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[0:31] Eila Mell: Hello and welcome to Behind the Awards.

[0:33] Bruce Gotlieb: I'm Eila and I am here with Bruce.

[0:36] Bruce Gotlieb: Hello there, Eila. How are you?

[0:38] Eila Mell: I am good. I'm so happy that you pulled the clip from Trammel Tillman's speech because you know I love him on Severance.

[0:46] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes, and I loved his speech, you know, just gearing it up and then he, you know, kind of slips in that his first acting coach was his mother.

[0:54] Eila Mell: And it's just so, like, it's just great.

[0:57] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh my gosh, yes. He's so good on that show. Wow.

[1:00] Eila Mell: And he's a Broadway guy, too.

[1:02] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[1:03] Eila Mell: So hopefully we can get him on the show at some point.

[1:06] Bruce Gotlieb: We should have asked before he won the Emmy.

[1:08] Eila Mell: Well, probably. Now is, you know, he's a little bit more in demand at this point.

[1:14] Bruce Gotlieb: You know, being nominated for an award helps, obviously, push people's career forward.

[1:20] Eila Mell: But then when you win, you're at a whole other level.

[1:23] Bruce Gotlieb: I know. So I know the Emmys, you know, were a week ago already, but I was still so surprised and thrilled for her that Kathryn Lanassa won.

[1:34] Eila Mell: I thought for sure it was going to be someone from White Lotus because every other person in her category was from White Lotus, I think.

[1:42] Bruce Gotlieb: Right, right.

[1:43] Eila Mell: I think she was the least expected to win.

[1:45] Bruce Gotlieb: It's always a nice, I don't know, little, you know, little surprise.

[1:50] Eila Mell: I know. And then her husband.

[1:52] Bruce Gotlieb: And she's great in The Pit, if you haven't watched it.

[1:55] Eila Mell: Oh, my gosh. I love The Pit.

[1:56] Bruce Gotlieb: And then her husband is Grant Show from Melrose Place?

[1:59] Eila Mell: Oh, no.

[2:00] Bruce Gotlieb: I loved it. He looked phenomenal.

[2:02] Eila Mell: He looked exactly the same.

[2:04] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[2:05] Eila Mell: Oh, my gosh.

[2:06] Bruce Gotlieb: I know.

[2:07] Eila Mell: That was fun.

[2:08] Bruce Gotlieb: When she called him out and they panned over, obviously, I was like, wait a minute.

[2:13] Eila Mell: I know. That was a shock.

[2:16] Bruce Gotlieb: That was the biggest surprise of the night.

[2:18] Eila Mell: I know.

[2:19] Bruce Gotlieb: It was such a pleasant surprise.

[2:21] Eila Mell: I loved it.

[2:22] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, so that was great.

[2:23] Eila Mell: And I think her first husband was Dennis Hopper.

[2:26] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, okay.

[2:27] Eila Mell: So quite a difference.

[2:29] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, yeah.

[2:31] Eila Mell: Well, maybe she'll get her husband on The Pit next season.

[2:34] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, that would be good.

[2:36] Eila Mell: I'm surprised that you like The Pit only because it doesn't seem to be your typical thing.

[2:41] Bruce Gotlieb: Well, there's not as much drama as, like, A Grey's Anatomy, which I love.

[2:46] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[2:47] Bruce Gotlieb: But I've always enjoyed a good medical drama.

[2:49] Eila Mell: Oh, my gosh. I love The Pit so much.

[2:52] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, it's intense.

[2:53] Eila Mell: I know.

[2:54] Bruce Gotlieb: It's really, really intense.

[2:56] Eila Mell: Because it happens in real time.

[2:57] Bruce Gotlieb: It's like 24 and ER converge.

[3:00] Eila Mell: Yeah, but I feel like it's a little less soapy.

[3:03] Bruce Gotlieb: So it feels more real than, again, like A Grey's Anatomy, which I love.

[3:09] Eila Mell: And obviously, people do. It's been on for, God, 20-something seasons.

[3:12] Bruce Gotlieb: I can't believe it's still on.

[3:16] Eila Mell: The most shocking moment of this whole season of The Pit was when Catherine Lanassa got punched by the patient.

[3:21] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, my God.

[3:22] Eila Mell: That was—

[3:23] Bruce Gotlieb: Wow.

[3:24] Eila Mell: I have questions about that, how it was filmed.

[3:26] Bruce Gotlieb: I know.

[3:27] Eila Mell: It feels like she really got punched.

[3:29] Bruce Gotlieb: I mean, obviously, she wasn't harmed.

[3:32] Eila Mell: But, yeah.

[3:33] Bruce Gotlieb: No, there are some people that, when they're filming a scene, they're like, yes, slap me for real.

[3:37] Eila Mell: Let's just do it.

[3:38] Bruce Gotlieb: I know. Punch the—

[3:40] Eila Mell: But she got it.

[3:41] Bruce Gotlieb: I mean—

[3:42] Eila Mell: Yeah, that was good.

[3:43] Bruce Gotlieb: They should have won an Emmy, too.

[3:45] Eila Mell: Hopefully, they did.

[3:46] Bruce Gotlieb: Maybe.

[3:47] Eila Mell: In the creative, maybe there's, like, you know, creative arts Emmys.

[3:50] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, that's a great show.

[3:52] Eila Mell: And Noah Wyle won.

[3:53] Bruce Gotlieb: That was fun.

[3:54] Eila Mell: That was fun.

[3:55] Bruce Gotlieb: Absolutely.

[3:56] Eila Mell: So we said we weren't going to talk about the Emmys, and then we did.

[3:58] Bruce Gotlieb: But I think that's okay.

[4:00] Eila Mell: They were fun this year.

[4:01] Bruce Gotlieb: That's all right.

[4:02] Eila Mell: They were good.

[4:03] Bruce Gotlieb: They were good.

[4:04] Eila Mell: What did you think of the host?

[4:05] Bruce Gotlieb: I did not like how he turned it into a telethon.

[4:11] Eila Mell: Agreed.

[4:12] Bruce Gotlieb: I feel like, especially the boys, I mean, any organization, not-for-profit, is obviously deserving.

[4:17] Eila Mell: Yeah, that's fantastic, but—

[4:19] Bruce Gotlieb: But you're taking an organization and, like, kind of toying with them a little bit.

[4:23] Eila Mell: And then it was like, I don't know, it took the focus off the Emmys and put it on, you know, people were rushing through their speeches.

[4:29] Bruce Gotlieb: That part I didn't mind.

[4:34] Eila Mell: But still, it seemed kind of unfair to the people who won that they had to have this pressure that they're taking money away from needy children.

[4:42] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[4:43] Eila Mell: So they can't make a speech.

[4:44] Bruce Gotlieb: I don't know.

[4:45] Eila Mell: Although, I will tell you, those few kids that they had from the Boys and Girls Club all in their, you know, dressed to the nines looked so thrilled to be there and so excited every time.

[4:54] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, that was sweet.

[4:55] Eila Mell: But, you know.

[4:56] Bruce Gotlieb: But I think that the writing for the show was pretty clunky.

[5:00] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[5:01] Bruce Gotlieb: His—I expected a little bit more humor.

[5:04] Eila Mell: I don't know, he seemed really nervous, which very possibly could have been.

[5:08] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[5:09] Eila Mell: I mean, it's nerve wracking, but.

[5:10] Bruce Gotlieb: It is, you know.

[5:11] Eila Mell: I don't know. The national telecast.

[5:13] Bruce Gotlieb: But even the presenters, their banter was not good.

[5:16] Eila Mell: The only people who I thought were really funny, and I'm guessing they wrote their own material, were Ray Romano and Brad Garrett.

[5:23] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, they were funny.

[5:25] Eila Mell: Jennifer Coolidge, I was like, what?

[5:27] Bruce Gotlieb: I don't know.

[5:28] Eila Mell: What are you doing?

[5:29] Bruce Gotlieb: I know.

[5:30] Eila Mell: I mean, she's amazing, but she wasn't then.

[5:31] Bruce Gotlieb: It's like somebody wound her up in the back and just sent her loose.

[5:34] Eila Mell: I think she didn't have good material to work with.

[5:36] Bruce Gotlieb: It was just—I mean, she can really do a lot with very little, but that was rough.

[5:41] Eila Mell: Yeah, I don't know.

[5:42] Bruce Gotlieb: It felt like maybe they just said, go out and be funny.

[5:45] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[5:46] Bruce Gotlieb: And that's not—everybody can't do that.

[5:48] Eila Mell: Right.

[5:49] Bruce Gotlieb: Not everybody's a stand-up comedian, so.

[5:50] Eila Mell: And, you know, maybe even someone who can do that isn't, you know, doesn't have an on-day 100% of the time.

[5:56] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[5:59] Eila Mell: And I don't know, without great, you know, Emmy-level material, it can be hard.

[6:05] Bruce Gotlieb: Absolutely.

[6:06] Eila Mell: So I don't know.

[6:07] Bruce Gotlieb: I think the writers did them a disservice.

[6:09] Eila Mell: Well, I guess we'll see what the next award show has to bring.

[6:14] Bruce Gotlieb: I guess, but it was still fun.

[6:16] Eila Mell: You know, I still liked watching it.

[6:18] Bruce Gotlieb: I watched it a little behind so I could fast-forward through, and I really didn't fast-forward through anything.

[6:24] Eila Mell: Okay.

[6:25] Bruce Gotlieb: Did you have any best-dressed moments for yourself?

[6:29] Eila Mell: Hmm.

[6:31] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[6:32] Eila Mell: I liked Brittany Snow.

[6:33] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay.

[6:34] Eila Mell: She was my favorite.

[6:35] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay.

[6:36] Eila Mell: How about you?

[6:37] Bruce Gotlieb: The one that's sticking to me, I don't remember, like, anybody coming out and, like, normally I'll be like, I'll speak out loud to my TV at how somebody looks, but the one that's staying with me was Mariska Hargitay.

[6:48] Eila Mell: Oh, okay.

[6:49] Bruce Gotlieb: I thought she, I thought her dress was very flattering.

[6:52] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[6:53] Bruce Gotlieb: Well, she, I mean, she's kind of flawless.

[6:55] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[6:56] Bruce Gotlieb: Well, who do we have as our guest today?

[6:59] Eila Mell: Speaking of flawless.

[7:00] Bruce Gotlieb: Speaking of flawless, yes.

[7:03] Eila Mell: We have Dominique Kelly, choreographer for The Great Gatsby, amongst other things.

[7:08] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[7:09] Eila Mell: But that's kind of been his, you know, splash onto the, to the Broadway scene.

[7:14] Bruce Gotlieb: I mean, and what a splash.

[7:16] Eila Mell: Yes.

[7:17] Bruce Gotlieb: And now I think they just, you know, embarking on the show in Korea.

[7:22] Eila Mell: I mean, it's incredible.

[7:23] Bruce Gotlieb: They have the West End.

[7:24] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[7:25] Bruce Gotlieb: It's, I mean, you, if you're going to do a show, you want to know that it's going to be performing in multiple places.

[7:30] Eila Mell: I mean, yeah, that's great.

[7:34] Bruce Gotlieb: Well, let's bring out Dominique and listen to what he has to say, because he's pretty great.

[7:40] Eila Mell: Absolutely.

[7:44] Bruce Gotlieb: I'm so excited.

[7:45] Eila Mell: I know you are too.

[7:47] Bruce Gotlieb: We have Dominique Kelly on our show today.

[7:50] Eila Mell: Who is doing more in the world of choreography right now?

[7:53] Bruce Gotlieb: I mean, viral sensation from Great Gatsby to, I mean, Great Gatsby is taking over the world.

[8:00] Eila Mell: New money.

[8:01] Bruce Gotlieb: New money.

[8:02] Eila Mell: It's all about new money. Welcome, Dominique.

[8:04] Dominique Kelley: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

[8:06] Dominique Kelley: I'm so excited to speak with you all today.

[8:08] Eila Mell: We're thrilled to have you.

[8:09] Dominique Kelley: So let's jump in.

[8:10] Eila Mell: I just saw Great Gatsby last week for the first time.

[8:14] Dominique Kelley: Oh, my gosh.

[8:15] Eila Mell: I know. Big show.

[8:17] Dominique Kelley: I was late. Gorgeous.

[8:19] Eila Mell: Just gorgeous looking.

[8:20] Dominique Kelley: And the choreography is so much fun.

[8:21] Eila Mell: Thank you.

[8:22] Dominique Kelley: Thank you.

[8:23] Eila Mell: So is that your Broadway debut as the lead choreographer?

[8:27] Dominique Kelley: Yes. Yes, as a choreographer, it is my Broadway debut and what a spectacular show to do that on.

[8:33] Dominique Kelley: I mean, it's literally jumping into the deep end of the pool because between the set and the costumes and the music and all the things, I mean, like, who wouldn't want their first experience to be that magnificent of a show?

[8:46] Eila Mell: Oh my gosh. It's gorgeous.

[8:48] Dominique Kelley: And yes, as Bruce said, you did create this viral moment with, well, it's that new money number, but the rehearsal video got so many followers.

[8:58] Dominique Kelley: It's really funny because, you know, when you set out to do choreography, if a viral moment happens, cool.

[9:04] Dominique Kelley: But that wasn't the case.

[9:06] Dominique Kelley: I mean, I didn't necessarily plan it to happen.

[9:09] Dominique Kelley: I don't think anybody can really plan any kind of viral moment.

[9:12] Dominique Kelley: It's just what happens.

[9:13] Dominique Kelley: And it was interesting because none of it started off as a dance challenge.

[9:16] Dominique Kelley: We never said, do this choreography and tag yourself.

[9:20] Dominique Kelley: It was more so that the people just felt connected to the movement and just started doing it.

[9:26] Dominique Kelley: And I think that it was an embarrassment of riches to watch everybody from across the world just doing some movement that I made up in a little studio in L.A.

[9:35] Eila Mell: That's crazy.

[9:36] Dominique Kelley: Well, because first of all, it's so much fun.

[9:38] Dominique Kelley: But, you know, there are some movements in that choreography that even if you can't dance, you can still do.

[9:44] Eila Mell: So I think that that is like the secret sauce there that, you know, while it's certainly not simple, there are things that everyone can do.

[9:54] Dominique Kelley: Absolutely.

[9:55] Dominique Kelley: And the whole point is to make it as accessible as possible for people who haven't seen the show in that number.

[10:02] Dominique Kelley: That is the first time in like a seven minute number that everybody does the choreography at the same time and they do it at the very, very end before the final button.

[10:11] Dominique Kelley: So that was my like line dance, like 1920s line dance that everybody would jump in and do all together.

[10:18] Eila Mell: How exciting to not only have your Broadway debut, but take this piece of a property that is known.

[10:25] Eila Mell: Everybody, you know, knows The Great Gatsby, whether it's the book that they read in high school, the movie that's come later, and have an opportunity to create this from the ground up, starting at Paper Mill Playhouse, to then just all the different incarnations of the piece.

[10:42] Eila Mell: How did the project come to you?

[10:44] Dominique Kelley: Basically, in short, to go way back, I was working on Dancing with the Stars, and a friend of mine who brought me on Dancing with the Stars, she was like, Oh, I have a friend who has a friend who is a director, and he wants to meet new choreographers.

[10:59] Dominique Kelley: So it started from like, I call it a blind date Zoom, where you're just on there.

[11:04] Dominique Kelley: It's just a general meeting.

[11:05] Dominique Kelley: I talked to Mark Bruni, who was our wonderful director.

[11:09] Dominique Kelley: And, you know, we were just chatting and talking about how we felt about theater and certain things I like to do and certain things I didn't like to do.

[11:16] Dominique Kelley: And ironically, I think the thing I didn't like to do was his next project, which was not Gatsby, it was something else.

[11:22] Dominique Kelley: And I was like, well, at least I was honest.

[11:24] Dominique Kelley: But then he said after that phone call, yes, I wasn't right for that.

[11:27] Dominique Kelley: But he called Kate Kerrigan, who was our book writer, Nathan Tyson, who is our lyricist, and Jason Howland, who is our composer, and said, I think I have the right person for you.

[11:38] Dominique Kelley: I believe that was like, April.

[11:40] Dominique Kelley: I had another meeting with them in October.

[11:42] Dominique Kelley: And then we did the first lab in November.

[11:45] Dominique Kelley: So everything about The Great Gatsby, it's fun and fast and furious.

[11:49] Dominique Kelley: And the great thing about that is you have no time to second guess.

[11:54] Dominique Kelley: You just have to go with instincts.

[11:56] Dominique Kelley: And if it works, then make the decision.

[11:58] Dominique Kelley: And then if it doesn't work, you'll know very quickly that it didn't work.

[12:01] Dominique Kelley: And I think that has been the beautiful journey about Gatsby is everything we've been doing has been pretty, like, fast because they wrote this in 2020.

[12:11] Dominique Kelley: So for me to be added in 2022, and then we're at Paper Mill 2023, we open on Broadway 2024, West End 2025.

[12:20] Dominique Kelley: That doesn't necessarily happen.

[12:22] Eila Mell: And Korea is right around the corner.

[12:25] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, they're actually teching in Korea right now while I'm in L.A., and I'm going to go to opening night in a couple of weeks.

[12:32] Eila Mell: Wow. Congratulations. What a huge thing for you. That's great.

[12:36] Dominique Kelley: Thank you. I'm living the life I prayed for, so I cannot be mad.

[12:39] Eila Mell: That's amazing.

[12:40] Dominique Kelley: Well, Bruce saw the show at Paper Mill and on Broadway a couple of times.

[12:44] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, okay, great. Some things have changed.

[12:48] Dominique Kelley: Yes, I mean, even New Money, which we were talking about, when you guys got to Broadway, it was a whole new game.

[12:56] Eila Mell: And, wow, what – and the old version was great on its own, but this one, did you guys feel it?

[16:33] Eila Mell: Welcome back to Behind the Awards. Today, we have an incredible guest, Dominique Kelley, who is making waves with his Broadway debut in "Great Gatsby."

[17:03] Bruce Gotlieb: It's exciting to see how his choreography is resonating with audiences around the world.

[17:23] Eila Mell: Absolutely! Dominique, you have such an impressive background. Can you tell us about your journey to this point?

[17:43] Dominique Kelley: Thank you for having me! My journey started in Bridgeport, Connecticut. I was the youngest dancer at 15 on the national tour of "Bring in 'Da Noise, Bring in 'Da Funk," which was a pivotal moment for me.

[18:03] Bruce Gotlieb: That's amazing! You’ve worked with some incredible artists like Janet Jackson and Mariah Carey. What has that experience been like?

[18:23] Dominique Kelley: Working with those icons has been surreal. Each artist has their unique style, and it’s a joy to adapt my choreography to fit their vision.

[18:43] Eila Mell: You also have a background in tap dancing and percussion. How do you incorporate that into your choreography?

[19:03] Dominique Kelley: I love to fuse rhythm patterns with classical movement. It creates a visual and aural experience that enhances the storytelling in dance.

[19:23] Bruce Gotlieb: Speaking of storytelling, your work in "Great Gatsby" has been described as a viral sensation. What do you think has contributed to its success?

[19:43] Dominique Kelley: I believe it’s the combination of the timeless story and the innovative choreography that resonates with both new audiences and those familiar with the classic.

[20:03] Eila Mell: You’ve also choreographed for television shows like "Dancing with the Stars." How does that differ from stage choreography?

[20:23] Dominique Kelley: Television choreography is often more about the camera angles and how the dance translates on screen, while stage choreography focuses on the live audience experience.

[20:43] Bruce Gotlieb: You’ve had such a diverse career. What advice would you give to young dancers looking to break into the industry?

[21:03] Dominique Kelley: Stay true to your passion and be open to learning. The industry is always evolving, and adaptability is key.

[21:23] Eila Mell: That’s great advice! Now, let’s talk about your upcoming projects. What can we expect to see from you in the near future?

[21:43] Dominique Kelley: I’m currently working on several new projects, including more choreography for theater and television. I’m excited to share what’s next!

[22:03] Bruce Gotlieb: We can’t wait to see it! Before we wrap up, is there anything else you’d like to share with our listeners?

[22:23] Dominique Kelley: Just a big thank you for the support! I hope everyone gets to see "Great Gatsby" and enjoys the experience as much as we enjoyed creating it.

[22:43] Eila Mell: Thank you, Dominique, for joining us today. It’s been a pleasure hearing about your journey and your work.

[23:03] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes, thank you! And to our listeners, stay tuned for more behind-the-scenes stories from the world of awards and entertainment.

[23:23] Eila Mell: Until next time, keep celebrating excellence in theater, film, and TV!

[23:43] Bruce Gotlieb: Bye for now!

[24:03] Eila Mell: Bye!

[24:23] Bruce Gotlieb: Bye!

[24:43] Eila Mell: Bye!

[25:03] Bruce Gotlieb: Bye!

[25:23] Eila Mell: Bye!

[25:43] Bruce Gotlieb: Bye!

[26:07] Dominique Kelley: And I also just refused to yell at them. They were like, we're used to people yelling and I was like, why? You're grown and I can use my words. Like there's no point. So at every point, like Alan Rene Lewis, who brought me on, who was the creative director for it, and he also is with B.I.V., Broadway Inspirational Voices. He was just a great leader in all of that. So I just had to follow the lead. Sometimes being a choreographer, you have to steer the ship. That time, I was just happy to be on the ride with him.

[26:38] Eila Mell: That's amazing. So growing up, who were your dance influences?

[26:41] Dominique Kelley: Oh, Gregory Hines, for sure. Savion Glover, for sure. Nicholas Brothers, for sure. Oh, they were like no one else.

[26:50] Eila Mell: Yes. And I mean, like, also, too, it was the people around me, like Dormitia Sunbury Edwards still looked to her. Ayodele Cassell still looked to her. You know what I mean? It was mainly my peers and also my mom. My mom taught me the electric slide when I was younger. She also taught me how to do salsa when I was younger. Will she say she's a dancer? No, but she worked in the education system. So all her students taught her the fun dances. So she brought them back to me. And I think sometimes it's important instead of looking up at inspiration, if you look around you, it becomes a little bit more tangible. And I just always got inspired by the people around me. Like, for example, my mother was telling me when I was about three years old, I believe, I first saw Thriller and I was scared to death of it.

So what I used to do was put my hand over the zombie so I could still learn the dance steps. And I was just that child. I was like Honey Daniels back in the day. I would look around everywhere trying to figure out who's doing what and use some kind of inspiration and do it at home. So I think for the most part, it was a lot of people around me also, not only just those people I mentioned.

[28:01] Dominique Kelley: Well, you know, it's funny that you say that, you know, you get bullied as a male dancer, but there's dance everywhere in our society. And people just don't think about that. They don't realize that they deal with it all the time. There's art everywhere. There's absolutely everywhere. And you just have to be around people who open your eyes to it.

[28:16] Eila Mell: Yeah. Was a career in dance always the dream or did it just kind of how did that evolve for you? Or did you always know?

[28:24] Dominique Kelley: I think I always knew. It's always been in there. I was that kid who was choreographing things for my cousins and my friends, like everywhere. My mother said I tore up her kitchen floor before I even really had tap shoes. And like I was the black Billy Elliot. I was doing ballet and jazz everywhere in supermarkets, like you name it. Of course, I like played sports when I was younger and I was a smart kid. So I went to like space camp and I went to the museum every weekend. And ironically, I went to University of Connecticut originally on an animal science scholarship. So I thought I was going to be working with animals, more animals, more because I worked at the zoo. And what I was doing, bringing noise, bringing the funk.

Of course, we were on tour. So I got to see every zoo around the country and like, you know, get special treatment. Yes, I always knew I wanted to dance, but I also knew that I love to learn. And I think sometimes the thirst for knowledge supersedes the thirst to dance. And I just always wanted to learn as much as I can. I wouldn't say I'm somebody who gets bored per se, but if we're going to use the word, I get bored very quickly. So I love to like learn as much as I can about a lot of different things. But that's the amazing part about having a life in the arts, because you're constantly in new situations. So you're constantly learning.

[29:50] Eila Mell: Yes, you're never failing. You're just learning.

[29:55] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, absolutely. And also you work with so many different people and different kinds of people so that you can't help but absorb different cultures and just, you know, everything. It's a very rich life.

[30:05] Eila Mell: Yes. And as a choreographer, you're not necessarily just the department head, but of course, you're the cheerleader, you're the therapist, you're the psychologist, you're all of those things wrapped in one. And more than studying about the job, you're just studying people. And then eventually I, you know, switched up my animal science major and I did communication. So we learned about nonverbal communication. We learned about all the kind of things. And I think that helped me in my journey because I know how to communicate with a lot of different people.

[30:35] Dominique Kelley: Yeah. And also communicate with your body, which is very important.

[30:40] Eila Mell: Very important, especially in what I do, nonverbal communication. Right. So do you ever take anything from that, you know, the science part of that and put it in your choreography?

[30:46] Dominique Kelley: All the time. Oh, my gosh. All the time. I say that's one of the most important things because at the end of the day, there are some people who don't speak the same language that we speak. There are some people who are hearing impaired, so they won't be able to hear it. So you have to do nonverbal communication. What was very interesting, too, was when we set the show in the West End, that's a different culture. British culture is completely different than American culture. So just teaching people what it was to be an American nonverbally was very interesting, too. And it's like, yes, you can't do a caricature, but we wouldn't do that or like that wouldn't happen. Or you need to push your way through people.

Don't be so polite. And it's funny. It's like, for example, walking in the South down the street or walking in Times Square. Nonverbally, you might get pushed and like things might happen quickly, where down South, it might be a little bit slower and people are passing you and being a little more polite. So even just that little nonverbal cue, it shows where you are. You know what I mean? So little things like that about like showing how you're sad. How would you show how you're sad without using your face or like how would you show that you're angry? Because but this is a thing. People show anger in a lot of different ways. So what does that mean? And as you can see, I like to get heady about all of these things. I just I love it.

[32:08] Eila Mell: So interesting.

[32:13] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, exactly. Because it's not just about doing steps. That's steps are boring, but it's what's behind the steps. Yes. Yes. And my favorite thing that I've learned is my favorite bit of choreography is the choreography that the audience does in the seats. Do they lean back? Do they lean forward? Do they lean to the side to talk to somebody? Are they looking around? And I think if I've done my job correctly, you're doing choreography in the seats, too.

[32:35] Eila Mell: Yeah, I love that. So when I went to Gatsby last week, I went with a friend of mine who is a dancer and she was thrilled.

[32:41] Dominique Kelley: Oh, my gosh. She was screaming after every number.

[32:48] Eila Mell: Oh, that's great. Tell him I said, yeah, I will. So what is happening on Dancing with the Stars that everyone is in such great shape after they do that show? What's happening there?

[32:53] Dominique Kelley: Because they're dancing with the stars diet. They're dancing 24 seven. I mean, the good thing was I've danced on it a couple of times. I've seen like maybe three or four over the years. But like those people on that show, a they're doing a workout regimen so they can look great half naked because the costuming on that show is like top notch. But also remember, not only are they dancing like the pros are dancing in numbers all together, they're dancing with their partner. So if you're dancing eight hours a day or sometimes, I mean, more than that, your body is going to be in tip top shape. And not only that to your brain is going to be in shape, too, because you can get anything thrown at you and you're ready for life.

[33:40] Eila Mell: Yeah, you probably need to increase calorie intake to maintain burning that much.

[33:46] Dominique Kelley: Absolutely. Absolutely. You should make an eight hour class that you can put online.

[33:52] Eila Mell: Oh, my gosh. We'll see how many people can last through it. And that's the funny thing, too. Like most people in the business, we rehearse eight hours a day, six days a week. And it's just like imagine, you know, I won't call them normal people, but anybody has a nine to five job and you're working eight hours and most times you're sitting. Imagine people dancing eight hours a day.

[34:14] Dominique Kelley: Right. Exactly. Like what athletes do. It's not very different.

[34:17] Eila Mell: Not very different at all. It's all physical.

[34:20] Dominique Kelley: Yeah. I know you said you learned from different pieces of, you know, cultural dance moments when growing up. Was there a show that spoke to you as a dancer, a musical theater show?

[34:30] Eila Mell: Oh, a musical theater show. I was about to get ready to.

[34:35] Dominique Kelley: Oh, you can do that, too. Basically, I didn't really grow up being a Disney kid. I was like a Nick kid. And I thought Nick was just so edgy and different. And there was a show that was the equivalent of Mickey Mouse Club called Roundhouse choreographed by Barry Lather. That's how I learned to dance. That's how I learned to tumble. And it's so wild that like Chris Dupre, who's a friend of mine, and Mickey Duran, who was also on that show, and Ivan Dudinsky, they're friends of mine now. And I watched them growing up and they, in short, taught me how to dance. But now when we come to musical theater, I will say Jelly's Last Jam. Hey. Sophisticated ladies, I grew up watching like there was just so many shows that thank God that my mother exposed me to.

[35:23] Eila Mell: Yeah. But I will have to say this. Beyond growing up 2020, where we all sat down for a little bit. I had Broadway HD. I was on YouTube. I was watching like Legally Blonde from MTV. It just didn't end. And I think it's reminding us all to still have that childlike quality of education of musical theater. And it also made me realize too that I'm like, yeah, it would help if musical theater is a little more accessible for all of us. Because when we were at home, I watched everything from Falsettos to what else did I watch? I watched Annie. I watched Holiday Inn. Like you name it, it ran the gamut. Pippin, like up and down, back and forth. And it was great to basically just revisit all of those things, especially getting older to go like, hmm, do I still feel that way about what I saw years ago?

As I grew up, does the lens change? Does my POV change? And then also where we are in society, does that change how I look at it? So it's been nice to like revisit Gypsy even. Because I remember growing up watching Bette Midler, baby went off because it was on TV. It was on TV when we saw it, you know what I mean? Or even like Beaches, watching Beaches. Or Polly. And there were just so many things that were coming on TV all the time. So it's now nice to go, oh, let me revisit to see how I feel about it.

[37:03] Eila Mell: Yeah. So in musical theater, music, you know, the music itself has certainly evolved, and it sounds more current. Has dance also evolved in musical theater, do you think?

[37:09] Dominique Kelley: I think so. I mean, for example, way back in the day, musical theater songs were the pop songs. Right. So it's just so interesting now that like, things have a more pop edge to it. And I mean, I think it changes from season to season. The season that Gatsby opened, there was a lot more street jazz on Broadway that season. But if you look at last season, it's more in quotes, traditional musical theater, with like, a little bit of street jazz here. So for example, like Death Becomes Her, gives more of a nod to way back, same thing with Boop, that gave a nod to way back Pirates of Penzance, gave a nod, you know, Gypsy kind of gave a nod. It wasn't like, you didn't have like your Ann Juliets or Hamiltons or anything that was like, more straightforward street jazz or hip hop that are infusing other little things in there.

So needless to say, I just feel like anybody training in musical theater, training street jazz and hip hop, a lot of people steer clear from that. But you're not going to, as of last season, you're not going to do a lot of bap ma's and double pirouettes and Fosse hands and jazz hands. And I think just to be prepared for anything, get to know your body and train in all the ways, because, again, we're hearing more pop, so you should have pop in your book. You know, you should have something contemporary in your book just to be prepared. And then also think about some some, you know, things that were written recently, some like monologues that were recently written or like anything with dance. It's like, see where the trend is, because more than likely the trend is going to come to Broadway sooner than you think.

[40:40] Eila Mell: We took, we had cats which broke the theater world when it did the Jellicle ball, so it took something that was a classic and it really turned it on its head as a creative. Did that get your juices flowing to say, "Well, what if we take whatever name a show and make it, I don't know, steampunk, make it African, make it something that it completely wasn't to tell the story differently?" I think that's been happening for a while. I'm happy that cats did it, but like even back in the day, I choreographed the all-black version of Oklahoma and that was a nice remix and it just changed the way I felt about Oklahoma in general and it grounded it in a different place. I mean, I'm all about like a big swing.

Like I think Jamie Lloyd has done some big swings. I think everybody who worked on cats, Jellicle ball did some big swings. I think we need big swings more and more. It gets hard financially because, you know, it's a big risk just in general. You never quite know, but I think I'm always inspired by people who take a risk like that in their storytelling as long as it makes sense to all of us, you know? And that is a beautiful thing about art too because our lenses will be completely different. You will never have a hundred percent of the community who will be behind what you did, but you will have a hundred percent of the community come out to have an opinion on it. So you might as well at least make it something you can stand behind and something that you can say, "Oh, that was a big swing, but I felt this way about it."

So yeah, I'm always inspired by that. I'm also inspired by just traditional, if you're gonna tell the story the way it's told already, just do it impeccably and then I have no nose, you know? I just like enjoying storytelling where I can just sit back and go along with the ride. Like for example, Harry Potter. I'm not even a Potter head, but I went there the first 10 minutes. I was trying to figure everything out and then after that 10 minutes, I just sat back and I was like, "Sure, I'm on the ride." And I think for any creative, when you go to a show, you just want to sit back and enjoy it and be on the ride and not pick it apart.

[43:26] Dominique Kelley: Right, yeah, and it's very basic, you know, fundamentally you just want to have a good time. Yes, that's why we go. Well, that's why I go, I should say. Well, some people go to have a strong opinion, but I don't do that either. I want to love every show, I say, but I think it's good to have an opinion. I think it's good to have a strong opinion. It's just where and whom you share it and at what time. I think that's the difference that people are misconstrued. I think in New York you are judged based on your opinion or just in the world in general in the industry. I think people ask like, "What did you think about something?" And whether you love it or hate it, if you can back it up with some good information, it'll make whoever asked you go like, "Oh, I get it. I didn't think about it that way. I get it." But I think it's just where and when and to whom you share that opinion.

[44:10] Eila Mell: Yeah, those keyboard. What did you do with your Oklahoma to make it different basically in short?

[44:17] Dominique Kelley: Just by having it all black and we only changed one word in the whole script and we changed it from blonde hair to black hair. Everything else was the same, but then when you think about like, ironically, cowman meant white people and cowboy meant black people. So the farmer in the cowmen is what they're saying, right? No, and then like some of the first cowboys were black and then also we know we belong to the land and the land we belong to is grand. That has a whole different meaning when you think about like the plight of African Americans with westward expansion and Tulsa Massacre and all those other things. So I don't think I necessarily did anything different. I just did it through my lens.

[45:02] Eila Mell: Like the cow your dream, but keep going. Sorry, your dream ballet was still ballet.

[45:07] Dominique Kelley: Um, yeah for the most part it was still ballet, but at the end, um when there was a fight scene I had harkened back to police brutality. So I did the same stance that we've seen with police brutality. So there were like little Easter eggs there and that also when it came to the wedding jump in the broom, which is an African American tradition, so we put the broom in there and there were just little things like that to give it the touch without necessarily, you know, throwing out the baby with the bathwater, but it was just more so incorporating touches to let you know this community of where we were and what kind of people were there. Like even with Kansas City, there was no like high kicks and it wasn't hokey.

They were pretty much grounded and stepping and doing tap and like really vibing off of each other. And I was thinking like if they tapped and they were always on a horse, they would have chafed inner thighs and almost be kind of bowlegged from being on the horse. So I don't think they would be up completely upright, you know? And I try to go into like what body types and what kind of people how they would be celebrating and I think that's why it was a success for Denver Center.

[46:20] Eila Mell: Wow, that's so interesting. Yeah, I love the science behind the creative, the creativity that you bring. It's, it makes it exciting because as an audience member you're being educated as well as, you know, just having a good time.

[46:36] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, it's just left and right brain mixed. I think that's my mantra. If you can do left brain or right brain, I think that's sometimes what creates really great art. And when you work with a recording artist, you know, there's no script, but you approach each song in a similar manner where you talk about the themes of the song.

[46:55] Dominique Kelley: Absolutely, every single time. Like for example, when I worked on Usher's residency, ironically, this was three Gatsby. There were just like, "Oh yeah, we wanted something like Usher to be Gatsby and he's gonna be controlling the room." And I was like, "Oh, okay, I can do that." All right, this person is this and then Simon, who was our director, he was like, "Okay, some people are a spirit. Some people are there. They're a real person. Nobody does everything at the same time. We're at a party." So it was nice to like try to figure out, "Okay, you three, you're gonna try to pick up these ladies, but they say no and then eventually one grabs." And as long as the audience may not know all the like minutiae and the details, but as long as the people on stage know and the artist knows, then I think you have a full complete thought and it makes it easier, right?

The audience might not know exactly, but they know that the person is committed to whatever they're doing. That's what makes the difference and there's intention there. Nothing is just happenstance. It's just intention.

[47:52] Dominique Kelley: Now, it's not all education. I mean, like we're not dancing per se like how people would have danced in the 1920s because I feel like if we watch that, we'd be a little bit bored.

[48:03] Eila Mell: Sure, especially on Usher's stage who does so many amazing things.

[48:08] Dominique Kelley: But it was great to at least have those little things that ground you in the world and ground you with the story and then from there you can paint.

[48:15] Eila Mell: Right, of course because the point is not to do a documentary of that time. It's just to suggest it.

[48:21] Dominique Kelley: Absolutely. And I think people forget that suggestions are wonderful things too. Nothing has to be pastiche or a museum piece.

[48:28] Eila Mell: Museum, right. People have done it better years ago.

[48:31] Dominique Kelley: Let me try my thing. But the reason that it's better years ago is not because they were better then, it's because they were looking at it from that lens. We are looking, we're coming at it from a different lens, so we can't see it in that same way.

[48:45] Eila Mell: Absolutely, the flavor of it, you just, you know, that just sprinkled on the top.

[48:50] Dominique Kelley: Absolutely, and I think about the shimmy for example. Like back in the 1920s, a shimmy was like, "Oh my gosh," like pearl-clutching, like you could be arrested for just shimmy, but now we see little girls shimmy. You don't imagine like just anywhere. We don't think about it.

[49:05] Eila Mell: We don't think about it at all and people forget that. I'm like a lot of the dance steps that happened in the 1920s is like, trust, I did the research. There wasn't a lot happening in certain areas. Like right before 1920, everybody, it was a closed hole. People were very conservative the way they were dancing and I was like, "Yes, I could do two hours of that if you want."

[49:25] Dominique Kelley: But that's who wants that, right? Nobody wants that. But it's the same, you know, talking about Oklahoma. That was controversial at the time. I think of it today as very traditional, but Rodgers and Hammerstein, they were, you know, breaking boundaries.

[49:34] Eila Mell: Exactly. It's the first show where someone was killed on stage.

[49:39] Dominique Kelley: Huh? And not only that, to have a dream ballet, that wasn't really a thing either. That was not a thing.

[49:44] Eila Mell: Yes, right, right.

[49:49] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, so, you know, we forget now. It's easy to forget because, you know, it seems like a dusty old show, but it really, you know, they were not, their shows were really special.

[50:00] Eila Mell: We are a nation and culture of forgetters for the better and the worst.

[50:05] Dominique Kelley: I guess so. There's a lot I'd like to forget, if only.

[50:09] Eila Mell: Exactly, but I think people don't, you know, less and less they care about learning about the world before they were born into it.

[50:16] Dominique Kelley: So, yeah, so not that you don't have, you know, you're not a busy person, but is there anything else coming up on the horizon that you can speak about?

[50:25] Dominique Kelley: Project-wise, I wish I could. I will say this, it is gonna be an epic music video experience that comes out soon. So stay tuned. It's next level. I can't quite say yet and I hate being that person. I really do. But stay tuned because it's coming out very soon. Most importantly, this is my year of chill because I've worked really hard for 30 years. So now I'm just enjoying Gatsby-ness.

[50:56] Eila Mell: Sure, I'm good. I'm gonna be out teaching in Jacob's Pillow in Massachusetts for about a week, so I'm excited about that. But my next project that I'm working on is me sitting down.

[51:10] Dominique Kelley: Well, I love that, you know. That's nice because that doesn't get to happen a lot.

[51:12] Eila Mell: No, it does not and that's a project to say like, "Okay, I'm going to sit down." I made a promise to myself that anytime I'm not vertical, I will be horizontal.

[51:23] Dominique Kelley: There you go.

[51:25] Eila Mell: No, but congratulations that you're at a place where you can afford to do that because, you know, not everyone can get off that train.

[51:31] Dominique Kelley: Yeah, and so, you know, enjoy that time. It's so special.

[51:37] Eila Mell: Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. Yes. Well, we invite you to come back anytime you have a project and we love talking to you.

[51:43] Dominique Kelley: I love how thoughtful you are. Thank you. Once you're here, you're family.

[51:49] Eila Mell: So that's right here for it when the next project comes. I'm gonna call y'all so I can come back and talk about it.

[51:52] Dominique Kelley: Excellent. And if you win that, that big music video is about to drop, you can come back and announce it then when you can rate our audience. I'd love to know.

[52:01] Eila Mell: Well, thank you so much for joining us so much. Thank you, and we'll see everyone next time on Behind the Awards. Bye-bye.