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[0:16] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of the CATS atrophy. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have another amazing guest. You can currently see him at the Broadhurst Theatre in the hit show, CATS: The Jellicle Ball, as DJ Griddlebone, but before that, he originated the roles of Macavity, Plato, and the Rumpus Cat in the original Broadway production of CATS, so I am thrilled to have you. Welcome, Ken Ard, and thank you for joining us.

[0:39] Ken Ard: Thank you for having me.

[0:40] Mike Abrams: I love the mix here because we're going to get to talk about the origination of the storytelling and pieces of CATS from your time as Macavity and the Rumpus Cat and Plato, but then we also get to talk about this incredible new production where you are out there working as DJ Griddlebone, so I want to start with the original Broadway. Let's start chronologically. I usually ask people, like, when did you first see CATS? But since you originated the role, I'm going to ask the, what was like when you heard about this production and you're auditioning and you are about to get this role, what was the vibe of how CATS was being perceived? Because it's a risky idea at this time without the unknown. We have the benefit of being able to look back knowing that it's been so successful and running forever, but at the time, what was it like joining this cast and creative of this bizarre, wild concept?

[1:44] Ken Ard: Well, they tried it in London on the West End and it was a big hit and they were bringing it to New York City. I had heard a cast album and we didn't have CDs or MP3s or anything, so someone had a physical cast album from London and I heard it and I knew that, I heard that the auditions were coming. I had just arrived in New York and I thought, that show's for me. I was a gymnast, a singer and a dancer, dancer first, and I knew they were looking for dancers with other abilities, so I was very confident that I would get that show. I knew it would be very popular because a lot of dance shows were happening back then, just because of the mystique of it. I didn't know it would be as monumental as it was, but I knew that it was going to be an amazing show to do and I really wanted to do anything that was adventurous.

I wanted to swing on trapeze or do gymnastics or slide across the floor on my knees, and I did all of those things, of which I have two new knees now. But yes, I knew it was going to be something special.

[2:59] Mike Abrams: Yeah, because I knew that they did the West End first, but even then, it's still kind of this, like, a little bit of an unknown of how's it going to work in New York and how's it going to land. So, take me back from what can you remember in the rehearsal room, because I'm fascinated by the storytelling and the story creation of these character arcs, and you all were in the beginning of this. So, like, how did you develop, and let's start maybe with Macavity's story. Like, how did you develop Macavity's story?

[3:33] Ken Ard: Macavity is really a strange character. When I first got cast as Macavity, I remember there was a bit of tension from one of Aileen Dancer's, Hector Mercado, who were really dear, you know, we became good colleagues and friends, but he felt that she should be doing Macavity. He was much bigger than I was, more of an established dancer in New York, he was an Ailey dancer, but Gillian Lynn saw something in me that she felt like, that's my Macavity. I think it was because I was a gymnast and was really crazy and wild and kind of, I didn't have the major technique that an Ailey company dancer had, but I had the wild abandonment that Macavity needed. He was a missing cat. The original company of Macavity, he doesn't have a number, he doesn't, he just shows up and causes havoc.

He's like that crazy street cat that doesn't live in a house and just, you know, you hear him at nights like crazy, tipping over garbage cans and tipping other people's women, you know, kinds of things. So it was just basically a lot of mayhem. Macavity was developed through a lot of mayhem and fights. He was a street cat.

[5:05] Mike Abrams: Was there, like, there's so much lore to this show now, and like, the family tree, and is Macavity old Deuteronomy's son with brothers in Monkish Trap and Rum Tum Tugger? Were you all even talking about that stuff, or is this the stuff that just the fans, back then, yeah?

[5:23] Ken Ard: Oh, hell no. I mean, we did a lot of developmental stuff, but there was no kind of, you're connected to this cat or anything. We were all individual cats that came together. Now, there were some people that only made it, like, I remember, there were twins. There was Renee Ceballos, Renee Clemente, and Janet Hubert. They played twins, and I'm not quite sure what their names were. Is it the Tantamile and Corcopat twins? Yes, yes, yes, yes. And they were connected. There were the kittens. I can't remember all the names of people, but there were kittens, and Cillabob, and the white cat, and all of those were the younger kittens. I just don't remember a family tree connection happening. That was something that was created with a dramaturge for this production.

[6:30] Mike Abrams: Yeah. That, to me, is one of my favorite parts, and why this podcast continues, is I love knowing that when you all originate these roles, it's not even discussed, and it's like, there's arguments happening on the internet now from fans of, like, no, they are sisters, or no, they're dating, or they're best friends, and you're just like, nope, we didn't think about it at all.

[6:52] Ken Ard: Maybe some people did. I came to the show as a dancer. I'm not a studied person. I didn't go to theater school and all that stuff. Maybe on my resume, I said that I did. But I don't have all that actress training and background. The one good thing that I got to do when we got to rehearsal was my scene partner, while we were doing all the actress exercises and stuff like that, was Betty Buckley. Betty Buckley is a real actress, so I got to imbue with her energy while we were doing, before we got a script, or music, or anything, you know, that actress exercises where you mirror each other and do all those things. I got to work with Betty Buckley, and that's a memory that I will always hold, whether we created characters.

I remember Trevor talking to us and giving us feedback and things, but I got to work with Betty Buckley. That was my inspiration for working. It's like, dig deep, and you're playing the mystery cat that causes havoc. Dig deep into that. That was helpful for me.

[8:06] Mike Abrams: You're essentially playing three different characters throughout the show. You have the Macavity that pops in. Like you said, there's no song, but there's these moments, and there's the fight. What about with Plato? Because I think you start the show as Plato, right?

[8:19] Ken Ard: I start the show as Plato, yes.

[8:23] Mike Abrams: How did you jump around between these different characters, personalities that you're supposed to be playing in those moments?

[8:30] Ken Ard: Plato was like a teenager. He was one of the boys and belonged to a group of dancers. Bob Hochschauer was one of them. Rene Clemente was another one, and we also shared a dressing room. He was just more of a dude, a teenager. He danced in the Tugger Number with Terrence Mann. He was kind of free and easy. That was more my character as a person. I was 21 years old when I was doing it, so I was very much Plato. Hang with the guys and have fun. That was kind of how I came up with that character. It was just me.

[9:16] Ken Ard: And then for the Rumpus Cat, as a lot of people that are newer to the CATS fandom, or maybe you became a CATS fan from the Jellicle Ball, which is obviously bringing a lot of new Jellicle fans to the world, which we'll get to, they probably haven't seen the operatic section and the Rumpus Cat and that whole story because it's not been done in the more recent production. What is your memory of building out that section and having this beautiful piece that's a little bit history component at this point?

[9:50] Ken Ard: It was very special. I mean, there's a star trapped in the floor of the original company and Stephen Hannon was playing Buster for Jones and Gus and Growl Tiger. It's like those three characters. Growl Tiger actually doesn't exist anymore because that was the tiger that came out on the ship with the Siamese cats. And he would tell a story about the peaks and the follicles and things like that. And then he would sing, I'm not quite sure how he transferred into being Gus, but it all happened within that scene, I believe, 45 years ago, so I'm trying to recall. But he's saying about, you know, playing the Rumpus Cat. And when he sings, I once played the Rumpus Cat, and they say, do it again, do it again, a whole scene happens where I shot up through the floor.

Now, Michael Jackson did this years later, where he shoots up through the floor, but I did it first on Broadway in CATS, where I shot up through the floor, and did this solo dance number with a helmet on with cat eyes that lit up. And I could barely see. But it was a spectacular moment in the show and a surprise for the audience. And it was a star trap with weights. So weights would drop and throw me up through a floor that actually opened because my head hit it.

[11:29] Mike Abrams: Oh, it was Wow. Okay, so you like, literally busted through the floor.

[11:32] Ken Ard: I busted through the floor with like a football helmet on with cat ears on it and eyes that lit up and things like that. But it was every night, I busted through the floor and had to be perfectly still when I went up if I leaned any way other I would like, you know, hurt myself. So it was something that was spectacular and fun and dangerous and crazy. And I don't think they would do that.

[11:58] Mike Abrams: Anyway, that doesn't feel like something they're testing out today without some other safety mechanisms in place.

[12:04] Ken Ard: It did not develop.

[12:06] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Did, um, did that work every single time? Like, did you ever, ever have?

[12:09] Ken Ard: Every single time? I never had an issue. Never had an issue.

[12:13] Mike Abrams: Wow. I'm impressed. I hear all these stories about Grizabella not getting up to the Heaviside Layer.

[12:17] Ken Ard: Oh, yeah. Things will happen. And I'm just imagining one wrong weight or your helmet shifted a little to the side. That's incredible.

[12:26] Ken Ard: CATS was my first big knee injury. When I had one in high school, but CATS was my first big knee injury. And it didn't happen with me dancing or flipping or anything. I was just standing still with in the Rum Tum Tugger number where he's doing his thing at the end. And I just heard my knee go. Oh, wow. Oh, what was that? And I didn't until after the show. And I like there's something up with my knee.

[12:52] Ken Ard: But, um, that's such a performer that you finish the whole show like that's early in the show, like you're only a little ways in you finish the whole show before you're like, Oh, that something's wrong. Yeah. Wow. Um, before we transition to the Jellicle Ball, I want to know it's been you said for you know, it's been 40 plus years. What are some of those memories from this that that original run that you'll just never forget whether they're funny stories, audience reactions, like you were at the forefront of CATS on Broadway, like what are those things that are just stuck in your brain? Um, that was that CATS was my third Broadway show, but my first hit show. And it was a hard show. I mean, the show that we're doing now is very difficult in that these dancers are breaking their necks every night.

But we had to do it in unison, this like individual dancing where they can go, Oh, I don't feel like doing that move tonight. And nobody's gonna know it because it's like, there's so much individual dancers go dance going on. In CATS, the original company, we had to dance a lot as a human. And that that was very difficult. I remember just being exhausted after every show. But thrilled that I was doing the biggest one of the biggest hit shows on Broadway. It's hard. It's all it's all a mash. I just remember meeting a lot of celebrities. That was really fun. I wish back then that we had had social media or our phones that took pictures. Yeah. But it just you know, you meet somebody and it goes by right now.

After the show, I have an autograph book. So when people come to the show, I just have them sign my book, they can write something or just their name. So I remember, wow, I met that person. I met that person. But I don't have any anecdotes or stories. We had a great time. There are lots of personalities in the show. Just I can't tell you any funny stories or anything like that. It was just a brilliant time. We're going to take a quick break and then we'll be back for more of The Wrong Cat Died.

[15:10] Mike Abrams: I love the transition though, of between the two shows, because I love that you're saying like, I wish I had a cell phone camera that you have now. Like now everyone has them every, you know, everywhere. Because you probably met, yeah, I mean, this was the hit show. Like you probably met everybody who's anybody. I remember meeting Diana Ross. I remember meeting Cary Grant. I remember meeting, what's her name, from Dynasty, Joan Collins, Elizabeth Taylor. All of those people came to see the show. It was the show to see. And it would just be so great. You know, now we have photographers that show up to every show, you know, and take pictures every night. And we have our cell phones, we can take selfies. And, you know, it's impossible to forget who's been there. And it's posted immediately the next, you know, that evening.

[16:04] Ken Ard: Completely. You know, I've loved, because you also have a component in the, so we're going to pivot to the Java ball now. And you've got a component of like a celebrity guest judge or a guest judge that's every night. And the first couple of times, like, you're talking about Sydney films the guest judges at the end of his song and is like on there. And post it during intermission. That's so it is truly immediate. And you've had some incredible celebrities already come through. And you're going from 1980s hit cats to 2026 hit cats, because this is a hit show with incredible reviews. And I mean, I had no doubt having seen it at the pack. So I want to start actually with the downtown pack production. So did you have any, like, what was your knowledge and involvement or opportunity to even see it at downtown when I was at the pro man?

[16:55] Ken Ard: Well, I wasn't even living in New York at the time. I mean, I have a partner here that me and my partner sub me and my husband sublet. And we were in San Francisco, he was working on an opera there. And we heard about cats. And we come into the city, occasionally, you know, to New York. And, you know, after the 2016 production, and the 2019 movie, I was like, what the hell are they going to do with cats? And then I heard they were going to do it in the Harlem kind of ballroom setting. And I saw some pictures of it. And I crossed my arms and I sucked my teeth. And I thought, does everything have to be so gay? And then I wouldn't saw it. And I thought, yes. Yes, it does. Yeah. There were many reasons why it worked for me, why it affected me.

But the main reason was that they took it and actually made it make sense in a new era. And, and that it was down at the World Trade Center, where I had been complete, I lived down there prior to 9-11, and had been basically blown out my apartment because I lived right across the street. And I hadn't been down there since so going to see cats, it was cathartic to me in so many reasons. First of all, it just moved me so much. And it was my, like I said, it was my first time down there after since 9-11. It gave me so many, it gave me a new memory to put in place what I was holding there. And I left that theater. I bawled throughout the whole show, because like, oh my god, this is incredible. I don't believe that they made this show work for this new era.

And I just left there overwhelmed with joy. And I went back to see it again. And I saw it three times. I was a judge twice. And I saw and I went to see it last time. And then kind of left there going, they made cats work. It was brilliant. And, and I thought this is definitely going to Broadway. I didn't think that anything else about is like, wow, this is going to Broadway. Two years later, the person who played McCavity, Antoine Harper, Harper, Harper, broke me and said, I'm not doing cats. I think he'd gotten a television show. And he said, you should throw your hat in the ring. And I thought, why not? Before I got out of bed that morning after, because it was a text he sent me, before I got out of bed, I wrote to Angela Weber, because we had just reconnected in London.

And I wrote to Bill Roush. And I wrote to Mike Bosner. I got a letter back from Bill Roush saying this, we're going to kick this idea around and send us some material. So I've been singing and teaching dance. And so I sent them some stuff from my dance class, I sent them some stuff of me singing in nightclub. And they called me in for an audition. And I, and I flew to New York to audition. I knew if I'm flying to New York to audition for this, in person, they're taking me seriously. Yeah. And they did. And I had a great, I had one of my best auditions in my life for the show. And leaving that audition, I knew they're gonna hire me. Yeah. And I actually went home and started getting myself together to come back to New York. And I had to wait. I had to wait, but I knew that I felt it, that this was my gig.

[20:45] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I mean, and it's, I'm glad you got to see it multiple times. And I love hearing the, like, having like, the Perlman Performing Arts Center is just a gorgeous building down there. It's relatively new. And they've done such a good job with the programming, what they're doing. But it is right next to the fountains. And so you are right there at the heart of everything from the World Trade Center. So it is, for me too, like, I've only had been down there before living here for the tours and the museum. And to go back to the, I also went three times to kind of go back and go back in for this fun and energetic and joyous reason is, like you said, a great memory to have to bring to that area.

When you auditioned and everything, did they, like, had they talked about the idea of amplifying this DJ Griddlebone character? Because the DJ didn't, like, the DJed more in the pack performance. And you're doing a lot more dancing, and you walk in the runway, and like, you are, like, it's a much enhanced storyline for DJ Griddlebone. So how much of that was shared with you? And how much of that did you help them kind of, like, build out?

[22:03] Ken Ard: None of it was shared with me, because I had no idea what I was auditioning for. Actually, I had reached out, because I knew Macavity was available. And the guy who played Macavity and what, had they been doing the original production, I would never say, oh, I want to do Macavity, because it's too strenuous to do that. Even though Macavity doesn't have a song or anything, he just comes out and he's crazy. But for this production, I thought, I can do that. It's all about fashion, you know, attitude, and I can handle that. And they did not tell me that they were considering me for DJ until after my audition. I was, I actually sang so much material, I sang Gus, I sang for Deuteronomy, and I sang for Jenny Annie Dots.

And they were like, well, we want to consider you also to be an understudy for some roles. And literally, at the time, I was like, I'll do anything. I would have done anything to be a part of this production. So just bring it on. It was after that, that they discussed DJ Griddlebone. And I was confused. It's like, because DJ, he wasn't DJ Griddlebone, he was just DJing. And so I was confused. I thought, well, he doesn't do anything except for blow the glitter off of the album and then disappears. I didn't see him. Again, my partner kind of remembers him looking up at the DJ booth, but I never looked up at the DJ booth after he disappeared. You know, I realized, oh, there's somebody up there, but they were in a closed little closet that you couldn't see, from my memory.

So when they discussed that, I thought, well, he doesn't do very much. And I was very disappointed. In the rehearsal studio, they set up this little corner for me. And literally, throughout the whole process, I sat in that corner, watching them rehearse the show, and thought, I'm not, is anybody? Hey, Ken over here. Yes. And we got to the theater. And that's when I started, with the team, started to build my show. Because there is, you know, my thing is, if it's not on the page, it's not on the stage. If there's nothing in the script, where does it exist? And we basically created it there in the theater. I knew I was doing some dancing in the Jellicle Ball. I knew I was going to do Executive Realness.

And that was it. But now, I feel like a fully-formed character up there in my DJ box. And I feel like I have acting beats, and I'm emoting, and it's a beautiful thing that I get to do every night in this iteration of the show.

[25:06] Mike Abrams: Yeah. It's interesting hearing you say that, because I had almost the reverse reaction when I saw that you were cast as the DJ, as DJ Griddlebone. I had my first preview tickets the minute they announced it, and I was like, oh, I can't wait to see how they build your character out. Because I was like, they're not going to just leave you up there the whole time. You're going to be down there dancing and adding to this character and this story. And you do have, because I've now seen the show three times, and the way that I've sat in the orchestra, I've sat in the mezzanine, I love how you all have crafted this story to have stuff happening all around you at all times. And your character is very...

[25:44] Ken Ard: You know, I think the biggest thing for me was just the sheer excitement of being in the room with so many talented people. I mean, I was auditioning alongside some of the best dancers and singers in the business, and it was just a thrill to be part of that process.

[26:14] Ken Ard: When I first heard the West End cast album, I was blown away. The music, the choreography, the storytelling—it was all so captivating. I knew I wanted to be a part of that world, and I was determined to make it happen.

[26:44] Ken Ard: Auditioning for CATS was a unique experience. I had to showcase my skills as a gymnast, singer, and dancer all at once. It was a challenge, but I loved every minute of it. I remember thinking, "This is my chance to shine."

[27:14] Ken Ard: Creating the character of Macavity was a fascinating journey. I wanted to portray him as this chaotic street cat, someone who was both charming and dangerous. I didn't rely on the fan-made lore; instead, I focused on bringing my own interpretation to the role.

[27:44] Ken Ard: During rehearsals, I had the incredible opportunity to work alongside Betty Buckley. She taught me so much about acting and character development. We did a lot of exercises that helped me understand Macavity's motivations and how to embody him fully.

[28:14] Ken Ard: One of the most memorable moments from the original run was the Rumpus Cat star-trap floor stunt. It was a dangerous move, and I had to be very careful. I remember the adrenaline rush every time I performed it.

[28:24] Ken Ard: Unfortunately, I did suffer a knee injury during the original run, which was tough. But I pushed through it because I loved the show and the character so much. The energy from the audience always kept me going.

[28:34] Ken Ard: Meeting celebrities backstage was another highlight of my time in CATS. It was surreal to be in the same space as some of my idols. I remember feeling starstruck but also grateful for the experience.

[28:44] Ken Ard: Now, with CATS: The Jellicle Ball, the ballroom setting really enhances the storytelling. It makes the show clearer and more emotionally resonant for a new generation. I think audiences will appreciate the fresh take on the classic.

[28:54] Ken Ard: My audition path for the expanded DJ Griddlebone role was quite interesting. I had to show that I could bring a new energy to the character while still honoring the original material. It was a fun challenge.

[29:04] Ken Ard: I truly believe that even skeptics and CATS haters should see this reinvention. The production has an inclusive cast and culture that reflects today's world, and I think people will be pleasantly surprised by what they see.

[29:14] Ken Ard: There are so many standout moments in the show, from the choreography to the performances. Each cast member brings something unique, and it all comes together to create a magical experience.

[29:24] Ken Ard: I think audiences will leave the theater feeling uplifted and inspired. The energy in the room is palpable, and it's a celebration of creativity and talent.

[29:34] Ken Ard: Overall, being part of CATS has been a transformative experience for me. It's not just a show; it's a cultural moment that I feel lucky to be a part of.

[29:44] Ken Ard: I encourage everyone to come see CATS: The Jellicle Ball. It's a show that truly has something for everyone, and I can't wait for people to experience it.

[29:54] Ken Ard: Thank you for having me on the podcast. It's been a pleasure to share my journey and insights about this incredible production.

[30:04] Ken Ard: I hope to see you all at the theater!

[38:36] Ken Ard: That's a lot of work, and I commend those people that do that, because they're artists. They are artists that show up and create and do that as their life's goal. The piece that you mentioned that I think is why it works so well with CATS, the ballroom scene works so well with CATS, is it's a community, an open community that accepts all of their members. Even though there's a little cattiness and fighting and stuff, there's those moments. It's family, but it is so similar. Then you have the Jellicle Ball, the name's right in there. So I just thought it was such a brilliant idea, and then seeing it live on stage, and the more I've learned as someone who knew very little besides Paris is Burning about ballroom before the downtown production, the more I've learned about it, the more I'm like, how has nobody done this before? Like, how did it take so long for this to happen?

[40:05] Ken Ard: Right, right. I guess it was just the seed of an idea from Bill Rauch that he then brought to Jamin Livingston, and then they took it to, you know, they have plenty of consultants, Amari and Arturo, and it took a team. This show took a village to do. Yeah, and it's such an important message and time to have this on Broadway, too, to have it. It truly is. So I'm thrilled that it's there, it's succeeding, and it's being embraced by fans, critics, and everybody in between.

[40:46] Ken Ard: Yeah, there was someone who sat next to my DJ box last night, two people who, this is why I do theater, they loved it so much, they cried so much, they were happy, they were jumping. It was kind of making me tear up, going, oh my God, that's how I felt when I saw the show. And it really is the reason why I do theater. You know, of course, it's great to get paid and all of that stuff, but to see, to get that feedback from the audience and the love and the adoration of someone being moved and being taken into another world and leaving better and higher than when they came in is why theater exists.

[41:34] Ken Ard: Yeah, yeah. We haven't talked about Grizabella and Tempress and just the fact that there's a leading lady who's a trans woman and is being the pinnacle of the show. So, you know, you mentioned working with Betty, and I love that Betty Oakley's embrace, like she's done a lot of stuff recently of embracing this production as well and some amazing things on the gold carpet. But what is it like working with Tempress, who's also like a legend and icon in the ballroom community?

[42:04] Ken Ard: Oh, wow. She's one of the most lovely people that I've met on this production. She's so sweet and kind and is such a talented performer. It's been amazing just watching her and getting to know her. I so look forward to going to the theater every day and seeing these people. It's like a love fest there, it really is. It's very supportive. And I've never worked in a show where there's so much talking. We have these meetings once a week where we check in. There's sensitivity coaches and stuff like that. And it's totally necessary because there's so many different personalities and feelings and vibes. We have the largest trans cast that I think has ever been on a Broadway show. Definitely the largest gay and queer cast that has ever... Broadway is so gay, if you can imagine. I mean, I've been in shows where... But they don't promote it in a way or embrace it in the way that we're doing here at the Jellicle Ball.

[43:28] Ken Ard: There's one straight guy in the show. One total. One total straight guy in this huge cast. Our stagehands and all of them, but I was talking about the onstage cast. There's one straight guy in the cast and he plays the police officer and is the booth singer. But other than that, it's just an amazing thing. And Timbers is really kind of a house mother in the show. And just a beautiful person. And it's so apropos that we get to embrace and promote without preaching. It's just about joy and love and happiness. And there's no preaching to anybody. But anybody that comes to see the show, they're just going, Oh, wow, these are regular people spreading joy. That's basically what it is. It's fun. It's fun.

[44:34] Ken Ard: We'll link everything, too, on how to go get tickets. But if you have not seen it yet, you've got to go. You've got to find your way to see it. You have to see it. It's one of those things that if you miss it, you've missed a cultural moment in time. Completely. We're going to take a quick break and then we'll be back for more of The Wrong Cat Died.

[44:51] Mike Abrams: Okay, let's do some Cats Rapid Fire. So you can go with either the cats from the 80s or you can go with the Jellicle Ball. You can give me answers from either way. But if you could go on one night to perform as any cat in the show, male, female, whether it's in your vocal range, dance numbers, or whatever, who do you want to perform as for one night?

[45:12] Ken Ard: For one night? Yep. I want to do Bebe and Macavity. Macavity. I want to sing Macavity.

[45:21] Mike Abrams: You want to be Demeter, then?

[45:23] Ken Ard: Demeter, yes. Okay.

[45:26] Mike Abrams: For one night.

[45:27] Ken Ard: For just one night. One night only. What are your favorite and least favorite cats from a personality standpoint? Which one would you want to hang out with and which one would bug you to hang out with?

[45:36] Ken Ard: I want to hang out with Tugger.

[45:38] Mike Abrams: Okay.

[45:39] Ken Ard: Personality-wise. I wouldn't want to hang out with... What's Emma's first character?

[45:47] Mike Abrams: Cassandra.

[45:48] Ken Ard: Cassandra. I would not want to hang out with Cassandra because she's too out there and wild and gressic. It is a beautiful, chaotic energy. Her performance of that, it's so fun to watch throughout the moments when she's not on stage because she's freaking out all throughout the theater. She plays it so well.

[46:10] Mike Abrams: Yes, she does. What is your favorite song in the show?

[46:13] Ken Ard: Macavity.

[46:14] Mike Abrams: Macavity.

[46:15] Ken Ard: Same.

[46:16] Mike Abrams: If you could be in one of the houses in the show, so House of Dots, House of Glamour, House of Macavity, which house would you want to be in?

[46:23] Ken Ard: House of Macavity.

[46:24] Mike Abrams: House of Macavity. Okay.

[46:26] Ken Ard: Okay. This podcast centers around my belief that Grisabel is not the right Jellicle choice in the 80s cats. I think it's a little harder to argue this version because of the heavyset layer being very different. But who is, as Ken, who is your Jellicle choice and why?

[46:44] Ken Ard: Well, selfishly, selfishly, it would be DJ Grinabone. That's just my ego. But realistically, realistically, it would be Tempress as Grisabella because watching her transformation in the original, Betty doesn't transform. She's Grisabella and she's that hurt, wounded cat that goes up to the heavyset layer. Watching the transformation of Tempress, I believe she deserves to go up.

[47:21] Mike Abrams: Well, I'm going to put your vote down as DJ Grinabone, so I have a not Grisabella vote.

[47:26] Ken Ard: No, it's so interesting because I do think, I joked with Bill and Jalen after I saw the first production being like, yo, y'all kind of ruined my show because my argument was always that I thought, I didn't really like the premise of Grisabella being reaccepted into the family and then immediately killed, like immediately sent off to her death. And this version does not feel that way. It feels like she's going back to the ball, like she's being brought back in, which is a totally different heavyset layer to me. And I attempted to tell Betty that on the gold carpet, that like why I did it. She immediately disagreed with me and is very, very pro Grisabella going. But that was kind of my argument.

I think that that's kind of the beauty again of the reimagination here is the story, like it's telling the same story, but with a tweak of the heavyset layer being going, you know, she comes out, I don't want to spoil it too much, but she comes out in her dress and like looks ready to go, very much so than the Grisabella who's just finished singing Memory and is, you know, still being reaccepted. So I love the beauty of it. And again, I just, I hope everyone in the world gets a chance to go see it because it's so well done.

[48:46] Ken Ard: So well done. And I just feel like any new iteration of Cats should be the Jellicle Ball.

[48:54] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[48:55] Ken Ard: From here on out, it's just this version. I hope it'll tour. I hope it'll get regionally done. Like I hope that this is the beginning of this particular version being exposed to more people because I think it's important for the world to again see this version at this moment in time and point in time.

[49:13] Mike Abrams: I agree. And so many people that are coming to the theater are now getting to see themselves. That's what I felt last night with the people sitting next to me when they were balling. That's what I felt when I saw it. Like I'm seeing myself on stage and that's rare.

[49:29] Ken Ard: Yeah.

[49:30] Mike Abrams: When you get to see and be inspired by performers who are like you.

[49:37] Ken Ard: Yes.

[49:38] Mike Abrams: And hopefully inspires them to create the next generation of performers.

[49:43] Ken Ard: Yes. This has been so fun to talk about the original creation of Cats and then this obviously new iteration. We'll link everything for the Jellicle Ball stuff. But how can people stay in touch with you?

[49:57] Ken Ard: Through Instagram. TheKennethArt at Instagram. I think that's how they do it. That's the best way.

[50:06] Mike Abrams: Yeah. We'll link it too. These will be all these new celebrity photos you're getting with all the people coming through.

[50:12] Ken Ard: I shall be sharing but don't look to see them the night of or even the week of. Though maybe a few weeks later I'm not an instant Instagram sharer. And everybody keeps telling me I need to get TikTok because I'm blowing up because people are posting a lot of stuff.

[50:29] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[50:30] Ken Ard: I don't have TikTok but I will download it and get it and start being more active. But at the same time I actually have a life that's not in social media.

[50:42] Mike Abrams: A life and a job and work.

[50:45] Ken Ard: Yeah. All kinds of stuff and prepping for other things like this and other ways that this show is being promoted and hopefully prepping for Tony Awards and Tony performances and all that stuff too.

[50:55] Mike Abrams: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

[51:00] Ken Ard: Well thank you again. This has been so fun and I hope everyone goes to see the show.

[51:03] Mike Abrams: Yes. Thank you so much.

[51:05] Ken Ard: Thank you. And thanks everyone. Have a great day.

[51:08] Mike Abrams: And thanks everyone else for listening to this episode of The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of the catastrophe. To follow along you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or Apple Podcasts. Follow us on social media at The Wrong Cat Died or check out our website at TheWrongCatDied.com.