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[0:00] Hannah Cruz: This is Hannah Cruz and you're listening to Behind The Award.

[0:30] Bruce Gotlieb: And the other winner is Gregory Peck, Moby Dick.

[0:34] Eila Mell: I think I won one of these in 1947 and it was very encouraging.

[0:42] Bruce Gotlieb: And it's very encouraging now.

[0:47] Eila Mell: Hello and welcome to Behind The Awards.

[0:59] Bruce Gotlieb: I'm Eila. I am here with Bruce.

[1:02] Bruce Gotlieb: Hello there. How are you?

[1:04] Eila Mell: I'm good.

[1:05] Bruce Gotlieb: So it's so exciting when there's a tie at an award show.

[1:09] Eila Mell: You know, and we don't get it often.

[1:11] Bruce Gotlieb: I know.

[1:12] Eila Mell: So this was in 1999. It was Don Cheadle and Gregory Peck.

[1:17] Bruce Gotlieb: They tied for their respective projects.

[1:21] Eila Mell: So I think, if I remember correctly, Gregory Peck was in Moby Dick.

[1:25] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[1:26] Eila Mell: And Don Cheadle, was this when he played Sammy Davis Jr.?

[1:29] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, in The Rat Pack.

[1:30] Eila Mell: Okay. All right. Yeah. I love Don Cheadle.

[1:33] Bruce Gotlieb: He's great and he's coming to Broadway this season.

[1:36] Eila Mell: I know. I'm so excited.

[1:38] Bruce Gotlieb: So do you have a favorite tie at an award show?

[1:41] Eila Mell: You know, I don't know that I do. The one that stands out to me the most is Barbra Streisand's.

[1:47] Bruce Gotlieb: Barbra Streisand and Katherine Hepburn.

[1:49] Eila Mell: Yeah, that is the one, I think, anyway. But it's just, I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often.

[1:57] Bruce Gotlieb: I know. You know, all of the organizations. It's not like they're all going by the same.

[2:00] Eila Mell: Okay, there's, you know, an odd number of people who vote because da-da-da-da-da, you know.

[2:06] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[2:07] Eila Mell: There's no math behind it, as far as I know, or formula.

[2:10] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, I don't know.

[2:11] Eila Mell: And I don't know if some of them have safeguards against a tie.

[2:14] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[2:15] Eila Mell: Like, do they have a tiebreaker just in case?

[2:17] Bruce Gotlieb: I don't know.

[2:18] Eila Mell: I don't know either. But I am surprised over how many years we've been handing out awards.

[2:24] Bruce Gotlieb: You know, every award is different.

[2:27] Eila Mell: Right. But we just had the, what, the 77th Tony.

[2:30] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[2:31] Eila Mell: So you would think, and I think Oscars are older than that.

[2:35] Bruce Gotlieb: Oscars are old, yeah.

[2:36] Eila Mell: Oscars go back to the movie Wings, which is the 20s, maybe, I want to say.

[2:41] Bruce Gotlieb: I don't know. I could be wrong, but.

[2:43] Eila Mell: But you would think over all of these years.

[2:45] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[2:46] Eila Mell: You would come across a tie, but.

[2:48] Bruce Gotlieb: That's right.

[2:49] Eila Mell: Well.

[2:50] Bruce Gotlieb: It's always thrilling.

[2:51] Eila Mell: I know. So I want to talk about something more serious.

[2:54] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay.

[2:55] Eila Mell: So, Shayna Taub. She was a favorite of mine in Ragtime and, you know, of course, Suffs.

[3:01] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh my God, she was amazing in Suffs.

[3:03] Eila Mell: She's just such a talent. But for personal reasons, she's stepping away from Ragtime.

[3:09] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, she made that announcement a couple weeks ago.

[3:11] Eila Mell: Yeah. It's okay to talk about because she made it public.

[3:15] Bruce Gotlieb: So she said the day before Ragtime opened, she had a miscarriage.

[3:21] Eila Mell: And it was her fourth miscarriage. And she had to have a DNC, which is a medical procedure that is similar to an abortion.

[3:32] Bruce Gotlieb: And she wants, I think it's important to her that people realize that women's health care is important, life-saving.

[3:41] Eila Mell: And, you know, it's not something that we should take lightly. So I just wanted to raise awareness because she and her husband created a fundraising page for future patients.

[3:53] Bruce Gotlieb: It's not for her. She's not looking for money for herself in the least. This is to help others.

[3:59] Eila Mell: The cost of one person's full care is $2,500. So she wants people to pay it forward and help others.

[4:08] Bruce Gotlieb: So if you go to her Instagram page, just search Shayna Taub, and there's a link. And you can donate there.

[4:16] Eila Mell: And what a special thing to do during the holiday season. You know, so many of us, we really don't need anything.

[4:23] Bruce Gotlieb: It's, you know, to give back and to give others. And, you know, what better way to help somebody.

[4:29] Eila Mell: Exactly. Medically. Like the gift of life is, you know.

[4:33] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[4:34] Eila Mell: That's really the best gift you can give in someone else's name, perhaps. You know, I mean, don't do it for your kids because they want gifts.

[4:40] Bruce Gotlieb: But for the rest of us, I certainly don't need anything. If anyone wants to give me a gift, give it, you know, donate it because I don't need anything.

[4:49] Eila Mell: You know, most of us really don't need anything.

[4:51] Bruce Gotlieb: No.

[4:52] Eila Mell: And I know a lot of people that, you know, especially in the holiday season, that they do. They'll, you know, of course, buying, you know, things for their friends and their family and whatever.

[5:02] Bruce Gotlieb: But I know a lot of people that also take this time of the year to choose and make, you know, a donation.

[5:08] Eila Mell: Or, you know, some sort of contribution to a nonprofit. Or, you know, in some way to try to help and pay it forward to those that need.

[5:17] Bruce Gotlieb: So what better way than with an organization that is close to the Broadway community?

[5:23] Eila Mell: No, absolutely. And it's just, you know, it's just it feels good to do something for others and to put, you know, put forth something good into the world.

[5:32] Bruce Gotlieb: So, you know, we wish Shaina Taub all the best.

[5:36] Eila Mell: Absolutely. And, you know, she just needs a little space for herself. But we'll be there when she's ready to come back and do her next project.

[5:46] Bruce Gotlieb: Absolutely. She's incredible. So just wanted to shine a light on that.

[5:51] Eila Mell: Speaking of bright lights on Broadway.

[5:53] Bruce Gotlieb: And speaking of Shaina Taub, right?

[5:55] Eila Mell: Yes.

[5:56] Bruce Gotlieb: You have her former castmate and friend, Hannah Cruz, who is, you know, playing a little chess.

[6:04] Eila Mell: That's right. And boy, she lights up that stage.

[6:07] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[6:08] Eila Mell: Yeah, she does. All right. Let's bring Hannah out.

[6:11] Bruce Gotlieb: Absolutely. Well, Bruce, I feel very cool right now because we have one of the stars of The Hot Ticket on Broadway.

[6:20] Eila Mell: We have Hannah Cruz with us.

[6:22] Bruce Gotlieb: That's right. Welcome.

[6:24] Hannah Cruz: Hi, guys. Happy to be here.

[6:26] Eila Mell: Yes. Good morning.

[6:27] Hannah Cruz: Thank you so much. We're thrilled to have you.

[6:30] Eila Mell: So I saw the show yesterday.

[6:31] Hannah Cruz: Yes.

[6:32] Eila Mell: Oh, cool.

[6:33] Hannah Cruz: Yeah.

[6:34] Eila Mell: And I saw the show. What was it now? Two weeks ago.

[6:36] Hannah Cruz: OK, great.

[6:38] Eila Mell: Yeah. So we're fully immersed in chess.

[6:40] Hannah Cruz: OK.

[6:41] Bruce Gotlieb: Not a clue.

[6:42] Hannah Cruz: No.

[6:43] Eila Mell: Unfortunately.

[6:44] Hannah Cruz: Do you?

[6:45] Eila Mell: I do. My husband taught me right before we started rehearsals.

[6:47] Hannah Cruz: And I always looked at it as, like, this impossible game to learn. And I couldn't possibly, like, sit down and learn it.

[6:53] Eila Mell: And it's not that difficult to learn.

[6:55] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. Once you, like, realize how all the pieces move, it's fine. But it is quite fun to play. I encourage everyone to learn. It's very fun.

[7:04] Eila Mell: Did it give you insight into the characters and the way the play is written?

[7:09] Hannah Cruz: I mean, my character, I think, hates chess. Or resents it in a lot of ways.

[7:13] Eila Mell: Right.

[7:14] Hannah Cruz: For sure. And so I don't think it would be, like, important to her. But I do think the way in which these people move, like, the manipulation and the trying to stay, like, four steps ahead, I think that's very chess.

[7:26] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[7:27] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. So there's so many questions I have just from seeing the show. But let's backtrack a little bit.

[7:31] Eila Mell: OK.

[7:35] Hannah Cruz: So I'm sure you didn't see the original production.

[7:38] Eila Mell: No, but I did watch it at Lincoln Center recently.

[7:41] Hannah Cruz: Oh, OK. Yes.

[7:43] Eila Mell: Were you a fan of the music, though, growing up?

[7:45] Hannah Cruz: Absolutely. Yeah. I was, like, a big musical theater person. I mean, still am. But when I was a kid, it was, like, to the nth degree.

[7:53] Eila Mell: And I loved One Night in Bangkok.

[7:56] Hannah Cruz: I loved I Know Him So Well. And I loved Mountain Duet was one that I listened to a lot on my iPod.

[8:03] Eila Mell: But One Night in Bangkok in particular, when you see the show, you see that I come up from the bottom of the stage.

[8:09] Hannah Cruz: And that's right after One Night in Bangkok. And so I get to stand underneath the stage and, like, listen to them all stopping on stage.

[8:17] Eila Mell: And I love that number. It's my favorite. It's so high energy.

[8:20] Hannah Cruz: And your ensemble, boy, they are working like nobody's business.

[8:25] Eila Mell: I know.

[8:26] Hannah Cruz: I know. I think, like, coming into rehearsal, I was like, what is the ensemble going to do? Like, I wasn't sure what.

[8:34] Eila Mell: We all were kind of creating a new musical in that way. And seeing what Lauren Lataro did with One Night in Bangkok, with The Arbiter, with the opening number, the amount of dance she's brought to the show is very cool.

[8:45] Hannah Cruz: I'm just going to say it's the most creative way to put on a pair of pants.

[8:49] Eila Mell: Yes.

[8:50] Hannah Cruz: I know.

[8:51] Eila Mell: That's great.

[8:52] Hannah Cruz: That's how Aaron puts his pants on every day, I bet.

[8:53] Eila Mell: I bet.

[8:55] Hannah Cruz: How many takes in rehearsal do you know was it to, like, get that right?

[9:00] Eila Mell: I mean, these dancers are so good. Honestly, I don't think it took them that long.

[9:05] Hannah Cruz: I was there when they were, like, building the number, but I've been there since they've been running it. And it's never looked bad. It's never looked difficult. It's just, like, we have some of the best dancers that I've ever seen on Broadway. Like, and we've compiled them all together. It's pretty incredible.

[9:23] Eila Mell: I can't believe what Michael is doing, those flips he does.

[9:26] Hannah Cruz: It's incredible.

[9:27] Eila Mell: It's crazy. When he jumps over the girls, his whole spine, like, makes a perfect C. I'm like, how are you doing that?

[9:33] Hannah Cruz: I think he's superhuman.

[9:37] Eila Mell: Probably.

[9:38] Hannah Cruz: I agree.

[9:39] Eila Mell: I agree.

[9:41] Hannah Cruz: Do you have to come the same time everybody shows up for their call time?

[9:44] Eila Mell: No.

[9:45] Hannah Cruz: I don't get to the theater until the overture starts, basically.

[9:48] Eila Mell: Wow.

[9:49] Hannah Cruz: Because you don't come on until act two, for those who haven't seen it yet.

[9:52] Eila Mell: Yeah, that's a nice luxury of time.

[9:54] Hannah Cruz: It is, honestly. I love to work, so a part of me is, like, give me more, you know? And it can also be kind of isolating, just being in act two, and I only really ever see Leah and Nick Criss. I don't really see anybody else.

[10:10] Eila Mell: So it can be kind of isolating.

[10:12] Hannah Cruz: But I'm not going to lie, on those two show days, getting to get to the theater at 2 o'clock instead of, like, 1.15 is a huge difference to a late night gal like myself.

[10:23] Eila Mell: Right.

[10:24] Hannah Cruz: And who needs to sleep in. Like, it makes a big difference to me.

[10:26] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[10:27] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. And then you have, you know, just that extra break time. It's not a bad thing.

[10:31] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[10:33] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, definitely not complaining.

[10:34] Eila Mell: Yeah. So this piece, you know, for years has been trying to come to Broadway and has incarnations in different ways. How long have you been part of it?

[10:39] Hannah Cruz: When did you, you know, get scooped up to be part of chess?

[10:44] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, I think it was early June of this past year. I was getting ready to go on my honeymoon. My husband and I got married last August, and I was doing stuff, so we couldn't, like, take a honeymoon after, even though we got married in Maui and it was a vacation all in itself.

[11:06] Eila Mell: Amazing.

[11:07] Hannah Cruz: But we still wanted to go more places.

[11:09] Eila Mell: Yeah.

[11:10] Hannah Cruz: You're entitled. And so we went to Greece in June, and we had this whole big two-week trip planned. And right before we left, I think my agent, Katie, called me and was like, would you be interested in going in for chess? Because I know I had told them I was kind of done with musical.

[11:29] Eila Mell: So she was like, would you want to go in for this? I think.

[11:34] Hannah Cruz: And I was like, oh, yeah. I like, I don't think that she sings too much. So maybe, maybe we could look into that. Let me go on my vacation and I'll come back to you. And I came back and I think I auditioned like the second or third day after I landed from Greece.

[11:47] Eila Mell: And so I was still like very chilled out. And I felt like, all right, like I'll go give this a shot. And the audition went so well because I was so comfortable. And I remember they gave me a note in the room. I was doing the scene with Anatoly. It wasn't Nick. It was a reader. And they were like, no. Okay. Do it like you're lying to him. Like nothing you're saying is true. I was like, oh, fun. And we just like played in the room and you can always tell. It's like a vibe thing. They were picking up what I was putting down. And I was like malleable enough to be able to play. And then I came in and, oh, no, it was the same day. And then I sang with Leah. I sang I Know Him So Well with Leah, which was crazy to me. A gleek like myself. And then I kind of, and I had to come in a different day than everyone else. I forget why. And so then they had auditions for like the next week. And I was doing a reading in the same building. And so I could hear the girls singing.

[12:46] Eila Mell: Oh, my God.

[12:47] Hannah Cruz: Right down the hall. And I was like, well, we'll see, I guess. And my husband's agent actually called him and was like, congrats to Hannah. And he was like, on what? And he was like, chess? And I hadn't even heard yet.

[13:03] Eila Mell: Oh my gosh.

[13:04] Hannah Cruz: Wow. There was no part in the audition process where I was like stressed out about it. I kind of felt like it was going to work itself out, which does not always happen.

[13:18] Eila Mell: Just rewind time a little bit more, away from Chess for a moment. Suffs was exceptional, you were exceptional. How did that all come to be?

[13:49] Hannah Cruz: Suffs was a long journey. I did it off-Broadway at The Public, but I played Ruzsa, so very different. But that's kind of where I pulled a lot of my Russian dialect from doing Polish with Ruzsa at The Public. Similar, kind of different mouth placements, but similar. And that show was like, I think the first time, not the first time, but I really fell in love with that group of people and that cast so deeply. And I think we all knew we were about to go on like a very long journey together. And so it was like creating this like sisterhood. And I'll never forget like our dressing room at The Public was like me, Pippa, Nicky M. James, Shayna, Ally Bonino, Nadia Nadashi. It was like, it was the best. We had the best time in that dressing room.

[14:34] Hannah Cruz: And so after that, I was doing something else. And Lee called me, Lisa Rolink called me and was like, would you be interested in playing Nez? And I was like, I was pretty against it at first, just because I loved playing Ruzsa so much. And I got to tap into a completely different side of myself that I've never been asked to do before. And I really enjoyed that. And also Ruzsa doesn't like the focus is not on the vocals. And I think anything to me where the focus is on the vocals, I get really anxious. And at that time, Nez was all stuff written for Pippa. And it just like didn't fit my voice as well. I didn't feel like, but I tried it in the workshop. We ended up liking it. And then I think we were rehearsing for the Da Vinci Code.

And I got the call that we were going to go to Broadway and we were going to be at the Music Box. And so by that point, we had done another reading and Shayna had written stuff just for my voice. And I felt a little more comfortable with it. It's still very high. And that was a very tough thing. But it was, I mean, being next door to the Music Box now is pretty special. I just love that whole block of theaters. And I'll never forget it. I mean, what a Broadway debut. I was telling my dresser Marissa yesterday, like nothing will be I don't I reserve the right to like let other things be as amazing as this. But nothing to me will ever match the night before or the night of the election and the night after the election.

Like that was the craziest audience theater experience I've ever, ever experienced. Like feel to say that like feeling what the audience was feeling like it was it was you didn't have to be an empath to be like affected by everything that was happening in that room. It was so intense. And I don't know if any experience will ever be as intense as that. Because you're experiencing history in real time with an unusually large amount of people.

[15:39] Eila Mell: So it's yes, that's really incredible. Right. And trying to tell the story of how we got to not only where we are, but to continue to fight for exactly all of the equalities.

[15:45] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, it was pretty heady. And like, and just so intense. It was so intense. And it felt like a like, especially the day after felt like a like a collective mourning or something. And it was just like, and people were tired. And it's just it was a lot. It was a lot of energy. I'm sure it was special. It was very special. And I'll never forget it.

[16:10] Eila Mell: You know, you said twice about wanting to have roles that don't have so much singing. And I'm surprised, because you come into Chess, and you immediately start singing, and you just kill it immediately, like from the first note. So I'm surprised to hear you say that.

[16:22] Hannah Cruz: Well, I remember when I signed on, I actually didn't even know that I had a song. I thought that someone else's story was going to Leah. And I was like, Oh, okay, so I don't have a solo. And then I ran into Danny Strong. My husband and I walk a lot. We were literally like walking the length of Manhattan one day. And we ran into Danny Strong. He was like, you know, you have a song. And I was like, No, I didn't know that. Because it's a, I think they did it in a Swedish version. He has a man, he has a child. And now we're bringing it to Broadway, but it's never been done like within the context of the show like this. But the thing I find different about the Chess score, maybe compared to a lot of scores written now, is that it's so backed by emotion and feeling and I never it's a true like acting through song moment, like something you learn when you're in a musical theater class or something like the words to me and the emotion.

Emotions to me are so much more important than my tone or like, if I don't sound like amazing on a high note or so I don't really like, I don't really think about that as much I want my voice and I like trust that the story is going to get me through and that is the thing that I'm interested in doing if it's like a whole song building up to this like high note moment that is very exposed. That to me like, will put me in an early grave. That stresses me out so much. But this, I know, I know the acting is the most important part of it, in my mind. And so I stress out about a lot less.

[21:01] Eila Mell: Good. No, well the acting has to be in any show the most important because otherwise, why do we care?

[21:07] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, why are we here? Like, yeah, just listen to a soundtrack at home.

[21:11] Eila Mell: Exactly. Yeah, yeah. If I were you, I would try to negotiate that you get to keep that coat you wear and that dress.

[21:20] Hannah Cruz: The minute Tom gave me that coat, Tom broke our costume designer, I was like, this is mine. Okay, this is mine after we're done. You have to go source out another one.

[21:32] Hannah Cruz: And the dress too, it's gorgeous. Wow. We went through many iterations of that dress. Really? Finally, yeah, I think I wore two different dresses in previews and then this dress I'm in now has been dyed. Because it used to be the same color as like the couches that we sit on. How funny. But now it's the same color as the coat. Yes, which is great. So then I have like a like a story through color for her a little bit. Yeah, like a palette.

[21:56] Eila Mell: Yeah, because there was a video that when that was around, like with different bows during preview and like you were in a navy dress and you were this. Yep, yep. It was fun though. That's why I love previews. How fun to like get to do something.

[22:09] Hannah Cruz: Now we do the same thing. I mean, same thing eight times a week, which is a different challenge in itself. But like, it's it is like interesting what a new piece of clothing will do to whatever it is you're doing. Yeah, really does like imbue it with something else. And the pumps are great too, by the way.

[22:24] Hannah Cruz: The pumps are great. And they're very comfortable. Very comfortable. Wow. I know. Those are also going to be mine. Yeah, they should be. They should be. I get so tired of seeing like people in character shoes and every show I say so I appreciate real shoes.

[22:39] Eila Mell: I know. So do I. I've never worn like a real pair of pumps. Yeah. And they're like Stuart Wiseman. They're just their field. Yeah, you know.

[22:48] Hannah Cruz: And everyone on stage, like you were saying with the costumes, everyone is just it's impeccable. Yeah, you know, everyone, even the ensemble dancing in three piece suits and, you know, everything is just so meticulously done and everyone looks amazing.

[23:06] Eila Mell: Good to hear it. Yeah, I feel the same. I was talking to Sarah, you know, Sarah Mille, one of the dancers. And I said, I was thinking how great for you that you get a break from, you know, like skimpy costumes and you get to wear a suit. And then I saw Act Two. Yeah, I was like, couldn't be skimpier. Nope. I mean, wow. Yeah. Pretty insane. And every one of them is gorgeous. It's so hot. It's crazy. Yeah.

[23:33] Eila Mell: Are you wearing a wig for the show?

[23:34] Hannah Cruz: I mean, I am. It's hard to tell because it's so natural looking. I know. I know they did a great job with the wig. Yeah. I think originally we wanted to use my real hair, but to dye it and to upkeep it, that's like a lot. Yeah. And but then I did see my wig and I was like, oh, and I went to the hair salon like a week ago and I said, give me that. Yeah.

[23:55] Eila Mell: So they like dyed my hair just like my wig and I got bangs. Because your wig looks so gorgeous on you. So I love it. Yeah. But I always wanted to be blonde. So I was happy about it. It suits you. It looks great. Thank you. Yeah.

[24:11] Eila Mell: Yeah. So Svetlana comes in and so we know the show's going in a slightly different direction just because, you know, there's that hint because of the color you wear. Right. Because we've only really seen black and white and gray up to then. So it's exciting. And what's been your biggest challenge with the role?

[24:30] Hannah Cruz: I will say I think it's the coming in and out, too. I think. I try and listen to the whole first act for the most part, I listen to like certain benchmarks, but sitting around for that long, especially like on two show days when I am at the theater all day, it can be kind of hard with no real rev up time. Like I have to come up. I have maybe 20 minutes on stage and I have to try and present like a fleshed out, fully three dimensional human being in this like me. Me and Nick Chris have like barely a scene together and we have to convey so much of their relationship history in that time. And it's it's fun. And we're like continuing to find new colors in it. But it's definitely a challenge to like to fit it all into that time.

And also to I find the most difficult thing is to enter as a fully realized person grounded with no real rev up. Because usually like the opening number serves as some kind of a like, all right, here we go. Like the train is moving, but I'm jumping on the train as it's already going. Right.

[25:40] Eila Mell: And so that can be hard. I definitely think I figured out what I need to do to get there. But it took me a minute.

[25:48] Hannah Cruz: And also the audience is not necessarily rooting for you. No, no. But the show, the show makes sure that you understand why, why she has done the things that she does. That's good. So, you know, you're not a villain. You're just not the central love interest because, you know, we spent act one getting to know Florence.

[26:08] Eila Mell: Yes. Which is such an interesting way to set up the story, right? Like you're rooting for this couple and then it's like, oh, who's this woman? But then you're like, oh, well, that sucks. She's been through some terrible stuff.

[26:17] Hannah Cruz: Well, that's the thing for her. You could write, you know, if you flipped it and wrote it as Svetlana's story, the same exact set of circumstances, the audience would totally be on your side. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then Florence would come in. They'd be like, who's this?

[27:07] Hannah Cruz: I think it helps the audience to, whether root-for not root-for or at least understand because you're not just looking, you know, a musical theater brushstroke over a story. You're looking at it from a humanistic point of view where this is probably something that happens more often than you think. With back and forth and people jumping into out of each other's beds, and so forth. Absolutely. I watch reality TV. This stuff happens all the time. And let me point out that, yes, Florence may be the ingenue, but first of all, her character has a lot more balls than most ingenues. But she also does some not nice things, you know, that have to do with maybe someone's medication. So she's not so innocent either, which is great. Who wants a perfect character? I like flawed people.

[28:02] Bruce Gotlieb: I know, because we want to watch ourselves on stage, right? Like, that's what I want to see.

[28:09] Hannah Cruz: Yeah.

[28:10] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[28:11] Hannah Cruz: And I think it helps the audience. When you guys do "I Know Him So Well," I think it helps the audience look at you and saying like, oh, wait, it wasn't her fault or it wasn't all, you know, this shade. There's all these other layers within your story and you're like, no, I know this because I've lived it. And that's why I like how it's kind of like the end of "I Know Him So Well," it's kind of like a dream sequence in that, like, we're not really singing it to each other. But it's like, we can actually get a chance to like, look at the other one and be like, oh, I've been where you are.

[28:49] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[28:50] Hannah Cruz: And so there's like an understanding there, which I think is really nice. And I also appreciate very much that it's not the women pitted against each other.

[29:00] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[29:01] Hannah Cruz: That they come to an understanding and, you know.

[29:02] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[29:03] Hannah Cruz: And it's not just like, left in this limbo of like, if we just had that one scene up there and then we sang it separately the whole time, I wouldn't feel as, and that's why I feel like we tried that at one point and both Leah and I really wanted to look at each other. And it doesn't mean that it's real.

[29:21] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[29:22] Hannah Cruz: Like, a lot of this stuff isn't like, humanistic realness. But I think we would be picturing one another in our mind's eye and so we'd be like, commiserating with each other over the shared thing that we have.

[29:34] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[29:35] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. Because at this point in time, the least interesting thing to me is two women fighting over a man.

[29:41] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[29:42] Hannah Cruz: Like, we're good.

[29:43] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[29:44] Hannah Cruz: It's fine.

[29:45] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[29:46] Hannah Cruz: So it was so exciting, the part. Now, you're on stage, I think, during this, so I don't know if you even see it, but the frame comes down and people on stage become the chessboard.

[29:58] Bruce Gotlieb: It's so cool.

[29:59] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. With everybody sitting in the chairs lined up as the pieces.

[30:02] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[30:03] Hannah Cruz: That is thrilling to watch from the audience. Endgame is so fun to do. I was talking to Nick Criss. We were talking about something and I was, I just, I see him because he's the kind of actor who, like, really likes to just leave everything he has on that day there. He likes to, like, leave it all there. And I'm very similar and I remember feeling that way in Suffs after, like, the campaign right before Inez dies. Spoiler alert. But I remember it was a very similar thing and that's a big reason why I liked that part is because there wasn't, there's not always an opportunity to, like, leave everything you have down there. And Nick really gets to do that and I love watching it. It's so satisfying.

[30:47] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[30:48] Hannah Cruz: And he does it every, every show he's on. It's just, it's fabulous. I remember him as Pirelli in Sweeney Todd.

[30:55] Bruce Gotlieb: Amazing.

[30:56] Hannah Cruz: A friend of mine, though, saw him go on as Sweeney and she said.

[30:59] Bruce Gotlieb: So did I.

[31:00] Hannah Cruz: It was remarkable.

[31:02] Bruce Gotlieb: It was so scary.

[31:03] Hannah Cruz: So great.

[31:04] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah, he was remarkable. I mean, he played Burr in Hamilton with me in 2018. And so he wrote me a card for opening and it was, like, going from Hamilton, no scenes together, to Jess, one scene together. Like, one night. Maybe we'll have more. But it's, we, like, barely got anything in hand together. But I've just always really respected him and I'm really grateful for a chance to work with him again. But it's a really meaty scene that you get together in this.

[31:31] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[31:32] Hannah Cruz: We get to do a lot in it, which is so fun. And it's really grown, which I really like. And it continues to grow. Because usually in musicals, the scenes are not as dramatic as in this.

[31:43] Bruce Gotlieb: No.

[31:44] Hannah Cruz: We really get to push the drama to a 10, which is a really nice freedom, almost. Because you don't have to worry about, like, being too much. There's no, and there's still subtlety amongst the drama. But you really get to, I mean, the stakes couldn't be higher.

[31:59] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[32:00] Hannah Cruz: And it's really such a pivotal point in the show, too. It's, yeah.

[32:04] Bruce Gotlieb: It's great.

[32:05] Hannah Cruz: Thank you. I saw a clip from your opening night, Red Carpet, with your buddy from Suffs, Jen Colella, just so excited and just gushing at getting to see you. And it really gives you, I mean, you would know from watching the show that you guys were all connected. It wasn't an act. You can just tell there was this, you know, chemistry between all of you. And then seeing that, it just was so touching to be like, space and time doesn't matter, and it still carries over. And that they were there to support you on opening night was just, was so touching.

[32:34] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. Nicky M. James was there, too. And I didn't realize Nicky was going to be there. So it was so nice to see her. I just love, I love them so much. And it's like you said, like, it's something that, I think adult friendships, I've talked a lot about this a lot recently with my husband and my friends. Adult friendships are really hard.

[33:00] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[33:01] Hannah Cruz: In this business, like, you're thrown together, and it's so intense, and you see each other every day for a year, and then you don't see each other for another year. But with Jen and Nicky, and that friendship, like, remains the same, even with time apart. Like, we don't have to talk every day to, like, remain integral parts of each other's lives, which I think is really nice.

[33:14] Bruce Gotlieb: You have a really special group of people there with that.

[33:17] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, I agree. Have you had an opportunity, because you've been in rehearsal, to see Shaina in Ragtime?

[33:23] Bruce Gotlieb: No.

[33:24] Hannah Cruz: I saw it at City Center, and I tried to play the lottery when we were in tech, but I never won. But I, I mean, when I saw it at City Center, it was remarkable, and I'm sure it continues to be remarkable. I love David Korins, and I would have loved to see what he did with it.

[33:42] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[33:43] Hannah Cruz: I don't know if our schedule, I don't know. Maybe it was the holiday schedule. Sometimes, like, we have different holiday schedules. I know my husband really wants to see it, so we can maybe try and make that work around the Christmas holiday, but I would love to see her in Ragtime. And Ben Levi Ross is in it.

[33:58] Bruce Gotlieb: That's true.

[34:01] Hannah Cruz: I'm a huge fan of Ben. He's so good in this. He's one of my absolute favorites in this cast. He's so good.

[34:06] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[34:07] Hannah Cruz: He's so special.

[34:08] Bruce Gotlieb: And, of course, I love Elsbeth, so he's on that, too.

[34:12] Hannah Cruz: Oh, my God. Yeah. We had Carey Preston on. I was so excited.

[34:15] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, amazing.

[34:18] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. My husband, it's like his comfort show, so it's always on our TV.

[34:22] Bruce Gotlieb: That's so funny.

[34:23] Hannah Cruz: It's very good. It's so, so fun. Yes. And I just love to see who the guests are, because it's always Broadway people. It might be Hannah one day. You'll turn on your TV.

[34:30] Hannah Cruz: Maybe one day.

[34:32] Bruce Gotlieb: So, you know, obviously, you've been quite busy doing theater for a long time now. Is there anything else, any bucket list things that you feel like you want to cross off?

[34:46] Hannah Cruz: Oh, yeah. I really want to do a play. I feel like I've been saying this for many a year, but I'm going to keep saying it until it happens. I really want to do a play. I did The Da Vinci Code. They made that into a play up at a playhouse a couple years ago, and it was one of the best times of my entire life. Like, I would love to play Blanche DuBois in Streetcar at some point. That is a big one on my list. And I have been having a really good time doing TV and film, and I would like to continue that. I think it's every time... I just shot a show called The Copenhagen Test that comes out next month, and we did reshoots in July. And it's such an interesting... There's not a lot of satisfaction in shooting something out of order, but it's like a drug.

I want to keep doing it until I feel satisfied, and I'm not there yet. So I just want to keep... I want to continue to do stuff on screen, because I do find it very compelling, and I like all the nuances that you can pick up that you don't maybe see on a stage.

[35:59] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[36:00] Hannah Cruz: And I really like doing that stuff. You're so much more acting with just your face.

[36:04] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[36:05] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. It's so exciting.

[36:07] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[36:08] Hannah Cruz: Right. Because the internal just comes through. You don't have to do a lot. And you can't lie, really. You see everything in your eyes.

[36:18] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[36:19] Hannah Cruz: Yeah, it's powerful. And I'm sure some of what you lean on in chess with that ramp-up that you were talking about helps translate to that skill set for film and TV.

[36:28] Hannah Cruz: Absolutely. If they're doing, we're going to pick up this scene, you have to just jump in.

[36:32] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[36:33] Hannah Cruz: It's really interesting. It's really... Learning about set life and all of that is so... Sitting in your trailer all day just waiting for them to be ready for you, and then you go and you don't really rehearse, you just have to do it. It's kind of amazing. And I just want to keep learning about it.

[36:50] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[36:51] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. And the adrenaline is probably just always on 10.

[36:55] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, yeah.

[36:56] Hannah Cruz: Always anxious, but I love it. I love it. And also, not knowing what take they're going to choose.

[37:02] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[37:03] Hannah Cruz: And not knowing... Because a lot of directors, some will, I don't know the right word, but they'll tell you if they're getting what they need or if they're not getting what you need. And some directors are less communicative. And so it's like, did I do it?

[37:17] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah.

[37:18] Hannah Cruz: You don't really know.

[37:19] Bruce Gotlieb: Right.

[37:20] Hannah Cruz: I'm a glutton for punishment, so I want to do it again.

[37:22] Bruce Gotlieb: Where can people watch that next month?

[37:24] Hannah Cruz: That'll be on Peacock.

[37:25] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay. So just wait, Hannah, until it comes out and you're in people's living rooms. You're going to get such a different reaction from people.

[37:33] Hannah Cruz: Weird.

[37:34] Bruce Gotlieb: It's different. They're going to feel like they know you more than they already do. And that's such a wonderful thing because they'll be connected to you in a different way.

[37:40] Hannah Cruz: Yeah.

[37:41] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah. I'm really excited to experience that.

[37:43] Hannah Cruz: Yeah. I think all eight episodes drop at once.

[37:46] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, that's good.

[37:47] Hannah Cruz: I love that.

[37:48] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah. So it'll be a good bingeable moment after the holiday.

[37:51] Hannah Cruz: Yeah.

[37:52] Bruce Gotlieb: No, that's perfect. And when everyone's home because it's cold in New York anyway, we don't want to go out so much.

[37:56] Hannah Cruz: Right.

[37:57] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah. I hope everybody likes it. It'll bring a whole different fan base to chess.

[38:03] Hannah Cruz: Yeah.

[38:04] Bruce Gotlieb: Spy thriller fan base.

[38:05] Hannah Cruz: Which they'll love chess.

[38:06] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes.

[38:07] Hannah Cruz: Perfect. It all goes together.

[38:10] Bruce Gotlieb: Perfect. Yeah, you couldn't have aligned it any better.

[38:12] Hannah Cruz: I know. I planned it.

[38:13] Bruce Gotlieb: Very good planning. Bruce and I always get mad when a show just drops one episode at a time. We don't like that.

[38:19] Hannah Cruz: It's hard.

[38:20] Bruce Gotlieb: Are you watching Pluribus on Apple TV?

[38:22] Hannah Cruz: Yes.

[38:23] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes. Oh my God. It's so good, right?

[38:26] Hannah Cruz: It's incredible.

[38:27] Bruce Gotlieb: And I don't yet know what day the new episodes come out.

[38:30] Hannah Cruz: It's Friday.

[38:31] Bruce Gotlieb: I'm looking. It's Friday.

[38:33] Hannah Cruz: Thank you.

[38:35] Bruce Gotlieb: Thank you. It's so good.

[38:37] Hannah Cruz: I know.

[38:38] Bruce Gotlieb: Yeah. Are you a Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul fan too?

[38:42] Hannah Cruz: Oh yeah.

[38:43] Bruce Gotlieb: It's just like peak television.

[38:44] Hannah Cruz: Yes. All I had to hear was Vince Gilligan and I was in. Done.

[38:47] Bruce Gotlieb: But it's so different, this show.

[38:48] Hannah Cruz: It is very different.

[38:49] Bruce Gotlieb: But it really works.

[38:50] Hannah Cruz: It really works.

[38:51] Bruce Gotlieb: Have you watched it yet, Bruce?

[38:52] Bruce Gotlieb: I have not yet.

[38:53] Hannah Cruz: It is on my list now.

[38:54] Bruce Gotlieb: You gotta watch it.

[38:55] Hannah Cruz: You gotta watch it. Put it to the top of the list.

[38:57] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay.

[39:00] Hannah Cruz: I'm telling you it's worth it.

[39:01] Bruce Gotlieb: So in a month, people are going to be talking like this about your show.

[39:03] Hannah Cruz: All right. Let's move on.

[39:05] Bruce Gotlieb: That's right. Definitely. Bruce and I are going to make sure.

[39:08] Hannah Cruz: That's right.

[39:09] Bruce Gotlieb: Thank you so much for joining us. This was such a thrill. We love chess. You know, I think that you already know it's a big hit already. And I hope it just keeps building and building.

[39:14] Hannah Cruz: Me too.

[39:15] Bruce Gotlieb: Me too. Thank you guys both for coming and thanks for chatting with me.

[39:17] Hannah Cruz: Of course.

[39:18] Bruce Gotlieb: Absolutely.

[39:19] Hannah Cruz: Thank you.

[39:20] Bruce Gotlieb: Thank you.

[39:21] Hannah Cruz: Thank you.

[39:22] Bruce Gotlieb: Thank you.

[39:23] Hannah Cruz: Thank you.

[39:24] Bruce Gotlieb: Thank you.

[39:25] Hannah Cruz: Thank you for having me.

[39:30] Bruce Gotlieb: Oh, of course. Absolutely. And we will expect you back whenever you have something you want to talk about.

[39:33] Hannah Cruz: Absolutely. I'm always here.

[39:34] Bruce Gotlieb: Amazing. Once you hear your family, so anything you want promoted, shared, talked about, just let us know. Happy to help.

[39:42] Hannah Cruz: Thank you.

[39:43] Bruce Gotlieb: Yes. And definitely for the show next month.

[39:45] Hannah Cruz: Of course.

[39:46] Bruce Gotlieb: Okay. Absolutely. All right. Well, thank you again. And we will see everyone next time on Behind the Awards.

[39:51] Hannah Cruz: Bye-bye.

[39:52] Bruce Gotlieb: Bye.