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[0:04] Sean Chandler: Hi everyone, I'm your host, Sean Chandler, and you're listening to Your Program Is Your Ticket, a discussion of smaller theater works and the people and organizations that make it happen.

[0:13] Sean Chandler: And I am back from a bit of an extended hiatus, which I'll tell you about a little later on in the show. My guests today are actor, writer, and theater maker Tana Sirois and director and actor Polina Ionina of The How Theatre's Untethered, an autobiographical comedy that follows a demisexual woman with obsessive compulsive disorder as she attempts to transcend her irrational fears, asking, should we tether to what makes us feel safe, or does the power lie in letting go?

[0:43] Sean Chandler: I'd like to dedicate this episode to a wonderful overall person, but also a director and a costume designer, John Nasca. He is episode 15. I encourage you to go back and take a listen to that. Unfortunately, John passed away earlier this week, and he was a wonderful presence in Chicago when David and I took our play at the Flash there, and he's just been like super supportive, and we're all very sad and remiss that he's gone. So I would like to dedicate this episode to him.

[1:18] Sean Chandler: Now, let's bring on the interview. Hi, Tana and Polina, and welcome to Your Program Is Your Ticket.

[1:24] Tana Sirois: Hello!

[1:24] Polina Ionina: Thank you so much for having us.

[1:26] Sean Chandler: Oh, it's my pleasure. I am so excited to talk to you today. This is my first show in like 15 months. I took a little hiatus, and I want to talk about that a little bit, and I have permission from these two nice artists here to do that. The reason why I took a hiatus is because about 15 months ago, David and I moved back to California, where we're from. We moved to Irvine, California, and we did that to take care of some family stuff, in particular with David's family. And we did it. About a year into it, we thought we would try to be bicostal. So we got an apartment here and we had an apartment there, and then we decided that that was too much money. So we went ahead and just moved everything back to our apartment in New York. So now we're back in New York and we're living there.

[2:27] Sean Chandler: It was weird because we had to combine a small apartment here with sort of a half-bedroom and then a giant two-bedroom apartment in Irvine, California, all into the same small. It was insane. I told David yesterday, I was like, is this has this just been a crazy year? You know, sometimes you just sort of like gear yourself up and you're like, okay, it's fine, I can do it, I can do it. And then all of a sudden everything mellows, and I don't know about you two, but that's when I come untethered.

[3:17] Tana Sirois: Oh yes.

[3:17] Polina Ionina: Yes, yes.

[3:19] Sean Chandler: I'm like after the battle, it's like, oh my gosh, geez. So that happened, and in addition, while I was in Irvine, I was trying to do a series called Theaters for Everyone by Teddy Lyndis. I was able to do one episode, although I tried to do more. That episode is James Bell of the Pump House Theater in Auckland, New Zealand. It's episode 115, and it's dated January 28th of 2023. How old am I? Jeez, I'm an old guy. But if you want to go back and listen to that, that's actually a really good episode. It's a great theater, it's an outdoor theater, and it's a beautiful complex. So that's the last one that I did. It should be relatively easy to find.

[4:14] Sean Chandler: I reached out to people throughout the world, and I didn't get a lot of response back. I mean, all the different continents. I was like, what's going on? I was trying not to take it personally. I really was. But I asked David, I was like, what do you think is going on? And he said, well, you know what? Everybody is just now starting to get back to business after COVID. I mean, managing directors, artistic directors, they're having to maneuver all of their seasons and move money here and there and get money if they have money still. So he was like, why don't you just chill out and give everybody a break? So I did. He's always the voice of reason with me. And you know, Tana, you know him. Tana has acted with him. You know David, I know, isn't he crazy?

[5:18] Tana Sirois: Yeah, he's like, settle down.

[5:20] Sean Chandler: Settle down. So I did, and there we go. So that's my hiatus, and I'm back, and I'm thrilled to have you two here in my first interview back and my first live interview since before COVID.

[5:35] Tana Sirois: Exciting.

[5:35] Polina Ionina: It's so much more.

[5:35] Sean Chandler: Everything was Zoom for a long time. Thank God for Zoom.

[5:41] Tana Sirois: No, but still different, isn't it?

[5:43] Polina Ionina: Yeah, it is.

[5:44] Sean Chandler: It's weird. When you're trying to talk with somebody, it's hard to know when they stop talking and you start talking.

[5:52] Tana Sirois: I know.

[5:52] Polina Ionina: And the little delay.

[5:54] Sean Chandler: Yeah, the delay. It's crazy. But you know, I'm sure Zoom made a fortune off of it. Somebody did, somebody made money out of that. But anyways, okay, let us move on. I'm going to, and I've asked Tana if I could do this. First of all, Polina, give me your full name.

[6:19] Polina Ionina: My name is Polina Ionina.

[6:21] Sean Chandler: Polina Ionina. And that is it's Russian?

[6:25] Polina Ionina: It's actually pronounced in Russian, Uwonina, but nobody can say it, really. So I've stuck with Ionina so much in America at least.

[6:38] Sean Chandler: Yeah, actually, you got a, oh, thank you. I'm surprised. Okay, now Tana, I've known Tana for gosh, almost a decade now. Tana has been on the show. This should be your fourth time. You have an episode for when I first met you for Tomorrow in the Battle, and then the New York Innovative Theater Award winning Stupid Fucking Bird for Best Play revival. Wasn't that a great feeling when that happened?

[7:09] Tana Sirois: Yeah, oh my god, I was so proud of you guys. I was so excited for you. I loved that show.

[7:14] Sean Chandler: Oh my god, but you guys did such amazing work with that. Painted Alice. And now and Tether. So I think you're now tied with Melissa Mashido for the number of times that you've been on my podcast.

[7:28] Tana Sirois: I'm honored. I'm, it's Maya. Are you kidding? I'm gonna have to start getting like the Letterman's jackets like they have on SNL for the five times.

[7:38] Sean Chandler: So maybe you'll be the first person to get a Letterman's jacket if that's something I can afford. Tana, I want you to pronounce your last name for me.

[7:53] Tana Sirois: Pronounce it for me. Sirois.

[7:55] Sean Chandler: Sirois. Yes. Okay, now can you spell it phonetically?

[8:00] Tana Sirois: Ooh. Like it's, I mean, if I'm spelling it out for someone who has to read it, I usually say S-E-A-R-W-A-H.

[8:08] Sean Chandler: Sirois.

[8:09] Tana Sirois: Oh, okay. So now do you find that people sometimes try to just overly like really get into it?

[8:17] Tana Sirois: Sometimes, yes.

[8:18] Sean Chandler: Everything's fine with me. Well, as somebody, as I said, you know, before we started recording the show, as somebody who has had my name mangled over and over and over again. My name is spelled S-E-A-N, and as I said, the only place where it was pronounced correctly every time was in Ireland when David and I did our show at the Flash there for a couple weeks. It was great. Otherwise, it's, you know, all versions of it. But you know, and the same people, it's weird. There's the same people who will pronounce like Sean Hayes or Sean Penn's name correctly when they read it. But for me, you know, I guess I'm not down, so there we go. All right, so let's get to you. Let's have you both introduce yourselves to our listeners. Tell us about yourselves and your functions with Untethered. And let's start with Paulina.

[9:13] Polina Ionina: So I am the founder of The How and the director as well of Untethered. I've directed quite a bunch of projects with The How, and I've been involved since February of this year. It's an incredible honor to direct this piece.

[9:37] Tana Sirois: Oh nice.

[9:38] Polina Ionina: Absolutely, it's true. I am an actor trained, you know, and I began directing as something that I was doing in between acting, but it has now become my primary thing that I do. I'm absolutely in love with it. I feel like I'm my best self when I'm directing and holding space for people.

[10:03] Sean Chandler: Okay, very, very cool. Also just a little sidebar, we are in a rehearsal studio here in Midtown Manhattan, and I believe that they're auditioning people for opera. So you're gonna hear, I don't know what a turn do, I have no idea. The Barber of Seville, who knows? I'm not a big, I try to see one opera a year just to figure it out, but that's just the same with ballet and Shakespeare. But now you are a Russian American director, actor. Now you were trained at Pace University where you got a BFA in acting, and also you studied abroad, and I cannot read this city.

[10:47] Polina Ionina: Kyrgyzstan.

[10:48] Sean Chandler: Kyrgyzstan, yeah.

[10:49] Polina Ionina: In, yes, country.

[10:51] Sean Chandler: Kyrgyzstan. I was there training actually a lot of my training comes from movement and meditation.

[10:59] Polina Ionina: Oh wow.

[11:01] Sean Chandler: Which is so much of acting is just focus, right? And attention. So that was primarily what I did, and I studied actually Sufi whirling.

[11:09] Sean Chandler: I also did a lot of Grotowski work.

[11:09] Sean Chandler: I'm sorry, what was that? Tell me what that is.

[11:14] Polina Ionina: Sufi whirling.

[11:15] Sean Chandler: Is that a type of acting or a technique or is it a person?

[11:21] Polina Ionina: I don't know.

[11:22] Sean Chandler: I'm sorry.

[11:23] Polina Ionina: No, no, no. It's um, so Sufi whirling is a practice, movement practice.

[11:27] Sean Chandler: Oh wow.

[11:28] Polina Ionina: I guess originally it was a spiritual practice by the Sufi Dervishes in Turkey. So it's basically where you whirl around and around and around.

[11:41] Sean Chandler: Oh, the whirling dervishes, exactly.

[11:43] Polina Ionina: So I studied that and I found that that is a practice that really centered me in a way that I've never been able to center myself with anything else. It's very difficult.

[11:53] Sean Chandler: And it's expanded my perception of just the moment. And I think so much of acting is the moment.

[12:02] Tana Sirois: I mean, it's a little bit.

[12:04] Sean Chandler: No, no, it's true, it is, it's true.

[12:07] Polina Ionina: So I attribute a lot of my knowledge to that actually, because it really kicked my butt, is I guess the short way of saying it.

[12:18] Sean Chandler: So you practiced that particular style of theater?

[12:23] Polina Ionina: Of movement.

[12:24] Sean Chandler: Of movement.

[12:25] Polina Ionina: So it's more a movement and less a style of theater.

[12:28] Sean Chandler: Right.

[12:29] Polina Ionina: Is that because it's something that's done also by people who aren't necessarily in theater?

[12:39] Sean Chandler: Yes.

[12:39] Polina Ionina: But who just enjoy it because I've heard it's like my own experience with it is I read a book by Fanny Flagg, who wrote Fried Green Tomatoes. She's a great author, and she had talked one of her characters had talked about going and seeing the whirling dervishes, and her experience was like, oh, kind of like I'm, this is interesting. They're just up there and they're spinning, but she describes it as sort of, it's almost hypnotic.

[13:04] Sean Chandler: Yes.

[13:05] Polina Ionina: As an audience member, the way it overtakes you and pulls you in. Is it, I would imagine it's the same feeling, only a million times more intense doing it.

[13:17] Polina Ionina: Yes, yes, it's hypnotic, it's difficult, it's quite painful sometimes. I mean, I'm not in any way a professional, and people who are practicing this, it's more of a spiritual practice than anything, but I considered it a movement practice because it was really so much of it is the body, right? Right balance and spinning continuously for hours, you know. It's very intense, but it's magnetic. You feel like you're standing still when you're actually moving very quickly.

[13:49] Sean Chandler: Really?

[13:50] Polina Ionina: Yes.

[13:50] Sean Chandler: Oh wow, I wouldn't think that.

[13:52] Polina Ionina: Yeah.

[13:53] Sean Chandler: I would think that I would do it for 20 seconds and get dizzy and fall down, but I'm very clumsy. But what a great experience. And I promise Tana we're gonna get to you in a second because this is very, very fascinating to me. So how does, so you're saying that it's about the moment is and that's really what it focuses on for you.

[14:24] Polina Ionina: Is it just like okay, I am present right now and here and I need to make sure that I'm doing this and I'm doing it correctly and nothing else matters. Is it like that or is there like a more transcendent kind of thing that happens?

[14:38] Tana Sirois: Um it is yes, it it's not that you're doing something correctly, it's just that you're doing. Um, period. It's that you're here and and you're sitting and or well, right now I'm sitting, right? But but if you're whirling, you're you're moving, and that's the only thing that's happening correctly or not, doesn't matter. Um at least that was the practice for me. Um yeah, and it it kind of taught me to be in space and and know that that I am doing. I don't know if that makes sense.

[15:10] Polina Ionina: No, it does, and it's I know we're gonna talk about um uh your theater company in in just a second, but I feel like I in all the literature that I read that um there is a lot of talk about being in space and and and occupying the space and working with it. So that's that's really cool. Do you ever ask the actors to do that?

[15:31] Tana Sirois: Oh yes, I mean so much of our practice with the how is exactly that. It's meditative, it's um, you know, it's almost communal, it it's it's uh spiritual in some ways.

[15:49] Polina Ionina: I mean, like anything that requires your attention, right? Uh transcendental perhaps is is a better word because spiritual comes with a context that I don't think it fits here necessarily, but talk about that about how it's how it's more trans transcendental and not necessarily spiritual because of the context you mentioned.

[16:10] Tana Sirois: Well, I think there's a kind of uh association immediately that we think of when we think of spiritual. It somehow all of a sudden it's other than it's it's uh outside of the realm of yourself, but I I think transcendental more so because you get to surpass yourself and your limits. Um you get to experience yourself on a whole new level where you've pushed and you've you've overcome the thoughts and the worries, and am I doing this correctly, or am I am I really here in the moment? Instead, you're just you are just um in space with people and you're moving and you're observing, you're listening, um, and being, and I think that that creates the most um provocative work in theater.

[17:00] Polina Ionina: Wow, and that probably I would assume uh a lot of that spills over into just your your non-theater life, your regular life of staying present.

[17:09] Tana Sirois: We always talk about that, yeah, which I I have a really hard time doing. I've been told many times. My head is like all over the place, but um, so that's good. I would imagine it's it's I don't know if I'm being crude when I say it's probably a little centering, and and that's that's am I saying that right?

[17:27] Polina Ionina: Yes, okay, good, okay, good, okay. Centering is is the perfect word for it, yeah.

[17:31] Tana Sirois: Okay, groovy. Wow, what a a very, very cool background.

[17:37] Polina Ionina: Thank you.

[17:37] Tana Sirois: Oh, you won't be a no, thank you. No, it's it's interesting. I've never had anybody uh come in, come in, and I've never interviewed anyone who's had that sort of background and and and um uh in please tell me the the proper name for it again. I want to call it the whirling dervishes, but you you you just you called it a the Sufi whirling, the Sufi whirling, yeah. I mean whirling dervishes is exactly what it is because practiced by the Dervishes of Turkey, and there's a they're a specific sect, and they're associated with some with religion, of course, and and spirituality, which is not how I practice it, but but yes, that is it's still happening by the way. It's in Konya in Turkey. They still have a huge center, and yeah.

[18:20] Tana Sirois: Well, because of that book, um I've I've always wanted to go and and watch it happen, only because I kind of want to get that sort of feeling about it. I mean, I'm one of those people who gets really transfixed into theater when I'm really into it. So I think that would be very, very neat. Okay, thank you very much for that. Appreciate that. Tana, now you are like such an alumni of this show. I think a lot of people know a lot about you, but let's refresh their memory. Tell us about yours yourself and uh remind us, bring us up to speed on what you've been doing and um what your function is with Untethered.

[18:58] Tana Sirois: Oh boy, yes. Well, I'm an actor first and theater maker. I suppose now I'm also a playwright. Yes. You are? It's exciting and scary. Um it's not so bad. Yes. Um, I've also done a lot of producing. Um my current project is Untethered, which is an autobiographical one-woman show. Um it is opening, we're doing a preview on Wednesday and Thursday of this week, the 6th and 7th, and then we'll be at the tank in Manhattan on the 21st, 23rd, and 25th.

[19:43] Polina Ionina: Very cool. Very, very cool. Now, I believe I have a description of it here of Untethered. Untethered is an autobiographical comedy that follows a demisexual woman with obsessive compulsive disorder as she attempts to transcend her irrational fears, asking, should we tether to what makes us feel safe, or does the power lie in the letting go?

[20:12] Tana Sirois: That is some heady, heady stuff. Wow. Oh my gosh. Um tell us a little bit about your original inspiration. Like what inspired you to do this? Were you just like, I gotta get this out of my head, or or what?

[20:29] Tana Sirois: Partially, yes. Um, so I actually moved to London two years ago to do a master's of science in creative arts and mental health. Um I think I really I really wanted to dive into the mind. I wanted to understand the mind more. Um I very nearly trained as a therapist, counselor, and then realized that I I've been acting since I was four years old. You know, it's my life, it's in my blood, it's what brings me joy and meaning and connection, and I quickly realized that I didn't want to let that go, but I did want to continue expanding and learning and pushing myself and be in an academic environment. So I left New York. This was right after the pandemic, made a big life change, I moved to London to do this Masters of Science in Creative Arts and Mental Health. And one of the courses was on performing the self.

[21:21] Polina Ionina: And wait, performing the self?

[21:24] Tana Sirois: Yes, performing the self. So we were both, we were the project at the end of this particular module was to present a 15-minute autobiographical solo piece, right? So we had to, in any art form we wanted, that had to be about us. And so of course I wrote a little play. Um, and I had just claimed the diagnosis of OCD a few months before I decided to do this program. So it was still very new. I was still working through what it meant to have OCD to tell people that I have OCD, especially romantic partners. Like I just navigating like when to bring that up, what people think of when they say, you know, you say you have OCD, and suddenly people are like, oh, do you want to do you want some hand wipes?

Do you like is everything organized? Is this okay? Do you need this to be straight? You know, people have a really like specific idea of what obsessive compulsive disorder means. And the way that this has manifested, the way the OCD manifested in me is just totally different. Like I never, I thought that it was just anxiety that I had that was sort of fixated on certain triggers, right? Um, so I think I was in this process when I started this course of wanting to understand myself and this diagnosis more. Um, so part of writing on tethered was me sort of, yeah, telling my story um and abstracting it in a way so that I could look at it from a creative perspective, um, and bring some humor into it as well. I think for me, that's such a healing mechanism.

[23:01] Tana Sirois: Oh, yeah. Comedy, like satire, you know, like just the absurdism of life, like especially when it comes to the things that really scare us. Um, I think being able to recognize the what is absurd in that and and sort of push push the comedy there is really um it really forces you to, yeah, just opens your mind to forces you to look at things from a different perspective. Anyway, so I wrote this 15-minute piece, and we had a public showing, and there were a few people that came who had OCD, and their response to seeing the work was really powerful.

[23:39] Polina Ionina: Um what did they say with the feedback you got from them?

[23:43] Tana Sirois: They said that they had never seen an accurate portrayal of OCD before in any art form that that really resonated, like they expressed feeling seen. Um I thought, wow, if I if I had felt seen in that way and I had seen someone share a similar experience and connect that experience to symptoms on the OCD spectrum when I was 18 or 19, when then I first started really, really suffering from these fears. Would I have been able to better navigate my late teens and 20s and early 30s having some sort of vocabulary or shared experience or um just feeling like I wasn't alone, feeling like there were other people that were afraid of these things and whose minds whose minds latched on to fears in this way.

So I think yeah, that really inspired me to push this story further and expand it into a full-length piece that can be shared. I mean, around the we just got back from Istanbul last month, and bringing the show to the Fringe Festival in Istanbul was such a powerful experience for us. It was really amazing and scary for me, you know, scary to share that sort of vulnerable intimate story not only with complete strangers, but but strangers from a different cultural background and just wondering like what's going to translate, you know. Um and I'm really happy with the outcome. I'm really happy with how it went. But but yes, so the it's really been the threat of of feeling like raising awareness around what what OCD looks like and can feel like has made me want to continue doing this work.

[25:35] Polina Ionina: Um it sounds like uh the feedback that you got from them, like it it helped you as much as it helped them.

[25:42] Tana Sirois: Absolutely, yeah. Because I would imagine uh I think we probably and I haven't seen the show, um, I don't have a lot of experience with OCD, but um I would think that everybody thinks it's sort of like it's all the same patterns of behavior, like checking things too much or washing hands too much, things like that. But it's got to be there's gotta be like a wide range of OCD.

[26:09] Tana Sirois: Absolutely. And is that something that you talk about in the play, or uh I mean, I know you don't want to say too much, but like can you give us like maybe one example from the play where you're you're talking about it and like a behavior that's going on?

[26:24] Tana Sirois: Yes, I mean this gives away a little bit, but for me, I have pretty severe contamination OCD, and not with um germs like on the subway, but like with incurable disease, basically. So like probably just to really make things heavy really fast, you asked me.

[26:44] Polina Ionina: No, no, no, I know I'm glad you're talking about it. It just I was just like, I uh you probably had a rough two years of you know a pandemic, like wow, yeah, I would imagine um so but I just always thought that was like a reasonable anxiety for me because I was like, well, you know, if the if the dog that licked my hand in the park had rabies and I have rabies, then I'm going to die. So for me, I would almost experience having to mentally wrap my mind around the fact that it's possible, it's possible that I could the dog I've had in Thailand could have rabies, and I could I I might die, right? So like living in like a really high state of these triggers that would happen to me, and I would have these crazy fear responses, and really have to try to um like contain my fears that I could function in society, you know.

[27:44] Tana Sirois: And after I found out, like for so for me, when I when my therapist said, Tana G, do you think you might have OCD? I thought, I don't my room's a disaster. Like my I I mean, right? It's tech week, it's tech week, baby. Like everything's chaos. No, I don't have OCD, not at all. Like, I don't wash my hands excessively. And then once I started realizing that, you know, OCD, a lot of time it's latching on to a fear that is, yeah, it could happen, but the it's the likelihood of it happening is what makes it irrational.

[28:14] Polina Ionina: Oh wow.

[28:14] Tana Sirois: Right? It's not that it's impossible for the dog to have rabies, it's that the chances of the dog having rabies are so slim that uh other people wouldn't be spinning out about it in this way. But for me, I've made it real.

[28:29] Tana Sirois: So once she sort of explained that to me and I started relating some of these mechanisms of OCD to my anxiety, I suddenly felt so free. Because I didn't have to, it's like I didn't have to come at it from a perspective of trying to convince myself that I was safe and that this horrible thing wasn't gonna happen. I came at it from a perspective of saying, okay, this is my OCD acting up. How do I manage the symptoms of OCD, right? So that was like a whole, it was just like a reality shift for me. And then there's also the whole question of the ambiguity of diagnosis in general, right? Because so much of mental health diagnosis is a spectrum. And for some people, for me, getting a diagnosis was freeing.

I felt liberated, I felt safe. I felt like I had a roadmap, I could talk to people, I had community, I could say my OCD is acting up today. I'm sorry, I'm late or stressed, I'm having a high OCD day instead of saying, I'm sorry, I'm just really distracted because I got licked in the park by a dog with my hands, and I don't know if it has rabies or not, and I'm just like, nobody, I'm not gonna say that to people, you know what I mean? So it gave me a vocabulary that was really helpful. However, for other people, claiming a mental health diagnosis is really damaging. It's stigmatized, it's not helpful for a lot of people. I think it really harms their sense of self. It's something they feel they can't get over or move past, they feel branded by it.

So another thing I'm trying to do with Untethered in the telling of this story is illustrate how these symptoms show up on a spectrum, and if it is useful for you to have the vocabulary and diagnosis, then use it and claim it and say, hi, I'm Tana, I'm 34 years old, I'm queer, I have OCD, right? But then if things change and so that doesn't feel like it applies to you anymore, if you don't feel like sometimes my OCD subsides, and I don't think about it for months, and in those times, I don't feel like I have OCD, and that's okay too. It's okay to release that identity and that label, and it's okay to not claim it if it's not helpful for you. Um, yeah, so in a large part, OCD is about being untethered. Untethered is about OCD, um, but it is also about identity, it's about the process of claiming your identity, of accepting who you are, and also allowing yourself to change.

[31:11] Sean Chandler: Wow, that's incredible. And just I can imagine if you took a 15-minute piece and got so much feedback that helped you with it. I can only imagine like just doing the show now in its current incarnation. Um, is it just like just blows it wide open? And it's good. I mean, I suffer from anxiety disorder. I have really bad anxiety and I take medication for it, but um, when somebody tells you it's not just you, yeah, it's not just you know, maybe this is what's going on, and it's not what you think it is, and you know, we can work to fix it. Um I do think that I agree with you on a certain point that you said, where um if you're going to if somebody is going to tell you you have OCD, I think that they should have the responsibility of saying, and this is what we're going to do.

[32:09] Tana Sirois: Absolutely. You know, instead of, oh, you must have OCD, and then all and then the person with OCD is like, oh shit, now you've got OCD on top of all this stuff now, too, which and it's probably just a meshing of two different things that are helpful if you have a mental health professional there.

[32:28] Polina Ionina: Absolutely, and this is one of the problems in the mental health system, right? It's like the care around how people are diagnosed, not only the diagnostic criteria being problematic in many ways, but the way that people are told and the support that is provided, um, and the way that the individual is left out of the conversation oftentimes, right? Like you're told you have something that kind of left in a room, and it's like, you know, I think it should be a dialogue, right? It should be it should be a dialogue where you're figuring out does this work for me? Does this feel accurate? Does this is this something you want to claim? Of course, there are exceptions, you know what I mean? It's not always, it's not, it's you can't simplify it in that way, but I think for many people they would really benefit from more conversations, deeper conversations, more nuanced conversations around diagnosis and mental health.

[33:23] Sean Chandler: Wow. That's great. I mean, it's so nice when somebody infuses their soul and their spirit and they personalize that into the show. It's just it's a really really brave thing to do. I think the two bravest things that you can do in writing and creating is to be absolutely completely thoroughly honest and put it all out there and then there's the other end of the continuum where you're just writing about things that you're just taking a chance on do I do I can't do I understand that so that's that's more fun about being a playwright just FYI if you haven't experienced that already. Okay now I'm I definitely definitely want to get to you Polina with your directorial vision but I want to ask what is the fringe in Stan Bull like?

[34:19] Polina Ionina: Yes, what's it like? Tell me about it.

[34:22] Tana Sirois: Incredible phenomenal the best cannot say enough positive things about these are so great and they're so important. Well and do what was it a was it uh like uh an international festival where there's lots of different projects from all over the world?

[34:31] Polina Ionina: Yes, yes oh wow um we actually we went last we went two years ago we took a piece with The How called My Favorite Person and then we came back this year with Untethered so for us it felt like a little reunion I think again you know we got quite close with the organizers and the other artists in the festival two years ago, and we were really really hoping that Untethered would be accepted into the season and would get the chance to return. And we did, and it was an incredible experience.

[35:06] Tana Sirois: So supportive.

[35:12] Polina Ionina: Yes, it's such a supportive festival and inspiring. Just you know, imagine you go and you put on your show, and then you just get to spend the next week going to see all the two shows a day sometimes from all over the world. Totally, you know, and then attending workshops or giving, we were teaching as well during the days, and we did some panels about mental health and art, and it was just a really full amazing experience.

[35:38] Sean Chandler: That's so cool. I've said this many times on the show, it's because some a mental health professional said this to me when I started to get some traction on my writing, it was like 2012, and I was I've I've been seeing therapists my whole life. But my therapist at the time who had worked with a lot of our artistic professionals, um, told me, she said, Sean, if you concentrate on the relationships that you're making through the process of this, don't concentrate so much on the competitiveness, you know, be there for each other and help each other and know that not everybody's going to be successful at the same time or need something at the same time. If you were focused on the people and the relationships, you'll have a great time with it. And it sounds like that's what happened at this fringe festival.

[36:34] Polina Ionina: Absolutely.

[36:35] Tana Sirois: Oh, but they I have to tell you, I maybe it's because of my age, but boy, they wipe me out. I because I'm like here and here and here and here and here and here, and then I wasn't even doing a David was performing our play. I know. We I don't think I've ever been as tired as after coming back from the Instant Home Fridge Festival. Because it is, yeah, you get wiped out. The social interactions, I mean, they're incredible phenomenal, but it they take it a lot out of you, right? And then not to mention they throw really good parties.

[37:06] Polina Ionina: Incredible.

[37:07] Tana Sirois: Like really good parties. They keep you busy socially.

[37:15] Polina Ionina: No, you cannot.

[37:16] Tana Sirois: Well, I'm I'm kind of an old fart at this point, so I can. David will stay and have fun. But um, uh yeah, I know they keep you really socially busy, and they're like, oh, after this, we're gonna go to this bar over here, and then we're gonna go here, and then it's the dancing for me that gets it. You get me dancing, and I'm just done for out all night. I'm like, bye, Tana. Shh, she's on one. I don't know. Back bend. On the dance floor, you know.

[37:44] Polina Ionina: Oh my gosh, okay. Well, if anybody can do it, it's you, dear.

[37:48] Sean Chandler: I know I know that I've seen you act before, and it doesn't surprise me at all. Okay, um let's get back on the rails for the piece. Polina, talk about your directorial vision of Untethered directors. They have to go in with the vision, they're they're supervisors and managers, but they're also creating the overall.

[38:11] Polina Ionina: Oops, sorry, look and feel of the play. Tell talk about that.

[38:15] Polina Ionina: So with Untethered, I didn't want to bulldozer through space. You know what I mean? I this is such a personal piece that my whole goal from the beginning um was to walk into the room and just listen to the piece. And it has changed a lot throughout the process from February until now, and we're still sometimes there's moments where we're like, hmm, I think this has to change just a little bit to suit the space or whatever, we discover something else. So as a director to come in and my job was to really listen to Tana's vision and to facilitate it. Of course, sound good, feel good, and with all the nuances of theatrical things, but primarily to just be there for her as she is exploring this and sharing this with me because it's such a raw piece.

[39:27] Tana Sirois: So vulnerable and very I mean personal.

[39:31] Polina Ionina: And vulnerable for sure. Yes. And I wanted to be cautious of my bringing in to it. Or if I do, it's very, very, very minor. I have when I was quite little, um, but not currently, and so I wanted to be very sensitive to that and to really make her vision sing. So that was my goal and vision as a director.

[40:03] Sean Chandler: That is smart because I feel like if it's like sort of all I don't know what what I'm gonna use to describe this, but it feels like everything has to be like absolutely completely genuine. It otherwise, I feel like if it just goes like one little tick outside of that, then it's throwing things off. Um, it's like one of those stories where if you're gonna tell it, you're gonna have to tell it all the way. Yes, you know, and and maybe possibly adding in, you know, um like a set floor ish or something like that, unless it's really truly working and keeping in context with what's going on, that it would feel very, very disingenuous.

[40:52] Tana Sirois: That's gonna be my new mantra. If you're gonna tell it, tell it all the way. I'm gonna say that to myself when I get totally embarrassed and freaked out before I do the show, which I still do, by the way. I'm gonna remember you, yeah, and say, if you're gonna tell it, to tell it all the way.

[41:04] Polina Ionina: Oh nice.

[41:06] Tana Sirois: Wow, I love when I'm quoted. It doesn't happen that often.

[41:09] Polina Ionina: It's true.

[41:10] Tana Sirois: Oh, it's cool.

[41:11] Polina Ionina: Yeah, it's true. You have to go, you know, you have to do it to do the thing, leave it on the floor.

[41:14] Sean Chandler: Yeah. Well, it's it's very different than you know, like say if you're you know, you're playing uh Carol King in Beautiful, you know, your your your focus has to be Carol King in Beautiful, but this is you putting yourself out there, and it needs to be, and so I would imagine you guys were like twins for a while.

[41:34] Tana Sirois: Yeah, we definitely I think during tech and assemble, I think we started finishing each other's thoughts and sentences.

[41:40] Polina Ionina: Oh yeah.

[41:41] Tana Sirois: Just because we kind of had to be synergistic like that, and um to do justice to this piece. And like I said, it changes, it feels like it's living and breathing.

[41:54] Sean Chandler: Good, good. That's that's the the audience will notice that. Um if they're if they're theater people, they will understand it, they'll feel it. If they're not theater people, they'll feel it without necessarily realizing it. You know, you're paying attention to the undercurrent and the pathos of that, and that is super super smart, super smart. Not that you need my approval, but there you go. I approve of that answer.

[42:27] Tana Sirois: Was or is there a continuing emotional catharsis for either of you as you developed and now perform the show? And and you're performing it as well because you're there and you're you're watching it and you're making sure everything is kept on the rails.

[42:46] Tana Sirois: Was there like did you go through were there crying moments, were there were there were there comforting moments? I mean what happened with it?

[42:55] Tana Sirois: Yeah, there were crying moments, absolutely. I would say for me the primary catharsis came in writing the piece. Um because in trying to find the words I inevitably uncovered some truths about my experience and how I see the world and my fears and shame that I don't think I would have necessarily been pushed to discover had I not been trying to write my experience into a play.

[43:36] Tana Sirois: Yeah. You know, so during those moments, I actually think most of the catharsis came from trying to find the right way to say something, feeling like something wasn't right, rewriting it, still not right, and then unlocking something that felt so true that it made me burst into tears. You know, like that happened to me probably three or four times writing the show. Like I would come to the you know, the very end of a scene, like the last line of like what I'm really what I'm really trying to say, or like the breaking point, like how does or or or voicing what I how I want to be loved. How do you really want how do you want someone to see you and love you? Um yeah, and then and then finding the text or the music that illustrated some of these big questions for me really like broke me open. Um and I think that's how you know that it's something that belongs in the show, right?

[44:36] Tana Sirois: Of course, of course, yeah. I'm not going to be sobbing every time I say this line in the show, but but the writing, I know that that means that it was true and meaningful for me. Um, the finding the finding it was cathartic. I would say in in terms of performing the show, I do feel like I've separated myself from the material enough now to be able to approach it as an actor. And you know, of course, it's it's personal, it's mine, so it resonates with me deeply, but um there's enough of a professional distance so that I'm not you know having any emotional breakdowns during the show.

[45:11] Sean Chandler: I was gonna ask.

[45:13] Tana Sirois: No, but there are emotional breakdowns during the show, no rehearsals where I really struggle to to show up, rehearsals that feel more difficult than they I feel like they should, yes. Um, and then also I think this is something I I've taught, I teach, I lecture at university here and there, and one of the classes I teach is actually performing the self. And um, one of the things I always stress is if you are going to work on autobiographical work, you really need to make sure that you're blocking out time to care for yourself after you do it.

[45:53] Tana Sirois: Smart. You know, and you might not need it, and and it's not that it's going to be so overpowering emotionally, it's just that it's the respectful thing to do to allow yourself to fully process the experience.

[46:05] Sean Chandler: Yeah.

[46:06] Tana Sirois: You know, it's to just like have some time to to let it settle and land. Um, and there probably less so now, but when I was first doing this piece, that was absolutely necessary for me.

[46:19] Sean Chandler: Oh, yeah. I mean, you're up there just revealing everything big time.

[46:24] Tana Sirois: Of course, you need to have some downtime, or you know, just you know, turn on you know something stupid on TV or whatever, or to not have to be strong, I think.

[46:35] Tana Sirois: Yeah, to not have to have like a mask up and to be like showing up in in any certain way right after doing this is really important. Just be around people where you can show up however you are, you know, yeah, which is I'm lucky enough to have people like Pauline in my life.

[46:52] Polina Ionina: Oh my god.

[46:54] Sean Chandler: Now Paulina, what about you? Did was did the material ever like reach out and touch you personally? Um and was it was it at times because the director sort of needs to to really at times be the objective one. Um what was it like for you?

[47:10] Polina Ionina: Um yes, I mean it's t it touches me all the time. Still, I I think that even today in in rehearsal when we were running it, um, we're in a tech technically. Um I had moments where I I got emotional, and and I think I don't get necessarily uh catharsis from the information but I do get the catharsis from uh Tana's vulnerability um or I get impacted by it so much she's so open and she's so truthful and as a director of course I have to be objective of course I have to like you know make sure that everything's working and I'm also running tech and and all this other stuff but it it moves me to see an actor so committed and uh yeah that that's that's really impactful for me.

[48:09] Sean Chandler: That's good.

[48:10] Polina Ionina: That's good. It's it's an appreciation for for uh for what she's doing and and that I think is so key in how you just told us how you approach the material being there for her knowing that honesty is important um because you as the director understand that that's you know these are the building blocks of the production and they're really really important because they're important and and they're important too to her and what she's doing to Tana and what she's doing I'm sorry to uh there there's only two people here besides me so I'm like it's important to Tana so sorry sorry audience out there uh I'll be a little more clear but it's it's it's really really a a smart uh tactic it feels like there's balance there in your approach.

[48:59] Polina Ionina: I feel like like when you know you needed to say, okay, Tana, I need you to stop because we have to focus on this like you.

[49:06] Polina Ionina: Yeah, you knew when to do it and how.

[49:09] Sean Chandler: Of course, yeah. And you probably thought a lot about that.

[49:12] Polina Ionina: Like when and when you should do it, how you should approach it. It just it feels like um I just after just knowing you for like an hour and a half, I feel like you would be really you'd have a good head for that.

[49:23] Polina Ionina: So yeah, and just to also hold space um for the process of it, I think is is really important um to go through all of the waves and just say, okay, well, this isn't working, and let's let's see how we can, you know, just manage it, or or what do you think, or how how can we make this work oh, this is not working, or or this is working really well. And I just I have to say, the first what almost year I was working on this piece, I was doing it alone because it was part of my course. So I didn't have a director, I didn't have anyone to bounce ideas off of, and honestly, I think I needed that I needed that solitude for me to make sure that what I was making was the story I wanted to tell and was not influenced by other people because it is so personal for it to be fully fully realized and exist. I needed to do it alone.

[50:11] Tana Sirois: Um, but it was so hard. I hate working alone.

[50:17] Tana Sirois: I am such a collaborator, I just get energy from other people. Like it was my worst nightmare to be doing this all alone. So having Palina.

[50:24] Polina Ionina: That's writing, dear.

[50:26] Tana Sirois: When we first started working together on this, and I asked her to direct this piece, I just suddenly felt so supported, and it was like there was energy infused into the process again. And I don't know. I mean, it's it's been it's been funny doing my first one woman show and having that teach me how important the collaboration and connection is. It's still for me all about the collaboration and connection, even in a one-woman show.

[50:54] Sean Chandler: Yeah, that's no, that's that's great. I know how you'd feel because I like I just said, that's that's kind of writing, yeah.

[50:59] Sean Chandler: You know, you're usually in sitting in bed with your computer in front of you when you're doing it. I know that I'll spend a couple of years working in writing one of my projects, and then I finally go into a rehearsal room and I'm like, oh like everybody, like, oh, finally I'm seeing it up on its feet and hearing other people do it. It's not just shadows in my brain and voices in my head. So I totally get it.

[51:22] Sean Chandler: Um, there is I've known uh a handful of people and artists who have uh gone back to school to um to study drama therapy. Now, is that what you did, Tana, or is it a little something different? And and also would you classify untethered as sort of in the camp of drama therapy?

[51:43] Tana Sirois: Such an interesting question. Um thank you. I did not study drama therapy, I studied uh creative arts and mental health. So we're basically I studied how the arts, um, participatory arts practice, so doing art yourself and also watching art, so being influenced by art, how why that is so important to our mental health, um, and how the medical system is not fully supporting mental health as much as they could um, like where the gaps are basically in the medical treatment of mental health and how how art can facilitate that.

[52:22] Tana Sirois: And my course actually, or my focus in my course had was largely rooted in in social justice as well, and looking at you know, why what's happening to us socially and politically uh is affecting our mental health, is causing mental ill health, um, and why we should be looking at that just as much as we're looking at things from a more biomedical perspective, right? Like we need to we need to be looking at why people are struggling, like we're not connected, there's a huge lack of meaning in our lives. Um we there are things that we can do, and there are ways that we can connect and heal ourselves that are not being prioritized when we talk about mental health initiatives.

[53:07] Tana Sirois: Um like feeding our minds in other ways besides the traditional ways of what everyone thinks we need to do when it comes to dealing with mental health.

[53:17] Sean Chandler: Yeah.

[53:17] Tana Sirois: And so for me, that's a big part of that's movement practice. A big part of that is is finding meaning. Um, you know, having consistent consistent creativity in my life and finding meaning with my collaborators for me is you know, it's what brings me joy. It's what keeps me mentally healthy, happy. And you know, and and in theater is um is very like sometimes I'll be sitting in in theater and I'll just look around at the audience and I'll think, what is the magical mystical thing that's causing everybody to be so enraptured? What it what is that going on there? And and it it feels like like I feel like that's kind of like what you're talking about, like that that thing that I'm discussing, and I see a lot of theater, it's it's something that people need in addition to you know, maybe therapy and and maybe um the drugs that are that are out there, which by the way, I take um uh medication myself, so I am a proponent of that.

[54:18] Tana Sirois: That's that's just how I feel about it. Um I think that everybody should, we should be encouraging people to figure out how they feel about all of these things. It's like, okay, here's a here what what works for you? Is it medication? Is it therapy? Is it a connective practice? Is it making art? Is it you know, like a supportive social structure where you have health care and you have people around you to help take care of you? So we're not all coming at this from a total individualized perspective. Like there are so many different ways that we can focus on our mental health, and sometimes I think, especially in in well, in America, the side of it that's related to art is lost.

[55:04] Tana Sirois: I think I don't think it's valued, disconnected, it's disconnected, yeah. So my that's my personal focus in my degree was was very much on these conversations, conversations surrounding this. Um whether or not on tethered is drama therapy. No, no, because there was no therapist or guide leading me through the process of creating it, so no, um, but was it therapeutic for me? Absolutely, absolutely. I think um writing this piece, I surprised myself with how much I learned about myself.

[55:43] Tana Sirois: It really forced me to face and vocalize some of my biggest fears um to work through them, even physically, my body, choreographing some of the movement bits of like how does this how does an obsession manifest in my body? What does it make me feel like internally, and how am I like repeating that over and over and over again to try to get it right? It it makes you connect to that feeling and process it in a different way. Um, so that was part of it, and then also the the the largest part was just an acceptance, I think an acceptance, an acknowledgement of how how much these anxieties have affected my life. I mean, we downplay things a lot, right? I'm very highly functional person. I mean like always working a million jobs, doing a million things.

I think most of the time I'm on top of everything. Like I think I'm pretty put together, but I struggle. I've really, really suffered with my anxiety, and so doing a play about it, I couldn't hide from it anymore. I had to, I had to accept how how big how much energy this has taken from my life and how hard it's been for me. And I think working through that was very powerful.

[57:03] Tana Sirois: It really made me accept where I'm at now. Um, there was also an element of healing just in finding some beauty and joy in it. You know, the show's funny. I like listening to this podcast; you probably think it's like a really, really dark show, but it's comedy. I mean, it's a ridiculous show. I hope it's hilarious a lot. I think it's hilarious. I mean, it's my humor. I don't know. Um, we all need that for levity.

[57:36] Polina Ionina: Yeah, it's important. I mean, how many times, well, for me, I've been in, you know, hospital situations with people who are really sick and the whole family's there, and all of a sudden somebody says something funny and it just lightens things up. It's so important. And when I say it's hilarious, I don't mean like the show I wrote was hilarious. I mean that the experience of looking at the things that I worry so much about and making them absurd becomes hilarious to me.

[58:10] Tana Sirois: Like the process of recognizing that some of these irrational fears are, it is hilarious that they've taken up so much space in my mind and energy, you know, and recognizing that has been profound in a way, I think.

[58:28] Polina Ionina: Yeah, it feels like it's connected a little bit to like, maybe you might at one point probably thought it was a little absurd. Like I know when I've learned things about myself, I've been like, oh my gosh, that was why, why was I doing that? Why was I thinking that? That just seems so absurd, but it's there, it's there for a reason, and something happened, or our brains were just wired that way, and we need to understand that.

[58:52] Tana Sirois: And when you're theatricalizing it, of course, you're like, all right, so if this is absurd, how can I make it more absurd?

[58:52] Polina Ionina: Right.

[58:52] Tana Sirois: How can I make this as absurd as humanly possible? Because this is absurd, let's push it, you know. So that's been a really fun process to play with some of these fears in that way to just make them ridiculous, you know.

[59:11] Polina Ionina: Good, good, good. I think that's so cool. I think it's, that's, and it really, it moves, it's, it feels like that's theatrical. And when we go to the theater, we want to be educated and edified, but we also want to be entertained.

[59:31] Tana Sirois: Yeah.

[59:32] Polina Ionina: So there's, that's the three reasons I think what people go, okay.

[59:35] Sean Chandler: Okay, we've got about five, maybe seven minutes left. So let's talk about the How Theatre. Um, Polina, tell us about the How Theatre. How did it start? Um, what is your mission statement? Um, talk about that or talk about your mission statement a little bit.

[59:53] Polina Ionina: So we say that the How is where you go to be reminded and renewed when you want to navigate how to love, how to move, how to grieve, and how to play. One of our collaborators said that, and I was like, wow, that is exactly it. Exactly it. Um, we started in 2016, and when the How began, our mission was really to work very closely with collaborators on new work that felt really, really meaningful to us, and um, and wasn't necessarily like, you know, it was something that was developed over time and was strong, that we thought was strong.

[1:00:43] Tana Sirois: Um, and in community focused on the group, basically. That was our focus when we were starting out, and as now we've developed over a long time, almost 10 years. Wow. Thinking about it now.

[1:00:59] Polina Ionina: Um, we've done a lot of movement theater, so a lot of our work is movement-based, and um, we work with a lot of international people, a lot. Uh, and when I say international, I mean people who are from all over the place, but also who are in different places, and they come and they go, and uh, we've formed a beautiful community here.

[1:01:24] Tana Sirois: Um, that's very strong, and we're very, very close, all of us.

[1:01:29] Polina Ionina: Um, the pandemic, of course, really, uh, it did a hit job on everybody. It really did.

[1:01:37] Tana Sirois: So a lot of my community has moved away during that time, so um, rebuilding it has been interesting and good too, and powerful. We're still doing it.

[1:01:48] Polina Ionina: So as I talked about in the beginning of the show, that's why nobody wanted me to interview them for a long time because everybody is busy.

[1:01:57] Sean Chandler: Yes, I know you know.

[1:01:59] Polina Ionina: Everybody's figuring out like, what am I doing right now? What am I actually doing?

[1:02:03] Tana Sirois: Yeah, it's, yeah, it's, it was so destabilizing. I mean, a year and a half ago we were all wearing masks in the theater. So it's very, uh, I can understand that.

[1:02:13] Sean Chandler: And you know what I think is really cool about uh, you and your style and what you just said is that one of the best qualities that a leader can have is to be nimble, is to be open to things changing and evolving and developing, and um, I think that's really great. I really, really do.

[1:02:35] Tana Sirois: And I mean, I've seen that. I've had that thought about four times as you've been talking, and um, also the fact that you pretty much gave the mission statement of your company to a collaborator. That's great.

[1:02:51] Polina Ionina: There's a lot of people who'd be like, I want to write the mission statement if I'm creating the company, but you, you know, you're open to communication and you're open to change, and um, that is maturity, it's, it's again, it's just really super strong leadership.

[1:03:09] Sean Chandler: So great job on that. Great job on that.

[1:03:13] Tana Sirois: Well, I always thought that, you know, um, I'm in the room with such unbelievable artists, holy crap, how lucky am I to sit in a space and watch them do their best work? It's such an honor really to witness. And so, and also two, three, four brains are better than one brain, and if I can be in the space to share it, bring it on, love it.

[1:03:13] Sean Chandler: Um, if you could have three wishes for the How Theatre, what would they be? Now they have to be three wishes in total, so like if you want to do a wish, maybe do you have a wish for the How Theatre and then you get one, you get one, and since we have the grand poobah of the How Theatre here, she gets two. She earned, she's earned two. So, uh, but what would be your three wishes?

[1:03:13] Tana Sirois: I would wish to deepen our community further. I think this being involved in this collective has been one of the most meaningful experiences of my life. I've learned so much, I've challenged myself. I want to keep doing that. I want to keep finding new challenges and work, um, deepen the way that we work and gain more support for our work so that we can work with more artists and do bigger shows.

[1:04:46] Polina Ionina: I started working with the How just after the pandemic, really. Um, yeah, we did a few things before that, but I really became a company member right after the pandemic, and uh, it was just, I can't think of anything better to have come out of that really hard time than to find a community here.

[1:05:06] Tana Sirois: Um, so yeah, I want it to expand. I want it to expand in terms of um, doing more shows and bigger venues, of course.

[1:05:13] Polina Ionina: Yes, getting the funding and support, yes, but also expanding our network, expanding the amount of time we're spending doing the work.

[1:05:20] Sean Chandler: Okay, very, very cool. Good job, Tana.

[1:05:22] Tana Sirois: Polina, I just did one. I didn't want her to take one of your wishes.

[1:05:30] Polina Ionina: It's a collective wish, honestly. Um, I would count that as part of mine as well.

[1:05:37] Polina Ionina: Um, I think additionally, I will add that I would love to take Untethered to a wider audience and just really keep expanding it and bringing it to more people because I think that it does have such a profound impact on people. It's beautiful to see it.

[1:06:01] Tana Sirois: So, yes, that, um, and working with people that are going to push the company, are going to push me. That's my wish always, and also to keep doing this, um, all the time. Full time, all day, every day.

[1:06:17] Polina Ionina: Those I think is that three?

[1:06:18] Tana Sirois: That's three total.

[1:06:20] Sean Chandler: Yes, yes, that's three. Um, you know, most people, most people, probably about 75% of people say money. And so I'm gonna say it for you. You know, go to their website and they're gonna give you that information in just a second and donate. Donate, donate, donate. Every theater company needs money. They really, really do. It's not free and it's not cheap usually. It goes a long way.

[1:06:44] Tana Sirois: It does.

[1:06:44] Sean Chandler: It's very, very helpful. So let's, um, uh, let's now give our audience your social media information so they can keep up with both of you and also the How Theatre. It's always best if you have like one address that you can send people to that connects to everything. Um, so tell us, tell us, give us your, let's have the social media stuff, please.

[1:07:09] Polina Ionina: So you can find us at thehowtheater.nyc on Instagram and at uh, thehow.nyc.

[1:07:21] Tana Sirois: Um, that was, that's our website.

[1:07:23] Polina Ionina: So the website I guess is the best place because it has the most information.

[1:07:27] Tana Sirois: Does it connect you to everything?

[1:07:29] Polina Ionina: Everything, yeah, yeah.

[1:07:30] Sean Chandler: Cool, very cool. That's thehow.nyc.

[1:07:33] Tana Sirois: Okay, cool. Tana, you have uh, your, your uh personal actor website.

[1:07:38] Tana Sirois: I do.

[1:07:39] Tana Sirois: It's my first name, T-A-N-A underscore my last name, S-I-R-O-I-S.

[1:07:46] Tana Sirois: And then of course, we also have at untethered underscore the underscore play.

[1:07:52] Polina Ionina: Pronounced Sir Wa.

[1:07:55] Tana Sirois: Yes.

[1:07:57] Sean Chandler: Um, okay, very, very cool. Uh, Tana and Polina, thank you for being my first guests back on the show, and my first guests, actually, that I'm looking at without looking at you through a screen.

[1:08:10] Tana Sirois: Um, you've been amazing, and I love this, this, your theater concept and I love, uh, I love everything you do, and I, I love that you put your whole heart and soul into it.

[1:08:22] Sean Chandler: And I just, I know that Untethered is gonna do um so well, and if people are just gonna connect to it so much, and um, and I think the How Theatre is doing amazing work.

[1:08:34] Tana Sirois: So, uh, thank you again.

[1:08:36] Sean Chandler: Uh, you've both been amazing guests, and um, I wish you many broken legs for Untethered and all the wonderful work you both do in the future.

[1:08:47] Tana Sirois: Thank you.

[1:08:47] Polina Ionina: Thank you so much.

[1:08:48] Sean Chandler: Thank you for having us.

[1:08:50] Sean Chandler: Well, folks, the 11 o'clock number has been sung and the bows have been taken, so it's time to lower the curtain. Once again, a big thanks to my guests, actor, writer, theater maker, Tana Sirois, and director and actor Polina Ionina of the How Theatre's Untethered.

[1:09:05] Sean Chandler: Untethered will play at Thespus Theater in Astoria on November 6th and 7th at 7:30 p.m. This production is generously funded by the Queen's Arts Fund Program, presented by the New York Foundation for the Arts in partnership with the New York City Department of Cultural Affairs.

[1:09:23] Sean Chandler: Tickets for these performances are free. Untethered will also play at The Tank in Manhattan on November 21st at 7 p.m., the 23rd at 3 p.m., and the 25th at 7 p.m.

[1:09:36] Sean Chandler: Now keep in mind that those tickets are not free. There's a charge. They range from 15 to 25 dollars.

[1:09:43] Sean Chandler: Now that's not a lot, so you know, cough up and go see the show. I think you'll really, really enjoy it. It sounds like just an incredible piece of theater, and these two artists are absolutely incredible, as you can tell from their interview, they're amazing.

[1:09:59] Sean Chandler: A big thanks to all my listeners for your patience during the hiatus. I really appreciate that. You can find more episodes of Your Program Is Your Ticket on the Broadway Podcast Network, who has honored me with a place on their incredible theater podcast platform. Broadway Podcast Network is all about creating an engaging, immersive, user-friendly experience where theater stories of all kinds can be easily found, shared, and enjoyed.

[1:10:23] Sean Chandler: Please visit them on my landing page at bpn.fm/ypiyt. Your Program Is Your Ticket is also on Facebook at Your Program Is Your Ticket. I'm on Twitter at @programticket, Instagram at yourprogramisyourticket, YouTube at yourprogramisyourticket, iTunes, Stitcher, Player FM, Podcast Addict, Podbean, Pocket Cast, Deezer, and pretty much any place you get your podcasts.

[1:10:48] Sean Chandler: So just look me up, and I'm kind of everywhere. FYI, I appreciate all good ratings, reviews, and subscriptions. Folks, take a little time to visit theater websites and see what they have to offer. Give them all kinds of great ratings and reviews, and most important, donate, donate, donate.

[1:11:04] Sean Chandler: As always, thanks for listening. We'll see you next time. And remember, theater is for everyone.