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[0:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Ariana Grande, hi. I'm Cynthia Erivo, and you're listening to the Broadway Podcast Network. Visit vpm.fm to discover more. There's a cat over here. There's a cat over there. I'm the one good night. I'm the one who died.

[0:29] Speaker 2: Welcome to the wrong cat died. The podcast breakdown of the cats. Taffy. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have a special guest. She starred as Bumble Arena in the 2016 Broadway revival of cats. Welcome Christine cornersmith, and thank you for joining us. Thanks for having me. So I want to start with before you decide to join the cast. How familiar with were you with cats in

[0:53] Speaker 3: musical I was as familiar as a girl in musical theater. Who's you know, heard of cats, but I was by no means a cat's person,

[1:06] Speaker 2: not a fan. No, okay. Have you seen it before? I

[1:10] Speaker 3: had seen the VHS, and I saw it on tour when I was, I think I was eight, and I don't share this, but I fell

[1:18] Speaker 2: asleep. I fell asleep. They didn't a captain like attack you mid show? Well, I was way

[1:22] Speaker 3: up in the balcony, balcony. Yeah, I know they do actually, I went to the balcony, but yeah, so I have never shared that, because I'm so ashamed. I

[1:32] Speaker 2: have big issues with parents bringing children to the show.

[1:35] Speaker 3: Yeah, you know it's hard, and because there's not when you're a small child, you know, you don't have a lot to grasp onto. If you're way far in the back, you know, it's hard to follow it. So I definitely did. It's hard

[1:50] Speaker 2: to follow it as an adult. Oh yeah, it's hard to follow in general, yes, but it is. It is a little. It's a lot.

[1:58] Speaker 3: A lot is the correct word. Yes.

[2:03] Speaker 2: Okay, so you, so you became Bumble arena, who I don't actually have an episode for, so I

[2:09] Speaker 3: want to is so offended right now, but it's fine. It's because

[2:13] Speaker 2: I don't want Taylor Swift coming after me. Yeah. And so I want to, how would you describe her?

[2:22] Speaker 3: I would describe her as she is fiery, generous and confident, yeah, many other things. She's sort of seen it all, and I think she does have a more mature, motherly presence. But she, yeah, she's, she's also promiscuous, and, you know, she's been around the block a couple times. So, yeah, no, just because

[2:53] Speaker 2: she's one of the adult cats, right? I didn't even realize that there were Cats, kittens. All these different parts to this. There's way more important, yeah, so she's one of the adults, so basically, she's, but that's, that's where we get really confusing. What's the relationship with Demeter, mom, sister,

[3:08] Speaker 3: sister, best friend, okay, you know. And I think she's older, and she sort of looks out for Demeter, okay, you know, it's sort of her troubled friend that, you know, she has to calm down. She has to, you know, Park therapist, yeah, all those things. So

[3:24] Speaker 2: we'll get into that main song. But I want to hear like, what kind of training your character is in multiple songs and multiple dances. How, you know, what was that like? How'd you prepare for that? Especially since, I mean, you, you did a ton in this, in this play, yeah,

[3:39] Speaker 3: no, it's, it's, it's, it's definitely a dream role for me, because there's very few shows where you can truly dance, truly sing and truly act, you know, to kind of the peak of all three of those categories. So it was very exciting for me. But yeah, I mean, I had to one. I probably was in the best shape of my life, because you're crawling, moving non stop for over two hours, so it's intense, and you're singing while you're jumping and dancing. And so it's very demanding, but also very fulfilling.

[4:16] Speaker 2: And so leading into getting the role, did you watch previous performances besides the VHS tape. Or did you come in and want to, kind of do your own thing? I was

[4:27] Speaker 3: sort of, I'd say 5050, I wanted to be informed about, you know, I read the TS Eliot poems. I tried to sort of take it out of the context of cats the musical, and try to do things like, anytime I saw an actual cat, just like, really observe it and, you know, and then read the poems, and read up a little bit about Andrew Lloyd Webber and the making of it, and, you know, all of those things, and sort of really learn about the bare bones of it so that I could breathe my own. Life into it, you know? And I think because we were doing a revival, and because I got to sort of originate the revival version, yeah, I wanted it to be

[5:09] Speaker 2: my own, yeah. So there's a lot of people who have not seen the show, and they're preparing this for the movie, yes. So how would you explain the show to an outsider, especially since you did research with actual cats. Yes,

[5:26] Speaker 3: I always say that cats is about community bottom line, and it's about how we come together to survive. And I think that it's sort of it has withstood the test of time and became such a big hit because it is so universal and it's so relatable actually, even though it seems like it's not, but each cat has a different personality, and it's sort of, to me, like a dilation or expansion of the human inside of that cat, like, for instance, like Demeter, she's anxious and kind of has, like, a schizophrenic sort of energy, or, you know, kind of overly pent up energy, and she can just express that in the fullest form. Whereas, if you're a human and you're anxious, you can't, like, Twitch and do this and go, You know what I mean, but, oh, that's just an the anxious person that is stressed out about work that I just saw across the street in this other form, you know, interesting.

[6:33] Speaker 2: So say it's about survival, but they're gonna, we're gonna celebrate the one cat that dies at the end. I

[6:38] Speaker 3: mean, to me, it's sort of, it's, it's like, you know, and someone is goes to heaven and they're blessed, and, yeah, I think that that is more. I always saw it as symbolic. And like, does she really die, or does she just go on to the next layer, you know, the next life to

[6:57] Speaker 2: be reborn? Yeah, yeah. Okay. I want to ask a few questions about your character. Okay, in particular, so you sing the cavity song, yes. What's your take on the cavity? First,

[7:10] Speaker 3: I think that I the cavity, the cat,

[7:13] Speaker 2: the cat, not, not the not the actors. Yeah, we're talking purely about oh yeah, no, I do the song or the Oh no. I love this. I love the song. I hate the cat,

[7:21] Speaker 3: same, same, same. Well, no, I actually don't. It's a complicated relationship. I think that she has a very close relationship with Macavity, and she knows more about his whereabouts than any other cat. I think she's been burned by him. I think she was in a very sort of abusive and messed up relationship with this cat.

[7:49] Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's my question. I felt the same way with both your character and Demeter was an abusive relationship, and then all of a sudden the cavity leaves, and you sing this overly sexualized song about him?

[8:06] Speaker 4: thing that's like, messed up about it is, it's like

[8:11] Speaker 3: she, as I think some people can relate to in a twisted way. It's like, why do we love watching horror films? Or why do we there's a thrill that's associated with it. You know, it's like, as much as this relationship was dark and scarring and all of these things, there's a reason why she entered into it, because it was thrilling and it was sexy, and it was all of those things. So it's sort of then, you know, leaning into that like, oh so terrible, but this is why, you know,

[8:45] Speaker 2: it gives off a little 50 Shades of Gray vibe. Oh, for sure, yes, there's

[8:49] Speaker 3: some BDSM happening. There's a lot of things occurring. But I think it with Demeter, it sort of scarred her and and really frazzled her, whereas with bomb, she has been through a lot of stuff, so it sort of didn't faze her as much.

[9:07] Speaker 2: So how do you believe the relationship between bomb and Grizabella? Because there was a couple different conflicting rumors on it. Yeah,

[9:15] Speaker 3: I think that she has empathy for Grizabella, and she feels for Grizz. Because she was almost Grizz. I think she was like one step away from from sort of turning to the dark side, and one, you know, line of cocaine away, or like, whatever you know, she kind of almost turned to there. So I think she wants to protect the younger cats from her, and not as much in a judgmental way, but just in a you know, you really don't want to go down that road. And

[9:56] Speaker 2: so there's a rumor that Grizz is actually your character's mom. Yeah. And abandon you. Oh, so what is your take on that? Yeah, that is. So I'm here for state. I'm here to dig up the rumors for the people I

[10:09] Speaker 3: this is very exciting to revisit all this. Um, yeah, I I've never heard that one that could make sense, though, yeah. Um, man, I'm trying to articulate my thoughts on that, because I've never heard that.

[10:22] Speaker 2: Never heard it so clearly, it's not true. Wow, it's not been a note given to you. Yeah, it was never

[10:27] Speaker 3: a note given from like Angelo Weber himself or something. But, um, does he

[10:31] Speaker 2: did he give a lot of notes about the backstory and the family tree of God, um,

[10:37] Speaker 3: he sort of popped up a couple times during rehearsals, and a few times during previews, here and there. But he wasn't super embedded in our process, like Jillian Lynn, make sure, you know, amazing woman, she was there for like, the first three days and then, so they sort of came in and out of the process. So they weren't super involved. Trevor Nunn, though was heavily involved as our director,

[11:05] Speaker 2: Nothing, okay, wow. What about the relationship with rum tuck Tugger?

[11:11] Speaker 3: Oh, I think they're just like the classic, on again, off again. That's like the lighter version of her relationship with Macavity. With Macavity, it was like that, on and off again, but in a dark, not healthy way. With Tugger, it's fiery, it's playful, it's kind of messed up, but not in a as abusive way. I think so.

[11:35] Speaker 2: And I'm basing this off of the movie the VHS, because that's what I'm working off of with YouTube, because my memory is not that strong for the two times I've seen this, but your character in Tugger song in that movie is on the ground when he does his patented crotch thrusts, yes and yes. I'm wondering, was there ever any rehearsal like over enthusiastic crotch dust that had accidents here. Like, it's a very traumatic like, over the top part of this show, yes,

[12:07] Speaker 3: well, we that was one of the numbers that Andy blanken Bueller sort of reimagined. So that part actually didn't happen in the revival, and a lot of things were chained. That whole number was, was very different than the VHS. Well,

[12:22] Speaker 2: they had to bring it back from the wrapping. Street cat, right, yeah, redo some stuff they

[12:27] Speaker 3: made our revival Tugger was, was the classic, yeah? The Terence man, yeah, yes, yes, that, I think they learned from the wrapping Tugger from

[12:38] Speaker 2: the one or two years it went right. So no, so you didn't have any issues in your song. Then when in the New York version, no, no,

[12:48] Speaker 3: but, I mean, that was one of my favorite numbers, and Tyler Haines, who played from dumb tuggers like one of my favorite humans. And, you know, he just did such a great job in the show, and we had the best time. I mean, we were just so perverted and so sexual, but in like, the best way, we had a great time. How

[13:07] Speaker 2: do you feel about the fact that there's rumors that Tugger and Mr. Mrs. Are together? I

[13:12] Speaker 3: think that that sounds like that could have happened realistically. Yeah. Because, you know, there are even lyrics like Rum Tum Tugger is a curious beast, Rum Tum Tugger, you know, I think he's, I think Rum Tum Tugger is bisexual, yeah, for sure. And Mr. Feliz is gay, but, you know,

[13:31] Speaker 2: yeah, I mean the movie, he pulls out a rainbow scarf out of a cup, you know, as part of his magic, yeah.

[13:36] Speaker 3: So, you know, I think Rum Tum Tugger 5050, misto flees, probably mostly seas male cats,

[13:42] Speaker 2: so who knows. So you're part of that triangle, basically, though, yeah, yeah, okay, so if you could, since you know the musical, who was your taking your character out of it, who was your favorite cat and who was your least favorite cat, not actors, characters. Okay,

[14:07] Speaker 3: I mean, man, I, I, I love bomb ballerina, just because I always was attracted to her.

[14:18] Speaker 4: Let's see favorite cat, the white cat, beautiful, probably my favorite, and then maybe my least favorite.

[14:29] Speaker 3: Oh, that's very hard. I have a special place to my heart for all the cats.

[14:32] Speaker 2: Peter. The answer is, Peter Peter,

[14:35] Speaker 3: oh, is that Gus is first? I

[14:39] Speaker 2: don't even know who it is. I don't know why they named a cat Peter. Peter. It was added for something to do with guys.

[14:45] Speaker 3: I think that was so both current so GUR or Gus. And was there one other are in the Old Deuteronomy, are in the opening number as other cats? Yes. So. That Peter? Yeah. So I guess I'm not a big fan of Peter, because I never really met him or talked to him and he, you know, I want

[15:07] Speaker 2: to know who named him, unclear, because of all the other names who was just like, oh, we need a new cat. We're just gonna call him Peter.

[15:16] Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like, they kind of pulled that out of nowhere, yeah? Like, oh yeah. It's

[15:23] Speaker 3: so interesting, you know, yeah, corico Pat, tanta mile, bombalina, Peter, like, exactly, okay. You know, someone just gave up. Someone definitely gave up. And, you know, shame on them. But you know, Peter still lives. He lives on he lives in you. He lives in me.

[15:45] Speaker 2: So have you seen the movie trailer, and what's your take on the movie? Are you excited? Are you nervous? Are you happy?

[15:56] Speaker 3: I'm excited. I and I have I'm trying to go into it with an open heart and open mind. And, you know, I think that it's great that a new generation can have the same amount of confusion about cats as probably the, you know, children of the 80s and the children of the 90s did for this musical. I think it is hard because I was, you know, that was my life for so long doing the show. You know, you naturally get really attached to a certain design, a certain style, and a certain, you know, like I fell in love with Tyler's Rum Tum Tugger. So it's so hard for me to see anyone else in it, not because anyone else would be not amazing, just because I was so using Tyler, you know. So there's biases. I do wish that their i Their bodies looked weird. It kind of was scary. My My first impression was this feels, I feel scared. So that was my first impression. And then I was like, their tails were weird, and I wanted their costumes to have more like shape the

[17:04] Speaker 2: tails and noses got the most issues online. Needed

[17:13] Speaker 2: then Christopher, because I had him on for an episode, he was mad that they had dialog because you weren't allowed to speak. Oh, right, yeah. So he saw that in the trailer, and he immediately was mad at that, right? So he's cheating, yeah?

[17:25] Speaker 3: Cheater, cheater, pumpkin eaters. Yeah, I don't know. I feel like I don't want to say too much until I see it, and I'm probably gonna have to see it twice to really Yes, maybe even three to 456, times.

[17:46] Speaker 2: So before I get to my final question, which is like my thesis of this whole podcast, but I do want to know, what are you up to now? Where can we see you? What are you doing? Yes,

[17:55] Speaker 3: right now. So I just closed Kiss Me, Kate, actually, right across the street not that long ago in the summer, and I've just been doing like little gigs here and there. So I worked on a little segment for John Oliver that TV show, which was super fun, and just kind of doing a bunch of little things right now, teaching and concerts and stuff like that. And I don't have, like, another sort of the next, like, big gig yet, I'm trying to be strategic about my next move. I think, yeah, so, yeah,

[18:35] Speaker 2: I gotta get to my final question. Okay, can't wait. Here we go. The real question, which is, I have spent multiple episodes arguing that Grizabella was the wrong cat to die at the end of the play, who do you think is the right cat to die? Could be your character, or do you think it should be Grizabella? And then I want to hear why I

[18:56] Speaker 3: should have known you were going to ask this question. So how dare I come in so ill prepared. I think that it could be any of the adult cats, any cat that has, I think not that. I think Jenny, any dots should die. But a good thing,

[19:16] Speaker 2: though, like this is, it's a good thing. I call it victory, because I look at this like it's a competition show.

[19:22] Speaker 3: Yeah, I think if it weren't Grizabella, either Jenny, any dots or Gus, yeah, I would probably be one of those two. One of the cats that I feel has lived their life and given back. You know, I feel like you sort of have your stages of life where, like, you're growing up, and then you, then you're really selfish, and then you sort of flip it, and then you have kids, and so then you're selfless, and then you, you know, like you sort of someone who, I feel a cat that have gone, that has gone through the stages of life. So it would be either Gus

[19:58] Speaker 3: I mean. Was also like, how much longer is this cat? Did? Did say? He

[20:06] Speaker 2: said that he thought that his cat didn't have another life to live, and so his ending was like, the end, and so took himself out of the running. Yeah, that was his interpretation.

[20:18] Speaker 4: Oh, dang Yeah. And I think Grizabella does have another life to live. Absolutely new life has begun, yeah,

[20:30] Speaker 2: to listen. Oh, okay, okay, that's the whole point. And if this was the last episode, I would, I would tell but, you know, I've got a couple episodes after this. Okay, I gotta tune in. No tune in. Subscribe. But I think there are some front runners. Okay, I look forward, yeah. I mean, I'm a big personally, well, I I've become the love mcavity song and whole everything about it, but he can't be the one to to win. So I'm a big rum tuck Tucker, Mr. Police fans. I loved Mungo Jared rumble teaser song, and then the whole dance cart, the the dual cartwheel like, I can't imagine how many children got hurt trying that on

[21:06] Speaker 3: a ramp. Yeah. Like those two they I think those two have the hardest track in the show.

[21:12] Speaker 2: Oh, absolutely. 100 it's also one of the hardest to get out of your head when it's stuck in your

[21:16] Speaker 4: head. Oh yeah. Oh god yeah. No, no. Thank you amazing.

[21:22] Speaker 2: Thank you so much for being here. How can we find you on social media,

[21:33] Speaker 2: Well, thanks for being here and listeners. Thank you for listening to this bonus episode with Christine cornersmith on the wrong cat died the podcast breakdown with a cat statue. Fee to follow along, you can subscribe on Apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts, follow us on Twitter and Instagram at the wrong cat died. Or check out our website, the wrong cat died.com. You.