This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Quincy Brown: And I think that's the most beautiful gift that the films have given us, is that it's giving it a lot of breathing room. I would have loved for the stage show to give us a little more time in there. Sure, it would have been four hours long. Yeah, but I mean me, I would have sat through ten hours. Yeah, they could have Angels in America that, separated, like, make me come on two nights. Well I say that to all the men, make me come on two nights. Don't spit, you'll never be popular.

[0:30] Kevin Bianchi: My name's Kevin, and this is Sentimental Men. We're here to talk, and maybe scream, about our favorite women in musical theater.

[1:00] Quincy Brown: What's your Jesus Christ Superstar history?

[1:10] Kevin Bianchi: I only really associate as a fan. Like you know it well?

[1:18] Quincy Brown: Not as well as I know other shows, but as a casual but supportive fan. I've never sung anything from it, I was never in it. I had never seen it, I only knew the hits, and I love the opportunity to see a show that you know you should know. I felt similarly about when I saw Hair at Signature Theater. I love Andrew Lloyd Webber, is what I decided after seeing Jesus Christ Superstar at the Hollywood Bowl.

[1:36] Kevin Bianchi: You decided that after seeing Jesus Christ Superstar at the Hollywood Bowl, got it. Okay, cool. Just such earworms and such melodies. I think of his Christian works, I might prefer Joseph a little more, but it was really cool to see this production, and it's a stellar production kind of all around. Cynthia obviously was incredible, Philippa I thought was amazing, Milo Manheim was great, Adam Lambert.

[2:11] Quincy Brown: Yeah, like a stacked cast.

[2:11] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, Josh Gad. Did they do any kind of like pro capture of it? Because it was so like starry and cool, and I'm so jealous of everyone like you who saw it live in person with your own ears.

[2:28] Quincy Brown: I mean I'm sure it exists because they have to... I'm sure there's an archive. There's like a three camera setup at Hollywood Bowl showing it all very well documented. I imagine it'll never be released, although I keep seeing rumors that it's going to play Radio City, which would be kind of slay. And then I think Angela Webber was hinting that there'll be an arena tour of it.

[2:49] Kevin Bianchi: I can't imagine it would be with that cast.

[2:53] Quincy Brown: Not with Cynthia Erivo.

[2:53] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. But it was so nice to see Cynthia outside of Wicked universe and be like, yeah, she's Elphaba, but she is just a stellar, stellar musical theater performer though.

[3:08] Quincy Brown: Correct. Her Gethsemane was jaw dropping. There were just so many songs outside of the hits that I knew that I was like, this is good. It's also so campy. Like I think I had always envisioned it as like a very earnest kind of retelling of the story of Christ. I think that's like the time it was written and gives it that impression. But no, it is like tongue in... like there's a tongue in cheekness to it.

[3:32] Kevin Bianchi: To the point where I was like, are Christians upset about this? Because I'm seeing so much on our clips of Cynthia. There's so much just mishigas of Jesus. Jesus wasn't black. Jesus wasn't a woman. Jesus wasn't white either.

[3:51] Quincy Brown: Yeah. It's like one, what a bizarre and annoying hill to die on. But the level of like outrage, because when Cynthia was announced, my initial reaction was slay. I didn't even like think of the possibility of controversy around that, but there's like a severe amount. So then I'm like, are those same Christians like upset about how campy and just like fun and over the top this retelling is as well?

[4:08] Kevin Bianchi: I don't know. I gotta look like when Jesus Christ Superstar first played, if it was like, no, people just loved it.

[4:18] Quincy Brown: It is a weird hill to die on. I agree with you there. Because my initial reaction was it was just like, like there are certain roles and this is like, I even feel like in the last like five years that this has happened, there are certain roles that it just feels like it doesn't matter anymore. The gender of the actor playing them. And I was like, oh, cool. Like this is a perfect role to cast in that way because it is this godlike character. So there should be no limits on who can or cannot play it.

[4:53] Kevin Bianchi: And honestly, I think the show needs like that kind of a twist to be interesting. If that was just a white man.

[4:59] Quincy Brown: Also, it's a concert production.

[5:06] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. I don't know. People need to direct their anger elsewhere. It's really crazy. The amount of comments.

[5:13] Quincy Brown: Yeah. Just across the board. That was my first time at the Hollywood Bowl. It was very, very cool.

[5:18] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, I've never been. It also felt a little bit like New York. Like I walked in and you're like running into all these people that you know and see. And I was like, where am I right now? It was kind of it was very cool.

[5:27] Quincy Brown: I would just love a cast recording out of this whole Jesus Christ Superstar endeavor. This feels like a cast that warrants putting on record.

[5:31] Kevin Bianchi: That feels reasonable. Adam Lambert was so good.

[5:37] Quincy Brown: Oh, my God. I am obsessed with Adam. I am. He has one of my favorite voices of all time.

[5:46] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. He has one of the sickest voices. And then I went back and listened to the OG cast recording for Jesus Christ Superstar. And I was like, oh, so they were adding like a ton of vocal pyrotechnics in this concert version, you know, popped up for me because of the algorithm is that old video of Adam Lambert in the like Ten Commandments musical.

[6:06] Quincy Brown: Oh, my God, Quincy, you're gonna lose your fucking mind.

[6:14] Kevin Bianchi: Okay, I'm gonna send it to you after this. It's insane. It's like it's at some like one of these theaters that is like a religious organizations. They have like a humongous budget for this like huge production of this original musical about the Ten Commandments. And Adam Lambert is there in a little tunic playing some biblical figure belting his little titties off.

[6:39] Quincy Brown: Sorry. Okay. You're gonna die. You're gonna die.

[6:44] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. I mean, bring this production of Jesus Christ to Broadway. That would be fantastic.

[6:51] Quincy Brown: Bring it.

[6:51] Kevin Bianchi: Okay, Kevin, we are launching into our busy era on this podcast.

[6:59] Quincy Brown: Sure am. Sure am. It's time.

[7:03] Kevin Bianchi: It's time of recording. I do not feel like the movie to press tour has kicked off in earnest.

[7:10] Quincy Brown: No, people have been saying it's time. Like people on Twitter or whatever are like, here we go. It's like press tour starts today. And I'm like, until I see the girls in outfits that they claim they didn't plan.

[7:18] Kevin Bianchi: It's not. It's not her story today. She's like in a recording studio zooming with Stephen Ramis and John Chu play.

[7:30] Quincy Brown: You're on last call. Bowen talked about they did reshoots a couple months ago.

[7:37] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. So maybe hopefully by the time you're listening to this, something has started. But at the time of recording, we're still in a little bit of a drought, which I am not going to complain about because I know once it starts, we're going to be inundated. So I'm just going to let it play out.

[8:00] Quincy Brown: I don't know. I'm excited, Quincy, because last year was so fun. I think last year was a little I was just talking to my therapist about this last year was like so fun. And it was a little like stressful is the right word, but it was a little intimidating because it was just so much that we had never done before or like had to deal with before. But this year we get to go into it having sort of done it already.

[8:21] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, I just I want to be more present this year because I feel like I kind of blacked out for the second half of last year and came to in like January.

[8:33] Quincy Brown: Yeah. But I agree. I think it's going to be so fun. I was going to say, what are you looking forward to based on our experience last year?

[8:39] Kevin Bianchi: Well, I'm looking forward to whatever the hell that NBC live live event thing is. I want to hopefully talk to more of the movie cast. I want to talk to Ariana and Cynthia again, but like more of the movie cast as well. I want to talk to Jon and Chew once we've seen the second part because I want I have questions.

[9:04] Quincy Brown: Yeah, I want to see the second part, obviously.

[9:13] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, I think. Yeah, we should see it maybe once. And I'm just excited for like, I'm excited for like the thing that we're not expecting to happen. Like what is going to be the Trisha Paytas of this year? You know?

[9:29] Quincy Brown: Yeah.

[9:29] Kevin Bianchi: I'm excited. Well, number one, I hope we get sweatshirts again this year because that shiz sweatshirt is the best sweater I've ever owned. It's like thick. It's well made. It's chunky. But then on the sides, it's like ribbed a little. You know what I mean? So it's oh, it's such a good sweatshirt.

[9:47] Quincy Brown: I can only wear it where I'm feeling good when I'm feeling good about my body because it is pretty like stiff. It is a fitted sweatshirt.

[9:52] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. It's not like a lounging sweatshirt.

[9:52] Quincy Brown: No, no, I wouldn't say that. So I hope we get sweatshirts again. I am looking forward to you know, I never went to a singalong screening last year. So I'm excited to do that again this year.

[10:09] Kevin Bianchi: I'm excited. Yes, bitch. I'm excited to. Do you think Elika Naminamin is going to stay the same? Because I feel like they changed the spells for Divine Gravity in the first movie.

[10:24] Quincy Brown: You know, maybe but those are lyrics. So maybe she wouldn't. Maybe they're added to but not because it's probably an extended sequence. I'm excited for the mania of like, how many times have you seen it? Like, oh, I've seen it four times so far. Like, I'm excited for that. And I'm excited for honestly, I am just excited for everybody to have it to like yap about again. Like that was it was just fun last year. Like no matter who you ran into, it was like, Oh, what did you think of the Wicked movie? Like, it was just fun to

[11:00] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, it's like when Barbie came out, it was just like, it's fun to have something everybody is participating in. And it's fun for that thing to be a musical theater thing. I'm excited for Taylor Swift to be in full force as Wicked is in full force. I'm just gonna have like, both of my monoculture obsessions being thrown at me at every second.

[11:25] Quincy Brown: I can't. I used to have a my friends and I used to have this theory that Ariana and Taylor never exist in the same universe. They're always on opposite.

[11:35] Kevin Bianchi: I remember this. I feel like it's gone out the window a little bit with the Arsdor and the Wicked movie and now this new album. But I always love when they're kind of like existing as celebrities at the same time in the culture.

[11:46] Quincy Brown: Yeah, yeah. Kevin, you just did our friends at down the yellow brick pod. You did a guest appearance on their episode.

[11:52] Kevin Bianchi: I did. It was really fun. They are doing a really fun series right now. Well, it's probably over by now by time of listening, which means you can go back and binge at all. But they went through kind of like we did at the start of our podcast. They like went through the movies kind of scene by scene and talked about just like the details of each scene, which is fun because, you know, like when we talk about it, we talk about it so much in like broad strokes that to really like get into the nitty gritty with someone was really fun.

[12:29] Quincy Brown: Obviously, they asked they asked us on, but you were not available.

[12:35] Kevin Bianchi: So that's okay. I'm sorry, guys. I was traveling. But I do feel like you were the perfect one of us to take this specific task.

[12:39] Quincy Brown: I lowkey was. We broke down the sentimental men see or sentimental man seen in the movie.

[12:49] Kevin Bianchi: And we somehow managed to make a two hour podcast episode about six minutes of.

[12:56] Quincy Brown: I'm not all the way through it. I started it and I was like, oh, this is lengthy.

[13:00] Kevin Bianchi: Lengthy. And we break down into like a full conversation about like the urban development of Robert Moses and how it relates to Jeff Goldblum and his portrayal of the wizard. Like we really went off the deep end with that. But it was fun to really kind of like break down the wizard as a character and like, you know, Jeff Goldblum's performance as opposed to the way he's portrayed on Broadway and things like that. So, yeah, it's a really fun episode of a very fun series of episodes. If you don't listen to their podcast, you should. They put they are like very consistently and like, I mean, they'll ask Quincy and I to come. They'll be like, hey, guys, in two and a half months, you have 17 minutes to spare. They're so organized. They crank out episodes like the Navy. I mean, it's they're insane. I'm so impressed with their unlike the sentiment, their level of content.

[14:02] Quincy Brown: No, we're so easy breezy. We're like dancing through life. If an episode breezes past us, if we manage to catch it, if not, we let it go. Whatever.

[14:16] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, is the movie coming out? Maybe we'll do an episode. They are like militant. They never miss an episode. So if you love this podcast, but you're like, these boys are a little unreliable, you know, we've never once gotten called out for being inconsistent, which is always shocking to me because we kind of are.

[14:38] Quincy Brown: Yeah. Well, I think it's because we are pretty upfront about our inability to be consistent. Like I and I think also we were so consistent for the first like two and a half, three years when nobody was like at work or like going out. And so like now that people have like things, other things to do, I don't think people mind that we skip some weeks. Thank you for the grace.

[15:13] Kevin Bianchi: That said, if we can hold ourselves to the plan that we made the other night between now and the end of the year, y'all will be fed.

[15:20] Quincy Brown: Yeah. But until the end of the year, no promises. But I also feel like it's for me personally, it's easier to like be on top of shit when there's a lot, when there's more of it.

[15:29] Kevin Bianchi: Yes. Cause it's just like, you gotta, I literally woke up yesterday morning and was like, Nick, you just a podcast in all aspects of life. I was like, you just have to lock in.

[15:37] Quincy Brown: Yeah. Buckle up.

[15:44] Kevin Bianchi: Kevin, I saw the recent Broadway cast before I left town a couple of weeks ago.

[15:44] Quincy Brown: You did. I, the current Broadway cast, we have been trying to line up seeing that cast together for so long that finally we were just like, you know what, we're going to go separately. And you beat me to it.

[15:57] Kevin Bianchi: I just knew that once I came back from vacation, we were going to be in hyperdrive. So I was like, let me see it now so I can at least get it in. I feel like maybe what we should do yet is I'll try to go like this week or next week and then we can record maybe like a mini episode just devoted to, to that.

[16:17] Quincy Brown: Do you have anything you want to tell me about them now?

[16:23] Kevin Bianchi: Sure. I'll withhold then. All I will say, it was great. It was really great. I'm loving Natasha Yvette as Marable.

[16:28] Quincy Brown: Yeah. Loving, loving.

[16:34] Kevin Bianchi: Brad Oscar, I think is one of the most perfect wizards. Allie Trim and Lencia are fantastic. I'm going to, before we have them on, say that I think Allie Trim is a no good or wicked Glinda. And I think Lencia is a no good deed, Elphaba.

[16:48] Quincy Brown: Okay. No one mourns no good deed. That's my take.

[16:57] Kevin Bianchi: Okay. Um, Jordan Litz, I love when a Fiyero is straight. He's still, you know what? Okay, Jordan Litz and, um, Jake had their little moment in Dancing Through Life where like he gets like right up in box face in like a very playful way. And every time I saw them do it, I was like, kiss, just kiss.

[17:25] Quincy Brown: Speaking of Buck, I do think Danny Quadrino is a pretty perfect, perfect Buck.

[17:30] Kevin Bianchi: Danny's a sleigh. He's so fantastic. He sings it down. He riffs where you want to riff. He gets a little poppy. He's so funny. I'm so happy. Dig up that episode from the backlog, y'all. Daniel Quadrino in like the first 20 episodes or 25. It's like a good episode too.

[17:44] Quincy Brown: It is. Yeah. It was like a pride episode or something, right?

[17:50] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. No, he's fantastic as Buck. It was so cool to see Jenna as Nessa. She's also phenomenal. I can't wait to have her on.

[18:00] Quincy Brown: Um, it's a, it's a really good time to see Wicked. I want to go back to see, uh, Carrie Renee Fuller, the standby, because I'm also hearing fantastic things about her.

[18:06] Kevin Bianchi: I bet. And the boots I've seen have been delish. Maybe I'll try to go when Connor's back. And it's like a little easier for me to like do something.

[18:19] Quincy Brown: Because we're entering Wicked Mania. We got it.

[18:21] Kevin Bianchi: We're going to have a lot. Quincy, speaking of current casts, one more thing to mention, because it's so apropos to our guest today, is that the Brazil production of Wicked is currently making herstory with Gloria Groove as the first drag queen cast as Madame Morrible in any production of Wicked.

[18:37] Quincy Brown: That is so slay.

[18:37] Kevin Bianchi: So slay. And like so perfect for Madame Morrible. I can't believe that hasn't happened yet.

[18:45] Quincy Brown: I do suspect a day in like 20 years from now where like drag queen as Madame Morrible is the norm.

[18:51] Kevin Bianchi: Is the norm. Yeah. Like when regional productions of Wicked are starting to pop up everywhere.

[18:58] Quincy Brown: Yeah. I mean, honestly, I would love to see today's guest as Broadway's first drag, Madame Morrible.

[19:10] Kevin Bianchi: Let's ask her.

[19:10] Quincy Brown: Yeah.

[19:11] Kevin Bianchi: Anna Gasteyer, hard no. But I do feel like Ginger Minj might consider it in a different light.

[19:18] Quincy Brown: Oh my God. Anna's episode was so funny. I still get texts from people being like, hey, I'm listening to the Anna Gasteyer episode and it's so funny. She killed it. If we ever need like a guest host because one of us has fallen ill, I say we call her.

[19:30] Kevin Bianchi: I think Nicole Parker would also be a good guest host.

[19:34] Quincy Brown: Yes. For a similar reason. You know, I do still you mentioned this once. I do still think it would be so fun to do like a roundtable with you, me, Jackie, Teal, and Dee.

[19:40] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. Maybe we should. Well, Dee's in Death Becomes Her. That'd be fun. I want to see her so bad. I want to see her as Helen, though.

[19:46] Quincy Brown: And she has never gone on as Helen.

[19:48] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, as Jennifer Smart?

[19:49] Quincy Brown: Yeah. Oh, no. I kind of love her as Madeline. She's only done Madeline and everything I've seen, I'm very interested in.

[19:54] Kevin Bianchi: Is she both?

[19:55] Quincy Brown: She's a standby for both.

[19:57] Kevin Bianchi: Interesting. I think like on paper, she's a standby for both. But I think off paper, she's like primarily Megan's standby.

[20:03] Quincy Brown: Kevin, who are we talking to today?

[20:05] Kevin Bianchi: Quincy, today we are talking to the one, the only, the incomparable, the fabulous Ginger Minj.

[20:12] Quincy Brown: Our second Drag Race Girl on Sentiment Pod.

[20:15] Kevin Bianchi: Our second Drag Race Girl. I know, which honestly, I just feel like it's fun that we're getting into the overlap of like, being a sentimental man via your high school theater drama club and being a sentimental man via putting on makeup when your parents weren't looking. That's a big overlap. And I feel blessed to explore it.

[20:32] Quincy Brown: And we're about to enter a wicked palooza. But sometimes we like to talk to some non-wicked folks. So thank you for going along for the ride with us. And also, there's a lot of wicked overlap with these quote unquote non-wicked guests.

[20:45] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, everybody's got a wicked overlap. It's all in the SMU. Also, it's not even un-wicked related because Ginger Minj, as we were talking about just now, had the distinct pleasure of lip syncing the Idina Menzel recording of Defying Gravity in front of Ariana Grande and Cynthia Erivo.

[21:01] Quincy Brown: What an honor.

[21:02] Kevin Bianchi: Do you think we'll ever have the distinct pleasure of lip syncing the movie Defying Gravity in front of...

[21:06] Quincy Brown: That's what I want. Let's say Idina and Kristen.

[21:09] Kevin Bianchi: I want it in front of all four for us. But yeah, I think so. I think, Quincy, you and me would really...

[21:13] Quincy Brown: We'd kill it.

[21:14] Kevin Bianchi: I feel like, what's it called, Fagtasia should have us as special lip sync guests for the...

[21:18] Quincy Brown: Yeah.

[21:19] Kevin Bianchi: Kevin, I also... We haven't mentioned it yet, but I do feel like it's important to flag your haircut and your new look that you're serving listeners who are not watching us. This is a Kevin I haven't seen in a very long time.

[21:31] Quincy Brown: In years, in years.

[21:32] Kevin Bianchi: This is a little bit the Kevin I fell in love with, though, minus the stache.

[21:35] Quincy Brown: Yeah, she's new. This is close to the Kevin that started this podcast.

[21:40] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, back when we were all... We're serving like mullet now.

[21:43] Quincy Brown: And yeah, yeah, yeah. I had a mustache, yeah.

[21:46] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah, those 10 francs, they sure did save my poor cassette.

[21:50] Quincy Brown: Sorry, back to Ginger Minj.

[21:52] Kevin Bianchi: Anyway, so yeah, so Ginger Minj is not even that far away from being Wicked related. For anybody listening who does not know, Ginger Minj is best known to most of us as a competitor on RuPaul's Drag Race Season 7, All Stars Season 2, All Stars Season 6, and most recently as the winner of RuPaul's Drag Race All Stars Season 10.

[22:11] Quincy Brown: She really is the Jenny D'Onoia of the Drag Race franchise.

[22:14] Kevin Bianchi: She just be coming anytime you need her, call her up. She's like, I could be painted in 15 minutes.

[22:19] Quincy Brown: So in a way, I'm sad that she won because now she's not going to compete anymore.

[22:23] Kevin Bianchi: Episode title, Ginger Minj, the Jenny D'Onoia of Drag Race.

[22:27] Quincy Brown: Approximately 20 people on this planet will understand that.

[22:30] Kevin Bianchi: Right, but all 20 of those people listen.

[22:34] Quincy Brown: No, but so Ginger is known across the fandom for being a campy queen, always excels at the acting and singing and comedy challenges, which makes a lot of sense.

[22:43] Kevin Bianchi: Yes, because Ginger has a background and a current present in the musical theater.

[22:47] Quincy Brown: Feels like she's getting more into the musical theater.

[22:50] Kevin Bianchi: Yes, and I can't wait to talk to her with the jinx of it all and like, with jinx really like forging the path from Drag Race to Broadway.

[22:57] Quincy Brown: In a very chic way, might I add.

[22:59] Kevin Bianchi: In a very chic way and also not to undermine any of like, Marcia or Peppermint or anything. I just mean like the jinx of it all feels like a very big moment.

[23:06] Quincy Brown: And I am really excited to see what I hope to be a wave of Drag Race girls coming to Broadway in some capacity.

[23:12] Kevin Bianchi: Because ultimately, drag queens are just kind of talented in all the aspects that you need for a musical theater career.

[23:18] Quincy Brown: So yes, you got to have the charisma, uniqueness, nerve and talent. And Broadway could use more of that.

[23:24] Kevin Bianchi: Okay, save that for the Patreon.

[23:27] Quincy Brown: Ginger Minj grew up performing on stage. She majored in theater in college. Since being introduced to the world on Drag Race, Ginger has been on stage in drag in shows like Sweeney Todd, Chicago, Hedwig, and of course, the Holy Grail, La Cage aux Folles.

[23:41] Kevin Bianchi: Two things. Number one, fun fact, Sweeney Todd, Stephen Sondheim personally approved her casting the casting like as of a drag queen as Mrs. Lovett.

[23:51] Quincy Brown: Well, second thing is I love that video, the Trailblazers Awards where she sings, I am what I am for Harvey Fierstein.

[23:57] Kevin Bianchi: Give her a whole revival just based on that.

[24:00] Quincy Brown: Honestly, honestly, she would kill it.

[24:02] Kevin Bianchi: She's the perfect. Honestly, her and Jinx should.

[24:06] Quincy Brown: Wow. Should do it.

[24:08] Kevin Bianchi: Ginger as Elben and Jinx, or they could Little Fox it.

[24:12] Quincy Brown: They could.

[24:13] Kevin Bianchi: Okay, that's a good idea.

[24:14] Quincy Brown: Who do we talk to?

[24:15] Kevin Bianchi: Also, Harvey Fierstein's Tony speech really got me so on board again. Not that I was ever off board, but I was like, damn, he really is the best.

[24:22] Quincy Brown: He's one of the greats.

[24:23] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. Let's have him on the podcast after the movie and everything.

[24:26] Quincy Brown: Let's have him on the podcast.

[24:28] Kevin Bianchi: He could have been a fun choice for the wizard.

[24:30] Quincy Brown: Or Madame Marble again.

[24:33] Kevin Bianchi: We got to ask Ginger if she wants to do more of them.

[24:36] Quincy Brown: We gotta.

[24:37] Kevin Bianchi: I hope.

[24:38] Quincy Brown: I've honestly never been more embarrassed. I worked up the nerve to ask Anna Gasteyer two questions, and her answer to both of them was no.

[24:48] Kevin Bianchi: Anyways, welcome back from the Patreon cut.

[24:52] Quincy Brown: Guys, subscribe to our Patreon.

[24:54] Kevin Bianchi: We're starting to talk off the record. Ginger has released three of her own studio albums, as well as appearing on the albums of tons of other drag race queens on screen. You may have spotted her recent cover of Defying Gravity, which is available to stream.

[25:10] Quincy Brown: Recent cover of Defying Gravity. Again, this is not an Unwicked centered episode. She's living out the sentiment fantasy.

[25:17] Kevin Bianchi: Listen, Ginger Minj is a theater kid who grew up to win RuPaul's Drag Race. There's no way that Wicked did not play a part in her life in some way.

[25:27] Quincy Brown: We're in the clear with this episode.

[25:29] Kevin Bianchi: This is a Wicked episode.

[25:30] Quincy Brown: They always are. You heard it here first. Ginger Minj is going to be our next Madame Marble on Broadway.

[25:37] Kevin Bianchi: It honestly would be so fabulous.

[25:40] Quincy Brown: Oh my god, and she'd make that stupid cross-eyed face in the...

[25:44] Kevin Bianchi: You may have fooled the rest of us with that aren't I good act.

[25:48] Quincy Brown: You may have spotted Ginger Minj on screen in shows like AJ and the Queen, in the movie Dumplin' with Jennifer Aniston, or in a little indie film called Hocus Pocus 2.

[25:58] Kevin Bianchi: Honestly, how iconic to be the drag version of officially documented J Armstrong Johnson found quaking.

[26:06] Quincy Brown: Every gay that's ever done it for Halloween, Ginger Minj, the official Winifred Sanderson drag queen. Thank you for your service, J Armstrong Johnson. Nothing but respect to other interpretations, but the call went to Ginger.

[26:18] Kevin Bianchi: Oh my god, Ginger Minj, Hello Dolly.

[26:20] Quincy Brown: Sure.

[26:21] Kevin Bianchi: And RuPaul can be Horace.

[26:23] Quincy Brown: So I want you to do a straight up revival of Hello Dolly with RuPaul as Horace, not as Dolly.

[26:28] Kevin Bianchi: Oh.

[26:29] Quincy Brown: Michelle Visage as Dolly.

[26:31] Kevin Bianchi: Michelle Visage as Dolly. RuPaul as Horace.

[26:34] Quincy Brown: Oh my god.

[26:35] Kevin Bianchi: That's all I have to say.

[26:37] Quincy Brown: Ginger Minj is fucking excellent. And I have a sense this is going to be a very fun conversation.

[26:42] Kevin Bianchi: I do too. I think she could be one of our rotating co-hosts.

[26:46] Quincy Brown: Lindsay Heather Pierce and Ginger Minj co-hosts.

[26:49] Kevin Bianchi: Oh my god.

[26:50] Quincy Brown: They start their own podcast.

[26:51] Kevin Bianchi: We're out of business.

[26:53] Quincy Brown: All right, let's get into this interview with Ginger Minj.

[26:56] Kevin Bianchi: I can't wait.

[26:57] Quincy Brown: Let's do it.

[26:58] Kevin Bianchi: Ginger Minj, thank you so much for joining us on Sentimental Man. Welcome.

[27:01] Ginger Minj: Thank you. I am quite the sentimental man.

[27:05] Kevin Bianchi: Yes.

[27:06] Ginger Minj: And the sentimental fan, the sentimental man fan, everything.

[27:10] Quincy Brown: We're saying we're branching out to these non-wicked guests, but all of our non-wicked guests still feel like they're within the wicked universe.

[27:17] Ginger Minj: We're in a wicked sweatshirt.

[27:19] Quincy Brown: Right. Are any sentimental men really outside the wicked world?

[27:23] Ginger Minj: We're all one leg in. We all live in the bubble.

[27:27] Quincy Brown: Okay, so our first question is, what is your first Wicked the Musical touch point in life, just as a person?

[27:34] Ginger Minj: I mean, I grew up just obsessed with The Wizard of Oz, with everything Wizard of Oz. The books were my building blocks growing up. And of course, whenever the Wicked novel came out, I had to have it. I devoured it. Didn't even understand what I had read at that point, because the novel is so crazy.

[27:54] Kevin Bianchi: It is so weird.

[27:55] Ginger Minj: So when I heard that it was being turned into a musical, my little gay heart was like, oh, yes, finally, these girls can sing like they've always meant to be. But I was like, how the hell are they going to do that? It's going to be quite the musical.

[28:10] Kevin Bianchi: On stage.

[28:11] Ginger Minj: It's going to be like five million acts.

[28:14] Kevin Bianchi: It's never going to end.

[28:16] Ginger Minj: And then I saw it and I went, oh, this was so smart, because you took those little bits and pieces that we really loved from the book. And then you made it make sense with the entire world of Wizard of Oz. And I was obsessed from day one.

[28:31] Kevin Bianchi: I saw my first time seeing it was the performance right after the Tony Awards.

[28:36] Ginger Minj: And I'll never forget.

[28:37] Kevin Bianchi: Was that intentional?

[28:38] Ginger Minj: No, it was just the first day that I could get tickets.

[28:41] Kevin Bianchi: And I stumbled into them.

[28:43] Ginger Minj: And we were in, we had rush seats. I think we were in like the first or second row, second row. And I remember, I will never, ever forget Kristen Chenoweth coming down in the bubble. And you could tell like there was this air of I just lost the Tony Award.

[29:01] Kevin Bianchi: Good to see me, isn't it? No need to respond. That was rhetorical.

[29:06] Ginger Minj: And it struck me like in that moment, and I have never forgotten that ever, ever, ever. And that's when like Glinda as a person, as a character, just became so like imbued with who I am as a performer and a drag queen. I was like, I strive to be that level of petty on stage.

[29:24] Kevin Bianchi: Yes. I wonder too, like because especially growing up, like as you said, like as a theater kid, as a theater lover, Kristen Chenoweth is like the ideal of musical theater comedy. Like she is the Lucille Ball of musical theater.

[29:37] Ginger Minj: Yeah.

[29:38] Kevin Bianchi: And so were you already doing drag at this point when you were seeing Wicked for the first time?

[29:43] Ginger Minj: No, this was right before I really kind of got all into the drag world.

[29:48] Kevin Bianchi: I was dabbling in it a little bit here.

[29:50] Ginger Minj: Yeah, yeah. Mostly because I was under the drinking age, but I knew that I looked enough like my cousin's fiance if I put a wig and some lipstick on it.

[30:01] Kevin Bianchi: I was dressing in drag to use his ID to go to the bar, not even to drink, just to kind of like be amongst queer people because where I was born and raised, there were no queer people out on the street. Nobody was loud and proud. So in order to like have a sense of community, I stumbled into drag and that got me into the scene and into the bars. But I hadn't really like developed who I was as a character at that point. I wasn't doing it professionally or really like, I wasn't doing it consistently, but it was seeing people like Kristen Chenoweth as Glinda that made me go, oh, I can kind of take the things I love like Lucille Ball and Carol Burnett and mix it with musical theater, mix it with Oz and just become like this character.

[30:53] Kevin Bianchi: So talk to us a little bit more about your takeaways after seeing Wicked that first time. I think something that's interesting is when Wicked was opening, it was a little divisive amongst theater folks. Like some people really loved it and some people really weren't taking to it. What was your just takeaways from seeing it?

[31:11] Ginger Minj: Well, there's the ambulance right there.

[31:13] Kevin Bianchi: Take me out.

[31:14] Ginger Minj: No, I mean, I absolutely loved it. I could see why it would be divisive because you have the MGM Oz fans who are so protective over that property. You've got the literary Wonderful Wizard of Oz fans who are very protective over that property. And then you have the fans of Gregory Maguire's novel who were so like, this is the Oz for me. This is the Oz that speaks to me. So you're trying to appeal to all of these different branches of the same thing. And I think that it successfully blends all of those different things into one. But if you are a specific fan of one or the other, there are elements of your Oz that you don't see represented or you feel like the elements that have been taken can be bastardized. So I do understand how some people could be like, yeah, it's fine, but it's not my Oz or it's not what I wanted it to be.

[32:14] Kevin Bianchi: The Oz is so expansive.

[32:16] Ginger Minj: Anyway, it's hard to boil it down. Even the MGM movie did not get it right when it comes to the story and the world building. But we love it for what it is. And I think that that's what people have really grown to love about Wicked on stage and now in film.

[32:32] Kevin Bianchi: What I love about the films is that they kind of just, okay, I'm gonna be completely honest with you. I love Wicked on stage, but the storytelling's not there.

[32:39] Ginger Minj: It's so fast.

[32:40] Kevin Bianchi: It's so fast.

[32:41] Ginger Minj: And I had forgotten about that until after I had seen part one and I went back to go watch it again. We were doing press week for All Stars 10. And I was like, oh, I can get a ticket. Let me go see it. And an hour and 10 minutes into the film, you're just getting into popular.

[32:54] Kevin Bianchi: Minutes into the stage show, she's already la la lying.

[32:57] Ginger Minj: I just went back to see it a couple of weeks ago. And that was my first time after having only seen the movie over and over. And I was like, this is moving fast. Holy shit.

[33:06] Kevin Bianchi: It's a breakneck speed.

[33:07] Ginger Minj: And you don't have time to breathe. You don't have time to really just kind of sit in those moments with the characters and let them resonate with you. And I think that's the most beautiful gift that the films have given us, is that it's giving it a lot of breathing room, giving us those moments to be like, oh, OK, now I understand why you're so close, how you're so close, why this is important and why it's a whole world.

[33:27] Kevin Bianchi: So I do think that I would have loved for the stage show to give us a little more time in there.

[33:32] Ginger Minj: Sure. It would have been four hours long.

[33:34] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah.

[33:35] Ginger Minj: Yeah. But I mean, me, I would have sat through 10 hours.

[33:38] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. You know? They could have Angels in America, that, separated. Like, make me come on two nights.

[33:44] Ginger Minj: Well, I say that to all the men. Make me come on two nights. Don't spit. You'll never be popular.

[33:50] Kevin Bianchi: But yeah, so I understood all of the criticism that went with it. And I'll be that one that said, maybe I don't agree that Avenue Q should have won the Best Musical Tony, but I understand why it did.

[34:00] Ginger Minj: I feel like Avenue Q was a little more like, this is exactly what we are. This is exactly what the message is. And it appealed to the people that it appealed to because it wasn't trying to be a bunch of different things.

[34:10] Kevin Bianchi: So I understand. But I also still am obsessed with Wicked and wanted to have all of the love and accolades in the world.

[34:16] Quincy Brown: So then talk us through when the movie casting comes out. Try and go back in time. You haven't seen the movie yet. What were initial reactions to the cast as it was coming out?

[34:24] Ginger Minj: I mean, Cynthia Erivo, I've been obsessed with since I saw her as Steely in Color Purple in London.

[34:30] Kevin Bianchi: Before anybody knew who she was.

[34:32] Ginger Minj: And I was just so, like, enthralled with her. Nobody can tell a story through song the way that Cynthia Erivo can. So I was really excited about that. I thought that it was also very exciting that we had a person of color playing a literal person of color to kind of, like, no pun intended, shade it differently.

[34:50] Kevin Bianchi: And I also was thrilled when Ariana got cast because I knew, A, that she was a brilliant comedian. Anybody that has watched her on any of the late night shows or on Saturday Night Live knows that she just has comic timing. Like, it's in her bones. And I knew what an obsessive Oz fan she had been her entire life. All of these other people are like, oh, my God, she's going to ruin it. I knew she cared enough about it that she wasn't going to screw it up.

[35:16] Ginger Minj: Yeah. And then in my head, I'm like, okay, this is their chance to get Bette Midler to play Madame Horrible. We're going to get Winifred Sanderson in, like, a part two, the remix, even better.

[35:27] Kevin Bianchi: We thought how cool if Liza could do it.

[35:29] Ginger Minj: Liza would have been amazing.

[35:31] Kevin Bianchi: But in my spirit, I just really, really, really wanted Bette Midler to do it.

[35:36] Ginger Minj: I mean, of course, that's my hocus pocus Winifred Sanderson loving soul. If it wasn't her, I really wanted Cheryl Lee Ralph because I enjoyed her so much in the show. And she has that bravado that she brings to everything that she does that I thought would really play. My Madame Horrible, I want her to be so incredibly awful and evil.

[36:00] Quincy Brown: I want to play Madame Horrible. That is my dream.

[36:02] Ginger Minj: Okay, this is our question. Yes.

[36:03] Quincy Brown: In the intro, we were talking, because they just announced in Brazil that Gloria Groove is going in. And we were like, now is the time. Marble, especially within the context of the show, she is drag. All those women have been in drag and performing at a drag level of camp. It's just built into the role.

[36:20] Ginger Minj: Well, it is so meta for me because I grew up watching the Golden Girls. And then the second Marble that I saw was Rue McClanahan. Flash forward all these years later, I've been playing Blanche Devereaux in Golden Gals Live for seven years. So I feel like now's the time for all of these elements to come together and let me play Rue McClanahan as Madame Horrible in Wicked.

[36:40] Quincy Brown: I think it'd be perfect.

[36:41] Ginger Minj: I do, too. And I also think that it would be such an interesting statement in this particular political climate, because people are trying to villainize drag so much. So why not? I mean, as political as Wicked is in general, why not just really hone in on those stereotypes and then kind of break them down from the inside out?

[37:01] Kevin Bianchi: I was telling Kevin, I think it's going to take one queen to do it once, and then that's going to become the norm on Broadway. It's just always a drag queen as Madame Horrible.

[37:10] Ginger Minj: Well, and Gloria, so I voice Lemon Chiffon.

[37:13] Quincy Brown: Oh, right there.

[37:14] Ginger Minj: Yeah, the little character.

[37:16] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, yeah.

[37:17] Ginger Minj: In Superdrags on Netflix. And it was a dub of the Brazilian one. And Gloria was a part of the Brazilian cast.

[37:23] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, I didn't realize that.

[37:24] Ginger Minj: OK.

[37:25] Quincy Brown: So we are all connected to each other in a circle and a hoop that doesn't end.

[37:29] Ginger Minj: Yes.

[37:30] Quincy Brown: All right. This is the official petition for Ginger Minj as Madame Horrible.

[37:34] Kevin Bianchi: The campaign starts now.

[37:36] Ginger Minj: There were petitions to get me to play Ursula in the live action Little Mermaid. They got hundreds of thousands of signatures and still didn't help.

[37:45] Quincy Brown: I will still miss out on Madame Horrible because Melissa McCarthy will decide she won't.

[37:50] Kevin Bianchi: Not the mug.

[37:51] Ginger Minj: The sips.

[37:53] Kevin Bianchi: The tea is thriving today.

[37:55] Quincy Brown: Oh my goodness.

[37:56] Kevin Bianchi: Well, what are your Broadway, what are your career aspirations? I think it's a really interesting time watching what's happening with Jinx. And Jinx is really doing a bespoke career path that I think makes so much sense. We were talking about how drag queens especially have all of the talent buckets that you need to be a Broadway performer. So it just makes so much sense.

[38:19] Ginger Minj: Well, yeah. And it's so interesting to go on a show like RuPaul's Drag Race, where it's not a project runway where you create and design outfits. It's not an American Idol where you sing songs. It's not this or that. There's nothing specific. It is every reality competition all shoved into one. And you've got to do it backwards and heels.

[38:41] Kevin Bianchi: It's true.

[38:42] Ginger Minj: Like a lot of us do possess all of the qualities that it takes to be a big Broadway star or a big movie star, any of those things. But it's hard to get taken seriously by people who are in charge because a lot of them don't understand all of the different facets of talent that you have to have and to hit consistently to have any kind of career or staying power.

[39:06] Kevin Bianchi: And I think Jinx has been such a beautiful journey to watch because she's really like she's not just opening doors, she's kicking them off the hinges so that others of us who have been trying to do this for years are starting to be taken a little more seriously.

[39:19] Ginger Minj: I was gonna say we had Anna Gasteyer on recently and she was saying the same thing to be on SNL when she was leaving. There was no road map of how to transition that or lever that into a stage career. And so to now, like you're saying, have a little bit of a road map and a little bit of just like legitimacy put under Drag Race as a path to Broadway.

[39:41] Ginger Minj: Yeah. And it's wild because I just did my fourth season in 10 years. Finally won. Yay, yay. God knows I don't have a fifth season and I had to win. But in that 10 years and four seasons, even though I got into drag through musical theater, I accidentally stumbled into drag because of theater and curated this whole character that was so musical theater coded. I never got taken seriously as that until I did my talent show performance on this season.

[40:06] Kevin Bianchi: It was the second to last episode and it airs and within hours I started getting producers from Broadway reaching out saying, we had no idea that this was in your wheelhouse. How can we get you into the room so we can start talking about what's next for you on Broadway?

[40:20] Ginger Minj: That's amazing.

[40:21] Kevin Bianchi: So it took me 25 years of doing drag, four seasons over 10 years of RuPaul's Drag Race.

[40:27] Ginger Minj: On the second to last episode.

[40:29] Kevin Bianchi: On the second to last episode to get people to understand that this is who I have always been as an entertainer and this is what my aspirations have always kind of built up to.

[40:38] Quincy Brown: Because what was your dream for yourself as a child? What did you think you wanted to do?

[40:41] Ginger Minj: I wanted to do Broadway. That was the ultimate goal. I never really saw much of a path for it. I was born and raised in Leesburg, Florida, which is North Florida. And in Florida, we always say the further north you go, the further south you are. And there were no other queer kids, especially like queer musical theater loving fat kids in our little Southern Baptist community. That was just me. And I didn't see anybody that really looked like me or did what I did on TV or Broadway or anything except for Divine watching all the John Waters movies. Loved Hairspray. I'm still traumatized by Pink Flamingos, but I love it so much.

[41:14] Kevin Bianchi: And then, of course, as I was a teenager and Hairspray the musical hit. Harvey Fierstein just gave me that hope. And I was like, oh my God, I could not only star in a big Broadway musical wearing a wig and dress and heels, I can also win the Tony Award for doing it. And it made me so excited. So it kind of like reignited this fire in me to figure out what the easiest, not easiest, but what the most viable path to Broadway would be. And that's when I stumbled into drag and started taking that on, thinking, oh, I'm going to be the next Madea, Robin Williams, like all of the people that have made a career blending drag and acting. And that was not the case.

[41:58] Kevin Bianchi: A lot of different directions to finally kind of wind back here.

[42:01] Ginger Minj: Right.

[42:02] Kevin Bianchi: Well, it's interesting. I feel like culture has gotten to a point and drag race as just an entity has gotten to a point where you look at Jinx and Marsha.

[42:08] Ginger Minj: You heard me call it the entity.

[42:10] Kevin Bianchi: The entity.

[42:12] Ginger Minj: Like Jinx and Marsha can do the, yeah, I did the drag race thing, but I'm just a talented performer and be taken seriously as a performer.

[42:20] Kevin Bianchi: It does feel like we're turning a new page with the crossover.

[42:23] Ginger Minj: Absolutely. And I mean, I've only met Marsha once and she's so lovely and so talented. But having spent so much one on one time with Jinx, I knew like what went into it. It was so weird because a lot of people look at it and they go, oh, it just happened overnight. No, I mean, it took her years of fighting to be seen to make it to Chicago on Broadway. And then once Chicago hit, then yes, everything else just started falling into place, which hopefully is the case for Marsha and myself and these other girls who are musical theater girlies.

[43:00] Kevin Bianchi: But it took decades of work to become an overnight success.

[43:03] Ginger Minj: Exactly.

[43:04] Quincy Brown: Okay. We have to talk about your lip-sync for your life with Diabetes to Defying Gravity original Broadway cast recording version for the movie Girls.

[43:12] Ginger Minj: The funniest part was, and I was hoping they would leave it in, but they didn't, was they do that whole setup of as a tribute to the OG Broadway witches. We're going to do the whole setup. And then Cynthia goes, because they wouldn't fucking release art.

[43:27] Kevin Bianchi: And the rest of us are on, especially me, I'm like, but it exists.

[43:31] Ginger Minj: It exists in the world. And I need to hear it because this was before the movie came out. And we all told her, we were like, we're not going to do this lip-sync until you stand up and do the battle cry. We just have to hear it.

[43:44] Kevin Bianchi: So you could hear a pin drop, not a sound on set. Cynthia Erivo stood up and did the whole battle cry as loud as could be, sent chills through my spine, which is why I was crying before the song even started.

[44:00] Ginger Minj: I was in it. And I knew once I saw what the lip-sync song was, I was like, there's going to be nothing that stops me from placing in the top on this challenge. I won't let it because I need to do this song in front of those two people, in front of the world. I feel like this is the turning point for me with drag and drag race, marrying all of the things that I love into one.

[44:24] Kevin Bianchi: So I fought hard to get to that spot in the first place and then to be able to do it. There's those moments in life where something just kind of takes over and you black out until it's done. And that's one of them. The other moment I remember having like that was when I got to sing I Am What I Am on the Trailblazers for Harvey.

[44:41] Quincy Brown: We just dreamcast you in La Cage in the intro.

[44:43] Ginger Minj: Yeah. To be completely honest with you, that is like the ultimate for me. I've played Out Bend twice. I did it in La Cage in Chicago a couple of years ago. And like all the reviews are like, oh, wow, isn't it so different when it's actually played by a drag queen? Somebody who has lived this experience. One of the reviews is like, I've seen this probably 50 times in the last 40 years. And this is the first time that it actually felt like a real story.

[45:06] Kevin Bianchi: And speaking of political climate, like now is the time, fortunately, where it's more relevant than it was four decades ago.

[45:12] Ginger Minj: So anyway, I'm getting sidetracked.

[45:14] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, it's great.

[45:15] Ginger Minj: Those two moments are the ones in my career where I remember the lead up and I remember the fallout and nothing in the middle. I don't remember doing that lip sync at all. I just remember coming to and seeing Ariana just sobbing in the corner.

[45:29] Kevin Bianchi: The iconic cut to her.

[45:31] Ginger Minj: Yeah, and she kept going. She kept going, I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry. We knew that what we had done was something really special for the people who needed to see it.

[45:41] Kevin Bianchi: It was special.

[45:42] Ginger Minj: Well, and that song, especially for a Lip Sync for Your Life, because it's not like a cat, cat, cat, cat, cat song. It's a very, you have to just be dropped in and just perform the honesty in the number. And, of course, like a lot of the younger fan base, they've gotten so used to the cat, cat, cat, cat, cat, that they still want you to death drop and kick and spin and punch and do all of these things to songs like Divine Gravity.

[46:06] Kevin Bianchi: And in all honesty, it wouldn't make any sense.

[46:09] Ginger Minj: And it's disrespectful to a song like that, that has so much meaning for so many people. And I know like Thorgy Thor was, I think it was Thorgy on one of the review shows. She was like, you should have shoved a bunch of fabric in your dress and pulled it out and made a cape and figured out a way to fly.

[46:24] Kevin Bianchi: First of all, nobody has the time, nobody has the budget.

[46:27] Ginger Minj: Or the luggage space.

[46:29] Kevin Bianchi: But also, it's one of those songs where you just need to be honest and vulnerable for two minutes. That's it.

[46:34] Ginger Minj: And the ones who got it really got it.

[46:36] Kevin Bianchi: And then talk to us about then your decision to record Defying Gravity. I'm assuming like that came after this moment, the push to do that.

[46:44] Ginger Minj: This season was very strange to film because we filmed The Bracket last summer, last July. And then we came back to film the semifinals into the final Lip Sync Smackdown in like March, April of this year.

[46:56] Kevin Bianchi: Oh, interesting.

[46:57] Ginger Minj: But there was a big gap of time. And I mean, it was enough for me to lose 100 and at that point, I think 125, 130 pounds. I've lost 170 at this point, which I am proud to say is the only thing I've lost this year. It was in that time, like in that time off, that my life started to take on a different meaning, a flavor, a different path. And it felt like that was becoming my theme song.

[47:27] Kevin Bianchi: Because especially from the moment that the cast was announced for All Stars 10, immediately people started going, oh, it's rigged. I mean, they hadn't seen frame one of me walking into the workroom, anything. It was favoritism. It's this, da-da-da-da-da. Like they couldn't think of any other reason to hate on me after four seasons and 10 years. So it suddenly became that. Or why is she back? I felt like I was being counted out from the beginning before I had a chance to show anything. And it really, like the more I listened to Defying Gravity, the more it just sunk into my bones. Like, oh, this is my anthem. This is my theme song. This is what's going to get me through this season.

[48:08] Kevin Bianchi: So then I started like singing it live in a couple of shows and it got such a great response that I was like, okay, I think this is the one. This is the one. And we went into the studio and we recorded it. And much like Ariana was saying in one of her interviews where she was like, oh, Stephen Schwartz was thinking that he was going to popify it and make it more of an Ariana version of popular. My music producer was like, yeah, we got to make this a little more either country or a little more rock and roll. Or I said, no, just trust it.

[48:41] Quincy Brown: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[48:42] Ginger Minj: And we did. And it's had such a beautiful response that I'm really, I'm proud of it. I'm really proud to have put that out into the world.

[48:48] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah.

[48:49] Quincy Brown: And I thank you for putting out a male key of Defying Gravity, because as a little boy growing up, I always wanted to sing along to like a male version.

[48:56] Ginger Minj: I've gotten so many messages from people that are like, oh my God, thank you. Finally, a key I can sing it in.

[49:01] Quincy Brown: Yes.

[49:02] Ginger Minj: You're welcome.

[49:03] Kevin Bianchi: Well, it's interesting to hear you. You know, we talk to a lot of Elphabas and they talk about just like the mental weight and struggle of playing the part on Broadway and all of the chatter and the comparisons to other Elphabas. And Drag Race feels like a similar situation.

[49:19] Ginger Minj: Absolutely. This past cycle feels like it might have been like especially difficult mental time for you in those heels.

[49:26] Ginger Minj: On the surface level, it can sound that way. But to be honest, I have never been more sure of who I am as a character, as a performer. And I think that that's why I know that that is why I did consistently well this time, better than I've ever done before.

[49:44] Kevin Bianchi: But I also think that that's why it was so difficult for some people to like buy into that and buy into the fantasy of me doing that well, because they had seen me struggle so much in the past. But this time I came into it going, there's nothing that's going to stop me. Literally, the world is my oyster. I've done really well in this competition. I've done really poorly in this competition. And I know who I am more now than I ever have in my entire life.

[50:10] Quincy Brown: When I turned 40 last year, I'll be 41 in like two weeks. And when I turned 40, literally up until midnight, I was, oh my God, I don't want to do this. I'm going to get so old. I'm going to feel better. Midnight hit. And I went, oh my God, I'm better than I've ever been. Life is better than it's ever been. And it's just going to get better from here. So if you just trust your instincts, close your eyes and leave, you will be so fine. And that's how I took on the competition this time. Every single mini-challenge, challenge, every day, it was just what's next? What's in front of me? How can I do this? And that's how I did as well as I did. And I think if people objectively go back and watch that, they will really see that it was a very different gameplay from a very different Ginger this time.

[51:00] Kevin Bianchi: I think also too, it's like kind of the difference maybe between Drag Queen via theater and Drag Queen via like makeup maybe is like a theater kid, like the mark of a theater kid is the resourcefulness to like figure out how to be good at something we've never heard of.

[51:16] Ginger Minj: In the moment.

[51:17] Kevin Bianchi: In the moment. Like there's just a sort of scrappiness that comes from being a theater kid or a theater queen. And I think that that sort of scrappiness, like you're saying is perfect for a situation where it's like, okay, this week you're going to be flamenco dancing, half as a man, half as a woman. While drinking out of a dog bowl.

[51:34] Ginger Minj: Yeah.

[51:35] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah. Like it's such a hard thing to be consistently good at that it's, it's like, I feel embarrassment for the people who are like, well, it must've been rigged for her to be that good at that many things. God forbid she's actually talented and well-rounded.

[51:51] Ginger Minj: But in the real thing about it is as a live theater person, you know that you have to immediately from the moment you step on stage, you assess what's around you, you read the room, and then you tailor whatever your performance is to whatever is given back to you.

[52:06] Kevin Bianchi: Right.

[52:07] Ginger Minj: And RuPaul gives you the secret to success every single time she walks into the workroom, make me laugh. That's what she says all the time. So if you are paying attention and you're kind of reading the vibes that you're being given by Ru and the judges, you can tailor whatever you're doing in that moment to what is going to make her laugh and what is going to resonate with her.

[52:27] Kevin Bianchi: Right. My favorite tweet throughout the whole season was this person that said, Ginger Minj has committed the cardinal sin of making RuPaul like you in the literal make RuPaul like you competition.

[52:41] Ginger Minj: No, it's true though. It's like this woman has been showing up for 18 years, 5 million seasons a year. She just wants to have a good time while she's working.

[52:49] Quincy Brown: Yes.

[52:50] Kevin Bianchi: If you can hone in on what tickles her little funny bone and do it in a way that's really authentic to who you are as a performer, she appreciates that and she rewards it.

[53:00] Quincy Brown: Okay. At the time of recording, Movie 2 Press Tour hasn't really started in earnest, it feels, which is a little confusing to me because I feel like last year we were all systems go from Super Bowl time.

[53:12] Ginger Minj: Yes, but aren't you just like so amped for it? You're waiting for it.

[53:15] Kevin Bianchi: Yes.

[53:16] Ginger Minj: It's smart.

[53:17] Kevin Bianchi: This is smart.

[53:18] Ginger Minj: This is smart marketing.

[53:19] Kevin Bianchi: What are you most looking forward to though from this Movie 2 era, either in the movie itself or from the press tour?

[53:24] Ginger Minj: Well, first of all, I know that the movie is going to destroy me. I mean, even Act 2, as swiftly as it moves, it never doesn't affect me. It always gets me right in the field.

[53:35] Kevin Bianchi: But just knowing how invested we all are in this relationship between them, I know it's going to devastate me.

[53:41] Ginger Minj: So on some level, I'm not even looking forward to the movie because I'm not looking forward to being that sad.

[53:46] Kevin Bianchi: But I am so invested in the merchandising.

[53:49] Ginger Minj: Yes.

[53:50] Kevin Bianchi: Because it was crazy for Part 1 and it is even more insane for Part 2. We have Gain laundry pod things that are wicked scented.

[53:58] Ginger Minj: The craziest shit we've got.

[54:00] Kevin Bianchi: Suitcases.

[54:01] Ginger Minj: Suitcases.

[54:02] Kevin Bianchi: We've got oil of Olay body wash.

[54:05] Ginger Minj: You've got secret deodorant in a Glinda and an Elphaba scent.

[54:09] Kevin Bianchi: As ridiculous as it is, I'm going to buy it all.

[54:12] Ginger Minj: Yeah.

[54:13] Kevin Bianchi: I have a box under my bed of just the craziest. And especially, too, when people know that you're an Oz fan or a Wicked fan or that you have a Wicked podcast, it's like, oh, I passed this trinket that has Glinda on it and I got it for you. It's like, thank you.

[54:28] Ginger Minj: I needed another Tumblr.

[54:30] Kevin Bianchi: Well, the thing is, I do. I need it.

[54:32] Ginger Minj: I have no limits.

[54:34] Kevin Bianchi: I am unlimited.

[54:36] Ginger Minj: I really need it all. And this $200,000 could not have hit at an opportune time because I'm so used to being broke that I really have to, like, sit and debate on the things that I...

[54:45] Kevin Bianchi: This is a necessity.

[54:46] Ginger Minj: No, that's not. The Voluspa candles, yes, are the best candles I've ever had.

[54:51] Kevin Bianchi: That Glinda pink yuzu.

[54:53] Ginger Minj: Oh my God, pink yuzu. I will buy a Universal Pass when I'm home in Orlando just to go into the park for 20 minutes to go into the Wicked store and buy those candles and restock them.

[55:03] Kevin Bianchi: I've started giving them gifts.

[55:05] Ginger Minj: Voluspa, please give me a sponsorship. I have put your entire family through school with those damn candles.

[55:11] Kevin Bianchi: The Drag Race prize money is your Wicked fund for part two.

[55:14] Ginger Minj: I haven't spent any of it yet because I know that it's all coming.

[55:17] Kevin Bianchi: Right.

[55:18] Ginger Minj: They're going to release the Wicked part two Lexus.

[55:21] Kevin Bianchi: Yeah.

[55:22] Ginger Minj: All the other girls are like, well, I invested in real estate and I bought a new car and look at my drag. Isn't it just tip top beautiful? Meanwhile, I'm over here rubbing Glinda pink on my armpit.

[55:30] Kevin Bianchi: But I'm gonna do it.

[55:31] Ginger Minj: But to the earlier point, I also feel like Act Two has the most room to expand and build upon. So I'm excited to see what they do in the movie. I'm hoping Ethan gets a little more screen time in movie two than he did in movie one.

[55:43] Kevin Bianchi: Well, I mean, he's going to because they gave him a Funko Pop.

[55:46] Ginger Minj: Back to the merch.

[55:47] Kevin Bianchi: That's an investment.

[55:48] Ginger Minj: That's an investment. The merch, right? Yes. So, I mean, I feel like he's definitely going to. What I'm most excited about is being like a Dorothy Gale fan and always being so