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[0:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Ariana Grande. Hi, I'm Cynthia Erivo, and you're listening to the Broadway Podcast Network, visit vpm.fm to discover more.

[0:29] Mike Abrams: the wrong cat died the podcast breakdown of the Cast session. Fee, I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have another amazing guest. It was Bill Bailey in the original West End production of Cats joining in the 90s. So welcome Damian Delaney, and thank you for joining me. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to have you. I think you know, Bill Bailey is an interesting character because he's been renamed. But I also, you know, this was the run of cats in the West End that went for 20 plus years. So yeah, I know you joined kind of midway through, but I'd love to hear what you know, I always ask everyone, was it the 1998 movie that got you kind of into cats? But you you predate that, so I would love to hear kind of like, where your history of cats was before you were cast in the show. And

[1:12] Speaker 2: I'm originally from Ireland. So I'm from Cork in south of Ireland, and I saw the very first UK tour in 1989 which came to Dublin. So I was 14, then when I saw the show, and I think I was hooked on it. After that, I think I broke the cast of chord and it could set the hands of it from saying it too much. And then I went to college in London when I was 18, and in my second year of college, I auditioned for the show, and they, the feedback was they they were interested, but they wanted me to finish out my training. So throughout my second year, I still carried on audition for the show because they would do cash changes every six months, not full cap changes, just maybe one or two people may leave. And then I in the summer of my in the summer of my second year, I auditioned for Julie, and then for another one of those shows, which is this show called Pickwick, which is doing a run for Christmas and Manchester Opera House, and was cast in that but then I had to pull out because I dislocated my knee about two months before, and this is the end of 1995 I then auditioned for the show one more time at the beginning of 96 after I got an over my knee injury, and then I was cast in the show as Bill Bailey. Originally, they thought I was maybe going to be a twin first, but then I was offered them the traffic.

[2:39] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So take me back to 14 year old. You, yeah, when you saw the tour, how much of the, I mean? So I've always thought that kids, it's good. Everything goes over the head as a kids, and it's just cats and entertaining adults. You probably get it. And at that point you, you're kind of reading between the lines. What about 14 year old? You How much of, like, the, you know, the innuendos and some of the darker parts of the show, like, how much of that? Did you did you pick up on?

[3:09] Speaker 2: Maybe the innuendo probably went a little bit over my head. I think I started dancing maybe two years previous. So I think I was more taken about by how brilliant the dancing wars and the singing etc. And a lot of people that were in that company of the first time I saw the show were then in it with me when I joined the show in London. So for instance, the woman who played through the fella, she is born by the Rena on the cat video, wow, yeah. So they a lot. And so you mentioned about the 1998 so they made that video when I was still in the show. So some of the cast members from my show were in that video. So I'm foster these, say Phil Bailey, and they've had ex cast members. There's some people over from board whiskey in that video as well. So yeah, it's a very, very special time.

[4:01] Mike Abrams: So you were basically in college and university. You were you were told, Hey, we want you, but you got to finish. And then you had an injury and all kinds of stuff. So between that first audition to when you actually went on the first time as Bill Bailey, how long was that?

[4:22] Speaker 2: God? I think I auditioned for the show over a whole period of a whole year, getting called back. Because when they would cast, they would obviously ask everyone if they were interested in leaving or not, as sometimes they didn't know who was going to go, so they were keeping me back depending on what role I was, maybe white for. So, yeah, it was probably over the course of a year, and I started rehearsal in February 1996 and then we opened in april 1996 okay, like the last time ago,

[4:53] Mike Abrams: and you said that about every six months they kind of bring new people in. Yeah,

[4:58] Speaker 2: yeah, we'll go. Ahead in in in London, you could, you could only stay with the shows from only after two years. You have to leave. I know it's different in New York, but they would either offer a year contract for six months.

[5:15] Mike Abrams: Yeah, okay, so you, so you, basically everyone on that show had a time limit. You can only do it for so long. Yeah, yeah, interesting. Okay, so when you join, you know you're, yeah, Midway ish in the run. I don't think you know at that point. You probably didn't know it was midway, but it's been going on for years at this point. Yeah, what is the introduction to you as a new cast member? Like, how do you get taught the show? Because, like a lot of people I've talked to, are a tour or the Broadway revival, where it's like they're kind of coming and they're starting it from zero, and you're coming into this, like well established production. So how do they kind of train you for that particular role?

[5:55] Speaker 2: Well, they, I didn't join by myself. There was, I think I mentioned earlier, there were probably around seven or eight people from that UK tour that I had seen. So there was maybe about 12 of us that joined the show at that time. And there's the woman called tiff Cartwright, who was the associate on board very recently, she put us into the show. And so I think on the first day, we sat down and we had the whole story about cats and giving three words for characters, and then we started to learn the show, starting from the opening and work the way to actually, like we learned the Jellicle Ball first, okay? Then sometimes at the end of a long day, she would, they would just go, right, we're going to do the Jellicle Ball from the beginning to end when you're really tired.

[6:44] Mike Abrams: So, yeah, yeah, because that's a, you know, a long and exhausting piece, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so you do, you remember much of that? You know, you were told the story. I've heard so many times that Chrissy Cartwright's, like, given the story and, like, you get this told this the lore, and I've been trying to piece it together as a fan. But what can you like, what do you remember about that experience and like, what were you told is, if you were going to explain it to somebody watching it for the first time?

[7:14] Speaker 2: I don't remember terrible, isn't I don't really remember the ins and outs of it. I think it feels such a long time ago, and it was basically that we were a tribe. She talks about each each of the different characters and their relationships to each other, and you were kind of given, I suppose, an over arc of the show. Yeah, I don't remember the A to B to C to G, which is not helping you, I guess.

[7:45] Mike Abrams: Well, you know, and I think that's where it's like, it's the cat's Bible, and the lore of it's kind of preserved throughout the years, but has also changed a little bit, yeah, production, yeah. Do you remember your three words?

[7:57] Speaker 2: And I was trying to think of this earlier, if you thought you might I want to say it was playful, young and curious. Okay, I think they may have changed together, yeah. Well, I

[8:11] Mike Abrams: think they changed it for tumble Brutus, because I was able to find Brutus his words, but I was able to find Bill Bailey's words, yeah. So I had chaotic and prudent and funny,

[8:21] Speaker 2: yeah, because I didn't, I don't tumble. But the guy who came in to play car box, he did tumble. So they flopped that round.

[8:29] Mike Abrams: Got it Okay, yeah. So tell me a little bit about the reaction was, I find this period a little bit fascinating in the sense that there's no social media. It's kind of a unique show to begin with. So what was the fan reaction like in the 90s when you're doing this? Like, what was it? Were there April traveling in or was it like the super Fauci? Yeah.

[8:52] Speaker 2: I mean, there were, you know, it was the show to be and I suppose it still is the show to be in as a dancer. And it was still the hot ticket in London, back in in the, you know, all the way through the 80s and the 90s, it was huge. It was, you know, we still, you know, when I joined the show that was 15 years in, it was still playing to pack houses every single week. I'm not sure if you've seen the picture of the stage at the New London where the theater was because they revolved. So when you sat, if you're in the stalls at the back of the sauce, you're sat at the beginning, looking at the back of the set, you're enjoying the overture. The set revolves when the when the cats come out and do flashing eyes. And that's the only version they have that got the revolve. And that revolve is still there, actually, they use it to develop at the moment.

[9:41] Mike Abrams: Wow. So, so it's it basically spins its way in, and that's when you organize. So were you there, or were there people still in the audience during that part?

[9:52] Speaker 2: People are in the audience, and as a set up to evolve, you either come from upstairs, meeting the circle, or you come out. On different parties, they do the set and then go to your face. Okay, yeah, yeah.

[10:05] Mike Abrams: So I'd love to kind of hear a little bit about more about Bill Bailey. So yeah, tell me a little bit about what you know you were told. I mean, I know you said your three words, but how did you play your character into the story?

[10:18] Speaker 2: I really took on board the him being because he was being really young and playful and I suppose, impressionable. He would play around a lot with carbucha tea, and would if there were trouble, or maybe drawing in the Macavity scares, or when Isabella came on, he was more than likely either go to skimble Shanks or to Jenny any not to be looked after. He was just having, I think, having a lot of fun. As you know, we did a lot of improvisation and stuff during our original rehearsals, falling around and just getting used to how those how cats move and stuff like that. And I think it was important to then integrate that within the show as well. And I think the more you get used to being on stage with people, you're thinking, you then allow the character to grow, I suppose, organically, with with, with different people throughout the show,

[11:19] Mike Abrams: completely, completely. So I with tumble Brutus in Bill Bailey and some of the other kittens. I've always kind of wondered, I made a case for almost everybody at why I still think they're more than Grizabella. But yeah, did you like when you're in the show and you're playing? Do you actually even think you're you have a chance to be the Jellicle choice? Or are you just kind of happy to be at the to be at the

[11:43] Speaker 2: ball? And I think, because you're a kitchen I think you're happy to be at the ball because you look up to the old cats, I guess. And I suppose you're, you're, I suppose being Bill Bailey, you're not. I suppose one of the central players who's offering up each, you know, each of the numbers is an offer up and their chance to showcase their talent for, you know, to be, to be chosen. And I feel babies. You know, apart from dancing throughout the show, you don't have an actual number, but I see what you mean. Yeah,

[12:19] Mike Abrams: yeah. I think it's interesting when you were told that, and I know you don't remember all of it, but when you're told the kind of the Bible of cats I'm I've always kind of interpreted it as it's like everyone wants to be the choice. And some of the cats know that they aren't realistic, yeah, but they still kind of want to be the choice. And so it's kind of interesting to hear from some of the characters that are less likely to be the choice, if that's how at all, how you play it, or if it's more of, just like, I was never even consideration, I'm just there to have a good time. I think, like, you know, some of the tuggers feel like I'm just there kind of,

[12:53] Speaker 2: I think, from my point of view, I was definitely there to have a good time. Yeah, okay, yeah. You're just there to enjoy. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, definitely, yeah, and hoping that maybe in years to come, when I get old, that maybe then I would then be able to put myself forward to have that chance to be before Yeah.

[13:11] Mike Abrams: So you mentioned car Bucha, but what other cats did you have kind of relationships with? We

[13:17] Speaker 2: had a left and acceptor, who were the other kind of, I suppose, kittens, as well as Victoria, mainly, mainly car Bucha, Jenny, any dots? Jenny, Lauren, skimble tanks, COVID and Canton while scared, the living daylights out of me, as well as Cassandra and me, alanza was just always very elite towards towards kitchen, just didn't get up. Okay,

[13:49] Mike Abrams: that's interesting. So the the twins and Cassandra are kind of terrifying. I mean, they, I think they're a scary part of the show. Once

[13:56] Speaker 2: you really yeah, they are, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I think when I when I very first saw the show, I didn't really kind of zone into that amount of detail. I mean, gillian's work is just so genius and clever. It wasn't till I'd gone back and seen a property in London that, after a few times, I really connected, because I was able to watch maybe somebody that whole way through the show, and see how the characters develop and see the narrative. But yeah, those three are especially quartz plant tantalometer. It's great.

[14:28] Mike Abrams: Yeah, the the I've interviewed a bunch of people have been tantamount, you know, the other the twins in general, and Cassandra and everyone's always like, if you happen to know to look for me, or you happen to catch us and be in for a treat during the show, because they're going to cue stuff that you didn't realize and and it's not something that I knew anything about the times I saw the show. Yeah,

[14:48] Speaker 2: we had an amazing they were actually their husband and wife, Samantha Biddle from Robbie yield, they were our they've done it on that forward I mentioned earlier. But they were absolutely amazing. They were so instinct and so together, it was like watching one person move is amazing.

[15:08] Mike Abrams: Awesome. That's so cool. I want to switch gears and do a little bit of rapid fire. Yeah? So I'd love to hear, you know, if you could play any cat at any moment. You can forget whether it's male, female or, you know, something that you think you could physically do or skill to do, like, which character would you want to just play for one day? Demeter. Demeter, okay, yeah, yeah. Give me, give me a little bit more of why. And

[15:36] Speaker 2: I think I'm at that age now where I probably had, you know, I've not had a troubled past, but there have been moments where, you know, I could probably bring some of that to her anxiety that she has throughout the show. And also, she's quite sappy. I definitely think I could be on board with that.

[15:55] Mike Abrams: yeah, that's, that's the dark part of the show that no one told me that. You do some digging. It's like, oh, okay, yeah. It's also, I think, one of the best songs with

[16:08] Mike Abrams: your favorite and least favorite cats?

[16:14] Speaker 2: Definitely. Monger, Jerry. I only studied him as well. I got to play him a few times. And who else? Um, Jenny, any dots? Jamika Bomb be my favorite, um, my least favorite, oh, I'm not sure if I have any. To be honest, my least favorite,

[16:57] Mike Abrams: me ask you a different way if you are as Bill Bailey, yeah, which, which cat is bugging you the most? Oh,

[17:04] Speaker 2: probably Cassandra and actually, probably Corey Pat and tanta Mars, because I'm so young in that sense, I don't understand them.

[17:14] Mike Abrams: Yeah, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, they're scaring you still. Yeah, yeah. What about your favorite song from

[17:26] Mike Abrams: McCabe. See, yeah, that's that's mine too. It's the one that I think is most interesting. Okay, and so this is kind of a more fun one, but if you look at the cats personality wise, which cat do you think is, was probably living their best life in the 90s, when, you know, when you were on stage, which you know, who would live in that era, on that time frame? Best? Definitely,

[17:49] Speaker 2: Tugger. Tugger just rocking out absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah. Second to that probably bomb by you in it. Yeah,

[17:59] Mike Abrams: that so Tugger seems to fit, like, every era. It seems like, yeah. It's like, okay, look, I can put him in the 70s or 80s, yeah, 90s. I think bomb is the one where, for me, I mean, just in the US, it's, you know, I kind of thought of the, I can see bomb wearing the neon and yeah, all that stuff, and just kind of jazzercising and doing, yeah, I love it. Yeah. Okay, so my, my kind of million dollar question is, I've argued at length about grizzabel and not being the right Jellicle choice. Yeah, I would love to hear from you. You know, if you're Old Deuteronomy, making the decision, are you picking Grizabella, or are you choosing somebody else? If you got to to to rewrite the ending. I think I would choose Gus. Okay, give me your Gus defense. I

[18:47] Speaker 2: he's been around a long time as haslo, and I think he has earned his stripes, you know, from his world of being, I suppose an actor in the previous day, which you get to see at the top of that too, when he goes into his or into the Aria and stuff like that. And I think he, if you know how in the UK, the Queen gives out order of service into unites people into medals, I think he, he deserves it for his work towards acting within his younger days. Yeah,

[19:18] Mike Abrams: I think Gus is such a worthy choice. And I think arguments for Grizabella you could make just as easily for

[19:24] Speaker 3: God, yeah, yeah, absolutely. What do you think is

[19:29] Mike Abrams: the reason that Grizabella is chosen every night, besides, obviously someone who got that way,

[19:36] Speaker 2: it allows the audience to, I suppose, feel empathy towards the character. So trying to have that arc and narrative towards the show, where you start off, where the tribe, I suppose, hater, and the outcaster, to then we see an act to where they accept her and they obviously take on on the journey. I think you know. It. She's probably at that age where she, I suppose, needs to be reborn, I guess. Yeah, it's

[20:07] Mike Abrams: so interesting. Is everything you just said, if you change that to he, I could have thought you were talking about Gus.

[20:13] Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, yeah. Which is fun, yeah.

[20:18] Mike Abrams: Well, you know, I appreciate you. You coming on and sharing a little bit about your experience. And you know, making any non Grizabella argument is a good argument in my book. Yeah. How can we stay in touch? What are you working on? What's your social media?

[20:35] Speaker 2: I don't perform anymore, and I teach. So I teach at university to conserve so I've worked there for over 13 years, and actually I work with Drew Raleigh, who's a monetary on the video. We work together. He teaches as well with me. So, yeah, I'm on Instagram. My hands all I should know that it's Damian Damian D 13,

[21:01] Mike Abrams: amazing, and we'll link that too. So for everyone can see and stay in touch, I appreciate you taking the time to come on and share about your experience and talk about Bill daily and yeah, give the the non grisabelle argument, which is what this whole podcast is about, yeah. And yeah, I appreciate you. You coming out to record with me,

[21:30] Mike Abrams: thanks everyone else for listening to this episode of The Ron cat diet, the podcast breakdown of the catastrophe. To follow along. You can subscribe on my apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram, at the wrong cat died. Or check out our website, the wrong cat