This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Josh: Hey Queens and welcome back to The Queendom Podcast. This week we are kicking off a couple of industry episodes over the next month or so. This week we are sitting down with Rosie Pearson from Pearson Casting. We chat about everything they look for in the room and just some industry knowledge throughout. So this is gonna be a really good one for anyone in the industry or anyone looking to get into the industry. Definitely stick around right to the end. This is gonna be a great one. Make sure you guys are checking out TheatreFans TV, that's TheatreFans TV on Instagram. But other than that, let's get down. I'm the Queen of the Castle. Get down your dirty Ross!

[0:50] Josh: Hey Queens and welcome back to The Queendom Podcast. I nearly forgot the name of the show. There we go. We're off to a cracking start, and this week we are talking all things casting with the wonderful Rosie Pearson. Hey Rosie, how are you going?

[1:03] Rosie Pearson: Hi, how are you doing?

[1:04] Josh: I'm good. I'm good. Right. I'm like really fired up for this one, guys. And if you guys don't know James Rosie, Pearson Casting, they are the guys that essentially find all the wonderful queens that we get to see on stage. So these are the people we have to thank for pretty much everybody we look up to. And we're gonna divulge into their little world and get all the information out of them throughout this episode, which is great. So Rosie, first of all, what's your favorite show that you've seen?

[1:35] Rosie Pearson: That I've ever seen?

[1:36] Josh: Yeah.

[1:37] Rosie Pearson: Oh gosh. Oh, you're putting me on the spot. Wow. Hard one to start it off with. Ooh. Um, gosh. I mean I just love musicals, and I thought the original cast of Jersey Boys in London was absolutely like I was just blown away. I just cried the whole way. I love Saigon again. I just like cried the whole show. I loved Anne Juliet, which I saw on the press night before that went out to London. I saw it in Manchester, but I don't know if I have a favorite. I don't know if I have something that I would like give up everything to go and see. And obviously I love Six. I saw it before I started working on it, and James and I were like, oh god, we want to cast this show so much. Um, yeah, so obviously I have to say Six is my favorite show.

[2:23] Josh: Um, what's your favorite downtime activity?

[2:27] Rosie Pearson: Um, I'm gonna be really honest with you that we don't really have a lot of downtime. So I was writing this question, I was like, I wonder if there's actually gonna be an answer. Like that actually went through my head. But this is the problem, isn't it? When you like work in the industry and you're really passionate about it, it becomes everything. So you go to the theatre, you watch TV, you watch film. I try and read a lot. I did an English degree and then kind of abandoned reading completely. Like just went, I'm never reading again. I read like 50 books a week. Um, so I love now I love to read for pleasure. Um, and we go on holiday whenever we can.

[3:01] Josh: Yeah.

[3:02] Rosie Pearson: So yeah.

[3:03] Josh: Perfect mix. Um, to wrap things up on the fun end of things, what's your favorite color?

[3:08] Rosie Pearson: Uh, blue.

[3:09] Josh: Blue. That was a decisive answer right there.

[3:11] Rosie Pearson: There you go.

[3:12] Josh: I don't even know. Um, so before we get stuck in, um can you just quickly explain for those people that maybe don't know um what a casting director is, um what your role is and uh how you got involved in the casting side of theatre?

[3:30] Rosie Pearson: Uh, so a casting director works for the producer, so very separate to an agent, and I think there can be a lot of confusion in the industry because you hear the words casting agent, but really it's um a kind of casting director or an agent, a kind of technically the two separate terms. An agent will look after your career, but a casting director works for the producer and they get commissioned. So like a director or a choreographer, a producer will come to you and say, hi, we've got this coming up. We want to find this cast. So they'll say, we need 12 people or six people or however many it is. And will you do it? Will you find those people? So then we go out into the industry, we use industry platforms and people we know and relationships with agents to shortlist, I suppose, a number of people then to bring into the audition room to work with the director, and then we kind of facilitate the whole thing.

So we organise auditions, we get feedback, we try and like nurture and take people on the path down to that final process, but ultimately the final decision comes down to the director and the choreographer. So we have, I guess, a lot of influence, but no power, if that makes sense. So people were like, oh my gosh, this casting director, well, yeah, they can get you in the room, but once you're in the room, it's kind of it's yeah, absolutely. And if the director and producer don't like someone, then there's nothing you can do about that as a casting director, you know.

[4:52] Rosie Pearson: Um, so we got into it by working, uh, we both been performers for a long, long time. James had worked in the West End and I toured a lot. Um, and we worked on cruise ships together for I think six years, and the company we were working for just said, oh, we don't really find much talent in the UK. Um, you know, we're doing open auditions and we were like, let us hold a private call for you. And they said, oh, we've got Legally Blonde the musical coming on to the ships. Uh, can you do that? And we're like, yep, okay, sure. Um, say yes now. Jump in the day and finally.

[5:25] Rosie Pearson: Yeah, literally. Um, so they were amazing. They were just like go run with it, and then we were able to work in their casting office with them throughout the whole year on and off on all different musicals, production shows. Um, and actually, it's Norwegian Cruise Line we started with, who now have Six on currently two of, well, we're on a break at the moment, but currently two ships with them. So that's kind of where we learn, and then it kind of went on to shows on land and TV and commercial casting, and so it kind of grew from there. Kind of blew up.

[5:53] Josh: Um, that's awesome. So, how did you first find out about Six?

[6:00] Rosie Pearson: Oh, actually, it's a really good story. So, we were casting a show that was going on at the Other Palace in London called Myth, um, that was written by this incredible um British young writer, and um none of us really knew each other. We came like recommended by someone else by someone else, and we were on the first day of auditions. Um, and Arlene Phillips was directing this musical, and she walked in on the first day, and obviously we were a little bit nervous, like we didn't know her, hadn't worked with her. She worked with so many amazing people, and she just walked in and she said, oh, before I say hello, everybody has to go and see this. And she held this program up and slammed it down on this desk, and she was like, I want to see this girl, this girl, and this girl.

She was like, it's on at the arts, it's on for like 10 days. You had like if you see anything in the next few days, and we're like, oh, that sounds so interesting. Anyway, we didn't have time to do that. Um, and then we went to Edinburgh in 2018 and it was on there and it was sold out. We're like, oh, we're never gonna get to see this show. And then we contacted Andy and Wendy, who are two of the producers of Six, about just working with them. They have another production company alongside Global Musicals where they develop new work, which is just so exciting. For anyone that isn't aware of that, that's Perfect Pitch, you probably would have heard me mention that a couple of times. Um, I think you dropped it on our episodes as well.

So please go check out them as well. Just amazing. They just develop new work and work with new writers, and that's just right up our street. So we'd written to them saying we really want to work with you. They said, oh, we have a new show coming up, not Six, and so we went to see Six in the arts before we had this meeting with them. So we knew and we came out, and I like I said, we were just like, we have to work on this show. They didn't have a casting team, and then that was just that way of when they needed some more people, they'd so originally the producers had cast the original London Queens, so Natalie Paris and Amy Atkinson and um Mayer and all that, they had found them themselves, but then obviously they needed more alternates, more swings, and then when the cast change came over, it all handed over to us.

So that's yeah. That's a perfect kind of um it's not what you know, it's who you know, kind of which is what this industry is predominantly like. It's it's more who you know than what you know because you need to know people to get you through the door or anything like that.

[8:21] Rosie Pearson: Um, it's always good to, and we'll touch on this later. Um, present yourself the right way online and work on those connections and relationships um outside of work, which is good. Um moving into working on the show. At what point did you guys join Six? Was that formal like that first initial change?

[8:48] Rosie Pearson: No, they needed so at the time Grace was the super swing at the arts, and bless I don't I don't even know. Like I have a really good brain. I was a little bit more. Do you imagine that right now? Like now, and um, like just incredible, and the same with Colette, who is the swing obviously at the arts at the moment and dance captain. Um just to have that brain to jump from like Matinee show your arrogance to then you know, in the evening you're playing Howard, just just uh yeah, just incredible. But obviously there was sickness and you know it's a vocally very demanding show, and they just we we can't have everyone feeling like they can never go off or have time off, and holidays were coming up as well.

So they engaged us to find Vicky Mancer and Courtney Stapleton. Um so they were gonna be between them kind of. I mean, everyone covers all six anyway, but to be the only swing I think is probably incredibly um impressive and pressure. Um so they brought us on just to find those two um queens, and there were other people actually in the finals of that who are now in the show. I don't want to say who it is, but that's the kind that I know you want to talk about the casting process, but that's the kind of show it was where there was the talent at the end of that process, was so incredible, and um yeah, so we found those two, and then we knew that there would be a cast change coming up for 2020, no, 2019, and also um the tour was going out, so then that was kind of a natural progression.

[10:17] Josh: Yeah, awesome. That's amazing. I love that. Um, how did casting this show differ to other shows that you guys had worked on um up until this point?

[10:31] Rosie Pearson: Six is a really tricky show to cast. Um, there are so many elements to it. And so, for example, we just cast um a new revival of Rent, which is going on at the Hope Mill Theatre in Manchester. Um, and you need exceptional vocals, you need amazing actors, you need people that have the right feel for the show. Uh, Luke Shepherd, the director of uh Anne Juliet is directing that, and he was very specific about what he wanted with that, but there's no dance in the show, so that you are you are freer, I think, to work with people that are just exceptional in kind of a couple of areas for that particular show, but is a triple threat show. Obviously, you know, the choreography is Olivier nominated for a reason, and um, so we started in the first in the beginning just kind of singing first, um, and then acting and then dancing at the end, and then we found we were losing just people, you know, the team were falling in love with exceptional people who then just couldn't dance the show, and it's more technical, I think, than probably appears, and that's what makes it so clever is that you are so swept up in the whole 75 minutes of it, you don't realise that these are quite technical dancers.

The style of kind of hip hop, jazz, commercial is it's a very very clever show, but you you have to be able to dance. It's not some, it's not a show for people who are amazing singers but can't act, or amazing sing actors who can't dance, or dancers who can't. It's literally it's the perfect package. Yeah, um, then you have to have an incredible pop vocal. Um, so musical theatre isn't right, and a rock vocal's not right, so you need to have a very contemporary, you know, all the queens are based on um, you know, very contemporary um pop stars, pop queens, um, and so that that have to have that right vocal and a good musicality as well. There's so many harmonies in the show, and then you know great acting there's so much acting in the show I know people say oh it's more of a sometimes you know it feels more of a concert but there's so much sharp wit that needs you know amazing comic timing and delivery but also some real moments of pathos and strength so you need women that really know themselves you need um actors who are literally the whole bundle and then are stars on top of that so it's so now we dance first um which means a we can see more people which is amazing because obviously there's always limits on how many days we can do for audition um process based on budgets and creative availability I mean there are so many productions of it now we're lucky to have a creative team together in London for like five days um which is amazing um so yeah we dance first and it it can be different it can be tough you know there are people I'm like that she is just so perfect but she can't dance it now and so we say to people listen you've got cut at this point your technique's not strong enough you need to go and do some commercial heels classes and come back in three months and come back in three months and they do and they book the show and so it's a this is something that I've heard about with the girls on from your perspective the girls right always highly praised you guys because if they don't get the call straight away they know why and they can work on that for the next time or they just feel so supported in that moment because you're giving them the feedback there and then so they can show you the best version themselves instead of not giving them a reason why they're getting cut not getting cast or why they're getting cut and um that's been kind of the biggest praise that you guys have been getting on the podcast which I've heard which is fantastic.

[14:11] Rosie Pearson: Good I'm glad that that's translating because you know the audition room can be kind of a busy and stressful place for everybody you know we're under pressure as well um as I said there are limited days producers have paid for studios and day rates for creatives and so it's really important to us that you know we're getting it right but also you know it's not a show that everybody books first time some people it takes like two years of auditioning um just to just to get that element right and then they're absolutely flying so I'm glad people feel supported in the audition it's really important.

[14:11] Josh: That's amazing. Um, what was it like coming into a show with a young creative team as well compared to um other shows you would have worked on because this this is a pretty much nearly all across the board a very young creative team so what was that like having that element in the room?

[15:02] Rosie Pearson: Yeah, amazing. Just, you know, really refreshing. I think Toby and Lucy have really kind of, and the producers as well, but from the off really sort of have driven this feeling about the show that it is literally, there's no preconception about what a queen looks like or what she sounds like. I mean, maybe a little bit in terms of vocal stylings for different queens, but every queen is based on the actor. So it very much came from a place of like, let's just find the right talent. Let's have representational casting. You need this to be representational of ethnicity, of body type, of, I mean, everything. You can look at the cast, there's no arrogance that looks the same across Broadway, West End, the ships, Australia, like it's all completely, completely different.

[15:52] Rosie Pearson: And so they very much came with this idea that, you know, that we had, there was a freedom creatively to just find the best people. And that's not, you don't always get that, especially with kind of more established shows. But you know, as the process has gone on and we have more and more casts, they're just very passionate. There's, you know, no one's particularly jaded yet, which is nice. And they are very energized and just incredibly passionate about the show and about finding the right talent. And so it's amazing to work with a really young team who have really fresh ideas and are very focused on, as I say, just keeping everything incredibly flexible. And I love the representational element of this show, which everyone is so behind.

[16:39] Josh: Yeah, 100%. I love it. And what's it been like kind of coming in, finding pieces to fit, so like the swings and then getting to do the tour cast and beyond? Like, what's it been like finding pieces and then kind of seeing a whole cast come together from day one on?

[16:57] Rosie Pearson: Uh, yeah, so finding, I mean, the swings are the hardest to find. They're just, they're like gold dust. Like, we're just never let them go, never let them do anything else. No, um, because, you know, they have to have such exceptional qualities that all these queens have, but be able to move between them convincingly, have the brain to learn it and execute it. Um, so that was, you know, it's always challenging when we just have to find like a swing or two swings. Um, but yeah, it's amazing just kind of, you know, seeing it all come together and it's, it's um, it's very interesting seeing like on the final day in the auditions, you see that lineup and it just suddenly makes sense and it all kind of slots into place.

Um, but also really exciting now. We've got queens who are starting to come off the ships because the contracts there are only six months, and then kind of going, oh, you know, um, we've got contracts, you know, there are UK contracts coming up next year, and being able to kind of work with people kind of in a longer term and look at them for future contracts is really exciting and kind of, oh, where would that person fit? But it is a real jigsaw, six massively.

[18:03] Josh: Amazing. Um, so I just want to delve into the kind of recasting portion for a second. Um, because how do you work with everybody to, for example? Um, Sophie going into um London and all of that. How do you find not only the perfect person to sit in the role, but the perfect personality to slot in with everybody else that's already there? Because it wouldn't be as easy to find that person that fits in all of those elements, like the on-stage element and the off-stage element, as well as kind of everything else.

[18:45] Rosie Pearson: Uh, yeah, it's a really good question. Um, I guess when we know there's one gap like there was for Sophie, you have a very clear idea of that, you know, you know the queen that they're coming in for. So you start with people who've worked perhaps in, so Sophie, for example, had done Heather's. Um, we knew her vocal style and also her work ethic really well. Um, and she'd worked, um, we knew people who'd worked with her. We haven't cast her in anything at that point. Um, so it became kind of a, um, it becomes a little bit more specific of a head hunt that you kind of go rather than just like, I would never kind of just put out on Facebook, hey guys, we're looking for this, you know. You know, we don't, we won't have time.

We do do open calls, which um, I know we can talk about differ separately, but um, for this one it's very specific. We knew the time frame was very difficult because it was over Christmas, so a lot of people were gonna be working other shows. We need someone who could balance that out. And again, like you say, like a personality who was gonna come in and fit in and just add to the amazing atmosphere in the arts and someone that was a positivity. Um, so the, you know, we saw a few people for that, um, and some, you know, were just incredible and amazing, but you know, Sophie just ticked all those boxes at the time. And there's also a little bit more time, I guess, when you're only looking for one role to spend time with.

Jamie, who is the director, original director along with Lucy, he was able to spend time and work with her in the room. So you get a much, it's much calmer sense of what someone's like, you know, than when you're kind of doing two casts at the same time. Um, so yeah, it's a little bit more of a kind of, like I say, a head hunt of having in mind, okay, who else is in this lineup, who's gonna fit in, who has the right, yeah, work ethic and um, as well as being just right for the role.

[20:39] Josh: Yeah, amazing. And um, with the message of the show, the like the strong female lead empowerment side of things, what's it like from your side of the table sitting there through auditions and seeing all the wonderful, amazing talent that's out there in the world come into one room and not only give it their role but support each other and just create that vibe in that room?

[21:01] Rosie Pearson: It's mind-blowing, honestly, and like I said earlier, it's really heartbreaking when you lose someone because their dance isn't just quite strong enough or vocally, they're just, they're amazing and they're an amazing raw talent, but they're not gonna sustain eight shows a week. Um, you know, which is tough, it's not an easy show. Um, but it's just incredible. And to see people grow through the audition process is amazing as well. And you see them kind of on day one, you just see that spark, and you know, that one of the directors or the associates say, I just want to bring, I just want to bring her back. I know it's a wild card, and then by like audition three, they're like owning the room and making their own choices, and it's amazing.

And I think it's that thing we were talking about a minute ago about that fat amazing flexibility to go, there's no cookie cutter for this. So let's work with people and let's let them find themselves because as you say, it's a show about empowerment. So you need people who know themselves and who are super comfortable in their own skin, and sometimes that just takes a bit of time in a rehearsal process, particularly, uh, sorry, an audition process and a rehearsal process. Particularly if they haven't done leading roles before or been in a show that's it's quite exposing. Um, a lot of shows, um, you know, the leads aren't on for the entire show, um, but there's nowhere to hide. There's no downtime, there's no, you know, it you are on stage the whole time, and you have to own that space, but also be able to gel with five other women on stage, it's not just your show.

So um, yeah, it's amazing, it's an amazing process. I love, I literally love it, and I think from, I want to say from like March 2019 up until the pandemic, I feel like I was in the casting room for six every month, every single month. So, yeah, but I love it, I love it. It's great.

[22:46] Josh: Also, from your perspective, like um auditioning, obviously, if you guys are casting other shows, um, are you always actively looking? If you've got say three shows on the go, are you always actively looking no matter what show you're in auditions for? You kind of not this show, but your kind of suit potentially this show.

[23:07] Rosie Pearson: Yes, always. Always play it. So like, yeah, that's that is literally my job is to remember is to remember people and to always be having in mind whether you go and see a fringe piece of fringe theatre that's like, uh, obscure off the tracks somewhere in the north of England, or whether you're in the West End, or whether you're in an audition, and particularly with a show like Six, you know, at the moment, um, until COVID happened, we were looking after six casts a year. So you always have in the back of your mind, like you're always looking out for that person that you want to kind of bring into the room, but it works vice versa. You know, there are people who we've had in for Six and aren't quite right for the show, and you kind of go, Oh, we've got Rent coming up, or we've got this maybe coming up at the end of the year, they'd be a really good fit.

So it's always that, and that's what we say to actors like it's really difficult to get cut from auditions, it's really difficult to hear no, and we've been there, you know. Um, rejection is really hard, but if you did, if you came in and did your best and you were prepared and you sang and acted well, that casting director will remember you and they'll bring you in for something else. So don't take that as a negative overall, because our brains are always turning. I'm watching Rosie's eyes right now kind of be like play through everything in your head. It's great.

[24:25] Josh: What is your favorite part of the entire casting process?

[24:29] Rosie Pearson: Oh my gosh. Um, the final day is really exciting but also nerve-wracking because you've been on this journey with all of these incredible women, and you suddenly see them kind of, we do, I suppose, like a kind of workshop scenario in the final day. So we might have, let's say we're looking for one cast, so we need six queens and two alternates for a ship. Um, we might have 20 to 25 in the room, and they come in and out of different roles in the script, and then they get up and they sing and they do um, you know, their a section of their song from the show, and you just suddenly see like what these women will be like on stage, and you start matching up, and you go, Well, if she were arrogant, then this would be our Berlin, and then how does Seymour fit into this?

And then suddenly you look and you go, Oh my gosh, this is gonna be such an exciting cast. Like the sound is amazing, the energy is so exciting, and yeah, it's yeah, the last day is amazing. The whole process just final pace of the jigsaw puzzle in and saying, Yeah, yeah, but it is nerve-wracking because you just think, oh gosh, if there's one person that doesn't quite fit into this lineup, then we have to look again, or we have to kind of review who, you know. So it's yeah, it's really nerve-wracking. But yeah, the whole, the whole process is just really, it's just joyous, and that's the creative team make it like that. The show is just I never get sick of hearing it, honestly.

[25:54] Josh: Yeah, it's a very special show. Very so, what's it like for you then to have been through that process with everybody? Um, to at some point potentially get to see them after seeing them roar all the way through, seeing them actually on stage performing the show?

[26:15] Rosie Pearson: Uh yeah, just yeah. I've had tears. I have, I've cried. I've been at the back of the arts, and I've been like, oh, um, because um, then it's another step, you know, that amazing rehearsal process where they then they find their character and they suddenly start to grow all these new elements and find different things in the character or in the, you know, the text is so clever, and every time I go I hear something else that I didn't hear the first seven times. Um, and so that's just, and then obviously they have the costume and in situ, and it's yeah, it's incredible, and suddenly they're suddenly they're queens, it's amazing.

[26:54] Josh: Amazing. Um, just to wrap things up on the Six specific stuff. Um, what is your favorite part of the show?

[27:01] Rosie Pearson: Oh, uh gosh, oh god, that's really hard. I didn't think about this. Um, the ending is pretty amazing. The end, I love, I love the end of the show. It's just so empowering, and everyone, the whole audience are just behind it from the beginning, which means that you enjoy the whole show with the people you're sitting with as well, which is so brilliant. Um, yeah, I'm not gonna pick one. I refuse. I refuse to pick a moment.

[27:30] Josh: I just thought of one more question, um, specifically related to Six. Coming into the show at the point you did, um, looking for Vicky and Courtney and then seeing it expand to Broadway, Australia, cruises. What's that been like to know that you were pretty much in the show from the ground roots and you get to see it kind of expand?

[27:53] Rosie Pearson: Uh, we've never worked on a show at this level before, you know. We've been casting for a long time, but you know, um, I think when we came on board, we knew it was something really big and really special, and there were already whispers of Broadway, and obviously with our connection with Norwegian, we knew that was kind of in the pot, I suppose, from about three or four months in, but just the scale of the fandom, I think is quite extraordinary. Um, and you know, to put it on Broadway is something extraordinary. Um, yeah, it's been amazing to be a part of it. Um, we're a very small part of it. Um, yeah.

[28:41] Rosie Pearson: Yes, no, I get, yeah, the casting is really, really important. But you know, what it's a very strange process, casting, because you're so involved from the office, so about, you know, sitting with the director and what are we looking for and this, and then you know, weeks, I mean, literally three weeks before auditions is us going through submissions and booking in people, and then the audition process is really intense, and then there's offers, and then we let people know that they didn't get it. Um, and then suddenly it's gone. Suddenly that casting just ends, and then suddenly we turn up like two months later to a press night and everyone's like, Oh yeah, no, our team are amazing and they're really appreciative, but it's a weird disconnect that we suddenly let these people go and then they go into the rehearsal grade and suddenly, you know, it becomes something else without us.

So it can be a strange process, but it's uh, it's an amazing show to be part of. And our team are incredibly appreciative of what we do. It's just you, you could, you kind of, you want to be a little bit humble, you know. The show is a lot bigger than the individuals involved in it.

[29:39] Josh: Yeah, of course. I love that. Um, I just want to delve into some industry stuff just because we've got a lot of uh young performers kind of listening. Um, just for that kind of introduction, or even the performers out there that are listening that may just need a top-up.

[29:54] Rosie Pearson: Um, advice for looking for booking auditions, um, pros and cons of having an agent and booking auditions. So, as casting directors at Pearson Casting, we don't need you to have an agent. It varies a lot through the industry and on the casting director and on the production and the team and everything. So we very much go and look for everything. So we'll put out to agents, we'll put out on our social media on our website, because we find a huge amount of talent that isn't represented for some reason. You didn't have a great showcase, you didn't get picked up, didn't work out with the agent that you signed with. That's okay. It's a very personal thing, it doesn't work for everybody. Um, and there's just lots of people who maybe took some time out of the industry or went away and did ships and didn't feel they needed whatever it is.

Um, so we're very, very open to finding talent that's unrepresented. However, it can be trickier to be seen for certain shows if you don't have an agent. I think if you don't have an agent, you have to be incredibly proactive. Um, and with the technological advancements that we have now, I certainly didn't have when I was an actor. You can record vocals onto your iPhone, you can get someone to film you doing a monologue, you can dance in your back garden and film it. So the more footage, the more of yourself, good quality um content. It doesn't have to be great like professional quality footage, but the content has to be really great. The more that you can put together, the more likely you are to work.

If you just send a letter out to somebody saying, Hey, my name's Rosie, and I have no representation and I want to be seen for I don't know, a West End show, the likelihood is very small that you're going to get called in for that. You have to be able to showcase what it is that you have because casting directors deal in huge, huge volumes. Um, I think the rent auditions, we had four and a half thousand submissions for, and on Six on average, let's say on a ship, we have about eight to nine hundred um people put forward. So to get that down to like 120, we have to be able to see something of you or trust that relationship with the agent or know you. Um, so it can be tough knocking on doors, but you just have to present yourself the best you can and make sure you have up-to-date footage of yourself that really showcases yourself in that style.

Um, you know, if you're with an agent, um, you know, make sure that you've been really clear with them about what it is that you want from your career so that they can work well for you. There's no point kind of saying, Yeah, I'll do everything, and then they say, Great, we've got your audition for Six on Luigi and Bliss. You go, Oh, I don't want to do ships. Do you know what I mean? Like, if you're working with an agent, make sure that that relationship, there's loads of great open communication that you're both happy with that relationship. Does that answer your question?

[32:46] Josh: Yeah, 100%. Spot on the nail.

[32:50] Rosie Pearson: Okay. Um, going on to the kind of representing yourself online through social media, how um important is it for young performers just to kind of get stuff up and have a kind of good social media presence, not so much a following, but a presence that goes your kind of um who you are. Um, I'm glad you said that about followers because I think there's a lot of um confusion at the moment about oh, I need to have this number of followers. I think if you're going on to like Love Island, yes, they want you to have a certain number of followers, and it might be that they're I mean, I have heard stories about people being asked in auditions about that, but honestly, that's never that's never come across from a producer to us, and I'm not sure I would ever work on a project that you needed followers for.

But a presence is really really important. Um, and we've been saying this a lot, we've been doing some industry surgery since lockdown happened, and we've just said, you know, you have to make a decision. What is your social media for? If it's for you and it's just selfies and holiday shots and your dinner, amazing, like great. But if you want to make it industry, there are casting directors online, particularly on Instagram, looking just for talent that's not obvious, you know, that's not necessarily on a casting specific casting platform or doesn't have an agent or you know, hasn't been to drama school or whatever it is, and particularly since everyone's now working from home, um, auditions are few and far between.

We're not in workshops, we're not in castings at the moment. So there are a lot of casting directors looking in online. So if you can have great footage of whatever it is that you do on your Instagram, someone might come across it. However, bear in mind that um whatever you put on Instagram or Twitter or Facebook represents you as a business. So once you are out there as an actor and you're using your name and you put that online, that represents you. So if you post really drunken pictures and um talk badly about people that you've worked with, it doesn't matter if it's true or not, like keep it off social media because we read that, and sometimes I will look people up on socials. You know, particularly for shows like Six where we need amazing uh team players and team members and touring and ships that were hard, West End is hard.

And so um if you're posting negative things about oh, this production company I work with and really drunk and hung over again today, that doesn't that doesn't project a professional image, and it's really hard because we live our lives publicly now online, yeah. Um but everything that you post reflects you, so keep it as neutral as possible. If you want, you can have Instagram private, you can lock that off and just have that for you and friends and do whatever you want on there, but anything you have publicly, just be aware that we can read it. And I've been saying to you, Well, are you happy for Pippa Alien to sit down and read this? And you're like, oh my god, no, oh my god, no. I'm like, well, take it off because you know, this represents you.

So I think it can be used really positively. I think that's one more thing. I want to say is if you are somebody for whom social media is stressful, um, and it affects your mental health negatively to be on left, and that's the case for a lot of people. You know, I use social media every day, all day for my businesses, but I need to step away from it at night and sure you're exactly the same. Um, I sometimes it can be a negative place. Sometimes, you know, we put things out there that don't get the likes and don't get the responses, and then that makes us feel bad, or um, we read you know, continuously negative conversations, especially at the moment, there's a lot of negativity out on you know, social media people are feeling down or lost.

If that's something for you that you find negative, don't now open it up and be like, I have to put me playing guitar on Instagram. You don't at all, you absolutely don't have to do any of that. Um, but if you do do it, make sure it's looks great and sounds great and is really positive and kind of represents you in a positive light. That's it.

[37:01] Josh: Yeah, definitely quality over quantity. Um you don't want to be putting anything up that's um negatively gonna affect you as a brand, essentially. Um amazing. I love that. That was such a good deep dive. I love that. Um do you have any other advice that we haven't touched on so far? Is there anything that sticks out that we haven't mentioned?

[37:26] Rosie Pearson: Um, letter writing. Um, so uh check first. Check first on the casting director's website or the casting team you might be writing to. I don't know, uh, you know, a um theme park or a um cruise line, check how they want to be contacted. Not everyone wants to be emailed, so if you do that might upset them. If they are happy to be emailed, make sure you write it. Um, I'd start a little bit formally. So I would start with dear, um, and then you know, find out who you're writing to. Dear Pearson Casting is fine, but dear Rosie and James just really kind of lands that. Oh, I know who I'm writing to, I've done my research. Don't have it too long. Um, don't just write hire, I really want to be seen for this show.

Um, Emily Kiss. Like that's I know you're laughing, I know, but I've I literally I can see you reading the email and being like you know, you wouldn't you wouldn't write to I don't know, a bank manager. Well, you might do, I don't know. But uh just remember that you know people are really, really busy. So the more personal you can be, keep it nice and brief. Um, again, include if you have YouTube footage, like just keep it as professional as possible. Let that person come back and go, hi Emily, yeah, no worries, great to see you know what I mean, like keep it nice and formal. And if you're writing off to 27 production companies, don't write them all in the two box. BCCs are a thing for a reason, folks.

Yeah, I don't want to know that you're writing to Belinda King, Universal Studios, uh Princess Cruises, and I was like, hiya. Um, yeah, just keep it, you know, remember that people are very busy and we want to feel that you've made a little bit of an investment in the show. Like talk about what it is you want to be seen for and what your key skills are, and yeah, that's kind of yeah, write good letters, people, it makes the world a different.

[39:27] Josh: There we go. Um final bit of advice I'm gonna ask you for some advice on um people that want to be in your shoes and want to potentially get into casting shows. Hi. Um what steps do you you suggest for those people that might want to go into the other realm of theatre and not be on stage, but help create and make shows?

[39:53] Rosie Pearson: Yeah, that's a really good question. Um we had a slightly unorthodox way into casting just because we happened to be, it was very much the right place at the right time. As you were telling your story, I was like, that's just like dead set, as lucky as it gets. I mean, to be fair, we had also worked a little bit creatively with them as well. So like we'd written a show that we'd sold and you know, we'd we'd built a really great relationship where we'd done like replacement contracts and helped out, and it it was just one of those transitions where we knew we wanted to move into something a little more creative, but we got very, very lucky and worked very hard. I think there are loads of opportunities um in creative areas, and the more experience that you can get, the better.

So it might be that you write to lots of different casting directors and say, Hi, I'm prepared to work for a week or two weeks on very kind of low pay effectively. You should always be paid for inter work, by the way, um, something by law, I think, in the UK. But um just kind of write to them and say, Look, do you have anything for a couple of weeks and get that get little bits of experience and find out what areas you like? Uh often, for example, in casting, um, we need runners for the audition room. Someone just to literally stand outside and tick off names and go and grab coffee, and that can be a really good insight into the other side of the audition process. Obviously, auditions like this much of an enormous, you know, um, an enormous pool uh that is a casting which is a lot of admin, but I think the more experience you can get anywhere, the better.

If you want to be a casting director, they often suggest you do a bit of work in an agency so you can see that side of it as well as agents do. Um, but just try out loads of different things, try and assist people, even just for a few weeks, um, even if it is unpaid, whatever, um, if you can afford to do that, that will just help build contacts. And you know, if you do a good job, people will call you back to do more and offer you paid work if they have it. So that's really my my my biggest piece of advice. You know, just keep get on the phone and call up. Same if you want to work in TV and film, go and be a runner, go and be an intern, just work in that environment and do a good job, and people will remember you.

[42:06] Josh: I love that. I think that's a perfect note to kind of wrap things up on. But before we do, you guys at Pearson Casting, uh, you and James are running some free programs at the moment. Is that correct?

[42:15] Rosie Pearson: Yes. So yeah, I'll talk about very quickly, but um, we recently launched a platform for performers. We've won some government funding. Um, and we have 30 hours a week. I know, yay, of um, live stream uh uh development support and connectivity for the industry. It's available live on YouTube 30 hours a week, and it is workshops, masterclasses, QA's with casting directors, agents, producers, um, tax advice if you're in Britain, it's specifically um British tax advice, um, wellness, yoga classes. We've got some incredible directors doing workshops. We have loads of the Six team coming in and doing Carrie Ann teaches commercial dance classes for us and Melody. Um, we've got Franny and Grace who are the associate directors doing audition prep workshops.

There's um just incredible array of different practitioners, and this is running till the end of November. There's no subscription, there's no sign up, there's no fees at all. It's 100% free to access uh until the end of November. So check it out. And the website is collectivecreativeinitiative.co.uk. So spread the word because we want more people.

[43:25] Josh: You will find that link down below for anyone that's interested. Please go click on it. Please go follow um Rosie's on Twitter. You'll find James on Instagram, you'll find James on Twitter as well, you'll find Pearson Casting on both. So make sure you go check them out. Um, just even if it's for the links or just to see how they promote the industry. It's really good insight, guys. Like I live in Australia, and it's a really good insight into how the UK system works and how things differ. So please go check it out, spend some time scrolling through, reading, check out their website, go through, read. Um, biggest thing is information overload. Um, and I hope you guys have very much enjoyed this episode because I have very much enjoyed chatting to Rosie. Thank you for coming and hanging out with us.

[44:09] Rosie Pearson: What time is it there right now, by the way?

[44:15] Josh: It is quarter to nine.

[44:17] Rosie Pearson: Um in at night.

[44:19] Josh: At night, yes.

[44:20] Rosie Pearson: Oh, okay. It's great time.

[44:23] Josh: Um but guys, we are gonna wrap it up there. Thank you so much for coming in and hanging out, and we will be next back next week with a brand new episode of the Queendom Podcast.