I'm like oh okay I am yeah not on my show.

[12:23] Chloe S. Campbell: What do you hope is next? I don't know really um do you know what okay so this is the one thing this is actually the biggest thing I hate about ending a show is everyone's like so what's next and you're like I don't know my show just closed if I had something I would let you know you know what I mean like people are always like so what do you do next I'm like your guess is as good as mine I would love another job but who knows um I mean it's literally just kind of back to the grind and just auditioning again um what do you want it to be I don't that is like the questionable question so I feel like for so long I had specific goals because when I moved here I was on like an artist's visa and then my goal was like a green card and then after I got my green card my goal was to be in a Broadway show and then like I got now I'm like oh oh my god this is like so cool because I've kind of like achieved what I didn't think was necessarily possible for my next I think like honestly I want to keep being part of the creative process so I would like prefer to do a lab or a new show um I love dancing but I also love like singing so I'm like maybe I should like try and do some smaller roles or stuff like that I don't know when you're doing eight shows a week it does become like a job um because it is grueling and hard and so honestly like I just am so appreciative for the show because it was such a diverse group of people and I don't know if I don't know if a group like that will come together again which is kind of like sad just because like people from all walks of life it wasn't like your typical musical theatre people necessarily you know we had like puppeteers that were like that come from like legit the puppeteering world in Australia so it was just like a really cool group of people what I truly loved about our company is everyone celebrated everyone because we were so diverse so there was not really competition it was more just like people just wanted to learn from everyone so it's like oh like how do you do that or like I want to watch how this person sings this and like or I want to you know what I mean it was just like such a mix um that I'm definitely gonna miss that getting to watch people on stage and like how they do things.

[14:51] Mo Brady: Special thanks to Chloe Campbell for sharing her stories with us this week you can learn more about her and how to connect with her online by visiting our website theensemblist.com the ensemblist was produced today by me Mo Brady you can help others find out about the ensemblist by leaving us a rating and review on apple podcasts and also download episodes wherever you get your podcasts or at our website theensemblist.com and make sure you're following us on instagram where we share news reviews original photography we're very busy it's a great feed awesome thanks for listening guys until next time.