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[0:30] Laura Camien: Welcome to The Spark File, where we believe that everyone is creative, but creative people don't go it alone.

[0:43] Susan Blackwell: I'm Susan Blackwell, and we are creativity coaches who help people clarify and accomplish their creative goals.

[0:51] Laura Camien: Know that just by listening to this podcast, you are joining a warm and wonderful clan of creatives.

[0:57] Susan Blackwell: Behold the phone. You may be asking yourself, what exactly is a Spark File?

[1:02] Laura Camien: Well, a Spark File is a place where you consistently collect all of your inspirations and all of your fascinations. In every episode, we are going to reach into our Spark Files and exchange some sparks.

[1:15] Susan Blackwell: From time to time, we're going to talk to some folks who spark us too. And your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to take some of those sparks of inspiration and make something of your own.

[1:25] Laura Camien: So without further ado, let's open up The Spark File.

[1:30] Susan Blackwell: I'm Susan Blackwell. I'm still basking in the glow of podcasting again, and I love it so much.

[1:38] Laura Camien: Podcasting. We're getting to sit and talk and chit chat and expand our minds a little bit.

[1:46] Susan Blackwell: Get sparked.

[1:47] Laura Camien: Yes. Let's expand our minds. And I'm going to pull you right into it. We hosted the capstone event for our Illume cohort, our 23-24 Illume cohort here in New York City.

[2:02] Susan Blackwell: And it was so beautiful. Those Illumineers, we thought about calling them Illuminatis, but like Laura Camien said, already taken. So those Illumineers went up on that stage and one by one, they just knocked it out of the motherfucking park.

[2:20] Laura Camien: They shared their work. They asked for what they were looking for in terms of collaborators, co-conspirators. And it was really bold.

[2:28] Susan Blackwell: And I was speaking with one of our clients, Hannah Marie Marcus, and she was saying what a marvel it is to see people doing that.

[2:42] Laura Camien: Absolutely.

[2:43] Susan Blackwell: The courage, the bravery. They are truly living.

[2:47] Laura Camien: Yes. They are living. So my spark today is all about shining your light. And there was a song that you might have learned, Laura Camien, when you were a little, little. Maybe you were in a church basement. I don't know. But do you know this song?

[3:05] Laura Camien: Church camp.

[3:06] Susan Blackwell: Church camp. This little light of mine.

[3:08] Laura Camien: Oh, yes, I do.

[3:09] Susan Blackwell: I'm going to let it shine. This little light of mine. I'm going to let it shine.

[3:15] Laura Camien: Don't put on rubble.

[3:16] Susan Blackwell: That's good. You know the rest of the song. So according to Wikipedia, this little light of mine is an African-American song from the 1920s, though the origins and authorship of this song are not 100% clear, which I thought was very interesting.

[3:30] Laura Camien: Yeah.

[3:32] Susan Blackwell: There's a lot of speculation about who actually wrote the song. It wasn't that long ago, but not clear. So maybe in the public domain, in case you want to cover it. It has been published with a set of hand movements to be used for the instruction of children.

[3:48] Laura Camien: As I was singing that, you were like, hey, my thumb is wiggling, and then I'm putting my other hand over it.

[3:54] Susan Blackwell: That's probably why. It has also been adapted as a freedom song that helped steady civil rights protesters' nerves as abusive police officers threatened to beat them or worse.

[4:09] Laura Camien: Mm-hmm.

[4:11] Susan Blackwell: It's been sung in Sunday schools. It's been sung in prison yards. It has been recorded by the folk singer Hoyt Axton and the British rappers LZ7. And Meghan Markle and Prince Harry chose to end their wedding in May of 2018 with a version of the iconic song sung by a gospel choir.

[4:29] Laura Camien: I did not realize that.

[4:33] Susan Blackwell: My voice just went up like 14 octaves, but I didn't realize that. As she was getting into the carriage, as they were departing the ceremony, there was a big gospel choir singing This Little Light of Mine.

[4:44] Laura Camien: I remember the choir, and I thought it was beautiful, but I had totally forgotten it was that song.

[4:50] Susan Blackwell: It is that song. That song.

[4:52] Laura Camien: Yeah.

[4:53] Susan Blackwell: So why am I sparked by this song and the concept of shining your light? Let's back it up. So in The Spark File, we talk a lot about the spark cycle of creativity. In case you've not heard us talk about it, after years of various creative projects in a variety of configurations and collaborations, it seems to us that every creative idea that reaches maturity flows through this cycle.

[5:21] Laura Camien: Mm-hmm.

[5:21] Susan Blackwell: You've got generating sparks, you've got fanning your creative flames, and you've got shining your creative light. Now it may not always be in that order, but I want to talk you through it chronologically in its most basic form, starting with generating sparks.

[5:37] Laura Camien: Sure.

[5:41] Susan Blackwell: Listening to this podcast, you are in the spark generation phase. When you are in this part of the creative process, you are consciously generating ideas, you are listening, you are actively seeking, you are leaning into things that fascinate you. So that is generating sparks.

[5:53] Laura Camien: Yes.

[5:53] Susan Blackwell: Next up, we have fanning those creative flames. In this part of the creative process, this is, as Larry the Cable Guy would say about getting her done, this is where the real making occurs. You are doing the work. And being able to fan those flames is how you realize the idea and make it a reality.

[6:13] Laura Camien: Yes.

[6:13] Susan Blackwell: And finally, we have the part of the creative process that we call shining the light. This is about sharing out, and it may be sharing your idea that you want to make, or literally it could be sharing what you've already made. It's about how and when you talk about your work. It's about how you generate excitement about your work. And sometimes it's actually about sharing that work.

[6:39] Laura Camien: Yes.

[6:39] Susan Blackwell: So that's the spark cycle of creativity in a nutshell, generating sparks, fanning those flames and shining that light. Laura, is there anything you would add to that?

[6:49] Laura Camien: Just that, you know, the more we work with that, the more I really truly believe in it. I think about like the blaze of it all, the fanning the flames and how challenging it can be to simply, like imagine tending a fire overnight. That's your job. And a million things can make it go out. And it is your job to keep that idea alive.

[7:14] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[7:14] Laura Camien: And then the shining of the light, how many people we know stop right before this phase, because the idea of it is terrifying for a lot of people.

[7:26] Susan Blackwell: You've read my mind, Laura Camien.

[7:28] Laura Camien: Oh, baby. Tell me about it.

[7:30] Susan Blackwell: We are creatives and we have worked with so many creatives. And it has been our observation that shining the light is one of the toughest, riskiest parts of the creative process. So many people want to hide their creative light under that bushel basket.

[7:44] Laura Camien: Yes.

[7:45] Susan Blackwell: Or they want someone else to come along. They want that knight in shining armor that's going to come along and shine their light for them.

[7:52] Laura Camien: Yes.

[7:53] Susan Blackwell: So that they don't have to. And please, God, can anybody market this or promote this besides me?

[7:59] Laura Camien: Yes.

[8:00] Susan Blackwell: Yes. So for my spark today, I want to share some of the common reasons why people struggle with shining their light and also share a few ways we might process through those blocks and impediments. Hear for this, Susan.

[8:13] Laura Camien: So here are some of the reasons people don't want to shine that light. And as I share these, Laura and listeners, I just want you to gut check yourself and see if any of these speak to you, if any of these are your go-tos. So here we go.

[8:28] Susan Blackwell: Fear of judgment. People may be afraid of being criticized or laughed at. And sometimes this is born. People have good evidence for this. It is born out of prior experience or observations. I think about sweet Matt Vogel, who plays Kermit the Frog, being booed at his talent show when he did a puppet show and how that put him off puppets for decades.

[8:52] Laura Camien: Yeah.

[8:54] Susan Blackwell: Thank goodness he worked through it. Fear of judgment.

[8:56] Laura Camien: Absolutely.

[8:57] Susan Blackwell: Fear of rejection. People may be afraid of being ostracized or shunned, and this is an evolutionary behavior. People may have evolved to avoid speaking out in ways that could lead to exclusion or ridicule, which leads me to my next one, mortal fear. In modern times, in certain parts of the world, creatives fear for their personal safety, depending on what they want to express.

[9:25] Laura Camien: Mm-hmm.

[9:26] Susan Blackwell: Yes. Fear of failure. People may be afraid of not getting the desired outcome. This one was interesting to me because I don't think I have this, but I can imagine people who do.

[9:38] Laura Camien: Yes.

[9:42] Susan Blackwell: Fear of being one-upped or bested. People may feel competitive when sharing their creative work, and they're afraid of being bested by someone else, that they're not going to be the best at the thing. I thought that was interesting. It's not me, but I thought it was interesting.

[9:56] Laura Camien: Yeah.

[9:57] Susan Blackwell: People may worry that if they share their work, their brilliant ideas may be stolen.

[10:03] Laura Camien: Oh, that's a classic.

[10:04] Susan Blackwell: Classic. It's a classic. Yeah. I got that.

[10:08] Laura Camien: Hiding it under the bush.

[10:09] Susan Blackwell: Yeah. That way nobody can get it.

[10:12] Laura Camien: That's right. You will always have a top-secret, fantastic idea that stays with you to the grave.

[10:18] Susan Blackwell: Yeah. People may lack confidence in their ideas or their abilities, and they're afraid that their work isn't good enough. People fear hurting others. They may be afraid that sharing their work will hurt others, themselves, their audience.

[10:34] Laura Camien: I've heard this.

[10:35] Susan Blackwell: This is interesting, and I've heard it more and more in recent years. People are afraid that by sharing their work, they are taking up space and or opportunities that might be best used by others.

[10:49] Laura Camien: That's interesting and complex.

[10:51] Susan Blackwell: Yeah. Yes, it is. Yes, it is. Sometimes people fear that their work, that it's not just that they aren't ready, but that their work is not ready, so that it's sort of like, yeah.

[11:04] Laura Camien: Mm-hmm.

[11:06] Susan Blackwell: We can live there for a long time. We can live in a lot of these places for a long time, and I'm curious, Laura Camien, I know that you are a very forward-footed creative, but even with that, are any of these go-tos for you, or do you want to add to the list?

[11:22] Laura Camien: I think one that I've gotten over more, it's not that it's not there, but in recent years, I've gotten over it a little bit more, but I think that first one, the fear of other people's opinions, I was stopped by not strangers' opinions, but people close to me, who I now can see had their own fears of what if they shared their work, and so it was a little bit of like, you're going to put that out there? You're going to do that? You're going to share that?

[12:01] Susan Blackwell: Yes.

[12:02] Laura Camien: And I was like, it caused me to sort of crawl inside myself and be like, should I not? Maybe I shouldn't? Maybe I should keep this to myself? But now I see what was at play, but yeah, that was big.

[12:10] Susan Blackwell: Does it ever get you?

[12:11] Laura Camien: Or are you like, I'm good?

[12:13] Susan Blackwell: I think I'm doing pretty good with it now, but can I say, Suze, there was one, was it shame? Was there like number around three or four? Was there one that was about shame?

[12:22] Laura Camien: Oh no, it was about rejection.

[12:24] Susan Blackwell: Yeah, fear of rejection. Can I tell you a quick story?

[12:28] Laura Camien: Yes.

[12:29] Susan Blackwell: I'm going to make it quick, I promise you, but you mentioned the Allume Showcase and all of our clients did an incredible job shining their light, but you and I were like, oh yeah, don't forget, we need to shine our light as well. We are hosting this event and we need to tee it all up for everybody.

[12:48] Laura Camien: Yes.

[13:09] Laura Kamien: It was so vivid. It was so shame-filled. It had to do with rejection. And I woke up in a start and my body was flooded with the actual feelings like of rejection. Wow. And I thought, oh my God, what is, like I felt, I was, I laid in bed for a minute just like, ugh, I feel horrible. And then I recognized it. I was like, oh, I know what this is. This is that part of my brain that is saying, what are you doing? You may get rejected. You're about to put yourself out there. Have you forgotten what rejection feels like? It feels like this and it feels pretty crappy and maybe you should pull back. We're trying to keep you safe. And Susan, like a flash, my feet hit the floor and I pattered out to the living room and I was like, Wes, you won't believe what just happened.

And I told him about the dream and I was like, I was able to recognize in that moment that my brain was trying to protect me. Yeah. But it reminded me of those feelings of rejection and the fears of rejection. So thank you for letting me take that little, but yeah, they're still there. I love how as you, I hope the same for myself and for all the listeners, as you have developed as a human and as a creative, that you can recognize that so much more quickly and just dispatch it. That you're like, I know you. I was thrilled with how quickly that happened. That is a new neural pathway. It felt that way. It actually felt that way. That was like, here, a totally new door that I went through in 30 seconds flat and yes, I hope that for all of our listeners and all of our clients as well.

I just want to share a few tools to process through some of, in case any of y'all related to any of the things on that list, here's a few ideas around the shining of the light. And I, just a quick caveat, I want to remind you that you don't have to share any of your creativity with anyone ever. Whether or not you share is entirely and completely up to you. But since you're listening to this podcast, I'm going to take a guess that there is at least a small part, if not a large part of you, that would very much like to share your work. So let's talk about how we can navigate all these things that can stop us from freely shining our light. Suze, I have to ask you before you tell us these things, do any of those resonate for you?

[15:55] Susan Blackwell: Oh my God, Laura, yes. Yes. Short answer, yes. Short answer is yes. And it depends, sometimes it's situational. For instance, I've written, because I write so much for my own life, I've written things that I'm like, oh my God, I hope that this doesn't completely nuke my relationship with my parents. I hope that, you know, things like that. Yeah, for sure. That makes sense, or hurt someone. Yep. Yeah. Okay, great. Just wanted to. All the greatest hits, the answer is yes. So when planning a party, we ask who, what, when, where, and why, right? When you're making the invitation, you're like, who's this for? That's also good journalism. You know, those are the five questions of journalism 101. Well, in addition to party planning and journalism, when preparing to share our creativity, we might do well to ask why, what, when, who, and how.

So first up, when you prepare to share the light, you should understand why you are sharing your work. There are no bad answers here, by the way. All reasons are valid. We just want you to begin thinking about your own desires, your motivation, and your purpose. So for instance, I'm very clear that my purpose in life and in my creative work is to free myself and anyone who wants to come along for the ride. I'm all about it. And almost everything that I do in this lifetime is about that too. And that clarity really helps me get past some of those fears.

[17:31] Laura Kamien: Yeah, yeah. Next up, ask yourself about what you want to share. Again, you don't have to share everything with everyone. You don't have to share your entire spark file and every thought and every insecurity you have. If something feels too private, too new, too raw, you are entirely empowered to keep some of those things for yourself or for yourself and your inner circle, right? So ask yourself about what you are sharing.

[18:02] Susan Blackwell: That's right. Did you want to say something?

[18:04] Laura Kamien: No, I think you're coming to it because it's a big one. I think it might be next. The next consideration is when do you share? It might be a good time to share if your instincts tell you that you're onto something, even if it isn't complete yet, or if you have enough confidence in it that you're certain that no feedback is going to deter you from continuing on. If so.

[18:30] Susan Blackwell: Oh, that's a big one. What were you gonna say?

[18:30] Laura Kamien: Well, just that, like if you feel strong enough, like if you imagine, again, to go back to the flame metaphor, if you feel like your flame is strong enough that a gust of wind is not gonna take it out, that's a good question to ask yourself before you go putting it in front of someone else whose exhale might knock you out of the game.

[18:53] Susan Blackwell: Yes, but you have teed me up perfectly, Laura, because if you have that confidence that you are ready to share, you might wanna think about who you are sharing it with.

[19:07] Laura Kamien: Yes. Yes. Things can get really dicey. When we look for, when we consider professional feedback from people who are not qualified to give it, they don't know how to talk about work in a way that empowers artists. And things can get dicey when we seek feedback from other industry professionals who have their own agendas for the project. Now, Laura just said something when she was talking about which fears are go-tos for you, and you said that there have been times when you have gotten, you know, blown off course by people, and later you realized that you were like, oh, it's because they had either an agenda or their own fears.

[19:56] Susan Blackwell: That's right. Yeah. Their own insecurities. Like you have to recognize when something is yours and something is not yours, and be able to say like, oh, I hear what you're saying. That sounds like a weighted blanket you are lying underneath, but I don't have to put it on. I don't have to borrow your fears or your agenda. Our goal is always for ourselves and for you to seek the right kind of feedback from the right people at the right time. That is, I know that sounds tricky, but it is completely doable. It really, really is.

[20:39] Laura Kamien: It really is, yeah. Finally, how do we share that work? Ultimately, getting useful feedback comes down to your ability to be clear about what you need and asking for it, rather than the general, hey, everybody, what did you think? Oh, setting clear parameters for the feedback you're looking for, stating them from the outset. For example, if you said, I'm working on the character arc for my lead in the script. Can you keep an eye on that as you read it and let me know if it had emotional impact for you? Or even something like, I've lost sight of my enthusiasm for this project. Can you just remind me what's wonderful about it?

[21:24] Susan Blackwell: Yes, yes. So just being specific about what your needs are.

[21:30] Laura Kamien: Absolutely. And I think we're trained as people pleasers to sort of prove our, I can take any feedback, whatever you got. It is actually working against your best interest to do that. It is very empowering to say, here's what I'm looking for. Here's what I actually need right now. Later, I'll ask your thoughts on this, that, and the other thing, but that's not this moment. It's so empowering. We really do. We want you to share your light. We want you to seek out feedback. To Laura's point, we just want to empower you in that process, and we want you to be as deliberate, intentional, and thoughtful about it as possible. Even if you are super clear on all these aspects of shining your light, it can still be incredibly vulnerable.

So be gentle with yourself. Trust your intuition. Know that you will still feel some fear, and that is normal. And on this podcast, we have learned from our conversations with prolific and uber-successful makers, the fear never goes away. We only get better at managing it and moving forward anyway.

[23:01] Laura Kamien: Yes. Eventually, your creative confidence is going to grow strong. By mastering your favorite navigational techniques, you will begin to fear less, and although you still feel vulnerable, you are going to be empowered to create more and to learn to follow your own North Star when creating. Building up that confidence is going to require bravery and courage. Nelson Mandela said, courage is not the absence of fear, but the triumph over it. Or if John Wayne is more your cup of tea, courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway. Or if music is more your jam, remember those civil rights protesters and freedom singers steadying their nerves with this little line of mine. I'm gonna let it shine.

[23:40] Laura Kamien: That's right, Laura Kamian. Don't put it under a bushel basket. You gotta let it shine. That's it.

[23:46] Susan Blackwell: Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I love this spark, Susan Blackwell. I love this spark. This is so, so key for people to remember. Like, these are skills you can learn. These are muscles you can build like any other muscle. And you can learn to trust yourself that you can tolerate whether what comes at you is criticism or what comes at you feels like rejection. You can tolerate it. You're going to survive.

[24:21] Laura Kamien: Yeah. You are a strong creative conduit. And it's all tolerable.

[24:24] Susan Blackwell: Oh, thanks, Laura Kamian. Thank you, Susan. I guess that's it. This episode of the Spark File podcast was made on the lands of the Lenape and the Mohican people and as always, we hope this put another bunch of sparks in your file. Listen, if there is a spark you'd like us to explore or if you'd like to learn more about how to coach with us to accomplish your creative goals, email us at getcreativeatthesparkfile.com or you can reach us through our website, thesparkfile.com. We will even happily take your feedback but you know the price of admission. First, you need to share a creative risk that you've taken recently. You can follow us on social at The Spark File and be sure to subscribe, rate, and five-star review this very podcast.

Believe us when we tell you it really helps other listeners to find us. Also, if you like this podcast, we hope you'll share it with people that you love and if you didn't like it, take that opinion, put a bushel basket over it. Why don't ya? If something lights you up and gets your creative sparks flying, we are writing you a forever permission slip to make that thing that's been knocking at your door. It's your turn to take that spark and fan it into a flame. You know, you gotta take it and make it.

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