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[0:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Ariana Grande. Hi, I'm Cynthia Erivo, and you're listening to the Broadway Podcast Network, visit vpm.fm to discover more.

[0:20] Speaker 2: to

[0:30] Speaker 3: the wrong cat die the podcast breakdown of catastrophe. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have another amazing guest. He was a in the cats chorus and covered Old Deuteronomy in the third and fourth us tours of cats. So welcome Austin, Jan, and thank you for joining

[0:47] Speaker 3: am very excited I'm starting to talk to more of your cast, and I have talked to a lot of the 2016 Broadway revival and the most recent tour. So I've always started with the question about you know, your introduction to cats, but I think it's very different for your, your tour, where you were kind of, like, right in the middle of the craziness cats, yeah. So what was, tell me about the 80s with cats? Like, what? Like, I heard, it's, it was just, it was the show, like, it was the thing that was all the buzz to be, to be a part of,

[1:19] Speaker 4: yeah, yeah. It was definitely the Hamilton of today. I mean, everybody wanted to do cats, and for me, it was ironic, because I'm a singer, I'm not a dancer, I'm a singer who moves well. So for me to get into a show like cats was just phenomenal. I do remember the the audition, three or four times the callbacks, I didn't have to dance, I didn't have to do any movement, because they were looking at me immediately for Old Deuteronomy, again, of which I was shocked because I wasn't going to go to the audition. I felt that there was nothing in it for me. It was my voice teacher who convinced me to go. He says, You have the voice for Oh, Deuteronomy, I said, but I don't have the right size, and I'm not tall enough, because they can pad you. They could put you on, put you in heels. So reluctantly, I went. When I got there, there were 60 or so guys in the room waiting to go in, guys much bigger than me, much taller than I was, and and I thought, I'm defeated. Well, my motto is just go in and show them what you got. They would come out one at a time and be disappointed. And then finally, I went in, and then they I walked out and all the guys waited around because they were shocked too that I was there to audition for Old Deuteronomy. And I said I got a call back, and they couldn't believe it, neither did I. I called my agent immediately and said I got a call back for cats. Called my voice teacher, said they want me to learn this music. You know, I've got to learn. I want to know it by heart. So I went back. They drilled me on it in different keys, test my stamina. And then the next call back was at a theater to see how big the voice filled the theater. And by this time, by this point, I was just my nerves were all over the place, because this was the first big show that I had gotten this far in, and I had auditioned for many, many shows, but for a show of this caliber, and to get that close, it was very nerve wracking. So went home, and my agent called me and says, come down and and so I did, and they had called her already and told her that I'd gotten the show. And so she threw a big surprise party for me. And then it all started from there. I got into rehearsals and saw all of these, these dancers in leotards and the leg warmers. The leg warmers were big, big in the in the 80s, and a lot of them, I think it was their first show. Also, they were younger than than I was, and not by by much, but, you know, sitting back and watching them learn this number, and us learning how to be cats with a rope tied around our waist, and the movements with our hands and and our our eyes and our face, our our homework was to as we walked home, is to look at every cat that we could, watch their movement. So we were like zombies. We'd come back into rehearsal the next day, and everyone was sort of doing their own, their own thing. It was sort of ethereal, but the fact that we actually. Actually were in the show, and then once it got on the road, it was a hit. It was one of the most hit national tours. We played all over the US. That was just phenomenal. And it was a crowd pleaser indeed. Yeah,

[5:20] Speaker 3: I mean, you sold out within hours, you know, as I've read more about it, just everywhere you went, and, yeah, it was really the first time that that cats got into other cities, like, you know, kind of the main city. So you're, you're bringing this craziness and chaos around the around the country, yeah. So I love hearing about the audition, and and just in general about that process and not being the, I guess, the the height, or what you would expect for that role, it is kind of, it's an interesting role. It's, you know, you're, you kind of come in later, and you've got this massive, massive, massive costume, I know, in the revival, and a couple other ones that you stayed on stage in their mission. I don't know if that, if they if you got to do that, or I did to do that, yeah. So what was, I guess that's, I would love to talk about that, because what is that like, especially you did a couple outdoor theaters on your tour, and how much that, to me, was a I thought it was a mistake when I saw it. I was like, that's a prop. And I was like, No, that's actually a human. That's actually somebody, a performer, staying there. What was the reaction like, did you have people coming up on stage? Like, this is pre selfie, you know, cell phone selfie era, right?

[6:30] Speaker 4: Right? Well, it depends. It depended on the theater, if the if there was a bridge across the passer Ella, where the orchestra was because of insurance reasons. They didn't allow people to come up. But if the orchestra was say, let's say under the stage, and they were piping the sound out, they would allow people to come up and, and one particular time I'll never forget it. There was an older lady who came by and, and they would sort of, you know, keep them flowing so they wouldn't stand there and just stare at you like you're a mon because you couldn't, you really weren't supposed to look at them. You're supposed to just be there and be this, this deity, more or less. And, but I had to look down at her, because I could see tears rolling out of her eyes, and I thought, Oh my gosh. And I was beginning to get emotional, and I thought, I can't do this, because I have to sing this recitative in a few minutes, and I've got to keep my composure. Well, she apparently her cat had died recently, and her cat looked just like, oh, Deuteronomy was a big, gray, fluffy cat. So she looked up, she was just like, my, my kitty fluffy, and she just stood there and bawled. The ushers had to come and usher her off. And I, and I was welling up. It was myself, and I thought, I've got to I've got to hold back. I've got to hold back. So I kept my composure. But things like that, kids who were just in awe, just staring at you in disbelief. You know that they wanted to touch you, but they weren't allowed to. But you could see the joy on their face. First of all, to get to come on that stage, to look at the garbage and and look at the rake on the stage and the tire, and try to figure everything out. So that was gratifying, you know. But the horrible part was that sitting there with all of the lights and stuff your vocally, you would start to dry up. And the song that Deuteronomy had to sing to open the second act was the moments of happiness, which is a recitative. It's it's very powerful, and it's very soft, and and, and it's sort of wordy, and it's easy to mix up the word. So I would try not to, in my mind think of the words before, because then I would panic. So I had to think of other things and just let it naturally come out.

[9:12] Speaker 3: Wow. You probably just picked, like, one point in the in the crowd, and just like, stared at it for you. It sounds, you know, it sounds like your experience with that was so much more pure than what I got to witness, which was just a bunch of people getting a social media post, yeah, in 2016 so it's kind of, it's cool that that's been a tradition that's kind of stuck set forward. I was, I was so confused. I don't think I've ever seen another show that's done something like that.

[9:38] Speaker 4: Yeah, well, it made the audience a part of the show, even from the from the get go, from the beginning, when, when the we would run out into the audience for green eyes and and scare people that they felt encompassed into the show, and depending, again, on the theater the proscenium, how far it would go. Out that the audience could be a part of the scenery, like it was on Broadway. But most of our theaters were so huge, it was, we couldn't do that. But they got, they got the feeling,

[10:12] Speaker 3: yeah, it was, you know, one of the first shows to kind of break the fourth wall. So I want to go back to not the audition, but when you get the role, and I know that you went through your cat school and you had your racks of training, you were told a lot about your character. You were basically given a backstory, and that's part of the part of the show that I've spent most time I was talking about the storyline and the characters plot. What were you told about Old Deuteronomy, about his character, his backstory, and then his relationships to the other cats. Well,

[10:44] Speaker 4: Deuteronomy had lived many, many, many, many years, and had gone through so much in his life that he gained all of this wisdom and not necessarily power, but everyone looked up to him because he was a wise old soul, that he basically became the leader of the tribe because of his wisdom. So he was the glue to the tribe that everyone looked to for answers, if they were happy, if they were sad, when Deuteronomy showed up. They felt comfort, comfort, and they felt safe. So Deuteronomy would always come in with this, with his head held high, his chest out. You know, the strength that everyone would would rejoice the first entrance for Oh, Deuteronomy is when he everyone is wondering, where is he? And all of a sudden he appears, and it's monkey strapped that sees him, and the tribe gets excited, because Deuteronomy, He's coming. He's coming. He's going to speak. He's going to speak. So there's a rejoice. So he gets there, then now the party can begin. Deuteronomy is here. Let's enjoy life. So that's, that's was, that's my take on it,

[12:11] Speaker 3: okay? And so you're essentially the making the choice, right? Kind of has been given to you, right? Do you feel you even have a chance at being the jellical choice?

[12:25] Speaker 4: I feel that I already had that chance, you know, and I chose not to take it because I felt that other people needed it more that just by being that was enough, because it was a comfort to everyone else. So choosing someone else to go to the heavy side layer was was gratifying to me, because anyone in that tribe could be the chosen one, and why was Chris and Bella the chosen one?

[13:07] Speaker 3: Oh, and that's what I've spent a lot of time debating, yeah, a lot of and I think what I'm most fascinated by older me is I always looked at him as a judge, the judge, judge, jury and everything in between. But the more I've kind of talked to people, it's you're not on stage for half the performances, right? So how do you judge all these cats and kittens that you didn't get to witness? Is it because you're just an all knowing being and you were just it's

[13:34] Speaker 4: the wisdom you Deuteronomy knows every cat by their actions on what they do. So he like, like a mother knows their child. A mother knows when you're lying. You know she can hear it in your voice. She can see it in your action. So Deuteronomy knows that. You know, I look at the for me, I look at the tribe, and it look at all of the different cats, and I sort of reference them to people, in a sense, where as you have the white cat who is quiet and demure but strong and A wannabe and wants to prove it. And then Tamil Brutus, who is the young one that's eager, I can do this. I can do that. And Deuteronomy is the ones that pulls everyone back. That's like in your time, let it grow, you know? So he can sit back and say, I'm good with this. Go out and do your thing, but I know who you

[14:40] Speaker 3: are. And so, yeah, you don't even need to watch a couple. No. Yeah, interesting. Okay. What other things were you told about relationships to other cats as Old Deuteronomy? Because I think it's like, is the father of, it seems like it's consensus, he's the father of monkeys trap and talk.

[14:57] Speaker 4: Yeah, well, he's, he. He's wanting Marcus strap to to learn to be a leader, you know, because there will be that that day when Deuteronomy will not be there. So there has to be someone that everyone can look up to that has that authority to say no or yes and to protect so that's why you see monkey strap by Deuteronomy side, quite a bit Deuteronomy. He proved himself to Deuteronomy. Now Deuteronomy says, Prove yourself to me, you know, to take over. So, yeah, that's, that's basically Okay. So

[15:41] Speaker 3: do you feel, I mean, I guess I'm kind of, I'm interested in hearing all the other pieces. Like, is mccaviddy, your brother? Is there other wives, girlfriends, like or is that just something that just, you know, you don't, you don't think too much as much about when you're performing. Don't really

[15:56] Speaker 4: think that much about it. Mccavity is he's, I say, a person who was in the tribe that went astray and went to the bad side, and therefore always has been jealous of, oh, Deuteronomy, and didn't like what Deuteronomy, because everyone looked up to Deuteronomy, and he thought, Why? Why? So therefore he he arranged Deuteronomy to be kidnapped, to be to be gone, but it was the powers of misto police that brought him back, because Deuteronomy will go only go when he feels that it is time to go, no one else can make that decision for him.

[16:47] Speaker 3: So if you're Old Deuteronomy and you're it's next year, grizzabel is out of the picture, right, right? What's happened in the Jellicle Tribe next year and next? Well,

[16:58] Speaker 4: I the way I look at it is that someone else would be chosen. The only reason why Grizabella was chosen, Grizabella is like the the cat or the person. Is using myself as an example. You come from a small town, and you have your tribe of people. You move to New York. That's Hollywood. You go there and you become somebody. But something happened, and you became tattered, and maybe you had got a little too big, therefore, and so no one wanted to be around you. So you want to come back home. So when Grizabella comes, tries to get back in, into the the tribe the other cats can sense this, something about her that wasn't wrong. It's Deuteronomy that says, Hold on. This can happen to you. This is a this is someone who left, went out to see the world, and it didn't work out. And we must always welcome them back. So therefore, you know, I choose her to be reborn, to come back to a new life, you know, and I don't I next year for the Jellicle Ball. Personally, I don't think that there really has to be anyone chosen each year, is just whenever it's time for it to happen. I

[18:27] Speaker 3: love that analogy. As someone who moved from Not, not necessarily a small town, but from Indiana to New York, so when she comes back the first time and she's still shunned, is that like a Thanksgiving visit? Like, how is that fit in this analogy? Like, is it, you know, she comes home and everyone's because everyone kind of hates her in that first, oh, yeah,

[18:46] Speaker 4: yeah, you know, it's like, Who is this person she's got, she's got this fur on, she's got these hills on, and this is this makeup that's running down her face. You know, who is, who is this person? And a lot of them didn't really know who she was. It was Deuteronomy that conveyed to them she was in the tribe, you know. She's was, she's an older person, you know. And she did her thing. Now she wants to come back home, bring her back in. So they this, they got a taste of it. It was only in this, in the second act, when she walks in, because they were still a little hesitant, you know, and when Deuteronomy is sitting there, and he he raises his chest and he holds his hand out to say, wait. And it just gives Grizabella a chance to walk in and and and to prove herself to to basically say, I'm sorry. Give me a chance. I love you. And, and then syllab and the white cat embraces her, and it becomes a whole, a big family again, after she's taken up to the heavy side of the hair.

[19:59] Speaker 3: So in that again, I love this analogy, and this is why I like talking about the shows different version every time I talk to somebody, right, which is always very different from the version that I interpreted myself. In this scenario, though, does the town not get upset that they're old thespian, leader of Gus, or they're kind of young, up and coming fun, you know, rocking the town Tugger. All these people not get picked,

[20:34] Speaker 4: yes, to a certain extent. But then again, no one should be Shun, you know, just because you went astray, it's the acceptance, you know, it's the obvious acceptance. Gus the theater, cat, Grizabella, Rum Tum Tugger, they all be okay. They're they're having a wonderful, life. Chris a Bella wasn't so much, so she needs to get that wonderful life back.

[21:06] Speaker 3: Isn't walking this is me just asking questions to try to convince you that I'm right. More than isn't walking her back to her town, though, wasn't she better off spending a year there? You know, like not being the choice right away, come back home, live with your kittens that you probably potentially abandon that are now welcoming you back. Like, I feel like she still needs some time at home. Yeah.

[21:28] Speaker 4: You know, a lot of people would think that way, but my take on Deuteronomy is like, Why should she have to wait? You know, why should you have to wait? Or you have to wait, if this happens to you, why can't we just forgive right now and forget about it? You know? What

[21:48] Speaker 3: about, if you're What about the precedent you're setting for Victoria? What's now stopping Victoria from going to New York, all my crazy life, coming back?

[21:58] Speaker 4: I think Victoria will. Go to New York, or should go to New York. Victoria has, I mean, she's, she's the white pure cat. But how pure is she?

[22:09] Speaker 3: Well, based on the dance that I saw during the joke Cabal, it's not that pure.

[22:17] Speaker 3: exactly, okay, I see I like this again. I like this theory. So my argument's always been that it shouldn't be grizzabella, that because I watched it as a singing competition, purely a visual of you're a judge, like an American, I don't X Factor any of those versions. And if I watch individually, cat by cat by cat, that wasn't my favorite. It was amazing. I mean, the performance memory is an amazing performance every time, but I was more entertained by other characters throughout See,

[22:45] Speaker 4: and that's the fascinating thing I think about cats, because there's so much going on and no one's going to look at at one cat all the time. You're look you choose a cat who really gets to you. It's like, I really love this cat. You know, skimble Shanks, you know, the orange cat. He's so fun. And you know, your your eye wants to go there. And just the little things that you're doing on stage, you know, you find your niche and and you really develop that character. Because you're, you are trying to prove to do Deuteronomy that you are worthy. But then you get it. You get it.

[23:21] Speaker 3: And again, that's kind of why I'm so fascinated by because I watched it as if you're the judge. And then the more I've watched the show or learned about I'm like, You're not even watching half of them. You're just like, Yeah, I don't even need to see these. Like, I know they're not going to get picked I'm sitting there like, I thought tuggers performance was great. I thought Mustafa's performance was great, yeah. But and then the more I've argued it, the more I've argued that Gus should be the choice.

[23:42] Speaker 4: Yeah, well, Gus the old theater cat wise and, you know, about to die. But then he shows you know what he was when he was younger, you know. And then again, even though he's old and feeble, he never lived the life of Grizabella, of leaving that private tribe and becoming so tattered and destitute more or less that he didn't need to be welcomed back in because he, he's there, you know, and he's, He's almost up there, I think, with Deuteronomy, as far as his wisdom, because he's a, he's a strong person that you, that you do want to listen to, because he's a great storyteller.

[24:34] Speaker 3: So if you were so what I'm hearing, which, again, I kind of love this, and I'm, poking mostly at it and picking at it just because it's fascinating to me. So I'm hearing that you you don't think there's a jolly cool choice every year, and mostly it's because someone needs to kind of leave experience life outside the tribe and come back, which means you're probably not gonna have all that many Jellicle choices unless there's a bunch of. Grizzabella is out there that we're just not introduced to in our two and a half hours,

[25:05] Speaker 4: right, right? And, you know, and anyone can become a Grizabella at any given time, you know, because as the kid, as the kittens grow up, and Victoria Goes to Hollywood, or rum Tugger Goes to Hollywood and and live this life of purgatory or whatever, and and comes back in then, to me, you have proven that you're worthy, that you you are able to weather the storm out there, you know, and stay strong and not be defeated in this sort of in a physical manner, kept your mind and knew where to come to be reborn again.

[25:51] Speaker 3: Now humor me if you, I know you've done hundreds of performances here. Say you, you've obviously know this way too well. If you were asked if they if you just said, Hey, look, Trevor non Andrew lover, sometimes goes like, look, we're thinking about a different ending. Who would you pick? Or would you still defend Grizabella to the to the end of time? Who would I pick to go to the heavy sight layer? Wow, maybe nobody.

[26:15] Speaker 4: It is such a high of being on that tire and singing that last song, you are Moses up there. So I, personally, I don't think I would choose anyone I would, you know, walk on that tire, let it raise and hold my hand out and sing that last song, because everyone is pose poise, and they are looking at you, at that, that message, and you feel like, God is just amazing. That's That's awesome.

[26:54] Speaker 3: I really appreciate you humoring with me. I love your theory of like the left and came back and, you know, different things is, I think I that's how I interpreted it, but in a different sense of like, that's not that her being Welcome back home. It was more of like she's just picked. You know, it's like this kind of came back, she's saying her thing, and got picked. I want to, I want to pivot a little bit. I want you, can you tell me a little bit about the fundraiser? I would love to hear a little bit about the fundraiser from your tour, but then also what you did in most recently this past October. Oh, yeah, no, you were pretty involved in there, right? I

[27:28] Speaker 4: was, I it was actually my idea to, yeah, it was, I was one morning, I was watching the news, and I, you know, was the height of all of this and, and, and I thought, wow, we wouldn't it be nice just to get the cast back together, just to just for fun. It wasn't even thinking of a fundraiser at the time, just to do the opening number, because everyone sings it. So I called Jonathan and and he said, first he was like, Yeah. He thought, You know what, we should do it as a fundraiser. And I went, Oh my gosh, that would be amazing. So I got on my computer, I contacted as many cast members as possible to see if they would be interested. It was immediate, yes, yes, yes. And it took us a few weeks to put everything together, but after we did, and a lot of people, I can't sing anymore, and I I can't do this. And I said, Oh, that muscle memory will come right back, and they all sound wonderful. We were one of the, I think we were the first national tour to start the equity fight AIDS on on tour, we did the Michael Bennett benefit. And also, what's her name, Lily Tomlin. We did a benefit with with her, and raised lots of money. And we were much younger then, so therefore we could do a show, get out of makeup, go to the place and do a show at 11 o'clock for about an hour or so and sleep, get up and do another show. So it was, it was that was fun. So I knew from what we did back then that we could pull together and do this again. And it's, it's been a success. Thank you. Broadway Cares,

[29:19] Speaker 3: yeah, and I mean, I got to watch it. I talked to Jonathan and a couple other people when it, when it first came out, and it's still, you know, people still can donate. So we will include a link in the description here. But right, I loved it. You know, I've heard more and more about your experience in the 80s doing that, and it's, you know, not only did you raise a ton of money, but you were learning additional numbers in between your shows and doing them on the off nights and still filling theaters, raising, I mean, just a ton of money. I mean, it's really an incredible story to kind of bring back, and then being able to kind of bring it into today, you know, with with everything going on, to be able to support another. Cause, yeah,

[30:00] Speaker 4: we were, gosh, thinking, thinking about national tours back in the 80s. I mean, it was the it was top notch. And to say in a few words, we were spoiled, and, you know, they took good care of us. We had a we could get a massage at night after we got home, they paid masseuse to come in and to give us a massage, which the dancers needed it or and then some of our cat, I think two of our cast members, started doing it. So they started paying them. So I look at the dancers, you know, they after doing the ball, learning cats. And then, while we're doing the other benefits, going to the studio at midnight and learning other numbers, you know, I would go for moral support, because I would just, I just had to sing, so I'd wait my turn. And if you, if you ever get a chance, I don't know if Jonathan still has a video of it. It's so worth seeing. It was put together so well and and the theater was packed, you know, because you say cats, you put cats with anything back in the 80s boom, people would be there, except for those who thought we were a baseball team. The show jackets was who thought you were a baseball we were when we were touring, you know, we on the bus. We would stop at malls to eat or whatever, and we all had our show jackets on, you know. And there are the different types of show Jack, because there's the wool jacket with the leather sleeve, there's the cotton jacket that looks more like a baseball jacket. So I had one of those on, and I was walking by and and this man says, cats, which baseball team? I said the Broadway. So he knew nothing about cats. And that was that was exciting to a sense that, wow, there's someone actually who doesn't know about cats, but they associated it with baseball. So that's

[32:09] Speaker 3: fascinating. I haven't heard that before. There's a little bit of a, you know, as a sports fan, I think, like, I'm kind of the reverse. I'm probably one of the few people that like, generally, now knows cats, but, but it's the reverse. You kind of either know cats or, you know, baseball. It's not a huge mix in that Venn diagram there in between. But, so where, where would you, where would you think the cats baseball team is from? Haha,

[32:33] Speaker 4: I would say Yonkers. Yonkers.

[32:37] Speaker 3: Yeah, I like it. Isn't there a Yonkers? There's, I think there's a minority theme. I

[32:41] Speaker 4: think there is, yeah, I want to do a little bit

[32:46] Speaker 3: of a rapid fire, but before we do that, I would love to hear, did you see the most recent movie I did? What did you think

[32:53] Speaker 4: I I'm one of those people that sort of gives, gives things the benefit of the doubt. But it was so different and and I to be nice, it was interesting.

[33:10] Speaker 3: Yeah. So I think the question I have is, I've talked a lot about, I did a review for and I went to see it when open, but someone who was in the show, and it's 20 years later, you know? Yeah, it's multiple, almost 30 years later. Did seeing the movie kind of bring back any of your like, did it? Did you go see it with other past cast members? Like, was there a little bit of that, the nostalgia of sorts, even though it was very different

[33:38] Speaker 4: for you? Well, I sort of didn't know what to expect, and I had, I wanted to go with other cast members. There are a couple of musicians that bought homes up here, also that I wanted to go with who did the show, but they chose not to see it. And so I decided, well, you know what? Let me just go and with an open mind and just watch this and see what I get out of it for myself. First of all, I thought it was they humanized it too much, you know, it's and that I didn't like. And then I just, I didn't like the take on some of the music, you know, the Tugger or the Grizabella, the way that they presented the song, it became too modernized. It, it just, it took them to me, it took the meat out of the show. It, you could it broke the plot down a little bit better that you can understand. But then that that makes it too easy. I think TS Eliot wants you to think what to think about these characters that you can come up with. What you think, you know, yeah,

[34:53] Speaker 3: yeah. I think you know as the more I've kind of, I've watched, I watched in theaters, and then I try to watch it again. Try to make. Someone, my family, sit down and watch it. And they could only get halfway through, yeah, and then they, then they said that we, if we have staff. But the more I've thought about it, is they, I think they just put too much money into making this a big production, versus staying in a lane of like, we don't need all the no one needs to tell a story. Just stick to the traditional much, you know, a well put together version of what people expect to see on stage, but not on stage. And you would have had a fairly successful show with half the cost of production and still had a lot of, I think, a lot more people that enjoyed it, versus what ended up happening where now everyone's kind of distanced themselves

[35:40] Speaker 4: from it, yeah? To me, it just, it didn't come across as a theater piece. It came across as a movie set, which is, I guess that's what they were going for. But this is cats, you know.

[35:54] Speaker 3: So anyway, yeah, I mean, it's a baseball that's like one of the best, exactly. So let's do some some rapid fire, a couple quick things. Just about, I love to ask these types of questions. So my first one is knowing. So I know you've said a couple times, not more of dancer or singer, suspend all if you could do any of them, if you just had the ability immediately, which character would you want to play? Like? Which trek would you love to do? If you just, like, I'm totally capable, forget vocal range or anything like that. I can do anybody. Who would you want to go performance? Tugger. Tugger. You want to go out there and just rock and roll? Oh, rock and roll. What is your favorite song? My

[36:37] Speaker 4: favorite song in the show? In the show? Yes, I would say skimble shanks.

[36:43] Speaker 3: Skimble shanks. Interesting. And what about it? That like, what does he love about it?

[36:48] Speaker 4: It was moving, exciting, and you've got this big orange cat that comes out that's, you know, telling his story, and he's upbeat, and everyone's enjoying it, and it's sort of bouncy,

[37:03] Speaker 3: yeah, yeah, that's, it's a, it's a super fun number. I think it's a number I personally misinterpreted the most, as I like, tried to break it down, and then I got called out by by Colin, who was in the revival in 2016 and told me all the things I got very, very wrong in my interpretation. But I did enjoy, I think part of the reason I didn't enjoy as much as when they make that, I love that they started to make the train, you know, I kind of build this thing out of the set, and then they flash light into the audience, yeah? And it hit me. It's always really angry, because I, like, couldn't see. Oh, yeah, so I think I'm, I'm scarred from that, that particular What about your favorite and least favorite character in the show?

[37:51] Speaker 4: Favorite character would be Gus. Least favorite character would be alanzo.

[38:03] Speaker 3: And then my last Rapid Fire question, if you were to be quarantined with one of the characters, stuck at home, oh God, which one are you? Which one are you stuck with?

[38:15] Speaker 4: I am stuck with. I'd say I'm stuck with tumble Brutus.

[38:20] Speaker 3: Tumble Brutus, I've not had anyone say that one, what's your answer for that? He was

[38:33] Speaker 4: Well, the character, let's see, wow. Again, I would say tumble Brutus, because he was, he was funny. He's, he's, he's a strong young cat that's, you know, that's going to see the world, you know. And he would, he would make me laugh constantly.

[38:50] Speaker 3: You know, what I found most interesting is, I've asked this question to a lot of people, is it's very situational. And so it's like, the people who are in New York in small apartments are like, Who could I spend in the small apartment with, yeah, and then people who are out, and they're like, oh, who would have who'd take care of me, or who would be fun, or who is this? And so it's like, there's, there's been no consistency in answers. Oh, wow. It's been great. What you know? Where else can we find you? What else are you working on? How can we find you on social media?

[39:19] Speaker 4: Oh, wow, I done. I'm doing sort of a lot of things. Last two summers ago, I worked at glimmer glass. It's an opera house up here where I live. And we, we did a production of Show Boat. I had done the national tour with Hal Prince years ago with Susan Stroman, and also did it in London. And then I left, when I left cats, I went to Germany and did Angela Webber Starlight Express, learned that in German, and eight hours of Roller Skating and and that was a phenomenal show and a phenomenal set that's still going on. They have since taken. Out Deuteronomy, and now they have mama. And the mama is the original pearl on Broadway Reba rice. So that was interesting. But here in Albany area, I I do a lot of commercials. You know, I play politicians and doctors and things like that. And 2015 I did a movie called moving mountains that start Teresa Russell, and it's a true story on coal mining in West Virginia. And I played a living legislator, Arlie Johnson, who helped get things passed because there's still things going on in that state. And one reason why I got the movie is the movies about a girl that I went to high school with who went to West Virginia, and she thought of me, that I reminded her so much of Arlie I had to audition and all that stuff and screen test and and I ended up getting it. I've since become a chocolatier. I have my own company. I have a website. I just open a store here. One foot is always in the in the door as far as theater, and I'll never leave it completely. But I found other avenues to sort of keep going and keep my life exciting,

[41:21] Speaker 3: and what you have to share the website so we can,

[41:32] Speaker 3: the ostentatious.com I'll link that as well so you can, you can order a do ship across the country. I certainly do amazing. Well, thank you so much for for spending the time with you today, and kind of bringing me back to this, you know, this kind of crazy time of cats when it was, you know, the the Hamilton, you know, it's fun to kind of hear from from your cast and your company, all about what that experience was like, since it's so different than almost even what it's been today. And, you know, 40 years later, yeah,

[42:00] Speaker 4: had 40 years. That makes me really old.

[42:12] Speaker 3: Thank you everyone else for listening to this episode with awesome jatan on the wrong cat died the podcast breakdown the cast atrophy to follow along. You can subscribe on Apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts, follow us on Twitter and Instagram at the wrong cat died. Or check out our website, the wrong cat died.com. You.