This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Alan Seales: Welcome to the Theatre Podcast, intimate personal conversations with theatre's biggest names. I'm your host, Alan Seales, and this episode is with Carolee Carmello, who you probably know from just tons of things. She's one of the biggest names on Broadway these days and one of the nicest people I've ever had the pleasure of chatting with. She got her college degree in business and French. Yes, an oddly specific combination. And then after finding the type of people who really got her excited personally, after doing community theatre for fun, she decided to give this a shot professionally, and we are all so glad that she did. Recently, of course, she was off-Broadway in Sweeney Todd and in the national tour of Hello Dolly, and now she's part of this video-on-demand production called Estella Scrooge, where everybody filmed in front of a green screen, no two actors filmed together.

It's an amazing use of technology when we are forced to adapt, and I just hope that this trend continues. If you want to watch the trailer, there's a link in the show notes, and of course, visit estellascrooge.com to check out the full movie. Please find me online on Instagram and Twitter at theatre underscore podcast. Leave me a comment. Let me know you're listening. Leave a rating. Leave a review. Share with your friends. And now, everybody, please enjoy this episode with Carolee Carmelo. Here you go. One, two, three.

[1:30] Alan Seales: Today's guest is a three-time Tony Award nominee with 14 Broadway shows on her resume, including the original casts of Falsettos, Parade, Lestat, The Addams Family, and Tuck Everlasting. In the last several years, she's received rave reviews in the off-Broadway revival of Sweeney Todd, as well as the national tour of Hello Dolly, and can now be seen in a fun new take on your favorite Dickens classic called Estella Scrooge, A Christmas Carol with a Twist. Carolee Carmelo, welcome to the Theatre Podcast.

[2:02] Carolee Carmelo: Thank you so much, Alan.

[2:04] Alan Seales: I can see you're in some sort of living room with a Christmas tree behind you. Where are you coming to me from right now?

[2:10] Carolee Carmelo: I'm in my house in New Jersey. And yeah, I put up my tree the day after Thanksgiving because I just needed, you know, a task. I needed something to do.

[2:21] Alan Seales: My mother put up her tree the day before Thanksgiving.

[2:27] Carolee Carmelo: Okay. Sure. Whatever gets you through.

[2:30] Alan Seales: Well, yeah. And I think it was sort of the boredom, too. We were actually talking a second ago before we started recording that sort of this looming unemployment weight has been just sitting around, which is ironic because we're talking today because of a job that, you know, of course, Estella Scrooge, your latest project. But overall, the theater in person has been, you know, shut down for what? Coming up on nine months now.

[2:57] Carolee Carmelo: Right. March 12th, it was for a lot of us when the axe came down. Yeah.

[3:05] Alan Seales: Right. And were you was Hello, Dolly! done at that point or were you still going?

[3:08] Carolee Carmelo: No, we were in Buffalo. We were supposed to do a show that night and we had a company meeting. You know, you always hate to get that call. There's a company meeting at five o'clock. And, you know, we had heard rumors about things starting to close. And honestly, I thought they were going to say at the end of this week, we're going to, you know, pack up and go home. But they said, we're not doing a show tonight. The governor has just announced that we you know, we can't have gatherings this large. And so get your stuff out of your dressing room and get out. And it was really sad. I mean, I'm laughing about it now, but it was, you know, we were all crying and we wanted to have like a last show to say goodbye to each other.

And we had been having so much fun on the Dolly tour. And it was really disappointing. So I feel for all those people who were doing Broadway shows or off Broadway or regional shows all around the country who suddenly, you know, got the phone call or the notice that it was over. And it's it's really hard to kind of wrap your head around the fact that it may not come back until, I don't know, next summer, maybe. If that, I mean, they still need to open it and then tourism needs to come back. And for that, you need restaurants and hotels to be safe and flights to be safe. And it's, you know, flights themselves. I'm on a tangent here, but flights like the air circulation of an airplane is very clean for the most part. It's that it's getting from the front of the airport to the plane. And it's all that risk of contamination. This is where a lot of people apparently are getting contaminated. So I'm reading, but.

[4:53] Carolee Carmelo: Yeah, they say the airport is actually worse than the plane, right? Did you come home from Buffalo by plane then? Or were you were you driving home?

[4:58] Alan Seales: They rented me a car and it was about a five hour drive. But I, you know, put all my stuff in the car and drove back. It was, you know, I mean, I probably could have flown at that point. They weren't restricting flights yet, but it just seemed like the simpler, safer way to go.

[5:17] Carolee Carmelo: Right, right. Well, the production, I guess, I mean, who knows at this point what's going to come back and what isn't. And I feel bad for people like the girls from Six who were supposed to open that night that didn't get, they haven't had their Broadway opening yet. So a lot of them are going to make their Broadway debuts.

[5:34] Alan Seales: Yeah. So they haven't gotten that yet. They missed the Tony cutoff and there's the whole, I mean, actually, what do you think about the Tonys having happened just between you and me? Let's start. We'll turn off the camera now.

[5:48] Carolee Carmelo: Here we go. All right. I have to say I'm not as I'm not as up on all the decisions that were made. So I'm not sure I can comment, but I guess, you know, you hate to leave a whole season out. There were some great performances last year and great, you know, writing and all that stuff. So I mean, I guess the alternative would be to glop everybody from this year on to next year and combine it somehow. I don't know. I'm sure greater minds than mine have figured this out.

[6:22] Alan Seales: Yeah, I'm not sure. I'm not sure there will be a 2021 season because if we're not even opening until May or June at the earliest, and that was past what the normal cutoff would have been anyway. So in my opinion, I think, you know, like Aaron Tveit well-deserved nomination for for for Moulin Rouge. But but then, like in the back of my mind, is there there's always that asterisk, right? Of, you know, I mean, you've been nominated for three Tonys if you got your nomination now for this season for something, but you were the only one in your category just because of a pandemic. Would that feel like how would you feel about that?

[7:06] Carolee Carmelo: Grateful. I mean, you know, I understand what you're saying, like, it's like the baseball stats that have the asterisk because they, you know, were subsequently found to be using drugs. But, you know, this is through no fault of their own. It's not like we're cheating. And there have been times in the past when actors or or shows have been the only nominee in a category. So it's not unheard of. I know what you're saying, but I think anytime you're nominated for anything, you feel grateful.

[7:52] Alan Seales: Well, going back going back then to your to your nominations, do you? Well, okay, I want to back up again, because you grew up in 1962.

[8:05] Carolee Carmelo: Well, I want I wanted to actually sort of do that sort of go back because you you were grew up in Albany.

[8:09] Alan Seales: I did. And attended University of Albany, and you got your bachelor's degree in business and French.

[8:16] Carolee Carmelo: True. Two things that normally have nothing to do with musical theater.

[8:22] Alan Seales: In fact, you're right. Yes. So the way you do is eventually I and Scarlett Pimpernel. So maybe that counts for something. And you executive produced both of house business and French. And then were you in college or in high school? Or where did you first say, like, I'm just gonna sing, I'm gonna try to act, where did the performance side of your life come in? And why not pursue that in the first place?

[8:53] Carolee Carmelo: Um, I didn't pursue it in the first place, because I was really sure that I wanted to pursue a business career. I mean, the French I studied just because I enjoyed it. I don't think I ever really thought I was going to have a career that involved French. But I just loved the language and I wanted to keep it up. But I really imagined myself, I can remember my freshman orientation in college, and they sort of went around the group and said, What do you think you'll be doing in 10 years or whatever? And I was like, Sure, I was gonna be a personnel manager at IBM. That was my thing. I just knew it. And I really thought I'd be good at it. And I thought I would enjoy it. And then somewhere in the middle of college, I started just kind of dabbling as you know, it was just a hobby.

I auditioned for a local community theater production of Sound of Music, when I was 19 or whatever, and got cast as Maria. And that was really fun. And I did a couple shows in my dormitory. And I did another community theater thing. But they were all just like distractions. It was just, you know, it was like joining a club, you know, like, instead of playing chess, I was doing musicals, but never occurred to me that I would make a career out of it. Until my senior year of college, and I was doing a community theater production of The Music Man, playing Marian, the librarian. I think I was probably 20, like way too young to be playing that role. But I was offered a job for the summer that was coming up, which would have been the summer after I graduated from college in 1983.

That's how old I am, everybody. And I remember talking with the producer on the phone about what that meant, because this particular theater up in Lake George, New York was, they were offering us equity contracts. So he was explaining to me what it meant to, you know, join a union and what, you know, what the ramifications for that would be. And I remember standing in my mother's house, like listening to him going, what? Join a union? Like I had never heard of Actors' Equity Association. And he said, well, you know, if you want to continue doing what you were doing, like community theater and those kinds of things, then you really shouldn't join this union, because it will prevent you from doing those kinds of shows.

But if you ever want to do this professionally, then you really have to be in this union. And I was like, what? Professionally? Like it never occurred to me. So that was a real sort of fork in the road. And at that moment, I decided, well, I'll do this for the summer. It was just a, you know, a little resort town up in the Adirondacks, and I thought it would be a good thing to do for the summer and kind of figure out what my next move would be. And then I met all these like fun, smart, talented New York actors who were in the show, and they sort of encouraged me and said, yeah, move to New York, try it, you know. So I gave myself kind of a deadline. I thought, you know, I'll move.

[12:24] Carolee Carmello: New York for a year and see what happens and then I'll get back to reality. And when the year was up, I sort of reassessed and I had gotten a couple little jobs. I said, well, given another year, you know, it was that kind of thing. Every time I was ready to leave, I would get sucked in by another job. So here I am, 37 years later, whatever it is. Did you ever have any conversations with your parents or anybody that was saying like, you know, business is a paycheck? And even though you find your people that are super happy and can express yourself through art, it doesn't pay well. You know, I have to say that my parents, to their credit, were encouraging. I mean, they didn't say, go for it, follow your dream.

But they didn't say, this is ridiculous. What are you talking about? You just finished your business degree. So they, you know, they helped me find a place to stay and they just kind of let it play out. You know, I mean, I think they were probably fully expecting, as I was, that I would fall on my face and that I would be back in Albany, you know, looking for work at some big corporation before the year was out. But yeah, they were supportive in the sense that they didn't forbid it.

[13:51] Alan Seales: Well, the same thing, sort of, that my parents told me at one point, I have a computer science degree, was that it's easier to do acting with a computer science degree than it is to do computer science with an acting degree. So from my perspective, and you know, maybe yours as a parent too, I think it's probably like, yeah, let's let them try it. And if they fail, that's fine. But they have this degree now. She has a degree that she can fall back on, which is, you know, a strong business degree. So I can respect their decision in allowing, I guess, being supportive. You're, you know, you're of legal age, you can do what you want. But in supporting that career move for you, because a lot of people just, you know, they're at odds with their parents over this.

[14:35] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, I'm sure that's true. I guess I was lucky that way. I mean, we, we are both parents, we were talking about that before. And I think what we want more than anything is for our kids to be happy. So if they're going to pursue computer science and be miserable, you know, we don't want that for them. I mean, yes, you want them to be able to pay their bills, but you also want your kids to enjoy life. So let them pursue every angle and figure out what works best for them. At least I hope that's what my kids will do.

[15:04] Alan Seales: Yeah, I hope so. I mean, that's sort of what I'm going for, of just like, here's all your options, trying to pick out what's good. And with a little bit of nudging, judging, as one of my friends says, in one particular direction or the other to kind of like steer them, but of course, as I guess, most parents would try to do.

[15:23] Carolee Carmello: Right. And my kids had two actors for parents. So hopefully, they learned all the, you know, the negative aspects of a life in the theater. And as a result, are not drawn to it so far anyway.

[15:38] Alan Seales: Well, what about it? I guess thinking back on that moment when you were thinking to yourself, yeah, I think I want to, I'm going to try this. I want to try this. What was it at that moment? Do you remember what it was that was sort of drawing you towards leaving this other career path that up until that point, you had been so focused and very confident that you were going to do?

[16:03] Carolee Carmello: I think it was a combination of things. I, I really enjoyed the people, you know, as, as you know, theater, people are really fun, smart, funny, witty, interesting people. And so being exposed to that a few times kind of lit me up in a way that being in my accounting class didn't really. But also, I think there was an overpowering sort of knowledge in me that if I didn't try it, I would somehow always wonder and possibly have regrets about it. So I wanted to really get it out of my system. And I, I really believed that I would get it out of my system, like in a year or two that it would just be like, Oh, well, obviously, you can't do this, but good for you for trying. And now, you know, you know, when you're 60, you don't have to look back and say, I could have made it on Broadway.

[17:06] Carolee Carmello: I love how I do old lady voice, even though I'm going to be 60 in less than two years.

[17:11] Alan Seales: As soon as you turn 60, you're just going to turn 80, can't you?

[17:16] Carolee Carmello: You and my day.

[17:18] Alan Seales: My day, we had motovers that went doody-doo. We walked in the room.

[17:23] Carolee Carmello: Was, was there a time, I guess, in the career, right? So you're saying you're 19, 20, 21 is when you were sort of started to have the shift. And I, there's a lot of, of women that are in the business that are friends of mine that have said, like, in their 30s, they work a lot in their 20s. And then they started working again in their 40s. But like that 30s range, it was hard to find work just because the roles are usually for moms are a little bit older or for ingenues. And so you have to present a lot younger. I mean, do you remember back at that time, looking back at your resume, it doesn't seem like you had any trouble getting work.

[18:01] Carolee Carmello: I, I, I have felt that phenomenon more in my 50s than I did in my 30s.

[18:11] Alan Seales: Really?

[18:12] Carolee Carmello: I don't know. You know, there were always ups and downs. I mean, there, there were definitely stretches in every decade where I went, well, I guess that's it. I'm never going to work again. You know, I think all actors feel that way. Every time one job ends, unless you have something lined up, you just feel like you're, they're never going to call. And, you know, eventually they usually do, but it's hard. But in my 50s, I really felt a shift of, yeah, there are a few roles here and there, but they're not going to be as juicy and they're not going to be as well-paid and they're not going to be as fun. You're not going to be as on stage as much, you know, it's, it's been a real sort of reckoning. And then, so this year when there's nothing at all, I'm kind of like, wow, that, that was like a slow down and then a smash into a brick wall as far as job opportunities go. So I don't know, we'll see what happens after this is all, you know, settled.

[19:18] Alan Seales: Well, speaking of job opportunities, obviously Estella Scrooge, for those who don't know what it is, let's back up. It's a video on demand available on estellascrooge.com. And it's like the modern, it's a modern retelling of, of A Christmas Carol, but it's got all these other Dickens characters in there because you're Mrs. Habersham, right? Habersham?

[19:41] Carolee Carmello: Right, Habersham, yeah. From Great Expectations.

[19:43] Alan Seales: Which is, yeah, Great Expectations.

[19:46] Carolee Carmello: So they've mixed, they've mixed in a few other Dickens characters, but the, the bulk of the story is A Christmas Carol. And it's, you know, it's a really interesting, when I first got the call, I was excited because John Kerr directed it. And, and I've always been such a huge fan of his. I worked with him for like a half a second on the Les Mis National Tour that I did. But I always hoped I'd have a chance to work with him again. And he's just so brilliant. And I thought, well, if he's involved with this, then it's, it's got to be great. And I read the script, and it was witty and fun. And the songs were really good. So, I mean, it's a new way to do a show, you know, and hopefully for audiences, it's a new way to enjoy a show.

Since they can't go to a theater, you know, they can see a lot of their, you know, favorite Broadway actors. And the interesting thing is that we filmed it all on green screen, which I had never done before. You know, I've never done like a monster movie or anything, or a superhero movie. So I didn't have any experience with green screen.

[20:53] Carolee Carmello: So the entire thing that I was reading that it was individual performances, which I guess is requirement of COVID, but everything was a green screen.

[21:02] Alan Seales: Yes, everything. And I haven't seen much of the finished product. I saw the trailer, which you probably saw as well. And probably a lot of your listeners saw the trailer. But I mean, they did an amazing job of creating this whole world, this digital set that we were living in. And they were really smart about how they directed each actor to interact with this, you know, stick figure scene partner, so that we look like we're in the same room together. And we look like we're making eye contact. I mean, it's really fascinating. It's a new way. I mean, all things being equal, I would rather be in the room with my fellow actors and my director and my musical director. But since we couldn't do that, this was this was a great way to to make a show, you know, and I hope that people will, will be able to enjoy it in the spirit that it was intended.

[22:02] Carolee Carmello: You know, it's, it's three spirits, it was intended.

[22:07] Alan Seales: Ah, you see what he did there?

[22:14] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, it's, you know, it's it's people making the best of the situation, I think.

[22:19] Alan Seales: Well, you've got other people in the cast, Danny Burstein, Betsy Wolfe, Lauren Patton, Patrick Page, you know, of course, you there's this, this laundry list of amazing people. And you're telling me you never acted against any of them in person.

[22:34] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, that was the most frustrating part, because I had this meeting with Betsy Wolfe, and we never got to, I mean, we didn't even really get to rehearse together, you know, I mean, if we had, if we had worked together for a couple weeks, and I knew kind of what the shape of the scene was, and then you put me in a room by myself, that would have been one thing. But we really were just going off of, you know, off the page. And that's really tricky. So the fact that these performances look like anything is a miracle.

[23:10] Alan Seales: That speaks probably to, you know, the director, the direction and the and the effects coordinator.

[23:18] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, the effects coordination. I've seen actually, I've been watching some on TV, I can sort of notice now when there's two people in a commercial that are digitally put together, because their eye lines, like one, one person doesn't look like he's totally he's focused on the person who should be standing next to him. Interesting. So I'm always like, I can't I can't watch anything anymore without dissecting. I'm like, that's a crane shot. That's a drone shot. Like, I know too much about the industry. She's not really saying that.

[23:47] Alan Seales: Yep, ADR. And I always look at the other person in a reverse shot, because their jaw line, their jaw usually doesn't match the dialogue, because we're supposed to be looking at the person having the reaction. It drives me insane. But that's my own brain unable to shut off. But so you'd never you'd never done anything like this in front of the green screen. Was it was it a local studio? And you like you go in and they're saying, Alright, so this is what pages were doing today. And here's your was it literally just like a tennis ball on a stick that someone...

[24:17] Carolee Carmello: Absolutely. It was it was to like toilet paper rolls on a stick for eyes. But this this guy, Tyler, who's who you were mentioning, like the amazing sort of technological aspects of it. I mean, he's got a lot of the credit for this, along with the editors and john cared. But he was the one in the room who was saying, Okay, now, you have to, like, there's a shot in the trailer where my my ghost kind of floats from one side of the couch to the

[25:50] Carolee Carmello: Before COVID started, if they started production over the summer, the script had to have been written a long time ago, but I guess that's not necessarily true. They had done... Okay, sorry, I'm wrong. I shot in September, not in August. They had done an on-stage version of this before COVID. So they had the script and the songs already, you know, on paper. And they were thinking about a way to sort of adapt it to a digital format. So yes, you're right. If they had started from scratch, it would have taken, you know, probably a year to write all this stuff. But they had this piece, and John had directed it before, so he knew it well. And so they just had to sort of cast it and figure out a way to film it, which was huge.

You know, that was a huge hurdle. And all these sets that had to be designed. I mean, looking at the trailer too, the technology behind all of this stuff. And I hope that this continues after COVID is over, after quarantine is over, because there's so many different ways that theater and...

[27:05] Alan Seales: Quarantine is going to be over someday?

[27:07] Carolee Carmello: That's the thought. This is the news, Alan. Wait, quarantine.

[27:13] Alan Seales: Quarantine is going to be over.

[27:18] Carolee Carmello: Do you have a date for that? Do you have an exact date?

[27:21] Alan Seales: Well, I have a time, but not a date.

[27:24] Carolee Carmello: So it's at 364... 64? So 404. 404 p.m. It's going to be at 404 p.m. I don't know the date, though.

[27:39] Alan Seales: Please let me know when you find out.

[27:42] Carolee Carmello: So the sets are incredible. The technology is incredible. I go back and I look at the first Harry Potter movie. I was watching that over Thanksgiving. They're having some Harry Potter marathon. And just the technology, the difference between now and just a decade ago. Of course, it's incredible. So I really am excited and anxious to see where this sort of musical theater format will take us in the next two to three to four to ten years. Because if people are just now, out of necessity, having to adapt, then now that they know it works, this is proving it out for people. This is proving that they could work. I'm sure there's people investing in this who are pretty sure they're never going to make their money back. And if and when they do, they'll be like, oh, we could do more of this. And it's a little bit easier because for you, you specifically, you said you shot all your stuff in one day. You're a name, right? You're a big name.

[28:40] Alan Seales: Well, you are. And at least I think so. And so do many others. And you just said you shot yourself in a day, shot all your scenes in a day. So you could be in the middle of Hello, Dolly. You could be in the middle of Sweeney Todd. You can be in the middle of whatever the next Broadway show is. And on your day off, you go in and do a completely different musical that then gets spread all over the world.

[29:07] Carolee Carmello: You're right. I love this. TV and movie actors have been doing that for years, right? On their hiatus, they go to Brazil and shoot a movie or whatever for a couple of weeks. And then, yeah, I think theater people have been so boxed in by eight shows a week for so many years that we don't really think that way. But, yeah, maybe it'll open up a lot of opportunities for people. Who knows?

[29:32] Alan Seales: Well, it should. I mean, producers have to want to do it, obviously, because you've got to be able to finance it. That's the business side of your brain, right? Put that hat back on.

[29:41] Carolee Carmello: Yeah. There's got to be an opportunity there. I mean, just think about it, right? There's got to be an opportunity for all of this as a service to be given out to people. And now, do you know anything about the Ratatouille musical being created on TikTok?

[29:58] Alan Seales: I was talking to my kids about this last night. I was like, what is the deal? Because I have a 19-year-old and a 25-year-old, so they are much more in tune with this kind of stuff than I am.

[30:10] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm sure everyone who's listening to this is going, oh, God, she's such an OK boomer. But, yeah, I guess it started with someone doing a TikTok kind of joke about it. And now all these other people have created songs and scenes, and they're putting it all together. I mean, it's crowdsourced musical theater.

[30:34] Alan Seales: Right. And I saw a press announcement the other day. Ken Davenport has committed to bringing it to Broadway. So that might happen.

[30:40] Carolee Carmello: Of course, nothing's for certain in this business. TikTok has cast ABF as the main guy. I forget his name.

[30:52] Alan Seales: So Andrew has been posting himself.

[30:57] Carolee Carmello: Remy, yeah, right. Oh, Remy's the rat. Is he going to be the rat?

[31:02] Alan Seales: No, no, Linguini, you're right.

[31:04] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, Linguini. So Andrew started recording himself doing some songs as Linguini. And because of Andrew's following, that's just been growing and growing and growing. It's insane how fast technology can spread musical theater now if producers and people have the vision and the idea. And so I applaud whoever the driving force is behind Estella Scrooge, because I think this is just kind of the tip of the iceberg here.

[31:32] Alan Seales: Yeah, I think you're right. And, you know, we'll see. Like you said, we'll see what the response is. I mean, obviously, they're not going to make a ton of these if there's no profit to be made by the producers.

[31:44] Carolee Carmello: Right. But for now, I think it's just giving everyone an outlet, which is wonderful. And I think the product is from what I've seen. The product is going to be really top rate.

[31:57] Alan Seales: Yeah, the trailer looks incredible. So there will link link to the trailer in the show notes here for anybody who hasn't seen it. But, yeah, everybody check it out. Estella Scrooge dot com. It's just like incredible. I would never have thought that you were not that all of you were not in the same room together putting this putting this film together.

[32:16] Carolee Carmello: I could actually fly.

[32:21] Alan Seales: There's that, too. I wasn't going to let on to that. I've always wanted to be in a show where I did like flying by Foy, where I got to wear a harness and, you know, go across the stage and aerial tricks. And this is, I think, the closest I'm going to get to it unless I do some production of Pippin someday or something.

[32:39] Carolee Carmello: Oh, God. Nancy Opal told me a story once. Be careful what you wish for. She did something where she was flying and she flipped upside down and had to like belt these high notes, like facing upstage, completely upside down. I don't remember what show it was. But be careful what you wish for.

[32:56] Alan Seales: If anyone can do it, Nancy Opal could do it.

[33:01] Carolee Carmello: Oh, awesome. Awesome. OK, so we'll wrap this up here with the three standard closing questions that I ask everybody.

[33:08] Alan Seales: OK, they're easy. They're easy. The very first one is what motivates you?

[33:14] Carolee Carmello: Oh, gosh, motivates me. Well, I guess I hope to tell good stories. If that's a motivation, I consider myself a storyteller more than an artist. I think I have to have good material and good people around me. But ultimately, I just consider myself a storyteller. So that's my motivation. Tell a good story.

[33:42] Alan Seales: I like that. I like it a lot. OK, what advice would you give to your younger self and younger people listening now starting out down a similar path?

[33:50] Carolee Carmello: Oh, definitely, if it's a dream of yours and you feel like someday you might have regrets for not trying it, then you should give yourself time to try it, especially before you have responsibilities and before you have big bills to pay. When you're young, try everything, whether it's musical theater or stand-up comedy or you want to be a sculptor or whatever drives you, whatever passion you have, definitely try everything for a little while and see where you land because you might be surprised at where you can make a living. I certainly was.

[34:36] Alan Seales: I like that, too. OK, last question, hardest one here. If you can only see one show for the rest of your life, but you can see it as many times as you want, what would you see?

[34:48] Carolee Carmello: Oh, my gosh. The one that comes to mind is is like the show that I used to watch on television, the movie musical. You know, speaking of theater pieces in, you know, film form. That's how I as a kid who didn't live in New York and didn't get to see live theater. That's how I learned about theater is watching movie musicals on TV, you know, West Side Story and Sound of Music.

[35:13] Alan Seales: Me, too.

[35:14] Carolee Carmello: But the one that the one that I really fell in love with is sort of an interesting one, but it's 1776. It's one of my favorite shows ever.

[35:22] Alan Seales: And you got to do it.

[35:26] Carolee Carmello: Yeah, I got to do it twice. Yeah, I got to play Abigail and then I got to do a concert version where I got to play John Adams, which was the most fun ever.

[35:36] Alan Seales: That's awesome. I just need to throw a little nod to you as well, because when I ask, I've asked that to over 100 people now, obviously. And the majority by far have said Sweeney Todd.

[35:48] Carolee Carmello: Interesting.

[35:50] Alan Seales: Yeah. Yeah. They're like every time every time they see it, they just find something new. It just got so many levels. So, yeah, I mean, there's a reason why your run got extended. It is an amazing show. And I think that production that I had the honor to do was so cool and so unique. I mean, lots of people have done amazing productions of Sweeney, but there was something really special about that intimate setting and that small cast. And I hope, you know, maybe we'll get to do it again someday.

[36:21] Carolee Carmello: I hope so. I hope so. It's it was a great production. So where can we find you online? What are your socials?

[36:26] Carolee Carmello: I'm sure you're all over TikTok, right?

[36:30] Carolee Carmello: I haven't jumped on the TikTok wagon yet, but, you know, who knows? Maybe I will. I am Carolee Carmelo on Twitter and on Instagram.

[36:39] Alan Seales: All right. You can get more of me at the theater podcast dot com. I'm on Twitter and Instagram at theater underscore podcast. I'm on Facebook dot com slash official theater podcast. Please leave a rating. Leave a review. Share with your friends. Thanks to Jukebox, the ghost for the intro and outro music. Everybody, please go see Estella Scrooge on demand at Estella Scrooge dot com. And, Carolee, thank you so much. I really enjoyed chatting with you.

[37:04] Carolee Carmello: Thanks, Alan. Nice chatting with you. Happy holidays, everybody.