This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:15] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of the cat's atrophy. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have a bonus episode. I have promised to bring you every angle of Cats that I could possibly find. And this is a fun one. A few weeks ago, our guest partner, Spencer, went very viral for posting a video that said, "Can't sleep thinking about how my husband did Katz The Musical at his Jewish summer camp, and they renamed it Katz, K-A-T-Z." I'm excited because I want to know more. So welcome Eitan Levine, who played Macavity at Camp Kaleidoscope in Newton, Massachusetts. And thank you for joining me.

[0:52] Eitan Levine: Thanks so much for having me. I'm laughing that I'm even here, but I'm so excited.

[0:57] Mike Abrams: That's what I'm here for, to bring you parts of anything I can find about Cats. And when I heard Jewish summer camp, young children doing a show that's a little too risqué for young children to be doing, I had to know more.

[1:14] Eitan Levine: Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm speaking your love language, so here we are. I cannot wait. Let's start with just tell me everything you remember. How did this come to life? I think you said you were seven, eight. Tell me everything you can tell me about this production.

[1:31] Eitan Levine: Yeah. So I'll just paint a little bit of a picture. I grew up in a town right outside of Boston, very Jewishly involved, but very open-minded. And my dad played piano and grew up singing. And so I think I kind of got a little bit of the creative spirit from him. And they always would try to find some type of day camp or sleepaway camp for me to go to during the summer, revolving around something creative. And what better camp than at the JCC, the local JCC, Camp Kaleidoscope? It was kind of your one-stop shop to do anything. You could play sports, you could go to the pool, you could play games. And then they always did a few different shows and dances and whatnot, which obviously I signed up for every single one of those.

And this given year, they did the production of Cats, which at the time, I really don't think I thought about how hilarious it was that the camp director just decided to name it K-A-T-Z, Cats. But my parents obviously got a chuckle out of it. I, of course, took things really seriously. I was very focused on just learning the songs and whatnot. And I think we picked our roles out of a hat, because we were all seven or eight years old. There weren't even auditions. They were kind of just makeshifting it. But I do have a vivid recollection of pulling Macavity out of a hat and everyone going like, "Ooh." Because I think maybe the teacher had explained what the role was. So that's kind of a funny, like, no one knew what Cats was, but yet everyone's oohing and aahing. Because you're the villain. You pulled out the villain.

[3:24] Eitan Levine: Yeah. So that was that. And then with the show itself, I mean, it was an incredibly condensed version of what we all know and love, the musical Cats. It was probably 20 minutes of seven and eight-year-olds singing and dancing select songs in truly Halloween-style costumes and cardboard boxes. And I say that with love. I mean, this camp was putting together this creative outlet for children. But it was really kind of a hilarious spectacle, I'm sure, to look at. And I'm sure there were other, like, what we call Yiddishisms, you know, like splattered throughout the show that I can only imagine all the parents got a good laugh at. But those are kind of just like the core memories. I just like remember the ears and the black t-shirt and, you know, little things like that.

[4:26] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I mean, you clearly didn't do the whole thing, and it had to have been a very simplified choreography. Yes. But was it still kind of the essence of Cats? Or was it very much just like, we're just going to do the overture, some dance, and then a couple songs, and then "Memory," and then head out?

[4:44] Eitan Levine: I think it was more the latter. I truly feel like we were, you know, like bunny hopping. We would like bunny hop, bunny jump over each other. Like, really getting into the essence of a playful cat.

[5:00] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So it wasn't, I mean, it's kind of a dark storyline when you really dig into it. So there's a lot to it. Obviously, didn't do it. How much did, was it just the naming, K-A-T-Z, like the re-spelling? Or was there more lean into that?

[5:15] Eitan Levine: I think there were, I mean, I remember that there was, I, to be honest, can't remember, like, all of the specifics. But I, once you reached out, actually, I spoke to the former director of the camp that, of course, my parents go to the same synagogue as her. And she was delighted to share her own memories. And, you know, she just said that she had a, she was both a cat lover and a cat haver. As she reminded me, no one owns cats. So I was like, great. She was really, like, invested into that.

[5:54] Eitan Levine: She was in.

[5:55] Mike Abrams: She was in. She was fully in. And I think she probably just sprinkled some, you know, little, like, Yiddish, you know, Jewish dialogue into the language. But nothing, nothing huge that comes about. But I will say the Boston community, the Boston Jewish community, definitely has a thing with doing some riffs on some of the, like, just, like, classic Americana musical canon, which I did in some of my other schooling.

[6:32] Mike Abrams: Let's hear them. Let's hear them, if you remember any of them.

[6:35] Eitan Levine: Well, I went to Solomon Schechter Day School, which is, I think, a chain of Jewish day schools across the country. And every eighth grade class did a full musical. Everyone was, like, it was a huge deal. And the musical was always fully in Hebrew. So my year, they did the production of Oliver. I played the titular role of Oliver. And I, at the young age, made the choicest decision to say the line, what's the line? "Please, sir, can I have some more?" Which I think is, like, such a definitive classic line for the musical. I said it in a Hebrew-British accent. So every time that we did the show, it always got a laugh, because most of the people don't know Hebrew to that extent that they could understand. But they knew that line. And the fact that I punctuated it with the British RP dialect was, I think, helpful. What else? I mean, they did Hello Dolly, but they called it Shalom Dolly. Just funny, funny riffs.

[7:55] Mike Abrams: Little tweaks. Nothing major. It's still the show.

[7:58] Eitan Levine: Yeah, it's still the show. Yeah.

[8:00] Mike Abrams: Okay. For Cats, did somebody belt "Memory"? Was that part of it? Or was it more, like, choir style, where everyone's singing together?

[8:09] Eitan Levine: I think it was more choir style. Like, let's hold hands and be a community and share songs and whatnot. I mean, but could you imagine if, like, a little six-year-old belted "Memory"? Like, they can barely remember the previous day.

[8:22] Mike Abrams: For sure. I mean, there's not a lot of grasping at their troubled life to go through. So there was no jellicle choice, either. Nobody went up in attire. It was purely get in costume and dance.

[8:40] Eitan Levine: It was purely play. It was purely play. I mean, you and I were talking earlier, like, it is hard to wrap your head around the storyline of Cats.

[8:51] Mike Abrams: It's a very—

[8:52] Eitan Levine: Very much.

[8:52] Mike Abrams: Yeah. You're there for the music. You're there for the dance. You're there for the spectacle. I think, obviously, this production of Cats, K-A-T-Z, brought the playfulness of the feline spirit. But yeah, it really did not tell the story of what exists of Cats.

[9:15] Eitan Levine: It'd be hard. Because one of my favorite things to talk to people about who did it on tour or on Broadway is what they're told about their characters. Because characters are pretty loose to begin with. There's obviously a personality and some known facts, but there's also a lot of debates. And so part of me is thinking about your poor director trying to be like, okay, let me explain Macavity's history to you and trying to get you in character. But it's probably more of just you be on this X on the ground so you don't kick this person.

[9:47] Eitan Levine: Yeah. Please try to say a line at this given point in time. That's what their focus is. Step to the left and step to the right.

[9:56] Mike Abrams: So now looking back, how do you think you played Macavity?

[10:01] Eitan Levine: I mean, I think I took it. I think I took it very seriously, even though it was in this play construct. I remember practicing whatever lines that I had and the music and the choreography. And I'm sure most of the other kids were just like, we're at Camp Kaleidoscope. Don't take this that seriously. But I think I was a very, I don't know, serious. That's the word that comes to mind.

[10:34] Mike Abrams: I want to go a little bit into it going viral. So what was that experience like for the two of you?

[10:40] Eitan Levine: Yeah. So it's funny. So my husband, Spencer, he owns his own consulting and coaching business for actors and writes some actor thought leadership, if you will, on Broadway.com. And he also has this online presence on social media and whatnot and whole come up with funny things here and there. Sometimes I roll my eyes, sometimes I chuckle. And so with this one, we were visiting my parents for the high holidays. And I think he just thought it was so hilarious that, of course, at the JCC in Newton, Massachusetts, when I was seven years old, I did this production of Cats, spelled K-A-T-Z. He couldn't get enough of it. Like you, wanted to know more about the production and what was happening and how the decisions were made.

And because he's all in the theater world and is starting to analyze this as if it was a real production. But anyway, then I guess later that night, I wasn't even with him. He made this video. And the next day, I saw it. I was laughing. We saw that it was getting some pickup. And then all of a sudden, different people were reposting, people he didn't even know, bigger influencers that he didn't even know, theater platforms that he didn't know. And, you know, there have been a couple of things that he's done that have sparked a lot of interest. But this one definitely, I think, went pretty far and wide. I mean, it would be a week later and we would see like, oh, Monica Lewinsky has not only viewed this and liked it, but commented and tagged her friend in it.

And like, Kristen Bell liked it, who's now, you know, getting a lot of press for the show that she's doing with a lot of, you know, Jewish themes. So it was just like, really funny to see. And this would be like weeks after it was posted to see, you know, the traction that would happen and the different milestones of who would see when and whatnot. So that was really funny. And then to, I mean, I never thought that coming out of this post, I would get press.

[13:05] Eitan Levine: You would be the interviewer.

[13:07] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I would be the one to get press. So I was like, okay, I'll do it. Why not?

[13:11] Eitan Levine: Yeah. So, I mean, I'm uniquely in both buckets here. And so, I got it sent to me. I should go back and count the amount of times because every Jewish person, all my Jewish friends sent it to me. And everybody that knows that I do the cat stuff sent it to me.

[13:26] Mike Abrams: Really?

[13:26] Eitan Levine: So it's like, this is like, specifically targeted to you. And so, when I saw it, I was like, I have to, I want to know more. And I, again, have the, I think, the only platform that is serviced to be able to speak about this properly. And so, I asked, I was so grateful that you agreed to come on because it's so fun to capture these, like, Cats have such a long and deep history. And it's constantly happening. Like, there's, you know, drag versions of Cats happening. There's a junior, like, where I'm from, they did a junior production for, like, two days this year, where it sounds more like your camp. It's, you know, there's an actual model that they follow, that's like, from the Real Useful group. And so, I just hear all these different stories. And it's so fun to kind of look back on, like, oh, there's, like, that's a...

[14:14] Mike Abrams: That's a very specific, strange, small one that got to happen. And then it got a ton of press because it went viral, which is a cool part of, I think, our current society is, with the way the algorithms work on all these things, it can get picked up. The most random things that you don't expect, all of a sudden, ends up with you and I talking about the Camp Kaleidoscope on a podcast specifically devoted to Cats. Shout out to Camp Kaleidoscope. So, is your feed just full of Katz The Musical? So, my podcast feed is all theater and all Cats. My personal feed is all stuff for me and sports and Indiana and my friends and stuff. But so, that was where it really hit home is that I got it sent to the podcast a ton.

But that happens with lots of Cats. But to get it sent to my personal account from a bunch of other people that are also like, look at this, is not as common. Because my lives do live fairly independently of each other in those spaces. A lot of people I work with don't know I do this. It's not hidden. It's just not the first thing I lead with in my daily life. And so, it was fun to have all that. And then I was like, oh man, this opens up a whole different world to all the different versions you could do. Because there is a 90-minute version that's happening professionally on Royal Caribbean Cruise. There's the junior version that happens around the country. But to hear this very tweaked, very localized, very specific. When was this, too? It was what year?

[15:51] Eitan Levine: I know. Well, first, I need to ask about the Cats Jr. thing because I am curious what that production is like. And second, you're now making me nervous that the Cats theater gods production are going to come down a kaleidoscope and be like, where are you? Of course not. That's funny. Okay, you asked what year this was. I have to do some quick math. It was probably around 2000. 1999, 2000, 2001, around that time. Yeah. So, the 1998 movie is still fresh.

[16:31] Mike Abrams: Oh, yeah. I remember watching the 1998 movie. I remember knowing what Cats was. I don't think I had seen a production yet, but I did see one maybe a couple years after the tour.

[16:51] Eitan Levine: The fifth tour started in early 2001, which is the fact that I know this is also like, we're here.

[16:59] Mike Abrams: I'm very impressed, Mike. I'm very impressed that you didn't really know everything and here you are.

[17:04] Eitan Levine: I knew nothing. And I'm like, yeah, it started in 2001. They did their first couple performances in Atlantic City, because I've talked to a lot of that cast.

[17:13] Mike Abrams: Yeah, yeah. No, I think I saw that production that came to the Boston Opera House, iconic venue. And then I also saw a production at the Muny in St. Louis.

[17:24] Eitan Levine: Okay. So, that was gonna be my next question is, how many times have you seen it?

[17:28] Mike Abrams: So, those two, and then I know you mentioned the most recent Cats of Jocobol.

[17:33] Eitan Levine: Yeah. So, I saw the movie, the original movie.

[17:38] Mike Abrams: Did you watch the movie to prep for your role? Or was it just now?

[17:41] Eitan Levine: No. Can you imagine? That would be not serious. That would be psychotic. I just know that I knew what Cats was, and I think it had to have been through the movie. And I was also watching any Disney movie that had music, The Sound of Music, Mary Poppins. I was in it. So, that was number one, the tour. I saw it at the Muny, because for a summer, I randomly was a Muny teen. I wanted to see one of the productions before I performed. And then, yeah, I think since then.

[18:19] Mike Abrams: Nothing since.

[18:20] Eitan Levine: Nothing since then. And then I saw it at Off-Broadway this past year, and it really just blew my mind. And I was so enthralled and impressed. And I mean, I'm not in the theater anymore, but I'm obviously a lover of it. And it was, I mean, everything and more. I think you get nervous going to shows when people hype it up so much. But it really delivered. And the audience, the energy, the actors, the dancing, the acting, the storytelling, I was really there for it.

[19:01] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I was the second performance.

[19:01] Eitan Levine: Wow.

[19:01] Mike Abrams: And so, the preview. And I was there with the same kind of like, ooh, it was before the hype. I knew there was hype. A lot of people were talking about how great this is, what they'd seen was going to be. But there had only been a performance at that point. And so, I was really excited to be able to be early on. And then, going in knowing all about Cats and just the basics of ballroom, just what I've seen through Paris is Burning and some of the more mainstream culture parts of it, I couldn't get over how I was floored by it. And then, I was so glad that it got the hype and sustained the hype. And I love that what we said earlier, I know we were talking earlier, that it did a better job with the storytelling.

It kind of cleared up some of this ambiguity that was there. And it turned a lot of Cats haters, because there are a lot out there. No Cats hater that I know can give me an articulate reason of why. It's just not for them. And it's like, oh, it's a little confusing. And this like, well, it's not if you really dig into it. But one night at the theater, yes. So, that ruined that argument. And it turned a lot of people into, wow, I understand this finally.

[20:06] Eitan Levine: 1000%. And I think, going back to my first like, entree into Cats, you know, I remember googling, you know, the top musical, like, top running musicals of Broadway, and it was always there, number four. Like, I just, I remember seeing it always there. So, of course, I had to know something about it. But to your point, this production, you know, you go to Cats for the music, you go to Cats for the dancing, you go to Cats for the spectacle. But you don't always go for the storytelling, or at least I didn't. That's not what compelled me to the show. And this production, The Jellicle Ball, really turned it into a story. And you understood lyrics in a different way. You understood dynamics in a different way. It was really special. And I actually can't really recall another revival that made me feel or learn something different about a musical in the same way that this one did.

[21:08] Mike Abrams: Yeah, it is rare that you get a different version of the same story and still deliver at such a high level. I had a blast with that. But I want to be respectful of time here and know that this is, let's do some Cats rapid fire. So, if you weren't pulling a cat out of a hat, and you got to choose who you would want to go on as for one night, which character do you want to perform as?

[21:30] Eitan Levine: Old Deuteronomy.

[21:36] Mike Abrams: Old Deuteronomy. Okay. Who are your favorite and least favorite characters in the show?

[21:42] Eitan Levine: Oh, God. I'm gonna have to pass on that one.

[21:47] Mike Abrams: Okay.

[21:48] Eitan Levine: I feel like you are being really respectful, but I probably don't know the show as well as you think that I do.

[21:55] Mike Abrams: I was waiting for you to be like, all right, this kid at camp when I was seven years old, I really hated him. And so, it's his character because he pulled out X character.

[22:00] Eitan Levine: Oh, my God. That's so funny. That probably would happen, but I don't really remember that.

[22:12] Mike Abrams: Okay. Okay. What's your favorite song from the show?

[22:16] Eitan Levine: I mean, Memory is obviously such a classic. And of course, I used to sing it around my living room. I mean, I love Old Deuteronomy.

[22:29] Mike Abrams: Old Deuteronomy. Okay. All right. So, this is the premise of this show, is that I argued that I don't think Grizabella is the right Jellicle choice. So, I like your production because it seems like you didn't make a Jellicle choice, which means Grizabella did not win. But I want to know who would be your Jellicle choice and why.

[22:49] Eitan Levine: Ooh. I would say Mr. Mistoffelees, but mainly because I just like the costume. Is that a horrible reason?

[22:59] Mike Abrams: Nope. Anyone that's not Grizabella is a great reason, in my opinion. So, I basically don't argue with anybody unless they say Grizabella, and then I'm going to debate it.

[23:06] Eitan Levine: Oh, I thought you were saying besides Grizabella.

[23:09] Mike Abrams: Oh, no.

[23:09] Eitan Levine: I thought you were weeding the witness.

[23:11] Mike Abrams: Oh, I mean, I guess I don't want you to change your answer. But no, that's my opinion. Grizabella is a vote, if you would like to make that vote. She has about 45% of the votes for this podcast.

[23:25] Eitan Levine: Who's your vote?

[23:26] Mike Abrams: So, I think my answer is Gus. I think Gus makes the most sense because I think Grizabella should be next year's choice. She comes back, accept her to the family, let her spend some time, hang with the family. She doesn't need to go right away. But I will say this whole podcast started because I saw Leona Lewis in the 2016 revival, and I thought X Factor, which was who had the best performance, and I picked Tugger and Moussafwee together as my One Direction.

[24:00] Eitan Levine: Okay. Okay.

[24:01] Mike Abrams: So, that was my original joke, and I still hold true that. That's actually kind of what the Off-Broadway with the Perlman Performing Arts Center kind of did, which was like, we're going to have the whole competition, and we're going to have everyone walk.

[24:09] Eitan Levine: Yeah.

[24:09] Mike Abrams: So, I was like, that's X Factor.

[24:10] Eitan Levine: Yes. And that also part blew my mind. I was like, wow, this is what the show is about.

[24:18] Mike Abrams: Yeah, very much.

[24:19] Eitan Levine: Everyone is performing. Everyone is trying to have the spotlight.

[24:24] Mike Abrams: But also a family.

[24:25] Eitan Levine: Also a family.

[24:27] Mike Abrams: They're all together, and while they might battle and have their moments, they're still family.

[24:33] Eitan Levine: Yeah.

[24:33] Mike Abrams: And that's where it was like, it's so perfectly aligned. It's brilliant writing, brilliant directing. Everything was awesome. The choreographers were also so cool.

[24:40] Eitan Levine: Oh, my God.

[24:41] Mike Abrams: It was such a great—everything about that show.

[24:43] Eitan Levine: Yeah. Incredible.

[24:44] Mike Abrams: I hope it has another job in life.

[24:46] Eitan Levine: What's been your favorite production of the show?

[24:49] Mike Abrams: So, I've only seen—this is what's crazy. I have only seen a few.

[24:53] Eitan Levine: Okay.

[24:54] Mike Abrams: So, I've seen the 2016 revival, which is what started this. I saw the sixth national tour, because I did my hundredth episode with them. So, I saw them back-to-back nights. I filmed with them in DC, which was super fun. I watched the 1998 movie on a plane, on an iPad, on my way to a work trip, which got a lot of very fun and interesting looks, because I was rewinding as I was trying to figure out what in the world I was watching. But I was in full business casual, like everyone else around me is consultants plugging away on their computer, and I'm watching Cats on my iPad, but rewinding and fast-forwarding like a maniac trying to figure out which cat I'm even watching at this point.

[25:38] Eitan Levine: Of course.

[25:39] Mike Abrams: I saw the 2019 movie, which we're not going to talk about. And then I saw the Perlman Performance Center. And that's all that I've ever seen live.

[25:49] Eitan Levine: Wow.

[25:49] Mike Abrams: I've seen clips. Obviously, Fergie and JJ did an Elon production, and I have seen that YouTube video. I've had guests send me parts of it. So, I've seen a bunch here and there. But actually, live, I've only seen it three or four times of the in-cat costume, and then I saw the Perlman one three times.

[26:15] Eitan Levine: Wait, what about the last revival, the latest revival that was on Broadway?

[26:19] Mike Abrams: So, that was the 2016.

[26:21] Eitan Levine: Oh, okay.

[26:21] Mike Abrams: So, I saw that one. That was what started this. I saw the second to last.

[26:24] Eitan Levine: That was 2016? Oh, my God. It feels like it was two years ago or three years ago.

[26:28] Mike Abrams: It's like the couple days before I moved here, like when I moved here, which is why I saw it.

[26:33] Eitan Levine: Oh, my God. Wow.

[26:34] Mike Abrams: It's been a while. And it did two and a half, three years. It finished right before the movie.

[26:41] Eitan Levine: Okay. Got it. Got it. Which we must never speak of.

[26:45] Mike Abrams: Yeah, it's...

[26:48] Eitan Levine: I've never seen it, actually, because I heard such horrible things about it.

[26:52] Mike Abrams: I wouldn't be here with you if it wasn't for the movie. So, let's just say there's at least that silver lining.

[26:58] Eitan Levine: Fair. Okay. Yeah, I guess it did get a lot of fodder.

[27:01] Mike Abrams: It got a lot of attention for the wrong reasons.

[27:04] Eitan Levine: It did. Very much so.

[27:06] Mike Abrams: Which is funny.

[27:06] Eitan Levine: Well, this has been super fun. How can people stay in touch with you and Spencer on social media and see the viral video?

[27:14] Eitan Levine: Yeah, well, you can definitely follow him at HiSpencerGlass on Instagram. And I think it's Spencer Glass actor or Spencer Glass something on TikTok. I should probably know that.

[27:28] Mike Abrams: We'll link it. We'll link it all.

[27:30] Eitan Levine: And then I'm Eitan K. Levine on my Instagram, but it's mainly just reposting Spencer's content. So, you might not have as much fun, but you might see some fun content here and there.

[27:49] Mike Abrams: Well, we will post all three. We'll link all three in the notes so you can go find it.

[27:54] Eitan Levine: This has been so fun. I'm so glad we were able to capture this amazing part of the Cats lore.

[28:02] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. I really appreciate it.

[28:05] Eitan Levine: Amazing.

[28:05] Mike Abrams: Well, thank you.

[28:06] Mike Abrams: And thanks, everyone, for listening to this episode of The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast based on a Cats atrophy. To follow along, you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or any of us' podcasts. Follow us on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, and Threads at TheWrongCatDied. Or check our website, TheWrongCatDied.com.