This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Susan Blackwell: Hey everybody, this is part two of our interview with Erika Henningsen, recorded long before the quarantine kicked in.

[0:06] Laura Camien: If you'd like, you can go back and give part one a listen or not, however, you're doing it right. Enjoy the show.

[0:12] Susan Blackwell: The Spark File podcast may contain profanity and other adult content. Please use your discretion.

[0:22] Erika Henningsen: When I bumped into something that inspires me, I jump in my sparks. I pump it in my sparks. I jump into my sparks. Let's open up this box.

[0:49] Susan Blackwell: One of the things we're obsessed with is failure. I think in life in general and not just with social media, we sort of get the highlight reel. And we're obsessed with failure. So could you tell us about a time when you felt like you really shit the bed? And it could be in your personal life, it could be in your creative life.

[1:14] Erika Henningsen: Yeah. Or even perceived failure. You felt like it was failure. I mean, there has been so much failure in my personal life, which is a whole nother after dark podcast. But I think it all stemmed from the idea that, like, in my personal life, the idea that something that was shiny or alluring was good. And I mean, I just think about that when you think of highlight reel. Like there were versions of highlight reel choices that I made when it came to people or how I carried myself that were just terrible, terrible paths to go down. But from the outside, it looked so good. So I thought, well, I'm gonna do that.

[2:02] Susan Blackwell: So you were catering to sort of like an external gaze of how this would look.

[2:09] Erika Henningsen: Yes, okay. An external gaze. And I think that is, I mean, I think that external gaze is the thing that like haunts an A-list's shoulder.

[2:18] Susan Blackwell: Sure.

[2:19] Erika Henningsen: And it's that's the thing that I have to constantly push back and be like, who for example, this new show that I'm doing, I'm a very supporting part. And I remember thinking, what are people gonna think if I go from that to this? And I have to sit down and be like, who the fuck cares? Like I'm working on something different with people I like who I respect at a cool place in New York City. And I have no idea what this new thing is gonna turn into, but it's just it's a step forward, not even towards success, it's just a step forward and away from something that was comfortable or safe.

[2:58] Erika Henningsen: But with failure, I think for me there was a lot of failure, and this is going to sound it's kind of like a paradox. There was a lot of failure in trying to be 100% right.

[3:14] Susan Blackwell: Say more about that.

[3:15] Erika Henningsen: I just and I think it all stems from this comment of this teacher of clearly there in somebody's eyes who was important to me, there was a right way to do things and a wrong way to do things. And whenever I decided what that was, I think it crafted in my head this idea that there's a way to nail creativity and be the best at it, whether it's in on stage, in a rehearsal room, in an audition. And if I had any moments of weakness or messiness or anything that didn't feel like I was in control of it, that to me was a failure.

[3:57] Erika Henningsen: It's very challenging when it comes to creativity. If you're always like that's that old Zen Cohen of like you need to hold the bird loose enough so you don't crush the bird and tight enough so it doesn't fly away. But if you're holding it tight all the time, remaining in control, remaining this is my word, not yours, but sort of perfect appearing. That's real hard on creativity.

[4:21] Susan Blackwell: Very hard.

[4:22] Erika Henningsen: Yeah. Like white knuckling.

[4:24] Susan Blackwell: That's right. We like to always say, however, you're doing it, you're doing it right. And I think that really stems from the knowledge of like everyone does it differently. And the more you learn that, you're like, what works for one person may not work for another person. And they're both right. Everybody's right. As long as you're creating and making shit and doing it right and not doing anything.

[4:47] Erika Henningsen: Right.

[4:48] Susan Blackwell: Right. And not hurting anybody.

[4:49] Erika Henningsen: Not hurting anyone.

[4:50] Susan Blackwell: Physically or emotionally.

[4:51] Erika Henningsen: You're doing it right.

[4:52] Susan Blackwell: Yeah. But how did that how specifically did that show up? And are we talking about like last week or when you were a high schooler? Like what are you thinking of when you talk about that?

[5:02] Erika Henningsen: I mean, I have a very specific instance in my head that relates, and I and I don't mean to keep relating it back to the show, but I feel like these two years have been a constant ebb and flow of learning and failing and succeeding, and or, you know, a constant rotation of those things.

[5:24] Susan Blackwell: Yeah.

[5:24] Erika Henningsen: But I we were in previews when we were out in DC, and I just broke, like I cracked. I just had to walk off stage and cry during the show. During rehearsal, you know, and there were people there, but I just thought I was like, I was pretending to have everything under control and just so did not. And was so confused and felt so like I'm letting if I can't get through this, I'm letting people down. And I had to walk backstage and our director, Casey came up and just said, like, you don't have to push yourself on us. You're here because you are exactly what we want, exactly what the story needs alone. You don't have to force yourself. No additional work.

[6:23] Erika Henningsen: Yeah, exactly. And he said that, and it was like immediately like the tears kept flowing, but like the pressure just dissipated because I just thought, if I'm not like really just motoring this in and getting it 100% right and at a 10 out of 10 out of 10 at all times, then it's not good enough. And it was like the process of unlearning that happened in the show by necessity because that's not sustainable for eight shows.

[6:52] Susan Blackwell: It's grindy, yeah.

[6:53] Erika Henningsen: Yeah, it's too grindy, and that was the first time I heard him say that. I don't think it sunk in until maybe nine months later, when the toll it was taking on my body was like something has to change. And it became less about, you know, being the person driving the car and ensuring that we were always in the right gear and just letting it ebb and flow. Just more ease.

[7:18] Erika Henningsen: Just more ease. And I think that I mean, I think that about creativity. I think I had so much more fun and discovered so much more about the character and about myself when I did that. I wish I had learned it sooner in the process, but I'm happy I learned it at all.

[7:38] Susan Blackwell: For sure. So, how do you think that learning?

[7:41] Erika Henningsen: Yes, that to me also feels like something, you know, that you might I might relearn and then unlearn and relearn. How do you feel like that has impacted your creativity?

[7:55] Erika Henningsen: I think I'm less afraid of judgment.

[7:59] Susan Blackwell: Um I want in terms of my teaching.

[8:01] Erika Henningsen: That external gaze.

[8:02] Susan Blackwell: The external gaze.

[8:04] Erika Henningsen: I think also when it comes to teaching, which does feel like a part of my creativity, I want students to be less afraid of judgment.

[8:12] Susan Blackwell: Yeah.

[8:14] Erika Henningsen: My God, yes. Because I think I used to teach in a very regimented way that helped kids understand the discipline required.

[8:21] Susan Blackwell: The discipline required.

[8:23] Erika Henningsen: Yeah. Yep. And I just thought, you know, you can learn, you can, there's a time for discipline. And I'm just seeing more and more. There's a time to like be soft and be forgiving and be messy. And to throw things up on the wall and just see if you like it. I think it's also I've just noticed that my trust in myself as opposed to, you know, I was that person. If I had an audition for something that existed already, I would go see it and I would think, well, I gotta copy exactly that. Because I'm a good student. I can take notes. So I would do that. And I just think I'd trust myself more now that whatever my interpretation is correct.

[9:10] Susan Blackwell: What you're saying also reminds me of this spark that we recently did. And I don't know when this will air, but it reminds me of the spark that we that I recently did about preparation.

[9:20] Erika Henningsen: Yes.

[9:21] Susan Blackwell: And I just talked about these performers, they were all performers, I think, that I really admired as opposed to other types of creatives who make it look effortless, but they really put a lot of work into it. But something that I uh what you're saying reminds me of a lesson that I try to remember on my good days, I do. Many days I don't, which is you do all of that hard work, you do all of that preparation, you have all of that discipline, and then when it's go time, you let it go and you let it fly. And that's the magic trick is the letting it go.

[10:01] Erika Henningsen: You gotta let it go.

[10:02] Susan Blackwell: But boy, is that uh that's a that's a trick.

[10:07] Erika Henningsen: Yeah. It's not always easy. And I do wonder if the only reason I learned it was because I stuck around long enough on this show to learn it. It became it became so comfortable. The prep was so in-depth that I could finally let it fly.

[10:22] Erika Henningsen: And I just put on your flannel in your backpack and rip.

[10:26] Susan Blackwell: Exactly.

[10:27] Erika Henningsen: And I just hope I can keep that sense of trust and ease in myself. And I I know I know what this is. So if I try it this way, it may not land or whatever that means, but it will be right because it will be real on something that is not so ingrained into my body.

[10:45] Susan Blackwell: Do you feel like you're able to apply these principles in the show that you're rehearsing now?

[10:50] Erika Henningsen: Yeah. I can feel yourself.

[10:52] Susan Blackwell: I it's interesting.

[10:54] Erika Henningsen: It's really I mean, we're on day four of rehearsal. I just think that's so uncanny that you're at like we're having this right here because we're making the time, you've got two jobs. I mean, it's kind of this is so rejuvenating because this is I mean, this is the stuff I love, and this is what um this is my favorite part of getting to be a performer is to communicate about creativity with people. My favorite part isn't really doing the work, it's talking about it.

[11:20] Susan Blackwell: We love to talk a lot.

[11:20] Erika Henningsen: It's just fascinating though, and I also I find rejuvenation from hearing about other people's processes. Um because when you're stuck so long doing the same thing, you forget there's other options. Um I'm finding it, I'm finding that shifting the gears is harder than I thought it was going to be.

[11:40] Erika Henningsen: Um shifting the gears to the new project or shifting the gears of preparation to letting go?

[11:48] Erika Henningsen: I think both. Of um, I will say there's a lot, and maybe it's just because I'm tired. I feel a lot less pressure to like be perfect in rehearsal anymore. Because I just think like it's just rehearsal. I mean I I'll get there. I'll get there in my own time. We'll figure it out. Uh, whereas, you know, I showed up for rehearsal for for me and girls, and it was like, I know every single note I'm gonna sing, I know exactly how I'm gonna sing it. I've thought it all through.

[12:21] Susan Blackwell: Absolutely. Do you feel fear about anything?

[12:24] Erika Henningsen: Oh my gosh, I'm afraid so much. What causes the scary feelings at this point in your career? Because I know that changes. That's a continuum. But I think for me, the thing that I'm most afraid of is I want to do this for a reason. And I want to do this for a purpose larger than the A list and the money and just constantly being working. And I worry that years might pass and I will have not done that. Like I I do think I am meant to be a performer, but even going from this show to the next, I've realized I'm excited. Um, it's not gonna be enough. You need the extra. You need the the other piece. Yes, the other piece. Those threads have to be woven and not lightly through they have to sort of shoot through everything that you do.

[13:30] Erika Henningsen: Everything I do. And the it also feels like it's up to you because whereas people will likely always be asking you to do interpretive work. Sure. Because of your skills and your talent, which is amazing. But less people are going to be asking, like, and we'd like you to be an activist, and we'd like you to add the you know, the book collection at the stage door, and we want you to register vote. They're not gonna ask for it. So you it's gonna be up to you to say, I'm here for it, I want to do it, make those opportunities happen, or make the connections to the people who are looking for exactly what that you can offer.

[14:12] Susan Blackwell: As you have done in the past, this is you're not reinvesting the wheel here. Sure. This is a beautiful opportunity for your creative self-expression and your activism to come through. And you can be wild. I think what you've done is wildly creative thus far. Amazing and amazing. I look forward to seeing more of the things you do.

[14:30] Erika Henningsen: As you're talking, it also strikes me. I feel like one of the cool things as we all sort of age and mature, God willing, that we get, you know, more time on the planet to like try things and fail at things and work things out and learn these finer distinctions about ourselves as people and as artists are bumping into things like uh Maida Wagner's work and saying, Oh, I've been read and I you've got me made up me. But the thing that's so cool about it, well, for I've said this many times, but when I first heard her speak, I was like, Oh, I thought it was so special and unique. Turns out um easily typed. But the thing that was so comforting to me about it is it was another piece of information, another fine distinction that I had in my arsenal, so that when opportunities either come to me externally, or um sparks of inspiration rise up from inside of me, it gives me a measuring stick against which to measure these opportunities and say, I almost like that opportunity, but I need to have a discussion with leadership about how we can bake in more activism.

[15:48] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[15:49] Erika Henningsen: Yeah, yes, or I like this opportunity. This is really crushing it on the A list front, but I'm also going to simultaneously, parallel to this project, I'm also going to be going door to door registering voters or um performing in that fundraiser for the ACLU or whatever that thing is.

[16:09] Susan Blackwell: 100%. I feel like those things, I I love all those distinctions because I'm just like, well, it's going to make it easier for me to make my next decision and to explain to people like, oh, I don't know, my representation why my heart doesn't beat faster when you tell me about that straight offer that I've just received.

[16:28] Erika Henningsen: Yes.

[16:29] Susan Blackwell: Do you know what I mean?

[16:29] Erika Henningsen: Yes.

[16:31] Susan Blackwell: One yes, 100%.

[16:32] Erika Henningsen: Yeah.

[16:32] Susan Blackwell: Yes. And it's knowing like that is the I'm learning to not be afraid of that. Whereas before I think I want to be a valued client.

[16:41] Erika Henningsen: Right.

[16:41] Susan Blackwell: I just want the job. I want the thing. I want I want the A list opportunity.

[16:45] Erika Henningsen: Exactly.

[16:45] Susan Blackwell: And now I'm realizing it will not, it can live, like you said just now. It can live in tandem with something else.

[16:52] Erika Henningsen: Yeah.

[16:53] Susan Blackwell: But I have to go out and create, continue to create those things. Because I really think back on like these last two and a half years, the happiest times were when it was living in tandem with activists that were with.

[17:08] Erika Henningsen: You're like, I don't feel so good. Your boyfriend's like, it's because the book drive the books and the books are gone. Our apartment was just filled with books. It was the happiest time. It was the best.

[17:19] Susan Blackwell: Our prescription for you is it kind of I feel like that thread of activism has to be shot through kind of so much. And I'm I'm looking ahead to this next phase that's going to be the double duty life for a little bit. And I'm like, okay, you you're not gonna be able to do it. And you need to for a moment.

[17:39] Erika Henningsen: For a moment.

[17:40] Susan Blackwell: Can I pull your toe?

[17:42] Erika Henningsen: I just pulled Erica's toe and she farted.

[17:44] Susan Blackwell: It was so weird.

[17:44] Erika Henningsen: So weird.

[17:45] Susan Blackwell: Or can I? There's no can't.

[17:47] Erika Henningsen: There's no can't. But in this time when you are double dutying and you this is a so you have we know you have a little slice of time when you can doodle on the subway.

[18:00] Susan Blackwell: Yeah.

[18:00] Erika Henningsen: That has been a hundred percent. Might that time be used to daydream and research about what the next book drive is going to be.

[18:10] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[18:11] Erika Henningsen: Or what the next voter registration drive is going to be. Hatching plans and harvesting sparks.

[18:18] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[18:19] Erika Henningsen: This is my hatching plan.

[18:20] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[18:21] Erika Henningsen: Jim's just saying last night. I'm sorry, I'm just like yakkity yak. And Cam was just saying last night something that I thought was so true, which is the creative life cycle is sort of like the life cycle of the phoenix. Uh it's sort of like sparks rise up, you fan them into flames, they come into maturation, you share the light with people, they conclude, the sparks die out, a fresh spark comes up.

[18:47] Susan Blackwell: And I you were saying that you feel like people, how did you say that?

[18:52] Erika Henningsen: Like nobody's really satisfied with where they are on the cycle at any time.

[18:52] Susan Blackwell: At any time.

[18:56] Erika Henningsen: Because we we've talked you were somewhere else on the cycle. You too, because people who are like in the process, they're like, oh my God, I just can't. I I want to be finished. I want the show to open. I want to finish my book, what have you? I want the show to close. You know, and then they get there, and it's like, oh, I don't know what my next project's gonna be.

[19:16] Susan Blackwell: Like now I don't like it.

[19:17] Erika Henningsen: Well, hang on, we haven't even celebrated that you got this project done. But you're already like, oh, but I'm envious of this person who's mid-process.

[19:27] Susan Blackwell: Like, like you just were mid-process. So it's just like, can we accept like where we are in the cycle in the cycle and also the thread.

[19:35] Erika Henningsen: So you're parallel, your parallel because right now you are in well, you're concluding the show. It's a very dynamic time for you. You're concluding you're starting a new project, and we also know it's been well established on this podcast that there needs to be the threat of activism that's running through.

[19:54] Susan Blackwell: But I do like the idea, and you have you have great capacity, so that we believe in you. I do like the idea of you in these little uh in-between moments, subway rides, drifting off to sleep, waking up in the morning over coffee, of harvesting some sparks and seeing what really excites you and what really moves you for that next thing.

[20:16] Erika Henningsen: It also makes me think of this quote, which I think we've talked about before, but I'm we're gonna talk about it again. It's from a book called The Movie Goer, and we just had someone on who would post it about it. Um, but it is uh essentially the gist of the quote, which I will get wrong, is is like to be onto something, you know, gives us life, and to not be on to something brings despair.

[20:41] Susan Blackwell: And believe that on to something.

[20:44] Erika Henningsen: So we have talked now for like three days straight about like, oh my god, before we got onto the spark file, we were both like, oh, what are we doing? What are we doing? And we want to apply ourselves to something, we want to be onto something, and it gives to me like new meaning to all the times that people have said, like they've read my work or something.

[21:06] Susan Blackwell: Like you're really on to something special here, and I'm like, on to something.

[21:11] Erika Henningsen: And the thing is, like you do have your A-list work lined up.

[21:15] Susan Blackwell: Sure, sure.

[21:15] Erika Henningsen: But you want to be onto something.

[21:18] Susan Blackwell: In terms of the activism.

[21:20] Erika Henningsen: Yes.

[21:20] Susan Blackwell: Which is such a distinction of the execution of something. Cause that can feel like, wait, but I I don't know how to execute that right now. But just having the spark to be onto something.

[21:32] Erika Henningsen: Looking for spark.

[21:33] Susan Blackwell: Gentle, gentle.

[21:34] Erika Henningsen: You're so busy.

[21:35] Susan Blackwell: Take it easy.

[21:36] Erika Henningsen: Yeah.

[21:37] Susan Blackwell: Just look for it.

[21:38] Erika Henningsen: Just look for it. Because I will say I am that person. And those two, you know, the things that happen during the show, other things have been those thoughts that I just run with immediately as fast as possible. And knowing that just to be a little gentle and let things see what writers surface.

[21:56] Susan Blackwell: Exactly.

[21:57] Erika Henningsen: Let it go.

[21:59] Susan Blackwell: I'm super excited. Is there anything creative that you know you need to do in your life before you're done?

[22:08] Erika Henningsen: Like beyond theater and what you're doing now. I do want to write um, I want to write something that for a while I thought it was going to be a book. And the more that I think about it, I just think I am too visual to not write something that is not seen or told in stories and pictures.

[22:32] Susan Blackwell: Yeah.

[22:32] Erika Henningsen: Um and it might even be a simple I have no desire to like, I need to create something that's a hit or that people love. Um but there's something that I have found um just from talking to my friends that I think the the people that I think I know really well, and then I learned something about them that completely shifts perception.

[22:56] Susan Blackwell: That is one of my favorite discoveries when you turn.

[23:00] Erika Henningsen: Yeah, that turn. Or where you start to um understand people that you had previously judged, or because I just think I think there's a lack of empathy right now in the world, and we're quick to judge and we're quick to assume.

[23:15] Susan Blackwell: Yeah.

[23:16] Erika Henningsen: Um, and I would love to. There's actually I love the German language a lot. There's this incredible German short film called Schwarzfarr, which is in black and white. Look it up, which translates to black rider, which is a term of somebody who like doesn't pay for their subway ticket or something.

[23:35] Erika Henningsen: Look at this film. But I just remember watching it when I was a German student, and I just thought that it was short, it was five minutes, and it's one of those things that just shifts your perception so immediately and so simply, very quietly done. And I just thought I would love to create like a series of vignettes like that, where we all think we know this person in front of us. Yes, and then we the rug is pulled out from under us. Um that's like my favorite moment. I love that. What a great incredible just a tiny side tangent. I have a favorite favorite moment. I have a favorite moment, which is I am fascinated by the moment where people go from just being like two distinct people to being two distinct people who are kissing each other.

Like when the you break through the film of just being like what the first time people turn into each other and kiss each other. I'm fascinated by that space. Like, because I freaking love like that space, like right before they kiss. I mean that. Yes, I mean that into the kiss. Mm-mm. Because I Hunter Bell calls it breaking the pudding film, where it's sort of like we were separated by this like sort of invisible thing. And then it's just like I reach through and I'm in your jello pudding. Wow. I know. Anyway, that's a table. Wait, you need to do that. Maybe just one thing about made a career of going around and putting my mouth on people. I'm doing better now. We live in a new time. We live in a new time.

You need to ask consent before you make someone's change. Consent, Erica. Consent before I pull your toe and make you fart. She did it. She won't you did the mic. I love this. I love this idea of you're fascinated by the moment that is the pivot where we perceived something, but there's a turn that happens and new information. New information. But then I was like, graphic novel, choreography, short films. A series of short films, a series of but who knows? And who it doesn't matter. No. Not right now. Yes. Those thoughts, those examples of the turn. And when they proceed. Can we give you the lightest homework assignment? And we'll never know if you did it. As you move through the world, if you see examples in real life, if you see, or I guess in in other mediums, if you see examples of that turn that you love, start writing them down.

I know collect. Collect. Yes. Yes. I feel like that's how I mean that's your spark file, isn't it? Where you just start collecting. There you we're getting you to make a spark like just collecting those little those little moments that's it that's right um that's it I love that yeah I know give me my own that's the thing it's like she loves getting homework but I gotta create my own homework in just for this conversation but now you're like wait I somehow I left with a list of things I'm ready for it I'm so excited.

[26:29] Erika Henningsen: You know you do so much you work so hard you may have already said the answer to it but maybe you'll say it again a different way what's it all for I think it's for growth I think that's kind of the only reason I do anything um I think not just growth for myself but I think the more that you are collaborating with humans being pushed into uncomfortable situations uh telling a story not telling a story incubating and thinking on things for me I just think I don't know if success has been something that I think success for a long time was what I thought the goal was and I just think you'll never have enough of that or there's a cap to it. Yeah and I just think as long as you are seeking to grow in some way and move forward.

I feel like that's the only goal that is sustainable for your whole life. And I didn't, and I'm learning that the way you grow is many times in ways that people will not see or pay you for. Um I just think that, like I'm realizing that is kind of to live creatively or just to live in a fulfilled way. I don't even think happiness is the goal, but I think being at peace with where you are on that Phoenix cycle, like what phase of growth are you in? I think that's I think that's what it's for. And if you're if you feel like you're growing a little bit every day or just changing or challenging yourself, I think to me, that's what it's all for. I think that's the only reason we're here.

[28:55] Susan Blackwell: I love it. And it is one of those good goals that it's like it's like heading east. You can always head more east. Yes, you can always grow more. I love that. And it is another thing on your list of um, you know, the measurement for my next job, my next project. Yes. Does it have the activism piece? Does it provide an opportunity for growth for me? Right. Yes. You know, right. You're so smart. You're so smart. It's so true. And if it doesn't, how do I thread that in? That's right. Because is the reason. Yeah. Oh wow. I think that's what it's all for. That's a pretty good one. That's pretty good. Now, can you tell us what or who is sparking you these days? Um what's got you lit up?

[29:40] Erika Henningsen: My book club. We've got a book club. Awesome. Erica's got a book club. I love it so much. Um, I love it so much. You do love books. What are you reading? Um, we've read our next book club meeting is February 10th. We read. Everything's invited. Come on in my house. We read that book on the shelf, The Female Persuasion by Meg Woolitzer. And before that, we read Three Women. And then before that, we read what was our second book. Oh, somebody chose The Stranger. Camus. Uh-huh. Interesting. And then we read what was our very first book. Maybe our first book was Three Women. This is our next book is going to be, well, the one I want to suggest is these are also the women who are inspiring me. Jody Cantor and Megan Twee, who are the New York Times reporters.

Yeah. I think that honestly, when I think of something I've been excited by, that might be the next spark. That's a great spark. Yeah. But I love my book club so much. I just love communities outside of the communities that you are hired to be in.

[31:00] Susan Blackwell: How did you find your book club?

[31:01] Erika Henningsen: I started it. I was reading three women at the time, and I told my boyfriend that he should read it because I was like, you need to learn about this book. I just think it explains. It doesn't explain it actually doesn't explain anything. It just gives you three very honest accounts of like female sexuality. So he read it and he said, you know, I would never have picked this up, but I'm so happy you made me read it. And I just thought, okay, great. So let's just do that. We each invited three people. Um, and then a couple people went away, and they were able to, a couple people like had to go out of town for jobs. And I said, okay, great. Fill your spot with somebody else. So it kind of changes every time we have like a few core who are just in New York.

Um but they have to have read the book. But they have to read the book. And what we do is everybody puts in a book suggestion at the end of the night. We pull one out. That's the one we read. And then for the remaining slips, everybody pulls out another one. So you walk away with a suggestion of a book to read in. Do you mean once a month? Or we averaged once a month. Right. But it's really I I mean, I love that. I love just I love talking to people. Um bringing people together. Yeah. And I will say, I think uh, I mean, this book that we just read was fiction, but I I've loved reading nonfiction with the group because I think, especially when it's things that are about sort of today's uh what's in the news um on any scale.

I just think it gets so easy to be in like an echo chamber. Oh my gosh. Um or or to not even realize that, you know, somebody I feel super close to has a different opinion of this thing that I thought we both felt equally passionate passionate about in the same way. Yeah. Um for me, it provides this the safe space to sort of talk about those things. Yeah. Um to open your head to other perceptions.

[32:57] Susan Blackwell: Man, I love the book club. Do you want to do you want to come to the book club?

[33:01] Erika Henningsen: Oh my god, yes, actually.

[33:03] Susan Blackwell: Oh, thank you so much.

[33:06] Erika Henningsen: Oh my gosh, we just I know, sadly.

[33:10] Susan Blackwell: This was so full. You are honestly, I'm not kidding. I feel like these topics we could I could talk to you for like 10 more hours about it. Um let's just turn the mics off and keep going.

[33:19] Erika Henningsen: Okay, okay. And I want to read these books because I have not read through them.

[33:24] Susan Blackwell: Oh, I guess that's it. It is. We hope that this put out another bunch of sparks in your file. Listen, if there's a spark you'd like us to explore, or if you've taken a spark and you fanned it into a creative flame and you'd like to share that, won't you email us at thesparkfile at gmail.com or submit it through our website, thesparkfile.com. We will even take your feedback, but you know the price of admission. First, you have to share a creative risk that you have taken recently. And be sure to subscribe to this podcast wherever you get your podcast. Subscribe. Rate, five star review it. If you like this podcast, it really helps if you share it with people that you love. If you didn't like it, I don't know, Erica. What do you say to your critics?

[34:04] Erika Henningsen: If they didn't like it, go find something you do like. Don't waste time doing something you don't.

[34:11] Susan Blackwell: There you go. There you go. If something tickles your fancy and gets your creative juices flowing, we are writing you a forever permission slip to make that thing that has been knocking at your door. It's your turn to take a spark and fan it into a flame. You got a fountain penetrat. You got a comedian. You gotta choose what moves your heart. Then Erica Henning sent it. You gotta take it and make it.

[34:44] ♪ Musical number: "Spark" — performed by Erika Henningsen ♪

[35:08] Let's open up the spark file.