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[0:00] Ellenore Scott: Hi, my name is Ellenore Scott. You're here at the Theatre Podcast with Alan Seales.

[0:03] Alan Seales: Hello, and welcome back to the Theatre Podcast with Alan Seales. That is me. I am Alan, and today we're sitting down with another creative who's having a moment that most people only dream of. Ellenore Scott is a choreographer who has currently not one, but multiple shows running in the same season here in New York, including the massive revival of Ragtime and the campy, hilarious hit Titanic. We dig into her incredible journey from being a finalist on season six of So You Think You Can Dance to returning a decade later as a choreographer for the show. And the real magic of this conversation, though, is the behind-the-scenes look at her life during this whirlwind year. Ellenore shares the wild story of her son, Ford's, birth, and she literally attended the opening night of Ragtime at Lincoln Center and then went to the hospital the very next morning for a scheduled C-Section. She actually had to negotiate with her doctor to push the date back so she wouldn't miss her own opening night. We talk about her unique family heritage, how she's bringing her personality history into the movement she creates on stage, and she reveals a little secret Easter egg move called the Bitch Swerve that she tries to hide in every single show she choreographs. This is a smart and funny and deeply human look at what it's like to balance a massive career with new motherhood and newfound success. Make sure to follow me online on all the socials, leave a rating and a review. You can watch the video version of the episode, as always, on Spotify or Patreon. And now, everybody, please enjoy this episode with Ellenore Scott. Today's guest is a celebrated choreographer, director, and performer who has become one of the most versatile and sought-after creatives in the theater industry today after rising to national fame as a finalist on So You Think You Can Dance. She returned to the program as a choreographer and has since built an incredible body of work on and off Broadway. Her choreographic credits include the hit revival of Little Shop, Funny Girl, Mr. Saturday Night, and the viral sensation Ratatouille, the TikTok musical. This season alone, she's achieved the rare feat of having multiple productions running simultaneously, including the celebrated Lincoln Center production of Ragtime and the hit musical Titanic. Please welcome to the Theatre Podcast, Ellenore Scott.

[2:39] Ellenore Scott: Hello, hello. Thank you for having me. That was a really beautiful little bio.

[2:44] Alan Seales: I will go in front of you and announce you royalty every time we go.

[2:50] Ellenore Scott: I appreciate that. Thank you.

[2:50] Alan Seales: Yes, yes. So you started, I guess, well, not started, but you got your fame on So You Think You Can Dance, I guess. What season was that?

[2:58] Ellenore Scott: Season six. I love to say it's the season nobody watched. It was the first and only season during the fall. So usually it's a summer show. You watch it with your family and friends when you're off of school. And they were like, surprise, this season, we're going to do it in the fall. And everyone was like, what? So I was on season six. We filmed basically through the holiday season. And honestly, it was great. But yeah, nobody watched it.

[3:28] Alan Seales: Oh, right. Because the latter half of it's always live, right?

[3:31] Ellenore Scott: Yes.

[3:32] Alan Seales: Okay.

[3:32] Ellenore Scott: So we did a combo platter of it still being live. So I still had the full experience, but they were definitely trying to compete with the World Series. And we had to take weeks off because of other events happening in the world. So, yeah.

[3:45] Alan Seales: I guess the first and only time it was...

[3:50] Ellenore Scott: In the fall.

[3:51] Alan Seales: In the fall. So I guess they learned from probably a different ratings. Though there are a beautiful amount of people that still know me from the show or have gone on YouTube to look up dances I've done. So I'm still able to say that I had a little bit of the fame that you talk of from the show.

[4:10] Alan Seales: Well, it brought you back then as a choreographer. How long did that...

[4:14] Ellenore Scott: 10 years.

[4:15] Alan Seales: It was a decade later.

[4:16] Ellenore Scott: It was a decade later. I kept being like, please bring me back. I'm choreographing now. I would love to do that. And they were like, yeah, okay. But 10 years later, they brought me back for season 17.

[4:28] Alan Seales: Right. How many seasons have there been now? Do you know?

[4:30] Ellenore Scott: I think they're on like 19...

[4:33] Alan Seales: Thousand.

[4:34] Ellenore Scott: Thousand. Yeah. It's like now that's what I call, so you think you dance 202. You know what I mean?

[4:39] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[4:40] Ellenore Scott: But they're all geriatric. So I think I wear pants.

[4:43] Alan Seales: That's right. I tap dance sometimes.

[4:46] Ellenore Scott: So you think you wear pants. We don't know. That's my old accent.

[4:50] Alan Seales: That's it.

[4:51] Ellenore Scott: But then rewinding, then when did you first start dancing as a little lady?

[4:56] Ellenore Scott: As a little lady? Well, I feel silly, but both of my parents danced. So I think it was kind of just in the gene pool. My mother was absolutely the ballerina, classically trained, jazz and modern. And then my dad was a hip hop dancer. Him and his brother were a duo called the Scott Brothers. They had been performing together since they were 13 and 15 and they traveled the world.

[5:22] Alan Seales: That's what the Property Brothers did prior, right?

[5:24] Ellenore Scott: Listen, correct. They were dancers first.

[5:27] Alan Seales: Yes. Okay. Okay. Okay.

[5:28] Ellenore Scott: No, it's so funny. Anytime I try to show people my dad, I also like YouTube. I'm like the Scott Brothers and I have to put popping or like the Scott Brothers dancing because it's just literally the Property Brothers.

[5:38] Alan Seales: The Property Brothers. Yeah.

[5:40] Ellenore Scott: So they met performing together at SeaWorld. SeaWorld used to have a performing called City Streets. And so they met doing that.

[5:47] Alan Seales: I remember that. Yeah.

[5:48] Ellenore Scott: They got married, had me. And my favorite thing to say is that they were like, okay, we'll put you into like baby ballet. And I went on and they were like, oh no, she can't do anything. She's awful. Actually, I had no rhythm. I couldn't pay attention. I was like picking my wedgie on stage. It was heinous, horrible. And I like to say that I think my mom knew secretly what she was doing because she put me in taekwondo and karate. And then also I learned how to play the saxophone. So I think like the musicality of learning the saxophone and the coordination of karate and taekwondo led me to have some type of body coordination. And so then I started dancing again when I was like 10 or 11 and I actually could do it this time. I was actually able to keep the beat. So I've been dancing since I was like 10.

[6:36] Alan Seales: That's really interesting because I literally had this conversation with somebody not like three or four days ago about like, can you teach someone rhythm?

[6:46] Ellenore Scott: I think I'm going to say yes because I truly was a hot mess. And again, I was two or three. But there are prodigies out there that can drum Justin Bieber style from when they're like four. But yeah, I think listening to music and playing music and learning how to read music taught me to find that musicality at such a young age.

[7:08] Alan Seales: I get that. Okay. So then you were doing the saxophone and then taekwondo probably like just control of your body and muscle isolation and all the things.

[7:16] Ellenore Scott: Yeah.

[7:17] Alan Seales: And like discipline and like being in a class and really paying attention and learning to listen and learn. I think in dance class, it was just so fun that I just kind of didn't pay attention. Yeah. So I think I learned a little bit more discipline in that kind of martial arts form. And so then I started with hip hop first because I saw my dad perform on this television show called Destination Stardom.

[7:43] Ellenore Scott: Never heard of it. Right. It was like I think one season or two seasons they filmed in Hawaii, which was amazing. So I got to go because he was on like the finale of it. Oh, wow. But I remember watching him and being like, I really like that. I love that he gets to dance and people are watching him. That's so cool. I think I want to do that. So I asked my mom if I could take hip hop. She was like, yeah, totally. So I started with hip hop and I moved to tap and then moved into jazz. And they were like, you have to do ballet. And I was like, no, I don't want to wear pink tights, but moved into ballet and then basically have been dancing ever since. And but when did you figure out that that was something that you liked because you just said you didn't like it. You didn't want to do it.

[8:24] Ellenore Scott: No, I really believe that the training I got, I was training at a school called Dance Center in Capitola, California, and they had like a really great like community performance initiative. So like we would perform at like the senior center, the Elks Lodge, and we would perform at like Six Flags and the county fair next to the pigs. And so it was they just really liked getting us out there and performing, which was great. And so I loved the fact that people were watching me dance like that was so fun for me that I was like, I'm performing like I'm a star performing. And then I also loved choreographing. And I didn't really put that together until way later in life. But I remember being 13 and choreographing my own solos because like, long story short, someone would have to like change their costume. So they needed like an extra two minutes. And I was like, I'll choreograph a little solo. And I would choreograph these hip hop jazz solos that had comedy in them. Like I would like try to make the audience laugh because that's what my dad did. Yeah, with his brother. And I was like, Oh, I love this. I love making people laugh. I love making people clap and smile. And yeah, so that's kind of I think we're the connection of, oh, this is something that brings me joy. And then now I can see other people are experiencing that joy as well.

[9:46] Alan Seales: That that's, that's where even in the young age, you were feeling Yes, yes. That's crazy. Cool. At the county fair. I remember, I did a boy's choir or something. It was probably second, third, maybe fourth grade. I don't even remember. But it was one of the things where we were, the stage was a was a trailer for hail. Hey, hey bales. Okay. Oh, like, you know, I was on the farm. Yes. And it was one of those things where it was like, Alright, so we're gonna wheel in, someone's gonna tow in the stage, boom, put the kids up there with a microphone. And we sang baby, it's cold outside. And I had a I had a solo, that was my first solo. And I remember, I don't remember what it was, it was probably one of the uber creepy lines, you know, looking back on it. But uh, yeah, I can relate to that, that that moment of just like, whoa, they're all listening, they're all listening. And I'm giving them joy and making them smile.

[10:30] Ellenore Scott: That's right. That it's a good magic. Yeah. And your background, your family background is very diverse. Like I was reading, you've got like, African American, indigenous, Filipino, Mexican, Hawaiian, and Irish. That's correct. Any more?

[10:52] Ellenore Scott: Um, I am mixed from a mix of a mix, if that makes any sense. So yeah, on my mom's side, her grandfather is African American. And then her mom was like, from Mexico, Mexican and indigenous. They met fell in love had my mom. And then on my dad's side, my great, my grandmother is Hawaiian and Filipino. And then she married an Irish man. And so my dad is also mixed. And so when they met, and had me, it was like, literally, I remember my mom being like, you are it's a small world after all, from the like, from Disney parks, like you are all of them. Like, when you go through it, you'll be like, that's me. That's me. That's me. Yeah. And so I've kind of always had this like, identity, not crisis, but like, I am so connected to so many different cultures. And also, because I have so many, I'm also like, Who the heck am I? But I've felt very lucky that my both of my, my mom's side and my dad's side have like, started to slowly, like, introduce me to more family and our kind of family background and our like, family tree so that I can start saying like, Oh, okay, this is when my like, grandfather came from Mexico. And this is where, you know, the African slave ships not to get dark, but like, came to America. And like, we can now trace that through the like, Smithsonian, you know, they have like a program that allows you to like, look back that far with family names. And like, my grandmother now has like a full document that she's like, passing down to me to like, remember who my grandfather and grandparents were. So it's, it's wild that that I am the just the world a little bit.

[12:30] Alan Seales: I think that's cool, though. And I forget what the statistic is. But people are saying all the time that like, in a couple generations, I forget how many it is. But like, we're all going to be so entwined. Totally. And there is going to be no, very little of what I hate to use the word pure. But like, um, yeah, yes. But like, my wife is is Asian. And I'm, of course, Caucasian. And so like, we've talked about like, to our kids now who are in fourth and fifth grade, we're like, you can check whatever box you want on what race are you form? You know, you you pick? Yeah. And they they both, they've just always got a grown up with that logic. And they're like, Oh, okay, like, we do Asian stuff, like celebrate Chinese New Year and hang out and and with that side of the family. And then we do traditional American holidays that are, you know, whatever. And so they're kind of they just grew up with that mix. But then you were saying you have so much of, of all of this intertwined. And you what did you use? Did you use the word crisis, identity crisis, identity crisis? Correct. So something like that. I mean, like, do you remember as a kid, trying to figure out what?

[13:40] Ellenore Scott: Oh, yeah, totally. I mean, I've always checked other because typically, when I was growing up, it was like, pick one, yeah, check one. And I was like, Well, I want to check multiple. So I would always just check other and right and mixed. I grew up in like a predominantly white, Caucasian area of town. And I remember, may he rest in peace, but my stepdad, before he passed away, when I was like, much younger, he made the joke, he was like, Well, Eleanor goes to like a very diverse school, there's Mexican kids, and African American kids, and Filipino kids, they're all my daughter, but and so like, I truly grew up kind of not really finding connection with that community where I was growing up. And then it only really kind of, I felt that connection even stronger once I moved to New York. So I moved to New York when I was 14, to go to LaGuardia High School, and to train at Alvin Ailey. And it was like, when I moved to New York, that I was like, Oh, my God, there are so many beautiful people here. And I can connect to so many different folks. So yeah, I think, especially now, I also have a five month old, and he is like, also more mixed, my husband is white. But it's so interesting to like, see him and like, know that we're gonna have to have a lot of different conversations about who he is. And, and now growing up in New York, I'm so excited that he'll be able to grow up with so many different types of kids. But yeah, I always check other, but now I think you can check multiple boxes. Yeah, great.

[15:14] Alan Seales: Yeah, they have. They have also added the, I prefer not to say,

[15:19] Ellenore Scott: I prefer not to say, yeah.

[15:21] Alan Seales: Yeah, which actually, I think is great. I don't understand ultimately why it matters, like for jobs thing. I mean, I guess it's being on a little bit of the HR side in the past, I get that you want to collect the demographic statistics, so you can make sure that you are collecting from all, from people of many, many diverse backgrounds. So I get a little bit of that. But it should never, by the way, it is illegal to discriminate.

[15:46] Ellenore Scott: Correct.

[15:47] Alan Seales: By that when you're doing a job, you can't even ask. When you transitioned from the behind or from on camera to the behind the scenes, though, you're saying you're always choreographing.

[16:00] Ellenore Scott: Choreographing, some would say.

[16:02] Alan Seales: Some would, most should say. When you did the transition, was that a natural transition, or was it hard for you to leave behind the on camera work at all?

[16:13] Ellenore Scott: I don't want to say it was hard to leave behind. Actually, I think the difficulty was once I was a performer, so after So You Think, I went on and I was dancing on television and award shows. I dabbled in background dancing, wasn't for me, but that's okay. And then I just kind of ended up continuing to perform. And I do love performing. But I had the opportunity to do pre-production for the Smash television series, which for folks that don't know pre-production is basically you go in with the choreographer or the director and you start developing movement or figuring out what steps you want to do for the show and plotting out camera moves, whatever. And I remember having the thought, I'm having way more fun doing this than the fact that I'm about to be in front of the camera for the show. And that was the moment that the light bulb clicked for me that, wait a minute, maybe I want to choreograph and not just perform. I think the most difficult part was that people were like, well, you're young, you're 22, just keep performing. You can't perform forever, right? You can't do that forever. So do it while you're young, especially as a dancer. And then you can make that transition as a choreographer when you're 30, right? When you're 35. When you're so old. When you're so old, yeah. When your knees are giving out. And I was like, well, I don't know. I really like the creative element. I have that brain where I can map where everybody is on stage at the same time and what they need to do. And so I slowly started trying to talk to people about, let me choreograph. And everyone said, no. And so I started my own dance company in 2012 because I was like, I need to practice this, I think. I really should practice. So I started choreographing with these dancers and we were performing in the tri-state area. And I started inviting even my dance agent at the time because I was like, girl, I would love to choreograph. Can you please watch the fact that I can? And it was after that moment that she said, okay, let's start broadening out who we're sending you out for, not just as a performer, but as a choreographer. And my big break really was being the assistant choreographer for Andy Blankenbuehler for the Cats revival. Not the Juggle Ball, the Cats revival in 2016.

[18:33] Alan Seales: That's, wow, good work. Very good work.

[18:37] Ellenore Scott: Yeah. So that was your, was that your official first Broadway credit?

[18:37] Ellenore Scott: That was my first musical theater credit. Teehee, what? Yeah. That was my first Teehee musical theater credit slash Broadway credit. It was my first job.

[18:48] Alan Seales: What?

[18:48] Ellenore Scott: Correct. Yes. I'm just as flabbergasted as you.

[18:52] Alan Seales: What was that like then? Because I mean, that's like going from zero to a hundred.

[18:55] Ellenore Scott: Correct. Because usually, especially for dancers, the pathway is you perform, you perform on Broadway, maybe you're a swing or a dance captain, and then you move to assistant choreographer. So you know what I mean? Like that's typically the way you move. I don't know how I went through this back alleyway, but I had been doing pre-production with Andy back in the day for a little unknown show, Hamilton.

[19:20] Alan Seales: Never heard of it.

[19:22] Ellenore Scott: Never heard of it. Something's utopian to me.

[19:26] Alan Seales: Correct.

[19:30] Ellenore Scott: Bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bump.

[19:32] Alan Seales: So I had been doing pre-production for him for Hamilton and Bring It On because I was dating a musical theater guy at the time. So he was like...

[19:41] Ellenore Scott: Trash. Trash. Trash all of them.

[19:42] Alan Seales: All of them. Trash. Throw them out. But he was like, I have a dancer girlfriend. She can come and do pre-production. And after that, I just kept working with Andy. We got a great rapport. And I do think that all of those things lined up perfectly. Hamilton blew up to be, obviously, the most recognized show in the entire universe. And I think what happened, which I'm very grateful for, was I had gone up to him at some point earlier when we were working together. And I was like, if you ever need an assistant or an associate, let me know. I will be there. I would love to learn. Even if I go just go get coffee for you. Yeah, I would love to learn how to do music. I will dance and come back, but I will bring you coffee. Totally. I'm like, I've never done this musical theater thing, so I would love to learn. And I think because he sent every single associate he has ever worked with to Hamilton, London, and Hamilton, the tour, and Hamilton, Broadway, and running the auditions, he was like, oh no, I've run out of people. I think this girl, Eleanor, said she would be my assistant once. I should call her. So he literally called me to do Cats. And he knew that I loved Cats, but I also had a background in ballet and jazz. But he also wanted to infuse it with some hip-hop, and he knew I did hip-hop and animation as well. So he was like, okay, you're the perfect fit for the show. So that's how I snuck into it.

[20:57] Alan Seales: Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back after this break. Welcome back to the episode. Do you think Timothy Chalamet would like Cats?

[21:04] Ellenore Scott: Too much ballet. Too much ballet.

[21:09] Alan Seales: But Cats in and of itself, though, is such a dance-heavy show, and it's very iconic and very known. How do you adapt what was put out before when you're reviving a show like that?

[21:27] Ellenore Scott: When you revive something, you want it to be... I think you need to step it up every time you revive something. How did the two of you approach bringing this back and adding new life into it? Because it is such an iconic show that everybody knows.

[21:36] Ellenore Scott: Everyone knows, and there's very iconic moves in the show, right? So I grew up with the VHS of Cats, which I would watch every day after school, middle school, send help, right? And so I felt very full circle that I was able to be doing this production. And so Andy really kind of discussed like, okay, there's iconic moments, and in the show, the cats are coming for this jellicle ball, and it's like the moon is shining on them. And he said, well, what if those moments in the show that are the most iconic, everyone can do like all those moments, what if we kept the original choreography for that, as if it was a traditional dance, as if it were the thing that the cats all knew? And that for the breakout songs, that's where we'll bring in the new choreography. That's where we'll make some things feel a little bit more contemporary or feel a little bit more fresh. So like, Mistoffelees kind of had like a different breakdown of his dance section for his solo versus what is originally done with the Gillian Lynn choreography. But like, all of the big kind of moments of full company movement, we kept a lot of the original choreography for that.

[22:51] Alan Seales: But there's no, like when you're saying, all right, Mr. Weber, I'm gonna license your show, do they send you a tape of here's all the moves?

[22:56] Ellenore Scott: They do not. We actually had the associate choreographer, so I was the assistant choreographer and the associate choreographer, Chrissy, who had been basically restaging Gillian Lynn's choreography everywhere. She came and she basically was the like Gillian Lynn Bible. She was like, so this is what we did originally in this section of the show. So we would learn it, and then we would like decide, okay, this is how we're gonna keep that version. Okay, well, this is what her intention was for this. So let's try something else for this moment. So it was like, awesome, because we got to like, learn in real time from a descendant of Gillian Lynn, the OG choreography. And then also she was helping us like adapt it to a new audience.

[23:41] Alan Seales: That's cool. Is there any movement, any piece of choreography from Hamilton that is yours that you can look at now?

[23:47] Ellenore Scott: Yes, I made that I'm so proud. There is literally a move my actually, when we get to it, my associate choreographer Voltaire Wade Green, for Ragtime, him and I were doing pre production for Andy, that's where we like originally met each other. And there's a move in the show called the Voltellinor.

[24:05] Alan Seales: The Voltellinor.

[24:05] Ellenore Scott: That we made up together. It's like a partnering step that we did together. And then when they teach it, he went on to be like a resident choreographer for the show, when he teaches it to new, like ensemble members. It's literally called the Voltellinor. So yes, there are.

[24:19] Alan Seales: What is it? I want to be able to look out for it.

[24:21] Ellenore Scott: It's in the like satisfied helpless moment. It's like the gentlemen and the ladies are like front to back. And it's this like arm, like isolated arm gesture. It's a little hard to do as like a solo. But if you look at the partnering and that it's there.

[24:38] Alan Seales: I'm gonna go watch it on Disney Plus.

[24:40] Ellenore Scott: Watch it on Disney Plus.

[24:41] Alan Seales: I'm gonna find it. Wouldn't it be great if you got royalties from every time they did your moves on Disney Plus?

[24:45] Ellenore Scott: Listen, that would be, I would be a, I think a bajillionaire.

[24:49] Alan Seales: A bajillionaire.

[24:51] Ellenore Scott: Yeah, all the money would be in your pocket. And then like you've done Little Shop and then like TikTok, actually Ratatouille.

[25:00] Alan Seales: Oh yeah.

[25:01] Ellenore Scott: We'll talk about this. Ratatouille raised over $2 million, right? What was that process like choreographing for TikTok?

[25:09] Ellenore Scott: So lol, I became a TikTok girly over the pandemic because as a lot of theater folks know, we all at the same time just didn't have work anymore. And I started like getting antsy because I was like, I miss creating. I miss having that connection with other people. And so I felt that the TikTok community at the time was very open and interactive. And I started making like anime dances. Like if you want to get into it, you really can. But I started making like anime dances and anime. I am an anime girly. I really do. Look at my tattoo. Hello, Yuri and Ice.

[25:49] Alan Seales: That's pretty.

[25:50] Ellenore Scott: I got this when I got a million TikTok followers.

[25:52] Alan Seales: I'm gonna take a picture of that.

[25:53] Ellenore Scott: You must. But I started really diving into TikTok. It was just like the one way that I felt like I can connect and chat with people. And this, you know, Ratatouille TikTok musical kind of, I started seeing it, people singing the like, I started seeing that. And then I started noticing that people were like making new songs and then adding dances to it. I was like, Oh my God, this is so interesting. So when Seaview Productions connected with me and they were like, we actually want to make it. We want to do it. We want to do the TikTok musical and we want you to choreograph it. I was like, huh?

[26:30] Alan Seales: You go, ha ha ha.

[26:31] Ellenore Scott: I was like, Tiki, what? And they were like, so everything is going to be virtual. Literally everything. All the actors are going to film themselves. We'll have some studios where we can social distance. We were in the thick of social distancing.

[26:44] Alan Seales: I remember. Yeah, this was like summer 2020, right?

[26:46] Ellenore Scott: Yes, correct. And so I was choreographing. I was videotaping myself choreographing things to send to Andrew Barth Feldman, who was playing Linguini, for him to film at home himself. I remember the craziest moment was we did a Zoom session with Andre De Shields, Lucy Moss and I, who was directing the show. I remember he was in this gorgeous sequin blazer and her and I on Zoom were privately chatting each other going, what is our lives? What are we doing? This is crazy. And they aired it on January 1st, 2021. You could watch it live. It was so wild that they were able to edit all of these vertical videos together to make a show.

[27:34] Alan Seales: That is crazy cool.

[27:35] Ellenore Scott: Yes. It was crowdfunding musical theater. I think folks were like, that'll never work. And somehow it totally worked.

[27:44] Alan Seales: Well, okay. So to go down a tangent for a second, that speaks, in my opinion, to the lack of accessibility that this industry keeps in place, the walls that are put up. Because I think a lot of people are afraid, if we give them too much, they won't buy tickets and they won't come in and everything's going to fail. And I think that it's the exact opposite of what we should be doing. I want to film and I want to put it out there. And the Disney plus Hamilton didn't hurt ticket sales. It helped it. Again, I talk about this all the time, but I think it's the exact opposite. I call it the Taylor Swift effect in that she is brilliant in she films everything, gives everybody access in a theater to go see her concerts and people still-

[28:34] Ellenore Scott: Want tickets.

[28:35] Alan Seales: Want tickets and spend so much money to travel to another country to go see her and see these things because she shows you what it is and what you're missing and how great it is.

[28:48] Ellenore Scott: That's right.

[28:50] Alan Seales: I literally just had this conversation yesterday with Diane Paulus right here. We were talking about the energy you get in live theater and we were talking about the difference of the virtual versus physical. And while you can give people the movies and film pro shots and whatnot, that's great and that's a step towards all the accessibility we need to have.

[29:13] Ellenore Scott: That's right.

[29:14] Alan Seales: People are still not going to be able to experience the real thing,

[29:19] Ellenore Scott: I put it in very loose air quotes, unless you're there in the room where it happened to bring it back to happen.

[29:26] Alan Seales: It always comes back to Hamilton.

[29:27] Ellenore Scott: Always comes back to Hamilton. So you want to show people the room in as easy a way as possible, and they're going to want to go into it.

[29:34] Ellenore Scott: 100%. And I do think that, like you're saying, the magic of live theater is that... I don't know if everyone always puts this together, like audiences that are coming in, the show that you're experiencing tonight will never happen again.

[29:48] Alan Seales: Exactly.

[29:48] Ellenore Scott: How they performed it, the people on stage, the people around you, how the orchestra is playing the show, that will never happen again. So every time you go see a show, it's a unique experience. It's brand new. It's magic, right? And I think people... I find the more behind the scenes, the more connection, the more that they feel like they are a part of understanding the show or hearing the songs or the development, it is proven that when you give them more, they want more, right? And especially, I think, with this younger generation, they are so used to accessibility and being on their phones and looking up and reading things or listening to things. And I do find that they also then want to come to New York and book a ticket and go see the show.

[30:00] Alan Seales: Well, it's a brand problem too, because when you have people who have traveled... English may not even be their first language, and they've traveled hours and hours from other countries, and they're on a limited budget, and tickets are so expensive, and they are unsure from all the many choices they have what to go see, they're going to see something they already know because they've heard of it. And if they've heard of it, they assume it's good. So when you have all this new work, it gets ignored because nobody's heard of it yet. So then it goes through the whole cycle... I'm on my soapbox again. It goes through the whole cycle of, we hope we can get to opening, we hope we have enough money to make it to the Tonys, we hope we get nominated, we hope we can win something, and then we hope we can get more money out of that to market some more.

[31:04] Ellenore Scott: And to tour or to do whatever, yes.

[31:20] Alan Seales: Right. And if we would market before all of that, then people would come and already know about it, and then they would give a chance. They would be more open to spending a lot more money than they should be on a show that is, we'll put, unproven.

[31:37] Ellenore Scott: I feel like when we were doing Ragtime, we were learning about the idea of... They did a survey with young people and they were like, would you spend $500 on a ticket? They were like, no. But then they were told, if you were able to watch a rehearsal and or listen to the cast recording sessions and see the tech process, would you spend $500? They were like, yes. We would spend more, actually. And it's like, boom, there you go.

[32:07] Alan Seales: And part of that too is union rules behind recording, recording your rehearsals and everything. Yeah, all of this stuff. It's so prohibitive.

[32:14] Ellenore Scott: It is.

[32:15] Alan Seales: And I'm out to change this. I want to change it.

[32:18] Ellenore Scott: Change it.

[32:19] Alan Seales: I do want to change it.

[32:19] Ellenore Scott: You must.

[32:20] Alan Seales: For the show I'm producing, we recorded some of the scenes. It's a play. And then we're like, if this was a musical, we'd already have a number or two out there for people to hook onto. But how do you do that with a play? So we recorded some rehearsal scenes and we wanted it to be rough. We wanted them to hold book. We wanted them to call the line.

[32:35] Ellenore Scott: Yes.

[32:36] Alan Seales: And because we wanted just to see what it's like.

[32:38] Ellenore Scott: That's right.

[32:39] Alan Seales: And so that'll drop tomorrow as I'm recording this. But so, yeah, Annie Hughes, Ragtime and Titanic, two identical shows.

[32:50] Ellenore Scott: I was going to say, same vibe and content.

[32:52] Alan Seales: Same vibe. Yeah, totally the same.

[32:56] Ellenore Scott: It's like I keep saying they're literally on the opposite sides of the musical theater spectrum right now.

[33:01] Alan Seales: Crazy cool. And was that fun for you to like kind of?

[33:05] Ellenore Scott: Oh, yeah. Yes. For a long time, I had been only really working on comedic shows, which I feel very blessed about because my favorite thing to do is laugh. My favorite thing to do is also make other people laugh. So Little Shop, funny show, funny girl. It's in the title, right? Like these shows that I got very lucky were my kind of first few that I was working on were very funny. Mr. Saturday Night, Billy Crystal. Those opportunities were so great that I was kind of yearning for the opportunity to do something a little bit more grounded and serious. And so when I was offered Ragtime at Encores!, I was like, this is perfect. This is exactly what I want to do. This is such A, an iconic show that everyone knows and loves. B, it's so timely always. And it gave me a challenge of how to like infuse more choreography into the show. And so I like was just unbelievably so grateful that it was when we announced that it was coming to Broadway. I was like, slay mama. I'm so happy that it's coming to the movie theater and it's going to be so beautiful there. And then when I found out Titanic was coming the same season, I was like, you have to be joking like this. This is silly boots. Like that. Like going from an iconic everyone knows wheels of a dream, Joshua Henry, like, you know what I mean? Like that to Marla Mindell, your friend being crazy, being Celine Dion, talking about the Titanic. I was like, this is wild that this is my career right now.

[34:42] Alan Seales: Where do you start to sort of dissect the show and develop the language of the movement? Because every show has a language.

[34:47] Ellenore Scott: Yes. Yes. I think for me, it's like, you know, the show is obviously the principles and the ensemble. And how do they move? Right. So for Ragtime, it was initially on course, as maybe folks know, but New York City Center has like these on course performances that's supposed to be, you know, a concert-esque style, tee hee. But it like sometimes is also like a full production. So our version was basically a full production. And, you know, it was a cast of 33 on stage, which is the biggest cast I've ever worked with, with a 29 piece orchestra. Right. And so we definitely prioritized like having really powerhouse vocalists. And so I knew I was like, okay, I'm not going to be doing grand bat mas and like triple pirouettes. So like, how am I going to convey these ideas with our amazing cast that we already have in our ensemble? So it was definitely for me, at least with Ragtime, because it was a revival, we were talking about like, how do you like re-up or re-imagine it? So much of what I wanted to do was like, look at the lyrics, and really figure out what was the intention behind the song. Like for example, Crime of the Century, which is like the kind of like bigger first number in the show after the prologue, is an Evelyn Nesbitt solo, but also like there's jury member, like it's supposed to be like a Broadway show within a Broadway show. And when you listen to the song, you're like, oh, it's like a happy go like the Crime of the Century, like very fun and happy Bobby. And then you start listening, you're like, what about a 15 year old girl who's like, being sexualized? And ew, and gross. And so then you start diving in, you're like, actually, this is kind of like sad and gross. And so I was like, okay, cool. I want to make sure that the movement starts matching that so that at the beginning, it's like, fun, happy, choreography, yay, dancer, blah, blah, blah. But that the ensemble are slowly shifting to becoming more like, not that they just love her, but they want to be they want to eat her they want to they are obsessed with her. And so you can watch the choreography on them slowly start to get more and more sinister as the number goes. And it's like subtle. But I kind of wanted to do that with all of these like bigger full company moments. You know, Henry Ford, it's all of the actors are being the machinery and they are the cogs in the wheel. And Henry does not care about them. He only cares about making money. And so I wanted to reflect that in how they perform the material like the dancing as well. And then we're Titanic, it's like, what is the dumbest, gayest thing we can do? Like, what is something that will make me laugh and hopefully make the audience laugh? It was like, truly the complete opposite. Obviously, it's still you know, I'm still connecting to the lyric and I'm still connecting to the movement. But I'm like, okay, we're doing a 90s music video. Like what choreography do I want? Do I want it to look like it's raining and there's like chiffon and the wind is blowing? Like, that's right. Exactly. It's definitely that. It's a lot of physical comedy. It's like what lift like silly lift could we do? What silly like Irish dancing? There's Irish dancing in the show. Hello. So it was just really how can we make each other laugh for Titanic? It was amazing. It was also the craziest part was I rehearsed Ragtime and Titanic in the same rehearsal studio.

[37:58] Alan Seales: Really?

[37:59] Ellenore Scott: At the Lincoln Center basement studio, rehearsal studio. I rehearsed both. And so it was so funny because Ragtime, I was fully pregnant. And then for Titanic, I was bringing my son forward to rehearsal. And he was like watching rehearsal and dancing with everybody. It was great.

[38:14] Alan Seales: That's so cute.

[38:15] Ellenore Scott: Yes, he loved it. He does. Like when he hears Joshua Henry's voice, he's like, I think that's my dad.

[38:22] Alan Seales: I mean, I think that too. Who doesn't think that?

[38:25] Ellenore Scott: That's right. That's right. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back after this break. Welcome back to the episode. Let's see. Your doctor originally wanted to schedule your C-section. You made him wait for Ragtime, speaking of your son.

[38:45] Ellenore Scott: Speaking of Ford, I was like 37, 38 weeks. And this little mother trucker did not want to flip around. He was like, he was Breach, and he was like, I'm Breach. I had gestational diabetes. And so my doctor, and he was Yoch. The boy was Yoch. And so the doctors were like, we need to get him out a little early. And so I looked on my portal for scheduling with Mount Sinai. And they were like, October 15th. And I literally was like, opening night is October 16th. I can't, I can't do that. I'm so sorry. So I called my doctor and I was like, Hey, Queen, hate to break it to you. I'm a little busy that day. Is there any way I could schedule my C-section for literally two days later? I was like, listen, if there's a medical emergency, and I like, have to do it on the 15th, I'll do it. But I was like, I've worked my tuchus off at Ragtime. I would love to be there for opening night to celebrate with everyone. And they were like, oh, yeah, no worries. We'll do the 17th.

[39:51] Alan Seales: Did you invite your doctor to opening night? You should have.

[39:54] Ellenore Scott: Should have. No, she did. She did tell me she was coming at some point. So I was like, okay, sleigh. But I was at opening night for Thwag Time. I was, I didn't think I was that big. And I looked back at pictures. I was like, oh my God. Oh my, I'm huge. So huge. In fact, that people at the opening night party were like, oh, my God, when are you due? And I was like, tomorrow. They were like that? What are you talking about? I was like, oh, no, 11am tomorrow. They're cutting him out. The sunroof. And so I said, it's a sunroof.

[40:24] Alan Seales: I've never heard that before.

[40:25] Ellenore Scott: It's a sunroof, babe.

[40:26] Alan Seales: That's terrible.

[40:27] Ellenore Scott: Where there isn't a sunroof. And so I was at the party. I remember we left. I was like, okay, my surgery's at 11. I can eat at 2. So I ordered 7th Street Burger at 1.30. I ate it. We went to sleep. I woke up and I had a baby.

[40:43] Alan Seales: And your son's birthday is two days before mine.

[40:46] Ellenore Scott: It is?

[40:46] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[40:46] Ellenore Scott: On October 18th.

[40:47] Alan Seales: Oh my goodness.

[40:50] Ellenore Scott: Libras.

[40:51] Alan Seales: Libras.

[40:51] Ellenore Scott: We balance it out.

[40:52] Alan Seales: We balance it out. Lovers.

[40:55] Ellenore Scott: Ford. I love that name.

[40:56] Alan Seales: Ford. So he is Richard Lee Everett IV.

[41:00] Ellenore Scott: Richard Lee Everett IV.

[41:02] Alan Seales: When I found, okay, my husband's name is Trey.

[41:04] Ellenore Scott: Right.

[41:04] Alan Seales: When we first started dating, I was like, Trey, Trey, Trey. And he was like, I have to tell you something. And I was like, what? And he said, I'm Richard Lee Everett III. I was like, oh, so you're a liar. So you've been lying.

[41:11] Ellenore Scott: Where did Trey come from?

[41:14] Alan Seales: So you're a liar. Apparently, Trey and Tripp are names for thirds.

[41:19] Ellenore Scott: Tripp, I get.

[41:20] Alan Seales: But Trey is Trey, Trey, Trey?

[41:22] Ellenore Scott: I guess it's-

[41:22] Alan Seales: Yeah, three.

[41:23] Ellenore Scott: Trey?

[41:24] Alan Seales: Trey. So he's Trey. So everyone calls him Trey. Everyone in his entire life, since he was born, he's been Trey.

[41:30] Ellenore Scott: So Ford IV.

[41:31] Alan Seales: IV, exactly. And no tea to any Ivans out there, but Ivan is the official fourth because of the IV.

[41:39] Ellenore Scott: So Ivan is the traditional name for the fourth or quattro or quad. And I was like, I just don't know if that's going to work for me.

[41:46] Alan Seales: Yeah, quad doesn't work as a name for me.

[41:48] Ellenore Scott: Especially as a dancer, I'm like, I'm just so, I just think of the muscle. So we were like, well, what if we do a spinoff of Four? And I was like, Ford. And I had been just doing ragtime. So I was like Henry Ford. And I was like, oh my God, I was like Harrison Ford, Tom Ford. I was like, boom. And Ford Everett is like a-

[42:06] Alan Seales: That's a name.

[42:07] Ellenore Scott: That's a name.

[42:08] Alan Seales: That's a powerful name.

[42:08] Ellenore Scott: That's right. I'm like, he's going to be a writer or like an actor, right?

[42:13] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[42:13] Ellenore Scott: Or a banker. He could do anything.

[42:15] Alan Seales: Dude, Ford Everett, that's a powerful name. I like that a lot.

[42:18] Ellenore Scott: Thank you so much.

[42:19] Alan Seales: That is very cool. The language you were talking about, there's a move in Hamilton that is, what'd you call it?

[42:26] Ellenore Scott: The Voltellinor.

[42:27] Alan Seales: Is there a titanic Eleanorism that's in there?

[42:32] Ellenore Scott: Is there?

[42:33] Alan Seales: I want to be able to go see these shows now and pull out things that are distinctly you.

[42:38] Ellenore Scott: I'm so glad you're saying that because it's actually reminding me that I do need to put this move into, or no, it's actually in the show. So I don't know if I'm allowed to cuss, so bleep it out as you wish. But I always like to put a bitch swerve into all of my shows. It's basically a pivot step that you have like a hand or your head kind of turns with it and you just like, bitch swerve. And you do that, right? I've basically put that into every show somewhere. It's in Little Shop. It was in Funny Girl. And so in Titanic, the background vocalists, we call them the BGBs, are performing with their mics a lot. And in one section of the show, they sing this like big note and then they bitch swerve. Boom. And that's me. That's all me.

[43:22] Alan Seales: All right. I got to look for this in everything you touch.

[43:24] Ellenore Scott: Thank you so much.

[43:25] Alan Seales: Now we're going to go back and watch like an archival of 2016 Cats.

[43:29] Ellenore Scott: To see if it's a bitch swerve.

[43:31] Alan Seales: Mastoffelees bitch swerve.

[43:32] Ellenore Scott: Mastoffelees. Macavity, macavity, bitch swerve.

[43:35] Alan Seales: Macavity definitely.

[43:36] Ellenore Scott: I looked for him, but he wasn't there. Okay. So as we start to wind down, let's play plot in 60 seconds. This is a little game. I got 17 musicals in front of me. You're going to pick from that list by giving me a number, one through 17, and then you tell me the plot to what you picked.

[43:54] Ellenore Scott: T-E.

[43:55] Alan Seales: In 60 seconds or less.

[43:57] Ellenore Scott: Oh my goodness. All right. Five.

[44:00] Alan Seales: Five is Mary Poppins. Go.

[44:02] Ellenore Scott: 60 seconds remaining. Mary Poppins is a musical about Mary Poppins. She is a nanny, but she's also magical. She has a really big bag and she can pull a lot of things out of that bag. And she likes to nanny these children. And these children are like, hey, queen, what are you doing? And she's like, look at my bag. I can pull an umbrella out of it and I can do this. And there's a chimney sweep guy and he comes around and they're like maybe in love, but they're also just friends. And then there's like a woman that feeds pigeons and she's there as well. But then they sing about Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, which is like a really long number, really long song. S-U-P-R, I don't actually know how to spell it. Anyway, they do that for a while. And then there's the Spoonful of Sugar and they do that too. And that's the musical Mary Poppins.

[44:40] Alan Seales: That's it. Spoonful of Sugar, the end. All right. Three standard closing questions. That was good. Three standard closing questions. The first one simply is what motivates you?

[44:49] Ellenore Scott: What motivates me is that you YOLO. YOLO. YOLO. You only live once unless you believe you come back. And if you do, right now you're only living once. So for me, it's like truly how can I make this day the best? How can I truly find what makes me happy? What makes my family happy? What makes the people I'm working around happy and how can I make their lives better and my life better? So that really is a driving motivation in that I love to take care of others and I'm also learning to take care of myself. So that is YOLO.

[45:25] Alan Seales: That's great. Okay. What advice would you give to your younger self and younger people listening now starting out down a similar path?

[45:28] Ellenore Scott: Yes. Young folks, you need to take care of your mental health and also know that the right thing will come. And you might hear a lot of no's and that no will lead to a yes. And sometimes a yes needs to come from within you. And so for me, like when I kept saying I want to be a choreographer and no one believed me, I had to believe myself first, which is why I started my own dance company and started a community of people that were like-minded who wanted to do and perform with me with my voice. And so I think making sure that yes, listen to your mentors and continue to train, but also no's will lead to a yes.

[46:04] Alan Seales: Okay. Last question. Hardest one. If you could only see one show for the rest of your life, but you can see it as many times as you want, what would you see?

[46:21] Ellenore Scott: Shoot. This is hard. I will have to say Little Shop. Little Shop of Horrors. And I don't know if I'm allowed to say it because it's my own version of the show, but it was my first show off Broadway that I got to do with Michael Mayer. And it is a perfect show. It is so funny. It's short. It's quick. The puppeteering is great. The songs are iconic that you want to sing with them. I would say Little Shop of Horrors. I enjoy The Urchins.

[46:51] Alan Seales: The Urchins are great girls. Yes, they are.

[46:52] Ellenore Scott: The Urchins are great. All right. Where can we find you online? Connect with you on social media.

[46:57] Ellenore Scott: Find me online at HelloEleanor, H-E-L-L-O-E-L-L-E-N-O-R-E. That's where you can find me.

[47:07] Alan Seales: Very choreographer of you to rhythm out your own username.

[47:10] Ellenore Scott: Why wouldn't I? That's right.

[47:12] Alan Seales: You can get me on, that was a good run up. You can get me on TikTok threads, Facebook. I don't know. I do this all the time. After how many episodes, you know where to find me. Leave a rating, leave a review. Thanks to welcomeintimesquare.com for the use of the studio and Eleanor. Thank you so much. This has been a lot of fun.

[47:32] Ellenore Scott: Thank you so much for having me. And it's truly been amazing drinking our sparkly drinks together.

[47:38] Alan Seales: That's right. Sam Pellegrino, you want to sponsor me? You know where to find me.

[47:42] Ellenore Scott: Get into it.

[47:44] Alan Seales: I got this blood orange is the bomb.

[47:46] Ellenore Scott: It's actually quite good.

[47:47] Alan Seales: This is quite good. And this is-

[47:49] Ellenore Scott: They should sponsor you.

[47:50] Alan Seales: They should sponsor me. You hear that? All right.

[47:52] Ellenore Scott: Mmm. Delicious.