This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Mary Dina: Hey everyone, welcome to Page to Stage.

[0:03] Brian Sedita: A conversation with theater makers.

[0:05] Mary Dina: We're your hosts.

[0:05] Brian Sedita: That's Brian.

[0:06] Mary Dina: And that's Mary.

[0:07] Brian Sedita: This episode is part of our series on A Beautiful Noise, the Neil Diamond musical.

[0:11] Mary Dina: In this series, we're looking at how certain design elements shape the creative process of a new musical, particularly one based on a true story.

[0:19] Brian Sedita: We hope you enjoyed this episode.

[0:26] Brian Usifer: Hi, my name is Brian Usifer, and I'm an arranger, orchestrator, and music director.

[0:26] Brian Usifer: Um, on A Beautiful Noise specifically, I am the dance arranger, the incidental music arranger, and I co-orchestrate with Sonny Paladino and Bob Gaudio.

[0:40] Brian Usifer: Lots of hats.

[0:41] Brian Usifer: Lots of hats.

[0:43] Brian Usifer: It's a nice big happy family we have.

[0:45] Mary Dina: It is.

[0:45] Mary Dina: And we just spoke with Anne Marie not too long ago.

[0:48] Mary Dina: And just talking about the dream team that is the music department for this show.

[0:52] Brian Sedita: I mean, it's gotta be pretty surreal with everyone involved in general, but specifically the music department just seems to have a really strong group.

[1:00] Brian Sedita: So I'm excited to get your perspective on that.

[1:02] Brian Sedita: Um, to kick us off though, I actually wanted to ask you what would you say would be like the biggest difference between all the different roles that you've held.

[1:10] Brian Sedita: You know, music director, orchestrator, arranger, composer, you know, is there anything that really sticks out for each of those individual roles?

[1:17] Brian Usifer: You know, in the Venn diagram of it, they all sort of overlap in a couple different ways.

[1:22] Brian Usifer: I think that to me, I separate them in um something that is sort of more on the performance and management side, which is like music supervisors, music directors, um, versus writing.

[1:36] Brian Usifer: You know, I don't I don't want to use the term creative because everything that we do is creative.

[1:40] Brian Usifer: Um, but when you're arranging or orchestrating, you're writing.

[1:43] Brian Usifer: You're writing music to some extent.

[1:45] Brian Usifer: You know, whether um you're using somebody's existing music as you do with arranging um or coming up with your own lines as as it is in orchestrating, you know, it is writing.

[1:55] Brian Usifer: So I I kind of talk about it in those two different ways.

[1:59] Brian Usifer: And I've done it where I am all those things.

[2:03] Brian Usifer: I've done it where I'm just some of the things.

[2:07] Brian Usifer: This is a team that is large; there's a lot of us and we all kind of have our little compartmentalized things.

[2:14] Brian Usifer: But at the same time, we all kind of do we work together.

[2:18] Brian Usifer: Like it's a real true collaboration.

[2:19] Brian Usifer: And when we first started out, um, you know, we talked about that a lot and talked about just like that being there for each other and being each other sounding boards and that no nobody can, you know, you don't have to say, oh I can't have that idea because that's somebody else's sandbox.

[2:36] Brian Usifer: Like we're kind of all in the sandbox.

[2:38] Brian Usifer: Ultimately it's you know whoever's responsibility to come up with the final idea or say like okay this is what it's gonna be.

[2:45] Brian Usifer: But um Sonny and um Anne Marie and I and in some cases Bob all work together, you know, in a sort of circle of ideas, which is really fun.

[2:55] Brian Usifer: And I I love collaborating and when you are the person that does all of it, it's a it's easy because you don't have to deal with anybody, but it's also like lonely because it's like oh man I had this idea that who am I going to bounce it off?

[3:07] Brian Usifer: I guess it's the cast.

[3:08] Brian Usifer: I guess I'm gonna like go to work and try this in front of everybody.

[3:12] Brian Usifer: Whereas when you're collaborating um it's a lot of like phone calls and voice memos and like hey what about this or no I actually don't think that works but it could be this I really find that fun.

[3:22] Brian Usifer: I think that's a really to me the most fun way to work.

[3:26] Brian Sedita: I think what's so unique about this particular process versus other uh arrangers or orchestrators that we've had on Page to Stage is the fact that you're not necessarily working with a composer.

[3:38] Brian Sedita: People are already aware of the music coming into this from a perspective of how you're brought on to the a pre a project like this uh and using this as an example who's assembling the team and who brought you on and how do you and at what point do you come on for uh for your particular portion of the work of the of the process?

[3:38] Brian Usifer: Right, I was brought on by Michael Mayer, the director.

[3:38] Brian Usifer: Um, Sonny had already been working on the show and had done a good amount of work and they did a reading; they had a full score.

[3:38] Brian Usifer: Um, Michael and I had worked together on some things and he asked if I would come on and bring my perspective and you know my ideas to this and um and I knew Sonny.

[3:38] Brian Usifer: Sonny and I had not worked together like officially I don't think that I can think of, but we knew each other just from you know the playground.

[3:38] Brian Usifer: Um, and we had like a substantial conversation before I really came on just about like what what could this be and what how could we work together and what would be the best way to move forward and we kind of I think built a strong um, you know, collaborative foundation to begin with which I think has been really successful for this.

[4:45] Brian Usifer: But you know a lot of the time it's the producer sometimes it is the composer sometimes it you know I've I I've gotten brought on to projects by like everybody you know you just never know when somebody's like oh you know who's really right for this Brian um and so it really can kind of come from anywhere.

[5:03] Brian Usifer: But Michael and I have you know a working relationship we've done some other things together we're currently doing some other other things together um and having that shorthand is um is good when you're doing when you're developing musicals when you don't really have a lot of time, you know, and you have to kind of make things happen quickly.

[5:18] Mary Dina: So what were some of those earlier conversations like?

[5:20] Mary Dina: I mean, as Brian said, obviously the music it already exists.

[5:23] Mary Dina: And so then the conversation I'm assuming is just like how can we musical fight, if you will, or like how can we use the music that already exists to then tell the story that's written in the book?

[5:36] Brian Usifer: Yeah, that's right.

[5:37] Brian Usifer: I mean, really the name of the game is storytelling.

[5:39] Brian Usifer: Like in every aspect of what we do, we approach it from a place of storytelling because that is really what we're trying to do with theater.

[5:47] Brian Usifer: Um, and you know you can come up with an arrangement idea or an orchestration idea, but really I always go back to what is the story?

[5:55] Brian Usifer: What is this, what are we trying to say here?

[5:57] Brian Usifer: What are we trying to do?

[5:58] Brian Usifer: What are the characters trying to do?

[5:59] Brian Usifer: Um, you know, when you think about original musicals, that's what the composer's doing, right?

[6:04] Brian Usifer: That the composer is like getting inside the brain of each character and saying, okay, this person is in this situation and this is what they want and this is how they're gonna sing it to get that.

[6:14] Brian Usifer: And so when you're working on a catalog musical, you kind of have to be that person and be the person that's asking those questions and trying to come up with, you know, what those ideas can be.

[6:24] Brian Usifer: In a show like this, which is a bio musical, it's a little bit of a double challenge because there are moments when the music is diegetic, right?

[6:33] Brian Usifer: When it's Neil Diamond actually performing music.

[6:36] Brian Usifer: And when that's happening, you know, there's a little less creative freedom there because the idea is that it sounds like when Neil Diamond sings, you know, whatever the song is Sweet Caroline or or you know Kentucky Woman, which actually we sort of reimagined a little bit so it's not a great example.

[6:52] Brian Usifer: But um you know knowing in this show whether the the music is diegetic versus dramatic is like the number the first question that we kind of have to ask because when it's used in a dramatic way, that opens up the whole conversation of like, okay, well, what is it?

[7:07] Brian Usifer: What would this sound like?

[7:08] Brian Usifer: Like what do I need this music to do in order to function as a piece of storytelling in this moment?

[7:14] Brian Usifer: Um, and then you kind of like go crazy with it, and you'd come up with all the different ideas and try to figure out you know what that would sound like, and then it kind of congeals into something that is like obviously a Neil Diamond song, but approached in a different way and approached from a different character's perspective and from a different character's voice.

[7:33] Brian Usifer: That's actually my favorite thing about this project.

[7:36] Brian Usifer: Um, I haven't done, I've done a couple catalog musicals, and all of them have been original stories where the world is sort of your oyster from an arrangement standpoint.

[7:45] Brian Usifer: You can, you know, reimagine any song.

[7:48] Brian Usifer: Um, and that's fun for me.

[7:49] Brian Usifer: I mean, I think that's like that's why an arranger would want to do a catalog musical.

[7:54] Brian Usifer: Um, but in this case, since it's both, there's just so much creative freedom there and so many ways to kind of play with that storytelling and play with the language.

[8:03] Mary Dina: So you brought up obviously catalog musical as as a term and then biomusical as another term, and I just uh I guess for our listeners out there, um, you probably have heard jukebox musical as as probably the more like front runner of the three terms.

[8:17] Mary Dina: Um, and I'm curious if so, are you saying catalog musical in the sense of like a jukebox musical, but just like as a more broader term?

[8:24] Brian Usifer: Yeah, you know, it's interesting.

[8:26] Brian Usifer: I feel like I yeah, I I have like an agenda by using that term.

[8:30] Brian Usifer: I I feel I figured it was it feels very purposeful, you know.

[8:34] Brian Usifer: Yeah, well, and it is what I use and how I talk about it because I do I think that jukebox musical has become a pejorative term, you know.

[8:41] Brian Usifer: I think it's become a term that people sort of look down on or turn their nose up at.

[8:45] Brian Usifer: And you know, I'm I'm not gonna make a judgment on the validity of these kinds of musicals because it's not my job to do that right now.

[8:53] Brian Usifer: Um, but talking about it in a way that isn't pejorative, I think is important for the creative team because we have to like be on board with this idea and drink this Kool-Aid and be like, yes, we're doing this show and we're doing it like it's a new musical because that's that's the approach that we're kind of taking.

[9:09] Brian Usifer: Um, and I do think that in 2022, jukebox is not like a it's not the thing.

[9:16] Brian Usifer: I mean, like I know what a jukebox is, but like sounds dusty and archaic, and there's already a negative, an old uh dusty connotation that I think would go along with it.

[9:25] Mary Dina: Right.

[9:26] Brian Usifer: I mean, it's more like if if the term didn't exist today, somebody would probably call it a playlist musical, right?

[9:30] Brian Usifer: Like if not if if it didn't exist, that's that's like how we consume music today, is like with playlists.

[9:35] Brian Usifer: And so that would probably be the term.

[9:38] Brian Usifer: And you know, catalog uh in this case is kind of the right thing because we are really drawing from all the songs in the Neil Diamond catalog, um, which is different than say um, you know, American Idiot, for example, which is a concept album.

[9:53] Brian Usifer: Um, and the songs I think actually they brought in a couple different songs, but like the idea of American Idiot is that it's that album, right?

[10:00] Brian Usifer: It's not like every Green Day song ever written, it's it's what they wrote for that album.

[10:04] Brian Usifer: And bio, you know, by bio, like I say that it's about the it's about the person or it's about a person, um, you know, uh the performer.

[10:11] Brian Usifer: Whereas like I've done shows um that use the catalog of certain artists, but it's not about those artists at all.

[10:16] Brian Usifer: It actually has nothing to do with them.

[10:18] Mary Dina: Yeah, like Mamma Mia, I would argue is like in that vein of not not biographical musical.

[10:24] Brian Usifer: But you know, that was really the first, you know.

[10:26] Brian Usifer: I mean, that you know, Moulin Rouge came before Mamma Mia.

[10:31] Brian Usifer: Moulin Rouge was obviously a movie, not a musical, but like Moulin Rouge was really the first thing to like break open the genre in a way that used existing songs, you know, as storytelling devices.

[10:43] Brian Usifer: Um, and then on Broadway, Mamma Mia is uh this is sort of what people think.

[10:46] Brian Usifer: I mean, I'm sure somebody's gonna fact check me and say that I'm wrong.

[10:49] Brian Usifer: But like, you know, we think of Mamma Mia as being the first, you know, jukebox or catalog musical to to hit Broadway um because that it was fully existing songs, but with a a totally different story that was not related to the songs themselves.

[11:04] Mary Dina: In terms of the process of kind of just getting started with the project and how you're going to approach certain songs.

[11:11] Mary Dina: Um, did you ever have conversations or I guess were conversations needed to be had with Neil Diamond about how things were going to be reorchestrated or arranged and used within the context of the musical?

[11:34] Brian Usifer: I think that from our perspective, the permissions are waived.

[11:38] Brian Usifer: However, Bob Gaudio is kind of there to be the protector of that, right?

[11:43] Brian Usifer: Like Bob in a lot of ways is the direct link to Neil.

[11:47] Brian Usifer: And so we look to Bob when we have questions. If there's something that's like, well, maybe this is like a little too crazy. Um, I think Bob is like a good arbiter of those things. But really, you know, not to sound like a Boy Scout, but I think that coming onto a project like this, you know that you have a responsibility to honor the artist and to honor what the artist is about. A lot of that is like getting inside what you think is the brain of the artist based on their music and organizing that into choices and ideas and things that exist in their catalog and in their performance style that feel like they're fair game versus things that are like, this does not feel like Neil Diamond to me.

This feels like something totally different. Um, and sometimes using that to an effect, using that to sort of make it sound different on purpose. You know, but we do talk about that. We talk about, um, we mean like Sonny and Amory and I, we talk about like, oh, that feels not really real Neil Diamond, or this feels right down the pocket, you know. Not to like, I don't know where this conversation's going, but not to skip ahead. But when we were orchestrating the show for Boston, one of the things that I did was listen to every single live performance I could find of every single song over like the 40 years that he toured, you know. Um, and that to me, I was downloading all of the nuances of the styles as they changed through the decades and how his band changes, how they play it, and how the players influence it, and how, you know, the horn lines in one song are this and in another they're that, and sometimes there's not horns at all.

There are strings instead, you know, and kind of looking at all of those different choices and those different ideas, and then organizing them into like, okay, this is useful, this is not useful, I don't have something here, so I'm gonna write something that doesn't exist. Um, and that was, you know, the approach for the orchestration. So, in a lot of ways, the orchestrations of this show really encapsulate like his entire career as a performer because some of the ideas are from recordings from the 60s, and some of them are from like the concert in 2009 that he did, you know, that his band is playing, and they have this little nuance that they add that it's like, oh, that's cool, that's interesting. How can we kind of use that and pull this into the world?

[14:08] Mary Dina: Yeah, I was curious. When do you figure out an assemble? Because like you mentioned, you know, depending on what tour it is, depending on what period of an artist's career, they play around with those things when they're actually performing, when they're recording in studios, and when they have the means to do so. So I'm wondering, how did you assemble the orchestrations and kind of figure out what your band is going to look like?

[14:32] Brian Usifer: Yeah, the band makeup was something that we had a lot of conversations about. Broadway theaters have minimums, right? There's a union minimum of number of musicians. So when you know that you're going into the St. James or the O'Neill or whatever theater, you know that there's a number that you have to sort either be at or be above or be below. There are different circumstances for that to happen. But knowing the ballpark of that is a good way to start, which is where we began. After a lot of different conversations, we ended up with the number 12, which incidentally is the minimum in the Broadhurst. Um, but with 12 musicians, we have two keyboards, two guitars, bass, drums, percussion, two strings, and three horns.

Um, which is a great band because you can kind of do anything with that ensemble. You know, you can really shift gears and go into the string world, or you can go into the big horns world, or you can have the reed player playing flute and the trumpet player plays flugelhorn, and suddenly it sounds like 1963, you know. Um, and two obviously two keyboards, two guitars, and Will Swenson plays guitar a lot in the show, too. So it's a lot of time it's kind of three guitars. Um, but really the question was like, what are all the what's the palette? What are all the different kinds of sounds that we need to make and the different decades that we have to represent? And that band is, you know, a real good indication of how to do all that.

And then, you know, in terms of assembling the ideas, you know, like I said, I listened to all of the different live recordings in the original recordings, and really again it all goes back to like what's the story? What is this song trying to accomplish? What's the story of the song? How does the sound of it have to build in order to support that? Um, I like to think of characters as having timbres and tones too, you know. Um, the bad example of that is like Peter and the Wolf, you know, where each character has its own like instrument in the orchestra. But there's something fun to play with with that idea. A lot of the time in this show when Neil is singing, there's cello involved as like a compliment to his kind of low voice.

You know, we wanted to kind of lean into that rather than do something that felt like it was an opposition to it. Um, whereas like a lot of the time when it's um Marcia, uh played by Robin Herter, it's like strings and flugelhorns, and like in her big number, it kind of goes above that and gets bigger, but um, you know, flute, that kind of thing, like play me, um, has a lot of like flute and like string parts in it. So a lot of it was just like how do we compliment the character singing the song and also how do we tell the story? Um, and then sometimes it's like this just has to sound like the record, and that's what we did, and that's, you know, it's fun to be able to do that because like when they like Sweet Caroline is Sweet Caroline.

Like we all agreed like that's what it was gonna be. And when you hear the band play that, it's like it's very exciting and very satisfying to hear the band play, and it sounds like Sweet Caroline. It doesn't sound like we came up with some crazy idea for Sweet Caroline, you know, it's like it really delivers the song in the way that you expect from an orchestration standpoint. I'm not saying that that's what the staging is. I'm not saying that's what the story is. I think that all has its merit and its value. And I love how it happens in the show. But we decided, like from the orchestration that we were just going to do Sweet Caroline, and that's one of the songs that kind of gets that like honor of this is exactly what it needs to be.

[18:07] Mary Dina: So I'm curious with in that same, I guess, mindset of what you're just talking about. Also, you have to, I guess, be concerned with the time period, right? So like over time. So I have seen the production, I saw it in Boston. It was a long, it feels like it was a lifetime ago now. So my memory is a little foggy, but I remember, you know, you go through the, you know, his career essentially. Um, and so I'm sure there's different sounds of that either that time period or specifically Neil in that time period. And so I'm curious as to how that played into the decisions that you were making for orchestrations.

[18:41] Brian Usifer: Yeah, a lot. You know, the whole, most of the first act is like in the 60s, and so that kind of informed a lot of decisions in terms of how, like what the guitars are doing, what the guitar sounds are, um, what the strings are doing, what the horns are doing. You know, there are moments when we really wanted to lean into like the 60s of it all. Like there's a little Peter Paul and Mary callback in one of the songs, and um Kentucky Woman, especially because the way that it's set in the show, it's really early, it's early in his career. I mean, it's before he's quote unquote Neil Diamond. And so we went with a different sound with that. That again uses like a lot of sounds of like 60s sort of pop rock.

You know, there's like I think there's even like some celeste and glockenspiel in there and flute and strings and you know it really has that like um that light airy and like relentlessly positive sound to it. It just it's a really like bright, you know, beautiful kind of um thing that has this band underneath it that's like acoustic guitars really like acoustic guitar based. You know, and there's like a little bit of piano and like some organ but no like synthesizers, none of that kind of stuff. As we get into the second act, obviously the second act starts in the 70s and goes like kind of through that period. And so you know the guitars are more electric, the band, the horns are like rock and roll horns like playing like cool ripping lines like he would have in his stadium concerts.

You hear some synthesizer in the keyboards not a lot because it's not like a huge thing in his music although um America has that like signature synth sound which we don't do until the bows actually. Um, but then my favorite part of the show is kind of like the last third of the show where it goes into like a memory play almost um where we have things like Brooklyn Roads and America and Shiloh which is really a whole like memory play sequence and that was to me the most fun to orchestrate because there were no rules to it right it wasn't diegetic. It wasn't like really storytelling and narrative it was really like essentially getting inside Neil's emotions as he's living them as he's kind of like going through this in the doctor's office.

I don't know how much I'm allowed to give away on this. But I guess I've, you know, I'm going not all the way with it. But uh that's it, that's its own different sound too. You know, like that is a real it we it goes like really orchestral in some of those moments. Like that's where I wish I had like 30 strings. You know, there's like sort of Aaron Copland-esque moments um in America and Brooklyn Roads that we do um that are really meant to just like make it seem um you know grounded and emotional but also like it's coming from this other place. Like it's not Neil Diamond as we know Neil Diamond, right? It's coming from a totally different part of his emotion and his psyche. Um which is what the show's doing. It's like that it goes back to we asked the question what's the story here, what's going on? And so that was the beginning of those decisions and how we decided to um to score it.

[21:54] Mary Dina: I was gonna say just to give people some context do you remember about what year and how long you've been on this process?

[22:01] Brian Usifer: I'm pretty sure the first thing I did was in March of 2020 and our last day was like March 11th or whatever like the day the Broadway world shut down. Cause they like had just did a workshop right before then I believe.

[22:17] Mary Dina: That's right.

[22:18] Brian Usifer: Yeah. And I came on like right after that. Actually no, yeah, no that's the one we did like a sort of vocal and movement workshop um in March of 2020 and they had just done a reading before that. Um so yeah it was but it was right then that I sort of came in and then yeah so I guess it's been um two years which is kind of like not a lot of time. Like I have shows that I'm that are not open yet that I've been working on for three, four years. I mean, it can range, but I certainly um I think two years is kind of a short period, which is great. I mean, that's that's what like when it goes, it's like it when it goes, it goes, and like that's the best way to do it. It's you know, the momentum of like having an out-of-town tryout and knowing your Broadway theater is amazing because you just you know you can really gauge how you work.

I've been lucky I've uh Kinky Boots and Frozen were both that for me, where we knew from our out-of-town what the Broadway show schedule was gonna be. Um, and we had a theater. And so that it's just it's it gives you the gift of time and the gift of perspective, and knowing like we're gonna get a whole other crack at this um when we go when we do it on Broadway. Now we've been hearing, even though yeah, you did know where you were going as soon as Boston was finished. Actually, you knew well before that even, but so I'm sure that kind of made your original process more productive because you knew we weren't gonna have to go back and do a ton of rewriting, but we've heard from just our guests in this series alone that there have been quite a few rewrites or that they're still working on some things of just kind of tightening things here because we know that there was a hiatus um during the Boston run because of COVID.

[23:56] Brian Usifer: Um, so a lot of things that maybe you would have adjusted or noted during previews were cut short, unfortunately. So I'm curious as to what the process has been like now, now that you’ve had a couple of months in between August, you’ve had maybe you will have a couple of months before a rehearsal start um in the next few weeks or so. So I'm curious what that's been like for you. Even before the hiatus, I had started making like a wish list of things for Broadway, things that I knew like we weren't gonna really have time or it wasn't worth spending the energy on um in Boston. And then when that hiatus happened, it was like, oh, we're not gonna get a lot of time, so let's really like make a list here and try to figure out what that is.

And you know, and then I had conversations with Michael about what his ideas were and what he needed from us in terms of any arranging changes, and so we kind of came up with this big list of like here's what we'd like to do with some arrangement things, with some orchestration things, with some changing the way that some of the um casting some things, you know, stuff that we just like need rehearsal time for. Um, and so yeah, that master list has kind of been like the guiding force. You know, one of the great things about doing the cast album um in between is that we had to do all of the wish list things for the orchestration. So but so before we went into the studio, um, we went back in and at many phone calls uh of Sonny and I of just like figuring out which we were gonna what we were gonna implement, how we were gonna do it.

Because Sonny and I don't always agree on everything, and that's like totally great, and I enjoy that, and we always um we always come out with a solution. Um so once we figured out what we were gonna do, we went through and made all of those changes. So the list is a lot smaller now than it was um when we left Boston, which is nice because going into rehearsals, there are a couple of things that were definitely changing in the arranging department, but I feel like we've hit all of the orchestration notes, which is nice. Um, and we've met and heard the New York band who played on the album, which is great, and that you know, different people are different people. So going from a band in Boston to the band in New York, um, everything feels different, you know.

And so you you have to sort of recalibrate, like, oh, this is now I have to like kind of rebalance this in a different way, or oh, actually, this could be something else now that I hear how this person plays it. Um, and our band at Boston was was incredible, so it's it's not about that, it's just different humans play things differently, and once you kind of get them together, you have a different sense of how it's gonna be. I want to ask you about dance arrangements, but actually first, I forgot to mention this when we were chatting with Anne Marie. So one of the things that like immediately took me away was the fact there's an overture, which I feel like we haven't really heard in any musical in like so long.

And it just is it's also because everyone knows the music, and so you hear like the different tunes of all the different popular songs, and obviously mixed in with one songs you may not know. Um and then also maybe just s from some of the um arrangements that you've added in. Um so I'm curious as to like what that process looks like when when kind of putting together an overture, specifically one with with notable music. And I'll say too, I don't know if it if everybody knows this, but it incidental music arrangements, which is one of my titles, is all of it's like the overture, the on-tracked, scene change music, um, underscore, music for the bows, music for the, you know, when the band does when the band keeps playing and people walk out of the music, we call it examusic.

If in tech we need a scene change, I have to run down the aisle and sit at the piano and like figure it out and make it up on the spot and hopefully it's good. And if not, I'll I'll fix it later. But um, you know, that's like the that is the main part of that part of my job. Um, and kind of being responsible for those things. And so, you know, when we were when you do readings and stuff, you don't need a lot of that. You don't need a lot of transitional music and um and nobody wants to hear an overture in a reading, unfortunately. We we did a workshop actually back in October, and I really advocated for an on track, which is the music, it's like the overture before the second act. Um, it's what plays to kind of get people back in their seats and to re-energize the air in the room.

Um, and for that we use um Crunchy Granola Suite from the Live at the Greek recording from the 70s, because it's just like a great arrangement, and we we sort of adapted it for our use, but the the you know, energy of that is what that idea was. And so for the overture, many, many conversations were had about its necessity, and many conversations were had about what it should be and what it could be. Um, I'll spare you what what all the conversations were, but ultimately we decided that it would be nice to have something. Um, and really what it does is it's it's a it's a little bit of a bait and switch in that it sets up a big Neil Diamond concert, right? It makes the audience think that they're at a giant like stadium Neil Diamond concert, um, and then the show starts and it isn't that.

And so um that really informed what it should be, and we kind of based it on the uh in the original version of America, there's like an orchestral introduction that's like really gorgeous and beautiful. And that was kind of like okay, well, that what if that's kind of like the backbone of it? What if that's like the bones and how can we make that feel like it's the beginning of something and and and leading up to something else, right? It has to feel like something is starting, and it's like, okay, here we go, and then I'm taking you on this ride. Um, so it starts as this big sort of fanfare of America, and then kind of goes through a couple different keys. Um, and so we kind of hear uh, you know, it feels like we're moving through time, I think, in my brain, which is what all the key changes are, is that we're kind of going through like this period, and then we change keys, we're going here, and then we're going here, and then everything just cuts out abruptly.

Um in a lot of traditional overtures, you'll hear like four or five different songs from the show, and for this, it's really just America the whole way through. Um, but it kind of like it spins it sideways and turns it's on turns on its head a couple times um to make you feel like that it's something different. But it was fun. I you know, I have not gotten to do a lot of overtures because people typically don't like them, but I just think it's so fun. And I really um I'm like a purist with a lot of things like that. And when we were working on um Book of Mormon, we didn't have one at all. There was like a little there's a prologue in the show where it kind of like sets up everything before hello, and then I think it was actually in tech um when they added like a full like fanfare sort of introduction thing.

Um, and it just it's it's so effective and it's so exciting. And as an audience member and an orchestra player, it's like, yes, we should do that. So I'm I'm glad we ended up sticking with it. Is there someone that um whether it's you or someone else on the team that would really kind of fight for that or bring that up, or is that something that is I don't I guess I'm just trying to be curious, I'm just I'm curious as to how the conversation is even broached uh approached, you know. Is it is it you're fighting for it and you're you know offering it up as like I really think we should be adding this, or is it coming from the director of like I think something's missing, or I maybe I I really don't want this at all? Like, how is that uh discussed?

[31:22] Brian Usifer: Yeah, yeah. In this case, we pitched it to Michael. I mean, like Sunny and I talked, and Bob taught you, we all sort of like talked about what it you know, should we have it and what should it be? And then we had to pitch that to Michael. And you know, with all of these things, we always go to Michael. I mean, Michael is such an incredible director and has such a vision, and when we have ideas and want to try things, you know, we don't suppose that he's just gonna be like, Great, I love it. You know, it's a conversation, it's always a conversation. And so usually what we'll do is we'll come up with an idea and we'll call Michael and he'll have opinions and ideas and we'll go back and forth. And there's always a shaping there, and it's always exciting.

I mean, Michael's very musical and he understands music and he loves music, um, which is nice because it's not I don't ever really have to fight for music per se. It's a matter of like for him, what is it? What is it doing? What is the story? So it's a lot of the same questions that we kind of ask as well. Um, but yeah, in that case, it was it was really a question for Michael, and I and I know that um in some ways Michael didn't envision it starting with that, and so it was like, let's try this and see how it works. I wanted to talk about dance arrangements because we have not actually really dived into that on the podcast specifically. Um, and I guess just to kind of open the door for our listeners, could you just explain really like where you start with dancer dance arrangements?

[32:46] Brian Usifer: Dance arrangements are essentially music that is meant to support the choreography. Um every choreographer is different, and really the dance arranger is there to help support their ideas and to help support their movement. Um, how that happens is very different from person to person and from show to show. Uh I've worked as a dance range dance arranger with choreographers where we create, you know, full elaborate dance breaks that have like multiple sections and move through keys and time signatures and tempo changes and everything, and um, and then I've worked with choreographers that it it's kind of within like the framework of of the songs that are there already, and um on this show in particular, because it's um the style of it doesn't feel musical theater, right?

Like the show feels theatrical. [33:38] The show is theatrical in a lot of ways. Um, but it doesn't ever feel like musical theater in the sense where um I don't know, a dance number is sort of crafted as like a storytelling device in like a massive way, right? There are two really big moments in the show that are like dance moments, and that's um the dance break in uh Stadium Medley and the dance break in Forever and Blue Jeans. And actually in Stadium Medley, um Stephen Hoggett came over to me and said, I don't think I've ever asked for a dance break before. Um, but I think we need a dance break here. And I was like, I guess what I'm here for. So let's talk about it. Um and so we had a conversation about, you know, how long for it's always like how long do you want it to be?

I mean that like we can kind of start there. And if if there is an answer, it's like a choose your own adventure. If there is an answer of like, well, you know, 30 seconds or five minutes, or it's a dream ballet, um, that helps kind of like frame what it's gonna be and frame the scope of it. Um and in this case, you know, it was like this is like a 30 second, you know, maybe like eight counts of eight or sixteen counts of eight or something like that. And it's the dancers, you know, on stage in the Neil Diamond concert that are kind of like expl like the energy explodes out of Neil and out of the song, and they sort of embody um that. But it's part diegetic too. I mean, they like the way that it looks, it looks like there are people in his concert that are on stage with him.

So um, you know the way that I approached it in that case was I didn't really want to go too far outside of the song. [35:22] Um and so we're in crunchy granola there and so the vocabulary of what crunchy granola is there's the verses and there's the choruses and there's kind of like the guitar line and so you know I look at it and say okay what are my what are my Legos here?

[35:34] Brian Usifer: Like what are what are the puzzle pieces that I can work with? What are the melodies? What are the harmonies? What are the different sections of the song? Um, and when we worked on it in October in the workshop, Steven also had this idea that as the break progresses, it gets like hotter and distorted and like almost just like gnarly in like good ways. I’m trying to find like a positive adjective for this but like, you know, I don’t know, I think distorted, juicy. Yeah, I say distorted but like that’s not the right term. But that, but I love that idea because that also gave me a shape, right? That gave me something to kind of like build to because when it starts, it starts at 10. You know, that’s another thing too, a lot of dance breaks, you know, start and they pull back so that they have somewhere to go or somewhere in the middle of them they drop back so that you can have somewhere to go, but this like is right out of the gate like out of 10.

So it’s like how do we sustain 10 for this entire break and then when they come back in it’s like 11. Um, but I played with the idea of kind of manipulating it in this way where it gets like hotter and sexier and grittier as it goes. And so in the last part of the dance break, the harmonies start to like fold on top of each other. And there’s like polychords where there’s like one chord and then another chord, and it creates a sense of dissonance. Um, and as it gets more dissonant and dissonant and dissonant, it then releases into the vocal right back into the song. Um, and so the idea there was to obviously like build that tension, tension, tension, tension so that when it releases, it just feels like thank God, you know, like that’s what everybody needs.

And so, and that’s you know, I think it’s really fun. I think you know, it was successful in sort of delivering um that idea in in like the smaller like micro of it too. There are groups that have their own little gestures and their different movements, and so sitting there and watching them come up with those gestures and those ideas and building kind of what they’re doing, um, allowed me to like make it into sections, and each section is kind of reflective of what that group is and what that gesture is in a way.

[37:54] Brian Usifer: It’s always different for me on each project. There are some times when a choreographer knows exactly what they want, and you sit down with them and you map it out, and like that’s what it is. And then there’s some times where they’re like, What do you got? Like, what could this be? What you know, what are some ideas that we can play with? What are some like styles that we can kind of mess around with? Um, the other one in the show is is the dance break in blue jeans, um, which you know is such a great moment, and Robin is incredible in it, and that’s another example too, where it needed to feel like fabric of the song, you know what I mean? It didn’t it it I didn’t want it to feel like it would it sent us to like a different place.

There was actually a day in rehearsal where I was like, I think we need to do a key change into it, and we did it and I got a lot of bad looks, but you know, it was I I wanted to try it because you want to feel like we’re sort of going somewhere, right? And it honestly it didn’t work. Um, and so that sort of even solidified more in my brain, like this needs to feel like we’re on this train and we have to stay on this train for this dance break. And so, how do we do that when we lose all the voices? Um, how do we raise the energy in the orchestra so that it feels like the orchestra can take over and support what Robin’s doing with her movements and hit when she hits and turn when she turns and you know, do all of that stuff that a dance arrangement has to do, um, but within the vocabulary of Neil Diamond and that song. Right.

[39:17] Brian Usifer: I actually I think what you said uh just a couple seconds ago is important to note because I feel like when you said, or so when you said that, you know, in rehearsal, you made this suggestion, you kind of you explored it, it didn’t work. I think it’s important to note for everyone out there is that like music doesn’t necessarily have to be finalized to hit when you hit rehearsal, right? So a lot of it is still playing just like you would direction or choreography. Um, so I just love that you point you made that point. Um, I wanted to just call that out a little bit.

[39:50] Brian Usifer: Yeah, for sure. I think that you know, to me, everything is a sketch until it’s not, you know. I think that I being open and willing to continue to look at something, develop and change, and being willing to react to that is to me the most fun part about this job. I might have said that about every part so far in this interview, but um, I love being adaptable and I love like watching really intently what’s happening on stage and just like continually asking, is the music supporting it? Is the music doing what it the best that it can? And if an actor changes the way they deliver a line or the way that they move or the way that they do, you know, walk, or that the set suddenly does something, like I wanna, I want to look at that and say, am I reacting to that?

Am I supporting that? Um, sometimes the answer is no, and sometimes the answer is, oh, actually, what if we did this? Um, and you know, everybody’s kind of be have to be on board with that because you can certainly get to a place where people are like, please stop changing the music every five seconds. Um, you have to be you have to be cognizant of it and respectful to people. Um, but yeah, it really I think it has to be a process, and you have to be really attuned to everybody else’s process as well to be effective. You have to always be paying attention to what the director’s talking about and what the choreographer is talking about and what the actors are doing and saying. Um, because that’s how you can really make sure that you’re keyed into what’s really happening on stage.

[41:22] Mary Dina: How about we move into our lightning round?

[41:23] Brian Usifer: Yeah, let’s do it.

[41:24] Mary Dina: So to kick us off, uh, what is one thing in the theater industry that confuses you?

[41:29] Brian Usifer: Eating and drinking during shows. I think this I feel like such a grandpa saying that. But like, sure, like having a cocktail during a show, that’s fine. It’s like a smell thing too. It’s like when you like you’re smelling everybody’s food, and it’s just like it’s maybe it’s just like a sensory thing for me.

[41:45] Mary Dina: What are three adjectives that describe your ideal working environment?

[41:49] Brian Usifer: Collaborative, uh positive, and excellent.

[41:54] Mary Dina: Is there something in your process that you have found unique to you?

[41:58] Brian Usifer: I think that one of the things that I personally have discovered about myself is the ability to like be really attuned to everybody, for better or for worse. Um, and I think that like I was just saying before, it does help me really be keyed into the rehearsal room and what’s happening in the com in every conversation with and on stage because I think that I want to know what the director is thinking and I want to know what the choreographer is thinking. I want to know how the actors are feeling when they’re singing the songs. You know, I want to be like really keyed into all of that. I don’t walk into a room and present a piece of music and say, this is what it is, perform it because this is what I wrote. I I like the feedback, but I also feel like I’m good at sort of intuiting the feedback um in a lot of ways.

[42:48] Mary Dina: Do you have any books or resources, podcasts, something that you’ve found helpful to you in your process, or maybe that you found uh that you used earlier on in your career to get you to where you are?

[43:00] Brian Usifer: You know, I’m like a real nerd. I’m like a I’m a definite nerd and I am a constant student and learner. I I love reading, I love studying. I I mean I collect books on orchestration, which is like, you know, I like I’m the person that like paid a couple hundred dollars for like an out-of-print like random book from the 50s uh on like big band arranging. I just you know, I love it because I I just think like there’s reading any information on what you do is fascinating because as you like get along in your career, you you start to look at it from a perspective of I have an opinion about this. Like I’m reading this and I’m like, I agree with that, or I don’t agree with that. And so, you know, in a lot of ways it’s like validating your sort of perspective as an artist, but sometimes you’re like, oh my god, I’ve never thought of that idea, or like what a that’s like such a cool perspective that I haven’t um really thought of.

So I I really enjoy that. I like the books, and I also am like a real nerd for watching you know like music production tutorials on YouTube and on Instagram and stuff like that. I just you know anything that I can like find to give information I think is really fun.

[44:14] Mary Dina: Amazing like a master class even totally um yeah what is one job you have in the theater industry that you would trade jobs with for one week?

[44:14] Brian Usifer: I think this is like kind of crazy but I think I would enjoy being a stage manager. I like the organization of it I like the people management of it and I like um, you know when they call shows how it’s like it’s like it’s the same as conducting. I mean like when you know when you’re conducting a show you’re conducting and the stage manager is calling and like you are like in concert with them. Um, and so it’s similar in a lot of ways to like being the conductor so I think that’d be kind of fun and interesting.

[44:52] Mary Dina: What’s one hobby that you have outside of theater?

[44:52] Brian Usifer: Oh you know I’m a real foodie. I love cooking I love restaurants um I love all of it. That’s like my other passion in life um I like studied wine a little bit for a little while um because I just got real nerdy about it and thought it’d be interesting to learn about the different regions and how the how it’s made and what the different grape varietals and all that you know so that’s I that’s my definite like other hobby slash passion.

[45:22] Mary Dina: What are you looking forward to most about the process of Beautiful Noise here on out?

[45:22] Brian Usifer: I’m excited to get into the Broadway theater and and feel our s feel the space there and feel what it’s going to feel like in that theater performing the show because the Colonial is such a different theater um than the Broadhurst. And so I’m excited to like feel the different physical space of the theater is and what it sounds like and what the like different visceral um you know experience is of it. I’ve had that a couple times like we did Frozen in Denver in like a 4,000 seat theater and then going to the St. James it like changed the show. I mean like truly changed it so it’s a it’s a real thing when you move into a new home and I’m so excited to see it hopefully by the time this airs I will have seen one of the first previews but um thank you so much for for coming on board the podcast and and speaking with us today and um is there any way we could find you on social media uh do you want to shout out any of the shows you currently have running?

[45:56] Brian Usifer: Yeah I have I’m on Instagram I have a website um and I also have a band that I started in the in the pandemic called the 1920 and you can find us on in you know Spotify and Apple Music and all those things it’s it’s Colin Donnell and I.

[46:35] Mary Dina: Oh amazing and we’ll link we’ll link all that in our show notes and on our social media as well.

[46:41] Brian Usifer: Well thank you. This is great.

[46:43] Mary Dina: Yeah thanks guys this is really fun.

[46:45] Brian Sedita: Thanks everyone for listening to this episode of Page to Stage. To keep up with us you can find us on Instagram and Facebook at Page2Stage podcast. And if you’re enjoying these conversations we would really appreciate it if you could take a couple minutes to rate and review us wherever you’re listening to this podcast. Until next time that’s Brian that’s Mary we will see you later.

[47:05] Mary Dina: Bye.