This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:01] BenDeLaCreme: My name is BenDeLaCreme.

[0:03] Jinkx Monsoon: My name is Jinkx Monsoon.

[0:05] Jinkx Monsoon: And you're listening to Eleven, the official theatre podcast.

[0:20] William J Connolly: Hello and welcome to Eleven, the official theatre podcast that brings the biggest stars and creatives together in one place to discuss life in the arts. They're the drag duo making international waves in the world of live performing as they perfectly merge the world of theatre and drag. No strangers to touring across the UK and afar, they brought us death, singing, and a total camp makeover with their joint and individual tours. And this time, we're set to get down in the spirit of Christmas and the holidays with the return of the Jinkx and DeLa Holiday Show, LIVE! Yes, two of the most instantly recognizable and beloved RuPaul's Drag Race stars are set to take to the stage in a post-apocalyptic mess extravaganza, certain to make this Yuletide gayer than ever before.

After a year of doom, gloom, and Zoom, the Queens of Christmas have risen from the rubble to unearth your favourite holiday traditions, featuring smart comedy, brand new songs, and lots and lots and lots of fun. So here in an exclusive conversation, we discuss finally getting back on stage with the brilliant return of the Jinkx and DeLa Holiday Show, LIVE! Celebrating the holiday season for all, not just those that celebrate Christmas. How the power of great collaborations makes sense of the creative madness that so often goes on in our heads, and why they won't miss performing to muted audiences via the medium of Zoom. We also discuss teaching Courtney Act her now signature dress ripping off move way before she started out on national television in the UK.

While they feature rather a lot in the now infamous Drag Queen Epic Fail videos that I know we've all seen online, and while they'll forever be happy to identify rather openly as Patti LuPone groupies. We also discuss why there's no drag without theatre and no theatre without drag, their respective dream roles in the world of the stage, and the presents that they'd send respectively to each other to open on a certain December date. Plus, you'll see how they claim their fuck it quota for this episode of Eleven and while they're using every last token. So strap in as it's now time for a whole lot of laughs with Jinkx Monsoon and BenDeLaCreme here now on this, the next episode of Eleven, the official theatre podcast.

[2:26] William J Connolly: To ensure the safety of all involved in this episode of Eleven, Jinkx Monsoon, BenDeLaCreme, and I connected for this conversation digitally. So please forgive any brief moments while we wait for the internet to catch up. Enjoy.

[2:42] William J Connolly: Please help me welcome to this, the next episode of Eleven. It's double the trouble and double the fun. And the only people that I'm happy to come down my chimney this Christmas. Sorry, mum. It's Jinkx Monsoon and BenDeLaCreme. Hi, both of you. How are you?

[2:54] Jinkx Monsoon: Hello, we're well. Thank you for having us.

[2:57] BenDeLaCreme: How are you doing?

[2:58] William J Connolly: I'm good, Jinkxie. How are you?

[2:59] Jinkx Monsoon: I'm damn good.

[3:00] BenDeLaCreme: I spoke on her behalf.

[3:02] Jinkx Monsoon: You don't believe me? You don't trust that I know how Jinkx is?

[3:05] BenDeLaCreme: I was just thinking about how you said come down your chimney, and then you like cheeked at that maybe that's a sexual innuendo, but that's going up the chimney, right?

[3:15] Jinkx Monsoon: Well, I guess if you you're but you're like coming down the I don't know. The point is we're women, so I don't even know how that was like.

[3:22] William J Connolly: Thank you both so much for doing this. I'm massive fans, and also I guess loose friends, we can call ourselves that as well. So thank you so much for agreeing to see.

[3:31] BenDeLaCreme: William, I think you know, you have to just call us friends at this point. We went and saw Patti LuPone together, for God's sake.

[3:39] Jinkx Monsoon: Which means we're Patti LuPone sexuals.

[3:41] BenDeLaCreme: I don't know, how can we identify as like Patti LuPone groupies?

[3:44] Jinkx Monsoon: I mean, I'm sort of alright with that.

[3:45] BenDeLaCreme: Are you?

[3:45] Jinkx Monsoon: Yeah, I mean, she's Patti fucking LuPone.

[3:48] BenDeLaCreme: So, oh, can I say fuck? I forgot to ask.

[3:50] Jinkx Monsoon: You can say fuck. That's absolutely fine.

[3:52] BenDeLaCreme: Do they have fuck in the UK? What's the fuck equivalent in metric?

[3:55] Jinkx Monsoon: 500 fucks in one episode, but that's your limit.

[3:58] BenDeLaCreme: Okay, not 501. Are you okay with that?

[4:00] Jinkx Monsoon: Okay, go ahead.

[4:01] BenDeLaCreme: Yes, absolutely. Started fucking now.

[4:03] Jinkx Monsoon: Welcome to fucking Eleven.

[4:05] William J Connolly: Okay, wow, this has gone off the rails very quick. Hi, thank you so much for being here. And we get to talk to you about actual live performances, which after the last 18 months slash nearly two years is just feels like the best injection of fun camp, but also both of you. And even though we're doing this on Zoom, you're actually going to be coming to us in person, live in an actual theater in a space where we guess we can almost touch you. I don't know if touching's allowed yet, but it's just so exciting. And I guess before we talk about specifics for you both, after all of this time and all the shit that's happened between you must be so excited.

[4:36] Jinkx Monsoon: Hell yes.

[4:37] BenDeLaCreme: Oh my God. Fucking yeah.

[4:40] Jinkx Monsoon: I seriously like you know, these two years, the last big live thing that both of us really did was this tour in 2019. You know, it's so incredible that after this two-year period, this is what we get to jump back into. I always knew how much I loved and needed live performance, but I would say these last two years really made me understand it in entirely new ways into new depths.

[5:05] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, because like you know, we've definitely kept busy. We put out a fucking film for fuck's sake, and um, you know, we've kept busy, we've done all the things that all the drag queens have done in the last two years to stay viable and relevant in a digital age. But yeah, it's become abundantly clear to me that what I'm meant to do is be a live performer because digital can only get your rocks off so much, you know. Your laptop never gives you the feedback that you're looking for. It's like the kind of validation that we got into this business specifically for is only comes from a theater full of screaming, half inebriated strangers.

[5:50] Jinkx Monsoon: Yes, homosexuals.

[5:53] BenDeLaCreme: Also, Zoom definitely doesn't give me anything because I can't even get the microphone to work. So at least you both of you are halfway there more than I am.

[5:59] Jinkx Monsoon: Oh, sorry, it's a comedy killer to tell a joke to a muted Zoom call, you know, because a punchline without laughter is like winking at a girl in the dark.

[6:12] BenDeLaCreme: You started doing it, but nobody else does.

[6:16] Jinkx Monsoon: That's an AbFab reference.

[6:17] BenDeLaCreme: Okay. Well, alright.

[6:20] Jinkx Monsoon: But it is interesting that you started a sentence about a pun without any actual plan for what the punchline was.

[6:27] BenDeLaCreme: Listen, I'm a pro, I knew something would come to me.

[6:34] Jinkx Monsoon: That's very, very good. But it must be weird though, like even this sort of feels normal now. But for the first sort of half of last year, I can imagine it was slightly strange. And as much as we joke about like laughing and nobody really responding, but like muted calls and waving heads and stuff. If that's just not what you're meant to do. Like, obviously, I can imagine having seen both of you live together as well as individually. Half of it is the fun of you know the spontaneity, it's in the room, it's in the moment. That moment's never gonna happen again. You can't do that via this.

[7:00] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, Dela and I were actually just talking about, even though our holiday show is very scripted, um, it still has room for, you know, like all live entertainment, it still has room for in the moment spontaneous, you know, stuff to happen. And we haven't flexed those muscles in a while.

[7:22] Jinkx Monsoon: So lately we've been YouTubeing ourselves to remind ourselves that we're really good at banter.

[7:27] BenDeLaCreme: Because I know half the time when I do a club gig when I'm at a bar and I get on the stage with a mic, I have some go-to jokes, but most of it is like I find what I'm saying to the audience in the moment based on what the audience is giving me.

[7:43] Jinkx Monsoon: So in that way, drag queens are vampires.

[7:46] BenDeLaCreme: Well, and you know, we actually we've been because we're creating the new show right now. And so we were looking at some of our past year's performances, and it's really fun because we do build these really elaborate shows with these really you know well thought out set pieces, but it's like that like revisiting these videos of what happens when things go awry on stage and the two of us have to solve it together in real time is some of I was like, oh, I can't wait to do this again. I can't wait to get on stage in front of an audience, have something go absolutely terrible, like terribly awry, and then have to have to figure it out with my uh with my my sis in improv.

[8:30] Jinkx Monsoon: Oh, your sister in improv.

[8:32] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, I thought you were with my sister's gender improv partner who I will be bringing on the road with me instead of Jinkx this year. Surprise.

[8:40] Jinkx Monsoon: At least some of you've both seen those drag queen videos where it's like drag queens gone wrong. And it's like, oh my god, on YouTube, you know, and like it all goes I like that's sort of my idea of hell ending up on one of those.

[8:52] BenDeLaCreme: Well, uh Jinkx can speak to that because I would say a solid 40% are starring her.

[8:58] Jinkx Monsoon: I am in uh like there's a drag queen falling compilation, and I think there's like four clips of me. And it's not that you necessarily have fallen more, but you have fallen uh more grandly.

[9:10] BenDeLaCreme: I don't do anything halfway.

[9:13] Jinkx Monsoon: It's true. There's a wonderful video of her falling down in a production number and ripping Courtney Act's skirt off of her body.

[9:19] BenDeLaCreme: There's also—

[9:19] Jinkx Monsoon: Which just became a thing for Courtney Act for her skirt to just fly off of her.

[9:19] BenDeLaCreme: Wait. Did that happen before or after her little stunt on the show?

[9:26] Jinkx Monsoon: I ripped her skirt off before.

[9:33] BenDeLaCreme: Oh, so you were the inspiration for that.

[9:35] Jinkx Monsoon: She owes you royalties for that show.

[9:36] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, try telling her that. You're gonna have to get a penny for every dime she makes on that thing.

[9:41] Jinkx Monsoon: Taylor, I love how you literally didn't even take a breath before throwing Jinkx under the bus.

[9:45] BenDeLaCreme: Then you were like, this has happened to you already. Do you remember left?

[9:48] Jinkx Monsoon: Oh, well, no, this is some of it because you know, as an artist, I need to I need to be able to speak about some of my favorite inspirational art pieces. And um, another one of them is when Jinkx was in the UK and she's performing with Major Scales, and he claps, knocks her drink out of her hand, she goes to yell at him and then falls off the stage.

[10:09] Jinkx Monsoon: My heel hooked onto the back curtain, and then I couldn't put my foot back down, so then I just fell forward and had to start the whole show over again.

[10:19] BenDeLaCreme: The point is pretty good.

[10:21] Jinkx Monsoon: The point is, these are the golden moments that you can only experience as a live audience. You're not gonna see all the times we fell down in the Jinkx and DeLa holiday special, those are on the cutting room floor.

[10:31] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, Dela, you chose to go on tour with her, right? You know that you actually have to do it together.

[10:36] Jinkx Monsoon: Yeah, but I am the producer, so you know, I get—

[10:36] BenDeLaCreme: She knows that she could get canned at any stop along the way, so um that's quite an introduction.

[10:46] William J Connolly: Okay, cool. So you two still get on. That's a good start. Let's talk about Christmas because it is my most favorite time of the year. And I know as a homosexual, it's a lot of people, it's very surprising. I can imagine to a lot of people that Camp Christmas is something that I love, but I do love it because it instantly just makes you feel good. And I wonder before we talk about specifics of the show, is writing for this time of year easy because it only happens obviously around December? Are you like, right? I've got loads of stuff, I'm saving up for December, or is it quite difficult? I guess as creatives, how easy do you find it?

[11:19] Jinkx Monsoon: I think easy is the wrong word, but we have developed a formula and we have developed like a method for working, and we share actually a lot of sentiments on the holiday season, even though we play starkly contrasting characters on stage.

[11:42] BenDeLaCreme: Okay, you know, I think we both share a point of view similar to the point of view that I portray on stage, but then Dela synthesizes the counter to that.

[11:56] Jinkx Monsoon: So you've got one, it's Ren and Stimpy plus Christmas plus drag queens.

[12:01] BenDeLaCreme: There you go.

[12:02] Jinkx Monsoon: Yes, yeah, and even my sort of like hyper positive character is more of a critique of that than anything else, especially in this show. Like our characters are pushed so to the extreme by each other.

[12:15] BenDeLaCreme: Like BenDeLaCreme is so much dumber in this show than she is in any other show she does.

[12:21] Jinkx Monsoon: Um, but the other thing is, you know, it's like we like Jinkx is absolutely correct in that we have these this shorthand for working together now where we really like finish each other's sentences and we were really good at sentences.

[12:32] Jinkx Monsoon: Right. We're really good at writing for each other. But in terms of coming up with Christmas content, we've each been doing our own Christmas shows for so many years that it is like every year. It's like, what else do we have to say about candy canes? It's that is always a challenge, but I think that it challenges us to come up with, um, you know, every year. I think the content is in some ways more original because we're having to think more deeply about it. I think you do reach a point as an artist when you're like, wow, I've really said a lot of what I feel like saying. And so once you've hit that point, you have to go, okay, how can I say it in a new way? Or what's something I never thought would be a universal thing?

But maybe this year it is. And, you know, it's why I pretty much always work with a collaborator in all of my work, even if I'm doing a solo show. I've collaborated with someone on it because I need someone to help me figure out what's Jinkx's crazy thoughts that no one else shares and what are things that human beings think about.

[13:42] Jinkx Monsoon: And also in the title, it's not Christmas, it's specifically holiday. And I wondered, is that just the fact there's a difference between the word Christmas and holiday in the UK to the US, or does it encompass all different parts of the holiday season? Okay, so we try to acknowledge and give room to the fact that this time of year does not belong to Christmas. We don't try to, we do. We acknowledge and give room to the fact that this is not just the Christmas time of year, but we also write from our own personal experiences. So we're not gonna stand up on stage and tell you what it's like to celebrate a holiday we don't celebrate, but we do really like hold a mirror up to society when it comes to the Christian dominance of this.

[14:25] BenDeLaCreme: That's actually not true. In 2019, I did an entire number about the meaning of Hanukkah. So but also that is in Dela's character to step completely out of her, um, and what she has any right to speak about. But I think holiday largely gives us room to play wherever we want. You know, the show changes from year to year, and this allows us to like dive into whatever direction as we explore it. Because, you know, like we said, you have to every year you're trying to mine for more material. So it's like, who knows? Maybe we'll like dip into like a really inappropriate Kanza journey. But you know, like you bringing that up, even that I would say you wrote a song about celebrating Hanukkah as an outsider, acknowledging the entire time through satire and wordplay that you're very much an outsider.

[15:18] Jinkx Monsoon: Yes. And that's how we do things. You know, if we're going to do something, it's going to be the most complex meta existential esoteric way of doing it, which strangely resonates with a very broad audience. And our characters, I think seem like, you know, like they're making flippant spur of the moment decisions on stage, but we there's we're very careful about any topic that we dive into, we want it to feel taken care of and well considered.

[15:50] William J Connolly: How does it vary in terms of location and geographically? Because I can imagine the UK's attitudes of Christmas will be different to audiences that you have in the States as well.

[15:57] BenDeLaCreme: Well, yes and no. I mean, we very much write the show and give everyone the show that we wrote. Um, but we do, you know, like last time we were in the UK with our holiday show, I like changed one line in a song from Applebee's to KFC because I wanted the joke to land. I would say the geographical influences are more in those spontaneous moments and those like, you know, those unexpected moments. Because if something goes wrong in the UK, we're gonna deal with it in a British way. And I think it's also, you know, just interestingly, the differing feelings about this time of year vary so much from person to person that it that almost kind of one-ups regional experience. And we really try to in the show, um, touch on multiple perspectives, you know, really think about the fact that everyone in the audience is gonna have a really different relationship to this season. And we want to figure out a way to speak to all of that.

[16:57] William J Connolly: And does this also eat into both of your love of the theater? Because I can imagine this is obviously there's a narrative, there's a script, there's a story. So it's you both getting to flex your drag, but also getting to flex your live performance slash character slash theater. So it's like almost feels like the best hybrid of everything that basically means you can just go on stage and kill it.

[17:16] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah. And I would say that's just kind of what we've always done, and it's what we always do in our work. You know, even even when we're just, uh, you know, a guest star in a show in a bar or a club, like if I have 20 minutes on stage, it's gonna be a 20 minute one act play, you know. I've been saying this for so long and it's lost all meaning. But for me, there is no drag without theater and no theater without drag. Like I treat every theater role that I play like how would I do this if this were a drag persona? And vice versa, with every drag show that I do, I'm like, how do I bring everything I know and love about theater into this performance I'm doing, however long or silly it is.

[18:03] Jinkx Monsoon: Yeah, I think we both, um, came into drag very much. Uh, it wasn't as if we started drag and then we found these kind of ways of performing. It was all really, you know, Jinkx obviously comes from more traditional theater background, but the queens who inspired me, Charles Bush, Ethel Merman, you know, these queens were already doing those things, and that's what made me fall in love with drag anyway, you know.

[18:26] BenDeLaCreme: Feels like the most perfect hybrid of both worlds. And I love that analogy you just said, Jinkx, about theater and drag sitting perfectly together, and that that's literally at both of your cores. But and I sometimes feel like theater gets a bit of a bad rap. And I love the fact there's this emergence of the two that seems to be sort of making it cool. And I do think drag has a huge part to play in that.

[18:45] Jinkx Monsoon: Well, I think one of our, you know, unspoken goals is maybe not unspoken. I think we speak a lot about it. But what we um what we hope to accomplish with each show is that if you come in as a drag fan, you leave with a greater appreciation for theater, or you leave like going like, wow, that makes me want to see more theater shows. And if you come in as a theater enthusiast, then you leave going, I want to get more into drag now, you know.

[19:18] BenDeLaCreme: Definitely. Christmas is the time and theme where pretty much anything is possible. So I wondered is there a specific role in the world of theater that we could just magically make happen for you? Is there anything that you think I reckon if I did that, I'd be pretty bloody good.

[19:31] Jinkx Monsoon: Wait, specifically in a Christmas capacity. If we're talking Christmas, then I really think I'd nail it as Jacob Marley. In I'd like to see, you know, like a really glamorous Jacob Marley in a Christmas Carol with just like rhinestone chains a clinking. And like I've always felt like, you know, Jacobina really needed like this grand kind of entrance. So in the world of the holidays, that's my theater desire. Everyone back off. I know you're all clamoring to play Jacob Marley, but just clearly.

[20:03] BenDeLaCreme: I'm just saying that I can breathe new life into this character that people may have overlooked in the fact that's insensitive. He's dead.

[20:11] Jinkx Monsoon: Oh, that's a good point. That's a good point. Wouldn't be as interesting if I breathed life into it. Now, Jinkx, I can imagine yours would be either a witch in Wicked, because I would love to see that, or would you also then maybe just play like a leading Hamilton?

[20:27] Jinkx Monsoon: My dream role has always been um Mrs. Lovett in Sweeney Todd. Um, hence this wig I'm wearing right now. Um also the witch in Into the Woods. Can I just play a female lead in a Sondheim musical already? Um, but if I were going Christmas specific, I love playing villains. Um, I like playing villains more than I like playing heroes, and I would love to play like a real femme sissy Grinch or like a real like diva, like big titted Oogie Boogie person.

[21:04] BenDeLaCreme: The Oogie Boogie person. I love it, and I'll play that floating dog ghost.

[21:08] Jinkx Monsoon: Zero!

[21:09] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, that one. Also, I cannot believe it's been 29 minutes already. This is literally the fastest episode of this podcast ever. But my final question for you, because I know that you've got a very busy day ahead with your gorgeous pink background and my very dull background behind me. But let's talk Christmas. Also, by the way, it's the 28th of September when we're recording this. I cannot believe we're talking about Christmas already. But in terms of presents for each other, and this is like, oh gosh, what would be the best present that you could get your counterpart? And I want honest answers, not necessarily good presents, and then I can tell you what I'd get both of you.

[21:39] BenDeLaCreme: Acceptance.

[21:40] Jinkx Monsoon: No. Um no no. Jinkx is jinx is a witch. She'd probably want some sort of like fistful of like special rocks with energy in them or something. You like that kind of thing.

[21:52] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah. Aura Aura. Um yeah, and some aura. I was gonna say or an Oculus headset. Um I think um the perfect gift Dela could get me is um uh I don't know. Wait, aren't you supposed to say what you give me?

[22:12] Jinkx Monsoon: What I'd give you. Um the gift swift kick in the pants. No, I if I could give Dela anything, I'd um give her like a Ferris wheel in her backyard.

[22:24] BenDeLaCreme: Or a bouncy castle.

[22:25] Jinkx Monsoon: A bouncy castle, like something definitely something that was intended for children that an adult has no business getting in.

[22:35] BenDeLaCreme: You really won up to me. Okay, I'm gonna give you the crystals in like a hollowed out skull of a of an unbaptized child.

[22:41] Jinkx Monsoon: Oh my god, I'm not a dark witch.

[22:44] BenDeLaCreme: Um, but uh, I'm a chaotic neutral. Um, but like just to give you some context, this is the last gift I gave Dela for her birthday. It's the top of a bowling trophy, but it's vintage, so it's made out of like actual metal rather than that cheap resin stuff they make trophies out of nowadays. And I gotta find something to screw it into because it's actually got a screw bottom here. You can't like set it down or anything. So it's gotta be like a permanent fixture.

[23:07] Jinkx Monsoon: Jinkx wanted to make sure that whatever gift she gave me was gonna be on display for eternity. I also gave her some face cream for mature skin.

[23:16] William J Connolly: All right. Wow. Would you like to know what I would get both of you?

[23:20] Jinkx Monsoon: Yes, yes.

[23:21] William J Connolly: I would get tickets to your fucking show. How about that?

[23:24] BenDeLaCreme: Oh my God, that is the greatest gift of all.

[23:28] Jinkx Monsoon: Patronize the arts. Although, if I get you tickets, does that mean I'm performing? Because you can't watch and perform. So maybe this doesn't work. No, I didn't really think this out. I've sort of I fucked it at the end, didn't I really?

[23:40] BenDeLaCreme: Oh gosh. Um how can we end this in a positive way? I mean, if you both tell me to fuck off and we can end it there, does that work?

[23:47] Jinkx Monsoon: Is that yeah? But first, I have a question.

[23:50] William J Connolly: Okay.

[23:50] Jinkx Monsoon: Um, what inspired the name of your podcast, Eleven?

[23:54] BenDeLaCreme: Do you know the answer to this?

[23:55] Jinkx Monsoon: What?

[23:55] BenDeLaCreme: No, I don't.

[23:56] Jinkx Monsoon: You know how in a theater show there's an 11 o'clock number, it's the big crescendo. It's yeah, yeah. It's the big moment before the end.

[24:02] BenDeLaCreme: It's my big it's my big finish.

[24:04] Jinkx Monsoon: Why can't you just use this is it? That means that the you asking the question about what it means was actually the answer to the question.

[24:11] BenDeLaCreme: Yeah, but I just wanted to talk about dicks.

[24:14] Jinkx Monsoon: Yeah, right. Fuck. Um, it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much. I cannot wait to see you both. And I am gonna make, I am gonna ask you to tell me to fuck up in a second, but just thank you so much and best of luck in the time between now when I actually get to see you both in a live theater. I can't wait to come see it, but just thank you so much.

[24:32] Jinkx Monsoon: Thank you, William. I missed you and you in a sweet place.

[24:37] BenDeLaCreme: Fuck off, William.

[24:38] Jinkx Monsoon: Bye. Love you.

[24:43] Announcer: You've been listening to Eleven, the official theatre podcast. Find out more about Eleven at elevenpodcast.com or via the Broadway Podcast Network.