This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Mike Abrams: There's a cat over here. There's a cat over there. And the wrong one died. And the wrong one died.

[0:15] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown that casts atrophy. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have another amazing guest. She just finished performing as Grizabella on the Royal Caribbean Cruise Oasis of the Seas. So welcome Savannah DeCrow. Thank you for joining me.

[0:28] Savannah DeCrow: Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. I think you're the third or fourth straight Royal Caribbean Grizabella I've had.

[0:32] Mike Abrams: Continuing the legacy.

[0:39] Savannah DeCrow: I know. And I love the idea of this has always fascinated me because it's 15, 16 years now that this is run. The ship was built around the stage and the mechanism to lift Grizabella to the sky, which is crazy that like Royal Caribbean, this massive cruise company was like, when we're building this ship, we got to make sure we start with this show that we're only going to do two or three times a week as like the guts of the ship. But it's also so fun too, because they also shortened it to 90 minutes, which is such a unique, different way of doing Cats. So we will get to your time on the ship, but I always start with the beginning. So what was your cat's experience before this cruise? Seeing it, watching it, knowing it?

[1:16] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. I never, ever saw myself being in Cats the musical. I am not a crazy dancer first, like most of the parts in that show require. So I just had always kind of written it off as something I would never have the pleasure of doing. I did see it on Broadway when they did the revival. I saw Leona Lewis as Grizabella.

[1:39] Mike Abrams: Okay. So first year, 2016 revival. Got it.

[1:45] Savannah DeCrow: I went in with no prior knowledge whatsoever of the show, and the curtain fell for act one, and my mom and I looked at each other, and we were like, what just happened? Because we were under the impression watching the show that we were just meeting all of the cats, and then the story was going to start. And they were just introducing all of these cats so that we knew who they were, and then the plot was going to begin. And that, for anyone that has not seen Cats the musical, is not how it works.

[2:14] Mike Abrams: No.

[2:14] Savannah DeCrow: So we, and Grizabella sings a little sneak peek of memory right before the end of act one. And as someone that was not a super fan, I thought that was just it. And so I was like, oh, memory happened halfway through the show, and—

[2:28] Mike Abrams: And disappointed, right?

[2:29] Savannah DeCrow: And it's very sad and slow and short. And so I just thought, what's going to happen in act two if memory has already happened and there has not been a plot established yet? But by the end of it, it was slightly more clear than before. And when we did the necessary research that we should have done beforehand and found out that it was based on the Book of Poems, and that it's very avant-garde, it was a different experience, a different viewpoint on it. But I always have always been very enamored by the costumes and the set and the choreography and the makeup. I think it is visually one of the most impressive things I've ever seen, but very confusing on my first go, for sure.

[3:12] Mike Abrams: I love, we have very similar experiences, because I also saw the first time ever was the Leona Lewis production. And I think because of her, and I've said this a lot on the show, but because she was an X Factor winner, my mind immediately went to, oh, I'm watching the X Factor. I'm getting a little pre-package of what this person is, I'm getting their song, and then we're going to the next one, pre-packaged person of what they are. So I was expecting, that's kind of how my whole frame of reference of the show started. But I had the exact same little memory, question was like, oh, I know this song, huh, I thought it was longer and more, like more belty. And I was like, this doesn't feel right. And then it didn't until it came back. Then I was like, oh, that was the teaser. And now years later, I know way too much about that. But I had the similar thing. But as not a dancer, that was a different choreographer. So that was Andy Blankenbuehler. Was that something that you noticed or even really noticed when you got into the rehearsals of doing, because I think your production does not do his choreography, you do more of the Gillian Lynn choreography. How much of that did you pick up on or notice when you, either then or in rehearsals?

[4:18] Savannah DeCrow: I feel like the revival choreography is a great homage to the Gillian Lynn version. I think there's a lot of elements that are similar stylistically. So I definitely noticed that it wasn't identical. But I didn't feel like it was a huge stray off the path. I felt like in the same camp, I think Cats is its own category in terms of style. And I think that the revival choreography does well to pay homage to that camp. But yes, it was a very humbling experience, to say the least, to tackle the Gillian Lynn choreography, because I do dance in the opening number as Grizabella. So I am doing some of that Cats choreography. And it is not easy. But it's definitely such an incredible honor to be able to do the original choreography, as amazing as the revival choreography is. It's just, there's something special about doing the preserved original view.

[5:11] Mike Abrams: Yeah. We'll come back to your, I think you're called Baby Griz at that moment in the beginning. We'll come back to that, because I have some questions for you about that. But I want to hear a little bit more about, you said, this is not a show you ever expected. So when you had this come across as an audition opportunity, what was that like? Did you go in of the, was there a moment in the audition, like, I think this is, oh, this is a show I want, I'm going to get this? Or is it a little bit more, you're just blasting out so many auditions and seeing what comes back, and then you kind of hype yourself up when you realize it's a real possibility?

[5:42] Savannah DeCrow: Well, it's funny. I had just graduated college when this show came across my opportunities. And I had just taken a class in college that we called Callbacks, which is basically where every single week we do a fake audition and callback scenario for a different show. And so, it's a good way to kind of know how you're going to be viewed and cast in the real world. And one of the shows that we did was Cats. And I actually did end up booking Grizabella, I think maybe even the understudy, in the class. And I ended up singing Memory at the final class showcase. And it was fun. It was something I never thought I was going to do seriously, but it was just a fun little diva moment. And then exactly a year later is actually when I found out that I booked Cats. So, it was a very full circle moment. But I live in Texas. I don't live in New York City. And so, I have to be very strategic about which shows I go for when I go to New York, because I'm booking a flight. I'm trying to find accommodations. It's a whole ordeal. It's not like I can just roll out of bed and go. And cruise work was something that was at the very top of my list for years. And so, I kind of weighed with myself, even though I thought there was no chance in hell that I would book this. I was like, it's better to be seen and get in front of them in the first place, even if it goes nowhere. And so, I took the gamble and I went and I got to the end and here we are. So, it's something I never expected to happen. But I just knew it would be a great opportunity. Grizabella, the casting call for Royal says that she is 30 to 55. And at the time, I was 22. So, I was like, no chance, but it ended up working out really well.

[7:21] Mike Abrams: I don't think they've had a 30 to 55 in years doing that role.

[7:26] Savannah DeCrow: That's okay. So, you said that you were really interested in cruise work. What drew you to that particular type of audition? What about the cruise life was more of the first year out of school, I want to tackle maybe that as an opportunity?

[7:40] Savannah DeCrow: I have always been someone that has really loved traveling. I studied abroad in college, because I've always wanted to see the world. I've always wanted to travel as much as possible. And cruise work is a great entry level job for the new actor. For any actors listening to this, highly recommend. It's a great way to save up a bunch of money because you don't have a ton of expenses on board. You're not paying your room and board. You're not paying your food. So, really, the only money that you're spending is out and about at the ports, and that's up to your own discretion. So, it's a great way to save up and maybe build that nest egg if you're wanting to move to the city or wanting to pursue something else in a different direction. There's a great way to start building those savings that you wouldn't get in another theater job. So, I knew pragmatically that it was a smart thing to do. And it combined my love of stability in a career with my love of travel. So, it was always very high up on the list for me. And I'm so happy that I finally got to do it.

[8:39] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Okay. What was the favorite port?

[8:42] Savannah DeCrow: Gosh, I really loved San Juan, Puerto Rico. That one feels like you are transplanted to Europe. It feels like you're in Spain. I feel like the give or take with cruise ports sometimes is that sometimes because they're trying to accommodate so many people, they kind of curate a port that feels kind of like the original country, but it's more curated, more manicured. And San Juan, they drop you right in the middle of the city and you're just getting a glimpse of what the actual local life is like. So, it's a very nice culture. It's lots of amazing art and shopping and culture. It's just such a fun port.

[9:20] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Very different than your perfect day at Coco Cay Bay, whatever it's called.

[9:24] Savannah DeCrow: Very different.

[9:26] Mike Abrams: Okay. I finally did... I haven't been on a cruise in a long time and I did one recently. And that was the only stop because it was a very unique cruise situation. And yeah, that's a curated experience, like you said. Okay. So, I want to talk about... Let's start with the Baby Grizz section because I want to talk a little bit about the plot and what they tell you, and then especially how they narrow it down for you for 90 minutes because you're not doing this eight times a week. You're doing all these other things too on the boat. So, I want to start with the Baby Grizz part because you mentioned it. You dance in the opening number. Did they tell you anything about that or is it just very clearly your body to be a dancing number in the opening number, or is there a story to Baby Grizz there?

[9:57] Savannah DeCrow: It depends on who you ask. The easiest way, story-wise, to grasp it, I think, is that Baby Grizz is a different cat. Because technically, in the world of Cats the Musical, everything in the events of the show is supposed to take place on one night. So, it doesn't make a lot of sense for Grizz to be a baby and then to come back as this old haggard cat. So, that's the way that I was able to stomach it the best. We don't really talk about it. There really is no explanation for it. But I think that everybody just kind of calls it Baby Grizz. The colors are slightly similar, but I think it's the easiest to wrap my head around, for me as the actor playing it, to make it two separate cats. And as productions go, it's hit or miss as to whether you find Grizzabella in the opening. There are some absolute star divas that have just been old Grizz and have just done that. But in the Royal production, Grizzabella is always in the opening. And so, I think it varies Grizz to Grizz. But I think in our sake, it's mostly for the sake of establishing the tribe and also having a bunch of dancing bodies and having this very spectacular opening number.

[11:27] Mike Abrams: Yeah. There's a lot of decisions where I'm like, from a storytelling perspective, it can mean a lot of things. And then from a business, how you're putting a show together perspective, it's like, no, we need somebody to dance and we don't have another cat. So we're going to put you in an adjacent color scheme so that way you don't have to completely redo what you're doing to go back on later. But it opens up such a wild set of possibilities of that character's story. Because since there is nothing about it, it could be last year's choice. It could be a child of Grizzabella's. It could be some other relationship. There's just so many things there. And I've always wanted to know if there's ever any discussion about it. But every time I've talked to people, it seems like, it's just kind of like, no, we're going to focus on you not kicking somebody over here before you go get ready for Little Memory or you come back out.

[12:10] Savannah DeCrow: Exactly. Yeah. I think that every actor that steps into the roles, because there's also Baby Old Deuteronomy, there's Baby Tugger, like a lot of the entire cast is in it, whether or not they transform into other cats or other versions of their cat later in the show. And I think it's really important as a group, from a cast perspective as well, to establish the nature of the tribe and establish a sense of unity and all be on the same page for the first number before we dive into the show.

[12:44] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So since you have to be so tight knit, you're literally crammed down there at the bottom of the ship living together and doing all this stuff together and going on ports together. How much does that add to the jellicle nature of the story you're telling? I'm sure you become very close with these people that you have to because one, you're crawling on top of each other, but you're also living in such close quarters. It feels like the tours and the Royal Caribbean Cruise, you get a different level of friendship and family ties to this because of just the proximity of what you do.

[13:01] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. No, exactly. I mean, the level of closeness that you achieve when you're living and working on a cruise ship for eight to 10 months is unmatched. There is not another experience like it. And I think that that does inspire a closeness within the show as well. I think there's a lot of just behind the scenes, little relationships, little tiffs and tats that nobody would notice, but it just adds a different layer to our performance and keeps it interesting. And I think that our offstage closeness definitely affects that and influences that because we are so close and it just migrates onto the stage. It's impossible not to. So definitely, if there was an eagle-eyed audience member that saw the show a hundred times, they would start to pick up on the little things that we'd added over the course of the contract that definitely weren't there to start. And don't influence the story in any way, but keep our experience interesting and unique and building the relationships within the tribe.

[14:19] Mike Abrams: So I'm sure you had some of those super fans. I know you get a mix of people that are showing up because it's a thing to do and they're on the cruise versus some that are going for that reason or just know Cats. Did you ever get a lot of comments or any conversations with people on the cruise that noticed some of those things or that wondered where Bustopher Jones was or the stuff that kind of pops up for someone who knows the show well?

[14:44] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. Well, it's always so fun to talk to a super fan because it's such a mixed bag on a cruise ship in terms of how people feel about Cats the musical, people's level of exposure to Cats in the past. It's such a wide array, wider array than you would ever have in a touring or a Broadway scenario. You're getting such a wide array of theater exposure. So it's always fun to get a super fan because it just reminds us why we do what we do. We have a few cosplayers that come on very often. That is always so fun to see them walking around the ship in our costumes. And I think by this point, the super fans are aware of the changes that have been made to the Oasis production. A lot of them have come many times, multiple times, but it's always fun. We don't have a playbill in the show. We broadcast our names on a screen to the audience before the show. And so it's always crazy when you have someone that's seen enough of the show enough times to know when there's a cover on or when an understudy is or when someone's out because that's not broadcasted. So you really have to be paying attention because it's not like you can really tell with the makeup and the costumes. You'd have to really know their voice and the way they carry themselves. And we've had a few people that are very observant and are like, oh, wow, you did great on your cover tonight. And nobody else in the audience would have any idea, but it's just those people that come back again and again.

[16:03] Mike Abrams: That's amazing. I want to go so badly. I want to see the 90-minute version. I'm so curious where they cut. And I know the obvious stuff, but I'm also just some of the other things of where they've shortened or I think your ball's a little shorter, right? Not much.

[16:20] Savannah DeCrow: A teeny bit, yeah.

[16:21] Mike Abrams: It's still a feat of athleticism beyond belief. But it's crazy to me, too, because you're also doing one of the most physically demanding shows on a moving ship.

[16:32] Savannah DeCrow: Oh, yeah.

[16:34] Mike Abrams: So I want to hear a little bit, though. One of my favorite things to talk about with the Royal Caribbean Group is the crazy stories, audience interactions, unique moments. Things don't go perfect in general, but even more so it feels like on that ship, stuff happens.

[16:50] Savannah DeCrow: Yes.

[16:50] Mike Abrams: What are the things you'll never forget?

[16:52] Savannah DeCrow: Well, I think, as I said, there's always a wide array of exposure levels to Cats the Musical. And some people really do not know how to take it. They don't know how to interpret it. So we get a lot of screaming. We get a lot of people that meow back at us, bark at us, hiss at us. It's very common. Things you would never see in a real theatre etiquette situation. We have to brace ourselves that people are going to be interacting right back to us. And that's always something that is fun, keeps it interesting. But I think that the things on the ship, and I think I remember Elise actually mentioning this on your podcast. There's always the chance that they can make an announcement of some sort. And when that happens, that completely cuts out the music in the show and overrides the singing and everything. And so this loud, blaring announcement from an officer comes in the middle of the show. Music stops completely silent on stage. And sometimes it'll be in the most poignant, silent moments. And then there will be a medical emergency. And they'll list this long message about how the emergency personnel need to go here. And this is the kind of emergency. And it's long, and we just have to keep going. And we can never prep for it. It is the funniest thing ever. It's such a test of our actor endurance.

[18:12] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Do you all freeze in that moment?

[18:14] Savannah DeCrow: Oh, no.

[18:14] Mike Abrams: And then pick right back up?

[18:16] Savannah DeCrow: No, we keep going.

[18:17] Mike Abrams: Oh, so you keep singing and dancing, and they just can't hear you?

[18:19] Savannah DeCrow: Yep. Yep.

[18:20] Mike Abrams: Wow.

[18:21] Savannah DeCrow: And you better hope you're on the music, because you can't hear the music.

[18:25] Mike Abrams: I figured you would just pause it for a second. But I guess your tech all doesn't work, maybe, or everything's just on a track.

[18:31] Savannah DeCrow: It's also streamlined, but it'd be really hard to get back into it. So that's definitely one of the most interesting things.

[18:37] Mike Abrams: What's the oddest moment or most challenging moment that got cut out for you?

[18:42] Savannah DeCrow: There was a moment when we were in the ball, and I was on stage, walking on stage to do my entrance into the ball. So it's right before Copeland, and I do a little sad, haggard version of Copeland next to the tribe before they hiss me out. And as I was walking on stage, this is right after the Victoria lift. So it's very sad. It's very poignant. It's very quiet. We had one of the Alpha Alpha Alpha announcements come through. And it's very hard because the whole tribe is looking at each other on stage, and I'm making my entrance. And you can't hear, and everything about everything we do is choreographed to the music. And so I didn't know when to get on my little platform. I didn't know where we were in the music. It was really tough, but it was so funny. And we got it on video, and it's always so funny to go back and laugh at.

[19:33] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So were you too long, too late? When the music picked back on, were you like, oh, here I am. I need to run off real fast.

[19:41] Savannah DeCrow: Luckily, I actually felt like I had a good sense of how long it normally took me, so I wasn't too far off. And I was just then making my entrance, so I had a lot of time to recover and make sure I was back on the music. And obviously, there's no singing at that point because we're in the Angelica Ball. So it ended up being okay, and you do the show enough times that you kind of know how long everything takes, but it just really takes you out of it mentally. You're just not ready for something like that to jolt you out of character.

[20:08] Mike Abrams: Yeah. And so the seven-day cruise, you're doing it, what, three, four times? I mean, how many times is it? Because I know that they do a couple shows per day sometimes, too, right?

[20:19] Savannah DeCrow: We do three shows a cruise. So one, two show day, and one, one show day.

[20:28] Mike Abrams: Okay. And that's over a week, right?

[20:30] Savannah DeCrow: Well, it depends on the length of cruise. Sometimes we did a five-day cruise, a six-day cruise, a seven-day cruise, or an eight-day cruise. And so that would just mean our time in between shows either got shorter or longer or shorter or longer, which makes it really hard, particularly for the dancers, to build any sort of stamina to get in the habit of the show. People would think that doing eight shows a week would be much harder. And obviously, it's very, very strenuous on your body, but you get to the point that you have the stamina for it and you're just in a sort of routine. Whereas for us, we kind of have to start back at square one every six, seven days and get back our stamina, both vocally and physically. So it provides a different challenge that you wouldn't expect.

[21:09] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I believe that a lot, actually, because I think it is physically demanding to do it eight times a week, like in a row, but it's muscle memory at some point. It's very much in your body that you, it's like, I just did this twice yesterday.

[21:25] Savannah DeCrow: Yes, exactly.

[21:27] Mike Abrams: And for you, it's like you do that, but then you also have to go do a bunch of other things in between. So how much Grizabella went into the other things you did? How much did you bring into it? And how much did people realize that you were the Grizabella when you were doing these other things?

[21:42] Savannah DeCrow: Never.

[21:43] Mike Abrams: Never?

[21:44] Savannah DeCrow: We are never recognized out and about the ship, which has its pros. Sometimes we wish we could talk to people that liked the show and hear what they thought and get to know them. But it's also nice to have a sense of anonymity around the ship. But we are never, ever recognized, even in the other show. I mean, our other show is called One Sky, which is a pop rock variety show. And we just are in regular people wigs, regular people costumes. So nobody would ever know who we are outside of that show and outside of Cats. And so, yeah, there's really not a ton of overlap. It's a very stylistic change. I'm singing Foo Fighters and Sia and crazy, crazy stylistic differences from Andrew Lloyd Webber. But it's kind of nice to be able to have such a variety in a week. You have to be very intentional about switching back and forth between the styles.

[22:39] Mike Abrams: We're going to take a quick break and then we'll be back for more of The Wrong Cat Died.

[22:43] Mike Abrams: And then in the rest of the time, what other obligations do they make? And does it differ between the dancers and the singers and everything else?

[22:52] Savannah DeCrow: It does differ. There's a very antiquated system within cruise ship work that we all think is absolutely ridiculous and needs to be updated for sure. It's coming from the old age of cruise ship entertainment. But there are differences in terms of benefits that dancers have versus singers and where we can go. There's a different matrix for both contracts because they're contractually different. And everything on a ship is ranked by stripes, which is kind of your privileges via the officer hierarchy. We're not actually officers by practice, but that's how they rank the privileges. And dancers for no reason are a different stripe number than singers. And so, there are different expectations of both contracts. And especially for a show like Cats makes no sense because everybody is doing all three and everybody is working their little butts off and everybody's on stage the whole time, basically. So it's a very unfortunate system that's in place, particularly surrounding Cats the musical, but it definitely differs singers to dancers.

[24:01] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I asked that question a little bit because I've talked to both that have done this and it feels like, again, I framed so much of this from just the story and thought, but it's very Grizabella of you to have more privileges than they did. It's a little diva-ish to get that, even though I know it has nothing to do with you. It's just the way it's set up systematically.

[24:23] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. Yeah. It's unfortunate, I think. I mean, the dancers are working so hard and there's absolutely no reason that they shouldn't get all the privileges and more that we get.

[24:34] Mike Abrams: It's a show where they're on stage at all times.

[24:36] Savannah DeCrow: Exactly.

[24:38] Mike Abrams: It is a show where even though Grizabella is a well-known character, they're all doing so much at all times and there isn't an order like some very traditional musicals where it's very clear that this is your male lead and this order. But I do want to hear a little bit about... There's obviously a lot of knowledge of the show from the super fans and from everyone else. You shorten it to a 90 minute, so you have the story. It's very similar. There's not a ton of changes, but is there anything that your cast adopted or leaned into that wouldn't really necessarily change the story, but maybe is a little bit counter to what you saw in 2016 or just because of friendships or relationships or things that you really... Our cast is very similar. Our cast liked this theory or that version.

[25:33] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. I mean, all of the theories within the inner workings of the show are different cast to cast to cast and nothing is super duper set in stone. I think that part of the fun of Cats the Musical is that every tribe has a different history and different relationships and it's gonna vary cast to cast. There are certain things that are solidified, but it's part of the fun of the rehearsal process is building those relationships that are special to you and your cast. So for me, a lot of people don't know exactly how to place Grizz age-wise or relationship-wise. What era is she in terms of the tribe? Is she top elder? Is she really old? Or is she more of a lower age era? Because that new costume update that came with the Nicole Scherzinger one makes her look a lot younger and hipper. So it puts her kind of in a different place than the original costume design. Some people think that Grizzabella and Old Deuteronomy are together and had Tugger and Monk. I feel like she's more of an older sister to them age-wise. I feel like especially with my Grizzabella, me being on the younger side, it makes more sense for me to be more of a sister figure to those two than like a mother. And some people think that Jenny Annie Dots and Grizzabella were sisters. Taylor and I had the theory that they maybe had a little fling back in their day, a little romantic fling. That's kind of the theory that we ran with. It's always just so fun to play around and definitely your personal relationships offstage influence what decisions you make on stage.

[27:11] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Did you play any of the Grizzabella's mom to Cillabub or Victoria or any of those?

[27:19] Savannah DeCrow: I think it definitely is more of a maternal vibe for those two because they're so young and they're so innocent. And so I don't know if we ever leaned into the biological mother theory, but she definitely is a maternal figure for the two of them.

[27:34] Mike Abrams: Okay. Okay. So much. I mean, so many versions. I like the Jenny Annie Dots fling. That's fun. I've not heard that. That's a fun version. The other one I hear a little bit, and I think it mostly comes from in certain productions, Tugger and Grizzabella, and I think it might be baby Grizz, but the two of them leave stage early on together. It says that that could be a fling because that's a little bit of like, where are they going?

[27:59] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. I like that. That's interesting.

[28:02] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I know. There's no way to record with you on the ship because that's what happened to Elise and I and so many other ones where the internet just doesn't work well enough. But I love recording when people are doing it because I'm like, I got a lot of things I can feed you to make your next performance a little bit more interesting. But maybe there's another Grizzabella in your future still early on in your career that there's, although you're not allowed to go back, you can't do two years in a row, right? That's a rule on the cruise ship or is that just—

[28:29] Savannah DeCrow: You can.

[28:30] Mike Abrams: Strongly recommending.

[28:32] Savannah DeCrow: It's very much up to your preference. You can't go back to back casts. So there's a handover period where both casts are on at the same time and the following cast is rehearsing while the previous cast is still on board. So that would just be impossible. But you could hypothetically come back for two casts later. So I was cast 19. If I wanted to, I could submit to come back for cast 19. So yeah, you can go 17 to 19, but you couldn't go 17 to 18.

[29:00] Mike Abrams: Got it. Okay.

[29:01] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah.

[29:02] Mike Abrams: I want to hear a few more crazy either things that you didn't go to the sky one day, crazy audience stories. What are the ones that, again, I love capturing these because they're so unique from the cruise ship.

[29:14] Savannah DeCrow: Oh, I have many. I was very accident prone in this production for some reason. I had, and particularly I had numerous costume mishaps. I don't know what was going on with me, but many costume mishaps. The thing about the Grizabella change from baby Grizz to old Grizz is it seems like it's a lot of time, but it is a full transformation. And I am very much perfectionist. So I was cutting it close every single time, which meant that sometimes that quality check before I went out on stage just couldn't happen. And that led to a lot of mishaps. One of which I, so our backstage area has a lot of up and down metal stairs to get to the entrances and exits. And so Grizabella's costume has this big, long, heavy tail on the end of the coat. And there's a metal weight at the end of the tail to just keep it dragging. And so Elise told me early on that when I'm going up and down those stairs to hold my tail so that the metal bit in the stairs wouldn't go. So I would always sling my tail around my shoulder and let it drape there while I was getting ready to go on stage. And then usually by the time I was walking down the stairs, my tail would just fall off and walk right on stage with me. One time when I was going on stage for Memory, and I was obviously so in my head because I'm always very nervous for that number, my tail did not fall off my shoulder. It was nestled in there very good. And I didn't realize. And so the entirety of Memory, that my big pinnacle moment, I had this giant black tail slung across my chest.

[31:01] Mike Abrams: So I looked like a human being. I had no tail. And I had some giant black objects just hanging down right in front of my chest. The whole number, didn't even realize. Finally, we get to the end and we're doing the processional line where all of the cats are accepting Grizabella after she's been chosen. And Demeter, my good friend Abby, finally did me a solid and took the tail off of my chest. The thing is, though, it has a big metal weight in it. And if you aren't Grizabella, you wouldn't know that. And so it's this very quiet, poignant, pivotal moment in the show. And the tail, because of Abby, drops to the floor with a huge thump right on her foot. And everyone, the whole cast is looking at each other. There's the big noise. It's a very quiet moment. And I just had to keep going. And I just couldn't laugh because I was on the verge of tears anyway. But I was on the verge of crying. It was so funny. We were all dying just to go from having this giant black tail across my chest for the whole number to this huge thump in a very pivotal, poignant moment. It was not the best way to do that song. And we've learned from our mistakes, but it was hysterical.

[32:05] Mike Abrams: I love it. I think it's fun. Did anybody in the audience notice or come up or even mention it? I guess they don't see you afterwards.

[32:10] Savannah DeCrow: I know. I hope not. I wouldn't matter. Luckily, there's a lot going on in that costume. So unless you were really paying attention, hopefully, you wouldn't notice. But yeah, we don't get to talk to them after the show. So I will never know. I hope not.

[32:22] Mike Abrams: Yeah. You don't have a stage door. Okay.

[32:22] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. The last thing I want to talk about before we go into the rapid fire and my million dollar question. I really enjoyed... We connected because I thought you did a really great job with sharing some of the cruise life and some of the experience on social media. So how did you decide what you were going to share and what you were allowed to share to have a little bit of a way to give a sneak peek behind the scenes of something that a lot of people don't otherwise get to notice?

[32:49] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. I mean, I was always very tuned in to other creators on TikTok before I got in this job because I was so curious about it. It's so unlike anything you do on land. And unlike anything, if you're not a theater person, it's especially unlike anything you do. And so it's just fascinating to learn about all the rules of the ship and all of the everything that you have to know and places you can and can't go and things you can and can't do. It's just something you would never know until you live it. And so I always found it really interesting to follow other people that were living that life, especially because it was something I wanted to do so bad. And so honestly, I started out sharing just for me and just for my friends, just so they could keep an eye on what was going on in my life. And just as I was equally interested, there was a lot of people that were very intrigued by the lifestyle when it came across their For You page. And so I started getting a lot more engagement and questions about this, that and the other. And so it just became such a fun thing to let people in to the behind the scenes of the lifestyle because you truly would never know until you live it.

[34:05] Mike Abrams: It is. And it's funny you say that it's different because it's not something you've experienced and you get to get a sneak peek of it. Even you mentioning your college experience of you had a callback class. I was in business school. I didn't have anything like that. And so every time I do a recording of this, I'm like, what is this class that I was not in that theater school at all to have that? And it's training you for your profession, but it's just so different than the business school and the other schools where you're, mine was very much everyone's in their suits to try to learn how to do interviews and resume writing and all the other things you'll do in that profession. So it's cool to have that behind the scenes. I do like that it opens up these doors for people to see this is what it's like and here's what your room looks like and here's what a day looks like and all the stuff that you wouldn't have access to otherwise.

[35:04] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah. It's just always, like I said, until you live it, you could never know. And so it's always fun to get a glimpse into a life that you don't know. And that's true for everything.

[35:08] Mike Abrams: Okay. For sure. Let's do some rapid fire.

[35:11] Mike Abrams: All right. If you could go on one night, any cat, doesn't matter if you can sing it, dance it, male, female, who do you want to perform as?

[35:14] Savannah DeCrow: Jenny Annie Dots.

[35:16] Mike Abrams: Jenny Annie Dots. Okay. You want to have that fling with yourself.

[35:19] Savannah DeCrow: Oh yeah. I've seen my former lover and I just want to step into her shoes for a day.

[35:25] Mike Abrams: Who are your favorite and least favorite cats from a personality standpoint? Like which character would you like to hang out with and which one would bug you?

[35:29] Savannah DeCrow: Oh, I think my favorite cats. Hmm. That's a good one. I feel like I'd love Cassandra. I feel like she just would be a good time night out on the town with Cassandra. The cat that I think I would get annoyed with would be MonkaStrap because he's always enforcing the rules. I think that would get on my nerves after a while.

[35:47] Mike Abrams: Okay. Favorite song in the show?

[35:51] Savannah DeCrow: Old Deuteronomy. I think the harmonies in that show are so beautiful.

[35:55] Mike Abrams: Which cat do you think would be the most cruise life cat? Like who do you think would embrace living or being on a cruise for a week?

[36:02] Savannah DeCrow: My first thought was Skimbleshanks, but I think that ultimately he wouldn't be able to fully let loose as much as he would like. Cause he's a cat of the railway train. I think it would be Alonzo. I think Alonzo is destined for a life of relaxation and being pampered. He is a diva cat.

[36:21] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I always thought it was Bombalurina.

[36:24] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah, true.

[36:24] Mike Abrams: For similar reasons and, you know, would be filming their TikToks or Victoria. But the real answer to this one is, is, you know, I have is I think it's Bustopher Jones. He's just eating his way through the whole show.

[36:33] Savannah DeCrow: Yes, the buffet. He would frequent that buffet and love it.

[36:37] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Okay. My million dollar question. I have argued at length. I don't think Grizabella should be the right joke of choice. So I want to ask you Savannah, not Grizabella, you Savannah, who's your Jellicle choice and why?

[36:51] Savannah DeCrow: That's such a great question. You know, I, for the longest time was a Gus defender. I thought that Gus was the rightful heir of the Jellicle choice. And I thought that Grizabella just kind of smoothed her way in there. But after living in the show and living with the character for so long, I have now pivoted back to my girl Griz. And let me tell you why.

[37:15] Savannah DeCrow: So for us, the Jellicle choices, Skimbleshanks, Jenny AnyDots, Gus, Griz. For me, Skimb and Jenny immediately written off. Did they give the performances of a lifetime? Absolutely. Did they perform circles around Gus and Griz any day of the week? But they've got their chance and they will be the Jellicle choice in their rightful time. So that leaves Gus and Griz, both solid options, both at the end of their road. Both gave great performances. I think that a very central motive and the motif in Cats the Musical would be lost if the choice went to Gus. I think that one of the most poignant messages of Cats the Musical is the importance of acceptance and the importance of second chances and the importance of a tribe. And Gus is already beloved. Gus has already been chosen by the tribe and he's had such a life that he can be proud of. I think that both as an audience member and in the world of the show, I think it's a much more important and significant lesson when Griz is the choice because it teaches us that Jellicle's forever, now and forever. That is the message of Cats the Musical. And I think even from Old Deuteronomy's point of view, he needs to teach the tribe that we have to give second chances. We have to give people room for growth. We have to give people acceptance and back into the Jellicle tribe. And so, I think, all this to say, after having a full circle moment, I think Griz is the right choice because she inspires that lesson of acceptance.

[38:50] Mike Abrams: Okay. All right. So, my first follow-up question.

[38:53] Savannah DeCrow: Okay.

[38:53] Mike Abrams: What is your definition of the Heaviside Layer? Like, where is Griz going?

[38:57] Savannah DeCrow: I think it is sort of heaven for cats. I think it is a cat-like heaven where they can all frolic and play and have a good time up there.

[39:05] Mike Abrams: So, she's not coming back. This is the end of the road.

[39:08] Savannah DeCrow: I think she's not coming back as she was before. She's coming back to a new life, but it's not the Griz that we knew. She's coming back reborn.

[39:17] Mike Abrams: So, this is where you lose me.

[39:18] Savannah DeCrow: Okay.

[39:19] Mike Abrams: Because I agree with everything you said, except for you were just out of college.

[39:26] Savannah DeCrow: Yes.

[39:27] Mike Abrams: And you got a lot of life to live still if you're playing Griz younger, as she is being played in most cases now. You're accepted back to your family that you've been needing and yearning for, and you have that entire redemption arc. And then it's like, cool, bye. And I get that argument. I get where you're coming from. Here's the thought process, though. Ultimately for her, as important as the tribe, that current tribe is to her, I think the thing that she sings about the whole show is how bad her life has been, and how many missteps she's making, and how she would like to have a second chance. And I think that the acceptance, the greatest acceptance of all is giving her that second chance. Not that she gets to live with them for a long period of time. I think that that is the gift of the Jellicles, is you get to relive and get a second chance at life.

[40:21] Savannah DeCrow: I think that we're saying the exact same thing, and where we split is what the second chance is.

[40:26] Mike Abrams: Yeah, fair.

[40:27] Savannah DeCrow: Because I think the second chance is you get to have your family back and spend some time, versus being like, nope, you're going to be an entire new being in your new life number seven, or eight, or wherever it is in the cat's life. And so that's kind of where it's like, it's this whole acceptance and stuff. But it's like, the argument that I struggle with a little bit is the Jellicle Ball, the one that's coming back to Broadway, because it does not feel like the end. It feels like she's being sent back out to the world, which feels like it is going back to her life, but accepted. And so that's kind of what I want for Grizabella. I want Grizabella to be brought back to her family and be accepted and have that redemption arc, but not just immediately end at the end of it.

[41:11] Savannah DeCrow: Well, and I think too, that is one of the crossroads with this new Grizabella interpretation is, I think in the original interpretation, she was seen as on Gus's level in terms of age.

[41:21] Mike Abrams: Yeah, yeah.

[41:21] Savannah DeCrow: So accepting her back into the tribe, like, she doesn't have a lot of time, whereas this Griz feels like she has more time, which is why I think it does create that interesting kind of conflict. But I think we are meant to believe that Griz doesn't have much time left on Earth. And so is it, are we letting her legacy die here, or are we giving her a second chance?

[41:43] Mike Abrams: True. I also watched the 1998 movie Too Much, and that Gus did not have a lot of time left. He was blind at the time, I believe I read, and he was very, very old and gave an incredible performance, all things considered. But it's like, yeah, you could argue that for Grizabella, but Gus is even worse in most cases than that.

[42:03] Savannah DeCrow: He's always right at the end of his rope.

[42:05] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Well, I will mark you down as Griz, or maybe I'll just cut out this whole part, when you said I was Team Gus, I'll just end it there, so I get another Gus vote here. But no, this has been super fun. How can people stay in touch with you for anything else you're doing, any new shows you get to do, or if you get to do Cats again, hopefully?

[42:23] Savannah DeCrow: Yeah, you can find me on Instagram and TikTok at SavDeCrow, S-A-V-D-E-C-R-O-W. And then my website is www.savandadecrow.com. So I'll be posting updates with whatever is next for me.

[42:38] Mike Abrams: Awesome. I highly recommend it. It was a fun follow for all the time on the cruise ship, so give it a follow. We'll link everything as well. Thank you for coming on, sharing your experience and talking a little bit about everything you got to do on the boat and all the fun that you had.

[42:52] Savannah DeCrow: Thank you so much. I had a blast.

[42:54] Mike Abrams: Awesome. Well, thank you, and thanks everyone else for listening to this episode of The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown catastrophe. To follow along, you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or other podcasts. Follow us on social media at TheWrongCatDied or check our website at TheWrongCatDied.com.